#phantomarine theory

[shadedsecrets]

The Color Language of Phantomarine

At just a cursory glance at this webcomic, it is very obvious that there are strong colors and that they will be tied to themes of the story. And the impulse to discuss and dissect them is.... far too great.

So! Let's start with something general, yes?

Saturation

There are two types of color schemes in the webcomic so far. Schemes with brighter colors and additional accents, and more muted colors with much more limited value differences. Practically speaking, more saturated colors and visual interest helps to draw the eye to what is important; like black thick lines around animated characters to distinguish them from the background. But.... we have a group of characters who has changed from a background scheme to a main character scheme. Such as....

...Our Favorite Princess.

Three different color schemes for three different Phaedras. The first muted yellows and browns, almost boring against the intense lighting of the Candlelight Sea and its foreshadowing hues. The second an intense yellow and terracotta red that hold up against the maroons and deep reds of the Red Tide. The third, blues and white like the very sea she was looking down at but saturated and darkened with indigo and purple unlike any of the other sea ghosts we have seen before.

The transition from background color scheme to VIP color scheme coincide with the very critical moment of the Princess meeting Cheth, demonstrating that her death is a critical moment plot-wise. Her transition to a completely different but still VIP scheme is when she realizes exactly what has happened... and we see that it changes her outlook down to its core, all the warm colors replaced with cool tones.

So, a characters' color scheme tells us both how important they are and can clue us in to their mental states and affiliations. Nothing new. Let's see those groups!

Cheth

As the Red Tide King, it isn't surprising that his color scheme is dominated by a bright red, mixing into warmer purples with highly contrasting white and black. This color scheme overtakes the muted blues of the sea ghost, as well as marking them with his tattoos. White is the secondary color closely associated with Cheth in-story, representing bones featured both in skeletons and his original divine body the Bonefish. This sort of color pallet usually infers more sinister intentions, with red commonly being associated with aggression, but I believe in this case it implies passion. Not necessarily romantic passion, mind, but a deep level of involvement and care.

The Plume Church

Black and bright turquoise and blue with touches of white and green, Cheline and the institution worshiping her are perfect foils to Cheth in color scheme; the cool colors of the Goddess of Life oppose the warm tones of the God of Death while still being unique against The Candlelight Sea. I imagine the black represents the ashes left in the wake of her fire and the greens and blue new life growing from it, though the predominantly black robes are not the usual choice for a Life Diety. The very liberal use of black also paints a more sinister color scheme, with it's traditional use to imply 'evil' in villains. As of writing this, I do actually think that is the intention.

The Mantaluna Crew

Being Seaghosts, the group's scheme is focused around a cool blue, but with more saturation and variation than other seaghosts to represent how they still have some life in them yet. Their cooler colors also allows them to contrast starkly with Cheth, but the purple gives it just a bit more warmth than the Plume Church, showing that while the crew may follow their Church's teachings.... they are fundamentally different on some level than those who have tied themselves closer to the Church.

Pavel, Vanna, and the Lodestars

Characterized by yellow with accents of white, red, and black, the Lodestars stand out. Being the third primary color, they easily stand apart from both Cheth and The Plume Church, showing they are not tied to either. Yellow appears to be the 'neutral' side in this diefic-level conflict, with Best Boy Pavel trying to be a mediator and Phaedra from Chapter 1 treating Cheth with more empathy than in the current chapters when her color scheme was strikingly similar. They do not have a side: they simply want what they think is best and try to stand as a beacon against the dark.

The Fata Morgana

Monochromatic with only lighting and their pale pink eyes for color, these enigmas stand apart as blank voids against the rich vibrancy of the rest of the Candlelight sea. The dominant white with bone-like designs implies a closer relation with Cheth than Cheline, though the exact nature is still up for debate.

Seaghosts

Another monochromatic and muted color scheme, the seaghosts of the Candlelight sea are a pale blue with some white to outline and to fill the eyes. A traditional scheme for spirits, hostile or otherwise, and it blends nicely with their home in the ocean, truly making them feel a part of it. Their cooler color scheme also allows the Red Tide to stand out beside them.

I have a few special mentions that are not fully flung schemes of their own, yet, but that I feel need mentioning.

Silas, though we have yet to see him in different lighting, has the Plume Church's signature blues and greens catching in his hair, with the rest of his pallet being a background tone with little detail. Almost like a certain bird's words have wormed right into the head of 'some nobody' and he all too eagerly listens for the boons she promises.

Daphnie and Euphamina also share a muted color scheme, tending towards the golds with purple to show their high status. Though this is their funeral dress, Daphnie having the black on top covering her own warm and regal colors while her mother instead covers the black with yellow and dons spectacles of a familiar red seem to hint at how the Plume Church interacts with them. Daphine is being covered and almost smothered, though her pure intentions still peek through; Euphamina cannot get away from the influences, but has found ways to assert her will.

Speaking of the funeral, we have a mystery bean with their very own VIP color scheme with cool, deep blues that we have yet to see used elsewhere.

Finally, we have Amos Ellery. We also do not know much of his color scheme sans funeral, but I believe his color scheme hits at his own motivations, similar to Silas. Whereas Silas's colors were seemingly very average for persons in Saperport, save the little highlighting of his hair, Amos is all black, white, and grey. His course is chosen not because of promises, nor because he agrees with the Church... they are driven by the Church being the only thing 'correct' to follow.

I hope you have enjoyed my ramblings, the pretty colors, and any snippets of a story you saw. Do please go read and give the author all the support!

[phoenix-is-the-hottest-thing]

Oh wow we can see this page in a new light now

Cheth's siblings had their divine essence broken, but his is fine, so he's "disassembled" or "broken", but not dead

Phaedra unknowingly bringing up humans(?) murdering gods, not knowing that has been done before

No fucking wonder Cheth was so confused about the niece thing.

Then there's Pavel. Cheline and Cheth both "recognized" Pavel. Could this name be one of their siblings? It's three characters long, like Cheth and Cheline.

Someone dear that Cheline lost should be one of her siblings? (Unless she was lying through her teeth...) She could have been thinking of Cheth because of Pavel's clothes, though. Seems like she internally frames the Fracture as having been done "for his own good". Dear wouldn't be so strange if she doesn't actually hate him, just thinks he's been "corrupted" so he had to go for his own safety... oh this can have queer parallels alright.

Actually I WAS wondering how much Cheline hated Cheth or not for ages. Because she acted so tame when they bumped into each other? He glared and she just ran away, letting Pavel escape. Sure, when he asked her a question she just ignored him, but he called Phaedra's death a 'gift'.

I was wondering why he'd even accept gifts from his sister. Makes a whole lot more sense if she doesn't actually hate his bone ass.

[greenbloodedskink]

Very serious teethories about @phantomarine and Cheline. I'm kidding, throw me in the oubliette for this.

[silvereyedowl]

It would be really funny if the next chapter of Phantomarine abruptly resurrected the ghost protagonists and they were suddenly alive for the rest of the story.

I don't actually think it's going to be that simple, but I had this thought and I had to share it.

