#over a melon and because Richard wanted to start a fight

[paleshelter29]

Gets microphone: BENJAMIN DESERVED BETTER!!!!! Thank you for coming to my BENtalk.

[twdmusicboxmystery]

8x02: General Analysis

***Spoilers About for 8x02. Don’t Read until you’ve watched***

How did everyone like the episode? I thought it was great! Except that once again it cut off in the middle of the action and I was cursing. I need more! Grrh! 

First, let me revise what I said last week about the plot. I said they seemed to be going to three different places, which is still true, but I think It's all part of the same operation, not three different operations as I first thought. There's those at the Sanctuary (Aaron and co) who are just trying to keep all the people there and contained, Jesus/Tara/Morgan who are at the same satellite station from S6, which is in a different place than the Sanctuary. It's unclear why they are specifically attacking the satellite station, but it's obviously a three-pronged attack to make sure they take care of everything all at once. And then it seems Dwight told them that the "heavy artillery" is in that building Rick and Daryl are searching. But the guns don't seem to be there. I'll come back to that.  

I'm going to start by something said on The Talking Dead. I'll do a TTD post tomorrow because there was lots of good stuff in it this week, but I think this one comment is extremely relevant to understand the structure of the episode.  

They specifically asked Gimple what was up with the extreme closeups of each character at the beginning and ending of the episode. Gimple said it's because each of the characters it showed are going to go through a major arc. And while we did see them again at the end of the episode, those arcs definitely aren't over. Gimple confirmed we'd continue to see this motif as the system progresses. This is SUPER significant, especially where the 101 Days Without an Accident sign is concerned. But I'll come back to that. Promise.  

Aaron: 

Only two things to say about Aaron's arc here.  

1.    The obvious is that Eric was shot. Comic Book spoilers: Eric does die in the books during AOW. It’s possible they'll change it for the show (they do that sometimes) but I kind of doubt it. I think Eric's done. We'll have to wait and see. So this is going to be Aaron's major trial. 

2.    Major callbacks to 5x06, Consumed here. Aaron runs over three people with his car to try and save Eric. It LOOKED a whole lot like when Carol was hit in Consumed. Then, despite Aaron's efforts, Eric was shot anyway. Kinda like Beth? When it showed Aaron and Eric limping away, I was also reminded of Noah's limp in that episode, which was pronounced just before Carol was hit. Remember Daryl was helping him, which was why Carol walked out of the building alone.  

Not sure what to make of that, yet. Interested to see where it goes.  

Jesus and Tara: 

They're at the satellite station, and arguing over whether to let various saviors live or not. I actually think their tactical plan for going into the satellite station was super-cool. They had to spread out and enter three (I think; there were lots of 3s in this episode) doors at once. It was well-thought-out and coordinated. I only have two other notes for this arc: 

1.    They talked of Denise quite a bit. Just a callback and of course she had lots of parallels to Beth. 

2.    Dean. The guy in the closet who lied and tried to kill Jesus was named Dean. Remember this in 7x13? 

I tried to figure out why Dean was used both times. The only thing I can think of is that there was deception both times. In front of Dean's hardware was where Richard hid the melon and lied about it. It got Benjamin killed. Here, Dean lies about who he is and it nearly gets Jesus killed. Any other insights? 

Carol and Ezekiel: 

Their big thing for this episode was to track the Savior that got away. It's still unclear what exactly is going on here, but what we have so far is that Carol, Ezekiel and co went to the place that has the research building in it. They were trying to take out the dude stationed there so he couldn't warn the Saviors that they were coming from that way. He threw an explosive at them, which let out a horde of walkers, and ran away. This whole episode they track him while Carol and Ezekiel talk about Ezekiel's confident attitude.  

1.    They use an orange golf ball to mark their way, pointing the T in the way they went so that those who come after them can follow. I totally didn't realize it was a golf ball when I first watched it, but obvious callback to Still and the golf club. You could interpret that two ways. A) Beth. Obviously. B) Once again, Carzekiel paralleled with Bethyl = romance.  

2.    They come across a strange walker that suggests a mystery the writers haven't revealed to us yet. Jerry axes the walker and Ezekiel says, "what befell this creature?" I couldn't tell for sure but it looked like it had been burnt with bleach or acid. Carol said they didn't have time to figure it out, but obviously they'll be coming back to that later.  

3.    I loved Ezekiel's attitude. I see a lot of people online who are annoyed with how he talks, saying it's "over-the-top." And okay, it kind of is, but I love it. It feels over-the-top to us because we're sitting in our living rooms, watching TV. But his way of speaking gets his people all hyped up and keeps them positive. I think it's super-effective.

4.    Let's not overlook the fact that Ezekiel calls Carol, "Baby." "Fake it 'til you make it, Baby!" 

5.    And, you know, SHIVA!!! ;D 

 Morgan:  

Morgan's had some super-interesting TD stuff. Obviously Morgan is in a dark place, which we predicted after Benjamin's death last season.  

1.    He stared at the walkers behind the fence for WAY too long. That was kind of disturbing. Visually it looks a lot like when Gareth did this with the walkers in the school in 5a. That probably doesn’t bode well for Morgan.

2.    He kept having flashbacks to Rick's speech in the church in S6. I thought that was interesting, because Morgan himself is seeing it differently than before. At one point, he heard Rick say, "We can't leave them alive." Then Eastman's voice says, "Where there's life, there's possibility." Then Rick's voice says, "Of them hitting one of us!" And then Morgan almost kills Jared. It's like he's hearing the speech, but where before he saw it as flawed, now he's using it as a justification to kill everyone. (I gotta say, I wouldn't be sad if he took out douchebag uh Jared.) 

3.    He also tells Jesus, "We're supposed to," which is exactly what Rachel says to Cindy when she wants to shoot Tara and Cindy stops her. This is obviously a theme we're seeing. Not sure where it's going yet though.  

4.    Also, when Morgan steps into the light, it's painful for him. Another way to show what a dark place he's in.  

5.    This shot of Morgan walking away after waking up

reminded me of two others, both of which revolve around Beth. The first is Noah trapped under the shelf and Daryl walking away from him in Consumed. (We don’t get the exact same shot, but the setup is the same.) The second is in 5x09. It's Rick, Michonne and Noah running back to Ty after he was bitten. 

