#which is a messy and ethically dubious thing to do
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thinking back on it i think i was thinking about sci fi cloning in the name of repopulation as a plotline for rebuilding altea like, in my own brain, unrelated to the tv show, and somehow i decided that this was something i got from the childrens netflix television series. As opposed to Obviously being a machination of my deranged mind
voltron was really going for something when it’s villain was keeping a dead genocided species alive through cloning and keeping them in isolated colonies in order to be quite literally farmed for their life force. but sadly That’s the premise of a psychological horror not a children’s TV show so they kind of lightly shoved that bit to the side and never went anywhere with it
#i had misremembered that the way lotor was making alteans with the strain of pure quintessence#involved cloning some of the initial alteans hed imprisoned#so that he could keep those particular powerful bloodlines going while still farming them for their quintessence#which is definitely something netflix would make. For sure#this blog is relatively tame compared to the shit i think about on a daily basis#one day i will just admit i want to write dd:dne fic in crazy sci fi settings and i will become more powerful than god#to.....To the people who want to read about [REDACTED]#anyway the idea was for allura to clone herself in order to have children of the royal bloodline#without a) diluting the bloodline (SORRY) and b) involving another person whatsoever in the proceedings#plus this was an idea for an au that didnt involve an altean prison colony who worship lotor as a god#so she wanted full altean children#thats how you do it#which is a messy and ethically dubious thing to do#like regardless of her intentions#plus they wouldnt be able to have full altean children either#not unless they had children with each other#which is an entire horrifying can of worms in and of itself#and i like things that suck so obviously i was considering this very deeply#in the end i think my canonverse au is going to involve the altean prison colony that worships lotor as a god#i like romelle & besides its a very compelling premise#i just need to make it worse
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Okay yeah I finished Genefather and I genuinely enjoyed it (with the disclaimer that's it's very much a 40k book with the common issues that entails and also some frankly uncalled for necron slander) but now I'm feeling unhinged about Belisarius Cawl, our messy jumbo shrimp of a man, so now I'm gonna make it everyone else's problem spoilers to follow.
I love Cawl. I genuinely do. He's one of my favorite 40k characters. I love his design, I love his devotion to his faith and the way he's basically a Mechanicus Jesuit. He's hysterically funny. He's a mad scientist crossed with a carnival huckster. He has one of the biggest egos of any human living or dead and he does not want to be machine Pope.
And he is an absolute monster.
Like obviously the things he did to create the primaris marine are... ethically dubious. So many people dying in agony. So many kidnapped children. People who were lied to about what was going to happen to them and suddenly they wake up hundreds of years later to find themselves something else. There was no informed consent. And yet Cawl loves each of them. He knows them and cares about them. That does not stop him from torturing them nor sending them to their deaths.in combat.
Cawl is so loving and that is one of the most terrifying things about him.
Which brings me to possibly the most monstrous thing about him. He will not let Friedisch die. He is creating copies of his dearest friend, putting them through a terrible existential crisis, ensuring they remember their deaths (all 87 of them!!) and all in service of making the "perfect copy." Of achieving a true resurrection. Something he can never achieve. Even the Dark Mechanicum thinks that is fucked!
I really think Genefather missed the boat here. I don't think the story addresses just how horrifying this is. The narrative acts like because it comes from a place of affection that makes it okay??
Of course Cawl wants Friedisch back. His only friend (or love, could go either way despite how hard the book tries to "no homo" them). The only person who calls him Belisarius. Who calls him on his shit, who knows the core person beneath all the mechanics and devoured consciousnesses. Cawl literally cannot function for five minutes without a Qvo by his side. He loves Qvo so much, but he is tormenting him. Qvo wants to die! And Cawl is too arrogant to see it.
It's terrifying and compelling and so ripe for drama and consequences. Because I do think that's one issue with how Cawl is written. He gets away with...a lot of shit. He thinks he's invincible because he is Belisarius Cawl (TM). Which is really fun! To a point. And I think Qvo should be that consequence. The thing he cannot achieve, cannot get back, and a living testament to the horrors his hubris and love can lead to.
God, Cawl is just a genius egomaniac who wants love and connection so badly. He loves humans and humanity and thinks his own humanity is still in tact but...is it? Is he all that different from the necrons he dunks on?
Food for thought.
#warhammer 40k#belisarius cawl#Genefather#i am gonna talk about Primus#because boy did that emotionally devastate me#but that is it's own post#ghost does character analysis#not a robot this time!#i mean he is mostly robot#but there is some flesh in there
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I’m sorry for what happened I’ll stop sending you asks like that
Note: This is a follow-up to a debate that started last Friday which came about in response to an ask from before that. Should I link to any of that? Idk if I should, but... I'll link to the Ask reblog that contained the debate, I guess. There's your context, for better or worse.
It's totally OK; you didn't mean any harm, and I know that. You can still send in those asks if you want; maybe we just don't mention any other users by name? That'd be an easy fix. Or I can just respond to you privately, if you still want to name people.
There was another Anonymous response to that debate, actually. And I hope this further makes you feel better about your asks/our conversation:
I appreciate this, Anon friend, and I think everything you said makes a lot of sense. Even so: Does any of what you're saying mean I should be tagging the user I'm openly disagreeing with, or that I should be able to talk about them anonymous while still sorta "calling them out"? Is it more polite to loop them into the fact that they're being discussed, or is kinder to just let them live in peace and not alert them? I don't know the answer. It's the naming of the party being discussed that most got me like 🤔. I think that's where it becomes ethically dubious... and I feel like the cleanest approaches are either (A) openly reply to or reblog the person I'm disagreeing with to engage with or debate them directly, or (B) avoid specifically naming them. (Though I've gotten some negative blowback from approach A in the past. Apparently some users feel that simply writing up and sharing their opinions on Tumblr does NOT put those opinions up for discussion/debate, so to them, any disagreement or further conversation is... just not welcome *shrug*.)
But I'm glad you see value in these posts/discussions regardless. And I understand where you're coming from. I've certainly felt like an isolated party in regards to my opinion vs. common fandom views on certain things before. And I've gotten involved in messy discussions on here in years past with some pretty big-name voices in the fandom. It can be isolating to feel like there's a majority opinion or a powerful fandom voice who is promoting a perspective you just CAN'T understand, that feels deeply wrong to you. And I do like the idea of providing some kind of respite from/support against that feeling. I just...... don't want that act to then feel like we're calling out people behind their backs.
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THE ASOIAF BOOK REVIEW.
The Main Series, Best to Worst:
1.
A Storm of Swords
It’s interesting how Dany, Sam, and Brienne both express the same idea in Storm, that the strong should protect the weak. This is a central idea within Storm: authority.
In Storm, Jon is plunged into a world without rules, and yet he still follows the rules which commanded his life before him.
Robb is forced to make morally dubious decisions in order to protect his reign, as does Dany.
Davos undermines the authority of someone he’s sworn to help because it’s the right thing to do.
However, heavy is the head that wears the crown, as we see how responsibility weighs on Robb, Edmure, Cat, and Dany.
Dany and Jon and Davos are forced into these very ethically messy situations. These situations place them in the center of arguments concerning power and freedom.
The book does not answer these questions. Is Ygritte right that everyone should be allowed to do whatever they want? Is Jorah right when he argues the ends justify the means?
Who knows.
Moving on. Storm sticks out from the rest of the books due to its pacing, as pretty much every chapter advances both the arcs of the characters and the plot.
For such a great novel, it might have the weakest prologue, in my opinion. It’s not bad, but it doesn’t have the suspense of Game, the fantastic character building of Clash, or the beautiful mysticism of Dance. However, immediately after that, we get Jaime I and the banger chapters start coming and they don’t stop coming.
Jaime’s story is very close to perfect. As stated, his dynamic with Brienne is fantastic, and his arc is perfectly paced and extraordinarily satisfying. It’s impressive how Jaime goes through such a monumental change in just nine chapters, and it still feels real. Plus, the adventure he and Brienne go on is a legitimately fun adventure where you don’t know what will happen next. All of the foes they face are interesting and test them in unique ways, it rarely wastes time in unnecessary details, and did I mention how well Jaime and Brienne play off one another?
Arya’s chapters work just the same, with all of her little stops being intriguing, distinct from one another, and helpful in moving her character arc along. It does get a bit annoying how long it takes for her to meet Dondarrion, but if I couldn’t stand being impatient, then I wouldn’t read this series. Arya at the end at the Crossroads is the perfect culmination of her story so far, with both her internal and external conflict coming to a head.
This is probably Jon’s best book, as every chapter of his is insanely intense. Undercover stories are always interesting, and they are made all the more interesting when the undercover agent falls in love with someone. They’re made even more fascinating when his undercover adventure makes our undercover agent question his worldview. There is not a single dull moment in these chapters. Jon is always in danger, always going through a dozen moral quandaries and character conflicts, and there’s always something really cool going on with the Wildlings. There really does not seem like there’s a way for Jon to get out of this situation, and that fills the chapters with a huge amount of suspense.
Plus, Jon’s relationship with Ygritte manages to work despite how little time it’s given, capturing this feeling of rebellious young love.
It is a bit weird that Jon’s story has multiple climaxes to it. Him choosing to stay at the wall is the climax of his arc so far while Stannis defeating Mance is sort of the climax in the sense that it’s the height of the action. Basically, the internal and the external conflicts in Jon’s story are resolved at different times.
Dany’s chapters are decent, I guess. They have some nice character moments for Dany, some fun action, and it’s satisfying to watch Dany slowly rise to power.
However, her chapters suffer from how under-developed Slaver’s Bay is as a location, and how uninteresting every character is (except for her and Meissandei).
Also, like, obviously the oppressed group needs to be oppressed, but can you at least have them be defiant? The image of oppressed groups simply being helpless little guys who can’t do anything is an outdated storytelling device. Give us an Unsullied who isn’t completely loyal. Don’t make everyone Dobbie. The reason why Meissandei is interesting is because she seems to be the only enslaved person who isn’t completely obedient.
We should feel more for these characters than pity. Pity does not humanize someone- humanity does.
And, as I said, Slaver’s Bay is a location with lots of cool facts and history and buildings, and yet, it doesn’t feel nearly as alive as Westeros. On the surface, Slaver’s Bay is far more interesting than Westeros, as Westeros is very similar to many other fantasy locations. However, Westeros shines because of how detailed and meticulous George is with his world building. We don’t just get a few lines on the religion, we see how The Faith affects characters like Davos and Catelyn, and we see the same for those who believe in the old gods.
All of this means that we get what the people of Westeros are about. However, we never really know what traits the Ghiscari value, how the citizens of Slaver's Bay the world, or how their culture affects their behavior. I definitely don’t know much about the Ghiscarin religion.
Worldbuilding is essential to Song, as the destruction of feudalism is also a deconstruction of the fantasy genre itself. However, Dany’s chapters aren’t really deconstructing the society she is in.
