#sig p320 m17 review
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Sig P320 M17 Review by Craft Holsters
Overview of the SIG P320 M17
The SIG Sauer P320 M17 is a highly reliable, semi-automatic, striker-fired pistol designed for military use. Known for its performance, the M17 boasts a full-size frame with a coyote-tan PVD-coated stainless steel slide and a modular polymer frame that ensures durability and resistance to corrosion. It features a 4.7-inch barrel, an overall length of 8 inches, and a 17+1 round magazine capacity chambered in 9mm. The ergonomic design, including interchangeable grip modules and ambidextrous controls, enhances user comfort and handling. Priced between $700 and $800, the SIG M17 offers military-grade reliability, making it a top choice for military personnel, law enforcement, and civilians.
Performance and Features
The SIG P320 M17 excels in accuracy and effective recoil management due to its balanced design and high-quality barrel. It performs consistently under extreme conditions, including heat, cold, rain, and dust. The pistol's safety features, such as the manual thumb safety, striker safety, and disconnect safety, ensure secure handling. Additionally, its M1913 accessory rail supports various tactical lights or lasers, making it versatile for different applications. To learn more about the Sig P320 M17 Review, check out Craft Holsters' Sig P320 M17 Review blog.
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Sig P320 - M17 Review on TFB TV
Recently I posted a full video review of the Sig P320 - M17 Pistol on TFB TV. *Sorry for the delay in videos - life happened*
While I’ve used Glock Pistols for a number of years, I had the opportunity to go out to the Sig Sauer Academy to put in some time with the New Sig P320 – M17 Pistol. Overall it was a great experience and ultimately my first experience with the P320 Platform.
I’ve posted a full video review of the Sig P320 – M17 over on TFB TV (The…
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Army’s New Pistols A Flop?
Looks like they might have jumped on that decision too soon?
The Drive Writes
he U.S. Army’s decision to select two versions of Sig Sauer’s 9mm P320 pistol as the new standard sidearms across the service was not without controversy, including a formal protest by competing gun maker Glock, which claimed the service didn’t complete certain critical tests. The Pentagon recently released a report that shows testing of the M17 and M18 handguns exposed a number of significant and persistent deficiencies, including firing accidentally if a shooter dropped the gun, ejecting live ammunition, and low reliability with traditional “ball” cartridges with bullets enclosed inside a full metal jacket.
These and other details were in the Pentagon’s Office of the Director of Operational Test and Evaluation review of such work during the 2017 fiscal year, which it published earlier in January 2018. This regular report covers a wide variety of high profile weapon systems and other important equipment across the U.S. military, including the Army’s Modular Handgun System (MHS) program. In January 2017, the Army chose Sig Sauer to supply a total more than 300,000 of the full size M17 and compact M18 pistols as part of that project, a deal worth approximately $580 million. The other U.S. military services are now considering following suit and adopting the guns and the company is making essentially the same gun available to civilian shooters as well.
According to the Director of Operational Test and Evaluation, the guns experienced a number of issues in testing between April and September 2017, which is the end of the period the report covers. The first of these was a publicly known issue that the pistol could go off if the user dropped the weapon. Needless to say, an accidental discharge could be dangerous to the shooter or those around them.
The Army discovered this issue during the initial “Product Verification Test,” but it is unclear when specifically the service became aware of the problem. Sig Sauer did subsequently make unspecified changes to fix this issue in the M17 and M18 pistols.
US ARMY
Members of the US Army’s 3rd Cavalry Regiment train with their M17s in January 2018.
It’s worth noting that in August 2017, Sig Sauer issued a voluntary recall for other P320 pistols due to the same issue, but implied in their press release that shooters had dropped the weapons in an excessive manner “beyond U.S. standards for safety.” That statement also stressed that Army’s new guns wouldn’t need the replacement parts, but declined to mention that this was because they already had them, leaving open the interpretation that they never needed the update in the first place.
More worryingly, the Pentagon’s top testing office said that during further tests, the trigger assemblies in two pistols had splintered apart and this was potentially the result of the drop fix, presenting an entirely new issue. As of September 2017, the recommendation was to “work with the vendor to identify and eliminate cause of variability in the manufacture of the trigger group mechanism.”
