#there's so much fate out there!!!! if you go the vn route then you can go to fate/zero which is its prequel (has an anime & ln series)

[fieldlands]

@l-cereta​ 

the gacha game is in fact totally skippable! if you’re interested in nosing around the story of it anyway though, you don’t even necessarily have to Play it: there are transcriptions https://apps.atlasacademy.io/db/NA/wars here! you’ll have to click around some to access them, but everything from the game is dumped to this site. (just make sure you’re in the NA tab instead of the JP tab, represented by the country flag on the bar at the top) This also means you’ll probably be scrolling past a lot of mechanical info that doesnt concern you in the process lol and if that bothers you you can probably find story compilations on youtube instead! (i have never tried this because i just play the game myself, so i dont have recommendations on who to check out) i really like atlas academy though its good stuff.

the number 1 high fidelity Way To Get Into fate is in fact to read fate/stay night! there’s no Official way to do this in english atm BUT type-moon has been on a consistent kick of translating their older (pre-fate) visual novels for overseas audiences so if you sit down and wait a few years fsn will probably be on your steam capable device / nintendo switch / playstation for like 60 real world american dollars. that said that’s a silly thing to recommend doing and im aware of this so HERE IS my friend lance’s post of links to read fsn in fan translated english right now! i used these links to read the VN myself so they do work!

the main difference between the original VN and the “realta nua” version is that realta nua is a remake that replaced explicit sex scenes with non-explicit (but sometimes still sexual!) equivalents. other than that essentially no changes were made to the game’s story so choose whichever based on your level of comfort! the fsn sex scenes are kind of infamous for being anywhere from Silly to Outright Bad To Read so realta nua is absolutely a valid choice to make here. if you do choose realta nua, the game’s routes will be separated out into different .exes: the intended reading order for the routes is fate route -> unlimited blade works -> heavens feel

i dont have the reading advice Memorized on most other fate entries but i do know a bit about one other: fate/extra! a remake called fate/extra record is in development and everyone’s excited about that because the story of the original fate/extra is very good but the gameplay is generally unpleasant to most. there’s also a fan translation of a different extraverse game, fate/extra ccc, which is nearing playable completion! i’ve been keeping myself unspoiled on ccc happenings in anticipation of this so i don’t actually 100% know how it relates back to extra in particular lol. and the bow on top of these two games is the anime fate/extra last encore! which is NOT a direct adaptation of extra, it’s a story that’s set in its world using its characters but tells a very different story. it’s not looked upon well by the fandom because i think a lot of people were expecting a straight up adaptation so they didn’t have to tell people to play extra anymore lol, but i personally love it to death and i think all that’s required for a satisfying watch is cursory knowledge of extra’s normal setting and circumstances/characters. if you spend a good few hours with the facts of fate extra (like via the wiki, perhaps) you will probably be ready for last encore. i did this by trying to play the original game myself (it was released officially in english for the psp, so no need to hunt down a translation, just a rom) + the passing familiarity with a lot of the game’s Servant characters i had from fgo. i did not get very far in the game though lol which is why i say cursory!

most fate anime adaptations are not too bad honestly, but even the best tend to be imperfect and leave out some of the punchier parts of the story. the only one i’ve heard described as unsalvageably bad is the one for fate/apocrypha though, so if you want to get into apocrypha i THINK the recommended solution for that one is the manga adaptation. there are a LOT of options for most fate works once you start looking so i think generally the best way to make sure you’re getting the best is to ask people whose tastes you trust instead of just going to your local search engine wild west lol.

ok apologies for asking this but what actually is fate?? i thought it was a gacha game like arknights but i just saw that one manga post... is it a manga?? why is oberon, husband of titania, there,

OH BOY

SO, essentially, fate is one company (known as type-moon)'s long-running series that has since its inception expanded into several different mediums! it started out with fate/stay night, a visual novel which was released aaaall the way back in 2004. the base universe established in the visual novel has since been expanded on through several other games, several manga series, anime adaptations, light novels, etc, And yes the gacha game!

The gacha game is called fate/grand order! fgo for short. Oberon husband of titania is a major character (and fan favorite lol) from one of the game's recent* story chapters, lostbelt 6 avalon le fae!

*it's recent on the english-translated north american server of the game. NA fgo is about 2 years behind the original japanese server in terms of content releases, so for japanese players lostbelt 6 has been out for about 2 years already!

[versegm]

What is Fate/Stay Night?

Fate/Stay Night is a visual novel that came out in 2004. It features three routes: Fate, Unlimited Blade Works, and Heaven's Feel. It is also the first installment of the Fate serie.

If you are familiar with that serie (and if you follow me I think I can safely bet you do,) it's the one game all the other games keep referencing.

If you are not familiar with that serie, it's the game this blonde anime chick you can see everywhere since 2005 is from.

Oooh nifty. What's it about?

The story follows SHIROU EMIYA, a perfectly ordinary teenager with small magic abilities, as he gets dragged in a mage battle royale where the winner gets to fulfill one of their wish. During that battle royale, mages are aided by Heroic Spirits, aka historical and/or mythological figures as summons to fight. As you can imagine, the question of what makes a hero? is a major one in the story, along with What makes a villain? What makes a victim? How does one uphold their ideals?

Cool. Should I play it?

Well that depends on what you're looking for in a story, but if you enjoy strong thematic writing, balls to the wall concepts, and commitment to any worldbuilding implications (be they really silly or deeply horrifying) then yeah you should def go for it! Also, as a visual novel, it is extremely well-made and it fucks with the medium in ways I have rarely seen before.

I'm already familiar with other Fate games and I know the tl;dr of the plot. Do I really need to play it?

Yeah you should!! As I said in the intro, every Fate entry out there references fsn in some way, be in directly by making references to plot elements, or indirectly by echoing and building on its themes. Trust me no amount of knowing what would happen could have prepared me from actually reading it.

Isn't it a porn game?

The original is an eroge, yes, so it did contain sex scenes. The remake, Fate/Stay Night: Realta Nua, replaced the sex scenes with sfw ones. I can give you my personal opinion on which version of these scenes is best if you need me but really it's up to you as to which one you'd rather read.

I tried playing the game a while back but I thought the protag was a cunt.

Yeah I getcha the first route is a bit clumsy by today's standards and it's easy to read the protagonist as a bitchy chauvinist at first. Still he gets better (and in fact never acts even remotely like that in the other routes) so I would ask you to grind your teeth and keep going.

"The first route"? Is there an order to the routes?

There is! In the original game you had to go Fate route -> UBW route -> HF route. Iirc you can play them in any order in the remake, but I strongly advise you to play these routes in this order regardless, because they were very much built with the assumption that this is the way you'd experience things. (A very basic exemple is that the Fate route has a lot more explanations on the worldbuilding and the rules of the battle royales, while the other routes assume you already know this shit and ellipses it up.)

Ohhh. Ok I'm kinda interested. Where can I play it?

Well funny story! This game is like, the ONE fate game that never got any official release in the West whatsoever! So you're gonna have to go with fantranslations. You can play the sfw remake over here, or you can download the og eroge over there.

I'm gonna be real with you bestie I am not committing to a 70 hours-long vn when I don't even know if I'll like it.

Understandable! Perhaps you'd be interested in the anime adaptation of one of the routes then? I'm told the Unlimited Blade Works anime is a good introduction to the Fate serie, its vibes, and therefore whether it might be your thing or not. That being said disclaimer that I have not watched it (<- not an anime watcher) so I can't personally back it up.

Hey why are there like twenty versions of that blonde anime chick

That would require me to make a separate 2k long post king.

Anyways.

[kwamiwayzz]

Flop Side

I haven't yapped this much about something since Citrus...

But shipping aside, the criticisms in this game are warranted because of lack of content, lack of choices, and inconsistences from the first two games. It also doesn't help that SBN has straight up admitted that he barely tried in this game. Also, where does the $15 justification come from? Because when compared to Re-Up, I don't think the increased amount of CG art in Flip Side is enough to justify it. Is it to offset paying for the VAs performances? Maybe I can see that as a justification, but the original VN was only $10 and had 15 different endings so...

Compared to the previous times I've talked about how weak of an installment this is, I'm mostly talking about how weak it is from a VN standpoint. From other reviews, I've seen people say that there's only a total of 6 choices that you can make Jecka pick for each route. After those 6 choices are up, Jecka is just locked in the route and the rest of it becomes a Youtube video you'd be playing on the side while you're washing the dishes. The game is also 3 hours max with getting all endings, which is only half the time of the previous two games.

At that point, you could've just made Flip Side into a side series instead of a $15 video disguised as a game.

Also, this is probably a cold take at this point, but I never saw Class of 09 as an "anti-VN", even when I was first getting into it. It was just a Western VN that played off as a rejection simulator with late 2000s edgy humor. It's kind of hard to really see this as a meta on Japanese VNs when visual novels like Higurashi, Umineko, Fate/Stay Night, and Steins;Gate exist. I don't know, I just think the creator happened to accidentally write something good that resonated with an audience that he didn't intend, and instead of just ending it there or building off it, he just took it out back and shot it point blank.

Oh... and what the fuck was the point in mentioning Palestine in the sex slave ending? If you want to be edgy, then okay, but where's the tact and decorum with everything going on right now?

I feel bad for the fans who latched onto the characters and found something relatable in all of them only to be tainted by this slop.

[prettycottonmouthlamia]

On Fate/Hollow Ataraxia

"Lamia you keep saying people should play Hollow Ataraxia but no one knows what that is" okay listen I KNOW that's why I'm making the post

Fate/Hollow Ataraxia is the sequel visual novel to Fate/Stay Night. This is true in a very literal sense as well: the events of HA take place about six months or so after the events of F/SN. If you're wondering which route from the original game Hollow Ataraxia is a sequel to, the answer kind of broadly is all of them. Hollow Ataraxia broadly isn't really interested in answering which of the three routes was canon, because asking that question kind of reveals a lack of engagement in the themes of the original.

