#sorry for the nessian shippers that follow me

[washmchineheart]

there’s two scenes of acosf I can’t forgive. like when he tells her he fells shackled to her and that everyone hates her? he regret saying almost immediately so I can see why people excuse his behavior given the context of the scenes (I don’t but I can see why people do since nesta is the same way. she says things she doesn’t mean when she is angry so sjm was just trying to parallel them.)

but laughing at her falling downstairs and the hike are just what makes me just…idk. she could’ve died and he was laughing at her. he was amused that she fell bc that meant she failed getting a drink. and no, the hike wasn’t about the fucking healing mountain. he wanted her to breakdown emotionally when she was rightfully angry and punish her. she was fainting and suicidal. I don’t really care about his “there’s nothing wrong to be fixed” speech because yes, you all are acting like she’s broken. actions speak louder than words, sorry buddy

[sad-scarred-sassy]

tamlin “trapped” feyre after all negotiations broke down with the certainty of knowing feyre would endanger herself and others temporarily

from the wu this fandom talks about it you’d think he’s mother gothel but like. it was only until he came back. it wasn’t like he had her isolated, restricting access to who got to see her. he offered to invite her sisters - she was the one who said no! i really don’t see how it’s comparable to feyre + the ic making nesta stay on a remote island for what it’s worth with two near strangers who she has little to no positive associations with if they can’t be considered the cause of all her trauma in the first place (in that they are fae etc)

whereas nesta’s sentence (bc let’s face it she was sent to azkaban as punishment with a fun caveat like “you’re free if you can cross the sea! and manage to maintain a sense of identity while around guards who remind you how terrible you are of course!”) is indefinite and it’s pretty obvious from everything that comes after that it’s just something she’s expected to make the best of as opposed to something that can get better with time.

and cassian being her jailer whose amicability she has to earn by performing rigorous physical activity she had no interest in even if she grew to love it.. i wonder if she’s had that experience before

sorry, i’m not disagreeing with you, i saw your post + i just die a little inside every time someone’s like “ew tampon” “wow i wish i had a cassian” like no. they’re not the same, you (not you, ily) just have the attention span of a gold fish on catnip

You know I restrained myself from posting more on this because I’m such a hater sometimes lol, gotta focus on more positive things sometimes but... I’ll get this out of my chest.

I wanna preface by saying I do not care if people like Cassian/Nessian, truly. I even like fanon Cassian and fanon Nessian. I also have seen very little people that like Cassian bashing Tamlin (probably bc of my filters and just the type of blogs I follow bc I do love them all) BUT☝🏼 what I do see is a lot of “Disclaimer: we know Tamlin is an abuser” on Tamlin neutral posts (when no other character gets that treatment) or using Tamlin as a cautionary tale of how he treated Feyre and then praise the other “mates” for being “the right ones” and treating them correctly or something, which does annoy me a bit, but alas.

In my opinion yes, you are right, what Cassian and the Inner Circle did to Nesta is a million times worse than what Tamlin did to Feyre, but nobody, nobody considers Cassian’s actions in Silver Flames as bad as they actually are. Nobody considers him an abuser like Abusive Tamlin™️. When talking about what Nesta has endured in SF people put all the blame on Rhys and Feyre (which yes of course) but they forget Cassian was also there, willingly.

I’ve seen people use the argument that both Nesta and Cassian treated each other poorly in their relationship, but I have to ask… what did Nesta do to him that’s worse than what he did… intentionally. She was mean to him and called him bastard like four times? And only when he trespassed her boundaries. Somehow this is comparable to him being her jailer, taking her to train in the middle of Illyria, being a dick when he knew she was struggling, telling her everyone hates her and he cannot understand why her sisters love her, controlling her food intake as if she’s a gym bro or something when she clearly had an eating disorder, not telling her that Feyre was not mad at her and letting her BREAK while making her carry a huge backpack and forcing her on a hike not talking to her for days, to the point she fainted and fell on her face near a cliff?? (this because she made Rhys mad). Anyway the list goes on.