[phoenix-is-the-hottest-thing]

@greenbloodedskink YOU DONT GET TO HIDE THAT ONE IN THE TAGS

Has this been done before

[whimsilica]

Assorted Phantomarine theories and thoughts

I wonder if the reason Cheth doesn't have Shoshana's soul to summon as sea ghost is that, either due to her "half breed" status, as Cheline so kindly put it, or to her having been "loved into immortality", is that her soul went wherever the souls of the dead gods are (If the dead gods have souls at all, that is)

Cheth and Cheline handshakememe.jpg: Hating Shoshana

...If we can trust Cheline's word, I wonder if two of the reasons she hates Shoshana so much are that

1) Shoshana helped with the deicide, also against whoever her divine parent actually was

2) She got to be remembered, whereas the other deities have been wiped from memory save in phrases such as "gods above and below", although their names aren't in use anymore

.....How much of the villainization of Cheth is Cheline comitting crimes in his name, and how much is human revisionism (Cheline would never betray them, after all)

...............Phantomarine is the bones of one of the dead gods, isn't it

...How the FUCK are the clergy rationalizing that the AQUIfers (with water being Cheth's domain) help with seabite. How. (Also how the fuck are the seabitten supposed to trust the aquifers if they're supposed to fear water.) (....Graduation requirement: be so afraid of water you won't even touch the aquifers)

(Wonder if that's how at least some Lodestars got the idea)

There's more thoughts about how Vanna is currently apparently alive and the Fata Morgana are corpses puppeteered by Cheline and likely killed by her and the reason they're silent is because she fucking hates talking to humans and they're her way of relieving stress, but I can't formulate them out of the pudding that is my brain rn

[comicteaparty]

June 24th-June 30th, 2020 Reader Favorites Archive

The archive for the Reader Favorites chat that occurred from June 24th, 2020 to June 20th, 2020.  The chat focused on the following question:

Which comic do you think has the best written world lore?

Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~

I don't know if there is a "best" for me, but I have a list of favorites in regards to worldbuilding and lore! Heart of Keol by @keii'ii (Heart of Keol): https://www.heartofkeol.com/ Memorabilia by Escente: https://quietdistance.net/memorabilia/ Stray Souls by Maf: https://www.webtoons.com/en/fantasy/stray-souls/list?title_no=2018 The Fever King by Victoria Lee and SaraDeek (based on the novel by Victoria Lee): https://www.webtoons.com/en/super-hero/the-fever-king/list?title_no=1659 KEYSPACE: A Winged Tale by @eliushi [Keyspace]: https://www.webtoons.com/en/challenge/keyspace-a-winged-tale/list?title_no=322364 And Grand Spirit by motolokiev (on hiatus indefinitely ): https://www.webtoons.com/en/challenge/grand-spirit/list?title_no=6608 That's a lotta comics

boogeymadam

Your Worst Nightmare has some very creative and beautiful worldbuilding, involving a city built on and inside a giant wooden dragon, that is alive but asleep, and there are spooky shadow people made from other people's nightmares running around, as well as dryads connected to the dragon, gargoyles, harpies-- it's great! (it's on hiatus but not abandoned) https://tapas.io/series/Your-Worst-Nightmare Heirs of the Veil is urban fantasy and has a lot of magical beings and creatures present in a really interesting town called Port Arbores. There are living dolls with ice powers, skull-wearing wind spirits, stuff about witches and how they run their covens (like one of the protagonists' Vicky's family!) It's great about letting information on each magical entity present unfurl slowly which gets readers really curious about them. http://heirsoftheveil.com/ Daughter of the Lilies has a ton of high fantasy lore, going so far as to create whole magic structures, rework classic fantasy races like orcs and elves, and even creating whole new ones. There's also a whole section of the comic about how different cultures perceive and portray each other (poorly) in novels, which personally affects the protagonists. https://www.daughterofthelilies.com/

Joichi [Hybrid Dolls]

There are some great world building in the comics, I'm inspired by! I love to look back and learn how they build a world I'd love to visit Chirault by @varethane http://chirault.sevensmith.net/ Suihira - The City of Water by Riana http://suihira.com/ - the soft lighting, the legends Heart of Keol from @keii'ii (Heart of Keol) - love your detailed landscapes Phantomarine by @LadyLazuli (Phantomarine) how an island town have mysteries(edited)

eliushi [Keyspace]

I love worlds that are suggested, that feels fantastical but also surreal. These are just some that I love: Nameless and the Scientist by Amei Zhao http://nameless.ameizhao.com/ Lilith’s Word by Nina https://www.lilithword.com/ Mirror by Hwei Lim https://imagecomics.com/comics/releases/mirror-1

shadowhood {SunnyxRain}

Aight here goes

eliushi [Keyspace]

Am ready

shadowhood {SunnyxRain}

I love the worlds that are rich in lore, the ones that make you think that they can exist on their own. But most importantly...they don't feel like it's stuffed down your throat, but that they just are. Phantomarine by LadyLazuli Heart of Keol by Keiiii Muted by Anidoodles Sfeer Theory by jayd ait-kaci Unsounded by Ashley Cope Hookteeth by Boogey Heirs of the Veil by Phineas and finally Ghost Junk Sickness by Krispy and Space(edited)

eliushi [Keyspace]

Sfeer theory!

I love being immersed into the world that feels lived in and when characters start to care about the mysteries, that hooks me right away

Eightfish (Puppeteer)

Sfeer Theory Shadow!!

absolutely yes

Shizamura 🌟 O Sarilho

I'm absolutely in love with what Sink your Hookteeth by @boogeymadam has shown us thus far and I can't wait to see more I'm gonna have to go and repeat that the work on Heirs of the Veil is thus far amazing, and the environments on Ghost Junk Sicknesses ( @FeatherNotes(Krispy) & @spacerocketbunny ) are absolutely evocative and really make you wonder how things got to the point they are right now, how all these species got together and how they interact

eliushi [Keyspace]

Indeed! I’d love to know what sort of word/art sorcery you do to make your world so enticing! (For everyone to answer~)

RebelVampire

For me, I have to give it to Rising Sand https://risingsand.glass/ which has not only a very deep world lore, but really lets the characters lead you through that world to explore it. Second @Joichi [Hybrid Dolls] about Chirault. And also give a shout out to Sombulus http://www.sombulus.com/ just for being plain interesting all around with the worlds

Joichi [Hybrid Dolls]

Oh I forgot, yes Rising Sand has great world building.

Mitzi (Trophallaxis)

I'm a sucker for fairy tale type things, so my favorite comic lore-wise has gotta be Lost Nightmare. https://www.lostnightmare.com/ It's rather short, and works with the super cool concept of the sandman and the boogeyman as rulers of separate kingdoms. Absolutely lovely, 100% recommend. Not super convoluted, and ties everything together nicely in the end!

[phoenix-is-the-hottest-thing]

Random Phantomarine theory: The seabitten can see Cheth because Cheline knew/thought they’d need him.

Cheline kicked Cheth into gay baby jail yes, but her issue was allegedly him no longer performing his duties to her liking. He was “corrupted”, but she thought he’d come to his senses and go back to the brother she knew.

He just has to be away from humans long enough to realize he’s been misled!

— Cheline probably

Since the Fracture was meant to be temporary�� it’s fine if he doesn��t get to talk to mortals for a little while, she’ll take over, the dead souls can wait around with him in the water too, but what if there’s an emergency only he can fix, like soul damage?