Testing also revealed that the handguns had a propensity to eject a live round along with the empty cartridge case during normal functioning. There was no indication that this issue caused any malfunctions, such as “stove-piping,” which generally involves empty casing ending up jammed in place, typically sticking up from the ejection port.
The video below shows a stove pipe malfunction in a Glock handgun and a process for clearing the jam.
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It is still a significant issue for shooters to be losing live cartridges during routine use, meaning they might run out of ammunition before they expect to or simply waste resources. The Office of the Director of Operational Test and Evaluation’s said that the problem became more pronounced the more rounds evaluators fired through their M17 and M18 pistols. As of September 2017, the Army was still working with Sig Sauer to identify the root cause of the problem, after which they would need to develop another fix.
This wasn’t the only ammunition related issue, though. In tests, the M17 and M18 worked just fine with the Army’s new XM1153 “special purpose” cartridge, a hollow point round. They did not function reliably with the companion XM1152, a standard “ball” round with a bullet fully enclosed within a copper jacket.
US ARMY
M17 magazines loaded with XM1153 hollow points during a test.
The Army had a requirement for the new pistols to be able to shoot 2,000 rounds straight without a stoppage at least 95 percent of the time on average. The service defined a stoppage as any instance in which the guns stopped functioning normally, but where the user could get the weapon running again without the need for tools or replacement parts.
With the XM1153 hollow point, the M17 hit the 95 percent reliability mark, while the M18 managed just slightly better at 96 percent. But when troops loaded up magazines with the XM1152, the results were dismal. The full-size gun had only a 75 percent probability of functioning properly, while the compact version was barely over 60 percent.
The report does not say why this might have occurred and it’s not clear what the Army was doing to correct the issue. The problems had appeared during the Product Verification Tests and the service simply opted to conduct operational testing and evaluation with the special purpose cartridge only. This in turn suggests that troops getting the pistols will receive the hollow points as their standard round, a significant change from previous doctrine.
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Only having one ammunition type available – not counting blank and dummy rounds for training purposes – could limit the utility of the new pistols. Traditionally, hollow points begin to expand after hitting their targets, generally creating more serious wounds, but also reducing their ability to penetrate through cover, such as car windshields and doors. Modern bullet design has greatly enhanced the hollow point’s versatility and lethality, making it less limited and far more deadly than it once was, though, and pistol rounds generally are not suitable for piercing body armor or barriers to begin with.
There is a possible international law issue, as well. The Hague Convention of 1899, an agreement that the United States abides by, bans any bullet that has features that cause it to deliberately expand from combat use. The U.S. military has previously said that types with an open tip to improve accuracy aren’t subject to the restrictions because expansion is not the primary purpose of the design, but it has generally limited the issue of actual hollow points to its internal law enforcement arms.
It has also made the argument that those rounds are legal for combat use when there is a “clear military necessity.” Some special operations forces already issue hollow point pistol rounds for specific combat missions with this justification in mind.
The Army began…
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This is more or less the assortment of guns I’m looking for to replace my SIG P220 as a pistol dedicate to IDPA (for the moment, I’m using my P225 but I’d want something a little bit different for once)
- I’d like to find a P320 compact, and replace the frame by an OD green subcompact one. That way I’d got the round triggerguard, a short but not too short handle and a good trigger, while still getting a barrel of an acceptable lenght. Problems are that the extra shells are hard to find in Switzerland (and their legal status is a bit dubious), the P320 price has skyrocketed since the announce of its adoption as the new M17 (no way I’m paying about 900.- for that), and last but not least, I’ve only tried the standard one but find the handle a bit weird.
- I really love the P238. It’s old school, it’s probably the smallest gun I can shoot great, it’s available in Switzerland, it’s light and smaller than my Beretta 71, and while I understand there is quite a gap between .380 ACP and 10mm Auto, I can live with the performances of that cartridge (I like its controllability). I’ve got three problems with the P238 - the price of the ammunition, the fact it’s not available in a lavishly adorned variant and its price (we’re talking here twice the price of a Glock 42, which is borderline ordnance P210 prices). Additional, I don’t like much the tortured design they gave the slide. It’s maybe reminiscent of the old P22x pistol series, but they are not exactly the more subtle or pretty gun on the planet. A simple “monolith” slide à la Les Baer or Coonan would have been nicer.