Hollow Ataraxia has two protagonist characters: Bazett and Shirou. Hollow Ataraxia actually keeps pretty well to the night and day contrast of the original visual novel: Bazett's story largely takes place at night and involves her own participation in a Holy Grail War with her Servant, Avenger, while Shirou's story is largely a slice of life deal involving most of the cast from the previous VN and takes place during the daytime.

This separation is also mechanical. While Bazett's sections are entirely linear and play out like the original visual novel, Shirou's sections have a tremendous amount of free choice available. You're allowed to choose which events you'll see and when, although ultimately you're still likely to see all of them in order to progress.

When I say most of the cast from the original come back, I mean it. All of the Servants from the 5th Holy Grail War are still around and kicking in Hollow Ataraxia without considerably much in the way of explanation, and other members of the cast get more exposition and characterization to go along with them. You won't find any particularly unique scenes with Issei or Mitsuzuri, but the lunch trio have like their own running plot line. It's honestly an odd choice.

The only character not to return from the original is Kotomine Kirei. The given justification for this is that Kotomine Kirei never survives the 5th Holy Grail War in any timeline since he already survived the 4th Holy Grail War, and instead he is replaced by his daughter, Caren Hortensia. Caren doesn't actually serve a particularly large role in Hollow Ataraxia though, but usually her presence is a giveaway on the primary tension of the Shirou portion of the story: during night time, the darker, gloomier elements of Bazett's story start to creep into the slice of life segments, and Caren is usually there for that happening.

While Bazett's sections are emotionally well-written and powerful, Shirou's are a fair bit sillier than the general tone of Stay Night. Since its slice of life, there quite a lot more silly gags and a greater emphasis on characterization than before: a lot of the characterization you might be familiar with for the main cast actually originates from Hollow Ataraxia in particular, such as Saber not being able to swim because she can just walk on the surface of the water.

It's always something of a hard recommend from me personally (there's a rape scene in Hollow Ataraxia you have to view in order to progress, like thankfully you can just fast-forward through it because its not super plot important but its still THERE) in part because you really need to have read Fate/Stay Night to get it. It's not as well written as Fate/Stay Night and honestly has some real dud characters in my opinion (Caren and Makidera kind of just suck), but there's still a lot of heart to it and the ending genuinely made me cry. Bazett in my opinion may be one of Nasu's best written protagonists ever.

So if you've read Fate/Stay Night, give Hollow Ataraxia a read too, if only because there's like maybe 10 of us out there who have read it on the EN side of the fandom and we need people to discuss our shared brainworm infection this VN gave us.

[cute-girls-from-vns-anime-manga]

I already sent you an ask on this and then FORGOR but any recommendations on where to start with majikoi? Is there a "best" version etc? I am stupid and unsure what's just a release vs different version etc

WELL NOW THIS IS A DAMN GOOD QUESTION AS MAJIKOI IS A LONG SERIES!!!

But unlike some vn franchises (Fate) there is a clear starting point and the quality doesn't drop like a fucking rock! But the naming conventions they ascribe to with Majikoi are somewhat annoying cause yeah their titles dont really scream "THIS IS A SEQUEL WITH ALMOST TRIPLE THE CONTENT" not to mention how "Majikoi" is not actually the name of any of the visual novels but a shortened title given by fans as the actual name is annoyingly long to say

So the order to play is simple:

Maji de Watashi ni Koi Shinasai! <-(Commonly refereed to by fans as Majikoi or Majikoi O)

Maji de Watashi ni Koishinasai! S <-(Commonly refereed to by fans as Majikoi S)

Maji de Watashi ni Koishinasai! A-1

Maji de Watashi ni Koishinasai! A-2

Maji de Watashi ni Koishinasai! A-3

Maji de Watashi ni Koishinasai! A-4

Maji de Watashi ni Koishinasai! A-5

NOW while Majikoi O and Majikoi S are very much Sequels to each other there is not a true route in O that S's plot hinges off of, S actually ends up giving six short after story routes just going into more details about the circumstances and events (but mostly more CG's and HCG's of the main 5 girls from O). But S's new content does hinge on you having played O before as it expects you to already know the characters of the story so it spends little time introducing them in favor of spending its focus on the characters added in S. S is also INSANELY longer than O like I havent actually verified but going by my gut I would say its double or triple the length

On the subject of Majikoi A-1 through A-5 those five vn's are SIGNIFICANTLY shorter than O or S being only three routes each (I think one of them might even only have two routes) now these are full routes and the writing is on par with even in some surpassing a lot of the original two's route writing there. Good thing is Minato soft were gracious enough to release Maji de Watashi ni Koishinasai! A Set which is just all five A games packaged together!

Quickly I will also touch on Kimi ga Aruji de Shitsuji ga Ore de which shares characters and is set in the same universe and timeline as the Majikoi games but as it is quite old an no fan or offical translation exists I wouldnt go seeking it out. Mostly is just neat trivia as some characters fro Kimi do get a cameo in Majikoi S and the A's

As for obtaining these visual novels so far only Majikoi O has gotten a full and official English translation and release with a downloadable version being purchasable on Steam and Jast (apparently jast is a publisher never heard of them befor this)

For the rest of the series I personally Imported the Japanese copies cause im an absolute crazy person who likes this visual novel series way way too much, I believe they are purchasable outside of Japan on Minato Softs store (Of course there is also ☠️ if you so choose that option) you can get the Unofficial translations which are all but indistinguishable from an official release TL over from Majitranslations

[neomedievalistbr]

pull out the fate watching/reading order. please

I DIDNT SEE I HAD THIS IN MY INBOX. cami you should've asked me on discord i wouldve seen this earlier

ANYWAYS. the best experience is reading the original vn, fate/stay night, as everything just builds from you knowing abt that

BUT IF YOU DON'T WANT TO READ 80 HOURS OF VN, ufotable adapted two of the three routes as animes, unlimited blade works and heavens feel. so just go on 9anime and search fate/stay night: unlimited blade works (by ufotable. theres a prologue, then s1 and 2, and the sunny day ova, which is an alternative ending)

you can understand pretty much everything from just watching ubw (sure, some things are not explained since. youre supposed to know, but they dont hinder the experience)

after that, the third route, heavens feel, got adapted into 3 movies (which are numbered, so you wont get confused on the order). pretty straightforward

after that... youre free to do whatever. you can read the sequel, hollow ataraxia, or watch the prequel, zero. you can go watch the slice of life spin-off, todays menu for the emiya family, or you can watch other animes that diverge from the canon events of zero and stay night, like apocrypha (or read the manga, since its a better adaptation of the original light novel)

theres also the other games, like fate extra and its sequels, which are their own universe not connected to the main universe

you can even play fgo. for some reason, you can put yourself through that hell. youre free to di whatever

[kob131]

All this talk about the fate series you’ve engaged in has piqued my interest. If I were to dive into the series with no knowledge about it whatsoever, where would you recommend I start? I’m a huge mythology fan, so I’m sure I’d just eat it up. Speaking of which, I learned a bit about the legend of Cu Chulainn that makes me especially interested in him. In the original Celtic folktale, he goes to Mag Mell (the Celtic afterlife), and meets a priestess named Scathach, who gives him an indestructible spear named Gae Bolg (it’s Gaelic for “belly dart”). The spear is so heavily barbed that when it’s shoved into a creature, he only way to remove it is to use a bladed weapon of some sort to literally carve it out of them. As if that wasn’t bad enough, it’s also poisoned. Celtic folklore is wild.

Oh boy...

Gonna tag @avalonblue12 since he helped me out with Fate a bit in the beginning.

So...I'm going to offer two quick suggestions and expand on why this question has haunted this fanbase for so long.

If you want to get into Fate the purest (and best in my opinion) way possible, try this guy's Let's Play of the first route of the visual novel (THE HOLY GRAIL WAR - Fate/stay night - 1 [Prologue] - YouTube) Or this one if you don't like commentary (Fate/Stay Night Visual Novel Fate Route Day 1 Part 1 (No Commentary)(English) - YouTube) Be warned, the visual novel does not have voiced narratin and is in Japanese.

If you don't care about spoilers or such, try Fate/Stay Night: Unlimited Blade Works by ufotable.

But in truth, you can start just about anywhere that isn't Hollow Atraxia, Fate/Extra: Last Encore or Fate/Extella because many entries assume you don't know the basics and these are direct sequels.

I suggested those above because they pertain to the original Fate/Stay Night, whose influence is felt throughout the whole franchise.

(More below)

So...why is this question such a hard one to answer for Fate fans?

Well, Fate is an infamously dense series that has a lot of interconnecting elements and ideas along with a deep magic system. Meaning that you can get the general idea easily...but things are so much better when you have knowledge of the series. For example, a certain character in Fate Apocrypha (a spin off) is rather compelling and engaging but with knowledge of one of the heroines in FSN, it adds another layer to her character.

So, I would recommend getting in through the Visual Novel somehow...but the visual novel is a huge time commitment and it might not be to your tastes. So you'd think there would be an anime or something to watch right?

Well, there is...with two problems.

1- Ufotable has only adapted Heaven's Feel and Unlimited Blade Works, the third and second routes. Fate, the first route which acts as the primer as well, only has an adaptation by Studio DEEN and it's kind of divisive.

and 2- The animes all have one issue- They don't have the inner monologue of Shirou, the protagonist. This is important because a lot of what is needed to understand Shirou is IN his monologues. Without them, it becomes very easy to misunderstand Shirou. To the point that the divide around him is basically between those who have and haven't read the original VN.

So while you can get in however you want and it is VERY MUCH worth the investment- getting the best introduction is hard.

"Well, how did you get into Fate?"

The doujins.

... No, really. I found some FGO doujins (ironically enough, based on Fate's Scathach) and I got interested in the series so I kind of just...flailed around until I ended up on the other end of the series. I still don't know how it happened.

If you're still reading this, even if I turned you off- I'd like to say what I think is Fate's greatest strength. And I believe that it's Nasu's writing. Or rather, the bittersweet way he writes. It really pulls on the heartstrings while making you feel satisfied by the journey.

I really do hope you try it out, as I can't recommend it enough.

