#tdp kppar

[amber-in-the-rough]

so, as far as I understood, Rayla's parents chose to... go? I think they don't need to be freed, at least. Runaan is out, Aaravos is out. Two out of three quasar diamonds are used. Which leaves us with one. And we just so happen to have one more person in need of de-coining.

... If Rayla hasn't forgotten about him and if the underground laboratory is still holding.

[self-spaghettification]

me when s6 gives me everything i want and more

[artaline]

#hey #hey op can we be friends because like #tdp became my long lasting hyperfixation years ago #and now lately I've been endlessly obsessed about bg3

#Viren is a character i love to hate and hate to love which is SO WEIRD compared to the absolute adoration i feel for Gale

#also if wyll became a dad i know in my heart he'd 1000% be a harrow kinda dad

#the contrast of ambition and duty between the two of them is something i hadnt thought enough about #doing distasteful things and seeking power solely for the greater good vs *saying* its for the greater good and also having selfish reasons #cause like i think about the complexity of what gale says in regards to seeking out the orb #he did it to prove his love to mystra but also specifically in the hopes that it would persuade her to loosen the rules for him #very much like viren 'everything I've done is for the people i love' and Kppar in the dream sequence going #'yoh made the choice that gave you power'

#I definitely see more parallels between viren and gale than harrow and wyll #i think the parallels work best in the context of their relationship and foils than solely the characters themselves

(tags via alls-fair-in-pride-and-prejudice)

*waves*

Gale is fun! He's a good mix of nerdy, handsome, tragic, and dark, which does keep one entertained.

(I do also find it incredibly funny that on our first playthrough I was playing as Lae'zel, and I did find Gale vaguely annoying. However now, playing as Wyll I am very much *hearteyes* at the guy. What can I say, character immersion I guess.)

And I do totally understand having complicated feelings about Viren. I do have to disclose that I have been on the Viren train since like, 2018, and due to the way serial media is, I am fully aware that my perception of him (and story in general) is likely warped by years of wait and fannish treatment. And while each consecutive season has been bringing in new interesting tones into the picture, there's definitely also a mix of personal disappointment, because in my "personal" "perfect" TDP i envisioned and hoped for back after s1 things would be very different.

Re: Harrow & Wyll parallels, you are not wrong, but i think part of the issue is that TDP never quite gave Harrow the freedom to be an independent character? With him being gone from the active narrative since s1e3, he's only ever present in the story to serve as a memento sounding board to others (mostly Viren, but occasionally Callum).

In season 2 there are some parallels between Viren-Harrow-Sarai and the scales-blindfold-sword symbolism of Lady Justice's paraphernalia. But at the same time the narrative subverts him as the proxy for "fairness" by having him pull the blindfold off in the final credits.

To me the kind of, core driving part of Harrow and Wyll is that they are striving to do good, but they do end up locked into having to solve trolley problems, and face up to being flawed humans while at it.

(It is true for other BG3 characters also, but for many others the choices are more power vs integrity of the self, where for Wyll it's so much more about autonomy vs duty. And Wyll's submersible mission is probably one of the most tightly controlled encounters in the game)

And ultimately I think Wyll is somewhat more precious to me than Harrow, specifically because he does get his hands dirty, he has to make the hard choices, where for Harrow a lot of his failures are cushioned by Viren.

It is a good observation regarding Viren and Gale's noble outward and selfish inward reasons! It was a very interesting aside regarding the Weave.

(I am admittedly very much of the "build the orphanage" mindset regarding selfish motivations, but here it's a sideways point)

With Viren i think lot of his "duplicity", stems less from strictly not being truthful about his motivations, as much as pure impulsiveness. He would be advocating for "rational" choices such as abandoning the wounded to save the rest of the expedition, but then would run to fight the dragon with queens of Duren.

I do think that one of their core traits is desire to be useful - Gale talks about it when telling you about Tara in the context of the tiefling party, that "it feels good to have repaid the favor". But also both of them are prone to entering the toxic doom spiral when their efforts are not appreciated/welcome.

Coming into BG3 BladeWeave (Wyll x Gale) from TDP Virrow (Viren x Harrow) is kind of a weird experience. Admittedly, the big part of the initial draw for me was the matching aesthetics between them, and, obviously, they are not the same characters. But in terms of narrative draws they do have lots of common themes that it feels more like a conversation.