I don't know if these things are purposely paralleled or if someone just likes to do shots this way, but I’ve wondered before if this shot in 5x09 could have symbolized them leaving Beth behind. Given that Morgan just woke up after being left for dead, in my mind, this kind of proves that theory right.

6.    Finally, *drum roll please* DEATH FAKE OUT!!! Morgan, Freddy and Andy are all shot. They all go down together (rule of threes). But one of them survives. Notice how Morgan was left for dead, and even appeared dead for a time. Then his eyes suddenly open. Where have we seen THAT before? 

Andy and Freddy are interesting choices. I'm sad Andy died. Remember that Freddy was the dude in S6 who saw Abraham coming toward him and suddenly thought he saw his dead wife standing in front of him. Just kind of interesting.  

Morgan's in a dark place and I wonder if his arc that's begun here will resolve his PTSD for good, or perhaps lead to his death. He said, "I don't die," and so far, that much is true.  

Rick:  

Rick is looking for guns here, which he did a lot last season as well. I'll talk about that more in my titles meta.  

1.    It gives us a closeup of the note Dwight gave them, which is super interesting. The place they're in is SHEPHERD office plaza. It talks about guns being on the 4th floor, and then Rick and Daryl climb up an elevator shaft. You gonna tell me that having "Shepherd" and "elevator" on the same note is a coincidence. Yeah, really not. There are also tons of Xs on this note.  

2.    I also notice that RIck tells Daryl that if he finds the guns, he should go to the window and use the guns to help those in the courtyard right away. I'm not sure how far away this building is from the Sanctuary, but I was thinking that maybe Aaron's group is waiting for Rick and Daryl to find the guns and come help them. Not sure if I'm interpreting that right, but if that's the case, you can see that, without the guns (they don't seem to be there) this plan is gonna south super-fast now.  The other option may be that there are still guards in the courtyard that Rick and Daryl slipped by, but need to be taken out once they have the guns. That may be who Morales called.

3.    So we have Rick in the dark tunnel. I can't help but notice that the light is behind him. It's like he's walked out of the light and into the darkness of the tunnel. That's probably a foreshadow of his arc this season. Based on the red eyes in 8x01, he's probably heading for some emotional darkness, and the dark tunnel often has to do with death. Not good. 

4.    So just before trying to enter what turns out to be the baby's room, he peers into another room, and I'm really side-eyeing that room. The curtains are red and green, 

and it's a really happy room. Flowers on the bedspread, yellowish walls, candles.

Yeah, it could be the baby's father's room, but it feels pretty feminine to belong to a guy. Could be another child or a woman who's been staying there.  

5.    Rick fights the Savior who tries to keep him from entering the room. That man, it seems, is probably the baby's father. He tells Rick, "No guns." 

So here's the next question. We're dealing with one of three scenarios here.  

1. Dwight was telling the truth about guns being there, but Negan moved them before Rick and Daryl got there. I've been wondering if there will be a twist where Negan knew they were coming and has something up his sleeve and theeeve and they'll find themselves trapped. That could be. It would also suggest Negan is on to Dwight, which wouldn't bode well for him. But why would Negan leave two guys and a baby on the 4th floor if he knew Rick and Daryl were coming? Not sure this option rings true for me. 

2. Dwight lied about the guns. That would definitely be bad for TF, and a departure from Dwight in the comics. I actually could see that because, unlike the comics, I think they'll eventually kill Dwight, and they're really not making Daryl look for reasons to make good on his promise to kill him. Then again, we don't see any particular reason for Dwight to lie. He told them he wanted Negan gone and seemed sincere. Again, unless there's something that's happened (like Negan found Sherry or something) and they haven't told us yet, I don't see this being the case either. Though it's a possibility. 

3. I think the third option is the most intriguing. Maybe Dwight didn't lie about the guns. He truly thinks they're up there. But they aren't. That would suggest Negan is lying to even the other Saviors (including Dwight who's one of his most trusted) about what's in this building. I mean, what's he hiding up there that he would hide from his own people? 

The first thing that came to mind (all Beth theories aside) is that maybe this is Negan's baby. Maybe one of his wives got pregnant and this is his daughter. Still not sure why he would hide her this way, or what the hell Morales has to do with it. But it opens up some interesting possibilities.  

6. Key theory. At one point, Mara tells Todd to lock all the stairwells. Then, when Rick and Daryl try to use the stairs to explore the upper floors, they're locked. We just see Daryl trying to kick in the door and a clear shot of the lock. 

The next thing we see is them climbing up the elevator shaft. We must assume they couldn't get the door to the stairs open. They didn't have the key. This theme is continued because Rick didn't get into the baby's room until he took the key off the Savior. Just kind of interesting. 

7. Gracie, has a TON of interesting symbols around her. There's her name, which has religious connotations. "Grace of God." Then there's the mobile over her bed. I'm seeing a dog and a frog, both Beth symbols. And there's a stuffed rabbit in the crib beside her. 

That is part of the theme we've seen around Beth. We've seen baby rabbits/bunnies and baby carrots. Remember when Rick found a jar of baby carrots on one of the wolves while in the RV in 6x03 (you know, the beginning of Glenn's fake death?) I feel like we might be seeing the fulfilment of that symbolism here. 

7. Rick also sees a mirror. We could relate that to the mirror theory, but I also think it's a matter of looking at himself in the mirror and not liking what he sees, which will probably affect his mindset moving forward. I mean, he can't help but compare himself to this dude he just killed. He just offed a father trying to protect a daughter that simply MUST remind him of Judith. That's gonna be hard for him to deal with. 

8. Annd Morales! Check out MY POST FROM YESTERDAY about why Morales is great for TD. Other things I noted: We see a fishing pole and fishing nets in his room. And yes, the obvious reference is to Oceanside.

I also wonder if it’s another callback to S1. Remember in episode 1x02, Amy and Andrea (2 sisters, one of whom is the origin of Beth's scars) in a boat talking. I wonder if Gimple relied on that to build Beth's Oceanside arc at all. 

