#lady lyonesse

[cesarescabinet]

For @caer-gai's Arthuriana August! Prompt 5: Lady of the Hour

Used this prompt to jot down some character designs and to experiment in style a bit, so you get the Orkney Wives this time around! Between their husbands and their in-laws, I imagine them being quite the support group for each other.

(L-R: Ragnelle, Lynette, Lyonesse, Laurel, and Cwyllog)

[queer-ragnelle]

The whole marriage thing between everyone in Book of Gaheris is a disaster. I have no words for it.

Misogyny.

I’m not saying the characters shouldn’t be flawed. But the author Kari Sperring has Gaheris apologizing profusely all the time to everyone except his wife. It doesn’t feel like Sperring is writing a flawed character with intention, rather it’s just internalized misogyny about how women are treated seeping into the story. Guinevere was narratively okay, but she openly dislikes Morgause and does next to nothing to defend Laurel or the others when they’re wronged. She talked to Arthur about Gaheris cheating, and then Arthur talked to Gaheris, and then he pokes the bear until Luned [Lynette] gets irritated and gives up. Nothing comes of it. She didn’t even get dialogue to express in her own words how she felt about her husband’s infidelity. So Guinevere feels part of the “in” group with the men by turning on the others and nobody else has agency. That’s how it read to me anyway.

With that said, here’s some great Orkney Wives content! (Not all, just the ones I personally liked.)

Ragnelle:

Loathly Lady Master Post

The Story of King Arthur and His Knights by Howard Pyle

Gawain by Gwen Rowley

In Camelot’s Shadow by Sarah Zettel

Merlin and the Sword (1985)

Laurel:

Mordred: A Tragedy by Henry Newbolt

By Camelot’s Blood by Sarah Zettel

Lynette/Linet:

The Savage Damsel and the Dwarf by Gerald Morris

Mordred: A Tragedy by Henry Newbolt

The Story of Sir Launcelot and His Companions by Howard Pyle

Under Camelot’s Banner by Sarah Zettel

The Adventures of Sir Lancelot Ep19 (1956-57)

Lyonesse/Lionors:

The Savage Damsel and the Dwarf by Gerald Morris

Mordred: A Tragedy by Henry Newbolt

Exiled From Camelot by Cherith Baldry

The Story of Sir Launcelot and His Companions by Howard Pyle

[cestacruz]

i drew this with protoverse in mind but can be taken for normal fate arthuriana since gareth is so androgynous teehee

anyway

gareth's quest to save lyonesse sparked very different emotions the whole time

[gawrkin]

GUINEVERE

IS

SO

Fae-coded

You can almost feel like the Christian writers know that Gwen can't and can never be an ordinary lady, especially within THIS kind of setting - the Arthurian Setting, the pinnacle of the Chivalric Romance genre.

A setting where nothing ordinary or mundane is at the forefront. A setting where men like Arthur and Lancelot exist - Men who are objectively superhuman - both in character and in physicality.

This is a world where Arthur, Lancelot and every other male character has curb-stomped entire armies by their lonesome, go toe-to-toe with fearsome monsters, and endure punishing physical challenges that would kill lesser men.

Where Arthur can be the most charismatic and most virtuous king in the world, ruling over a kingdom with strange habits and customs. Where Lancelot can harbor love so strong, that it can both empower him as much as it kills him.

And these men are in love with Guinevere.

Guinevere, as character in this genre, HAS to be an exemplar female in order to fit in and complement the men in her life. The problem is that the exemplar women of this genre are on the cusp, if not outright, of unchristian status.

Other Arthurian women who are Fae-coded include:

Isolde (who is a "doctor", whose uncle is the giant Morholt)

Enide (who has several cousins with strange-looking horses and another cousin who trapped her lover in an enchanted garden; Chretien de Troyes saw fit to assure the readers that Enide didn't use spells or charms to arm Erec)

Laudine (who owns a magical storm-making fountain and a magic ring)

Lynette & Lyonesse (One is capable of reviving a knight that has been cut to pieces. The other also owns a magic ring. Both are sisters of the Lord of Avalon)

Ragnelle (who has a brother by the name of Gromer Somer Jeure, which means "Man of Summer Day", and is made the mother of Gawain's son Gingalain, who is normally half-fae)

...and all of them are described as unbelievable beauties comparable to Guinevere. Right.

[wellberightwithyou]

Learning French so I can better role-play as Repanse de Lyonesse. No joke Repanse’s campaign is the only one I’ve actually finished successfully. I’m now a diehard Bretonnia Supporter.

FOR ZE LADY!!!!!

(Can you guess how this ties into Code Geass? That’s right, Code Geass is filled with Arthurian references, just like Bretonnia! You should check out our Shakespearean Deep Dive on CODE GEASS linked below!!!)