[himejoshikomaeda]

the most narratively compelled i felt in the VN was yumiduka’s stuff during the akiha route, but i obviously felt really strongly about kohaku, just generally. i’m just not really sure what there is for me to say about it?

the plot was a little bit.. “this happened and then this happened and then this happened” for my tastes sometimes. maybe it’s cuz i read fate before it, but i was expecting something a little more coherent, i guess.

i didn’t really like shiki, which you can explain away by saying that kohaku was hypnotizing him every night and warping the hell out of his personality. as a result, i had a hard time understanding the character of shiki? he acted very arbitrarily and unpredictably, which was more frustrating and confusing than it was exciting to me. i also felt like nasu’s rape kink was kind of at odds with the narrative. or maybe it was just a narrative i didn’t want. everyone talks constantly about how nice shiki is, which is only ever said and not shown, which can again be attributed to the Nightly Hypnosis. but i know plenty of people like this guy! which is a little confusing to me i guess. too much of the game was about The World’s Most Hurt Girls worrying about, taking care of, and being raped by some guy (that happens to be the protagonist).

to get an idea of what moved me, i cried twice during it - once when nanaya went away, and once at The Tree Scene. i spent most of the game thinking “can’t wait to see how all this pays off in the kohaku route” (perhaps too primed by having read heaven’s feel), only to have kohaku’s route be basically the same as akiha’s and hisui’s. glad i got to save her of course but it wasn’t anything mindblowing.

fundamentally, i think my issue is that i didn’t like shiki and i spent most of the VN wishing he was shirou so entirely different events would transpire. i’m here to save girls, man.. sorry..

i’m kind of worried that all of this is going to come across as a little philistinist, so i’ll end this by saying that it was just not the kind of story i want to read for myself but i can easily see how it would have a meaningful impact on plenty of people. feel free to correct my misunderstandings and misinterpretations, just don’t get mad at me >_<

what did you get from tsukihime?

i thought it was alright!

[versegm]

Hi ! It’s been a while seeing your fate posts wanting to get into it - but with that last post about fate series levels…! Do you like… recommend getting into it ? And with a particular series ? Or is it the kind of media where you’re like i adore it but i wouldn’t wish it on my worst enemy

I wholeheartedly recommend the Fate serie. It is, and I mean this completely unironically, one of the best series I have been given to eat in years.

Usually when I make headcanon or meta posts about a given serie, there is a large amount of wishful thinking and self indulgence involved. I don't think Ariosto intended to write Orlando Furioso as a story about Angelica desperately trying to escape the narrative, but it is a lot more entertaining for me to read it this way. I am well aware that digimon is a children's cartoon and a lovecraftian horror story about the inherent corrupting power of light, it's just more suited to my tastes too imagine stories that involve that.

That's not the case with Fate. I am still very often self-indulgent and horny on main, but generally speaking when I say shit like "the protagonist of Fate/Grand Order is a normal person gradually becoming insane the further the plot goes" or "people die when they are killed means that if you refuse to let someone die when their time comes you are denying them the simple right to be a person" that is. Very textually what happens. The Fate serie allows itself to go all out on bonkers and/or horrifying concepts and themes, which is doubly refreshing in a world where media are slowly being made blander by corporations who don't want to alienate their audience and lose money.

That being said, it is a serie that has been going on for a very long time, so the writers like to reference their old works, make use of concepts they've foreshadowed 16 years ago in an obscure visual novel that never got translated, make full aus of their own stories, ect ect. So the joke of this post is that there are some Fate works you can jump in with 0 knowledge of Fate and you'll be mostly fine save for maybe a couple cameos you won't recognize, while some others will be fucking incomprehensible if you haven't eaten the full wikipedia page beforehand.

If you follow Lance's post, you can probably pick any work from level 0 to 5 and try to work you way out from here.

If you want my personal input, my entry point was Fate/Grand Order, and while I could make a whole post on its strenghts and weaknesses if you need one the important part is that it did a well enough job having a compelling story on its own while explaining the worldbuilding basics to me.

Fate/Stay Night (the visual novel) is the first title of the Fate serie, so it's a good entry point as well, but it is fucking long and frankly the first route has aged a bit so that's up to you. If you want something easier to digest to see what's Fate about and if it'll be up your alley, you can always check out the Unlimited Blades Work anime (which is an anime adaptation of one of the routes of the vn) or the Fate/Zero anime (which is a prequel.) I also know a guy who got in through the Fate/Apocrypha anime, so if you like Mordred specifically it might be your thing idk.

Honestly don't sweat it too much, Fate is very much a serie where you will revisit works you've already eaten and go "oh THAT'S who that bitch from episode 5 came from and that's why they made it into a big deal at the time" once you've got a bit more context. It's worth asking your friends if any of them are already into Fate so they might be able to give you insight on how blorbo #34 actually has SUCH a compelling backstory in an earlier work, but if you don't that's fine just go with the flow.

Oh yeah fair warning tho that Fate sometimes features some Anime Bullshit (that's a polite way to say "lolis") so if that's a dealbreaker for you be aware of it.

[akampana]

Because of zero 10th anniversary I have a lot of people are #Remakesaberroute, and I have mixed feelings about this in one part it would meant the remake of the final farewell of saber and Gilgamesh in 4k, 144fps l, but in the other it would meant suffering trough saber x Shirou again, want do you think, would you like a remake or are satisfied with the original

Do I want a remake?

Actually, I like the idea of a remake, as long as it corrects a critical flaw the Deen adaptation had: the lack of Shirou's internal monologue.

Especially after reading the visual novel, you just realize how much of Shirou the anime, well, left out. Compared to what we get in the VN, the Deen FSN is so half-baked it's like he didn't even make it into the oven.

In the end, the anime was...well...limited by its own medium. There is so much that goes on in the VN that they just couldn't cram it all into 25 half-hour episodes. Not to say the VN is perfect, there are still some issues that I have with it and Nasu himself also said he has some issues with the way things were written, but the depth of Shirou's incredibly messed up state of being is explored there, while the anime doesn't quite get that right.

UBW did a better job of showcasing Shirou's trauma, by frequent flashbacks, Shirou's expressions when he isn't able to save Illya, how they portrayed him and Rin when inside the Blood Fort and all their classmates were unconscious etc. but I still think more can be done.

So I'm not satisfied with the original anime. (VN is better tho xD)

Ship Stuff

Also, while I don't main Shirou x Saber, I definitely realize its importance and respect it (Admittedly, that took me reading through the VNs. I went on this whole obsessive arc after Deen FSN where I was like "No that can't be it! That CAN'T BE IT!" while eating up all three routes like a starving dog.) It's got its own space on my dock, although I haven't boarded that ship in years, and only mention it in passing in most of my works. To see that relationship done right would make me happy. Shirou's relationship with Saber was the most idealistic and well, romantic in the literary sense (come on, endlessly pursuing, endlessly waiting, that shit slaps) and to see it given the justice it deserves would be great actually.

And yeah, Gilgamesh's goodbye? I'd love to see how they showcase that. Tomokazu Seki's delivery of his last words really sold the Deen version and damn I'd like to see him give it another go (FGO's similar line aside).

Other stuff

Whether or not we'd actually get a remake, though? That's the real question. It's more of a want than a need in the Fate fandom, y'know? Especially since a large part of the fanbase swears by the Deen version anyway, and anime aside Arturia and Shirou are very much beloved by the fans.

Plus, a re-adaptation would probably warrant Nasu going back to correct or improve the parts of the route he would have wanted to change. I'm not sure what his stance would be on doing that (and uh, please Nasu, get some sleep) and well, from what I see, the new LB is clearly an ode to the Fate Route. So he might not even have to go back, and instead just continue writing new things.

I would be happy to get it, but I'd be okay with not getting a remake. At this point a remake seems like the stuff of dreams. Tsukihime got its revival though, so you never know.

If anything, maybe at least a wide release of the Last Episode. I'd wanna see that. I mean we have all three routes adapted now, so haven't we unlocked this ending yet?

This?

"Yes welcome back, Shirou." The dream, finally announced its end here.

This I'd love to see.

[clockworkmajyyk]

So! Fate and Homestuck have been a special interest for about a decade now (I’m sorry Dean, but I can’t stand you.) and yeah this might be a several month old post but it’s 3am let’s party. So this is my take.

I would have to say that Shirou Emiya is a Knight no question. When you consider the masks he wears and his future as EMIYA/Nameless there’s no other class I can see fitting. Aspect wise it’s actually difficult, because as Archer he fulfills the role of a Knight of Time narratively, but those powers aren’t inherently his, they belong to Alaya, not himself. It leaves me stuck between Doom, and then the Rage/Hope dichotomy. Because Doom Loves Shirou. He and Lancer keep meeting because he didn’t die when reality said he should (thanks Rin) so the universe keeps throwing these assholes at each other even when they don’t recognize each other. But I think Hope/Rage as class inversions match Shirou and Archer the best. Whether he’s a Knight of Rage or Knight of Hope I’m too tired to say for certain. Buuuut I think he relied on false hope in the beginning and came into his own as a Knight of Rage in the Heaven’s Feel route while Archer was him leaning too heavily into Rage.

As for Rin? Well her character is ultimately defined by her relationship with other people isn’t it? She’s always the deutertagnoist never the protagonist. Her relationship to her servant, to Shirou, to Sakura, to Hakuno, her father. It’s always someone else defining her character but I don’t feel like it’s in a lacking a sense of self Heart Way, and more Blood way. One of the best analysis I’ve seen of her character pointed out that Rin puts herself in the position of people owing her so they won’t leave her. With her experience I think she might be a Mage of Blood.

Poor Sakura I can’t see as anything but a Doom player, but that’s also because she seems to fulfill the role of Maid better than Witch to me. Because while she does snap and go heavy on her aspect, she doesn’t start off bubbly the way witch’s are like to do and doesn’t settle back into being an energetic person. I think Maid of Doom fits her best, but I could see an argument for Witch of Doom. Because while she does have the obscurity of a void player, I think the tragedy of Doom is more overwhelming to her story.