Directly after that, in Tell it to the Frogs, Rick and Daryl first meet. Morales plays a role in that first meeting. He's the one who "warns" Rick that Merle has a brother who won't be happy they left Merle behind. We have a lot of interesting elements coming into play here. Two sisters on a boat on the water, the episode where Morales kind of facilitates Rick and Daryl's first meeting, and Merle, who was left behind (which Daryl kind of went ape shit about) and presumed dead, but popped up alive and well several seasons later. Meanwhile, we now have Rick, Daryl, and Morales in the same building, with all these interesting Beth symbols hanging out around them. 

9. Finally, there's also a mirror in Morales' room. A lot of people are wondering why they brought Morales back as a bad guy. We don't know why in the plot; what he's been through that's led to him being a savior. But Gimple did hint at the arc in TTD. He said Rick isn't who he was in S1, and neither is Morales. I think they may be setting up a situation where Rick doesn't like what he sees in the mirror, and he'll see that Morales has become twisted and evil because of his experiences, and Rick doesn't want to end up like him. Remember that in the flash forward in 8x01, he said the line Siddiq said to Carl, "My mercy overcame my wrath." And that doesn't seem to be the case with Morales, so far as we've seen in this episode. 

Daryl's arc: 

Like Rick he climbed up an elevator shaft and the key thing was around him. 

1. @thegloriouscollectorlady also told me something interesting. She said she'd just re-watched Clear because we'd been discussing where Morgan's story line might be going this season. In this episode, Daryl mentioned that it made sense for them to keep the guns on the top floor because it was "Higher ground" and that's where he'd keep them. There's a LOT of talk in Clear and on Morgan's walls about "higher ground." Didn't TD always say those walls would reflect Beth's arc? We're really seeing all of this come together now. 

2. The other thing we saw with Daryl was him find what was obviously a cell used for someone else. The dog food was obviously a callback to his time at the Sanctuary and I’m sure reminded him of being a prisoner there. But here's the super-interesting thing. Daryl was never handcuffed in his cell at the Sanctuary. Here we have handcuffs attached to a bar and blood on them. That's a MAJOR callback to Merle in S1, not only being left behind, but cutting off his hand to escape. And once again, Merle disappeared when Daryl went back for him and showed up several seasons later. So we have all the stuff with Rick and Morales I mentioned earlier, and Daryl meanwhile getting reminders of Merle. Can't help but wonder who was actually being kept in that cell. Hmm. 

The other thing is that whoever was in those cuffs obvious got out of them. There’s blood, which suggests escape. The food left there may suggest it was sudden. There’s not a hand lying on the floor as there was with Merle, so it’s safe to assume the hand wasn’t cut off, but maybe just pulling the hand out of the cuffs drew blood. Either way, someone was left in those cuffs but improvised and managed to escape. Just like Merle.

So maybe Merle is alive and will show up any time. Hehe. Or maybe someone else who’s been heavily paralleled with him will. ;D

Other than that, not much happened with Daryl. He's one of the characters with the closeups, so he's entering a major arc or trial, as Gimple said. I just don't think we saw much of it here. The promos for next week do make it seem like that will be a Daryl-heavy episode. And remember that there was an 8 and a 3 behind him in the trunk in Still.

This is getting long, so I'll talk details and theme tomorrow. The day after that I'll do my TTD post. 

Let me close by saying this: I've had a lot of people express worry over the past few days who read spoilers and knew Morales was returning. They thought the 101 Days without an accident sign was significant for this episode and would mean something for Beth. Now it may not seem that way on the surface, but I think the meaning is there if you look. 

Gimple said the characters with the closeups would all "go through something" by the end of this. But these closeups didn't appear in episode 1. They appeared here. This is the beginning of those arcs. The 30 Days Without an Accident sign was seen in 4x01 which was the beginning of Beth's arc. Both were the beginning of something big and the fact that we can tie it back to Beth makes me think it's the beginning of events that will lead to Beth. 

It's very subtle, but then I think sometimes Gimple is subtler than even we give him credit for. So that's what I got for today. What did everyone else think?

[tysonthebitcher]