Dany does shine in these chapters, however. I like the part where she is badass, cries alone in her room, and then continues being badass. It’s such a mood. Plus, caring for everyone because she
It is also good writing to have such a moral character be put in a moraless environment.
Still, everything in Mereen and Astapor, while extremely important to her character, feels like a sidequest whose only purpose is to get more loot so Dany can do the main quest. All of the other chapters in ASOS manage to weave character and plot progression really well, but it’s difficult with Dany. Apparently, George originally planned on her invading in the second book, and you can kind of tell from how stretched out her story feels. And this time could be spent fleshing out the side characters and the world, but there isn’t even any flesh to flesh out. There’s no meat on the bones! The events in Mereen and Astapor probably wouldn’t feel that way if we were more fully engrossed in the world.
Also, I can list a million differences between The North and the Riverlands, but the only difference I can think between Mereen and Astapor is that Mereen has a pyramid.
Moving on, Cat’s stuff is fantastic. Duh. The drama works. The characters are all fantastic. The Red Wedding is one of the most effective moments ever. If I haven’t sung these praises then I already will. Pretty much all of her chapters deliver a trillion different excellent character moments.
I wish I could have had the experience of reading Storm without knowing that the Red Wedding would happen. However, it was still just as shocking and powerful, and it never loses its impact with every reading. The tension leading up to the chapter always reverberates in my bones.
Bran’s chapters are simple, with only a few characters, and all of these characters are really fun to watch.
The vibes of these chapters are a mix between a post apocalyptic and childlike quality often only found in Studio Ghibli films. Bran and Meera and Jojen and Hodor and Summer are alone in this expansive world. Freedom is simultaneously wondrous and terrifying, as is magic and also growing up. Of course, a big part of growing up for many people is gaining freedom and having to deal with that freedom, because it means you have no safety net to catch you if you fall.
Like with many other character’s stories, there’s always danger within Bran’s chapters.
My problem with Bran’s story is that they end suddenly halfway through the book. Every other character gets a pretty fantastic final moment, but Bran is just kind of forgotten about. That’s easily my biggest complaint about this book.
Davos’ stuff is very good. He’s a great character in great company, and his story fits snuggly into this thematic tapestry the book weaves. As I said previously, Davos is making a similar decision to the one Jaime once did, breaking an oath to serve the greater good. Davos reading the message from the wall to Stannis is another example of how good this book is at giving us a culmination of a character’s arc. Davos also has a lot more agency in this book then he did in Clash, which means he’s a lot more active, making decisions which actively affect the story.
Sansa’s stuff is very good. She’s in a situation where she’s completely alone and at the mercy of everyone around her, and even those who seem to be helping don’t really help her. Her story has the tragedy which the death of innocence brings.
Sam’s first chapter is some of the most intense and gripping writing in the entire series, and so is his second and third. It’s pretty much non stop action, broken up by some angst, and that is exactly what I want out of a story. Sam is the perfect character to be put in this extremely harsh environment, and seeing him get out of it is satisfying because he fucking rocks. The dude is doing the most impressive stuff ever all the while hating himself, and that is very relatable.
Also, his chapters, and the book as a whole, also make good use of beginning the chapter in media res and then going back in time to explain how the characters got there. There’s no reason why I like it, it’s just a fun bit of styling.
Sam’s arc in this book is pretty much perfect, with him meddling in the election making a perfect culmination.
The first half of Tyrion’s story is alright, but then Joff dies and shit gets wild. Tyrion’s entire messy, complicated arc comes to a head in a few giant, extraordinarily impactful, scenes. Those final Tyrion chapters are filled to the brim with some of the best moments of the series, whether they be Tyrions “I wish I had enough poison to kill all of you” speech, the battle between Oberyn and the mountain, and Tyrion and Jaime’s confrontation.
Tyrion’s entire trial feels like the nightmare of an insecure person, where everyone comes and mocks you and you have no one to depend on. It’s interesting to compare it to Jon’s predicament occurring at the same time. However, Jon has all of these people who do stand by him, and Tyrion does not. It’s funny how Tyrion spends all of Clash gaining power, but he never built up an actual support network or whatever, so everyone just kind of abandoned him (except Jaime, and Podrick I suppose, maybe Garlan would have helped him if he had asked).
It’s sad that not only are Tyrion’s loves all paid for, so are his friendships.
Basically, Storm has all of the traits of ASOIAF at its peak. The character drama is heartbreaking, the magical and realist elements are blended beautifully, the story has never felt more huge yet more interconnected, and every chapter ends on a cliffhanger. The political aspects are as intriguing and layered as they always are, the action is intense and biting, and every character is used perfectly.
Every character’s journey goes through multiple phases. Jon spends the first third of his story undercover, then he’s caught in a tidal wave of violence, and then Stannis the Mannis shows up and he gets elected. It’s the same with everyone else. Storm is not a story which stays in one place for long, and as such, it has a chaotic, whirlwind feeling to this. However, there is a controlled, almost mathematical, method to this chaos, with every character beat placed perfectly within the story. The pacing never abruptly changes its speed, and every chapter is placed so as to perfectly juxtapose with the chapters next to it.
One thing George is consistently great at is testing his characters, both in terms of ethics and resolve. Each character in Storm is put into a situation which is the most challenging to them specifically, whether it be Jon’s commitment to his oath being tested, Dany’s leadership skills on trial, or Sam needing to depend on his courage to survive.
Storm also uses its structure of multiple POVs excellently. We see Arya thinking that Cat might not want her back, and then we see Cat going through absolute mental hell because Arya is missing, and it’s absolutely tragic. Tyrion wishes he was Jaime, and then Jaime has to act like Tyrion to save Brienne.
There’s also Tyrion’s relationship with Sansa, which makes excellent usage of this device. We see how both are equally miserable for completely different reasons, and boy oh boy is it painful to read!
One of the best uses of multiple POVS is when Sam meets up with Bran. It is one of the most satisfying moments of the entire series. I love when two characters in a story who don’t know that they’re connected meet up. It’s like a story showing off how sprawling it is.
The multiple POVs also make moments like Stannis saving the Wall feel well set up and satisfying, instead of just a deus ex machina.
In fact, the whole book is full of satisfying moments.
In the previous books, Ser Dontos gives Sansa the hair net, Mance Rayder is constantly mentioned, and justice for Elia is discussed. It’s here where all of that comes into play, and all of the threads collide to make all of these really satisfying moments.
It’s insane how this book manages to feel like one cohesive whole, and that’s mostly because George never lets the story get too big, with everything connecting and influencing each other.
Everything the series has been building up with Tyrion’s relationship with Tywin, the Freys, Roose Bolton, the Bloody Mummers, and a million other things come to their head, and each is executed perfectly, all of them coming to a pretty logical “conclusion”. All of these plot lines move with a quick feel, events leading to other events like a line of dominoes. This is not a story where events just happen, everything is a natural reaction to what has come before, and Storm represents this perfectly.
Another interesting thing about Storm is that it really loves the trolley problem. Robb chooses to kill Rickard Karstark because he thinks it’s necessary for him to continue ruling. Tywin defends doing the Red Wedding because it meant less people would die in the long run. Stannis ponders killing Edric to save the world.
Hell, Stannis has a conversation with Davos about killing Edric immediately after Tywin has a conversation with Tyrion about the Red Wedding.
Storm isn’t just about power and authority but specifically the morals of power and authority. These ideas are not pondered and examined so much as they are fiercely argued with both words and actions, the characters heatedly debating their opinions. This is a positive statement, it makes the book feel lively and energetic. We get all of these characters with different ideas on the same subject, and watching the clash is very entertaining.
A theme throughout these books has been whether or not the ends justify the means, if doing something bad in pursuit of something good is alright. Ned seems to believe the ends justify the means. In Game, he tells Arya that doing something dishonorable such as lying is alright if it's in the pursuit of something honorable, like saving the life of a dog or whatever they’re talking about in that scene.
In Storm, we see that Jaime has similar ideas, as that was his logic with killing Aerys II.
If I so chose to, I could complain about how this book has no real climax, with the Red Wedding being the most intense part of the book and only coming in the middle. However, climaxes are a made up concept, and I didn’t really mind when reading this book.
ASOS has a sense of finality to it, despite being the third book in a seven part series. That’s because it feels like many of the characters have completed an arc. Jon has gone from a little emo boy to a Lord Commander, Arya from a feisty tomboy to a vengeful killer, Jaime from a jerk to a jerk willing to work on himself, Tyrion from a comedian to a vengeful killer, Cat from alive to dead, and Dany from a helpless girl to a competent leader in her own right.
Not only do all of the plotlines in this book fall in place, they all fall into place in the most satisfying ways. Everything from the Purple Wedding to the Red Wedding to Petyr pushing Lysa out a window to Sam meeting Bran feel like half a dozen different plotlines crashing into each other, all of them leading to these pretty perfect character beats.
To recap,
Catelyn’s chapters are everything great about this series.
Arya’s chapters are everything great about this series.
Jaime’s chapters are everything great about this series.
Jon’s chapters are very quickly paced, stuffed to the brim with all the action, intrigue, and character dilemmas one can want.
Bran’s chapters all showcase the classic Bran formula to success, but his story has no real ending.
Giving Davos agency makes his story far more interesting.
Sansa’s chapters are as good as they are in Clash.
Sam’s chapters have something in them for everyone, whether one wants magic, political intrigue, angst, action, horror, or pretty descriptions of nature.
Dany’s chapters have the same issues as all her books, but she’s still a fun character to follow.
In conclusion, I’ve said everything I’ve needed to say.
2. A Feast For Crows-
This book has some of my favorite and least favorite stuff.
Brienne’s chapters kick butt. They’re slow, but simple, and the interesting characters coupled with the dense tapestry of themes makes it worth it. Plus, the slow pace makes the brutal moments feel extraordinarily gripping. The story rewards you for your patience. Seeing Brienne savagely massacre three people in Brienne IV is one of the most satisfying moments of the series because George very slowly builds the tension, faking you out a half dozen times. The agony of losing Dick Crabb and the amazement of seeing Brienne in action is definitely worth the four chapters of build up.
The slow pacing also allows every event to be given its proper weight. Brienne gets to stew over Dick Crabb and the men she’s killed.
You really feel the toll this journey is taking on Brienne is, even if that means having a page devoted to trying to find an inn. But, that’s the point. Brienne’s mission is simple, but she keeps getting involved in all of these annoying misdirections. It definitely communicates this specific feeling of stress and monotony which is very hard to express.
There is a wonderful, almost hypnotic, atmosphere to Brienne’s story, with all the descriptions of ruins and seascapes. It really places in Brienne’s shoes, and we feel what Brienne feels. Brienne VII, where she fights Rorge and Biter is one of the most impactful chapters ever. Biter eating Brienne’s face is not the most brutal and disgusting thing that has happened in this story, but I can think of very few things which feel more brutal and disgusting (except maybe the Red Wedding). This isn’t just because of how well it is written, but also because of the chapters of set up, with Brienne having this desire to prove herself and all these anxieties about failing and this and that.