I think she designed his banishment the way she did, and allowed the Seabitten to see him, specifically because she wanted him to perform the minimum of divine duties she couldn’t. A small compromise, they won’t be able to understand him, just see, surely not too many people would somehow damage their own souls while her brother was in time-out.

The dead can understand Cheth, because he does need to discuss their final judgment together, fine— but the living only get to see him as far as they really need his help.

…and then things completely spun out of control, and they got stuck with him only able to perform that bare minimum.

Worse, it seems he can’t even fix soul damage in his current state, so it’s possible that he was hurt beyond what Cheline expected… perhaps for the same reason Shoshana unexpectedly died? After all, Bonefeather and her grave are right next to Cheth, so they might just have died together.

Who knows. I don’t (yet). But I thought I’d get this thought out there 🤔

[shadedsecrets]

I realized today... that I can't wait to see where Amos Ellery ends up and I have more predictions about how that'd go.

Do I think he's going to be showing up frequently? Likely only as frequently as we check in on the rest of the Parents Squad, not often until thicker plot entanglement. Is he going to have important things to do and plot-impacting choices to make? Ooooh, most assuredly. And I am most eager to see which garden path he grouches down.

From my perspective... there are two options, and both of them are so very very fun.

This man has already been asked to and made some hard choices. He would not be a confidant of That Bird Goddess if he hadn't committed. The man knows his son has been dead for two months and that his body will never be found. And he isn't enthused about it, even grumbles a complaint, but that is as far as it gets. He reaffirms his loyalty. This is a man... that clings to the belief that seeing whatever this is through will be worth it in the end.

He has put his eggs in this basket and come hell of high water, he will defend those choices.

.....for now.

We don't currently know why Amos was upset about Irving not getting a body double that could at least be brought home. And I can think of a few reasons other than caring for his son that could fit that bill, but again, we don't know. With how hostile he got when our favorite Grandmother of Chaos implied he didn't, I do think he loves Irving, and expresses his affections... differently.

So we have a grumpy man currently working for the assumed Big Bad who seems like he may be loyal out of principle, fear, and honestly not believing there to be another option. He professes that he will do whatever it takes to see this through, even something like being implicit in the murders of his family and friends...

So what do we think is going to happen when news inevitably breaks of some Really Funky Seaghosts that look like those missing nobles? Yeah, the Phantomarine Crew are going to do their best to stay out of sight, but if a Pavel needs defending? Screw that, protect the baby! Let's face it, the boy with a stigmatized condition and a Godly Bounty on his head is going to be at risk of harm around people and in the wilds in equal measure. But what will the Parents do with this knowledge...

Personally... I hope Amos will be given chances at choosing something else, and he will double down the first couple times. He is a man of conviction. He does not read as someone who gets shaken easily, expression barely changing, voice rarely raised... Changing tracks just like that for likely only vague information would undercut all of that unless he was shown to take the time to VERY thoroughly research it on his own. I doubt he would be given the time to, however. No no... it's going to be the last time he has a choice that would be interesting.

It would be a choice that he cannot take back; most of the cards will be on the table and he will not be able to feign ignorance of the consequences. And he would have two options... Continue on this current course, or finally reach his limit and do ANYTHING else. Either he goes down as a man who finally tried to stand up to a Deity, or as someone who could not accept he had done the wrong thing.

What can I say? I am a sucker for these sorts of stories. An antagonist that just can't accept they did something wrong for a shitty reason is so cathartic to watch go down, just as good as someone finally taking a stand and responsibility for their actions and striving to dig back out of a very deep hole is.

Am I reading too far into a side character? Maybe! But he seems to be set up as the actual right hand of the Big Bad and is a protagonist's FATHER. He has some stuff to do here... And I see some veeeeeery fun flags.

[bubblewrapsnek]

I have a couple speculations on the matter, the first one is that even if he could put the soul back into the body, why would he? he knows Cheline killed Phae, and since the body fell into the sea at first, he must have seen that the Fata Morgana piloted by Cheline took it, even if he could put her back in her body she would just wake up in the arms of Cheline and be killed once again. Second speculation of mine, them being sentient ghosts could also be a countermeasure to Cheline: they have no flesh now, they are outside her domain and are much less supscetible to her actions, and that might be needed later if a confrontation is going to happen

this was mostly just a hunch + now a bit more backed by current evidence: I have this feeling that even if Phaedra won to only save herself I feel like Cheth wouldn't have been able to bring her back to life? Since he's like, god of the spirit and all that, the body is still very much Cheline's domain, like "Your souls fine, your body, not much that can be done. woops." + If he can't help the souls to move on from afterlife, and that's like, his job to a degree. Why would he be able to do the opposite? (before the body/soul thing was revealed, it was just logical that if you need a living person to do a job, give her a human body. So i started guessing he couldn't give it to her even if he wanted to.) I also feel like if other people managed to defeat cheth (and we know there are) there would be more stories of people coming back to life. (I actually had a theory that the people that challenged cheth and won, got to be fata morgana. (not completely discarded in my brain, yet))

Sorry this got rambly, your worldbuilding and storytelling are amazing, pacing in circles with this comic.

I love how you're all sending me these theories instead of just telling each other. It actually helps me think about things more carefully, haha.

[phantomarine]

As a reminder before the chapter ends, Phantomarine has a Discord! It's very active with art, theories, fanfic, and other various shenanigans. Join if you'd like to be tided (ha) over until Chapter 7!

[phantomarine]

You should know I binged Phantomarine tonight and oh my god. Oh my god. I have theories and favorites and the art is so good and I am so happy I found this. Thank you for your amazing art and for Cheth, praise whatever the hell he's got going on you put so much into all their character designs and it makes me so happy! (⁠ﾉ⁠◕⁠ヮ⁠◕⁠)⁠ﾉ⁠*⁠.⁠✧

HOORAY! Thank you so much for reading and for the kind words! Cheth is my baby through and through - I’m so happy to hear how much people like him. I hope you enjoy the rest of their antics!! 💖

[comicteaparty]

March 14th-March 20th, 2020 Creator Babble Archive

The archive for the Creator Babble chat that occurred from March 14th, 2020 to March 20th, 2020.  The chat focused on the following question:

How do you react to readers predicting your plot twists?

chalcara [Nyx+Nyssa]

Depends when they do. A page or two before it happens? Both of us get to feel clever. Yay! Months ahead? Well, obviously the thing I thought a a big twist ain't it, so I get to decide what other thing to focus on. I usually don't change the plot on reader predictions, but I can always change how a twist is presented from "Big surprise! Bet you didn't expect that" to "Well, ain't it neat to FINALLY have confirmation about that thing?"

Funnily, the best plottwist I ever wrote was in my now defunct comic. I thought it was obvious, but my few readers went "WOAH, didn't see THAT coming." So these days I try to just write the story and let the twists fall where they may.