And you know what I don’t care if people like this guy after all this, but it is just funny how somehow Neris shippers are the “morally dubious” ones lol (and don’t get me started on Tamlin stans aka the devil worshippers), because Nesta said she “deserved Eris” (as a punishment), babygirl your WHOLE relationship with Cassian has been a punishment, for what sins you ask? Being mean (as she should) and spending the High Lord’s coin.

And what makes it worse is that the narrative will always favor the Inner circle, Cassian will never pay for what he’s done the way Tamlin has (and still is) he will never even apologize because he was “holding out his hand” or whatever bs that was. (Honestly if I get proven wrong and he does pay and apologize then I may give him a chance, but I highly doubt it)

I won’t even pretend that I think Neris will be canon as much as I wish it was, even if I know that if SJM wrote it, it still would have had its problems but at least Nesta wouldn’t have ended up with the people who treated her like a criminal just because she wouldn’t kiss their ass. And on top of all, with a mate that doesn’t even have the balls to stand up for her. Holy shit.

Okay I got it all out of my chest I think, I’ll try not to hate so much but this shit bro makes me seethe. I’ll go touch some grass.

[separatist-apologist]

I have to say, I'm mostly an elriel, but I enjoy elucien too because I'm 100% an Elain stan and I'll take any content about her done by someone who loves her (like you and everyone making content for elucien week). It drives me kinda crazy to see other elriels say that people who ship elucien don't like elain, because I have honestly never ever seen that. (Feel free not to answer if you don't wanna get into a shipwar mess)

It's a bummer because I end up having to decide if I'm going to purge all e/riels following me or risk getting hate. And for a really, really long time if I put anything in the elain archeron tag, I'd get hate, too. I have like, 50 people blocked I've probably never interacted with (to my knowledge) so I can go back in her tag and I think thats absurd.

It's frustrating because before I had a lot of followers, I did have more multi-shippers following me and now that I'm over 1k, if I see e/riels following, I typically just block and assume bad intentions.

And what's WILD is that like, I would LOVE to tag-team against the anti's. Being a bitch online is like one of my top 10 hobbies. I see the most broke, stupid ass shit about Elain and I'm like, we could unite under this banner but too many have made liking Elain into a social justice cause instead of fighting our true enemy which is people who think Tamlin is her mate (SORRY IM SORRY BUT THAT THEORY IS MY VILLAIN ORIGIN STORY). I want what you want- Elain to be the protag and get the dicking down she deserves (and see Graysen die). Like the only thing we disagree on is who is doing the dicking.

I've got Nessians and Neris's in my fucking tags 24/7 but I can't have e/riels? BROKE.

[nikethestatue]

I have always loved theories (movies, books, tv shows—you name it). And I fell in love with many elriel accounts because of their theories and how they made me feel welcomed and appreciated. But lately, I just feel really tired. I kind of want to take a step back and not deal with the labels of the ship war, the “they’re the enemy” type of mentality, and just be simply a *reader* again.

Like, I just saw someone posting about another book series I really like under its tag, and when I visited that person’s page, I realized they were a pretty well-known Gw*nriel shipper who has more often than not been very snide and rude towards Elriels. And it made me really sad because obviously we enjoy a lot of the same books, but because of this stupid, absolutely crazy ship war, I have such a negative view of them and they probably do of me as well.

So then I decided to glance through the Gw*nriel tag just to see if I could feel more neutral about the whole thing, but I was met with fake acotar quotes that made me cringe and posts belittling Elriels. I scrolled for a good 10 min and other than harmless fanfics, everything else was completely unconvincing. The same ribbon/training scene was used exhaustively. You get my point.

