#kim kitsuragi meta

[discobrainrot]

Do you think Kim would have danced with Eyes?

Kim is a man who takes his job seriously. He jokes with the player (re: "Do-eth thou also thorough inventories?" and "Daba-doop-doop-dead" interactions), but that doesn't erase his dedication. He hates pinball but trained for nine months to be a champion to crack a case. Regardless of the more complex moral questions about his commitment to the RCM and real-world philosophies for/against policing, he is devoted.

Was Eyes just as duty-bound? Was he straight-laced? Was Kim the loose canon between them? Would Eyes have joked around using police codes?

If you convince Kim to dance in the church, you can tell him it's a "Code 31 Emergency." He'll question how you're dancing on a busted leg if you've already done the tribunal. But he doesn't stop you. You can tell him you're undercover or that you "have become dance, destroyer of worlds." No matter what you say to him, he just says:

KIM KITSURAGI - "Good for you!" He looks around the church hall. "Rock on, then..."

You can tell him the Code 31 Emergency is "not enough Kim [on the dance floor]." A passive Suggestion check reveals that hearing you say that cheers him up. He smiles.

Did Eyes make him smile? Did he go to great lengths just for a sidelong smirk? Did he want to cheer Kim up on his worst days? Or was he content with a partner who felt a grim sense of obligation to Revachol and her people?

If you pass the next red check, you can either pull rank on him or tell him that he'll face a disciplinary hearing if he doesn't dance. When he does dance, if you've already done the tribunal and have high enough Esprit De Corps, you get the following insight:

ESPRIT DE CORPS - Part of him is amazed you're both able to just *dance* after all these horrifying events in Martinaise.

Is he amazed because, despite it all, there's joy here? Is he stunned because he never would have done it before, especially after the events preceding it? Does it remind him of a partner he lost? In the days after, does he ask himself what's different this time?

Do you think Eyes would have danced with Kim?

[medusaesque]

Kim's itchy trigger finger

So, Kim reaches for his gun often. Very often. sometimes for the most ridiculous reasons- opening the bear fridge, the experiment in the church, a note from Klaasje.

This one is just from being anxious going into the communist reading group. Kim doesn't want to be the kind of cop who draws his gun constantly, who shoots instinctively, but he is, or at the very least it's very difficult for him to stop himself from becoming one.

Perhaps the most horrifying example is with The Pigs-

Even if he KNOWS the gun isn't loaded, even if he knows it's safe, the instinctual muscle twitch could have ended in an unnecessary death. Kim is very well aware of that fact, and it's horrifying to him. @shufflerock-jam has this really good post about it, where they wonder how many of Kim's kills were unnecessary. "Something about a pair of traumatized cops, one fighting against shooting himself and one fighting against shooting everyone else".

At the end of The Pigs exchange, if Harry says she tried to kill him, Kim begins to interject, but stops himself and agree this situation could've been very bad. Then Empathy chimes in- 'He's trying not to think about how bad it could have been had the gun been loaded.' Which is the heart of the issue, right? that leads us to Eyes-

This is such a fascinating background to give Kim as a character- not just losing his partner, which gives him the trauma and survivor's guilt that lead to this unhealthy relationship with his gun and frankly with death in general, but losing his Eyes, and having that not interfere with his shooting. Kim doesn't need to see well to hit, he doesn't need to think. It's all in his hands, a reflex. A reflex that nearly took an innocent life. That might have taken one before.

His awareness of looming danger, to him and to his partner, is fueling his version of Hand/Eye Coordination to have him constantly on edge, his whole body is like a loaded spring, always prepared to make sure it doesn't happen again. Then it does-

In his nightmare scenario, leaning over his partner's bleeding body, Kim only needs one word to shoot without a second's hesitation. He's never not ready to take that shot. He doesn't need his Eyes.

Harry is distraught to discover he's killed before- his body remembers it. He wants a drink to soften the feeling. Kim however is impressed with how little he's killed- especially coming from the bloody murder unit. He wants to be 'one of the good ones' (Kim's adamant belief in the possibility of a Good Cop is a whole other can of worms) the kind of cop he would think highly of. Kim is disgusted by cops who kill like it's a game. Espirit gives us a vision of a cop exactly like that, who kills so often it doesn't feel like anything anymore. In a way that is completely mechanical- no thought, no feelings, just a thing your body does. Not unlike the way Kim shoots- like a spring unloaded. Kim has 6 confirmed kills before the tribunal, double the amount Harry has. He doesn't react the same way though-

It's doesn't bother Kim that he has killed, even if he declines to elaborate on it, and he seems to frown upon (or worry about) Harry's destructive coping mechanism. If they're unable to save Ruby, he says "Control your emotions. We did our job. This won't be the worst thing that happens on this case… believe me. You can't let this break you." When you wake up after the tribunal, he doesn't dwell on the lost lives on either side. Harry's skills call him a killer, a bloodstained killer, but when he tells Kim he also killed he simply nods. He's smoking though. I'm not saying that Kim is heartless or careless, he's rattled by nearly blowing The Pigs' head off, very sorry for the lives lost during the case, and clearly hunted by death, having been surrounded by it for his entire life. But I do think death is a part of the job for him- not just possible civilian causalities, but his own potential death. He speaks plainly about how he might die in the lie of duty, and he narrowly avoided it more than once, with others dying in his place..