Pistashi

ASDFPHIaewpf a friend of mine was reading my comic and he was making a lot of theories, a bunch of them was way off but he managed to be 100% accurate about one of his theories and I just started laughing nervously when he talked to me about it before it happened in the comic. This was years ago and the thing already happened and it's not a big deal anymore, but at the time I felt proud to write something that was obscure enough to not be on the reader's face but at the same time having someone figure it out after connecting the dots

I have little twists that happen in a more funny way, and it's usually used for comedy, and my readers seem to like it

but that's probably because of the expectations in humor coming from my writing style

which is usually bad puns and character reactions to absurd situations

and I agree witch chalcara, sometimes we can feel like we failed a plot twist when people see it from miles away

which is true, but sometimes even when they figure it out it's best to leave it as it is

I've seen a lot of writers fucking up their stories by changing plot twists that were stablished just because "people found out too early", and retconing a lot of the story in result

like, making a plot twist consists in creating some kind of foreshadowing

to make the twist not seem too forced and taken from nowhere

also to make it rewarding for those who searched deep for those clues

idk I love these little foreshadowing/clues we can leave for our readers

to make the twists even more powerful and meaningful

RebelVampire

I want to second a lot of the above. A plot twist should not be completely unguessable. Because if nobody guesses it, it means to most readers it's gonna feel like it makes no sense and came out of nowhere. The goal of a true twist is to have as few people as possible guess it but then when it's revealed, the reader smacks their head going "how could I miss all these clues."

Pistashi

exactly

Deo101 [Millennium]

Readers predicting things usually makes me lead with "oh no, I'm predictable!!!" And then makes me thing "wait, no, it means they're picking up on the hints I've left behind." Though sometimes it's predictable, like if someone guesses the actions of the next few pages, that's less of the readers picking up on hints and more just guessing right. But guessing big plot things, j think, is a reflection that I'm making things as clear as I need to, and I'm rather fond of it

Tantz Aerine (Without Moonlight)

99% of the times I am delighted if they guess the plot twist. I like it when I feel like my readers are on the same page as me (pun ...maybe not intended?) and see where things are going. Since my stuff is character driven, it tells me they can read the characters and their personalities well enough. However there was this one time when I had intentionally depicted something that was not going to be the historical norm (namely the p-51 mustangs' coats of paint on a cruiser in the opening scene of my WWII webcomic Brave Resistance). A war history buff called me out on it IMMEDIATELY saying "wait, these aren't how they're supposed to be!" and nearly spoiled the entire plot on page 2! I had to DM him to tell him to tone it down, and explain to him why the planes where the way they were. He apologized and stopped, but I'd wanted to throttle him for a while there

keii’ii (Heart of Keol)

I agree with Rebel re: the purpose of a plot twist. In that sense, though, I don't think my story even has plot twists. There is no moment anywhere in the story where I want the readers to go "how could I have missed all the clues!!!" ... On the spectrum of brainy vs hearty, my story is very close to the extreme end of hearty. Like, think of stories like The Little Prince or My Sweet Orange Tree. Even when unexpected things happen, it's never about the brilliant reveal. The most shocking thing in My Sweet Orange Tree comes out of nowhere, and it works for that book. Heart of Keol is a lot like those two in this regard. Not exactly the same, but pretty dang similar!

So back to the question, honestly? I want people to be able to guess. The usual bane of my existence is the opposite problem: people not knowing wtf is going on. My story isn't supposed to draw its strength from its surprises, so guess away (edited)

eli [a winged tale]

I love it when the reader guesses the gist of the plot twist a few pages just before the reveal. I sort of follow the novel structure idea that the reader should see what’s coming next right before it hits them, hence rewarding their investment in the story. Wild speculations without the clues I’ve planted are interesting. It does make me wonder if I relied too much on tropes or left too big of the crumbs. That being said, I’m not too fussed by readers predicting the general directions of the plot because it’s all about the character reactions. Could they predict that too? Maybe, to a degree. But there are a lot of subtext I try to write in my characters that give some nuances that I feel may entertain even those who guess correctly how the story would go. TL;DR: guess away. Love reading theories. The story is set so I won’t be changing anything big but perhaps layer the reveal with subtleties.

Cronaj (Whispers of the Past)

I've actually never had readers guess what's coming next. I mean, unless you count obvious, broad stuff (such as "the MCs get together"). I mean, it IS a romance. But in regards to big plot events, no one has gotten remotely close with their predictions (which kind of surprises me, because I drop clues everywhere). To be fair, I'm only a chapter in, so I guess it makes sense. But I am excited for the day when people finally guess

eli [a winged tale]

Same Cronaj! The predictions I’m speaking of are from my betas reading the entire script I love it when then go—- “omg this [plot point] must mean [reveal!]” .... right before the reveal

Feather J. Fern

If anyone does pick out certian plot twists I will be like "Yesssss people do think like me, I am not crazy" XD because most of my twists are all shown from the start through hidden background things so if people found them I am excited they took time and effort to figure out twists

LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)

I love it. I haven’t been disappointed about it yet, and I don’t think I will be. It doesn’t make me change the twists at all - in fact, I’ve even shifted some story elements around to give the readers even more confirmation that they’re right, earlier on in the plot. I want to reward them with a treat, and now they can revel in their cleverness a bit longer Hee hee.

Eightfish (Puppeteer)

I love it too, but I don't change things to make readers more right like LadyLazuli does. Sometimes I'm tempted to, though! My readers have good ideas!

Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)

I like plot twists so I like to set a hint of them off early tbh (edited)

but I try not to make it too obivous :3c

tho for those who like to guess, I welcome it. I like hearing folks and their interpretations even if it's not what I'm going for too lol

LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)

Admittedly, a lot of it is due to the nature of the medium. I know that webcomics take ages to get to major reveals or spoilers - I can wait to totally-confirm things, but I can't wait to... almost-confirm things? I don't want people to get tired or frustrated. I know I've gotten angry at anime shows that take 20 episodes to confirm something we guessed at episode 1, so I like when these things are all but confirmed early on. It can be really fun to know a secret that, maybe, the heroes don't know. It gives an extra layer of STOP, NO, DON'T GO IN THERE! in times of danger

But given my propensity to practically s c r e a m my spoilers to people who I can trust with the plot... a lot of it is just me bursting at the seams wanting to say YES YOU'RE CORRECT.

Patience and restraint. Essential things in webcomics

eli [a winged tale]

Indeed! So much patience needed I do love some excellent plot twists executed just chefs kiss

Eightfish (Puppeteer)

Yes! I just want to tell readers, "Oh God, you're right! Good job!" But instead I usually respond with a ":)" or "I like this analysis!" Which I think is basically just confirming it. But if it's a real life friend? I cannot resist from telling them everything. I've even spilled spoilers in this chat before, trusting that most people here haven't read my comic. Kind of backfired when I reached a major plot point and someone commented, "She's been waiting to bust out this plot point for so long." Oops, guess someone did read my forum posts. But even if I did spoil things in the comments, is it really that big of a deal? I'm the kind of person where spoilers don't detract from my experience of things and sometimes even adds to it. But some people care about spoilers, so.(edited)

eli [a winged tale]

Haha yeah it’s honestly so freeing to just tell someone about the spoilers

Here’s what I have planned that will wreak the readers muahaha

keii’ii (Heart of Keol)

Past me could super relate to that! But these days I don't really want to TELL people? I'm not sure if that's because I've changed as a person, or if it's because this story is different from my previous ones. That being said, my patience is not infinite. I am itching to SHOW people. Can't wait to get to those Big Scenes

"Big" is a weird adjective here because they're very small scenes in some ways. Very intimate/personal

But... you guys know what I mean. The scenes that every longform webcomicker is dying to get to

Mei

Oh gosh, I agree that plot twists shouldn't be entirely out of the blue, since it's nice to have the hints that give people the crumbs to follow a trail. But like, since I write a lot of these chapters way in advance, and if I had the chance I'd love for them to be readable in one go as opposed to a page per week, I fear that I'm boring people with a predictable punchline? That being said, I get so many comments that predict the end of the chapter or the punchline or the joke. And I'm always like "haha maybe????" but inside i'm like "oh my god, they got me, THEY GOT ME"

Ohh yeah keii I get what you mean

the scenes you're like, checking your watch, checking your current pagecount, and thinking "soon I'll get to draw it, and it will be marvellous"

eli [a winged tale]

Oh gosh those scenes for me are at the finale

keii’ii (Heart of Keol)

TBH last time I got to one of those scenes (which was very recent), my anxiety skyrocketed because I was expecting someone to say something harsh. Because it happened in all of the previous ones. But this time it went well, so hopefully the future ones will, too?

eli [a winged tale]

Yay!

