#or counterpoint they’re too similar to recognize that the other is in a bad situation so its just like “huh that’s annoying” over crazy shit

[transmasccofee]

Hc that saiki and teruhashi take turns screaming “thats not normal, please get help” into the others face whenever they say something about their life

[the-nysh]

Hey! I just wanted to say that I love your writings and character analysis! :D. Do you have more examples of garou being an empath?

Oh! 😳 Thank you, ah you probably saw some of those recent posts about it, yeah? :O Are you looking for more story examples or older posts previously written more in depth? Cause I think this one went into most detail before, but also oddly enough, I don’t think I’ve ever used that precise term (diagnosis?) for him either, hmm mainly because I’m no clinical expert he most often practices avoidance - both with his feelings and in forming relationships with others, in favor of focusing on his goals instead. (Familiarly, he’s that lone wolf introvert who isolates himself out of having to deal with such socially difficult situations.)

So other than Tareo, we haven’t really seen him...allow himself many other opportunities to empathize or connect with others yet (even when he has the potential & capacity for it, which I feel Garou has some of what Bang lacks and needs most to improve his teaching method, in that regard). Also because whenever he finds himself caring too much (like about Bang, whom he still closely emulates, so you can interpret Garou’s ‘absorbency’ trait as a symbolic manifestation or another side to him being an empath, heh :P) he gets pissed at himself for feeling that way, cause it interferes with his goals and how he thinks he should act & behave instead. :’)) So here he is, getting pissed whenever he runs across or experiences injustice (compelling him to act on emotion, instinct, or gut intuition which he can hastily misjudge), but then also getting pissed at himself when he doesn’t fully understand why he’s upset, or when he feels it goes against his ‘image of a monster,’ only to forcefully push those feelings aside and once again avoid thinking about them any further. Ohh!!! lol someone help him always suffering a cycle at conflict with his own feelings...

But! Saying all that, I feel the first instance that closely represents this, as part of his origins to show he was always empathetic like this, comes from when he stood up for the other kid getting hurt by Tacchan:

“That’s dangerous; I feel sorry for him!” Getting upset for the other kid’s pain (already knowing this game’s behavior is wrong for the violence inflicted & injustice suffered) and instantly stepping in to break it up. (Driven to help out only for the other kids to turn on him as the next easy target...) 

This also ties into why he relates most to the fictional representations of monsters on tv; he sees himself in their shoes and sympathizes with their pain and situations too, so to speak. Not because they’re ‘evil bad guys’ per se, but rather cause they’re the unpopular ‘outcasts’ like him, who have dreams and aspirations to live too, but get unfairly targeted, outnumbered, humiliated, and crushed underfoot by.....the representations of those preaching ‘justice’ (like Tacchan above). When what Garou clearly sees, feels, and takes from this, is the unbalanced injustice suffered by those in these designated ‘monster/villain’ roles instead. (Counterpoint: these fictional roles he saw in cartoons, or reenacted in games, were not accurate to real monsters & heroes, but that’s Garou’s other struggle he comes to realize as he experiences more of the real world...) Another way of looking at it: when the favored/popular/strong group deems another marginalized group as ‘bad’ or undesirable, it absolves them of any guilt and their capacity & kindness to care, giving them the freedom to enact violence on them (ie bully the weak) without shame. For ex: ‘oh you’re a [insert any dehumanizing label here] monster? Prepare to be dogpiled and eliminated in the name of performative justice! :3′  I’m getting ahead of myself, but does this not ring a bell to anyone familiar with online cult movements? Which is precisely the unjust behavior Garou hates.

So another instance of him stepping in to inadvertently help a stranger in distress, as another victim to what he hates seeing (with the excuse ~they just happened to be in his way~) was when he stomps over to break up a fight between an old man and a rowdy drunk outside the dine n dash restaurant. He could have ignored it, walked on by, or gone to another place to eat, but nooo; seeing this behavior still pissed him off enough to intervene and deescalate the fight by scaring off the aggressor. 

With non-strangers, naturally we see most examples of Garou’s empathetic side with Tareo, cause Garou sees much of his bullied past-self in him, and he can’t help but care and react to his similarly felt distress even if Garou is very tsundere denying how much he cares; remember his ‘I didn’t come here to save you’ blatant lie line? Yeah; no one else made a beeline responding to Tareo’s cries for help, heh. 

(As covered in the other posts you’ve seen) he sensed and understood why Tareo was upset without him even having to fully explain it. Since he empathized enough with that familiar frustration (peers messing with him) to step in and help out with advice. Which was a gracefully ineloquent way with words, but hey he tried the gesture actually calmed Tareo down and got him to stop crying. :’)

Likewise, later witnessing Tareo suffering from the bullies pissed him off for reasons Garou can directly relate to (they were even calling Tareo a monster!) so once again, he’s compelled to step in, break it up, and deescalate the behavior.....then waltz down there to check in with how Tareo’s doing.