Wyll, raised by a leader to be a leader, ends up accepting demonic warlock pact with Mizora to protect Baldur’s Gate. And is banished by his own father because the pact forbids him to share his reasons. This does mesh with themes of dark magic in TDP and how it’s distasteful, but instrumental in keeping Katolis safe – and how if Harrow didn’t have Viren to do the dirty work for him, he may have had to make these choices all on his own, ending up with debts and scars and stigma of it all.

Meanwhile, if human dark magic was not stigmatized, it’s easy to see Viren in the role of Gale – a successful and ambitious archmage. This background almost seems lighthearted in comparison, with Gale not really being involved in politics. But not having all the same challenges doesn’t free Gale from hardship – his ambition has to go somewhere. Both of the characters’ cores are ultimately about their drive in serving others and challenging the forbidden. And both of them have to deal with divorce/breakup, and the weight of positive utility of their death for the people they care about.

Bladeweave in relation to Virrow feels like a fix-it power balancer ship – they both fuck things up, and have their insecurities, but they can make each other better.

And it is a little funny to me that I keep chatting to my TDP friends about bladeweave with all the joyful excitement – “Just imagine, ‘Harrow’ has horns!” “’Viren’ has a magical cancer bomb in his chest, what fun!”. But I do struggle to go full propaganda the other way.

TDP is ultimately a kids show, and some of the narrative decisions are v much not my jam. Half of my favorite ship (Virrow) has been dead (or as good as dead) since s1e3, but it still lives rent free in my mind. I guess it is just the near shakespearian tragedy of them. Which I suppose does highlight the biggest potential draw for any BladeWeave appreciators: they have SO much history together.

Basically, imagine that Wyll and Gale grew up together. Imagine that Gale has served as a mage to Wyll’s family. They both want to do the best for the Baldur’s Gate, but that often means accepting dangerous ‘demonic pacts’. Gale has been taking the burnt of those onto himself, ruining his personal relationships for the sake of the greater good. And as much as Wyll is accepting of that, he is also at least a little disgusted at the cost, and at himself for letting it happen. And both of them are not very good at letting things go.

Virrow is a trainwreck that keeps going, and I just can’t turn away.

[alenkorra]

Ok so I'm saying this as a Viravos shipper myself, I think you're using the term queerbaiting too lightly. Yes, the writers are aware of the ship but they have never once acknowledged it outside of a couple of very SFW fanarts. I don't know if I'd consider it queerbaiting when most of us ship them because of what we interpret as sexual tension. I mean, considering this is a show aimed at kids I sincerely doubt the writers sat down and said "ok, how can we give Viren and Aaravos sexual tension?". The people involved in the show have done nothing to make us believe Viravos will be canon.

I honestly think it's more likely we'll get Viren x Kppar or just a little confirmation that Viren is queer. Especially because they're villains and TDP already faced backlash for the Queens of Duren, so they seem to be focusing more on positive rep now with Janaya and Ruthari.

If this wasn't a kids show then I would be more inclined to call it baiting, but they haven't given us much reason to think they'll make it canon.

Just realized something about what they will do with Viravos: No matter what the writers chose, they can’t win.

If they completely let it stay subtext and not confirm it they queerbait.

If they put in a small confirmation only adults will catch aka both of them leaving the tent where one of them sleeps to different times, subtly adjusting their clothes its not open enough and hiding queer representation.

And if they do confirm it and have them kiss on screen or something it is bad queer rep because they are both villains and their relationship is not healthy. Now, I personally don’t think it should be forbidden to show unhealthy queer relationships between bad people, as long as there are healthy, good relationships in the series too and its not portrayed as them being evil because they are queer, and there was indeed a very prominent very abusive queer ship confirmed in another show, though there neither the writers nor most of the fandom acknowledged how abusive it was, while here the writers seem to be aware of it. I just don’t think the purity kiddos will be able to grasp the difference and will whine about queer people being portrayed as evil or something.

I honestly wonder why the writers manovered themselves in such a dangerous sitation. I love Virens and Aaravos sexually charged interactions, but why would they put something like this in there when they can’t win with it?