Ilya is the hardest for me because so much of her character is best explored in the VN, and unfortunately she doesn’t explores in things like Extra, AND I don’t think it’s fair to consider proper timeline Ilya and Kaleid as the same person the way I normal do Nasuverse characters. Narratively she bounces so far all over the place depending on the route and choices you make it’s hard to choose. She was born to die, a vessel for the holy grail. Ironically my first thought was Blood, but I think Ilya is the Heart player here. Possibly the Most Unhealthy Page of Heart I can think of in media. Which could possibly work for Kaleid too… hm.

Remember at midnight when I was like "Mmmhmm yes magical girls very good then"?

Well, strap in we're doing more of that shit.

I apologize to anyone who has a massive fight or flight reaction to the Fate franchise, but they have a magical girl spinoff and I am in love with it SO!!!!

Illya von Einzbern (Child): Page of Blood

You know, it occurs to me that Homestuck is a creation myth about gods who give birth to themselves, and Illya is the ONLY one of there grail children that can't be said to have done so. Amazing. What a terrible little creature she is. I adore her endlessly.

Anyway, Illya has many charming character traits, but her absolute adoration for her friends and family are top of the list, right next to her immense cowardice. The self-conflicted Page of Blood title is a natural fit not only for her immense, world shaking love of Miyu, Chloe and Shiro, nor her literally being a source of life fuel for Chloe, both of which are very Blood behaviours.

She's also just pitiful, absolutely the saddest baby, until she busts out these insane growth curves. Classic pagery.

Chloe von Einzbern: Prince of Rage

Speaking of Gods Who Give Birth To Themselves...

This is a really basic read that I don't think needs much justifications. Chloe appears during impossible situations to break barriers and let Illya achieve her goals.

Mostly by way of overwhelming destructive force.

Miyu Edelfelt: Bard of Light.

Miyu is also a self manifested god, amazing, what is even happening with these magic cups?? Why do they want so badly to be Real Girls??

Anyway, Miyu is a Bard of Light because she is a channel for ultimate destruction forced into an inconsolately passive role, and worst of all the force is literally just "other people getting constantly really lucky." I mean, damn, girl lost the lottery at birth. Oof.

Bonus the main timeline: adult!Illya is a Bard of Light too; I think being a grail kinda does that to you. Shiro is the Heir of Space because literally there were 3 anime about him inheriting othes people's space powers come on. Rin is a Thief of Heart and a damned good one at that. Sakura simply deserves not to have to play SGAME let the poor child have a break mein Gott (Witch of Void). Saber is a fucking sprite obviously.

These are my opinions not statements of fact. I am always interested in hearing your opinions too.

[assexassin]

title: fate/stay night unbreakable bond

chapter 1: new meetings

synopsis: kazumi finds herself in a dire situation which may determine her survival: the need for food and lodging.

pairings/dynamics: canon x f!oc (at least 3), artoria pendragon x rin tohsaka, sakura matou x medusa

wc: 5k

warnings: none that i am aware of, please let me know if any need to be added

a/n: i'm sorry for the very late update, but i finally have a direction i want this to go to, plus i can now read the full vn complete w all 3 routes to make a better fic! i do hope that you all like it. thank you so much for supporting me!

“Uh, Kazu?”

The rosette tilted her head slightly in her beloved Servant’s direction, never once lifting her optics from the take out menu in front of them. Her Saber let out an exasperated sigh at her Master’s lack of attention. Promptly, the amaranthine tressed woman plucked the laminated sheet from the Mage’s grasp, arms folded as if she had been ready to scold a child. To Alessia, Kazumi may as well still have been one.

“Nee — san!” A puckered pout formed on the rosette’s labrums as she crossed her arms upon the makeshift table, chin resting on a forearm. “Gimme back the menu!!”

The Heroic Spirit just clicked her tongue in response, tapping her foot impatiently against the floor of the abandoned barn, brows furrowing in growing irritation as her lips pursed.

“When are we going to find a suitable place for you to actually dwell in while we’re here? You can’t live for the next few months in this dingy barn like contraption! You’re a human , Kazumi. Not livestock!”

The Heroic Spirit’s hands curled around her hips, a deep frown marring the knight’s features. With a swift strike, she thwacked the back of the rosette’s head with the folded up menu, a slight huff emanating from her lips. Kazumi could tell from the mildly irritating glint in those lavender pools that her Saber was utterly done with her childish antics. Begrudgingly and with a pout lining her features, the mage simply sighed in defeat, raising herself from the chair and stretching her lithe arms up above her head.

“Fine, fine. Wish I had brought a change of clothes with me…”

Looking down at her hand, Kazumi’s face contorted into one of confusion, seeing as her bright ruby command seals had disappeared from her skin. Guess the Grail found out… Shaking her head softly, the pink haired woman headed out the door, Alessia dematerializing behind her and slipping into the magus’ shadow. Kazumi began her trek for sustenance, humming softly to herself to fill the void of silence that blanketed around her. Walking in the direction of the town, she rummaged in her pocket, pulling out various bills and her ID.

I’m going to need to exchange these for yen right?

Kazumi… the nearest place to exchange it would be in Tokyo… you need food NOW!

Recoiling from the yelling in the Master — Servant bond within her mind, the rosette grimaced slightly, walking aimlessly into Fuyuki. Sharp malachite optics surveyed the town, taking in the ambiance as she tried to find a place to eat. The evening’s autumn breeze whipped her hair every which way behind her, reminding her of the Italian sea winds kissing her face when she stared up at the sunny sky. Stars became chatoyant in her hues as she spotted a liquor store, her feet already paddling in its direction. Her lips tugged into a small smirk, already dashing towards the establishment.

Kazumi, you do know you have to show your ID right?

Don’t worry! I’m over twenty — one anyway!

But Kazumi… your ID would say you’re seventeen …

… Guess I’ll just have to convince them to just let me pay for it without showing my ID then!

Kazumi… that’s not how this works… oh my gods, you’re going to be thrown in jail before you even try to fix this anomaly aren’t you?

A long sigh could be heard within her mind, but Kazumi paid no heed. The woman stepped into the store, the little bell ringing as the doors swung open and closed. Her verdigris optics scanned the bottles and liquids, her hands reaching for the neck of a vodka bottle. Walking up to the counter, her hues remained on the bottle in an effort to concentrate while arguing with Alessia in her head.

If I’m going to be sent to all these places, I might as well have fun and get drunk doing it!

Kazumi, no you need to stay focused! What if you get hurt before you even start investigating? Or worse, die ?

A soft pout lined her lips, low grumbles escaping her lips as she walked up to the counter. So immersed in arguing with her Servant was she that the magus didn’t even notice the poor boy standing at the counter waiting to check out the one bottle in her hands until he coughed slightly to garner her attention.

“Um… miss, do you plan on buying that?”

Kazumi’s head snapped up, the familiar voice causing her eyes to widen and nearly tear up. His eyes… his eyes were just like his , warm honey pools she could just stare into forever. The male looked at her quizzically, she couldn’t blame him. Kazumi was sure her own countenance bore a concoction of emotions he wasn’t sure what to make of. Swallowing the lump in her throat, she set the bottle down on the counter for him to take.

“Yeah, sorry about that. Guess I got lost in my train of thought…” she breathed out, hands clasping behind her back.

Is that… oh gods, tell me that’s not who I think it is!

… No comment…

I swear if it all goes downhill from here…

“Ah, you know, I’m going to need to see some sort of identification…” the boy asked, nervous as he had never really worked the counter all that much. “My boss will yell at me if I sell alcohol to someone underage…”

See, don’t end up being the reason why this poor boy gets fired. Wait… how old is he anyway…

Oh, calm down Sia! I got this!

Clearing her throat, Kazumi laughed a bit nervously, a hand coming up to sheepishly rub her nape. “Ah about that… you see, my license kind of got revoked. And that’s the only form of identification I really have.” A soft laugh resonated from her throat while the redhead in front of her pursed his lips softly. “But I do promise that I am over twenty — one!” A white lie, yes, but Kazumi had done worse. “So, can’t you let it slide juuust this once?”

Blinking her malachite apertures softly, she watched as his own golden — auburn ones became hesitant. However, his hands moved to take the bottle and scan it, lips letting a soft sigh escape. “Alright, fine. But only because you do look older.” The male’s cheeks puffed as he pressed the corresponding buttons on the register before telling her the total. “Alright, that'll be 10,602 yen, miss!”

Fishing the money out of her pocket, the woman handed it to him, tilting her head slightly. “What’s your name? You seem kind of young to be working at an alcohol store. How old are you anyway?”

The male sighed, a soft blush painting the apples of his cheeks. “Well… I just have connections…” Looking off to the side, the ginger just bagged the bottle and gave her the receipt. “I’m Emiya Shirou, and… yeah I’m seventeen…”

Kazumi’s dainty hand immediately flew to the necklace fastened around her neck, holding onto the bow pendant tightly. “Shirou…” Memories flooded into mind, as if she were seeing a fast paced slideshow of her life right in front of her eyes. Tears pricked the corners of her eyes, pastel lashes blinking furiously to blink them back, so that they wouldn’t cascade down her cheeks. The hand clutching onto the plastic bag clenched it tightly in an attempt to calm herself from sobbing in the middle of the store.

“Um… miss, are you okay?”

Startled, Kazumi nodded and managed a smile at the male. “Yeah, thanks for asking Shirou!” It hurt, saying his name again after all this time, but she went on with it, pushing down all the bubbling emotions down into the depths of her heart. She nearly melted seeing his soft smile in response, only to be confused when his countenance became wary.

“You okay?”

“Yeah… I just feel as if someone’s staring at me… more like glaring at me. But you’re the only one in here right now…”

… Sia, stop glaring at him. They’re not really the same person — well okay they are but —

Never. But you could use this opportunity to get some intel as to where you could spend the night.

“Ah, don’t worry about it. I’m sure it’s just your imagination!” Smiling softly, the woman tilted her head to the side as she pondered how to phrase her inquiry. “Shirou, by any chance do you know anywhere I could stay the night? I’m kind of new here, just visiting for a while really.”

Shirou could only sigh and shake his head. “Not that I’m aware of. I mean, there is that one hotel nearby, but I’m not sure if they have any open rooms for you. Plus, it’s pretty expensive from what I’ve heard.”