The time i got arrested in Florida

*Names have been changed When you picture getting arrested on spring break, you picture things like getting in a fight, having sex in public, getting too drunk, or better – all three. But this wasn't anything like that; the time I got arrested sums up my life. When I was 17, I got arrested on Spring Break in Florida. I don't even bring this up when people talk about getting arrested. It’s by no means a "bad ass" story. But when I do tell people I was arrested, they automatically want to know why.  This isn’t your cool and normal Spring Break “who outdrank who” story. This is a random and "uncool" arrest story. I don't even like to tell people. Honestly, I’m not sure why I’m telling you now…but fuck it In high school, I went on Spring Break with my friend, John. Because I was 17, it was one of those “high school” Spring Breaks. We’ve all been on these “all-inclusive vacations.” You know, the trips where you just go with your friend’s family because you are too broke, too irresponsible, and just slightly too underage for your parents to let you go anywhere by yourself. So this is the best you are going to get.  But hey, don’t let the details get in the way of the facts, you get to tell people you went somewhere. This was going to be the first time I was on my own: It was a huge deal for me. My parents always thought I was too "irresponsible" to go anywhere or do anything, let alone wipe my own ass, by myself.  I had gotten caught in a few minor fuck ups, but I was right at the tipping point where I was starting to gain their trust back and things could go one of two ways: I could be the son they’ve always wanted, or I could go with John and be a 17 year old on Spring Break.  It took a lot of convincing but, the choice was obvious. My parents ended up letting me go.I was going to be with John’s family…what could go wrong? . Well...actually a lot can go wrong. ​ When Spring Break rolled around, John, his parents, and I drove down to Navarre Beach, Florida. I had never even heard of the fuckin’ place, but it was Florida. How horrible can it be? Wrong. It’s more than slightly horrible. It might as well be located in Satan’s asshole, and renamed to Dante’s 10th Circle of Hell. Like all naïve high schoolers, we were expecting rivers of beer, and mountains of topless college chicks. Wrong again. Upon arrival, John and I instantly realize there is a reason we had never heard of this place. It is one of those near death retirement communities, where the only women you will see are wearing a one-piece and a foam golf visor. It was one of those quiet, dust-farter destinations for the old people who came to Florida for long walks on the beach, and to watch the sunset. Throughout the week, we did boring touristy shit with John’s parents, like visit museums and sight-see. I'll admit it wasn't bad. Then again, at this point in my life, shopping at a Walmart in a different state would have been fun for me. Prior to entering this hellish wasteland in sunny Florida, John and I got some irresponsibly awesome 21 year old to buy us liquor before we left. We hid the vodka in a couple of water bottles and smuggled it down with us. Even though the place sucked, we still were excited. Our standards were still low; getting drunk in someone's basement was still considered "new and fun.” Drinking in Florida was more than good enough for us. Throughout the week, we made sure to conserve and ration the gut-wrenching warm vodka. When nights rolled around, we took shots and wandered aimlessly around the deserted hellscape, looking for any sign of human life. The whole week we hadn’t seen anyone that hadn’t been born when Richard Nixon was still in office, but on the last night we were there, slightly buzzed on warm water bottle vodka, we went wandering desperate to do anything. That’s when the warm vodka Gods spoke to us. When we got down to the pool, there was a small glimpse of hope. We saw some kids our age, so we approached them and started talking. Turns out they were 15 and from Indiana too, and in the same situation as John and me.  There was our glimpse of hope: two girls, and a douche. The brother, the douche, and sister looked inbred. But their friend, Jennifer, caught our eye with her big melons. John and I were so desperate, we looked past inbred Jack and Jill so we could hang with this girl and her big cannons.  There wasn't really anything for us to do so we started walking around, bitching about this shitty paradise we were in. ​ John and I were content; we were kinda drunk, and since we were in high school, just walking next to a hot female got our penises hard. While we were walking, Jack was telling us about how they were playing ding dong ditch earlier.  That stuff stopped being fun for me in 4th grade, so I instantly knew these fucking kids were even lamer than John and me. Feeling nice, or drunk, or bored, maybe all three, I chalked it up as they were probably just bored like us. We continued to walk, and Jack started to play ding dong ditch again.  I felt like I was babysitting this giant pecker.  I felt like I was too cool to be hanging out with these incestual people, and for me to think that is a huge red flag. John and I laughed and went along with it. Fuck it, I even joined in a couple times. Here we were, playing ding dong ditch in fuckin’ Florida. Other teenagers our age were on Spring Break having sex and lasting a whole two minutes. Or getting limp wristed hand jobs.  Either way, I was envious. Instead we were ding dong ditching condos of old fossils who probably couldn't even hear it. Although lame, John and I were glad to be doing something. But then shit got weird. Like one of those "you had to be there moments". These things happen for some strange reason, and when they do, and you really don't what the fuck you were thinking. A string of bad luck happens, and it's almost like it was meant to be. At this point, we are acting like a bunch deranged toddlers who escaped Chuck E Cheese, laughing and acting like reckless buffoons. The more we laughed and fucked around, the more of that reckless teenage "fuck it" chemical got pumped into our little bird brains.  We gave no fucks and just wanted to have fun. It was almost like we took a back seat in our bodies while some crazed maniacs were manning the control stations. We continued watching Jack ding dong ditch until we got to the garbage room where you throw trash down the chute. For some fuckin’ reason, Jack opened the door to look inside.  He flings the door open, and in the process, breaks the garbage room door. The metal rod snapped right off the door, and fell in front of his guilty feet. We look at each other…then like most teenagers, we just start laughing. I don't know if it is a phase or what, but fucking stuff up was just fun in high school. I don't fuckin’ get it now. But it was. It seemed like everyday something got fucked with. If something could be broken, it was.  Luckily ,I don't think it was just me; teenagers just like fucking with shit when they’re bored. Teenagers are just shitty selfish individuals who don’t even think about consequences. It's almost like that part of the brain isn’t developed yet. If you didn’t go through that "break shit" phase, this whole story will leave you even more shocked. When the door broke, and we all start laughing like a pack of wild hyenas, Jack got egged on even more. The difference between a teenager and an adult, is the adult stops, and the teenager keeps fuckin’ going to make his friends laugh. Then out of nowhere, Jack hurls this metal rod off the 14th floor and it hits the ground. We laugh at his Olympic javelin throw , and start going to the other floors to break other garbage room doors as we now know how much fun this teenager pastime is... The harmless game of ding dong ditch quickly turned in a category five shit storm. We were on a vandalism rampage. We broke three or four more doors and tore down some paper signs. Shortly, the storm was over.  We decided to go walk around outside and cool off. We walked around for an hour and headed back to our condo. While walking back we run into this 20-year-old dick bag with roid rage, wearing a pink polo. He stopped us to tell us that the cops are coming because that metal rod that came sailing off the 14th-floor balcony, almost hit someone.  Also, turns out that throwing anything off a balcony is considered a felony. Who would have thought? This butt fuck in the pink polo pointed to the condo behind him, and asked if we knew anything. John and I play dumber than my parents were for letting me go on this trip. Meanwhile, the other 3 dumb fucks go on to explain to this guy that we weren't doing it in the building he pointed at but we were in another one.  Like that fuckin mattered?! The guy then starts flipping out talking about how the cops thought he might have done it and if he gets arrested "hes going to crack our skulls." We then saw the cop cars parked in front of the condo. We decided we best just get the fuck away from the whole situation – a real ding, dong, ditch. We decide we probably should head to the beach and lay low until the cops left. We waited at the beach for a good half hour. Continuing on with the night like nothing happened; we walked to the lone gas station by our condo. As we got to the gas station, we saw three cop cars leaving the condo and driving away. They drove past the gas station. Suddenly, all three cruisers pull a U-turn and head back our way. The worst part is, if we would have waited at the beach one more minute, we would have been in the clear from all the shit that was about to rain down on us. They stopped us and told us that someone told them to look for a "red-haired kid" and someone with a blue hoodie on. The red-haired kid was John, and Jack was the hoodie wearing bastard.  We had figured the skull crusher ratted on us. It didn't take a rocket scientist to realize we were fuckin’ guilty. One by one, they talked to us to hear our stories. They knew they had caught us with our pants around our ankles. They hit us with all that cop bullshit, which if you aren't familiar with, you might as well just put the handcuffs on yourself. They said they knew the truth and were trying to break us. They actually didn't have any evidence, so if we would have just denied everything we could have walked away again. But we didn’t have a consistent story so we got fucked – and not in the envious limp wrist handjob type of way. After the brutal bloodbath,the cops told us to get in the car and we headed back to the condo, while they continued to mentally butt fuck us even more. We were grade A fucked, there was no getting out of this one. When we get to the condo there was a fuckin’ platoon of cops waiting. You would have thought we were clubbing puppies and not breaking door hinges. We get to the police circle jerk and notice there is a different group of kids in trouble too. We then found out they were skinny dipping when the cops came to investigate the garbage door massacre of the 14th floor. They saw them and arrested them. Lady Luck must have been sucking dick somewhere in a corner, because she wasn't with any of us that night. The cops continued questioning us and Jack started lying, saying I was the mastermind behind this circus show. It was every man for themselves at this point. I wasn't going to jail for that inbred fuck. I would have been home free again, but John "did the right thing" and told them I broke a door too. He really just wanted to save his own ass because he was going to be joining the Air Force – what a dick, but hey John, thanks for protecting our country. Jack and I got blamed for the doors, and Jill got charged because she ripped off the paper signs in the elevator.  John really should have been there with us, because he ripped some paper signs too, but I didn't want to ruin his chance at the Air force.  The only innocent one was Jennifer. I thought committing acts of vandalism was the best way into her pants, but she wasn't impressed. It was now 3 am, and the cop said she had to call my parents since I was a minor.  The cop put the call on speaker phone and called my house   A call from the cops is the last thing any parent fucking wants, let alone at 3 am during Spring Break. My dad picked up the phone half asleep and heard, "Hi Sir, this is Sergeant Kelly from the Navarre Beach Police Department. I am calling to inform you that your son is getting arrested."  There was a pause, where I could almost hear the brick my dad was shitting fall right out of his ass. They talked for a second, and then he did that white dad thing, where he thanked the officer and said he was glad I was at least safe. Glad I was safe? It probably would have been better if I was in a coma. The three of us on the freelance demolishing team, got corralled into the back of the cop car and made the 40-minute maiden voyage to my new home, jail. I was in and out of sleep most of the way there.  At one point, I woke up and the two cops were fuckin’ talking about Disney World. Here I am on the shittiest night of my life, and these guys were just calmly talking about visiting Disney World. Dicks. It wasn't really until I got to jail that it really hit me. There I was, in some random fuckin’ jail in buttfuckville, a thousand miles away from home. Everyone watches those cop shows and everyone tells themselves they are never going to jail. So, now being here, it felt surreal, and it was a total nightmare. They told me I was getting charged with "criminal mischief", and Jack with a felony for throwing the garbage room rod over the balcony. Jill got charged with "criminal mischief" for tearing paper signs off the wall…. I wish I could make this shit up. They took my belt and gave me some rubber slippers. I got processed and got my mug shot, and new Facebook profile picture taken, and thrown into a holding cell with Jack. If they hadn’t taken my belt, I most likely would have strangled him. Jack was acting like some big bad bad ass earlier. Now, he was laying on this concrete slab, bawling his eyes out and crying about how he wants his mommy. It's like I was in some stereotypical jail movie.   I was furious at that mosquito dick for getting me into all this, so I wasn't the most sympathetic to his river of tears drowning the cell. I told him to go cry on the ground so I could sleep on the concrete slab we called a bed. He continued his blubbering on the floor while I tried to get some sleep. When morning rolled around, John and his family came to pick me up. We were leaving that day, so the car was already packed up. We headed straight back from picking me up from Jail. You can only imagine how fuckin awkward the whole car ride was with John’s parents. Especially since John didn't get arrested, and this was really the first time I had met John's parents. They took me on vacation with them, and I get arrested. Apparently that’s frowned upon. The whole car ride I played back the whole situation and thought of all the things I could have done differently. We pulled into my driveway, and my dad was standing there.  He told me to go to my room, while he talked to John's dad. My dad came up later, and was surprisingly calm. Which made me more scared. I was wishing he would have yelled at me, so I could yell back. But instead, he took the other road. He was "disappointed" in me which made me feel even worse. To no surprise, I was grounded. This wasn’t my first rodeo, I knew the routine. I had just got ungrounded, and there I was grounded again. This time around, I was grounded for six months, and I had to pay $3,000  for a lawyer in Florida. Luckily, my lawyer was able to get the charges dropped. Worst part of the night? I didn't even get to see Jennifer's titties; all I got was an "I got arrested for breaking a garbage room door" story from Spring Break. At least Jack was a felon.                  