So now I’m sitting here debating if I just want to delete this app because at this point I know who I ship and that’s not going to change, and I feel like the only thing I’m enjoying anymore is fanart and I can typically just find that on insta. I do still enjoy a lot of elriel pages (such as yours), but I find a lot of elriel pages also dive into the drama too much for me. Sometimes even purposely mistagging to spark drama, or making pretty snide posts of their own that I just don’t think help the situation. So many Elriels preach of being the bigger person, and while I think that’s mostly true at times, I still find many Elriels just as guilty of shameless behavior online.

I am so sorry I ended up kinda rambling and didn’t even really have a question in there. I think I just wanted to get that off my chest. I think it may be time I give tumblr a break until after the acotar 5 announcement comes out…

I always advise against deleting accounts, unless you leave the fandom entirely. I think some drama comes with the territory.

Also, while it's a bit more difficult, but you can try to separate the fandom allegiance from your interest in other books. So to give you an example--I follow some Nessian blogs, which are EXTREMELY anti IC and anti Elain, but they offer me interesting info, stuff that I want to read, and while i dont necessarily engage, I still enjoy what they put out. And stuff I dont enjoy, I just skip.

I think we are so programmed to be very black and white in our likes and dislikes that we leave no room for gray. I think in every fandom you have a 'hard no', but otherwise, as I always say, enjoy what you enjoy.

But, as I always say in these instances--you look out for Number One, which is you. If something is affecting you very negatively, don't force yourself to follow or engage. Your mental health is the #1 priority. Always.

[louiseleblancdiggory]

what did you think of the whole azriel and rhysand discussion?

as my followers have been reminded repeatedly (i genuinely feel sorry for whoever follows me) i am a hardcore elriel shipper. i’ve been here since 2016 and, if this ship sinks, i’m going down with it

however, i didn’t see that scene as an ending! i mean, imagine how fucking anticlimatic it would be lmao. rhysand tells azriel (who has been described many times throughout the series as the person who sometimes simply goes over rhys’s head) to stay away and he’s like...... sure?????? nope, that’s too boring, too irrelevant. until now, every single book has ended with the story of who’s coming next (acofas ended with a clear nessian plot, and now acosf ended with a clear azriel plot, but sjm also said that acosf is full of clues for the next elain’s book) so i’d think that everything the highlord has done for us was to pave a perfect path for a lot of sweet angst 

also, feyre and nesta would beat his ass if he seriously sank their ship

[g-perla]

From “Nessian Shipper!!” to “Nessian…Shipper??”

This...is going to be a long one so strap in.

Years ago when ACOMAF came out and the kind people of tumblr posted screenshots of the Wings and Embers short, I found myself looking at Nesta and Cassian, considering the idea of them being romantically and physically involved, and found myself with the following thought; that’s my SHIP. These feelings were reinforced throughout the smattering of brief interactions between the two we got in ACOWAR, probably until the very end where it was unclear if Cassian had gone to see Nesta before or after she headed up the stairs seeming distinctly not ok. That wasn’t a very big deal though. For all I know he did, and she pushed him away, or maybe they did have a talk. Feyre’s perspective is very limited after all. This didn’t really stop my Nessian shipper heart at all.

My Nessian shipper heart became compromised in ACOFAS and in the teaser to ACOSF. I still haven’t re-read ACOFAS so I just want to make it clear that I’m still dealing with 2+ years of accumulated messy, largely unexplored feelings about this ship. That being said, I wasn’t very impressed by Cassian’s behaviour towards Nesta. The interactions between them we were shown left me questioning the stability of a ship I had previously loved with reckless abandon. I questioned Cassian, I questioned Nesta, I questioned their independent trajectories, and them as a couple in the context we were given. My conclusion was that I could no longer really ship them as eagerly in good conscience.

A week or so ago I wrote in a post that Cassian seems, to me, ashamed of Nesta. This idea came to me after considering his behaviour mostly in ACOFAS and to a lesser degree in the previous books. A post by @inyourmindeye, where they put forth their arguments about why Cassian isn’t ashamed of Nesta made me reconsider, however. I read their post carefully and took some time to gather my thoughts after taking in this other perspective. I will share them now.