Also, stories where people aimlessly wander through ruined and scarred lands are some of my favorites. It also really helps that all of the characters journeying with Brienne are fantastic, and we’ve already had many books to familiarize us with this section of the world, so it’s fun to explore it. We’ve spent about half of the series in the Riverlands and the Crownlands, so we already know the general vibes of the place. Despite this, George still manages to introduce us to tiny little pockets of which we haven’t seen yet like the Quiet Isle or Crackclaw Point.
The story also works great at showing us the real cost of the war by placing us on the ground, making the effects of the war more visceral. Most importantly, this all has an effect on Brienne. This makes it different from, say, Tyrion’s chapters in Dance, where he seems rather apathetic to what is going on in Lys or whatever. And, if the main character doesn’t care, then why should we? George makes the right move by tying a lot of what is going on to Brienne’s past by having characters like Randall Tarly and Hyle Hunt, as well as having everywhere she goes or everyone she meets affects her character in some way, from everything from Dick Crabb to that bathtub which was annoyingly small. Despite how stretched out the story feels, I legitimately can not think of a single moment that could all be cut. Even if everything doesn’t move the plot forward, it’s really crucial for our understanding of Brienne as a character, and it makes all of the emotional parts of her story feel like you’re being bludgeoned by a baseball bat.
Plus, it’s perfect that Brienne goes out looking for Sansa and instead finds Lady Stoneheart. Now that’s what I call Subversion that Ties Perfectly Into the Themes of The Piece.
Most importantly, Brienne’s story tackles a huge amount of different subjects, discussing religion, war, gender, sexuality, and a million other things and then ties them all together in this subversion of a knight’s quest to save a damsel.
Moving on, Cersei's chapters are nothing but fun, as she slowly spirals into insanity, all the while failing at everything. She’s a fantastic character to see the world through the eyes of, and her paranoia makes the already cutthroat world of politics all the more spicy.
Every chapter tells us a little more about Cersei’s character and has some of the funniest moments in the series.
Sansa’s chapters are full of fun political shenanigans and a large cast of quirky characters who all bounce off each other really well. There’s a great mix of intrigue, humor, and drama as Sansa slowly learns the ropes of political espionage in this new environment. The Eyrie is a fantastic location, with its beauty and isolation, and it gives Sansa’s story a very contained feeling. This makes sense, as Sansa is in this very pretty prison. Sansa is simulatenously free and more trapped than she’s ever been, and this sends her character in a really intriguing direction.
Sam’s stuff is alright. Aemon’s death is obviously very sad, and that one chapter in Oldtown is nice because Oldtown is a fun place to explore. Sam’s constant self hatred does start to get tiresome after a while, especially considering the fact that his character seems to actively revert. At the end of Storm, Sam seems to have found a new sense of bravery, and then it’s gone. Sure, progress isn’t always linear, but it feels like Sam is just back to who he was at the beginning of Storm.
However, Sam is in good company. There’s lots of very minor characters, like the captain of the Cinnamon Wind and his daughter, who are very fun and add a lot of vibrancy to the world. George also plays with a lot of time in Sam’s chapters, like the one with Aemon dying constantly jumping back and forth. Usually, George will usually start in the middle of the action and then flashback to what happened before, but with Sam’s chapters in both Storm and Feast, we’re actively pinballing around, till there’s not even really a present- if that makes any sense. This has a cool effect.
Arya’s chapters are quite slow, but I don’t mind because it means we can just soak up the awesome setting. Arya is a 10 year old member of a death cult/group of immortal face changing assassins, how can that not be interesting? Plus, Arya’s character is just so fun and layered, it’s hard not to be invested in her struggle with identity. Once again, Song always knows the perfect place to put their characters. Of course the character obsessed with identity and revenge is in a place which offers her the ability to commit vengeance while stripping her of all of her identity.
Bravos is also easily the most developed place in Essos, being a mix of New York and Venice. Half of the chapter “Cat of the Canals” is just Arya drinking the city in and it works because Bravos is just so vibrant, full of fun pockets of worldbuilding, a forest of delights. I could spend an entire book learning about the Bravos and the temples and the Titan and the courtesans and the mummers and everything else.
Moving on, Jaime’s story is full of fantastic side characters, but the star of the show is still Jaime, who is just a delight to follow. He has one of the funniest inner monologues, and it mixes very well with how angsty his inner monologue can also be. All of the fun characters Jaime meets along the way really help move his character along, whether they be Lancel or Genna or Emmon Frey or Lyle Crakhall or that one lady who corrected her grieving daughter’s grammar.
Plus, if you remember my character ranking, I already talked about how making Jaime have to do a siege is fantastic for his character growth.
Everything else in the book is Eeeeehhhh. As I’ve said or will say, The Dourne Plot is boring as all hell.
George asks a lot of us with the Dourne plot. We’ve just had three books with a very large cast of characters, and then we’re plunged into a new pocket of the world and introduced to a dozen or so new characters. Dourne isn’t an uninteresting place, it is just that we are going to compare it to places such as the North and King’s Landing which we already know a lot more about.
Not only that, but the characters are also far less developed and fun than the characters we already know. I really don’t care about Arianne and Areo Hotah and Arys Oakheart.
The worldbuilding feels similarly lukewarm. Dourne is very interesting when it’s off to the side, but when it’s the main focus, it just comes across as the rest of Westeros but with feminism and spicy food. We never hear about unique traditions or anything of that sort. We do only have four chapters in Dourne in this book, so we don’t get any time to explore this world.
However, here is a much bigger problem I have with the Dorne plot:
Feast is all about people failing, but at least most people's failures still have consequences. While Brienne’s quest to find Sansa and Arya fails, her discovery of Lady Stoneheart is going to mean a lot for her and Jaime. While going to Oldtown was basically a futile journey, at least Sam is in Oldtown, a place where he can get information.
All that The Dourne Plot accomplishes is killing off Arys and getting Myrcella’s face cut up. I suppose Arianne learns some lessons along the way, but as I previously stated, I don’t care. Dourne’s future in the story is going to be helping Young Griff. That’s all we needed. Oh yeah, I guess the Darkstar plot is going to go somewhere…I guess. Maybe it will affect the larger story of the books, who knows?
It’s possible that Winds will eventually make all of the Dorne plot feel worth it, but until then, I’m still pissed off at it.
It also doesn’t help that half of the Dourne plot is actually the Dourne plot. The first chapter, the Areo Hotah one, is just here to set the scene, even though the Sand Snakes introduced in the chapter do very little in Feast going forward. Arianne and Arys Oakheart are barely in this chapter, so much of The Soiled Prince is dedicated to setting them up
Not only that, but many of the other important players, Arianna’s friends and Darkstar, are introduced in the Queenmaker, so we have to spend half of that chapter doing introductions. As a result, introductions make up most of the Dourne plot.
After the Soiled Prince and the Queenmaker, the actual meat of the story, we then get The Princess in the Tower, which is basically just an epilogue to the story, featuring Doran dropping a massive exposition dump whose purpose is mainly to set up how the Dourne plot will continue. All in all, it feels like the Dorne plot is just set up. I guess you could say that contradicts what I said before about the Dourne plot seeming meaningless, but the actual story of the plot feels meaningless, with its only purpose being to set up Arianne’s role in the Young Griff plot to come.
Despite all of this, the Dorne Plot is way too quick, not giving enough time for us to actually get to know the characters or the world. That’s because it’s basically a side plot. We can’t spend dozens of chapters on a side plot introduced more than halfway through the story. However, the Dourne plot demands more time. I’m not sad when Arys Oakheart dies because I don’t know him, and the dynamic between Arianne and Doran isn’t even flushed out at all. All throughout the story, motives are uncertain, we never get a true feeling of what Dorne is actually like as a place, and the plot feels kinda contrived at some points, like when Darkstar just decides to kill Myrcella because he wants a war because…he’s jealous of Arthur Dayne? With more chapters, the world can be developed a bit more, and we can be given actual reasons for everything.
That’s because George had to introduce a whole new section of the world, with a whole new cast of characters, in a minimum amount of chapters. As a result, we get a lot of information and developments crushed into a very small amount of time.
This rapid speed causes a lot of minor problems which I’ll discuss in the chapter ranking.
Moving on, there is also The Iron Islands plot in Feast. Many of the problems with Dourne are here, and yet I don’t mind as much.
George asks a little less with us for the Iron Islands plot, as we have been there before and met our three POVs, if only briefly.
It helps that the Iron Islands is muuuuch more interesting than Dourne. It’s vikings mixed with Lovecraft mixed with Klingons, and it’s fantastic. Every aspect of the Iron Islands, from the architecture to the traditions to the way food is prepared has these very specific vibes baked into it, and you can just tell George was having fun coming up with stuff like Naga’s Ribs and The Seastone Chair.
Plus, the events of The Iron Islands Plot were significantly set up during the previous books, and the Iron Islands plot does feel like a natural evolution from what we hear in the previous two books. If that wasn’t enough, the mystery surrounding Euron’s character is more than enough to grab my attention.
Also, what the Iron Islands Plot sets up seems really interesting, filled with magic and intrigue. In contrast, I don’t care about whatever vengeance Doran has planned. There’s no real reason, even though I suppose all of those who wronged him being dead may be a factor. I simply don’t care about Doran and his goals. However, I do care about what Euron has planned because it seems very interesting, as he’s an evil warlock pirate. Basically, what I’m saying is that the rule of cool applies to the Iron Islands plot. Sometimes, it’s as simple as that. The Iron Islands plot has better characters, a more interesting setting, no cringey sex scenes, a much cooler action scene, a far greater atmosphere, and it fits more naturally in with the story. It also helps that it actually holds influence elsewhere in Feast, playing a part in Cersei’s story.
There’s a sense of mysticism and horror in The Iron Islands plot and an atmosphere of dread. There is both suspense and mystery. It gives the whole thing an energy, as well as stakes that aren’t really present in the Dourne plot.
The Iron Islands plot is similarly quick, being five chapters long, and yet, it never feels like we’re cramming in a huge amount of stuff into a small amount of time. That’s because it’s a fairly simple story, and a very focused one, centering itself around Euron and the choosing of a new king.
The Reaver also works much better as an ending note than The Queenmaker. The Reaver is full of action, and it feels like a climax. The Queenmaker is half uninteresting angst section and half exposition dump. I like angst, but in order for the angst to work, I need to care about the character.
Anyways, in two different chapters in Feast, two different peasants boast about having distant highborn ancestry, and I think that’s interesting.
Despite Feast being a bit of a mess, I’m still very grateful that it exists. Of the 45 chapters, 26 are from the POV of a woman, making this the only book in this series to be mostly from the female perspective. This means the book deals with gender the most of the entire series. All of the female POVs approach gender in a very different way, showing us this spectrum of experiences.
