#miri maz durr

[moonflower91]

To be completely honest

I would’ve done what Miri Maz Durr did if I were her.

You have the chance to destroy a mans budding dynasty. This man conquered your village and his men thought it was their right to rape you, and his wife thought making you her slave, was her saving you.

Then you get the chance to destroy him, his wife and his legacy.

I would’ve taken it, if I were Mirri Maz Durr.

[ruffiorocks]

I don't think Daenerys has gone mad, she made a choice, and it was the wrong choice. (Long post)

Disclaimer: I'm a woman and a historian so please don't start throwing 'sexism' and 'jon is only better because he has a d**k' statements at me.

Soo I dont think Dany has gone mad. I think she has PTSD and she made a choice out of anger and desperation.

Let's go back to the beginning, Viserys told Dany from day one that the Targaryens belonged on the throne and it was stolen from them. She grew up with that mentality but she never seemed all the bothered by it. She pretty much knew even if Viserys was given an army he would probably fail. Dany was happy in her life as Khaleesi, it was only after she watched her brother die and Drogo said he would take the seven kingdoms for her than she seemed to think she should be queen.

Dany got a taste for power as Khaleesi and was pissed when she couldn't have everything she wanted. She wanted to claim all the slaves as her own but that wasn't the Dothraki way, even Jorah told her that but she wasnt having it making her very unpopular with the Dothraki.

She went against all the Dothraki believed in when she had magic used on Drogo. Once she really messed him up she lost the great khalessar and any respect she may have had. She was tolerated because she was Drogos wife. Only the women, children and lame stayed behind with her.

Once she gave 'birth' to her dragons she started to be seen almost like a goddess. Everyone kneeled to her even Jorah. She started to show signs that fire was now her answer to dealing with people she doesn't like. Remember Miri Maz Durr who was supposed to save Drogo? She had her burned alive because Dany thought she owed her her life. Dany thought she was a hero and should be treated like one, but remember Miri Maz Durr's words to her:

"Saved me? Three of those riders had already raped me before you saved me, girl. I saw my god's house burn, there where I had healed men and women beyond counting. In the streets I saw piles of heads... the head of the baker who makes my bread, the head a young boy that I had cured of fever just three moons past. So... tell me again exactly what it was that you saved?"

Miri Maz was traumatized and her world ended, she told Dany that a life had to be taken for Drogo's, Dany just wanted what she wanted and unfortunately it was her son's life that was taken. Her solution? She burned Miri Maz on a funeral pyre. Miri Maz lost everything and took revenge, Dany lost a lot and did what? She massacred an entire city of Innocent people. By Danys own logic she should be burned to.

Then what? Dany went and started to free slaves, great! But she used fire to deal with her enemies again. I'm not pro slavery, but the slave traders weren't Danys enemies, she decided to turn up then burn and crucify them all. She took it upon herself to decide how those cities should be run when she had no place there at all. Then she got all the Unsullied who decided to stay with her, which makes sense because she freed them, same with the other slaves. Once again Dany was hailed as a Goddess 'Mysa!' 'Mother of Dragons' 'Breaker of chains' 'the unburned' and all that Jazz. All that praise? Goes to a persons head.

Dany would liberate these cities and then she would leave them in chaos. Dany might be good at liberating people who had no say in their lives and wouldn't embrace the first person to treat them as people, but she sucks as governing.

Dany said she was going to break the wheel rather than stop the wheel. She hadn't even seen the bloody wheel in Westeros. All she had was stories. Dany believed she belonged on the throne just because of her name.

Tyrion? Varys? They chose Dany because at the time they thought she might be the best answer and they hadn't seen her more murderous tendencies. Plus anyone has to be better than Cersei on the throne right? And no one knew about Jon.

When Dany finally got to Westeros she said she always thought it would feel like a home coming, but it wasnt. Why? Because it's not Danys home, she doesn't belong there. She immediately expected everyone in Westeros to bend the knee to her purely because she finally decided to show up and demand the throne. No one knew who she was, no one had ever seen her before.