First, I will say that the word “ashamed” perhaps isn’t the most exact word to express how I feel about Cassian’s complex emotions when it comes to Nesta. I think a more apt word would be conflicted. Second, I want to clarify that when I wrote “ashamed” I didn’t mean to imply that he didn’t care about Nesta. Feeling ashamed of something or someone because of the feelings of attraction or care one might have is certainly possible. Additionally, these emotions aren’t necessarily contradictory, nor do they necessarily depend on each other. They do, however, complicate each other and create conflict.

But what exactly is the source of Cassian’s possibly conflicted feelings?

In the most simplistic sense, I suggest the source is Nesta and the Inner Circle. Or rather, Nesta v. the Inner Circle.

Many in the fandom and some of my own posts have discussed the inherent incompatibilities between Nesta and the IC (as depicted in the canon texts we have access to as of 21/10/20). These incompatibilities are largely ideological such as different definitions of “free will” and agency. Nesta simply does not tolerate the messy dynamics of the IC and the tacit acknowledgement that Rhys has the most authority. For Nesta to fit into this world, she would have to abandon the elements of her character that constitute her core self and which make her subversive within the narrative and without: a disdain towards authority, a resolute mind that isn’t easily moved, quick to anger and abrasive and hostile in her expressions of this anger, but capable of making concessions if the situation gnaws at her strict moral code, morally grey, not nurturing, generally unpleasant to those she doesn’t trust, judgemental, unapologetic in her sexuality or in her femininity, lacking in patience when it comes to idiots and sycophants, critical to a fault, not immune to enacting cruelty, etc. See, if this were a man and if this book had been written during the Romantic period and we were reading it now we would just say “well, I’ll be! What a text-book example of a compelling Byronic hero! We love to see it.”

Note how the men (sorry, males) in SJM novels tend to have many of these same characteristics. They are also pretty good examples of Byronic heroes. The main difference is the energy most people bring when they criticise women. One of the characteristics of a Byronic hero is his refusal to be confined. This confinement can be moral, ideological, epistemological, or physical. Basically, people in the world of such a hero (or even in ours) can’t compute when they encounter him and are unable to put him in easy categories. This often manifests as irrational hatred towards this character because it offends our sensibilities about what is known and what is unknown.

It’s attractive to think that we are immune to this as people existing in the 21st century, but we are not. We still rely on the “Other” to define our identity by both creating it and violently rejecting it. I suppose it’s as good a time as any to share the thesis of my overarching analysis project; basically, Nesta is the ultimate representation of the Other. She is Other in her womanhood (or I guess femaleness), she was Other even as a human, now that she is high fae she is Other to humans but tragically she is also Other to the high fae because she was Made. She is Other as a magical being, she is Other to the IC, she was and is Other to her bio family. She is Other to many of us because we simply cannot comprehend her actions in ACOTAR (how could she have been so cruel????). As of now, there is not a single place where Nesta can exist without offending the very core of what a lot of people value.

One framework for the Other was proposed by the French psychoanalyst Jaques Lacan. He basically said that the Other is that which we must reject when we start forming a concept of the Self. The Self is the known therefore safe; the Other is the unknown therefore dangerous and disruptive. The Self creates the symbolic order which is essentially the blueprint of accepted life to which the Other is antithetical. I can go on and on about the intricacies of this, and Lacan himself certainly did, but I’m working on a review of different conceptualisations of the Other so I will stop here. What I want to establish while bringing this up is that Nesta is essentially the Other to the IC’s symbolic order, i.e. fundamentally incompatible and an epistemological threat. This is a very theoretical way to explain the IC’s hostility and dislike towards her, but I find it compelling enough to pursue (and I am a nerd).