Deo101 [Millennium]

I think for me, I worry more than anything that it will ruin things for other readers, rather than me worrying so much about someone guessing right or me sharing spoilers.

keii’ii (Heart of Keol)

Someone DID say something harsh, but it was right before the actual scene and not about the scene and a lot of people got fed up with their attitude so I felt like it wasn't my fault, lol

eli [a winged tale]

Ruin things for other readers? Oh like someone predicting correctly in the comments?

Deo101 [Millennium]

Also yay! I always get anxiety about those kinds of scenes

Yes, someone predicting Something

keii’ii (Heart of Keol)

Well thought-out predictions are a lot of fun to read though, as a reader going through the comment section

eli [a winged tale]

I guess I stopped minding it and now embrace it they could be wrong or right and who knows until we get there~

Oh totally!

Deo101 [Millennium]

Oh I don't mind so much, but that doesn't mean I don't worry a bit too!

J like reading them for me, but I still think "I wonder if this will ruin it for someone else"

keii’ii (Heart of Keol)

Occasionally there are problems with Korean webcomics that were originally webnovels? Because people who've read the novel version sometimes spoil things in the comic comment section, and that's not cool. They're not even theorizing, they're straight up spoiling.

Deo101 [Millennium]

:(

eli [a winged tale]

Oh no that’s bad

keii’ii (Heart of Keol)

But if people are theorizing, and the theories turn out to be right, that's all very fun IMO!

Mei

ugh when people spoil things it irritates me to no end. Let people enjooy it for what it is!

and yes!! that's one of my fave things too

Deo101 [Millennium]

Yeah, every reader is different though. I have some people who explicitly have asked me not to share spoilers, and others who kinda beg for them! So I worry if some people don't like to see predictions (I know my dad doesn't like when I guess things in a movie)

Mei

theorising, discussing with other fans, just chatting about what you think may or may not happen

keii’ii (Heart of Keol)

Sometimes you even see comments like "Hurry up, Konans! I'm too tired to think, so post some good interpretations/theories!" lol (Konan as in the detective... in Korea, it's a term for hardcore theorizers in webcomic comment sections)

Oh, I think movies are different

I don't want any form of verbal remarks while I'm watching a movie

Or like, if I'm marathonning a show with my bro, we're entirely silent except between episodes.

But comment section is like, you have to actually go there.

Deo101 [Millennium]

Some people might be like that for comics, too. Idk. I'm not trying to say i don't like to see theories I'm just trying to think of everything that makes me worry about them is all.

And for me, the biggest worry would be that someone seeing a prediction would make them enjoy my comic less. It doesn't mean I necessarily think it's all that common, but I refuse to say it won't happen I think

snuffysam (Super Galaxy Knights)

Personally, I think that's not an issue unless you confirm the commenter's theories

like I've seen theories for things online where my first reaction is "that's dumb, that would never happen" and then it happens

some people will latch onto another person's theory, others will reject it, but i don't think people will take it as a spoiler in advance

Cronaj (Whispers of the Past)

Yeah, theories are just theories

keii’ii (Heart of Keol)

I mean I know some people don't even want to hear other readers' theories, but if they are that extreme, they need to avoid the comment section on their own IMO?

Cronaj (Whispers of the Past)

^^

keii’ii (Heart of Keol)

like... cool, I respect your preferences, but you can't hold me responsible, pal!

Deo101 [Millennium]

Again I'm not trying to say I don't like theories or I don't want them I'm just trying to think of all potential issues with them

Cronaj (Whispers of the Past)

Granted, I'm one of those people who will scroll through the comments and read theories because I like to see all the smart people reveal the clues to dumb people like me

keii’ii (Heart of Keol)

I can relate to that

@Deo101 [Millennium] Understandable! Just don't be too hard on yourself for things that you can't control

Cronaj (Whispers of the Past)

Those geniuses that remember details from 30 chapters ago and somehow manage to connect the dots

Mei

Exactly! The comment section is there, but it's their choice to read it, and also like it's not your fault either? like they're not YOUR comments

haha in our RPG games sometimes people drop character plot hints way at the start of the campaign, and my friend will turn up, 7 months later, " remember when Character A said this? I remember"

and everyone's like "what the heck?!" some people are just detectives

they can see it, they see the matrix

snuffysam (Super Galaxy Knights)

Anyway, I love when my readers theorize! I don't believe any reader has guessed any of the major plot twists in the first two books, despite there being enough evidence beforehand to make a guess (closest was "whatever zebugu's doing, it's not evil this time" but not the specifics of what he was doing). Though, if they had, I wouldn't mind, since that's max two years they gotta wait before the reveal (and that's assuming they guess it on the cover page lol). Book 3 is a different beast - strictly speaking, there's enough evidence for someone to predict both twists at the end of the book, right now. And... that may be an issue, given that this book will take over three years to reach those twists. So... we'll see if anyone guesses them. What's weirdest is when people guess things almost correctly with absolutely NO hints. And it's some super specific and minor thing like "Mizuki is secretly the reincarnation of a thousand-year-old dragon". Like... there haven't even been dragons mentioned in the comic up to this point. Nor any events from a thousand years ago. And like, that's not exactly the truth, but how do you get THAT close???(edited)

Cronaj (Whispers of the Past)

They see E V E R Y T H I N G

eli [a winged tale]

Sometimes it’s a trope thing? But yeah wild speculations can be so wild but so spot on

snuffysam (Super Galaxy Knights)

but there aren't any fantasy creatures in the comic, at all!

except a squid with feet!

eli [a winged tale]

Lol whaaaat then yea not sure where the dragon part came from then

Cronaj (Whispers of the Past)

Sherlock Holmes readers lol

eli [a winged tale]

Yeah detective Conan lol

Deo101 [Millennium]

Joke gone awry

snuffysam (Super Galaxy Knights)

basically

Feather J. Fern

Well I mean I have crack theories about random people being random things too so...