Dany was used to being in a Khalessar or 'ruling' over a city. Dany has no experience in fuedalism. She demanded Jon bend the knew and said he was in open rebellion against her. Open rebellion against a woman who claims the crown but hasnt actually done anything to get it? Open rebellion against a woman he and the North have never even seen or knew anything about other than she has dragons?

People say Dany saved everyone's arses from the white walkers. That's just not true. Dany claims to be Queen of the Seven kingdoms? Well then the problems of those kingdoms become hers. If Dany had left Jon to deal with the white walkers then yeah he probably would have been killed along with everyone else. But then Dany would have had a white walker problem to deal with on her own. The walkers and the Night King would have destroyed the North and headed South killing everyone in their path while Dany sat at Dragon Stone waiting for people to bend the knee. There wouldn't have been anyone left to do that and the Night King would have destroyed her armies and then her. So no, Dany helped with an issue that according to her own claims became her own.

Dany is foolish to, when she meets Jon she hardly believes that white walkers are even a thing. In the same scene she then tell Jon about how no one believed Dragons would exist again but there they were. So she believes that she's great enough to bring back dragons but the very idea that White Walkers are a thing is beyond her comprehension? This woman has seen magic and visions!

Dany also told Jon it was her destiny to be Queen of the seven kingdoms. Well that's just nonsense and something she's just convinced herself to be true because she wasnt born to be queen. She had two older brothers and an elder nephew and niece, add Jon to the mix and Dany would never have been destined to be queen.

Dany and Sansa didn't get on because Sansa wasn't taken in by Dany like many others have been. Sansa isn't dazzled by titles or dragons. While Dany and Jon were busy squabbling over who should rule Sansa was busy making sure her people had enough food and leather in their armour to keep them warm. Sansa had no interest in the North giving up their autonomy to a woman they had never seen before. Jon had no right to give the North to Dany, he was elected king, that doesn't make him an absolute monarch.

Dany asked for Jon's advice and he told her not to go burning people because 'she wouldn't be different, she would be more or the same". She then Immediately goes and burns the Lannister army without giving them a chance to surrender. She let's a few live, and demands they bend the knee or they die. Thats not really a choice at all, it's dictatorship. Even Tyrion tries to talk her out of that, he knows how Westeros works and Dany doesn't. She then burned Lord Tarly and his son. She won't have the love of those people, she can't demand their love and she can't gain it the same way she did in Merreen. The people of Westeros aren't slaves, they dont want her or need her.

After they won the battle for Winterfell Dany was seen to be on the outside looking in at the feast. She helped save the day, but she doesn't know anyone in the North. The Northerners celebrate with family and friends. Jon and Sansa and the wildlings all drink together, Tyrion is drinking with Jaime and Brienne. Dany expects everyone to worship her because she had been treated like that for years so when it doesn't happen she feels put out. It's not Danys fault, it's just no one has ever put a check on her power until she arrived in the North. The Unsullied and the Dothraki aren't Danys 'friends' they worship and serve her.

Dany finds out Jon is a Targaryen and the true heir to the throne. She begs him not to tell anyone something she has no right to do. He tells his family though and of course it spreads. Sansa doesn't trust Dany and I dont blame her. Jon may not want to be king but he doesn't go around burning people to get respect. Jon already has it, he's a Northerner, he's the 'son' of an honorable Lord. He's was Lord Commander of the Nights Watch, he's been beyond the wall, he fought white walkers, he fought in the battle of the bastards. Jon was elected king in the North. Jon doesn't demand respect because he feels he's entitled to it. He even came back from the dead but he doesn't brag about it. He doesn't call himself 'Jon Snow, The King in the North, the Ressurected one". So yeah given the choice between the two I'd have chosen Jon to.

Varys realises he made the wrong choice, he serves the people and always has. He would place his bets on Jon rather than Dany given what he was seen and he dies for it.