- the Glock 26. I like Glock pistols. They are ugly, but are great service weapons even with their disastrous grip. The 26 is probably one of the most effective of the collection - it’s quite comfortable to shoot, ridiculously accurate, durable and reliable. It’s also the cheapest option of the three, especially on the second-hand market (”almost new, shot fifty rounds”). What I don’t like about it is the grip, of course. I really hate the finger grooves, and I can’t wait to see if the smooth grip of the FBI contract 17/1.9M will translate into a Gen5 pistol series (before 2025, I mean). And of course, it’s an Austrian gun.
www.luckygunner.com/lounge/sig-sauer-p320-compact-and-subcompact-9mm-review/
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TFBTV: The New Sig P320 M17 Edition Review
««« FOLLOW US ON SOCIAL MEDIA »»» https://ift.tt/2Ny4xaJ https://ift.tt/2wqXNET In August 2018 Ivan, from Kit Badger, headed out to a press event with Sig Sauer. There he was able to put in some time with Sig’s new P320-M17. The pistol that bridges the gap between Sig’s P320 and the newly awarded winner of the MHS […]
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TFBTV: The New Sig P320 M17 Edition Review
««« FOLLOW US ON SOCIAL MEDIA »»» https://ift.tt/2Ny4xaJ https://ift.tt/2wqXNET In August 2018 Ivan, from Kit Badger, headed out to a press event with Sig Sauer. There he was able to put in some time with Sig’s new P320-M17. The pistol that bridges the gap between Sig’s P320 and the newly awarded winner of the MHS […]
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The post TFBTV: The New Sig P320 M17 Edition Review appeared first on The Firearm Blog.
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TFBTV: The New Sig P320 M17 Edition Review
««« FOLLOW US ON SOCIAL MEDIA »»» https://ift.tt/2Ny4xaJ https://ift.tt/2wqXNET In August 2018 Ivan, from Kit Badger, headed out to a press event with Sig Sauer. There he was able to put in some time with Sig’s new P320-M17. The pistol that bridges the gap between Sig’s P320 and the newly awarded winner of the MHS […]
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The post TFBTV: The New Sig P320 M17 Edition Review appeared first on The Firearm Blog.
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M18 pistols successfully completed acceptance test for U.S. Army
US firearms specialist SIG Sauer Inc has announced that he M18 pistols, the compact variant of the U.S. Army’s Modular Handgun System (MHS), has successfully completed a recent Lot Acceptance Test (LAT) with zero stoppages during the required MHS Material Reliability Testing.
According to a company’s statement, historically, Lot Acceptance Testing would include testing handguns to 5,000 rounds and allow for up to 12 stoppages to pass.
The recent MHS Material Reliability Test consisted of firing three M18 pistols to an unprecedented 12,000 rounds each, and in an extraordinary display of reliability, the M18 performed with zero stoppages. Additionally, despite undergoing this level of strenuous testing the M18 passed a parts interchange test, met all of the stringent accuracy and dispersion requirements, was tested for firing pin indent and trigger pull measurements to ensure consistency, and conformed to all workmanship standards.
The success of the MHS program, and the performance of both the M17 and M18 pistols, was further confirmed in the recently published Director of Operation Testing and Evaluation (DOT&E) Annual Report, which provides an independent review and analysis of the U.S. Department of Defense weapons systems.
The report states that, “the MHS meets or exceeds requirements for accuracy, lethality, ergonomics, and safety,” in addition to stating that, “both the XM17 and the XM18 are operationally effective and suitable.”
Ron Cohen, President & CEO of SIG SAUER, Inc., began, “the results of this testing for the M18 pistol is truly impressive. The M18 withstood the harsh testing and performance requirements set forth in the MHS contract and has set a new standard for reliability in service pistols.”
The M18 is a 9mm, striker-fired pistol featuring a coyote-tan PVD coated stainless steel slide with black controls. The pistol is equipped with SIGLITE front night sights and removable night sight rear plate, and manual safety.