Humming to herself, Kazumi pondered her options, knowing that she didn’t exactly have the money to live it up at such a nice hotel. At the same time, however, she truly may have had nowhere to go. It’s not like she could be exactly welcomed into her father’s hermitage in this… predicament , let alone know where it is. The magus sighed, pressing a finger to her temple as she tried to think of an alternative.

The boy behind the counter could see that this woman was in quite a predicament. He wasn’t sure if she was just reluctant to spend her money or if she had a limited amount, but he assumed that she didn’t want to stay at that fancy hotel. Shirou, being generous to a fault, believed that he could offer an alternative for her.

“If you’d like… you can stay at my place for the night!”

“Wouldn’t your parents mind?”

Shirou let out a somber sigh, a finger scratching his cheek gently. “I actually live alone…”

At Kazumi’s concerned frontispiece, the redhead immediately smiled and shook his hands in front of him in an alleviating manner. “Ah, don’t worry, I have a guardian who periodically comes in and takes my food… and I have… certain connections through her.” He laughed gently, a hand coming back to rub his nape.

What does he mean by that, Kazu?

Those connections.

Kazumi could hear Alessia sighing within her mind, causing the rosette to smile wryly. Indeed, those connections weren’t the best, but they made do for him. So this was how he managed…

“That’s really kind of you, Shirou! But are you sure that’ll be okay?”

“Yeah! Ah, Sakura might be apprehensive about you staying, but since it’s my place, it won’t be much of a problem!”

An eye twitched at the name “Sakura” before a smile graced her lips, Kazumi simply nodded and clutched the bag with her alcohol bottles closer to her. “Great! When’s your shift over?”

“Soon! If it’s not too much, you can wait outside! It’ll only be a few minutes. Ah I didn’t get your name, would you mind telling me?”

“... I’m Kazumi. Kazehana Kazumi! Alright, I’ll wait for you until you’re finished.”

The rosette just waved at him and turned around, heading out the door and taking out one of the bottles. Her hands clasped onto her keychain, using the bottle opener she had attached to it to undo the cap before taking a sip. The slight metallic shine of the keychain caught Shirou’s amber optics, squinting hard to see if he could make out the words. But it was in a language he couldn’t understand.

Are you sure this will be alright? For both you and him?

Well, I don’t see any other option. At least not one that would raise concern. Don’t worry, Nee — chan, I’ll find Dad’s hermitage. He was here in the last Holy Grail War after all. In the meantime…

Yeah, yeah I get it. I’m sure I can help you find Lord Masato’s land in the meantime. I guess… I guess I’ll let this slide then.

Smiling to herself, Kazumi idly hummed as her malachite hues glanced up into the sky. So transfixed by the radiant stars was that Kazumi didn’t notice the wind nipping at whatever skin showed, nor did she notice when Shirou walked out until he tapped on her shoulder.

“Kazumi? Hey are you alright?” Shirou looked at her with concern written all over his face, his belongings in his arms as he turned in the direction of his place. “It’s a long walk from here, but don’t worry. I’ll make sure we’ll get there safely!”

The way he beamed up at her when he iterated those words, as if he was sure that he could take care of and protect her, as if their difference in experience wouldn’t matter, had her stifling a laugh. She knew how he was and how he would insist on being the one doing all the protecting despite his lack of power. It was both amusing and concerning, knowing what it could entail.

“Don’t worry about me. I can take care of myself if need be. But this town seems quite tame and quiet. I highly doubt anything bad would happen to us even if it is late at night!”

Kazumi simply followed him as he led the way. Shirou raised an eyebrow but didn’t say anything else after, just continuing his trek back home with her. The redhead, for all his kindness, was of course a bit skeptical about her. She clearly wasn’t from here, with the way her pale emeralds scoured the area with immense intrigue.

“So, Kazumi. What are you doing here?”

The rosette slightly turned her head towards him, pondering the best way to answer the question. After all, she couldn’t outright tell him she essentially traveled through time to fix anomalies as ordered by Alaya.

“This is my dad’s hometown. I wanted to see it; it’s been a while since I’ve last been here.” A frown marred her labrums, her arms coming up to wrap around her own torso, hugging herself. “He… he died because of an illness about a decade ago. He was last here. I want to find the place he had while he was in Japan!”

She quickly replaced the frown with a gentle smile, her gaze returning to the path before them. “Don’t worry, I’ll be out of your hair before you know it.”

“That’s not why I asked, you know..” Shirou smiled before letting his gaze stare straight ahead, shoving a hand in his pocket. “You just stick out a bit you know?”

Letting out a soft laugh, the shorter male just continued walking, his smile never leaving his visage. “You know, I can relate to the whole “losing your father” thing. My own dad died a few years ago… so I understand how lonely it can be.”

Kazumi looked at him solemnly, knowing how hard it must've been for him to continue on after losing a parental figure. It was hard for her too. “I’m sorry for your loss, Shirou.”

“It’s alright.” Shirou pointed to the hermitage atop a hill. “That’s my place. The lights on mean that Fuji — Nee and Sakura are there.”

Oh, so even when they were this young he had girls all over him.

Could you please say something nice, Nee — chan?

But never!

Snapping out of the mental conversation she was having with her Saber, Kazumi found herself walking uphill towards the Emiya residence. She hummed softly, her hands clasping behind her back while they continued upwards.

“If it’s alright with you… maybe I can help you with finding your dad’s place?” Shirou tentatively asked as they walked, face slightly turning towards hers. The pallid moonlight reflected off those auburn pools of his, bringing out the shining determination that swam in the midst of them. “What’s his name?”

His question had Kazumi a bit startled, not expecting him to offer assistance for her secondary objective. She covered it up by quickly shaking her head and letting a nostalgic quirk of her lips show on her countenance. “Masato. Kazehana Masato. I’m not sure if you know him somehow, but he grew up here before meeting my mom!”

The name that slipped off the woman’s lips caused a twinge of remembrance in the redhead’s brain, but he couldn’t exactly place a face to the name, nor recount where he’s heard it before. “I’ll do everything I can to help you, Kazumi!”

Kazumi could only smile and giggle in response. She was just about to complain when they finally arrived in front of the door. Shirou fished out the key from his pocket and slid the door open. “I’m home!”

“Welcome home, Senp —”

A violaceous tressed girl bounded towards the door only to stop in her tracks, her amaranthine optics glaring at Kazumi. The rosette, in turn, stepped back instinctively, about to tell Shirou that she could try to find another place to stay in; however, the cerise headed male took her by the hand and brought her inside.

“Sakura, this is Kazumi. She’ll be staying with me for a bit until she can find a place of her own.” Shirou found himself sweat dropping as Sakura had her glower still trained on the rose tainted tressed woman beside him. “Is Fuji — Nee around?”

As if on cue, the said short haired woman popped up out of nowhere, about to greet the young male only to see a woman next to him who she had never seen. Taiga’s lips curled up into a cavalier simper, sauntering over to the redhead and throwing an arm over his shoulders. “Oh Shirou ~ you should’ve just called and told us you'd be bringing a friend home tonight ~ Sakura and I would’ve gotten out of your hair! Well since you’re both here, Sakura, you mind setting another plate for her?”

Sakura gave a pouted huff before promptly turning round and complying, gingerly placing an extra plate down onto the table before briskly walking back into the kitchen. She threw a side eyed glance at the rosette, clearly wary of who she was and what she was doing here.

I don’t think she likes you, Kazu.

You think?!

Laughing a bit awkwardly, Kazumi gingerly stepped inside, having been dragged by Shirou in order for the latter to show where she would be staying for the night. They walked into one of the spare rooms in the minka, the male gesturing around.

“You can stay here for the night, I hope that it’ll be alright.” A sheepish smile wove across his lips, his hand rubbing his nape in an embarrassed manner. “It’s not much, but I hope it’ll be alright.”

“It’s perfect!” The rosette’s countenance bore a soft smile as she tilted her head to look at him. “I don’t need much anyway. I’m just a guest in your home, Shirou. Thank you for your hospitality!”

A soft coral painted itself on the boy’s cheeks as he averted his gaze, his hand once again coming up to rub the back of his neck. “It’s no big deal, really.” Shirou started towards his own room, a lone index finger pointing down the hall. “There’s the bathroom. You can go wash up before we have dinner. If you need anything, I’m down the hall!”

He jabbed his thumb in the direction he was headed, giving the older woman a bit of an awkward smile before nearly running back to his room. This caused Kazumi to let out a soft laugh, placing some of her stuff down in the room provided for her before heading to the bathroom to get ready for dinner.

Kazu… are you really sure this is such a good idea? I mean… think of all the things that could happen! What if you accidentally let something out that shouldn’t be said this early? What if you slip up, say something you shouldn’t? What if —

Sia, no matter what I do, I’d be somewhat altering this timeline. You know this; this has always been the way it’s been. It’s one of the things that come with Alaya sending me back to fix anomalies that can potentially bring the end of humanity… or whatever excuse they gave me.

Hearing Alessia sigh through their bond, Kazumi simply washed her hands and walked out the door, hands clasping behind her back as she kneeled down at the table where the extra plate had been set for her. Upon her arrival, the short marmalade haired woman intensely stared at her, her elbows leaning on the table while her hands cupped her cheeks.

“Soooo ~ Shirou brought you home huh ~ ? I’m Fujimura Taiga, Shirou’s homeroom teacher in class!”

So she’s the “Tiger of Fuyuki”, huh?

“It’s nice to meet you, Taiga. I’m Kazehana Kazumi!”

“What are you doing here? Why did Senpai decide to let you stay here?” Sakura asked, amaranthine hues wary of the newcomer. Not that Kazumi could blame her, she too would be wary if a friend, or crush, were to invite a total stranger into their home. The violaceous haired girl still glared at her, though with less intensity this time, which made her a bit uneasy.

“Ah, it’s not like that. I actually met him at his workplace while I was passing by, and since I don’t exactly have the money right now to stay at the hotel, Shirou kindly offered to let me stay until I found my dad’s place.” The rosette smiled as best as she could with Sakura’s leer trained on her, her lithe dactyls fiddling with one another. “That’s what I’m here for in the first place, to find my dad’s own hermitage here.”