Gender is also important to many of the male POVs. Jaime feels emasculated due to the loss of his hand and because Cersei cheated on him. Sam is a man constantly haunted by the abuse he received for not appealing to his Dad’s standards of masculinity.
Victarion is this epitome of stereotypical masculinity who’s also really depressed and a total coward.
In Feast, see how patriarchy doesn’t work in just one way, it’s a spectrum of causes and effects, with many victims.
I would argue that if Feast were to have a central theme, it would be gender. In the character ranking, I talked about how the election of Euron
I guess it does make sense for Dourne to be here, as it is a place where gender and sex are seen very differently. Not only that, but it deals with this idea of pro-women movements failing because they’re still based in patriarchal ideas. Arianne convinced Arys by saying that Myrcella would make a better ruler than Tommen because she doesn’t cry and acts a lot more stoic. This relates to Asha, who constantly shows her strength by attacking the masculinity of men around her, saying they have no dick or calling them girly in some ways, and Asha also shows her strength by mocking the idea of being traditionally feminine, like with the joke about an ax being her baby.
Obviously, it’s alright for a woman to not be stereotypically feminine and be proud of it, but what Asha is doing is making the claim that she is strong despite being a woman and not because of it. She’s also continuing to display this myth that traditional masculinity equals strength.
Believers of this myth include Victarion, Randall Tarly, and Cersei, who is constantly putting down other women.
We see the consequences of this belief in the Iron Islands plot, when Euron uses these myths of masculinity to get himself elected.
It’s clear that one can’t fight fire with fire in order to deal with bigoted ideologies.
However, I still think the Dourne plot is boring.
There is one more problem I have with Feast. Some of the best parts of Song are when there’s a POV chapter sandwich. For example, during the Battle of the Blackwater we get a Tyrion chapter, then a Sansa chapter, then a Tyrion chapter. You know that shit is going down when that happens. However, that does not occur in Feast, which leads me to believe that shit does not actually go down in Feast.
Going back to positives, Feast is one of the best anti war narratives in how much pointless suffering we see results from war. An idea which is reinforced multiple times is that the Small Folk do not care who the king is, nor who they are fighting for. They just want to survive.
However, the stories are all sung about the important figures, the kings and noble knights. The reason we see two different commonfolk boasting about being part noble is that being noble makes them important.
Another theme which Feast focuses on is this idea of history repeating itself. Aeron thinks about it, Arys and Arianne discuss it, and it plays a key part in Cersei’s story.
Another note I have is that purposefully unsatisfying stories are very hard to successfully pull off. However, most of Feast’s plotlines are those kinds of stories. Somehow, almost all of these plotlines are quite enjoyable, which says volumes about how good George is as a writer.
To recap.
Brienne’s story is a masterpiece of character writing and world building.
Cersei’s chapters are as delightful as they are intelligent.
Jaime’s story is everything we’ve come to expect from the series, with an eclectic cavalcade of characters bouncing off each other in a fun world.
I can say the exact same with Sansa’s chapters.
Arya’s story benefits from simplicity, a fantastic main character, a well thought out location with a great atmosphere, and loads of magical intrigue.
Sam’s story is perfectly alright.
The Iron Islands plot shouldn’t work, but it does.
Dourne bores me to tears.
3. ACOK
The prologue to ACOK is the perfect tone setter for this book: a sad, regretful old man tries to do something, fails, and then dies in an embarrassing fashion.
The prologue is also some of George’s most beautiful prose. The description of Dragonstone and the comet is so mystical and otherworldly, it manages to fill you with the same sense of awe that magic does, but there isn’t even any magic.
The prologue also has some pretty concise writing, as we’re introduced to a huuuuge amount of characters in a short amount of time.
Really, the first couple chapters are all bangers. The device of the comet is perfect, tying all of these desperate points of view together. It shows how our characters, despite how different they are in every conceivable way, are all united by this shared sense of wonder and awe. There’s a line from The Outsiders about how everyone looks at the same sunset, and this reminds me of that. However, ASOIAF makes sure to show us that everyone sees the comet differently. Some see it as a sign of fortune, others as a good omen, and a few merely see it as a shiny thing in the sky. Many of the characters specifically see it as being good for their side, including supporters of all of the five kings. The descriptions of the comet are fantastic in pretty much every chapter, and George always manages to tie it into what’s going on in the chapter itself.
However, after the first 8 or so chapters, the book starts to drag on. It seems like we’re done setting the stage, but then the stage keeps on being set, and it feels like a lot of these characters aren’t moving forward.
It is in the middle of the story where the pace starts to pick up, and so do the fantastic character beats.
Arya’s chapters in this book place her character in a perfect position. She’s forced to grow up very suddenly. The freedom of adventure is now hers, but she keeps finding herself unable to be truly free. All of Arya’s chapters in ACOK and ASOS are mostly Arya escaping from some authority figure and then falling under the control of another authority figure. I think that’s great!
Arya’s chapters also do a fantastic job of showing us the horror of war from the ground.
Sansa’s chapters are filled with horror and angst. Just like Arya, Sansa has been given everything she’s wanted, as she’s now engaged to a prince. However, she’s now in a world where her actions have consequences, and those consequences matter. She’s forced to guard her tongue and control her emotions like she’s never had to before. That’s what growing up is all about.
Davos’ chapters in this book aren’t anything special. The characters of Davos, Stannis, and Melissandre are really fun. However, Davos doesn’t have much agency, and as such, he’s mostly just watching what’s happening, with his actions not really affecting the story. Having a character who doesn’t affect the plot can make a story rather tiresome.
Dany’s chapters in this are boring. She mostly spends wandering around aimlessly. The House of the Undying part has some great imagery, but that’s mostly it. You can skip all of her chapters in that book and it would change very little. Barely any progression is made in her arc, which contrasts extremely sharply with the AGOT, where she goes through a really well done arc that changes her immensely but doesn't feel rushed. It doesn’t help that Dany has very little in the way of character conflict in this story. The climax of her arc is the House of the Undying, and she does not make any decisions in the house. There’s no path she chooses to take. What she thinks at the beginning of the book and what she thinks at the end is the exact same.
book
Tyrion’s chapters are a fucking delight. It is so fun to watch this clever and witty guy play this political game. The other players of this game, like Cersei and Littlefinger and Varys, are also fun to watch. Unfortunately, they have some of the worst sex scenes in the entire series. It’s annoying when the first two thirds of the chapter has some clever plots filled with intrigue and the second third is just Tyrion boinking Shae for ten pages. They add nothing to the story, and are just unpleasant to read. Obviously, Tyrion’s angst about Tysha and how it affects his relationship with Shae is interesting, but the sex scenes focus mostly on just the sex, with Tyrion usually thinking about Tysha afterward.
This might be Jon’s weakest book, as he doesn’t really go through an arc in it. The big decision he makes is killing Qhorin Halfhand, but I feel like that’s something Jon at the beginning of Clash would also do.
It’s also one of the more slower stories, with a lot of wandering and discussion of Mance and events that don’t happen in this book. It’s not the worst thing ever, but it does feel Jon’s chapters are mostly just set up for the next book.
Theon’s chapters are much more quickly paced, as Theon goes from being on Robb’s side to pretending to kill Bran and Rickon. Theon’s monologuing is filled with personality, and watching this scummy person slowly getting what’s coming to him is fantastic. Theon can not stop taking Ls in this book, and it’s both fun and extremely tragic.
However, this book is really made by two POVs: Brans and Catelyns.
If you remember my character listing, I mention Bran’s role in this book quite a bit. This book is all about Bran learning to deal with responsibility and being away from Cat and Rob and it explores these ideas of growing up perfectly.
Then, there’s Cat's story. Oooh wee. This book features Cat just drowning in grief, but she is kicking and screaming and thrashing and it just hits you in the feels.
Cat II, ACOK is a masterpiece for this Brienne quote alone,
“Winter will never come for the likes of us. Should we die in battle, they’ll surely sing of us, and it’s always summer in the songs. In the songs, all knights are gallant, all maids are beautiful, and the sun’s always shining.”
(Catelyn II, ACOK)
Bran III to Catelyn II in ACOK is one of the best two chapter punches in all of ASOIAF. We go from Bran being bummed out at a party, watching all of the northern adults have a good time. Then, we have Catelyn being bummed out at a party, watching all of the sothron children having a good time. It is in this chapter that Catelyn talks to Matthis Rowan about how Renly and Brienne and Loras and all the young folk are “children of summer” who are excited to grow up, but they will soon find out how shitty adulthood is. That’s an important theme in this series, as that is what happens with Jon, Bran, Sansa, and Arya.
ACOK is a book of juxtapositions, and I think that’s what makes it work so perfectly. The insane horror within the Riverlands is juxtaposed by the festive mood within Renly’s camp, and that’s juxtaposed with the sour nature of Stannis’ camp.
We get five kings, all flawed in their own way, and all seen through the view of someone else. Theon’s homecoming is juxtaposed with Catelyn’s homecoming which is juxtaposed with Tyrion’s return to King’s Landing.
ACOK is also a book full of angst. Pretty much every character (except for Dany, and also Davos sort of) spends the entire book absolutely miserable and in love with the past.
Arya’s chapters are a journey through hell.
Bran is a lonely outcast in Winterfell, forced to only watch as everyone the merriment and excitement around him. Bran is defined by being a watcher, and how much he hates that. However, we do see that there is some good to that. He is good at reading people and learning about them. His choices of meals to send to others are based around observations he makes.
Theon is also outcasted, in a sense of complete culture shock.
Sansa is insanely outcasted, in a situation where she has no one to talk to and no shoulders to cry on. She is deprived of what she needs the most, which the story loves to do.
Tyrion is Tyrion. He’s angsty in every book, but he’s very contemplative in this, constantly thinking about Tysha.
Catelyn.
Jon is actually doing alright.
The result of all of this is that ACOK is a very empathic book, but it’s also kind of plodding. We’re in the middle of this extremely intense war, but we spend so much time on the character’s unresolved trauma. It can be annoying.
However, it does match what the characters feel. A lot of them are on the outside looking in, feeling frustrated about their lack of power.
I have one big complaint I haven’t already mentioned.
The Battle of the Blackwater serves as a fantastic climax for the story. Unfortunately, there are twelve chapters after it. A lot happens in these chapters, but after the Blackwater, I find myself just waiting for the book to wrap up. I feel like maybe Theon, Jon, and Dany’s last chapters could have been moved up to right before the battle. That way, we would only get chapters which focus on the consequences of the battle, as well as Bran’s chapter, which fits well as the ending.
However, Clash easily makes it up with its highs.
I would say that the beginning of Catelyn VII is one of the most emotionally devastating parts of Song, as that is the chapter where Catelyn has learned about the fake deaths of Bran and Rickon. It’s not difficult to make a woman mourning the loss of her two sons sad, but George rubs salt in every wound. Her grief over her children connects to her grief over Ned and her father, the way she had all of these responsibilities as a child, and everything the book has been doing with her character. It’s like all of Catelyn’s chapters in this book secretly build up to this barrage of brutality. Without Catelyn’s angst about how she’s far from her children and how she had always needed to be strong and her relationship with religion, this chapter would not hit as hard as it does.