[twdmusicboxmystery]

7x13: Details

 Okay, just wanted to go over some details in the episode.

1. The number 5. We saw 5 Kingdom-ers at the beginning with the cantaloupe: Richard, Ezekiel, Jerry, and two others. Then when Carol kills walkers in the tree, she kills four with the sign and one more with a knife: 5 total. Probably pointing us back toward S5 for, you know, some odd reason. ;D

2. Candlelight Theme. We saw it with Carol at the beginning when she woke from her nightmare. After Benjamin dies, we see it with Morgan as well. Both are in psychological distress when we see this. Of course, there are Norman’s famous lines about Beth being the light in the dark tunnel for Daryl. Daryl was in serious psychological distress after the prison went down, and Beth helped him heal from that. This kind of lighting almost always signals serious emotional angst.

3. 63 on the wall again. @bluesandbeth told me that in issue 63 of the comic books, Michonne is thought to be dead…but then turns up alive. Hmmm.

4. I wondered if Nabila meant anything specific. It means “Noble or Excellent.” Another thing I didn’t mention on Monday was what she said about burning the garden down. She said the beautiful thing was that, “If you want, it can all grow back. ” They “get to come back,” but it’s always a choice. Carol was making a choice by staying alone in that cabin. She was in a self-imposed Purgatory and wasn’t progressing at all. Now she’s made the choice to move forward and become part of the world (the Kingdom) again. Same with Ezekiel choosing not to fight the Saviors.