[tiodolma]

beaumains

Gareth x OC, Ipomadon AU

[rokkzalm]

Wicked Demon Jade

AF7583 / 3F2A60 / 0E0916 / 590920 / BA0131

[gringolet]

various knights and ladies from my sketchbook

in order: gawain and lynette, lore, lancelot galahad and lyonesse, gawain, galahad, gawain again, gawain again, elaine of shalott, gawain (x3), agravaine (x3)

[cesarescabinet]

Wives of the Orkney Brothers: Old Hollywood Edition

Dame Ragnelle: Lauren Bacall

Lady Laurel: Merle Oberon

Lady Lyonesse: Olivia De Haviland

Lady Lynette: Myrna Loy

St. Cwyllog: Audrey Hepburn

[queer-ragnelle]

Hey I was wondering if there were any medieval or old-ish stories with Lynette and/or Lyonesse/Lynors other than the Beaumains story? I'm trying to get a read on Lyonesse In particular for ~ writing things~ and I want to know if there's anything else I should look into

Also what (if any) is the difference between Lynesse and Lynors bc I was assuming they were the same but just now I realized maybe they aren't lol 😅

Hey buddy!

Those characters are original to Le Morte d'Arthur, so there are no earlier mentions of them. Any appearances they make will be derivative of that text. I don't think there's any difference between Lyonors, Lyonesse, Lionesse etc. it's just spelling alterations depending on the translator or author preference.

Sorry, got nothing else for you there lol

[cestacruz]

Gareth and Lynette Sure don't like each other

Its just so fucking funny to me

I dont have my sources rn but i just find it hilarious how fcking mean some people are to gareth

And the fact that Gareth and Lyonesse are so jn love and trying to have that premarital sex but then Lynette (and iirc in some versions, even the other Orkneys) cockblocks them so bad to the point of enchanting an armor to attack Gareth (and he actually gets stabbed in the thigh the two times they try to consumate their premarriage relationship)

[mermaidsirennikita]

Any recs where the fmc is considered frigid or a bitch?

For sure!

Historical

The Widow's Kiss by Jane Feather—The heroine is accused of murder (and is being investigated by the hero) after her FOURTH husband dies.

Any Duke in a Storm by Amalie Howard—The heroine is a frosty spy/pirate who ends up entangled with a potential smuggler rake.

Melissa and the Vicar by S.M. LaViolette—Melissa is a madame who's kind of removed from others emotionally on a deep level, ends up falling in love with a virginal vicar while on vacation.

Joss and The Countess by S.M. LaViolette—Alicia is a famously frosty widow who nonetheless wants to finally have good sex... Enter her footman, Joss, who's also a former sex worker who specializes in giving it to 'em rough.

For My Lady's Heart by Laura Kinsale—One of the best ice queen books ever, Melanthe is not only an ice queen but a political power player who's as ruthless as they come.

Private Arrangements by Sherry Thomas—Lady Tremaine is icy and cunning... but only because she was hurt quite a while ago by her husband, from whom she is now trying to get a divorce so that she can marry her lover (his deal: he'll give her a divorce if she gives him an heir first).

The Perfect Crimes of Marian Hayes by Cat Sebastian—Marian claims to be icy, and in some ways she is, but a lot of it is a defense mechanism (she also doesn't like to have penetrative sex, and may be seen as frigid by some because of it... certainly not by her hero).

Waking Up with the Duke by Lorraine Heath—Jayne is distant and touch-starved ever since her husband's accident, and is surprised that she can feel that much with Ainsley.

Between the Devil and Desire by Lorraine Heath—Olivia is a classic ice queen, and is super upset when Jack Dodger gets her all hot and bothered.

A Lady Awakened by Cecelia Grant—The heroine is super frigid at first (she's fucking the hero to get a baby) but everything changes over time.

Contemporary

How to End a Love Story by Yulin Kuang—The heroine was traumatized by her sister's suicide when they were teens, and has become known as a bit of an ice queen who can't admit to loving people (this is one of my favorite books of the year).

The Other Side of Disappearing by Kate Clayborn—Heroine had to grow up too fast after her mother abandoned her and her sister to ruin away with a con man; she's cold and distant to many.

Not in Love by Ali Hazelwood—The heroine had a rough childhood and holds herself at arm's length from others emotonally, ends up in a no-strings physical thing with the hero despite them being at professional odds.

The Lyonesse Series by Sierra Simone—Isolde is famously frosty and removed, though of course, she's actually an emotional mess under it all.

Lush Money by Angelina M. Lopez—Roxanne is as cold as ice... OR IS SHE.

Fantasy

Throne of the Fallen by Kerri Maniscalco—Camilla is a perfect ice queen, and entirely unimpressed by Envy's antics.