Before anything else could be said, Shirou entered the room and kneeled down next to Kazumi, idly smiling at all the females present. “Sorry for making you all wait! Sakura, did you make all of this while waiting for me?”

The younger girl’s harsh glare suddenly morphed into a beaming smile, her head nodding ecstatically while her hands clasped in front of her chest. “Yes I did! I wanted to hone my cooking skills in traditional Japanese dishes!” She iterated those words with such passion, it was hard for Kazumi to not smile in acknowledgement of the younger’s efforts.

“Well, it looks really good!” Kazumi commented, her hands in her lap and gripping onto the hem of her attire. Sakura simply looked at her and thanked her, a slightly unreadable expression on the canvas of her frontispiece.

You two are hopeless aren’t you?

Shut up, Sia.

The four then began to say their graces, Kazumi remembering how her father had shown her how to say it Japanese. It had been years since she’d seen him, her last memory of him being the day before he left for Fuyuki in 1994. Nostalgia washed over her before she steeled herself, grasping the chopsticks and digging in. Content hums resounded in the room as they let the flavors meld on their tongue.

Silence blanketed the room as the quartet enjoyed the meal in front of them. Kazumi surveyed the room, noticing how Taiga ecstatically dug into her plate. Sakura, on the other hand, ate in a much calmer manner while glancing back and forth between her plate, Shirou, and Kazumi herself.

Still with that glare…

The host himself was lost in the food he was chewing, an appreciative hum emitting from him. “It’s really good, Sakura!” Shirou began to ecstatically comment on how well the spices on the fish mingled with the sauce that had been prepared, causing the heliotropic stained tressed woman to blush under the praise. It was no surprise to Kazumi how he gave positive feedback, that was just how he was after all.

Dinner didn’t take all too long to wrap up, Sakura raising from her spot and helping Shirou to collect the various dishes. Naturally, Kazumi offered to help, but Shirou insisted she relax and take it easy.

“You’re a guest, Kazumi! It’s alright, just sit back and relax.”

His smile radiated the warmth of a thousand suns, his twin Venus’ beaming with the same warmth before he disappeared into the kitchen. Taiga, much to Kazumi’s chagrin, continued to simper at her, nearly making the face of a smug Cheshire cat who’s found its prey.

“Taiga… it really isn’t like that. He’s just being a good Samaritan!”

“Hmm ~ don’t do anything stupid while I’m gone then!” With a wink, Taiga got up to wash her hands in the kitchen sink before getting her coat from the front closet. Thanking the redhead as she placed her shoes on, the short haired woman complained about the amount of paperwork that she would have to do later that night. “I’ll of course be taking Sakura home, so don’t worry about it!”

Once Sakura had gathered her belongings and shrugged on her jacket and shoes, she looked back at the two left in the foyer with a pouty frown. “Have a good night, Senpai! … Kazumi…”

I’ll take it.

“Bye, get home safe!” Shirou waved as the two made their trek before sliding the doors shut. Turning around, he simply shoved his hands into his trouser pockets, averting his auburn hues so that they looked at anything else except the woman before him.

Kazumi noticed this easily enough, not that Shirou was trying to hide it in the first place, and couldn’t help herself from giggling at his antics. “Never had a girl over that wasn’t either one of those two at night?” she teased, arms crossing underneath her chest.

Shirou stuttered a bit before swallowing the lump in his throat. “No, not really.”

“Ah. Don’t worry, I won’t be much trouble for you.”

Laughing a bit, she was about to turn around to head into the room he had assigned her before he spoke up.

“I — I’ll be back in the shed if you need me! It’s around the corner, so you can walk in the middle of the night if you need to.” Shirou fiddled around with the sleeves of his shirt before raising a hand in parting for the night and leaving through the sliding doors. His eyes had been shifty to say the least, as if he was trying to hide a secret from her.

Kazumi gave him the benefit of the doubt, squinting her chartreuse optics when he slid out a little too fast for her liking. He hadn’t displayed such signs beforehand, so naturally, the magus would be wary of the new and sudden behavior; however, there wasn’t much she could do about it now. He was gone before she could ask anything about it. Sighing, the rose haired woman continued her way back to the room, sliding the door open to enter and letting it shut partly.

“Nee — san, you can come out now. He’s gone.”

“I heard him, you know?! I was right there with you! As if I’d leave you alone with him.”

With a huff, a woman donning locks of elysian lavender materialized before Kazumi, her hands on her hips in a near condescending tone. Alessia’s brows were knitted together in a bit of frustration, causing sweat to form at Kazumi’s temples. She knew just what this meant for her.

“You have some nerve just accepting his offer without thinking this through! How long do you even plan on staying here? Surely you can’t find Lord Masato’s hermitage in just a span of a day, you know!” Gritting her teeth, the Roman knight crossed her arms over her chest and tapped her foot impatiently against the wooden floor.

“Calm down! We’ll see how it goes, and if it ends up being more than anticipated… we’ll find a solution!” Kazumi stood there, her countenance bearing a cavalier and eminent simper, as if she had just come up with the world’s best course of action. “At least I’ve got a place to stay for the night!”

Letting out a sigh that exuded the energy of “this is not going to go well”, Alessia pointed towards the futon. “Well, if you’re going to mess up, you might as well do it with a good night’s rest. To bed, now!” Alessia sounded like a mother scolding her child to get to bed, and that is exactly how some would regard the two’s friendship.

Kazumi rolled her eyes, but did as asked by the Saber. She peeled off the clothes she’d been wearing all day before flopping onto the futon, wrapping herself in the sheets and comforter before peering up at Alessia. The latter let a soft, nostalgic smile stretch her lips upwards, materializing a cape of sorts and letting it settle around the magus, the argentite emblem of a kingdom long forgotten luminescing underneath the iridescent moonlight.

“Sing for me?” Kazumi peeked out from under the covers, her pale emeralds shining at the prospect of her best friend easing her to sleep with a lullaby from her childhood.

“You really don’t want to break this habit, do you, Kazu?” Nevertheless, Alessia agreed; she sat on the edge of the bed and let her nimble fingers move stray locks of pastel pink behind her Master’s ear, the hanging gossamer lace of her attire brushing against the woman’s cheek.

Despite the kind of tone she had previously utilized, Alessia’s singing was soft and ethereal, as if a choir of angels were singing from the heavens above. The celestial hymn wafted through the air and into Kazumi’s ears, causing her to smile and close her eyes. Pastel lashes kissed the apples of her cheeks as she gently drifted off to sleep, clutching onto the cape and the sheets tightly. Alessia soothingly stroked the woman’s hair as she continued to sing, not taking note of the volume her vocals were reaching. She didn’t mind nor care, all that mattered to the demigod was this one woman’s happiness and health.

And because of that disregard, that same Latin tongued lullaby was able to be heard, albeit slightly muffled, by the ears of a certain redhead. A song he had heard many times in his dreams within the past couple of nights.

[mybrendanthehuntress137]

Adapting visual novels are not easy

(Unfortunately I wasn’t able to put this ramble on reddit since I don’t have enough karma with me so I guess this shitty website will have to do.)

You know, after watching all of Ufotable’s fate adaptations (Heaven’s Feel included), I’ve noticed in the community that whenever ufotable is mentioned, there’s are ‘very’ polarizing opinion on this specific studio: Some people love the series for it’s beautiful, artistic animation, other people hate it for condensing and cutting the most important moments in the 2004 visual novel. And while yes, I do have my problems with the adaptations when comparing them to the vn, I honestly find it very unfair for fans to say that Ufotable is a disgrace to all of Type-Moon.

Adapting visual novels are not easy, I mean when has there ever been a perfect vn adaptation or as a whole? There will always be a moment where a studio cuts corners in a series. I mean, take Unlimited blade works for example: there was a movie adaptation made by the infamous studio Deen who also made the infamous 2006 Fate route, it was such an inaccurate adaptation that even watching the film AS a just a movie is just as bad as it sounds due to it just craming in as much as possible into film length, so you’re just going to be left all confused, so yeah, pretty bad (And also the animation is trash). And when ufotable adapted UBW, it was umm... well it was way better than Deen’s, but man when there was a change, there was a DISGUSTING change. 

Unfortunatly, this adaptation also falls pretty flat too due to it being a 26 episode and when you have to cram in as much information into a 20 min ep, it doesn’t go so well. Like how they changed Ilya’s backstory, or cut out a very important scene about Shirou, yeah, it doesn’t do the vn justice. But enough about my ramblings, the animation is fucking orgasmic, when Ufotable knows how to adapt a fight scene, they really know how to adapt a fight scene, you can basically pause any moment in this series and it can instantly become your new wallpaper, and the fact that it has been about 7 years since this came out really shows that. And also Emiya’s theme is absolutley amazing. 

(These are just two examples of Ufotable using 5%)

So while yes these adaptations are very flawed, and if you don’t like them, thats totally fine, I’m sure their are plenty of people reading this have their own perspective to the series. But I don’t think we should throw all of Ufotable’s effort away. You can really see how much passion they put into making this series more than just your average vn adaptation. This isn’t just some and I feel that many readers throw this adaptation off as just bad.

[iloveyoutotype-moonandback]

CW: gore, abuse and rape mentions.

So I recently played the original Tsukihime visual novel (it’s being remade so I might as well check out the original right?) and I wanted to talk about some of my general impressions and thoughts on it. 

TL;DR for people who don’t wanna read any spoilers (or if you just don’t wanna read through my long-ass post): I thought it was good and there were lot of aspects and themes that I found interesting. I did have problems with certain aspects of it however, and I wouldn’t recommend it to everyone since it’s really violent and...well just see the CW for yourself. But if none of that deters you, then I think it’s worth checking out!

So, like I said above the cut, I enjoyed it overall. The story was interesting, with the focus being on vampires and some more information on the church for example (fate tends to focus more on the grail war, so other aspects of the Nasuverse are inevitably glossed over or not mentioned at all). This also had a psychological horror aspect, with Shiki having dreams where he kills people just to give one example. But then there are certain indications that what he’s seeing is real, leading him to believe that he could be unconsciously killing people. And he doesn’t WANT to see these dreams, he actually hates them to the point that there are a few scenes where he straight up avoids going to sleep altogether. The problem is that he has no idea how to stop seeing them, or even what’s happening to him. Also other characters often hide stuff from him or lie for his “protection”, so that really only adds to the uncertainty (this dude kinda gets gaslit a lot, come to think of it). 