After one of the most rigorous and highly competitive selection processes in the history of military firearms, SIG SAUER was awarded the Modular Handgun System (MHS) contract for the full-size M17 and the compact M18 with the P320-based pistol platform. Both the M17 and M18 pistols are being adopted by the Army, Air Force, Navy, Marine Corps, and Coast Guard. The MHS contract was awarded to SIG SAUER in January 2017 for delivery of 480,000 pistols over a period of ten years; to date SIG SAUER has delivered over 20,000 pistols.
“For this testing the U.S. Army set very high standards for quality and performance, and at SIG we relish the opportunity to meet a challenge and exceed expectations. The performance of the M18 not only surpassed the U.S. Army’s testing requirements, its performance was simply outstanding and nothing short of perfection,” concluded Cohen.
from Defence Blog
US firearms specialist SIG Sauer Inc has announced that he M18 pistols, the compact variant of the U.S. Army’s Modular Handgun System (MHS), has successfully completed a recent Lot Acceptance Test (LAT) with zero stoppages during the required MHS Material Reliability Testing.
According to a company’s statement, historically, Lot Acceptance Testing would include testing handguns to 5,000 rounds and allow for up to 12 stoppages to pass.
The recent MHS Material Reliability Test consisted of firing three M18 pistols to an unprecedented 12,000 rounds each, and in an extraordinary display of reliability, the M18 performed with zero stoppages. Additionally, despite undergoing this level of strenuous testing the M18 passed a parts interchange test, met all of the stringent accuracy and dispersion requirements, was tested for firing pin indent and trigger pull measurements to ensure consistency, and conformed to all workmanship standards.
The success of the MHS program, and the performance of both the M17 and M18 pistols, was further confirmed in the recently published Director of Operation Testing and Evaluation (DOT&E) Annual Report, which provides an independent review and analysis of the U.S. Department of Defense weapons systems.
The report states that, “the MHS meets or exceeds requirements for accuracy, lethality, ergonomics, and safety,” in addition to stating that, “both the XM17 and the XM18 are operationally effective and suitable.”
Ron Cohen, President & CEO of SIG SAUER, Inc., began, “the results of this testing for the M18 pistol is truly impressive. The M18 withstood the harsh testing and performance requirements set forth in the MHS contract and has set a new standard for reliability in service pistols.”
The M18 is a 9mm, striker-fired pistol featuring a coyote-tan PVD coated stainless steel slide with black controls. The pistol is equipped with SIGLITE front night sights and removable night sight rear plate, and manual safety.
After one of the most rigorous and highly competitive selection processes in the history of military firearms, SIG SAUER was awarded the Modular Handgun System (MHS) contract for the full-size M17 and the compact M18 with the P320-based pistol platform. Both the M17 and M18 pistols are being adopted by the Army, Air Force, Navy, Marine Corps, and Coast Guard. The MHS contract was awarded to SIG SAUER in January 2017 for delivery of 480,000 pistols over a period of ten years; to date SIG SAUER has delivered over 20,000 pistols.
“For this testing the U.S. Army set very high standards for quality and performance, and at SIG we relish the opportunity to meet a challenge and exceed expectations. The performance of the M18 not only surpassed the U.S. Army’s testing requirements, its performance was simply outstanding and nothing short of perfection,” concluded Cohen.
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🔫 NRA - AMERICAN RIFLEMAN, INSIDER NEWSLETTER
🔫 NRA – AMERICAN RIFLEMAN, INSIDER NEWSLETTER
SIG Sauer Announces Commercial P-320 M17 Pistol SIG Sauer has introduced the commercial variant of the U.S. Army’s M17 official service pistol, the P320-M17. The P320-M17 will land on dealers’ shelves in August 2018. After one of the most rigorous and highly competitive review processes in the history of military firearms the SIG Sauer’s M17… Read More he Keefe Report: FN 509 Goes TacticalFN…
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US Army issued M17. Sig Sauer sidearm full review here just dropped. @dirtybirdtactical @frogbonesfsc @vikingtactics @sigsauerinc #guns #m17 #sig #army #usarmy #sidearm #freedom #rangeday #9mm #p320 #modular #polymer #madeinusa #dirtybirdtactical
#polymer#madeinusa#modular#sidearm#m17#9mm#freedom#guns#dirtybirdtactical#usarmy#rangeday#p320#army#sig
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New Post on Gunner's Alley Blog
New Post has been published on http://blog.gunnersalley.com/tough-weeks-sig-sauer/
A Tough Few Weeks for Sig Sauer
If you are a regular reader of the Gunner’s Alley blog or newsletter, then you know most of the staff here at GA are big Sig Sauer fans. I carried a Sig (P226 and P228) through most of my law enforcement career, and we all own a number of Sig models personally. So we were very surprised at the reasons that Sig Sauer has been in the news over the last 2 weeks.
