#me *kicking down the door thinking about discourse we’ve already dropped awhile ago*; I HAVE SOME THOUGHTS

[jjkyaoi]

hi. i figured that while i’m on that crime boys grind, that i should. cracks knuckles. pop off with something that makes yall cry, so

i’ve been rewatching the wilbur tour stream with tommy recently, and there’s some things i noticed about what c!tommy had to say to his chat about getting wilbur stone that i haven’t seen people talk about much? and because i’m thinking about it —and, honestly because i’m sort of tired of the ppl misinterpreting how c!tommy feels about c!wilbur— i’m just gonna. does my silly little dance. use my big boy brain and talk abt it

“nonono, i know about the manipulation, i don’t *care!* cause he doesn’t think i can! ....which, obviously i can, so i’ve obviously proved that— but it’s not *about* that! i know he’s trying to manipulate me and it won’t *work.”*

so, here it’s obvious that c!tommy is struggling about how he feels about the interaction he’d just had. he seems to be slightly caught up in the fact that wilbur doesn’t think he can get the stone, and that’s something that he has to remind himself “isn’t the point”, but *also,* the fact that he later on says this;

“and he would be impressed with me, which, admittedly would feel nice, cause it’s—cause it’s nice... and it.. it doesn’t matter, though, but it—it *would* be nice.”

clearly, all the bad past experiences he’s had with wilbur has lead him to distrust the man— has lead him to view the man as somebody who “can’t be trusted” no matter what and somebody who “hasn’t changed since pogtopia”, especially considering later on he goes on to say this

“cause he’s gonna start another *thing.* and if he thinks l’manberg.. was just a way so he could get in....”

“oh no. i’m gonna have to— he’s gonna destroy the server, if he likes dream.”

clearly, wilbur’s earlier interactions— the things he said to him, whether they be true or untrue about l’manberg and dream has lead to tommy not trusting him even more— or, the words had such an affect on him/hurt him to the degree where it’s doubled down on the little trust he has for c!wilbur, and hearing wilbur openly admit that he likes c!dream, the man who’s been tormenting him to no end, puts him in tommy’s “enemies” category— makes him think that he’s gonna destroy the server and he’s gonna have to go against him, whether he likes it or doesn’t like it or whether it be true or it isn’t.

c!tommy is currently,,, conflicted on how he feels about c!wilbur, to say the least. we don’t know the interactions he had in limbo with wilbur, but it caused his view of the man to go from apprehensive to aggression. even saying *this* to ranboo and tubbo in the revival stream.

“do you think i liked wilbur? is that what this is about?”

and when ranboo goes on to say,

“*the* wilbur? like, your friend?”

tommy responds,

“we are not *fucking* friends, ranboo.”

beforehand, if tommy were to be told that, he wouldn’t have such a violent reaction— he wouldn’t have dismissed his ally ship with wilbur completely, wouldn’t have said that they weren’t friends entirely. tommy’s main motivation in the past was dedicated to wilbur— the *real* wilbur, so it’s confusing yet, if you think about it, there’s some reasons for why he could react so violently against c!wilbur.

going back to the limbo interactions. there’s like, what, some canon months worth of interactions we didn’t get to see in there? we only got to see *one* interaction out of months worth, but when c!tommy came back he didn’t seem— he didn’t act like the interactions were very pleasant. it’s off screen interactions so there’s plenty room for interpretation, but c!tommy has hinted, multiple times that whatever interactions he’d had with wilbur in there weren’t good, even to the point of begging c!dream to not revive wilbur, when beforehand the most he’d been about c!wilbur’s possible revival was nervous, even going so far as to say that he’d be his *friend* just so he doesn’t revive wilbur, and in the revival stream c!tommy was looking genuinely scared at the possibility of wilbur being back, going “you don’t understand, *wilbur’s back”* in a tone that, obviously couldn’t mean good things or isnt said in a pleasant way.

tldr. a part of tommy things wilbur is going to do something dangerous. this mistrust/believe is a combination of all the unresolved trauma he has from wilbur from the past, the off screen limbo interactions, and c!wilbur unintentionally adding fuel to the fire by saying that he believes his literal abuser is the hero and that he didn’t really care for l’manberg —which, i don’t believe is true - in the least, but regardless, isn’t a good thing to say to c!tommy— which is just a huge heap of garbage onto “the reasons why c!tommy doesn’t trust c!wilbur, the saga”.

however, this doesn’t mean i’m saying c!tommy thinks wilbur is completely irredeemable/thinks he’s the spawn of satan, either. he doesn’t trust him, yes, but there’s *care* there, like the tangent c!tommy went on about how it would be nice for c!wilbur to be impressed with him for getting stone/possibly praise him; he still searches ofter the man’s reassurance praise and, probably always will, because c!wilbur had sort of always been a guidance figure for tommy for so long. c!tommy currently doesn’t trust wilbur, but there’s also a part of him for yearns for the man’s praise and his attention, which is the reason why he got the stone so quickly, though he furiously said that “wasn’t the point”.

and also, c!tommy’s entire monologue about “not giving up on people” to foolish, to which he said that c!wilbur wanted people to see him as the villain, iirc, which is. Interesting. to me, because it’s clear that he still hasn’t gotten completely rid of the “c!wilbur is the villain” mentality in his mind, but from that sentence alone he’s trying to understand c!wilbur more, and also his whole speech about how “if you care about somebody, don’t give up on them”. c!tommy’s feelings on wilbur currently are complicated, but he’s always been willing to follow him to the ends of the earth— he’s always trusted and loved that man with his entire heart, so that basically means that, yea, he still might think c!wilbur is a bad guy and not entirely trust him, but he also isn’t going to give up on him. and he’d said he “didn’t have it in him to save the server before” so it makes me think that 👁️ maybe he’ll just try to convince c!wilbur to the “good side”? thinks he doesn’t think he’s on the good side?? perhaps??

i don’t know. i’m just thinking about them. c!crime boys make me so very Emotional there’s so much - to them and i just ,,,, hold it gently. c!crime boys how do u manage to be one of the most bittersweet dynamics on this server