I remember seeing some people say that the artwork for this vn isn’t as good as what you get in fsn, which makes sense given that it’s older and thus earlier in Takeuchi’s art career. And I can see what they mean, but there’s legit some good CG’s in this one. Also it does this interesting thing where instead of drawn backgrounds, it has real life pictures that have been edited/stylized. I can’t quite articulate it, but it gives the vn a different vibe that really works for it imo. I like it.

In terms of characters, I gotta say that Hisui was one of my favorites. I guess I just kinda relate to her in a weird way. She’s quiet, isn’t super expressive (or at least it seems that way initially), and doesn’t like being touched. I used to be like that (I’m still like that sometimes but I’ve gotten a lot better), though obviously she has....very different reasons for being that way. But at that point my brain had already gone “that one” with her.

Speaking of Hisui, I really like Kohaku too. If we’re comparing Nasu’s works here, I feel like she’s kind of comparable to Sakura. Mostly in a thematic sense, seeing as how she’s someone who appears normal enough but there’s a lot brewing beneath the surface that we don’t fully see until her route (and by that I mean she suffered sexual abuse from Shiki and Akiha’s father when she was a child). I don’t want to compare them too much tho, since they are different characters at the end of the day. It’s just something of a common thread I noticed. Though with Kohaku, you do actually get a glimpse into what her deal is in Hisui’s route (mainly in the epilogue), which then leads right into Kohaku’s route. 

Outside of the two maids, Arcueid was another favorite of mine (if Hisui is my favorite, I’d say Arc is a close second) because she looks elegant at first but then you realize she’s a fuckin dork the moment she opens her mouth (and I love her for it). Ciel was cool too, and it was interesting to have a member of the church who’s more sympathetic than Kirei Ketamine over there (though as her route reveals, the church is still kinda fucked). I liked Akiha as well. It was really interesting seeing her develop across the 3 “far side of the moon” routes. At first you think she’s normal then op, turns out she’s part vampire and is actually pretty fucking powerful! That said, I did have a few problems with her route...

...which leads me into one of my criticisms of this vn. Akiha’s route was my least favorite out of the 5. Again, and I cannot stress this enough, it is not because of Akiha herself. Akiha good and cool. The issue here is Akiha and Shiki...basically fall in love and also fuck at one point. Did I mention that Akiha is Shiki’s little sister? Because she is. “Well Shiki was adopted so it’s not technically incest” don’t make me tap the sign:

Like yeah, I know “romance happens between Shiki and the main heroin of the route” is a common thread here but I’d like it if they made just one exception. Sibling relationships are good too, you don’t need to resort to romance. 

And, well, now that it’s been brought up already: this vn has sex scenes! And they were just as bad as I expected! I did read through one or two, but after that I just started either skimming through them or skipping entirely. A lot of them don’t really effect the story much (except for like, one which is actually kinda important) so most of them aren’t really worth it unless you just want to laugh at the weird lines. Not a big deal but I felt like it was worth mentioning at least.

Moving on, Tsukihime did have some problematic elements outside of the whole incest thing. Fate/Stay Night had its own issues and obviously Tsukihime will have them too. Tbf to Nasu, he did say he later regretted some of the stuff he wrote in this early period. It’s good that he’s grown as a person and a writer, because looking back there are definitely a few lines here that are really fucking bad. One that stuck out to me was this line from Arcueid’s route where Shiki is arguing with Ciel and then he just suddenly says something along the lines of, “if you try to stop me from going, I’ll rape you right here”. It’s right the fuck out of nowhere too. And like, the reasoning was that he could barely walk at that point so he just came up with some super threatening thing to say, but it was just really unnecessary. 

Actually, I think the same could be said about some of the sexual violence depicted. Like, there’s a whole recurring thing where Shiki will just suddenly get possessed to murder someone (because his vampire step-brother basically lives in his mind rent-free) and he mentions the arousal he gets from doing so. At several points he even acts on these impulses, and winds up getting hard and cumming as he cuts someone up into pieces. It’s...really fucking weird and I’m not sure what it adds by being there. It adds a creep factor for sure, but ig it’s a question of how necessary it actually is. Some of it is integral to the story, as is the case with...certain aspects of the Arcueid and Kohaku routes for example. So don’t get me wrong, I’m not saying remove it entirely, I’m just questioning some of the extra stuff that doesn’t seem totally necessary to me.

So all in all, while I did have some problems with it, Tsukihime isn’t bad by any means. Like I said before, I think it was good overall and I enjoyed it.  You can acknowledge the problematic elements of something, but still otherwise like it. But yeah, certainly not for everyone, but still worth playing in 2021 I think.

[yanderefairyangel]

I see, but imo 3H isn’t a game i would compare Engage with cause 3H is kind of a unique game : it’s FE x Personna, but it fails the Personna phase cause the VN phases are just horrible, and as much as Hopsies get critized, it doesn’t change the fact that Shez was a better self insert because they already were shown to have a personaily, whereas with Byleth they wanted both that the player could create Byleth’s personailty depending on which answer they choosed + them to have an actual background which clearly did not worked at all. With Shez, you could choose 2 very different cue, yet the voice acting + pacing made it clear that they had a personailty whereas Byleth could choose two drastically different cue, making your Byleth a sort of chimera of a character, a monster of inconsitent choices...anyway, not to disgress but seeing how Homies have 4 story compared to Engage who only has 1, comparing them feels wrong, cause it’s like comparing the Sonic several POV story game to the few games that have a unique POV story, not to mentions that the tone isn’t the same. Engage is lighthearted and don’t dive too much into darkness and seriousness whereas Homies tries to go hard into dark, seriousness, politics and yadi, yada

Had I to compare Engage to others games, I would have choosen the first FE Warrior cause it was too 1) a new kind of concept game 2) crossover/multiverse and compared to it (because I was expecting Engage to be like it), i must say Engage was a pleasant surprise. I 100% understand why ppl can’t like it, it’s very generic and we all agree that the story was weak but it’s goofyness and chessiness came right away to heal my depression and overall, seeing how it’s targeting a younger audience and appealing to more player, yes, the fact that it’s that simple of a story is most welcoming compared to Homies cause it was such a complex story as it strived to be ...that it lowered its quality in the sense that you have trouble understanding what happened and that’s coming from someone who enjoyed Evilious Chrnonicles and even that is incredibly complex but because it’s linear, it’s easy to actually understand what happened if you don’t lose the track of what happened whereas for 3H.. well, since it’s different routes, there are things that canonically DID NOT HAPPEN so it’s multiverse all again making it even more confusing because this means everything happened and at the same time not, and Fates, despite it’s flaws, was waaaay easier to understand and Engage’s story is actually easier to grow on you than 3H cause when you replay it, a simple story is more agreeable then the routes, especially when the monastery phase and VN phase are sooo BORING!! And once you completed all routes, why would you replay again ? especially when the gameplay is nothing exciting and that the calender system doesn’t allow you any replayable DLC pack ? Engage has weak replay value too, but it still has some enough with it’s gameplay being perfect when you’re bored and want a fun little challenge now if they had put a DLC pack like Awakenin’s cause Awakenin’s DLC pack was peak DLC, everyone would to it but the Fell Xenologue is all there is to it and it’s essentially hell so why would you go through this suffering again, you would really want to replay THIS ?

This map still comes at night haunt my nightmares, God. But again, people might prefer 3H's story and other Engage due to nothing but preferences, though overall Engage simple writing doesn't create the same level of plot inconsitency as any of the previous games, like all the twist don't ruin at least from the main story, but somehow people prefer the Xenologue's story which is really bad ima be honest, like it starts good and they showed that with a smaller cast they can actually put all characters into the story to flesh them out but it completely crumbles down like a card castle. Engage may seems weaker then 3H, but it's at least more solid then the 3ds game; i did remember a poll showing Engage beat the 2 games, and that's what dev were striving for since they said they wanted Engage to be a Awakening 2, not a 3H2 unlike what 3H babies hoped, and while I can't blame them especially if 3H was their first game knowing that Fates was the actual Awakening 2, 3H is, I repeat, a unique game, first time ever FE went that way, so really there was no chance they would repeat that formula.

It's not really like the Fates wank though cause it was more "ma route is da besto!" even though both can came off as boring in terms of plot and both as their flaw in terms of playthough cause Conquest still has the main problem of not allowing any bonus fight asides from the one offered by the DLC, which makes it harder to unlock the children units and in Lunatics, harder to have stockage unit compared to Birthright when you can actually unlock all ressources. As for the plot well... Conquest was good on paper but it had the curse to cross path with Revelation's plot since it introduces Anankos and Valla making the whole thing seems shallow, not counting what the Trio did put what reaaaaally ruined the plot was ... localized Xander. WHY TREEHOUSE WHY ??? <Why did they made him such a rebel when the jpn version wanted him to be a kind of delusional guy ??? This makes everthing, like Corrin not telling him about Fake Garon becomes nonsense since by the way Treehouse changed Xander he should have believed Kamui !! Nay, a wank more similar would be how back then fans were fighting over 3H's golden route, or true route (because they never played VN i assume) and it had only the merit of each supporter of their own beloved route to actually points out all holes and plot inconsistency in each route and while some are bad faith, or makes one reconsider "3H is an amazing story" but all routes have somewhat disapointing ending, CF and SF in particular, poor Eddie, all her route's ending are so bad....

Plus I keep seeing ppl reblogging and sharing localization change for Homies so I don't want to fall into the Fates trap of thinking Treehouses may be "innocent" in some plot holes or inconsistencies cause;.. The Awakening localization team did fixed holes, like that Chrom!Morgan hates bugs, not making sense with regular Morgan liking bugs, and turned it into a coarch to link with his support with Noire, or trying to fix, (without success) the Robin!Owain hole, but Treehouse sometimes makes me think they don't pay attention to the whole context and seeing what they did to Alear' S support... yeah they really never paid attention to context did they ? not that it's the only problem, they did censore Goldmary saying she ate too much or Timerra talking about her skirt, so would only half surprise me if some holes in 3H weren't due to Treehouse messing up again but even there would'nt change how Engage's story is more agreeable to make post about.