5. Benjamin’s girlfriend. Benjamin talked about some girl who helped him with the picture, but wouldn’t tell Morgan anything else about her. A Nonny suggested maybe this was a way of paralleling Benjamin with Zack. He definitely does have a similar, boyish look to Zack. For me, it depends on whether we ever meet this girl or not. If we do, we’ll have to see what role she plays in the show. If not, she’s only symbolic. The thing is, this was more than just a minor detail. Morgan asked Benjamin about her at least twice. They really drew attention to this, so I’ll be interested to see where, if anywhere, it goes.

6. Jerry’s cobbler. Okay, small totally silly note here. I think the cobbler has come to symbolize something good. Maybe happiness, normalcy. We saw it with Carol in 7x02. Only a place like the Kingdom that’s well settled and has a decent food supply could reasonably expect to have or make cobbler. Anyway, Ezekiel told Jerry to leave the cobbler. Yeah, it was a funny–gotta love Jerry’s smile–but also kind of random. I wondered if it was a foreshadow that bad things were afoot. (Yes, that was an extremely lame pun. Someone else also pointed out to me that a “cobbler” is someone who makes shoes. So the cobbler could also be tied to the shoe/foot theory. Just throwing that out there. ;D)

7. The Kingdomers gave the Saviors their guns. We’ve seen this before, as Negan took all the guns from Alexandria. But this made me think of Noah giving up his gun and giving into Dawn at Grady. Not only did that result in disaster where Beth was concerned, but I do think it showed his weakness as a character and led to his death later on. (X) Here, Ezekiel and co give up their guns. Not long after, Benjamin is dead.

8. The Saviors said they were going to “teach them” just like the Claimers. Small detail, but Gavin said, “You have to learn the stakes, so we’re going to teach you.” This not only points us back toward S4 but shows that the “bad guys” in this season are being set up as parallels to earlier things we’ve seen.

9. We again saw the theme of the Saviors killing someone for what someone else did. I thought it was interesting because in this case, it wasn’t supposed to happen. Gavin was surprised when he turned around and Jarod had shot Benjamin. He was supposed to kill Richard, as Gavin originally said. This has become more than just something intentional on Negan’s part.

10. “It’s As or Fs, no Is.” “One, not more not less.” I was a little confused by this part. Assuming these are letter grades with A being the highest and F being “fail,” and I’m assuming I = Incomplete, then it makes sense in the dialogue. They’re saying the drops have to be all or nothing. But I was reminded of shirt Daryl wore at the Sanctuary. It had a red A with what looked like an I super-imposed over it, which doubled as a handle of sorts. Not sure if this is what they’re going for, or even what it all means, but it’s what I thought of.

11. Carol planted tomatoes. We’ve seen tomatoes a lot, especially around Morgan, and most recently at the Kingdom. The thing I noticed was that on this package, it says, “Boston pickling.” I thought it was a pickle reference. @bluesandbeth told me that this company most often does cucumbers, not tomatoes. This may even be an incorrect pairing–something they put together for the show. A double pickle reference and paired with the tomato reference. ***Update: I need to fix the above reference. I misunderstood the information sent to me. Boston Pickling isn't a company. It's a type of cucumber. Im looking into it further but just know for now that we can't find any evidence that there is any such thing as a Boston pickling tomato. That type of plant, from what we've seen, doesn't exist. Just wanted to clarify. Thanx for the correction @bluesandbeth! 💖***

12. Family Doctor sign in background. Lots of people have sent me doctor or ER signs that have been in the background. I guess I’m finally starting to pick them up on my own. This one was behind Morgan, specifically when he found the missing melon. You know, the one that was separated from the others and hidden? As though a doctor or medical institution may have had something to do with that?

13. “Benjamin, get your gun up.” Okay I’m gonna be a total TD geek about this. They called attention to this twice. Richard says it when they first stop at the road block, and then Morgan thinks about it again after Benjamin’s death. It’s what makes him realize that Richard was the culprit. Richard says it just as he secretly separates the hidden melon from the others. I couldn’t help but think of the fact that Dawn’s gun simply wasn’t “up” far enough to have shot Beth. So right when the melon was separated from the others, “Benjamin, get your gun up.” I’m probably really reaching. Meh. Whatevs. It’s what it made me think of.

14. Babies Crying - Richard mentions this several times when telling Morgan about the camp he used to be in. It made me think of episode 5x09 where we not only saw an emphasis on Judith crying from 7x01, but we also heard echoes of it all throughout the episode. Now we had an emphasis on it here.

15. Finally, @sparklepoodles pointed this out to me. It originates in 7x10, when Daryl keeps Richard putting his plan into action that would have gotten Carol killed. Not only did they foreshadow Richard’s death through dialogue. (Richard: I would die for the Kingdom. Daryl: Then why don’t you?) but look at this picture:

Tell me that’s not a foreshadow of Richard’s death and, more specifically, to Morgan strangling him. 

16. The bull rider picture. I wanted to do this one last because it’s the most intriguing to me. I don’t have a specific theory, but I just wanted to share some observations. This is important, not only because it’s exactly the kind of detail they like to hide symbolism but it was also emphasized in the quiz on TTD.

I had to research bull fighting and found that I knew very little about it. Basically, it’s all about a fighter (commonly called a matador) showing off his skill by killing a massive, angry bull. It’s a brutal sport and they do kill the bull by the end. Usually. In the first stage, the bull fighter observes the bull, looking for strengths and weaknesses, and takes steps to weaken it physically, often by stabbing it to cause injury and blood loss. In the second stage, more steps are taken to weaken the bull, including stabbing it with barbed sticks that will remain in order to weaken its strong neck and shoulder muscles. The killing, in which the matador must several the bull’s spinal cord, happens in stage 3. It’s very dangerous for the matador, of course, but almost always fatal for the bull. (There are some special cases where they might let the bull live, but that’s rare.)

I don’t see a whole lot of TD things in this symbol. I’m side-eyeing a few things, but overall, I think this is a very strong Morgan symbol. In fact, it’s probably a very negative sign for Morgan. Morgan is the matador. Benjamin, however, is not the bull. Richard is. How do I know that? Well, for one thing, Morgan didn’t kill Benjamin, but he had to use his strength and skill to kill Richard. Another thing I read? After the bull is finally killed, it’s body is dragged through the arena by a team of mules. Kinda like this:

And then there’s the fact that there is a blue prohibition sign (the circle with the line through it) over the entire picture, as if to warn that this would be a very bad thing for Morgan to do. To me, that just points to his downward spiral even more.