He walked into the line of fire with harry expecting for of them to die, and his quick fingers on the trigger made it so they lived another day. Even if more ghost joined the list that hunts him in his sleep, he is alive. He goes on. He can't afford to fix this habit, as much as he wants to.

So it's so horrible and so touching that when Dros asks "What have you done?" Kim says-

It's a tragedy, really. A wartime orphan who wanted to be a revolutionary pilot and played with Franconigerian knights, who grew up to be a cop, a job that slowly shapes his body into a killing machine. And when you ask what he does, what you both do, he says keep people alive.

[earlofbats]

I think there was a mistake made when they made Harry's model and the art for the snake skin boots. Everything in the text refer to these as heels and disco shoes. These are just a pair of fucking croc skin loafers, thats a normal mens shoe.

with a normal sized heel. Now THESE, THESE are disco shoes:

running in these WOULD be impressive. Im convinced in the same way the froggy hat is missing its eyes, Harry is missing his heels.

[kryaaas]

Moments where Kim is being nice to kids.

Kim doesnt really hate children, his problem is mostly with unruly delinquents who challenge his authority.

He has worked with kids for 15 years, he probably knows how to handle them but because of the humiliating experience as a juvie officer who has to pretend to be a teen while he is in his thirties (because of racism), he doesn't want to get much involved with them anymore

[stellarwing]

Today on "tiny details in Disco Elysium that I am obsessing over":

Kim estimates the cost of Harry's sunken motor carriage as 40,000 reál and Jean puts it at 45,000 reál. This suggests that (at least) one of the following is true:

-Kim is better at guessing the cost of an MC than Jean (I refuse to believe that the inverse is true)

-Kim downplayed the cost to make Harry feel better

-Jean exaggerated the cost to make Harry feel worse

[selfchiller]

I do think it's really interesting that Harry can say the same things to Kim that he said to Jean before Jean left him in Martinaise, but I think it speaks more to Harry and his current state than it says about their dynamic. Sure, it's contentious, we know this. Jean is clearly upset and bitter about it, but it really has nothing to do with him, does it?

Harry can run the same script on Kim because these are his weapon words. This is the self isolation script. These are the words that demonstratively WORK to drive people away from him. So he can finish killing himself. Even if he doesn't remember that's what he's doing.

Because it's about spinning the same tape again and again. Cycles he can't break. Dream the same dream over and over. Obliterate yourself, wake up, remember, obliterate yourself again. Drive your partner away. Now drive your new partner away. Decide to kill yourself. Change your mind, embrace the world. Be beaten down and decide to kill yourself again. Wake up. Remember.

After life--death. After death--life again.

He is the infernal engine, cycling eternally.

Unless, somehow, this time, he can escape. And this starts here, maybe. Kim will not fuck off. Kim would be glad to cramp his style. He actively enjoys style cramping, even.

(It starts in other places, too, of course.)

[serchingthewinterslight]

i just found a blog from one of the devs of disco elysium (I don't know from where tho). It contains some designs of Harry, evrart, roy from the pawshop and so on. It also has a link to gameplay from the alpha (maybe on the same channel you can find more, I haven't dug in). And I want to mention Kim was supposed to have volition and endurance stats (you can see them above his portrait) and Cuno and C weren't by the tree yet.

In the dev blog there is also link to an interview with Rovert Kurvitz (without any spoiler). They mention the authority failure with Acele (one of my favourite honestly), and they talk about influences and give a general idea of the concept and ambiance but also the gameplay.

There is also a lot of text explaining the system of checks and the skills which I find very entertaining to read.

I wanted to highlight that at some point in development Lena was actually going to be a party member (but the wheelchair had a lot of problems in the map, and they wanted to center a lot on interactive dialogue which was expensive with only one party member).

And lastly, this amazing image of the blog

Some people surely know about all of this but I find it so cool to see the snippets of the game while it's still in development.

[dolorianwolf]

I’ve made like 10 of these posts and I make all of them on the same procreate canvas. According to canvas statistics I’ve put six hours of my life into these. Anyway enjoy the fruits of my labor.