Offering another “I feel sorry for you.” :’) Which he plays off as more detached pity before he whoaaa, quickly turns around to leave with a ‘tch, go home’ once Tareo speaks. :’D (Like he can’t emotionally handle facing this, even turning his back when Tareo thanks him for helping him twice now since the shed scene.) But, we know there’s empathy felt for Tareo getting picked on, which drove Garou to act and intervene on his behalf here, BECAUSE..!!! Look what drives that evidence home:

Ohoho...probably one of his biggest telling moments! 8′D Recognizing what’s on Darkshine’s face now (while rendered overpowered & unable to fight back)...is the same he remembers relating to in Tareo, cause it’s similarly what he’s felt and suffered before in his past! :O Ahhh!! Making him go ‘oshit, wait...NO,’ as he realizes this is what he hates; ‘this isn’t what I want to do or who I want to be,’ and forcefully stops himself (he breaks up his own fight) before soon barreling over as the pain and consequences of everything finally catch up to him.

So...! Based on his track record, and provided he’s not off on his lonesome anymore or unable to interact/socialize with anyone in the near future, then he’s highly likely to add on more examples of such moments. Especially whenever he witnesses what he hates seeing (similar cycles of what he’s felt in his past, attuned to the same injustice suffered by others that he’s already experienced himself) that he can’t help but intervene & act on their behalf. Even when it gets emotionally overwhelming (for him to get upset with himself and want to avoid it as much as possible) or in direct contrast to the person (ie closed-off ‘monster’) he’s trying to be, ever at conflict with the inner empathetic kid he always was. :’)

[daresplaining]

So what's Matt's relationship with Stick like? It's clearly very complicated and I don't know what to make of it. Because Matt seems equally frustrated with Stick (telling Jessica, Luke, and Danny that Stick is very good at manipulating people), yet also clearly felt affection for the guy (given how he teared up when telling Foggy what happened).

    Yes, it’s… complicated.

    In the comics (as in the show), Stick enters Matt’s life during a period of turmoil. Matt has just lost his sight, and finds himself trapped in a new, torturous world that he doesn’t know how to deal with and can’t discuss with his father. His whole childhood was defined by confinement, with Jack’s well-meaning over-protection forcing him to sneak out on his own to indulge his restlessness nature. After his accident, Matt sees this one source of freedom closed off, seemingly forever. He feels powerless, frightened, angry, and alone.

Caption: “That night. In the gym. It used to be Matt’s favorite place– but now it’s filled with cries of frustration– tearful fury– and low sobs that speak of defeat. He can’t see. He can’t see. He’s useless.”

Daredevil: The Man Without Fear #1 by Frank Miller, John Romita, Jr., and Christie Scheele

    Stick saves him from this despair. He understands Matt on a fundamental level– something Matt has never experienced before. (He and Jack are very close, of course, but they don’t fully get each other.) They’re similar people– two big personalities capable of challenging each other, which is part of what makes their interactions so much fun. Stick offers Matt hope and– more importantly– power. With Stick’s help, Matt fashions something he saw only as a weakness into a new source of strength, and he rediscovers his own freedom and independence, which has become even more important to him since his blinding. And while his training is hard, and Stick is an unforgiving teacher, Matt is a stubborn, hard-headed thrill-seeker, and in between the frustration, pain, and occasional terror, he enjoys learning to fight and use his powers. While Jack cares for Matt in mundane ways, Stick understands his need for freedom, adventure, and empowerment, and encourages behavior that his dad would never, ever allow.  

    (Pictured below: Jack Murdock nightmare fuel.)

Caption: “The nights are the best. When Matt wakes before dawn– and, as always, Stick is there– and they dance, unseen…”

Daredevil: The Man Without Fear #1 by Frank Miller, John Romita, Jr., and Christie Scheele

Caption: “He remembers feeling alive– in a way he never had before. The city was alive, too: he could hear every night-sigh, every bellow of rage, every desperate cry of hope. Catch the scent of an insomniac’s three A.M. cigarette. Of pooling blood. Of shedding tears. All of it– the pain and the joy, the terrors and the triumphs– washing over him as he sucked in his breath, made the leap… captured the night in the palm of his hand. But no matter how high he leaped, how far he went, his teacher pushed him higher, farther.”

Daredevil vol. 1 #349 by J.M. DeMatteis, Cary Nord, and Christie Scheele

Matt: “Stick! I made it, Stick! That was awesome! Right? It’s like I was flying! Whaddaya got t’say to that, old man? Huh?”

Daredevil vol. 3 #25 by Mark Waid, Chris Samnee, and Javier Rodriguez

    (Stick calls Matt “punk”, Matt calls Stick “old man”. Aren’t they great?)

    Matt knows that, essentially, he owes his life to Stick, and their team-ups when Matt is an adult reveal a functional working relationship and sense of mutual trust.