We can’t forget that Cassian is a known element of the IC’s symbolic order, thus one of the Selves let’s say. The Self should seek to annihilate the Other (as it usually does)…not love it, desire it, care for it. To do so is to enter a profound state of existential precarity. To pursue his feelings for Nesta, Cassian would have to question the fundamental assumptions that are at the core of his known world. There is nothing simple about such a task and I can’t really blame him for struggling. 

Still, understanding something isn’t necessarily synonymous with liking it. I wish that the distance between these two characters were not so great. I wish both could just sit and talk with the respect I know them to have for one another. The constant insults and underhanded jabs made by both parties are messy and not in a fun way. As the ship stands, I don’t feel comfortable liking it with the same reckless abandon as before. I think their hostility is too raw, even if their actions contradict them most of the time. Is it unreasonable to want them to interact without reservations in situations other than those between life and death? I hope ACOSF can provide the development they both deserve. Maybe then I can stop having one leg in the ship and the other overboard.

[elriell]

Hi! First, I just want to let you know that your page is helping me come to terms (and even slightly enjoy) the Elriel ship since it seems like that is probably going to be what happens haha. Believe me, that is a compliment considering I started reading ACOWAR right when it came out, and had to put it down at the first sign of elriel becoming a ship and refused to pick it up until almost exactly 2 years later out of rage. I was a hardcore Moriel shipper hahahaha.

Then, reading ACOSF I became a Gwynriel shipper. Not hardcore but I still felt so much rage at any mention of Elriel that I was just excited to see someone new I think. I didn’t even know all this Elriel/Gwynriel drama was a thing since I don’t follow any fandom things and haven’t been on tumblr in like 8 years.

Anyway, it wasn’t until after I finished ACOSF that I came across your page. Reading all these theories and your explanations and excitement for Elriel has been really helping me come to terms with it (since let’s be real... Elriel is more than most likely endgame) and has even made me slightly excited for their book! That is a high compliment in my book considering the pure rage I felt 4 years ago. Trust me, hating Elriel has been hard on me since they are the perfect embodiment of my favorite trope, so I’m really hoping their book (or your page) help me feel more than resignation!

Second, since SJM mentioned that she already has the genders of the couples kids picked out, what do you hope Nessian’s and Elriel’s first kids will be?

I hope my rant doesn’t upset you, I just wanted to go into detail as to why it’s such a big deal that I’m coming around (slowly) to the elriel ship.

Hey there! ♡

Oh wow I am flattered beyond, that you can even give them a chance is great and potentially even enjoy them... No one wants to have to quit a series because of a couple they don’t like/agree with (trust me i’ve been thereeee). So I am happy maybe this is an easier path, or idk happier one overall? That is so interesting to hear though!!

So you loved Moriel? At what point did you stop or do you still? I am not going to lie they did seem like the obvious way to go back in ACOMAF with their lines of loving her til death LOL SJM really threw us for a curveball. 

Yeah unfortunately there is a bunch of drama, I hope one day it settle a bit and everyone can learn to appreciate and love each others differences... Interesting that you were able to ship Gwynriel but not Elriel, do you think it just brought back all those unpleasant memories? Sorry, I feel like I am asking so many questions ahhahah

I do find this to be a compliment, I really do, I obviously and clearly love them greatly and am so excited to read their book. I hope for everyones sakes they are happy with the next books, no matter the characters! Ohhhh really? Which Trope is it because they have a few key ones!

There are some amazing Elriel shippers on this site that I am sure could amaze you with their theories and ideas if you are open to it!! 

I have a question just because I am curious in your tastes, what other book ships are you a fan of? 

No this doesn’t upset me at all, thank you for taking the time to share it with me... Listen I am not some eviiiiil shipper who hates everyone who doesn’t agree with me lol everyone is free to love and even hate as they please, it actually interests me to hear what people dislike when it is someone respectful like yourself. xxx