It did occur to me that the three stages of the bull fighting could represent Morgan’s bouts with sanity, but since he’s the matador, I’m not entirely sure that works.

And the things I’m side-eyeing? @bluesandbeth pointed out that how the bulls are killed isn’t so far off how walkers are killed in the show, which I think is a good point. You could, of course, relate this to Beth specifically because they didn’t stab her in the brain. (I had a Nonny point out that Morgan stabbed Richard in the brain despite an obvious head injury, which is a super-interesting observation - X).

The only other thing that caught my attention here is the red cape. It’s the traditional symbol of the matador, which is how you can tell (other than the bull) that this is a picture of a bull fighter. But I immediately went back to the red cape/poncho/whatever-it-was in Beth’s cell. 

I’m not sure how that would tie into this, unless it’s as anti-parallel. Morgan killed Richard, but he might have saved Beth.

And then there’s the fact that the prohibition sign on Morgan’s painting is GREEN. Just saying.

So anyway, like I said, no specific theory. Just observations.

That’s everything I had in my notes. Anyone pick up any other tidbits?

[twdmusicboxmystery]

7x13: Thoughts on Morgan and Carol’s Arcs

Good morning! Today I’m going to go over some stuff that jumped out at me about Carol and Morgan’s arcs. These aren’t necessarily TD things, though they’re often relevant to where the story is going and how they show foreshadowing and parallels. (Also I’ve been fighting a nasty head cold for two days. I’m much better today–thanks so much for all the well-wishes; you’re all so sweet!–but even to me this feels like it’s kinda all over the place. So please bear with me and just file this under ‘very random thoughts about character arcs.’ ;D)

I have more for Morgan, so let’s start with Carol. We see her having nightmares, which connects to Ty. This also parallels 6x12, where she woke up in the middle of the night at Alexandria. So we saw psychological distress from her in S6, which lead to her leaving TF. She’s definitely not past it yet. We’re seeing her still deal with it. I do also think the nightmare is supposed to be her realizing that something is off about what Daryl told her. 

There was a TON of foreshadowing in this episode, most of which was simply fulfilled by the end of the episode. When Morgan is teaching Ben’s younger brother, he says, “Wake it up, Kid.” Then the kid complains about the early hour. Morgan asks, “Do you want to go back to sleep?” to which the kid says, “No way.”

I mention this for Carol bc it feels very thematic. She was living in a dream world where everything was okay and Negan didn’t kill anyone. She “woke up” in this episode. It also occurred to me while watching this, the irony of Carol ridiculing Ezekiel and the Kingdom in 7x02. Remember she laughed saying, “These people…it’s play time.” But then she ends up cocooning herself in a fantasy world as well, blinding herself to the what’s happening in the real world. But finally, she’s awake.

The biggest thing about Carol’s arc in this episode are the callbacks to The Grove. I’ve said before that Benjamin is a lot like Mica. Here, he specifically asked her to teach him and she refused. Her adamant refusal made think her mind was on Lizzie and Mica and not wanting to put herself in that situation again.

When Carol shows up at the beginning to ask if everyone was really okay, Morgan doesn’t tell her the truth. He does say that if she wants to go to Alexandria, he’ll go with her. I think it’s interesting that at that point, he’s still trying to save her. He says, “You found what you wanted…Is it what you wanted?” Another theme, showing that Carol’s solution (hanging out by herself in the cabin) really isn’t the best and isn’t moving her forward at all.

When Ezekiel gave his speech, saying “It’s mere luck we are not all insane,” Benjamin responded that it wasn’t luck. The world does drive people mad, but Ezekiel had built them a new world. It reminded me of Mica saying, “Everything works out the way that it’s supposed to.”

Also, Morgan asks the younger brother if he wants to be like his big brother, to which he says, “Yeah.” Sibling, Lizzie/Mica vibes. Hopefully this kid doesn’t end up crazy like Lizzie. :/

Since Carol specifically refused to get close to Benjamin, I think she completely understands Morgan’s position when he shows up, tells her he killed Richard, and that he’s going to kill all the Saviors. It’s interesting to me that at that point, she tries to stop him. She asks where he’s going and he says, “Somewhere else.” This reminded me of what Carol said to Maggie in 6x13, right before they were both captured.

6x13:

Carol: Stay here.

Maggie: I’m going with you.

Carol: Damn it, Maggie.

Maggie: I have to.

Carol: What the hell are you doing here?

Maggie: What am I supposed to do?

Carol: You’re supposed to be someone else.

7x13:

Carol: Where are you going?

Morgan: I’m gonna kill them. Out there, one by one.

Carol: But where?

Morgan: Somewhere else.

Carol: Wait. Wait. Just wait. Wait. You can go…and not go.

I think that came to mind because I’ve never entirely understood what Carol meant by that in S6.

Then she says he can go but not go, which is a reflection of Ezekiel saying the same thing to Carol in The Well, 7x02. Both times, they seem to be referring to the cabin. Like they’re using it as a way to get out of their own heads and away from what’s happening, but not actually doing something rash yet.

I’m not sure what to make of the parallel conversations in 6x12 and 7x13, but I was thinking about something else while writing this. I’ve said several times that Carol being at the cabin is almost like doing penance. But it’s also a place where she’s definitely not moving forward or progressing in any way. Kinda like Grady being Purgatory. It also strikes me that there’s a graveyard inside the fence by the cabin. Almost like she’s living as or like the dead. Just there. Not moving forward. This little cabin represents a place holder for the character arc. Nothing significant will happen while they’re there. Carol leaving and going to the Kingdom is the first progress we’ve seen from her all season. I think Morgan will also have to leave the cabin before his arc progresses further.

When heading toward the Kingdom, the camera again focuses on the “one way” sign, which to me suggests Carol has found her path now. It’s kind of what I suggested last week when the sneak peek came out: Now that all this has happened, there’s really only one way things can possibly go.

Carol and Ezekiel: I said the two of them in the burnt out garden at the end mirrored Beth and Daryl at the moonshine shack. I wanted to expand on that a bit. When Carol talks to Ezekiel, she says, “I’ll be here now.” I thought that was super interesting. For a long time, we’ve only heard Carol say that she’s not here or refusing to be part of things. It’s also more evidence of her taking Michonne’s CB arc to be at Ezekiel’s side for the war.