And man, does it hit hard.
Cat’s entire life is falling apart in front of her eyes, and she’s basically in the worst possible scenario, and there’s no one she can talk to. She is completely and utterly alone. Everyone else (except for Brienne) is having a good time at the party, and being miserable when everyone else is happy is the worst possible feeling.
Really, every chapter from Bran III to The Battle of the Blackwater is gripping, as the chapters are pretty action-heavy. Theon’s story slowly builds to this epic crescendo of bad decisions, Arya is forced into an unknown dangerous situation which is perfectly designed to test her where every chapter ends on a cliffhanger, and the Blackwater pushes the characters of Sansa, Tyrion, and Davos almost to their breaking point, with all of them having their moments of bravery. Also, the descriptions of the battle are some of George’s finest prose. The way wildfire is described should be put in a museum.
A problem someone could have with Clash is that many of the characters don’t change a huge amount. Jon, Sansa, Davos, and Tyrion spend the book having their upcoming arcs being set up. They all make very important and character defining decisions, but these are decisions which they could have also made in the beginning of the book. Meanwhile, Dany…knows more, I guess.
Obviously, what happens to these characters in this book is important. Jon becomes less trusting of the watch because of Craster Keep, gets in touch with his inner warg, and kills Qhorin. Davos doesn’t speak out and gets punished for it. Tyrion does something kind of heroic and gets punished for it, with all the credit going to someone else. The thing is, these events don’t factor into our character’s decisions until A Storm of Swords.
There are exceptions.
Catelyn changes a lot, in that she slowly descends further into despair, and then when she’s at her lowest of lows she finds her strength and makes a decision she definitely would not have made previously. That last moment of her asking Brienne to give her the sword is the perfect final note for her.
Theon slowly descends into despair, but refuses to step up to the challenge, falling further into his own vices.
Arya and Bran both learn confidence, with Bran regaining his will to live.
This does make Clash stand out from Game and Storm, which has some fantastic character arcs. However…I don’t really mind a huge amount. Even if these characters don’t change, all of them are placed in really interesting situations which reveals a lot more about who they are. Plus, the characters who do change go through very well written arcs. I’ve already sung my praises of Catelyn’s story, Theon’s descent is written with huge amounts of nuance and realism, and Bran’s final realization that he’s glad he’s alive is one of the most satisfying ending notes imaginable.
I think one of the things which makes Clash very notable is that it focuses heavily on religion and belief. The comet is an obvious example of this, with everyone seeing this natural phenomenon and applying their own beliefs to it. A dozen different metaphors are made out of this one object, and so many people use this phenomenon to back up their own beliefs.
The comet is a bit like a story which everyone is reading and has different interpretations of it. The comet is also like the folklore of Planetos, as so much of it is different interpretations of the same thing, like how Azor Ahai and the Last Hero and The Stallion Who Mounts the World are probably the same person. Goddamn, the comet represents so much.
As the story moves on, we see how grief changes the religion of Cat. Her returning to the lands beneath the neck means she’s in a place where there are multiple different septs, as opposed to her life before. The other character who seems interested in the Faith of the Seven is Davos, who is also another “follower” type character. Davos keeps saying he isn’t religious, but he keeps finding trouble with what Melisandre is saying.
Tyrion provides an opposing view of religion, with his cynicism and atheism.c
With Bran, it’s not about religion but about belief in magic, as Lewin and Jojen pull him in two different directions. Magic does become sort of like a religion to Bran in the end as he uses it for comfort in a similar way to Catelyn using the Seven.
Meanwhile, Sansa uses religion as a shield with the God Grove or whatever it’s called.
Jon and Arya both interact with heart trees.
While religion is definitely present and explored in Feast, it is not viewed through a personal lens as it is in ACOK, where many characters actively grapple with their own religious beliefs.
This is best described with Harrenhal and Saltpans.
Harrenhal is mentioned frequently in Clash, in Tyrion, Sansa, and Cat chapters, and it actually appears in Arya’s story. While Harrenhal has little to do with the Faith of the Seven or the old gods, it has everything to do with belief, as it is always accompanied by talk of ghosts. This belief is very important to Arya’s arc, as she becomes the ghost in Harrenhall, and it helps connect her to Sansa, who also uses religion as a shield and also becomes a part of a story by becoming Jonquil. Harrenhall is also a bit similar to the comet, as people view the ghost stories in different ways.
The massacre at Saltpans, meanwhile, is mentioned many times in Jaime, Cersei, and Brienne chapters in Feast. This is an event where hundreds of followers of the Seven are brutally murdered and raped. This very clearly deals with religion. However, this event does not make any character question their faith. Instead, it influences the story in political terms, with the characters having to deal with reactions to the event.
Basically, Clash is interested in examining belief while Feast is interested in how religion affects the world.
Anyways, to recap:
Catelyn’s chapters are a ceaseless thunderstorm of grief and angst as heartbreaking as they are engrossing.
Arya’s chapters are a never ending parade of action and cruelty.
Tyrion’s chapters sparkle with political intrigue which lets our clever character shine.
The chill and simple nature of Bran’s chapters give us time for some fantastic Bran moments.
There are very few dull moments in Theon’s chapters, as the character we follow is an explosive one making extraordinarily terrible decisions with extraordinarily terrible consequences.
Davos is a great character surrounded by other great characters, which makes up for his overall lack of agency in the story.
Jon’s chapters are a bit slow, but the intriguing locations and characters make up for that.
Dany’s chapters are pointless drudgery, except for the House of the Undying, obviously.
In conclusion, Clash slaps.
4. A Game of Thrones.
This is a really tight story. We’re introduced to this new world, a huge cast of characters, and a whole lot of intrigue and mystery all within 800 pages or so. The amount this book manages to accomplish in such a small amount of time is legitimately impressive. Good job, George.
This book’s “simplicity” does make it one of the most readable of the books.
Plus, the climax is gripping all the way through, with it feeling like every emotional thread is coming to its peak. It’s also one of the few books here that actually feels like it had a real climax, but this is a book, not a movie, so it doesn’t really matter. It still has a very consistent pace which never lets the story drag.
Not only that, “For the first night in over a hundred years, the night came alive with the sound of dragonsong” is one of the best closing lines of any book ever.
I have very few complaints with Thrones. I guess the pace does occasionally slow down a bit, especially with a lot of the later Bran chapters. Also, you can tell George had not clearly thought the world out yet, so we end up with the Valyrian steel dagger and Joff and Sansa chasing “a shadowcat back to its layer”.
A problem with this one is Game is that it feels less…”thematically cohesive”, shall we say. ACOK is very focused on belief and religion, contrasting religious characters like Cat and Davos with more cynical characters like Tyrion and Theon, and then showing characters in the middle like Arya and Bran. ASOS is interested in power and power dynamics, with Dany and Robb learning to wield power, Jaime and Tyrion losing power, and Jon struggling with freedom. Gender plays a key role in AFFC, both in the perspectives of the female and male characters.
However, AGOT and ADWD don’t have a central idea at their heart. Sure, they both deal with identity and gender and power and trauma, but there’s nothing to centralize and tie this all together. ACOK ties together its narrative through the use of the comet, everyone looking at it and taking different beliefs from it. ASOS centralizes its narrative by having almost every POV character either interact with a monarch or be a monarch, and also almost every character makes a big life-changing decision at the end, as well as having two weddings that go badly, two characters falsely imprisoned, two duels, et cetera. AFFC centralizes its narrative with almost every character dealing with gender, repeating these ideas of the repetition of history and of the aftermath of carnage, and also by having most characters fail in some way.
It’s stuff like this which keeps the series from feeling messy, but it’s missing from AGOT and ADWD. Thankfully, while AGOT’s themes might be all over the place, its plot is not.
AGOT doesn’t have a huge amount of POVs, and most of the characters are tied up in the conflict at the start of the War of the Five Kings. Almost every character is at Winterfell at the party in the beginning and almost every character gets to react to Ned’s death (or, if they’re Ned, they’re the one who does the dying). That is actually one of the strengths of AGOT, almost everything feels all tied together, with the plot unfolding in a series of reactions like a complicated maze of dominoes. This is the book where different POVs interact with each other the most. It would be impossible to read just a single character’s POV chapters and have it make sense (except for Dany, I suppose), which does make the plot feel more “contained”.
It also helps that about 50% of this story takes place in either Winterfell or King’s Landing.
Despite my issues, pretty much every character’s arc works perfectly.
Ned’s chapters are the series' first taste of political intrigue, and it handles it perfectly. Song understands that to have good political intrigue, you need to make us first care about the characters in the political situation, set up clear stakes, and add a touch of mystery. Also, you can’t get too bogged down in the details, remembering that everything must be tied back to the characters' conflicts. It’s this stuff which makes Council Meetings about taxes on wine and ships being built not just interesting but fascinating.
It’s also very enjoyable to tour through Ned’s mind. Everything he’s encountering ties very well into his past, whether it be killing Dany, visiting Robert’s bastards, or just talking with Bobby B. We don’t really care about who murdered Jon Arryn, but we do care immensely about Ned and his struggle.
Dany’s chapters are her tightest story, with her going through a very efficient arc where she gets agency. Her last chapter has some of George’s finest prose, as the birth of dragons is given the exact amount of gravitas it deserves. We’ve had more than ten chapters building up dragons, and their introduction at the very end of the story does not disappoint, as the descriptions of Dany going in and out of Drogo’s funeral pyre are absolutely enchanting.
This is probably Bran’s weakest book, as he isn’t really…doing anything. With his last couple chapters, his only purpose is just to give us an eye into Winterwell. However, I like Bran a lot, so I don’t mind just hanging out with him.
As I discussed in my character ranking, Jon’s character arc is very tight and satisfying, and our introduction to the world of The Watch is fun.
Arya’s chapters have a very fantastic build to them as the situation in King’s Landing gets worse and worse. However, it’s also definitely her weakest book, as she has little in terms of inner conflict or introspection.
Sansa’s chapters have the same problem as Arya’s, as Sansa isn’t dealing with much, mostly just watching tourneys and eating lemon cakes. However, her chapters are still enjoyable on a reread because they set up so much.
Cat’s story goes through many phases, which does make it interesting, as she’s always on the move. The amount of ground covered by her story makes it feel quicker than some of the character plotlines which just stay in one place.
Tyrion is just being Tyrion. He’s a great character at his most charming and likable. I guess you could also say that means he’s also at his least interesting. However, the people he encounters and the places he goes to are all very interesting. We also get some neat battles in his chapters.
Overall, AGOT is the book which I have the least to say about. That’s good in the sense that it has very few flaws but bad in the sense that not much of it is outstanding. I don’t feel the need to recap my thoughts.
5. A Dance With Dragons
A Dance With Dragons is a very messy book.