If you missed these recent developments, here’s a quick recap:
#1 – Steyr Arms Files Patent Infringement Case Against Sig Sauer over the P320 Modular Trigger Housing
http://taskandpurpose.com/sig-sauer-p320-steyr-arms/ – On Friday, 5/5/17, Steyr Arms files a patent infringement case against Sig Sauer alleging that the P250 and the P320 models use the “plastic housing and multifunction metal part removeably mounted” which Steyr patented back in 2001. The patent infringement suit goes on to say that the modular polymer framed chassis used in both Sig models is in violation of a Steyr patent called “Pistol, Whose Housing is Composed of Plastic”, which was filed in August of 1999 and successfully patented in July of 2001. The patent was originally designed to protect the components of the Steyr M series of pistols. Interestingly enough, Steyr is also going after other manufacturers who use similar modular trigger housing as they had previously filed a patent infringement case against Beretta in 2015 for the serialized chassis platform found on the Beretta Pico, and are believed to be amending that filing to include the new Beretta APX model in the near future as it also uses a similar modular trigger chassis like the Pico series.
Commentary – As the P250 has been on the market since 2007 and the P320 since 2014, the question to be asked is why would Steyr wait until now to file this case? As mentioned in the attributed article (and I’m inclined to strongly agree as well), the filing is most likely tied to the $580M US Army handgun contract that was recently awarded to Sig for the P320/M17. Along those same lines, Glock has pending protest against the P320/M17 award that was filed with the US government, which has yet to be decided. Keep in mind that not only does having military adoption equal substantial revenue directly from the contract itself, but it also creates a huge trickle down effect that means higher visibility and sales within the civilian handgun market. Don’t believe that? Just ask Beretta how they fared after winning the military contract in 1984. Civilian sales of the model 92 shot through the roof over the next 5-8 years. I’m guessing that Steyr is hoping to get a piece of that pie as well in the form of a licensing agreement for each and every P320/P250 that has been and will be sold. Sig has yet to release any responses to this on-going case.
How does this affect the pending military contract for the P320/M17? Hard to say at this point but it’s going to be interesting.
#2 – New Jersey State Troopers Sue Sig Sauer
https://www.thetrace.org/2017/05/gunmaker-sig-sauer-sold-defective-guns-police/ – On 5/17, The Trace reported that Sig Sauer was being sued by the State of New Jersey (specifically the New Jersey State Troopers) for a breach of contract in the amount of 2.5 million dollars. The suit alleges that in 2014, the NJ Troopers awarded Sig the sidearm contract to supply the State Troopers with more than 3,000 P229 pistols in 9mm. The suit also indicates that right after the pistols were deployed, Troopers began experiencing situations where the pistols “sporadically exhibited a failure to extract,” or an FTE in layman’s terms which potentially puts the Troopers in danger as “An FTE malfunction renders a gun unfit for police use because a Trooper may be unable to fire more than one round of ammunition in a life-threatening situation”. Subsequent follow-up revealed that the Troopers had been provided a test and evaluation Sig P229 model called the P229 Legacy, but were actually sent 3,000 models of the Sig P229 Enhanced Elite, which is very similar to the Legacy model, but allegedly uses a different extractor system. Sig replaced the Enhanced Elite units with Legacy units in October of 2015, but the FTE issues persisted. In early 2016, the NJ State Troopers recalled all the Sig P229 models deployed and replaced them with Glock 19 Gen 4 models.
On 5/21/17, Sig released the following statement to The Outdoor Wire about the pending lawsuit:
“May 21, 2017 – Sig Sauer, Inc. is aware of the lawsuit recently filed by the State of New Jersey regarding its purchase of the Sig Sauer P229 model handgun by the New Jersey State Police (NJSP).