Tyrion knows he's fucked up, Dany doesn't believe the people in Kings Landing are important at all. She's so focused on getting what she wants she doesn't stop to think about the very people she claims to be coming to save.

Dany lost a dragon saving Jon, she lost another one because she didn't have the foresight to check the bloody perimeter and her dragon was killed. She took her best friend and advisor who doesn't know how to fight to the battle and she was kidnapped and killed.

Dany then made the decision to 'kill them all' with fire even AFTER the city surrendered. She could have just flown to the Red Keep and killed Cersei who was standing on the balcony. Dany made a choice and it was the wrong one. Dany isn't mad, she's traumatized and she's realised she would NEVER have the love and respect of the people of Westeros. She has done nothing to earn it, nothing that anyone else hasnt done. She has shown the people that if you say no to her she will burn you to a crisp. She's tried so hard not to be her father but ironically that's exactly what she's become. She said she hadn't come to be the queen of fire and Ash but that's exactly what she's done.

Dany has no head for strategy or ruling. She believes she's there to free people but the fact is Westeros isn't Mereen. The people of Westeros aren't slaves , they don't need their Lords killed. Dany wants to be the savior of a country that doesn't need or want her to save them.

Dany doesn't realise that soldiers of Westeros aren't like the Dothraki or the Unsullied. They don't all fight because they believe in the cause. The soldiers live under the lesser Lords who are the bannermen to the higher Lord who then swear allegiance to the monarch. Those soldiers and Innocents she burned all died pointlessly. She burns the majority then give the fraction of survivers a choice?

Look at all the other kings in Westeros, none of them acted like Dany does save for maybe Joffrey and we all know how that ended. Joffrey at least didn't believe himself to be absolute, he was put in his place by Tywin. The other kings? Robert? He was loved , Renly was loved, Stannis was respected, Robb was loved, Tommen was tolerated but didn't really do anything, but Margery was loved.

In conclusion Dany had good intentions when she started out but she was praised so much it went to her head and she started acting like that was her due. She broke chains and freed slaves and seemed to think that's what Westeros needed. She doesn't know how to rule, she's impatient and doesnt like listening to advice. She demands respect and expects to be obeyed by people she has never met before. She acts like her father even though she claims he was an 'evil man'. Remember when she apologized to Jon on behalf of her house because of what happened to his grandfather and uncle? Who is going to apologise to the people of Kings Landing? How is Dany not an 'evil woman'? Dany did exactly the same thing that made Jaime stab her father in the back. Dany knows what she did was evil.

There is no coming back from what she has done. If there was even a chance for her to at least gain the people's respect if not love she just lost it. She will forever be on everyone's hit list now. Dany has become everything she spent years fighting against.

I think what needs to happen is Drogon needs to die. Dany will always be protected while he is there. Drogon needs to be taken out then Dany.

[nightqueendany]

I thought I'd come to you with this. It's about the HOTU and the 'Dragon has three heads' prophecies Dany gets. "three fires must you light: one for life and one for death and one to love… three mounts must you ride: one to bed and one to dread and one to love… three treasons will you know: once for blood and once for gold and once for love… daughter of death, slayer of lies, bride of fire…" I'd love to hear your opinion of it.

This one is so much fun to interpret because there are honestly so many different ways to look at it, but of course, I have some theories. 

… mother of dragons … child of three … “Three?” She did not understand. … three heads has the dragon … the ghost chorus yammered inside her skull with never a lip moving, never a breath stirring the still blue air. … mother of dragons … child of storm … The whispers became a swirling song. … three fires must you light … one for life and one for death and one to love … Her own heart was beating in unison to the one that floated before her, blue and corrupt … three mounts must you ride … one to bed and one to dread and one to love … The voices were growing louder, she realized, and it seemed her heart was slowing, and even her breath. … three treasons will you know … once for blood and once for gold and once for love …