Matt: “Hallucinated, just as I was taking that last shot. Relived a promise to my father that I made as a child. That promise made my childhood a misery, Stick. The neighborhood ridiculed me horribly, made me so angry…”

Stick: “All the things that’ve made you feel that way… they’re obstacles in yer mind, keepin’ it from workin’ right […]. You gotta dig deeper now, Matt. You gotta face the enemies in yer head. An’ they’re just as real to you as if they was flesh and blood. They can kill you. Scared?”

Matt: “No.”

Daredevil vol. 1 #177 by Frank Miller, Klaus Janson, and Glynis Wein

    But Matt also resents him, to a certain degree. While “I hated that man. But he taught me well” (from DD vol. 3 #25, excerpted above) feels like an oversimplification, it speaks to Matt’s conflicting feelings regarding his teacher. The main comic doesn’t show us their initial falling-out, so we have to assume it’s the same as what happens in the Man Without Fear mini-series– which isn’t entirely within the regular continuity, but exists alongside it and often informs it. (You’ll notice we’re referencing it a lot in this post.) In MWF, Matt’s training ends when Stick deems him too volatile and emotional, as evidenced by his all-encompassing relationship with Elektra and his violent treatment of the people who killed his father. (The actual degree of violence in Matt’s revenge quest varies between MWF and the normal continuity… but in both cases he goes out and attacks people for emotional reasons, so we can assume Stick’s response is the same.)

Matt: “Stick– what–”

Stick: “Shut up and listen. That girl is poison. She’s on her way to the worst side and she’ll drag you down with her. It’s bad enough you failed me. I won’t have you joining the enemy. I’ll kill you first.”

Daredevil: The Man Without Fear #3 by Frank Miller, John Romita, Jr., and Christie Scheele

    (We have major issues with the way Elektra is portrayed in Man Without Fear, but that’s a topic for another post.)  

    Being cast aside in this way would be enough to make anyone resentful. Stick is right– Matt is extremely emotional, which often impacts his judgement– but Matt also has a lot of pride, and rejection hurts. His reunion with Stick as an adult is short, as Stick ends up sacrificing his life to protect Matt, Natasha (Black Widow), and Stone shortly thereafter. But he lingers on as a kind of sentient ghost, haunting both Matt and Elektra and offering up advice, for a long while afterward– which allows their relationship further exploration. Mostly, we’d characterize Matt’s attitude toward him as grudging respect and admiration. Matt would never choose to hang out with Stick, he recognizes that he’s a massive jerk (takes one to know one, right?), and he is fine with not having been chosen to join Stick’s super secret boy band. But he’s also willing to go to Stick for help when he needs it, and to trust in his advice… and as we said, he is grateful for everything that Stick has given him.  

    The situation in the Netflix show is similar– with one vital alteration. The sting of Stick’s rejection is far sharper in this universe due to Matt’s young age (616 Matt and Stick didn’t cut off contact until Matt was in college), and the fact that he doesn’t encounter Stick until after his father’s death. By switching the order of events and removing Jack from the narrative early (we’re not huge fans of this choice, for the record), Stick’s significance in Matt’s life increases. In the comics, Stick is a mentor and parental figure, sure– a kind of counterpoint to Jack– but in the show he is Matt’s only parental figure (that he knows of, anyway). When he has lost the one person he had in his life, Stick appears. And Matt clings to him all the more tightly because of it. 616 Matt would never have made Stick a dang bracelet. That wasn’t the nature of their relationship because that warm, fuzzy parental role was still filled by Jack. But Netflix Matt needs someone to hug him and take him to the park and tuck him in and do all the normal caregiver things… and that’s not what Stick is there for. He doesn’t want to get attached to Matt the way he grew attached to Elektra, and he certainly doesn’t want Matt getting attached to him.

    Reaching out for that kind of love and being rejected, losing another father, is a terrible experience for young Matt. Thus, his resentment of Stick is far more powerful in this universe– but so is his emotional attachment. After they get their initial, obligatory name-calling out of the way, Matt is friendly to his mentor when he first reappears. The discovery of the bracelet among Stick’s belongings clearly hits Matt like a truck, showing that on some level, he still cares that Stick might think of him as a son.

    And while he doesn’t have much time to mourn, he cries when he realizes that Elektra has killed Stick.

    (This moment, by the way, is probably multi-faceted grief. He is upset that Elektra killed someone, he is upset that she had the capacity to kill Stick (who is her father figure too), and he is upset that Stick is dead. It’s just a depressing situation on all levels.)

    This underlying attachment– which, evidence suggests, is mutual, and part of the reason Stick broke off contact in the first place– clashes with Matt’s anger and resentment, and the manipulation that becomes apparent throughout both seasons of Daredevil and The Defenders. On the surface, Netflix Matt hates Stick and his lying and scheming and emotional abuse. But underneath… it’s complicated.