If you asked me what the three greatest strengths and the three greatest flaws in this story were, I’d say the greatest strengths were the characters, the worldbuilding, and the prose. The greatest flaws are the pacing, the complexity, and the weird sex scenes.
Dance had all of these strengths and flaws on full display.
Let us again go character by character.
Dany’s chapters are boring.
Now, Dany’s chapters in Dance do explore her character well by putting her in a difficult situation where her morals are tested and there seems to be no escape. That on its own works well. However, there are some problems.
First, her chapters are stuffed with side characters and a lot of them barely get time to make an impression. There’s Hizarh Loraq, Daario Noharis, Galizza Golare, Skahaz Mo Kandaq, Reznak Mo Reznak, and fifteen others. Some are better than others, but most have very bland personalities. A result of this is that a lot of the character’s blend together. There are so many, it’s impossible to keep track, and almost all of them have very unusual names which are difficult to remember. I know that last part is a bit silly, but it did affect my ability to remember who was what. Simply put, her chapters in Dance are way too complicated.
It feels like her chapters have all of the moving parts of everything going on in Westeros, but crammed together into a little more than a dozen chapters.
The extremely slow pace of Dany’s chapters in Dance doesn’t help any of this either. There are definitely some very good moments. Her final chapter is great simply because it’s just her chilling. I know I just complained about the slow pacing, but slow pacing is only really a problem in certain contexts. Brienne’s chapters in Feast are slow paced, but I’m fine with that because her chapters are much simpler. What I mean is that slow pacing works best when everything is simple (mostly). Dany’s last chapter works for me because it’s her meditating on her life, and there’s a nice atmosphere, and we get a bunch of cool symbolism and imagery. In most of Dany’s other chapters, she’s thinking about whether she can either trust someone we don’t care about or someone else who we also don’t care about. It’s sort of like Dany’s story is fast paced when zoomed in, as something’s always happening, but when you zoom out, you realize that all of this stuff together forms a very slow moving plot. I think that makes sense.
Other than Dany’s final scene, there are some other great moments, like the man with the dead daughter, Dany comforting Missandei, and Drogon breaking loose, but these are diamonds in the rough.
It’s not “bad writing”, as it does accomplish everything George wants to do in terms of character progression and themes, but it is tiresome and tedious reading.
One thing they Dany’s story does show is how difficult writing this entire series is, as George has to juggle all of these plot threads, tie them together with character arcs and consistent themes, and all the while make sure it’s all logical and “realistic”. It can pay off in fantastic ways, but it can also lead to George writing himself into corners, which is the entire Slaver’s Bay plot. Dany is spending so long there, and yet, the only essential part of it plot-wise is that Dany needs to build her forces so she can conquer Westeros. However, it would be out of character for Dany to leave with the slavery thing being unresolved, and it wouldn’t make much sense if the slavery thing did resolve quickly. So, she has to stay in Mereen and go through all of these shenanigans. I don’t know what else George could have done, but I do know that the Mereen plot is extremely boring. Sure, it pushes Dany’s character forward by forcing her in this very tricky moral situation, and there’s a lot of questions it raises about the ethics of cultural interference and authority, but I just want her to go to Westeros. Plus, all of this would work better if it took place in an interesting place where at least half of the characters are interesting.
Plus, George himself has commented on how convoluted it is, talking about the “Mereneese knot”. Just as an example, I looked at the Wiki page for Dany II ADWD, and 19 characters appear, 31 are mentioned, and 56 places and terms are mentioned. That’s too much!
Moving on, let’s talk about Tyrion’s chapters! They’re also mostly pretty boring. Tyrion V and IV are the exceptions, mostly because those are the chapters where Tyrion spends the entire time with Young Griff’s crew, who are all fantastic characters. I don’t mind spending time doing nothing when we have all these fantastic characters. However, when Young Griff’s crew are absent, the story has to be carried by Tyrion, and also sometimes Penny. Sure, Tyrion is a great character, but that doesn’t mean squat if everyone else, other than Penny, is just a middle eastern stereotype.
Plus, for much of Tyrion’s journey, I was just waiting for him to get to Mereen. They say it’s about the journey, not the destination, but the journey was very uninteresting for the most part, as way too much time was spent on long descriptions of random locations in Essos. Young Griff’s crew were great, but most of the other minor characters he met along the way were on a spectrum from bland to annoying, and most of the places he visited were your generic middle eastern inspired fantasy setting.
Plus, the chapters are extraordinarily slowly paced, and it doesn’t feel like they have to be, like with Brienne in Feast. They just feel like George really likes Tyrion and wants us to spend a lot of time with him- even if nothing is going on. If the time spent apart from the plot built Tyrion’s character or gave us insight into what the book was saying then it would be fine, but that time is instead mostly taken up with filler.
Indulgent is the key word to explain Tyrion’s chapters. We’re constantly indulging in long, very pretty, sections of prose going on about how the Rhoyne looks, or the history of Volantis, or yadayada ya. Sure, it’s very well written prose, but it becomes an absolute slog.
Song is always interested in the details of everything, but we don’t need a two paragraph description of a ship, or summaries of three different books in a bookshelf, or ten different food descriptions in one chapter. We also don’t need four different conversations every chapter, three of which don’t tell us anything but how clever Tyrion is. About half of Tyrion’s story in this book actually has some use.
From the perspective of Tyrion’s character and the themes of the story, which I suppose are the most important parts of all of this, I have no complaints. Tyrion’s descent into darkness is realistic, horrifying, and intriguing, and him slowly piecing himself back together thanks to Penny is just as exciting. However, it’s easier to interact with themes and characters if you’re reading something interesting.
It doesn’t help that when Tyrion finally gets to Mereen, the chapters do become very plot-focused. However, this plot is the Mereen plot, which I have already stated to be boring. These last two Tyrion chapters are almost entirely devoid of interesting character moments, and almost entirely consist of discussions of the complex political situation within Mereen. I couldn't care less about the Yunkai or Qarth or this sellsword company or that.
I would be lying if I said there weren’t some fantastic moments in Tyrion’s chapters. Many of these come from Tyrion himself, as he is still a fantastically written character. Tyrion thinking about Jaime and Tysha in Tyrion V is heartbreaking, him apologizing to Penny is nice, and him arguing that his price as a slave should be raised is hilarious.
Basically, Tyrion’s chapters have some of the 20 best moments in all of Ice and Fire and 120 of the most boring moments.
Moving on, let’s talk about Quentyn. His chapters do end on a purposefully unsatisfying note, and new POVs this late do feel weird. However, Quentyn does encounter a lot of crazy stuff, and he does only have four chapters. Does that mean I like his chapters? No. They do feel unnecessary, both to this book and the larger story as a whole. His only purpose to the larger story seems to be freeing the dragons and maybe getting The Tattered Prince hired by Dany.
You know, many people cite slow pacing as the problem with Feast and Dance, and while that is occasionally true, many parts of these two books have the opposite problem. Quentyn’s story is a perfect example of this. Cletus Yronwood is apparently Quentyn’s best friend, and they have this really deep connection. However, we do not have the time to build the two up as companions. In fact, we don't get any time with them at all, as Cletus is already dead. We simply get a flashback with him dying. Was that scene intended to be sad? Because it’s not. We do learn more about Cletus, but it comes after we learn of his death. While I like non-linear storytelling as much as the next guy, sometimes it’s nice to show events in order.
The non- linear storytelling plays a big part in all of Quentyn’s chapters, and it gets very old very quickly. It ends up feeling like very little actually happens in each chapter. Quentyn is in the same place at a chapter’s beginning as he is with his chapter’s ending, except for his final chapter. Like, even though a huge amount happens in each chapter, at the same time, the plot doesn't really advance. It’s very…weird. The jumping around through time makes his chapters seem like a PTSD flashback. Do you know the album “Loveless”? It sounds like how Quentyn’s chapters feel, and while Loveless is one of the best Shoegaze albums ever, it is not the kind of vibe I want a low-fantasy book to have.
Quentyn’s chapters are really messy and full of so many jarring and dissonant tones, with really silly comedy and very dark settings thrown together. There’s no structure to them, no pattern or reasoning.
The idea behind Quentyn’s story is that it starts out full of optimism but then slowly sours, but we start out with it already being sour and get the optimistic part in scattered flashbacks. This means that Quentyn’s story is one without a beginning.
It doesn’t help that about 1/4th of Quentyn’s chapters is worldbuilding. Sure, so much of the stuff in Essos is really cool, like the sellsword company with the stilts, but I’m here for a story.
It feels like George is trying to push as much as he can into every chapter in Essos in this book. It’s like a Jackson Pollack painting but every color is a vibe. We get some mysticism, some whimsy, some grimdark, and some snark.
Also, while Tyrion and Dany’s chapters are anchored by their characters, Quentyn’s chapters have Quentyn. Now, I ranked Quentyn rather high on my character list because I do think he is a good character, but he’s definitely not a great character like Dany or Tyrion. While I’m not a huge fan of Dany and Tyrion chapters, they have many moments that are absolutely necessary for moving their characters along. Sure, Quentyn does go through a bit of an arc, however, we already got this arc with Theon.
We will get to stuff I like, but before that, I have to talk about Barristan’s chapters, which I do not like. The best part of the Mereen plot is watching how all of this affects Dany. Barristan, on the other hand, is very much so detached from all of this. He’s trying to redeem himself, yes, but nothing about Mereen connects to his past experiences or trauma like it does with Dany.
As a result, much of Barristan’s chapters will have him do some action within Mereen and then think of something completely unrelated. With most character POVS, their internal monologues contribute to the story, but with Barristan, it feels like they’re interrupting the story. One of the largest examples of this is when Bloodbears throws a decapitated head in front of Hizdarh. Barristan thinks a bunch about how different kings he knew would react to getting a head tossed their way, and after that, he grieves a bit because he knows the guy whose head got chopped off. It’s a very delayed grief, and it just feels strange, and it’s also never mentioned again. The whole internal monologue could just be taken out of the chapter, and it wouldn’t change anything.
Not only that, but Barristan is also an outsider to Mereen, just like Dany, and the perspective he gives isn’t much different than Dany’s. While Dany wasn’t raised in Westeros, she’s clearly familiar with their customs, as is Barristan, so both of them experience similar cultural issues.
I feel like it would be cool if Barristan’s POV was replaced by Grey Worm’s. Sure, I ranked Grey Worm low on the character ranking list, but George is a great writer, and he could have made Grey Worm interesting. Basically, I just think it would be nice to actually get the perspective of a slave, someone this is affecting. Maybe that’s the point. There are many stories which specifically don’t show the perspective of the victims of some sort of oppression. However, Song is all about having different perspectives, and Barristan does not give us a new perspective.
Now, I had a lot of negatives about those four stories, but I swear I like this book.
Moving on to stuff I enjoyed, Jon also had many chapters. Jon’s internal conflict in this story is similar to Dany’s, with both of them shirking their mental health in order to be effective leaders. However, Jon’s chapters were much easier to read as he’s in an interesting place with more interesting people and a more interesting external conflict.