I can see where they come from XD

sagaholmgaard

tbh I think my comic is fairly easy to predict as it has a pretty straightforward narrative xD but I don't have that many readers yet so maybe in the future! I would have fun reading people's guesses and predictions :D

Eightfish (Puppeteer)

AAA my readers right now are so accurate. They're so smart. They make me want to post my entire buffer right now and prove them right.

sssfrs (JOE IS DEAD)

I wonder if anyone would be able to predict the next things happening in joe is dead

Eightfish (Puppeteer)

I at least have no idea what's going to happen next but am looking forward to it anyways(edited)

🌈ERROR404 🌈

i know that it's only because TH is still quite new, and I haven't gotten to the meat of the story yet, but i like reading some of the really out there predictions and worries i get in some of the comments lol

AntiBunny

I will never tell someone if their guess is right or wrong, but if they do guess it, it probably means I'm foreshadowing well.

Then again I also find myself writing by the seat of my pants, so plans are subject to change.

kayotics

The original question mentions “plot twists” but I’m never trying to make a plot twist personally. I may intentionally obfuscate things, but I don’t ever try to do wild twists and turns. So when a reader predicts what will happen, I actually don’t mind, and I’m pretty happy that it’s following a logical chain of events. On the other hand, when readers are totally off base, I think that’s REALLY fun.

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Most of my readers feel that my comics are twisty and surprising, but I often get at least one reader who correctly guesses what will happen, even if sometimes they’re joking or think their theory is wild and out there. Honestly it feels pretty awesome to have a reader shrewd enough to puzzle out the clues, because that means they’re really paying attention. I don’t have a very big audience and most of the time they’re silent, so anytime someone leaves a comment that is carefully thought out, it makes me really happy. As for the times readers joke or wildly speculate but inadvertently hit the nail right on the head, I find those very amusing. I really love stories with well done twists and turns, and so I try very hard to execute good plot twists that have enough foreshadowing to be ‘Aha!’ moments rather than ‘Where did that even come from?’ moments. So I love when readers are both properly misdirected AND when they pick up on the clues and deduce the twist.(edited)

DanitheCarutor

Does my comic have plot twists? I don't really think about it. People have correctly guessed things that will happen in a chapter, someone even guessed correctly on the climax when a character named Daniel was introduced... well, it was more like "I hope things don't turn out like -blank-!". I don't mind, just because they guessed something correctly doesn't mean they know how the story will go for sure, it just means that they're theorizing and that is something I always encourage. I don't think that means the story is boring or predictable either, some people are just really good at that stuff. Even though I don't think my comic is very mysterious/unpredictable it's still impressive when someone pays attention to all the little visual and dialogue details, then guessing correctly about a future event based on them. Nothing more flattering than someone enjoying your comic enough to analyze it.

Lmao! I can't tell you how many movies I've ruined for people because I guessed a plot twist correctly.

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Haha, honestly same. I’m not allowed to make predictions during movies or TV shows anymore bc I almost always get it right. XD Webcomics I find a bit more unpredictable, though, because most of them aren’t nearly as formulaic as mainstream film.

DanitheCarutor

Yeah! Even if it's not obvious most of the time movies go by a pattern or set of traits, once you learn how they go a film or TV show becomes a lot more easy to figure out right away. The only time I'm stumped is when the movie is really surreal or absolutely awful. That's the nice thing about webcomics in a way. I assume a lot of creators haven't had professional training, and we want to tell a story more than be entertaining to the masses, so stories are less predictable. They don't always go by a formula, which can be refreshing.

Capitania do Azar

Aw man I would love to have some theories, but for the time unfortunately I don't I'm always super curious about how readers interpret things given they don't have an inside view of things

[phantomarine]

I keep coming back to read this.

It's everything.

Why Pavel is Important:

AKA Why Cheth and Phaedra need therapy and Phantomarine won’t leave my head–

The sheer importance of Pavel as a character and what he does hit me very hard today and I needed to share.

Cheth the Red Tide King is an ageless being who has been betrayed, mutilated, and discredited for a comparatively short 500 years out of his thousands. Everything he was, everything he had, taken away by someone who was supposed to be his equal and someone who his feelings about seem to be very… complicated. Even then, he didn’t even get to die, just watch as more as more was stripped away so not even the people’s memory of him remained unwrapped. His only company was himself… and a few fleeting moments with people who feared and hated him. If that didn’t fuck him up a bit, nothing could.

If he was to be made the villain until some nebulous future that might not even come, why not lean into it and have at least a shred of vengeance and amusement? The perfect target is right there, after all, a royal line dedicated to the church that sullies his memory with lies is right there. Why *not* torment them when they pass, why not make those ruthless bloodthirsty puppets feel despair? After all, he knows who is calling the shots. He knows she doesn’t care one bit once she can no longer use them…

The Red Tide surrounded and transported at least three sea bite victims to shore that we know of, however. Doubtless there are many more lives he has tried to save from a painful and premature death. But he can only be so many places at once… And it is rather telling that every seabite victim we have seen so far has been a child.

He thought Phaedra no better than a tyrant early in her reign when she came down to his domain. That she could not possibly know the loss that had occurred because of her people’s actions. That none of her line could, because ***she*** was pulling the strings… And of course, she would never trust him, so to get her to do anything, of course he had to lie. She had been manipulated all her life and was clearly none the wiser, even now when contradictions begin arising. And really, he has no patience for it anymore, for stubborn fools who refuse to hear him…. and Cheth is far too out of practice to do anything about this himself.

Phaedra is lugging around centuries of religious propaganda and pressure, as well as being young, inexperienced, and grieving the loss of her father. Her whole life has been surrounded by the church and it’s teachings, of her future responsibilities in relation to them, who her immortal enemy was and who her biggest inspiration should be. She was very literally tailor-raised to hate Cheth. 

His actions don’t help alleviate this either. I doubt he was lying about being able to bring back only one soul, but not being clear about it broke what trust Phaedra was ever willing to put in the god. She was not nearly as hostile towards him until that little snag, and has seemed only to double down on this stance ever since, her color scheme changing from yellows to blues. She will find the most bad-faith read of his words and believe that to be the only correct answer. His penchant to not being completely clear and honest with his intentions also clearly vexes her.

Clearly though, she cares deeply about people. She took up her father’s tradition to ease the grieving. She was willing to do whatever it took to save her friends, and feels incredible guilt for ‘dooming’ them to a these last months of not-quite-life. She wants to help people, really help them… but she can only see ‘help’ in such a narrow worldview and has been taught there are some people you just shouldn’t help.

And then… there’s Pavel. And the very first thing we learn about him is that the boy has more heart than sense. Vanna raised him well, but the kind of deep empathy to care for the very beings that killed his father and basically gave him a terminal disease with heavy stigmas that forced him to leave the life he loved for ***seven years*** takes a little more than teaching.

Pavel has defended almost every single being that has harmed him.

He understood that sea ghosts just couldn’t stop themselves and that they were people once because he trusted his mother and her research. He understood that his friend Eddy was scared and alone and lashing out because of that. He questioned and pushed back against Sofia’s manipulations and the bad faith readings of the Mantaluna crew, but tried to understand that they must be having a pretty hard time. He told the Manta Princess to her face that *Cheth was hurting too* and asked a literal deity to be nicer to the biggest pain in his neck.