Like if I had motivation, I would have picked on the loca changes for 3H but do i really want to go through all the 4th route to check on that ? Whereas Engage ? I can just replay it once in jpn dub and call it a day

"as for the incest stuff, been over that fair enough amount of times that i dont have much else to say without repeating myself." which doesn't surprise me, that thing blew up a mont ago like a volcano and in less then a week, all arguments in favor or against the ship have been said, only difference is that the people against it only have 2 arguments consisting on focusing on Xenobron and Not!The Fell twins (that's how i call their Elyos double) to absolutely tries to prouve that Alear and the Fell twins are half-siblings in a round a about way, which...

it kinda sucks cause it's always family bound or character that cares about family that ends up being dragged into this... like when they poke jokes at Prisicilla but I never saw anything "perverted" in her love for Raven at the risk of comming off as dense, just a sister happy that she is reunited with her brother, same for the Renais twins, what's so romantic about patting your sister's head ? And the wank for Rhea sucked too, cause Rhea was shown to deeply care about her family (even though they aren't related) and she isn't the kind of person who would break that taboo, she doesn't even view Byleth as family herself (but at the same time she never saw Byleth as Byleth, but more as the envelopp containing her dead mother's spirit) and now it's exploding in a game who'se main theme is family and about Alear, a character that values a lot family bound. And they have to deal with 2 shits : people trying to prove their relationship with the twins despite the game itself not caring and that no matter what and on the other hand, people trying to ruin the Veyle' S support by trying to prouve that it was romantic so either they hate on Treehouse or praise them... for literaly just removing a word?? IDK who on earth read the JPN version of Veyle's Support and though there was romance in it cause they really need glasses, and it suck even more cause this support was very good and was taking place between 2 character who tried to be siblings after having such a tragic story and that makes the Nel wank worse cause they also use her support with Veyle to aliment their argument that no human being should give the ring to her, even though this support was about 2 individuals's developpement and accepting to be friends/family and Veyle helping Nel's trust issue, so really this wank sucks even more then for others game. Now you can argue that Fates did messed up cause it looks occ of Corrin to date any of the Royals but seeing how the Fates manga tried to push F!Corrin with Leo... yes, and the difference i would say is that unlike for the Royals, neither did 3H and Engage tried to lead you into saying the characters into family cause the plot don't care unlike for Fates where, except for the Nohrian royals, you had to explain why Hoshidan aren't Corrin's half siblings, but step family only and it was not even out of nowhere because of Anankos shenanigans....but for Engage, it really sucks since it's really all about family and there it's about proving blood relationship, so actual losecest which... Engage is the worst game you could have choosen for that, realy any other but the one about family in particular, the "adopted sibling still is losecest" is more tolerable cause Fates kind of deserves it though Corrin isn't really an adopted sibling;.. i mean, if kidnapped is adoption that is...and even then, people would still be "at least they aren't related in canon" to make it more ok in fiction then if it was whatever thing they tried with Veyle...and in the difference is that people never tried to prouve that Corrin is still related to theirs sibs, whereas here the only ground they have to support thei claim is... by proving relationship btw Rhea/Byleth and Alear/Fell twins and the infamous "but Veyle was romantic in JP" that is so... grrr

And yes, I said Nel wank cause people are only diggin this into her, not Rafal, he has none of this or a few probably cause of husbando biais and cause in his support he sortas says that Alear and him aren't really related so it's fine....but yeah, really sucks that instead of just rolling with it they turn it into a "we don't like it so we are going to make it everyone's problem" like the anti studenleth and that's crazy seeing how it's about literal pixels and that mutliverse doesn't even exist but... well, one moth before the DLC I still had to explain why Veyle isn't romantic in JPN and somehow, the "morally upright" elite called me a liar for saying there is nothing romantic about your sister saying she might jump out of joy if you were to wake her up... and i still do not understand why saying that you can't romance Veyle is a problem, why does this exist ?

Gotta be frank, the more time pass the more i can't stand the "3H had an amazing story whereas Engage is a failure" refrain because 3H is not a game I would compare Engage to, just doesn't make sense as they were not made with the same mindset, but it's just another day of thinking that Fodlan's duology is really overrated for what it actually is *sight* : 3

yanderefairyangel asked: also don' wanna add fuel into the fire, but i think the other reason why I'd say it isn't losecest is because Engage's theme is family, so IS may have crappy taste sometimes, but I don't think they'be tasteless enough to have the character that value family bound in a story about family break a taboo based on the sacred side of family ( I mean in a story about Alear's family two of "their family member" have so little relevance you can complete the story without unlocking them and aa..seeing how much * interesting *things Nel and Rafal says when you use them on the battlefield during the exploration phase) so i think it's another reason why IS hides behind alt world shenanigans but imma be honest, they relationship is way to complicated to say they are your average half siblings ! After all, unlike Fates whose main theme was more about choosing and it's consequences, Engage is a story about family and whereas Fates never properly explored it, Engage is full of that (i have lost the count of character having siblings) and even then Fates still had an excuse to let you romance the Royal if requiredn but seeing how they handled Veyle'S support, even IS has some limits. Crazy I know.

bundlin em together

i think its to be expected that the refrain pops up, and to an extent i understand why its used because its one of those things that technically true but easily abusable. Which is to say well engage has some real good story aspects to it, its story is also its weaker half. Meanwhile its gameplay kicks so much ass especially compared to three houses that from what i've seen its difficult to criticize engage from that angle, so if your looking for a way to 'attack' it as some are oft to do you kinda get coralled into attacking the easier part to attack of it.

just look at fates for a case precedence, birthrights gameplay and conquests story are generally [considered] the weaker halfs of their designs [personally i feel conquest beats birthright on both counts] so those are the most oft criticized aspects of fates.

the main difference in engages case when compared to three houses aspect though... is that engage also beats out three houses on a story angle in all the categories that count. so its an inherently unfavourable comparison.

as for the incest stuff, been over that fair enough amount of times that i dont have much else to say without repeating myself.

[cantillat-moved]

I should be writing drafts, but I had a series of distractions and I saw a post that made me want to write some meta. It is also something that always bothered me: how people bash Saber and people also talking nonsense about how Shirou treats Saber.

On a meta level, Nasu always expressed some regret on how he wrote Shirou’s treatment of Saber. Let’s take a few things into consideration: at the time Nasu was fresh out of high school and had published his first success, Tsukihime. It is famous how many routes and ideas were cut from Fate/Stay Night due to time restraints, so it isn’t hard to assume that the drafts had fewer passes than Nasu wished to. Moreover, the first anime adaptation, the DEEN studios one, was HORRID when treating Shirou. He looked like a little misogynist in places, specially as it lacked the internal dialogue and the adaptation was in itself very VERY bad. I remember how much hate Shirou used to get here on tumblr when this anime was released and it was the main reason why I didn’t try my hand at rping him at the time.

The main focus on Shirou’s and Saber’s relationships is how their lives were parallels. Dedicating themselves to become the embodiment of an ideal that can’t be attained. How both of them discard their humanity in order to serve people without asking for recognition or even gratitude, only because it is what they believe they wish to do. This is why Archer’s lecture at the shed in UBW hits both Saber and Shirou so hard – and Saber can tell it was also directed to her after realizing Archer’s identity. And watching Shirou in that route she also had her answer.

To be the Hero of Justice is to always be facing the one dilemma: to sacrifice the one for the wellbeing of the many. Saber had to remove herself from emotions and make painful decisions sometimes, to the point that Tristan left the Round Table with the haunting words "Our king does not understand the human heart." – which was the farthest thing from the truth, because it hurt her so much that she had to make the decisions. Shirou, however, decided that the one to be sacrificed for the good of everybody else was himself. He was to be the sacrifice. And because of their mindsets being so alike, they got angry at each other for doing the stupid thing.

Shirou was also a deeply traumatized individual that lacked coping mechanisms. He could conceal his PTSD and was always aware that he was messed up and traumatized, but bottled everything to fit in. Everything he knew as a kid ended overnight: his biological family, possibly even the school he used to attend and his classmates, teachers, neighbors, everybody in his world was gone. His relatives never even seemed to bother to try to adopt him. Then he got adopted by his savior, someone whom he adored deeply, and gave him a sense of stability and safety. Shirou wanted to be just like Kiritsugu. … Except that Kiritsugu died, and the boy became an orphan for the second time. Sure, he had Raiga to fall back, and Taiga was his legal guardian and always present, but it wasn’t the same thing as having a “family”. For a very long time he vented his frustrations doing the high jump at the track team and failing miserably until sundown, but eventually got some more direction after getting a part time job, but he never really could work his fear of losing his fear of abandonment, of someone he loved dying. When he met Saber, she quickly became someone he adored. The idea of losing her was excruciating. Hence the “But you are a girl!” It wasn’t anything about sexism. It was the tip of the iceberg. I don’t recall if it was in a drama CD or in the game, or if I’m just imagining it, but Kiritsugu would say something like “A guy who makes a girl cry is the worst kind of man” and Shirou would seriously take it to his heart – coating his own trauma with a layer of “I’m a guy, so I must protect girls”.

Along the same lines, Saber could recognize in Shirou that he would go down the same way she did, and possibly having an upsetting end. Sure, at first she was offended that he saw her as a “girl” when he should be seeing her as a “king”, but it wasn’t the case: he saw her as a “person”, the “girl” thing was his awkward and rather immature way to try to express something that he couldn’t fully grasp. I’m pretty sure that Saber RPers have different views of it or how it would go, but it is clear that they saw reflections of themselves on one another and wished them to be happy.

I have seen so many people talking crap about Saber over the years, and it is easy to tell it is mostly from people who haven’t read the VN or try to find justifications and twist them a bit. If you don’t like her or like another route, sure. I love all the girls and have criticisms on all the routes. But if you need to demean one to validate the other, then maybe your ship isn’t so solid as you think.