Watching Jon forsake fun and friends hits because I like Jon’s friends, and the tough ethical decisions he made hit harder because I was invested in the story of the Wildlings and the wall. I also enjoyed watching him deal with Bowen Marsh and Stannis and Tormund.
Song likes talking about stuff that’s romanticized, whether it be war, romance itself, or, in Jon’s case, overworking. Jon is overworking himself, and he’s stretching himself to his limits, like when he swordfights three people at once. Jon is on that grind set, and it’s making him miserable.
It’s honestly astonishing how Jon goes through a new character arc every single book and every single character arc builds on each other, as his ideas of duty fight with his longing for human connection. Despite him encountering similar delimnas, the context they’re in is always changing, which means they never feel repetitive. Jon’s chapters are always some of the easiest to get through. They’re fast paced, never too complex or too simple, flush with cool characters and world building concepts.
Moving on. Joncon’s two chapters are fun as hell for the following reasons:
A., he’s just the kinda guy who’s fun to watch. B., his supporting cast is very nice. C., the plot actually moves forward, and events occur which have ramifications and change the story.
There’s also Asha. Her chapters are fun, I guess. Great characters, fast pacing, and a huge sense of dread are all I need.
Bran gets three chapters, and every single one of them slaps. They’re packed to the brim with dazzling mysticism, beautiful atmosphere, and perfect character work. It’s Bran at his peak, as it’s Bran at his bleakest. These chapters are also blissfully simple. There is no politics, no scheming, no massive ensemble of characters. Now, I do quite like the politics, scheming, and massive ensemble of characters. However, there’s something so gratifying about a chapter which is just three people in a cave with a bunch of nature spirits.
Also, George is just going ham with his prose in these chapters. The descriptions are eloquent and poetic, but it never feels like he’s being indulgent, as it all builds an incredible atmosphere. George takes a slightly different writing style with some characters, and with Bran, he rarely wastes time. While the descriptions are abstract and otherworldly, they’re also quick. For example,
“Their voices were as pure as winter air.” (Bran III, ADWD)
This style of prose makes sense, as Bran is a child. There is a definite sense of child-like wonder and awe to Bran’s chapters. The world is strange and confusing, but also really intriguing.
There’s also a lot of abrupt transitions in Bran’s chapters, with the book itself feeling like it has a low attention span, like a child. We go from Bran’s warging into Summer, and then boom! Bran’s asleep, and then boom! Bran’s having a talk with Meera and Jojen about the dream he just had. I quite enjoy this, as it gives the chapters a nice pace. This could be annoying if what was going on was complex, but it’s so simple and contained, it works.
Not only that, but these three chapters give us loooads of worldbuilding, but it never feels like information is being dumped on us, mostly because the worldbuilding is all awesome. There are paths underground that go to the “very center of the earth” where even the singers/Children of the Forest fear to tread? That’s awesome! Leaf tells us that, and she does not elaborate, which makes it even more awesome!
There are so many fantastic little moments. One of my favorites is when Bran has to try not to have an emotional breakdown because Jojen and Meera are going to see a river without him is the most relatable thing ever.
In case you forgot, when the three of them are in the cave, Jojen and Meera go to see a river, but Bran is left behind because they’ll have to climb to get there. Bran says “alright” and stays behind. However, on the inside he’s melting down because this reminds him of how he used to be able to climb. “Part of him wanted to shout at them for wanting to leave him. Part of him wanted to cry. He was almost a man grown, however, so he said nothing.” (Bran III, ADWD)
Note the phrasing, “leave him”. They are technically leaving him, but only for an hour or so. This makes it seem like they’re abandoning him.
Wanting to scream and cry over this minor thing is a very 8 year old response. However, most 8 year olds would express this violent rage and sadness outwards, whereas Bran bundles it up inside because he wants to be mature. This is basically all of Bran’s character summarized. He comes off as being mature for his age, but he’s really still a child, a very sad child. While this is in the context of a traumatized 8 year old not throwing a temper tantrum, it can be relatable to anyone currently in the “growing up” stage of life. I think a lot of people can relate to being forced to act more mature than they really are because of the situation they are in.
The fact that I’m putting all of this analysis into such a minor moment shows how dense Bran’s chapters are.
I could go on, but I’ll save the rest for the character ranking.
I should probably move on to Theon’s chapters. His stuff is absolutely fantastic. We all know it. There are no dull moments. The sense of terror and dread is ever present. Watching someone slowly piece themselves together and pull themselves out of this dark space is kind of inspiring honestly.
I have already talked about Theon’s chapters in the character ranking, and I will go into more detail in the chapter ranking. There is no need to repeat myself or say the same thing multiple times or say what has already been said.
Moving on, I almost forgot about Davos’ chapters. I like Wyman Manderly, I like Davos, and I have no complaints.
Moving on, there are a bunch of characters with only one or two chapters.
Areo’s one chapter has all of the problems with his chapter in Feast, and it feels even worse in this book with how little it affects every other chapter in this book. I see why it wouldn't have fit in with Feast or Winds, but it still feels so weird to go to Dorne for one chapter and then leave.
I guess I could say the same about Jaime’s one chapter, but I won’t, because Jaime’s chapter is really entertaining, and the events of it are talked about in Cersei’s two chapters.
Speaking of which, Cersei’s chapters have everything great about her chapters in Feast. We have a fantastic character in a harrowing situation, what more can one want?
Miss. Melisandre’s chapter is perfectly cromulent. It has some cool magic stuff going on, and George is great at showing extremely precarious situations. We know that the relationship between the Wildlings and the Nights Watch at the Wall is going to fall apart, we just don’t know when. This makes everything going on the Wall full of dread and suspense. We’ve also had three books to explore the politics of the wild and the watch. We know both groups very well, and that’s an important part of making the conflict interesting.
Moving on, Arya’s chapters are just like her chapters in Feast, and they have all of the good stuff from that.
Victarion’s two chapters have him on a boat with monkeys, and he’s angry, which leads me to believe that they’re actually just an Aguirre: The Wrath of God reference. Anywhoo, I don’t like really like them all that much because they are so fucking slow-paced, and he is the third character who goes on a journey to Mereen. Maybe Victarion’s chapters are actually a Berserk reference, because he’s on a boat, and I just want him to reach his destination.
There’s also the prologue and monologue. The prologue is an A+ from me, because of course it is. This is non-linear storytelling being used well, replicating the way the character is feeling. As opposed to Quentyn’s chapters, there is still a sense of present time, that being the time right before Varamyr’s death. Not only that, but Beyond the Wall is waaaay more interesting than Essos.
Finally, the epilogue is also quite nice. It has lots of political intrigue, and it lets Varys be the sexy evil drama queen he was made to be.
As you can see, there are a LOOOOT of POVs in Dance, and that’s a problem.
The first three books feel actively constrained and limited by the POVS, and the limits make it fun. There is lots of stuff we wish we could see, but we are blocked out from it. This can add mystery, like with the shadow baby, or it can reflect the way the characters feel.
However, with Dance, we have 15 POV characters, not including the prologue and epilogue, and many of these characters only have one chapter, meaning that their character doesn’t go through an arc in this book. Areo appears, sees some plot relevant stuff which will influence his next book, and then he’s gone. He does not go through an arc.
We also get many characters whose POVs are only there because the plot needs it, and that just feels…messy. It’s like the characters are more tools than anything.
Feast also has this problem, but it's even worse with Dance, as it has more POV characters, and more that only appear in one or two chapters. It doesn’t help that Dance is Song at its largest in scope, with a dozen different locations. It doesn’t help that many of these locations are in Essos, a very boring place.
To summarize:
Bran’s chapters are Song at its peak in terms of character, worldbuilding, and atmosphere.
It is impossible to put Theon’s chapters down because of how brutally intense and intensely brutal they are.
Cersei’s chapters are fun.
Arya’s chapters are fun.
The great character work, worldbuilding, and fun ensemble of side characters make Jon’s chapters a thumbs up from me.
Asha’s chapters are fun.
Davos is a cool dude doing cool stuff. Yippee..
Jaime’s one chapter is fine.
Melisandre’s one chapter is fine.
Tyrion’s chapters showcase some extremely brilliant character writing but they are extraordinarily tedious except for when he’s hanging out with JonCon’s crew during Tyrion IV, V, and VI.
Areo Hotah’s chapter is a slog.
I don’t care about Victarion’s dumb arm or his dumb boat or his dumb monkey issues.
Dany’s chapters have great character work but are also a huge slog.
Quentyn’s chapters are a dense haze of worldbuilding which never seem to end.
I hope Barristan gets his nutsack stuck in a blender in The Winds of Winter.
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Honestly, one of the WORST things about the Gossip!Dan reveal to me is that it’s damn near impossible nowadays to explore the moral ambiguities already present in Dan’s character without the “Dan is Gossip Girl!”/general season 6 stuff seeping in and polluting the discourse. The duality between Dan wanting to be this upright beacon of morality in the ethically derelict world of the Upper East Side versus the way he’s so easily drawn in by its most morally dubious residents (Georgina, Chuck, and - to a certain extent - Blair, namely) and the lifestyles they live… Like the whole “Dan is no longer baby! Dan wants power!” thing from season 6 never worked for me, because power was absolutely not what Dan had ever sought from the “shadier” parts of the UES, but rather love. Friendship. Acceptance. Dan tried to position himself above the Upper East Siders, but unlike someone like Vanessa who truly did not give a fuck what those rich brats thought of her, Dan absolutely fucking did. I just can’t see Dan, the way he was originally written, ever selling out his friends and loved ones for success or power - 2x05 and 2x10 entirely exist to refute that notion. On the other hand, I think 2x05 provides a great basis for what a “Dan gets corrupted!” arc could actually look like if done well - one can imagine what might have happened had the strange friendship between Chuck and Dan not been broken by the end of that episode, and had Dan continued being so heavily under Chuck’s influence. I just think that if Dan were going to go “dark” for any reason, it would ultimately be out of love and loyalty to those less-than-savory characters in his life that he formed attachments to, not any of the reasons presented in season 6.
oh yeah, absolutely!!! you said it SO well. dan is not the kind of guy who would write scathing exposés and twist the knife in your back. dan is the kind of guy who would look the other way when something bad happens if a person he loved was the one who did the bad thing! dan hates conflict, dan fears abandonment..... why on earth would he instigate those two things deliberately for himself? nobody can make this make sense to me.
interestingly, part of this is a thing i've always thought dan AND nate both have in common - both of them want to see the good in people, often to an extent that ends up being dangerous for themselves & the people around them, or makes them vulnerable. whoever it is, whatever it is.... both dan and nate do their utmost to help other people when people come to them in distress, which is by itself a good trait! but in BOTH of them, it manifests in a sort of disregarding of their own boundaries, a sort of putting their needs aside/seeing themselves as less important than the person they're helping. it isn't necessarily a saviour complex as much as it is a "i don't want anyone to feel as shitty/lost/helpless as i once did", but it's also very interesting that neither of them afford themselves this same courtesy.