Viserys screamed as the molten gold ran down his cheeks and filled his mouth. A tall lord with copper skin and silver-gold hair stood beneath the banner of a fiery stallion, a burning city behind him. Rubies flew like drops of blood from the chest of a dying prince, and he sank to his knees in the water and with his last breath murmured a woman’s name… . mother of dragons, daughter of death … Glowing like sunset, a red sword was raised in the hand of a blue-eyed king who cast no shadow. A cloth dragon swayed on poles amidst a cheering crowd. From a smoking tower, a great stone beast took wing, breathing shadow fire… . mother of dragons, slayer of lies … Her silver was trotting through the grass, to a darkling stream beneath a sea of stars. A corpse stood at the prow of a ship, eyes bright in his dead face, grey lips smiling sadly. A blue flower grew from a chink in a wall of ice, and filled the air with sweetness… . mother of dragons, bride of fire …

Let’s look at the second part first. This is the whole vision with the “threes” in it’s entirety and I think it can be broken into three parts:

Daughter of Death:

Viserys screamed as the molten gold ran down his cheeks and filled his mouth. A tall lord with copper skin and silver-gold hair stood beneath the banner of a fiery stallion, a burning city behind him. Rubies flew like drops of blood from the chest of a dying prince, and he sank to his knees in the water and with his last breath murmured a woman’s name… . mother of dragons, daughter of death …

Slayer of Lies:

Glowing like sunset, a red sword was raised in the hand of a blue-eyed king who cast no shadow. A cloth dragon swayed on poles amidst a cheering crowd. From a smoking tower, a great stone beast took wing, breathing shadow fire… . mother of dragons, slayer of lies … 

and Bride of Fire:

Her silver was trotting through the grass, to a darkling stream beneath a sea of stars. A corpse stood at the prow of a ship, eyes bright in his dead face, grey lips smiling sadly. A blue flower grew from a chink in a wall of ice, and filled the air with sweetness… . mother of dragons, bride of fire …

So Daenerys is given three titles by the warlocks: Daughter of Death, Slayer of Lies, and Bride of Fire. These are all things that Daenerys either already is or will become.

First let’s look at Daughter of Death. Like the vision as a whole, each section breaks into “threes” too:

Viserys screamed as the molten gold ran down his cheeks and filled his mouth.

A tall lord with copper skin and silver-gold hair stood beneath the banner of a fiery stallion, a burning city behind him.

Rubies flew like drops of blood from the chest of a dying prince, and he sank to his knees in the water and with his last breath murmured a woman’s name.

The first is Viserys being killed by Khal Drogo which is something Daenerys actually saw happen. The second is her son Rhaego as an adult had he lived as the Stallion Who Mounts the World. And the last is Rhaegar dying on the Trident whispering Lyanna’s name. 

With each of these deaths, Daenerys gains yet another title: When Viserys dies she becomes the Heir to the Iron Throne. When Rhaego dies, she becomes the Stallion Who Mounts the World. And when Rhaegar dies, she becomes The Prince Who Was Promised. Three deaths for Daenerys to get closer to her destiny.

Slayer of Lies:

(A) Glowing like sunset, a red sword was raised in the hand of a blue-eyed king who cast no shadow.

(B) A cloth dragon swayed on poles amidst a cheering crowd.

© From a smoking tower, a great stone beast took wing, breathing shadow fire.

The first, the blue-eyed king, is Stannis. The lie that Daenerys will slay is that Melisandre believes Stannis is the Prince Who Was Promised. That title belongs to her. The second, cloth dragons swaying is likely a vision of fAegon during his war to take “back” the Iron Throne. The lie Daenerys will slay is that fAegon is actually Rhaegar’s son and the Heir to the Iron Throne. That title also belongs to her. 

The third…I am honestly not sure about actually. This one has me and many other theorists stumped. BUT, because the other two lies have to do with her titles, this one may have to do with The Stallion Who Mounts the World. Some say it has to do with Jon Connington because he has greyscale turning to stone. It also, may have to do with Jon Snow somehow and the lie that Jon is Ned’s son. Jon was born in a tower, he is often described as a shadow. But…unlike the others, it’s not nearly as clear.