This little boy is a critical bridge. He can just *feel* when people are coming from a place of genuine care or hurt and tries to explain that to others who are being overly harsh in his opinion. There is a reason he is neither Cheth’s nor Phaedra’s color scheme. *This tiny boy is the one neutral party that both of these stubborn powerful people will listen to, now.*

Phaedra only turned sour when the talk got a little too close to questioning the very foundation of her beliefs, and she just went cold and tried to make Pavel change the subject. She was so relieved to know she hadn’t hurt him, wanted to do everything she could to make him comfortable and did not even question if they should help him get somewhere safe. And Cheth… Cheth loves children and hates having to welcome a single one into his collection, I think. He tried to mock Phaedra with how many *orphans* her father’s last battle created. He became *angry* and cold at even the implication that he would have lied to Pavel. And Cheth does everything he can to make sure a child survives a sea ghost attack.

Without Pavel… neither of these two have any hope of working through their shit, because neither of them are able to view the other and their reactions clearly. Cheth IS AN ASSHOLE AND VINDICTIVE. Phae IS NAIVE AND OVERZEALOUS. And Pavel is the once person who can read them both as say it like it is. And that is going to make for one hell of a boat ride.

[comicteaparty]

July 18th-July 24th, 2020 Creator Babble Archive

The archive for the Creator Babble chat that occurred from July 18th, 2020 to July 24th, 2020.  The chat focused on the following question:

What makes you the happiest about being a creator?

carcarchu

getting fanart from people fills me with a certain kind of joy that can't be compared. this has never happened before but if someone told me that my comic inspired them or spoke to them i'd be over the moon

Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~

Oh gosh, yes, fanart is such a beautiful thing.

For me personally, I just get so incredibly happy when readers just get it. Like, they pick up on a specific nuance or they know exactly what I intended with certain dialogue, or they notice a small detail. Or when they react exactly as I hoped they would.

That's what I live for.

Eightfish (Puppeteer)

definitely friendart

Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~

hahaha

Eightfish (Puppeteer)

also just imagining future scenes to myself makes me smile and laugh

must look crazy to passerbys but i don't care

Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~

I relate

#when you laugh aloud at something one of your characters said or did in your head

or #when you cry because of something that happened to your characters in your head

I don't need help, I swear

Eightfish (Puppeteer)

all i want out of this server is solidarity with others who burst out laughing in public because of something the people in our heads did

our imaginations are strong enough to entertain ourselves this much, how beautiful

Cronaj ~{Whispers of the Past}~

Who needs movies when you have I M A G I N A T I O N ?

Deo101 [Millennium]

Hm... A lot of things about being a creator make me really happy. For me though, I think that the biggest thing is that I'm finally doing something I've wanted to my whole life. It kind of feels very right that I'm telling stories this way, and that feeling of "I'm meant to be doing this and young me would explode out of pure joy to see where we are now" is incredible.

shadowhood {SunnyxRain}

The best thing for me being a creator is that I’m creating something that can resonate with people. There’s a happiness in me being able to make my own world, a world where people can look at my characters and go “yeah, I know how that feels” or “that’s a mood.”

There’s something empowering about writing an emotional scene that touches you and finding out it touched others too. I think if I wrote a scene that made me cry and found out that it also made others cry....I would be very happy. Just the fact that they understood the sort of emotions I had in making it and also the message I want to send is enough for me.

eliushi [Keyspace]

That I can make anything happen! It’s a fun sandbox to explore narratives I’ve enjoyed or want to discover, a challenge to make something that connects with other people and something I do that’s part of my own personal healing journey It’s amazing what we can do, bringing something completely our own and different into the world

Jib {WIP haha}

For me, the best thing about it is the feeling of having something in front of you. What was once just ideas floating around your head is finally something that you can fully experience yourself and share with others! It can tell you so much about yourself and, if you’re really challenging yourself in the narrative, you can grow as a person. And the fact that other people might choose to also experience what you made is magical too! Just hearing what they think about it is amazing, I haven’t heard anything about something really moving somebody. But when that day comes, I know I’ll be just swimming in joy. I guess the short answer for me would be: seeing things come to fruition and the unique connection only found in shared stories

maxwestart

I have a story to tell and want to share it with others. But even if nobody else cared, I'd still draw comics

Feather J. Fern

That it's something that I can make. I struggle with the idea that I am not good enough to do something, but with my comic, when I finish a page, I always have a feeling of "I made something, I can do it". Also fanart makes me so warm on the inside.

AntiBunny

For me as a creator it's when I finally hear from someone who picked up my comic and isn't someone I know IRL. It's like "you actually read my work of your own free will, and I didn't have to guilt you into reading it just because we're friends?" It's validation for me that my work can reach someone I've never met before. Whether they love or hate it, I just enjoy hearing that someone's read my work and given it enough thought to form an opinion.

LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)

I like setting small goals for myself, page-wise, and I enjoy reaching or exceeding them. The story itself is mostly complete in my mind, so the real joy comes from physically inching my way through it. Every page I complete is a step closer to a smaller goal, and a larger goal as well. I love seeing people interact with it, but I get a particular joy looking back down at the mountain I’ve been climbing. I hope to reach the top someday.

Joichi [Hybrid Dolls]

I love connecting with others through creative stories. Of course, fanart is wonderful, I love the act of giving art and recieving art gifts. I agree with AntiBunny, is when people tell me they read my comic and give detailed thoughts on it. It hasn't reach this point yet but I like to read reader's theories on object symbolisms, events that they suspect will happen, whether it's intended or not.(edited)

Holmeaa - working on WAYFINDERS

What I really love about being a creator, is the joy of telling my own stories, to be able to be touched and laugh and get to do fun things around. I love the creative process of figuring things out, set out rules for yourself! And of course getting comments! Wayfinders have not gotten any fan creations yet, but when it does, I will be SO EXCITED! like someone loved it enough to spent time, doing anything?!!?! be it, playlists, moodboards, fanart, fanfics etc etc I love to be told that we do fun things with comic layout. Like the tought about in the future to be used as an example of cool ways to do things is a big goal that would make me so happy

maxwestart

Another reason I like making my comics? It is like what Lynn Johnston (For Better Or For Worse) said - you are in charge. You make the characters, create the world, decide what happens, etc.

YOU are in control!

rajmews

happiest thing about being a creator? For me it's just the act of making stuff. I can't guarantee if anyone will actually...see or like my stuff...but I really enjoy making it. And, when I do art as a job, and I get to help someone with absolutely no art ability make their dream a visual thing they can look at--that's a great feeling.

Miranda (Into the Swell)

I think it's seeing my ideas come to life. It's so frustrating when you can visualize something in your head but can't convey it to others, and when that works out it's just wonderful

AntiBunny

Indeed when you can bring a world to life that once lived in your own head is an amazing feeling.

Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)

The act of creating... I think that brings me major contentment in my work. of course there's times i feel like "dang why this isn't coming together" it's the culmination of those experiences along having folks looking in my work and interacting with it matters to me

also I get stupid happy when i get nice comments so ye lmao

TaliePlume

What makes me the happiest about being a creator is sharing my culture and changing how people perceive it in a positive and creative way while still staying true to myself.

Desnik

What makes me happiest about being a creator is having something to talk about with other creatives

I don't have to sit on the sidelines being fannish, sometimes my peers like MY things too!

Eightfish (Puppeteer)

yes

persephinnie

I have a question - are any of you afraid of posting your OCs in the risk of it getting stolen? or is this more of a thing in the past?