Paranormal

No Rest for the Wicked by Kresley Cole—Kaderin is literally known as Kaderin the Cold—Hearted, and is paired with the sweetest Kresley hero of them all. And then she corrupts him lmao

Pleasure of a Dark Prince by Kresley Cole—Lucia is not only emotionally distant; she also refuses to have penetrative sex with Garreth because she took a vow of chastity to serve a goddess. and will lose her supernatural archery skills if she breaks it.

[gawrkin]

(Source: University of Rochester - Robbins Library Digital Projects) (Footnotes) LINK

I love the idea of Gawain's wife being a demonic pagan goddess. Another supernatural lady in the Court of Camelot, alongside Guinevere (giantess), Isolde (giantess), Nimue (fairy), Guinevak (giantess) Enide (possible fairy), Lynette and Lyonesse (fairies), etc.

[pierrotwrites-hc]

soo... luca consistently refers to the lady in his pov chapters. his people's religion/spiritual beliefs/tendency towards human sacrifice seems to play a big part in branding them less than human by their enemies. i'm wondering whether luca somehow resisted being brainwashed out of the religion he grew up with, or did they just... introduce him to ganymene and called it a day, without bothering to figure out what exactly he might already believe in? it sticks out as very noteworthy considering how thoroughly most of his culture was taken from him. i always thought luca's little patchwork belief system was interesting (the lady as the true goddess in his mind who would not help him and ganymene as the guy painted on the wall of the training house who's probably more inclined to listen to his prayers... at least that's what it read like to me) and i wonder whether we'll get more insight into it. i've always assumed that he came to the conclusion that the lady abandoned him on his own, but maybe that's what he was told and it just... didn't stop him believing in her? then again, solasans don't seem to know about her to begin with and probably wouldn't care to. i've been thinking about this for a while, haha - have a nice day!

oh, I love this question.

so, the Solasan empire has no interest in religious conversion. there isn't even an official religious infrastructure within Solas, because Roland the Conqueror liquidated it in order to fund his wars abroad.

Toby and Tybalt discuss this in Part II Ch17:

“Well, my great-grandfather Roland got rid of all the priests, you see. And took their property and gave it to the Midland lords, and melted down all their gold and gave it to the lords of Lyonesse. And the priests had been around for positively ages. Much longer than three hundred years. But when Roland got rid of them the common people stood about amazed and said to each other, oh, what a thing, now we don’t need to give all our money to the temples, we can give it to the Crown instead.”

Tybalt looked like he was struggling with several responses to this. He settled on “Some commoners do still make offerings at the remaining temples, you know, even if there aren’t any priests to bless them for it.”

Toby waved this away.

“Silly peasant superstition. Anyway, my brothers say that people of quality don’t give the old rituals the least bit of consideration.

as usual, Toby doesn't get it quite right. the Midland lords were given property previously held by the temples in order to ensure their fealty and cooperation; ditto the lords of Lyonesse with the fungible assets. of course, a lot of that gold went into building up the army and navy and equipping and provisioning them during the takeover of Kel -- a massive one-time cash infusion that future kings would never be able to match (though they've tried by raising taxes at an ever-increasing rate, leading to a corresponding increase in poverty, debt slavery, and general resentment of the crown).

since priesthood as a caste was abolished, religion in Solas has become completely decentralized. the few temples which remain are run by the devout. belief in the gods remains widespread, however, particularly among the lower classes.

so that's Solas. let's talk about Kel. you're absolutely right that their zealous religiosity and practices like human sacrifice are perceived as primitive and even subhuman in Solas. at the same time, Solasans just don't care about converting the barbarians. it isn't part of their imperial project for the simple reason that they get nothing out of it. Solas isn't really interested in "civilizing" the barbarians, in part because they see the barbarians as inherently and irreparably uncivilized. they're just interested in exploiting barbarian land and labor. sure, the Solasan occupiers outlawed some traditional practices, but they aren't motivated by religious or humanitarian concerns. they just want to weaken group identity and, in the case of human sacrifice, prevent the deaths of potentially productive members of the workforce.

this is all to say that there has never been a concerted effort on the part of Luca's captors to stamp out his faith in the Lady. he can have whatever silly little beliefs he likes as long as they don't impede his usefulness.

at the same time, Luca's own experience of his faith has been shifted and reshaped by trauma. he believes in the Lady, but also thinks himself no longer worthy of her attention or protection. the Kel have a warrior culture; the Lady is a warrior goddess. Luca's entire existence in Solas is defined by conditions of defeat and subjugation. the Lady is still the goddess, but she can no longer be his goddess. Ganymene fills that gap. he's a more immediate, accessible divine presence, and having himself been mortal and victimized, he can understand Luca, accept him, and watch out for him. the Lady is all-powerful, but remote; Ganymene is local, amicable, and welcoming. Luca worships both because each offers something he badly needs (Ganymene, acceptance and hope in the present; the Lady, connection to his past and his people). it's a highly syncretic belief system that has helped keep him alive.

[ghw-archive]