Let’s move onto Morgan. More foreshadowing. When Richard talks with him, he says he knows Morgan is a good man, but the day is coming when he won’t be able to be that good anymore. That sounds a lot like the title of 7x01 (A Day Will Come When You Won’t Be) and it foreshadowed what would happen with Morgan later in the episode.

As Ben lays on Carol’s table bleeding out, he has a Beth Dialogue Parallel, but he also repeats what he and Morgan had talked about earlier, which I believe came from the Aikido book. “To injure an opponent is to injure yourself…” And this became really interesting because I think Benjamin probably meant either that the Saviors would cause more harm to themselves by having injured him, or else he was warning Morgan against retribution because it wouldn’t be worth the cost. But Morgan almost took this literally and took it upon himself to cause the harm to both Richard and the Saviors (he told Carol he was going to kill them all). Yeah, heavy stuff.

I forgot to mention yesterday, and this is definitely a TD detail, that Morgan came damn close to slitting his wrists. (Beth anyone?) And Gimple talked in TTD about how Morgan isn’t capable of committing suicide. It’s not in him. We saw that in Clear. It has to do with the whole Ibben theme, actually. (X) In that way, he’s a parallel with Beth. He’s contemplated suicide more than once, but can never actually do it.

Of course more foreshadowing came from Richard when he said they had to gain the Saviors’ trust and then they could take the all out. This really tied everything together. Again, Morgan took that very literally and killed Richard to gain the Saviors’ trust. Then he plans to take them all out. Richard follows that up with, “otherwise you might as well just kill yourself.” I don’t even think Richard meant to be harsh when he said that. He just means they might as well all be dead if they’re not going to fight because the Saviors will kill everyone eventually. But coupled with seeing Morgan put a knife to his wrist, there was a major suicide theme here. (And of course Richard essentially tried to commit suicide bc he thought by removing the melon, Gavin would kill him. His words to Morgan in that first scene were a goodbye and tying up of loose ends as, he thought, he was going to his death.)

Morgan, of course, calls Benjamin Duane, which was ridiculously sad. And the whole part where he buried Richard was super tragic too. It reminded me a lot of Daryl burying Denise.

Then he goes to see Carol and tell her about Glenn and Abraham. They said something really interesting about this part on TTD. They said he essentially went to say goodbye to Carol because he fully expects not to return from killing the Saviors.

There’s been a lot of talk about how Daryl returning to hug Carol was his way of saying goodbye to her. I don’t Daryl is suicidal or even as reckless as Morgan currently is, but in a similar way, he knows he could die in the fight against Negan and that’s okay with him. So we’re seeing parallels here. Many members of TF are descending into a deep darkness which they don’t expect to come out of.

Morgan stays at Carol’s cabin. Who knows how long he’ll stay there? But he’s turning his staff into a spear, which definitely suggests he still plans on doing violence.

So here’s the epiphany I had about Morgan while watching this episode. I said not long after 6x16 aired that they were repeating Morgan’s arc with Eastman, only in this case Carol was Morgan (wanting to die) and Morgan was Eastman (trying to help her). And I stand by that. As of 6x16, that was definitely true. However, things started changing as early as 7x02. Carol was not at all receptive to Morgan’s help. She shut him down at every turn, and he finally let her go, even leading her to the cabin. I always assumed that one of the reasons he stayed at the Kingdom rather than returning to Alexandria was to be close to her in case she needed him. Even in the beginning of this episode, he was still trying very hard to help her.

But the thing is that Morgan is probably not the one who will heal Carol. As I’ve said before, Ezekiel will. It will be part of the build up of their relationship. So where does that leave Morgan?

For the first time, in this episode I’m seeing him as a tragic hero. (Yes, I know I’ve used that term a lot lately, but let’s face it: it’s TWD. Every character is tragic at some point, right?)

There’s also the fool theme. Shakespearean fools always function as voices of reason. They’re the ones who use reason and logic to talk a character down off their ledge or show them how illogical their actions are. I think everyone in TWD has a voice of reason. Beth was definitely Daryl’s. She imparted wisdom, made him see the error of his ways, and helped him become the best version of himself. Michonne is definitely Rick’s voice of reason. She’s often the only one he’ll listen to. So who was Morgan’s voice of reason? It was Eastman. Eastman was the ONLY one who got through to Morgan.

And that’s a problem, because Morgan has retrogressed in this episode and needs Eastman again. But Morgan’s voice of reason is already dead. I couldn’t help but think that Morgan will just spiral now and die pretty quickly. It’s always possible that something will happen to restore his hope, but I sat and thought about what could possibly do that for him at this point. I mean, short of someone returning from the dead…

And when I thought that, I was honestly thinking someone like Duane or Morgan’s wife, which obviously won’t happen. But then there’s Beth. Honestly, because he doesn’t know or have a personal relationship with her, I don’t really see her return as being enough to restore Morgan’s hope. But then again, there are a lot of things pointing to him having found her at some point. So you never know. If she shows up, or anything more happened with them that we haven’t seen yet, it’s always possible that her returning will do wonders for him. I can see it going either way: him dying soon or Beth’s return giving him enough hope to keep going.

Morgan was never as adjusted as we thought. He was trying to be, and he managed it for a long time, but his sanity just came crashing down around him. I really think this ties into the change=survival/ brutality theory. Right or wrong, it’s almost always those who refuse to kill, defend themselves, or otherwise become stronger that die. Morgan hasn’t, but in a way, I almost think they’re saying he was kidding himself to think he could live in a world and not be willing to do violence to survive. And Morgan has done it, when pushed to the extreme, but he’s all but abandoned his pacifistic ways now. Very tragic.

Bottom line, what I said weeks ago in my Benjamin post (X) has pretty much happened here. Benjamin’s death brought Ezekiel into the war. I think Carzekiel will bond over the loss of their “children.” I didn’t see Morgan’s regression coming. It’s really tragic. Just so much sadness in this episode.

Okay, I think those are all of my thoughts for Carol and Morgan. Anyone else?