The NJSP selected the Sig Sauer P229 handgun as its new duty weapon after conducting an in-depth review and exhaustive testing of available handguns. Sig Sauer developed a version of the P229 specific to the requirements of the NJSP, and delivered to the NJSP as scheduled in the summer of 2014.
Following delivery, the NJSP informed Sig Sauer that it was experiencing failures during qualification training with their training ammunition. Sig Sauer immediately began working with the NJSP to determine the cause of this failure and resolve the issue.
Sig Sauer’s investigation of the failure mode indicates a contributing factor may be a compatibility issue between this unique NJSP P229 and the specific training ammunition used by the NJSP. Importantly, these failures were limited to the training ammunition used by the NJSP, and the P229s functioned when using their duty ammunition.
Sig Sauer had been diligently working with New Jersey officials to resolve the issues associated with the P229 handguns it purchased. In light of these discussions, Sig Sauer was surprised that New Jersey filed a lawsuit. Sig Sauer is committed to customer satisfaction, and stands ready to continue these discussions and work with NJSP to reach an equitable solution.”
Commentary – It’s unclear as to how this will play out as the NJ Troopers have already transitioned to Glocks so that part of the contract is a done deal. That being said, my experience with Sig Sauer has been very good, even with Sig models that were released with issues (think Sig P290 first generation). The fact that Sig released a statement specifically addressing this lawsuit says that they value their reputation and will most likely try to rectify this situation before it ever gets to court.
We love to hear your thoughts, opinions, or comments on either of these situations so feel free to leave a comment below.
http://blog.gunnersalley.com/tough-weeks-sig-sauer/
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Congrats to SIG-Sauer for having won the new US Army M17 pistol competition
h/t @doccarlson and @cdn-apex-predator
http://www.army-technology.com/features/featurelock-and-load-a-new-handgun-for-the-us-army-4809459/featurelock-and-load-a-new-handgun-for-the-us-army-4809459-7.html
http://forums.brianenos.com/index.php?/topic/192490-sig-p320/
https://twitter.com/weaponsworld/status/594199765761556480
https://www.eaglegunrangetx.com/shooting-review-sig-sauer-p320-carry/
http://soldiersystems.net/2014/10/21/sig-sauer-gives-us-look-modular-handgun-system-candidate/
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[SHOT 2018] SIG Offering the M17 for Civilian Purchase in 2018
BASED ON THE P320®, THE M17 IS THE U.S. ARMY’S CHOICE FOR TODAY AND TOMORROW. After one of the most rigorous and highly competitive reviews in the history of military firearms, SIGSAUER Inc. was awarded the Modular Handgun System contract with a P320-based platform, the new U.S. Army M17. This award makes it the U.S. Army’s first replacement sidearm in over […]
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[SHOT 2018] SIG Offering the M17 for Civilian Purchase in 2018
BASED ON THE P320®, THE M17 IS THE U.S. ARMY’S CHOICE FOR TODAY AND TOMORROW. After one of the most rigorous and highly competitive reviews in the history of military firearms, SIGSAUER Inc. was awarded the Modular Handgun System contract with a P320-based platform, the new U.S. Army M17. This award makes it the U.S. Army’s first replacement sidearm in over […]
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The post [SHOT 2018] SIG Offering the M17 for Civilian Purchase in 2018 appeared first on The Firearm Blog.
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[SHOT 2018] SIG Offering the M17 for Civilian Purchase in 2018
BASED ON THE P320®, THE M17 IS THE U.S. ARMY’S CHOICE FOR TODAY AND TOMORROW. After one of the most rigorous and highly competitive reviews in the history of military firearms, SIGSAUER Inc. was awarded the Modular Handgun System contract with a P320-based platform, the new U.S. Army M17. This award makes it the U.S. Army’s first replacement sidearm in over […]
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[SHOT 2018] SIG Offering the M17 for Civilian Purchase in 2018
BASED ON THE P320®, THE M17 IS THE U.S. ARMY’S CHOICE FOR TODAY AND TOMORROW. After one of the most rigorous and highly competitive reviews in the history of military firearms, SIGSAUER Inc. was awarded the Modular Handgun System contract with a P320-based platform, the new U.S. Army M17. This award makes it the U.S. Army’s first replacement sidearm in over […]
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