Bride of fire (my favorite):

(I) Her silver was trotting through the grass, to a darkling stream beneath a sea of stars.

(II) A corpse stood at the prow of a ship, eyes bright in his dead face, grey lips smiling sadly.

(III) A blue flower grew from a chink in a wall of ice, and filled the air with sweetness

Her silver trotting through the grass…the silver was Drogo’s bride-gift to Dany when they wed so this is a reference to him. The corpse on the prow of a ship…one of the Greyjoys. Euron or Victarion as both want to marry her. Now in the show, Euron wanted to marry Dany but Yara and Theon made it to Meereen first. Yara has kind of taken Victarion’s storyline so there’s no marriage but there is that alliance between Dany and the Iron Born. In the books, she and Victarion may very well marry briefly. And lastly…a blue flower in a Wall of Ice. This is our boy, Jon Snow. Blue flower is the winter rose which has always been associated with Lyanna (the crown Rhaegar gave her when he made her Queen of Love and Beauty was made of Winter Roses) and she’s Jon’s mother. And Jon is at the Wall “growing”, gaining more responsibility and power and eventually becoming Lord Commander. 

Before we get into the first part of the vision, let’s take a look at the organization of these. 

1, I. - Viserys killed by Drogo (Daughter of Death), Her silver given to her by Drogo (Bride of Fire). Both of those have to do with Drogo somehow but the only one that doesn’t fit is (A) Stannis as PTWP (Slayer of Lies).

3, III. - Rhaegar dying whispering Lyanna’s name - Jon’s parents (Daughter of Death), and Blue rose in Wall of Ice - Jon Snow (Bride of Fire). Again, both have to do with Jon and we’re not sure about © - Sone beast breathing shadow fire (Slayer of Lies)

The middle parts of each 2. Rhaego, B fAegon, II. Greyjoy, seemingly have nothing to do with each other. Anyone have clever theories for this?

How does this relate to the first part of the vision?

(I honestly have no idea!)

three fires must you light … one for life and one for death and one to love 

three mounts must you ride … one to bed and one to dread and one to love

three treasons will you know … once for blood and once for gold and once for love

We have Fires, Mounts, and Treasons.

But lets start with the Fires You Must Light:

One for life - hatching of the dragons. This event also slays the lie that Stannis is the Prince Who Was Promised because it is one of the requirements to be PTWP (waking dragons from stone, forging lightbringer) - which is also why I think the dragons ARE Lightbringer because Dany had to kill Drogo.

One for death - open for interpretation, no clue. Could be Dany burning the Khals in Vaes Dothrak. Could be Dany defeating the Night King or killing undead Viserion. Really no idea.

One TO Love (notice the difference in wording) - this is interesting because how do you love a fire? I think this may be her child with Jon. She is the Bride of Fire after all, she and Jon both being Targaryen, their child would be Targaryen.

Mounts You Must Ride:

One to bed - kind of up for interpretation because Dany has a few lovers - Drogo, Daario, Hizdar (in the books). But it’s likely Drogo because he takes her virginity.

One to dread - Most likely Drogon as he is compared to Balerion the Black Dread and he is Dany’s chosen Mount as the Stallion Who Mounts The World.

One to love - Most likely Jon as they’re together now and their relationship was not forced upon them (like her marriage to Drogo was) so it is pure love, not just them fucking. 

And lastly Treasons You Will Know:

Now, many people think these are treasons that people will commit against Dany but I am of the belief that these may be treasons Dany will commit herself.

Once for blood - (again many say Miri Maz Durr but) I think this is Viserys. He was her blood and she didn’t stop Drogo from killing him. Plus it is the first scene of her next set of visions for Daughter of Death.

Once for gold - up for interpretation. Could be when she tricked the masters of the Unsullied in Astapor. She didn’t gain gold but it was a transaction that she didn’t hold up her end of the bargain for. 