but yeah, dan really, really wants to be loved & accepted. serena is the first person we see giving him that (not including his family & vanessa.) chuck sort of gives him that in the worst possible way - chuck hates dan, but it's fine, because dan lets chuck treat him disrespectfully and doesn't see anything wrong with it, maybe because dan's own sense of self-worth is so fucked. "hey, chuck bass compared me to a plague rat, but at least he's talking to me, right?" oh, dan. i'm so fucking sorry, dude.
then there's nate, who is just, in canon, platonically the one person who, so easily, fits into dan's life and who makes space for dan to fit into his? i mean. they have a don draper pact. they watch tv together, it's canon! they play video games together canonically too! & unlike with serena, and later, with blair, the fact that they don't have romantic history hanging over them means they never really have to navigate figuring themselves out as exes and all that messy stuff. like. they're best friends, unconditionally! (hilariously, this is why i ship them, among other things. if you have a friendship that strong.... it's a good base for a romantic relationship. and like, the romantic spark was there. fuck sparks, it was a whole firecracker.)
and of course, there's blair. dan's relationship with blair is the prime example of this, of him being validated for all these niche little things about himself and being with someone who is just as extra as him in similar ways, who has a lot of opinions on literally everything, etc. and blair appreciates him and supports him and sure, she didn't say she loved him, but the way she treated him & looked at him was proof enough.
acting as if serena was the gateway to all these relationships is a pretty big disservice to dan, who knocked on chuck's door on his own (sweetie WHY), who befriended nate of his own accord, and while he and blair DID team up to help serena, their whole s4 arc is about them connecting authentically in a way that has nothing to do with serena. so the retcon in s6 of "there is no winning without serena"... meh.
there's also the discussion we HAVE to have about how evil!serena of s5 kind of set the stage for a LOT of, uh. stuff that wouldn't have happened otherwise. dan lashing out and hurting everyone around him the way he does in the first few episodes of s6.... is not that unbelievable, if you believe that serena essentially took advantage of him & filmed him without his consent the way she did in the s5 finale... which i don't. i don't think serena would do that to anyone, and i definitely don't think serena would do that to dan.
but yeah, idk!! i have nothing else to say. it's really sad that they went all "dan wants power over everyone else & serena wants attention all the time and neither of them will stop at anything to get it!" because like. that's not dan, and that's not serena. & i think it's really sad that that's what derena became, by virtue of being in a show as terribly written as this one :(
#long post#kind of ???#meta#anon#dan humphrey#im not sure what i said adds value to what YOU said#it feels a bit like a parallel line of thought#but hey that's what conversations Are#also you just popped into my inbox with Such a perfect take#what's a boy to do etc etc
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But What If You Want to Come Out on Vers Bottom?: A “Coming Out on Top” Review (Part 4)
Part 1
Part 2
Part 3
All that’s left now are the ten Brofinder dates. Because there’s so many of these and because they’re all fairly short with only a few variations in how they can go down I’m not going to be spending much time on each - just a quick overview of the stories as well as an evaluation of the inevitable sex. The quality does vary a fair bit, although it’s all subjective as to which are better depending on what kind of story you’re looking for as well as, in some cases, your kinks.
Jake
Comes with a fairly obvious death condition, a sequence in which Mark and Jake get to nerd out over The Legend of Zelda, and another in which Jake lectures Mark/the player on the virtues of polyamory. I’ve always been poly-friendly myself, and the lecture does lead into a - thoroughly random - train scenario, but to say it’s not how you’d logically expect this date to go down is a bit of an understatement. Jake never even takes his shirt off, so in place of a body hair toggle he gets one to dye his hair pink for whatever reason. It’s a shame too, because at the start of the date there’s some discussion over Jake’s weight and how he should be confident in his size and his unusually elaborate buffet eating strategies.
Tommy
Like Jake’s date Tommy’s rapidly goes to some unexpected places, but in his case those places entail getting kidnapped and forced to talk through the failures of the criminal justice system at gunpoint. There are more than a few chances to get a quick game over, some funnier than others, but if Mark survives to make it to Tommy’s place he’s greeted by a brief but hot round of sex with the one man in the cast whose dick size is talked up even more than Brad’s. In this case it may actually be warranted; the girth of that thing looks positively inhuman in the CGs, so, rejoice if you’re into that.
Frankie
This guy talks an outlandishly highbrow game that he very clearly can’t deliver on, and having a successful date with him requires Mark to be as aggressively honest as possible as a means of badgering Frankie into admitting to all his unsubtle deception. The man underneath them may just be a more pathetic prospect than Mark himself, but at least the player gets treated to as good a striptease as this game can deliver with its assets followed by sex on the beach...literally, not the cocktail. This date reserves inexplicably dirty names of that nature for gelato of all things.
Luke
The absurdity only continues to build as Mark is invited to “Streamflix and chill” by an Irish frat bro who doesn’t know what that term means because apparently this universe’s Netflix knockoff doesn’t exist in Ireland. It’s up to the player to smoothly guide Mark through a showing of an inspirational story about a narcoleptic rugby player to get to the grand prize of a chance to quietly blow Luke under the blankets when his housemates could walk in at any second (or provide off-the-cuff commentary on Brokeback Mountain, as it happens). There’s also a dream CG at the end featuring yet more sports roleplay sex, as if Brad’s route didn’t offer enough of that. My favorite part though is Luke complaining about American bars not serving alcohol past 2 AM, as I agree with him that it is utterly barbaric.
Cesar
As should be apparent, this is the one with cop sex. Mark gets caught up in a drug sting, and depending on how the player feels about Ian’s suggestion of bringing along ranch dressing (or rather, ranch dressing mix) to the supposed siesta the specific type of cop sex will either be a fairly standard round of Mark bottoming or one of the only finger-fucking sessions in the game. Either way Mark will be resisting arrest as well as sexually harassing a police officer following what was very obviously a setup targeting cruising gay men, but because this is an erotic dating sim and every man in it wants Mark’s ass let’s all withhold our reservations regarding the ethical ramifications of this entire scenario. I have no trouble doing so, although that’s mostly because cop sex does nothing for me.
Terry
Well, color me surprised - if not terribly aroused - because at long last we have a twink. There seems to be a thinly-veiled pop culture reference here, to something like a younger Justin Bieber or one of those guys from One Direction, but as wild as this date ends up going I find it hangs together rather well even without working as an allusion to any specific celebrity. Mark finds himself billed as the winner of a date with a pop star, and hilarity ensues as he encounters screaming fangirls, a creepy stalker trying to get locks of Terry’s hair, and a karaoke contest in a dive bar where New Orleans gets name-dropped because this city is mentioned in so many songs and where Mark “rocks the hell out of” Schubert’s Ave Maria, somehow. The sex itself is a novelty, with the choice coming down to either Mark giving a rimjob while Terry performs autofellatio or Mark pounding some twink ass. A post-coital hair snipping for the stalker is optional.
Donovan
This man has some hang-ups, and I still can’t decide whether they’re hot or not. At first pass this date is a bite-sized deconstruction of what Dream Daddy could have been had it been interested in actually examining the kinds of relationships it claims to center around - Donovan is a literal father, divorced and new to the dating scene and clearly uncomfortable with many aspects of it up to and including the very sexualized concept of gay daddies. His attempts at flirting and blending in at a gay bar are awkwardly endearing, but as I suggested with Alex I think CooT wants to have it both ways by having Donovan opine about being treated like a daddy...when he looks the way he does and while he’s buying drinks for a guy more than ten years his junior. Even his attempt at more authentically bonding with Mark via an impromptu woodworking tutorial quickly pivots into innuendo and heavier flirting leading up to the inevitable sex scene (although the player should note that in order to get said sex scene you’ll have to know a little about what Donovan is teaching Mark as well as allow him to step away for a heart-to-heart with his teenage son). What follows is shower sex where Mark tops his bull of a date - so if you’re into big hairy bottoms and didn’t get enough from some of Amos’s options this is your story.
Oz and Pete
No Grindr analogue would be complete without a partnered relationship looking for one more, and in truth this date earns some major points for realistically capturing the mix of awkwardness and sensual chaos that comes from jumping in bed with an established couple. This includes crossed wires on who’s using the shared profile, a bit of informal relationship counseling, and the messy but inevitably uneven bonding Mark does with either Oz or Pete. There are two successful paths to this date according to which of them Mark spends more time with at the bar, with each of them building up to a particular type of fetish sex that the two of them haven’t discussed with one another until now. For Oz (on the left) that’s double penetration, while for Pete it’s cuckoldry with some bonus rimming and felching in the scene itself. This is admittedly one of the more physically demanding scenarios Mark can find himself in, especially if he favors Oz, but as I said it’s handled with a surprising amount of realism. Plus there’s a comment before the date that sort of handwaves Mark’s pre-sex stretching that goes along with an utterly ridiculous (mental) image, so I’ll let it slide.
Theo
This one is interesting, to say the least. Mark is paid to pose as Theo’s fiancé at his ten year high school reunion, as part of a ploy to show off how successful Theo has become and rub his former bullies’ noses in it. In addition to the usual wacky humor - and cameos from both Penny and Ian - this is a story with a fair bit of heart to it depending on how Mark deals with the situation. He can either play the perfect partner and earn Theo the recognition he craves...or he can go as absurd and over-the-top as possible but don’t try rickrolling the bullies because that’s a step too far, making a spectacle of himself and teaching Theo a valuable lesson about not caring about the opinions of the people who used to mock him. Provided the date’s a success in one form or another Theo will proffer the above Dom/sub scenario, and Mark can respond either by agreeing to be a sub (either in the comparatively vanilla sense if he was sensible at the reunion or as a pup if he went overboard with it) or by flipping the script and making Theo his sub for the evening. They could have done a lot more with the pup play considering it’s just the sub version with a collar and canine sound effects, but there’s already more logical bang for your buck going on in this date than in around half of the others.
Hugh and Jesse
This is...I can’t even....
Okay, whatever. It’s the last one. It’s not a date, properly speaking, but is accessed if Mark chooses to play with himself on the Brofinder menu. He gets high off some incredibly dubious weed given to him by Ian and proceeds to get intimately acquainted with his goldfish Slurpy in what is CooT’s second-heaviest icthyophilic moment (Google for #1, I already said back in Part 1 I’m not going there). If he calls for an ambulance he’ll be taken under the care of a pair of twin EMTs who make up for what they lack in professionalism with the kind of zany determination you’d expect with a setup like this. At that point it’s the player’s choice of a spit roast or a combo blowjob and rimjob. Adding to the overall disorienting effect of this “date” is the game experimenting with perspective and its visual assets in ways rarely seen elsewhere and that honestly don’t work very well. There’s only so much you can do with such, ahem, stiff portraits.
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