I feel like it used to be a big deal back then, but I'm not sure how much one would need to worry about this still.

keii’ii (Heart of Keol)

Who would even want to steal my very unremarkable-looking characters? And this isn't a self-neg; my characters shine through their story, not through the easily stolen designs. (May want to take this to #general BTW)

Tuyetnhi (Only In Your Dreams!)

hm. not really since past to present time I also made sure I had like watermarked and it's pretty much the only versions I had online tbh lmao

oh and yes

Eightfish (Puppeteer)

like the designs stolen?

i don't think my characters are remarkable looking enough to be stolen

even for the one or two interesting character designs i did, i don't really care if someone steals it?

oh oops this is creator babble. Should move to shop_talk

persephinnie

keii'ii - ack my apologies!

Deo101 [Millennium]

Where's the convo gonna go?

persephinnie

(#general!)

[comicteaparty]

December 7th-December 13th, 2019 Creator Babble Archive

The archive for the Creator Babble chat that occurred from December 7th, 2019 to December 13th, 2019.  The chat focused on the following question:

If you could redo one part of your story, which part would it be and why?

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

I can and do redo parts of my story. I’m working on a redux of the first two chapters of my comic, Dark Wings: Eryl (https://www.flowerlarkstudios.com/art-archive/eryl-redux-archives/ - rated M) right now. I’m doing so for quite a few reasons, some of which are very personal and have to do with my own growth as a person, not just as a creator. It was also to update the writing, partly to update the art, and because I took a three year hiatus a long time ago which created a huge, jarring gap in not the just art and writing, but also the tone and direction of the comic. I also sometimes go back and adjust speech bubbles in old pages to close plot-holes or fix some badly-written dialogue. I feel that if there is any part of my story where redoing sections can improve the entire course of the comic and readers’ enjoyment of it, I will. And if I don’t, I run the risk of losing inspiration for the entire comic because I can’t figure out how to work with an older part of it. Rather than twist my plot into pretzels trying to explain something carelessly written a decade ago in current scenes or allowing plot-holes to open, I go back and fix the bad parts. Reduxes are often seen as taboo by a lot of comic creators. But if looking back genuinely helps me to keep going forward, then I will.(edited)

LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)

For Phantomarine (http://www.phantomarine.com/), it'd be less about rewriting existing things, and more about... adding back in the extra pages/detail/fun-stuff that I originally wrote, but had to cut out to meet a reasonable page count per chapter. With the number of hours a single page takes to paint, I really REALLY have to streamline things, or I'll never finish this damn project Good news is, I think it's helped the pacing in its own way. And I have lots of fluff and fun stuff coming down the line that I think are better suited to the story anyway. So... I guess... in a different world, I'd simplify the art style, so I could just write more? Yeah, that. Let's go with that.(edited)

AntiBunny

We all have things we'd like to redo, but if we kept rebooting we'd never make progress. That said in AntiBunny: The Gritty City Stories http://antibunny.net/ I'd probably have set it in the 1980's instead of present day. It's hard to write mysteries around google and cell phones, or to keep the superscience impressive. Grounding it in a known time period would have been easier.

Eightfish

@LadyLazuli (Phantomarine) I just read through your archive and ohmygod, wow! Your art is so beautiful. The colors! The backgrounds! Every page is like a painting the panels are so well put together. And I love the way you draw the seaghosts all together. I can't imaging how much time that took. And the worldbuilding is fantastic and creative, and the dialogue flows so well, and I'm so invested in your characters (when are we getting back to Phaedra??), and your villains are so fun. Cheth is so fun to see, and such a unique idea, I am so into it.

twothirty

i actually did redo the first half of chapter 1 (http://versecomic.com/) when i came back to it after 2-ish years. I opted for a much slower start to introduce readers to this world where things aren't perfect but people are getting by. Originally i had it start off in the midst of a catastrophe and i just wasn't feeling it. I always ruminate on the pacing of my story, i think the first book moves very fast, and there's some scenes i'd make a few pages longer to just get in some more dialogue...

LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)

@Eightfish Oh my goodness!! That’s so wonderful and so kind of you to say. It’s my only current story idea, so I’m putting all the effort in that I can muster. Thank you for checking it out! This is the last of the chapters that help flesh out the outside world - we’ll be seeing a lot more of Cheth and Phaedra very soon... for better or for worse. I can’t wait to get back to them and FINALLY tie all the threads together Thank you again!

seetherabbit

The only one that I would do a redo would the first story in Vulperra https://vulperra.com/comic/flash-gauntlet-1/ Apart from giving it a George Lucas (redrawing it with improved graphics aka art skill), I would also add in pages before and after the 10 pages thats out. What I would add is Flash Gauntlet (the main character) tell the tale of him fighting the demon in the story. There's one story that I did a redo on before it got published, which is this one. https://vulperra.com/comic/guardian-of-castle-bogo-1/ What I changed was the climax and the ending. The story is about a bunch of people in a castle that has only one guardian who protects the rest of the citizen from monsters and such. No one else wants to use weapons and the guardian is tired of his work and tries to throw it on Flash Gauntlet. The climax is that Flash Gauntlet convices the others to help the guardian out by making better defences around the castle. In the old version, the citizens learns to wield weapons instead. I didn't like the old version because I felt it was too preachy, and the ending gave me a bleh feeling. There's a couple of things in the story that's being published now, and one future one that I could change, but that's more minor things that I think I don't need to go back to. I'm more of a "let the mistakes be and leave them as a reminder to get gudd" kind of guy. Unless I hate it the story, like the Castle short

Capitania do Azar

Oh I have done so many edits over at https://www.sarilho.net/en/. They're mostly to text (for clarity) and minor edits here and there for continuity or correcting mistakes. Tho more recently I found out than I have the time I shouldn't let it reflect anything less than my best work, so in the latest chapter I've moved pages and panels around to make for a better story flow (even adding pages when I realized I would go over the initial number of pages I planned)

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

Sometimes I think I should have started the story with Victoria's situation at home and her relationship to her mother, since that is pretty important for the plot. But to be fair...not showing this at the beginning created a little bit more intrigue and I guess I'm not far enough into the plot yet to really want to change anything of substance.

sssfrs

I would redo chapter 2 https://tapas.io/episode/1486719 to improve the art and change around some of the dialogue

Ooh there were also some details I forgot to include in the most recent chapter

Deo101

I think I would want to add some pages to slow my pacing down, and also spend a bit longer on backgrounds. I suppose in theory I could add pages in now, but I think I'd rather put that effort into moving forward!

snuffysam

In terms of art - a lot lol, the early art of Super Galaxy Knights http://sgkdr.thecomicseries.com/comics/ is pretty bad. But I'm almost finished redoing all the chapters that were drawn on paper & didn't have shading, so that won't be a problem for much longer. In terms of the writing and pacing and stuff, I'm mostly still good with my earlier work? The one thing I regret is the end of Book 1 Chapter 7 - the part where Cahe straight-up murders three guys. I feel like it doesn't make that much sense for his character, and doesn't even resolve the "we need a rounded out team" thing very well. An ideal redo would change Cahe's ability to make more sense for his character - say, he can put a shield on Pejiba that reflects all damage to her back at her attackers. But making a change like that would make it impossible for Mizuki to use that ability while fighting Zebugu, which would take away one of the major aspects of that fight. At the very least, I'd probably cut out the page where Cahe kills the tank driver :p