Once for love - up for interpretation also but I think this will be Jon dying a second time and Dany going against his wishes to have Melisandre or another red priest bring him back. 

So so far as organization, it seems the first part of each vision has to do with Drogo and the last part of each has to do with Jon. Each middle part of each vision seems to be it’s own thing.

But what does everyone else think??

Thanks so much for the ask! This was so much fun! 

[nightqueendany]

THIS IS FUCKING DISGUSTING.

The path to Dany being on the Iron Throne is paved in the blood of people she’s killed, as if that makes her a bad person.

As if everything she did in her story, along this path, was a bad thing. She birthed dragons? Boohoo she killed someone to do it so it’s bad. She freed slaves and broke chains? Boohoo she killed quite a few people to do it so it’s bad.

This is such BULLSHIT. Dany’s path was no more blood-soaked than anyone else’s and it was more altruistic than everyone’s paths combined!!!!

Im supposed to think Dany was in the wrong for all the people who died as she rose to power? I DON’T.

Miri Maz Durr killed an innocent unborn child. That’s a felony by today’s laws.

The slave masters were...SLAVERS. They killed and stole and mutilated innocent children.

Cersei and Jaime killed countless people and tried to murder a little boy to keep their affair secret.

I don’t feel sorry for any of those people!!! They deserved to die! Dany didn’t!

[teamkrissy]

It kind of bothers me that everyone is talking about the Miri Maz Durr prophecy reffering to Dany's infertility. That prophecy was a response to Dany's question anout when Drogo would he normal again. When her womb quickens again (which it does in the book universe, right before the end of the last book) her Khal will return to her as he was before. So basically, its a bullshit prophecy unless you can find some metaphorical loophole for Khal Drogo to return in her heart or something.

[that-angry-guy]

And the Great grass sea is going dry too. Could it be the Horn of Jaruman and the wall has to do something with Mountain part?

[moonflower91]

I just watched a video on YouTube talking about how bran warged drogon and bran burned kings landing and that's why they didn't show Dany's pov. This is the bittersweet ending that we thought Dany was mad but she won't be and it'll be revealed after Jon kills her and bran is king and wins the game of thrones. I think my iq dropped a couple of points.

Oh my goodness, no. Just no. 

This is what Daenerys has always been. Since season 1.

People were able to justify her killing Miri Maz Durr because they probably agreed, the woman should have been grateful that Daenerys stopped more blood riders from raping her and saved her life, only to kill Drogo and Rhaego. They justified her plundering Quarth because why not? Ducksause and Doreah betrayed her. They justified her tricking, burning and murdering the masters of Astapor because of the line of crucified slaves and the fact that the only Master Daenerys dealt with was a disgusting pile of garbage.

They justified her conquering the slave cities because they were slave masters who killed children. All the masters deserved it right?

Wrong. One of the men she randomly crucified was actually opposed to the crucifixion of children. 

This is probably the first time the audience really had to question the morality of Daenerys’ version of justice, and even then, fans denied that Daenerys was at fault and tried to turn it from a darker grey area to the gold standard of justice and righteousness. 

Then her dragon burned a 3 year old child alive. The father of that child had to sit in line, waiting as Missandei listed off her hundred ridiculous names purely to satisfy Daenerys’ own vanity. Some say she was devastated by the death of the child by one of her own “children” but no. She was more devastated because she had to lock away the two kids who remained. 

Then she burned the Dosh Khaleen and that was hailed as this beautiful powerful moment of female power. Cersei did it and she was called a crazy villain. 

People still try to make Daenerys out to be the hero of this story, when really, she never has been. She’s done good things in the past, but they never last. The slave cities are likely back to their old economy, and I hate to think of Meereen, led by that gross sell sword piece of garbage. 

TL;DR Daenerys is responsible for her own actions, weather she or her stans like it or not. She burned people alive who did not deserve it long before season 8, and has destroyed cultures and cities before.

They just don’t like finally seeing what’s always been there