[flame-cat]

obsessed with Kim kitsuragi and how good he is at hiding his wetpatheticsadness. he's so so good at it he even fooled Harry can opener du bois. he even fooled himself. he's a tin soldier. nothing but thin walls and hollow insides. he has hobbies but only indulges them so privately that no one else knows about them. he doesn't even make time to eat unless you bat your eyelashes at him. he wants to punch the little cardboard pieces out of the new board game but won't let you know until after you've already done it. he asks you if doing speed helped you be a better detective not to reprimand you but because he's considering doing it himself. he has a little blue notebook containing all of his thoughts that you can never look inside (blue is for mystery. / the blue heart. don't look into it). he falls so madly in love with a complete disaster of a messy bear within 4 days of meeting him he can take a bullet for him and defend him against his own institution and nurse him back to health while sitting vigil for 2 days with no sleep. all because the guy is fun and likes to get to know him and thinks he's cool. he thinks about Harry's girthy biceps for what is assumedly at least a day or two. he only lets himself have one cigarette a day unless harry doesn't suggest he transfer to the 41st, a rule he never breaks otherwise even when he was concussed and alone. he even has autism

[worlds-end-discotheque]

spotted DE reference on my university campus (it was me)

[renmorris]

I really do like how Kim and Harry have such a capacity to hurt each other through their fuck ups. Though, I don’t see many people talking about what the shaving scene like, actually means to Harry. Fandom doesn’t really examine that beyond the lens of seeing it as a funny joke. Which is a shame because for Harry it’s an intensely vulnerable moment for someone with disfiguring disabilities.

Harry has a speech impediment, he has a damaged jaw from infant polio. He also has partial facial paralysis.

The expression is part of this. We know it’s nerve damage because in the fash questline that damage is not only referred to as damage but in fact it progresses to the point where Harry loses the ability to make facial expressions.

So let’s talk about the shaving scene. It’s something Harry feels very good about in the moment. It makes him feel cleaner, makes him look younger even. He feels better about himself once he’s gotten rid of them.

And then Kim, who has at this point known Harry for days and would have noticed that he has a speech impediment etc says that he prefers the chops because they cover up the damage.

Which of course is why Harry probably grew them out to begin with. Harry lives in a world that doesn’t want to see his disabilities. He fixes a smile on his face, he grows big muttonchops to hide his crooked jaw.

And then he forgets that he did that to protect himself. In an instant he's painfully reacquainted with the ableism that made him hide his face to begin with.

[suresne]

my husband is doing a high MOT playthrough of de right now and started the communist quest last night. this hand/eye coordination passive popped up that i've never seen before, and it kind of messed me up

[Photo ID: A screenshot from FAYDE of dialogue from the game Disco Elysium.

Kim Kitsuragi - You notice the lieutenant is looking uncustomarily anxious. His posture is rigid, his right hand hovers near the zipper of his jacket.

Hand/Eye Coordination - He wants so badly to draw his Armistice, but he also doesn't *want* to want to draw it. End ID.]

kim is trigger happy, but it isn't because he likes to brandish his authority. he's fucking traumatized

kim's trauma has been addressed before, but i think this passive check is especially revealing because it specifically shows that kim's instincts contradict his will. as someone who has struggled with OCD, i know how excruciating it can be to feel like your mind is your enemy. like it's driving you to hurt people.

i imagine that kim probably has not a little self-loathing because of this, which maybe feeds into his need to keep himself on a short leash (the one cigarette per day, the strict routines). he fears his proven capacity for violence, and on bad days may listen to that part of his brain that says he does actually like killing, that he does really want to pull the trigger

[medusaesque]

Kim Kitsuragi and the pale-

Kim has a unique relationship to the pale, I tried dissecting it and making sense of it. Reposting with more thoughts after some good conversations with @binomech.

Warning- it's insanely long.

1. After life, death

One of the first thing you can learn about Kim is that he would hurl himself in death's way to save you. From the very first moment, Kim is related to sacrifice and death, it follows him wherever he goes-

The slaughterhouse.

He lost his parents at two years old. He worked a year in Processing (here's good post about that by @renmorris and @spilledkaleidoscope). He lost his partner, Eyes. People have taken a bullet that was meant for his more than once. His survivor's guilt is insane. He's killed six people. He's afraid of killing recklessly, and has a deeply unhealthy relationship with his gun (made another embarrassingly long post about that).

Kim also hears pale 'ghosts' on the police radio all the time, talks about it like it's normal, and says he doesn't believe in ghosts.

If harry is with Noid during the Moralist dream quest (more on it later), Harry can even wonder if Kim himself is a ghost, prompting this beautiful exchange-

And he's not entirely wrong. When Harry gets shot, after Kim fulfills Espirit's promise and stands in death's way for him, you can ask as you fall into darkness what will happen to you-

It's the living who are ghosts. You can leave them behind and rest. Go into the wild pale yonder, along with everyone else Kim has ever cared about. Or at least you can try to.

When death is at the door, you have two options-

2. After death, life again

Kim might associate himself with death, but Harry associates him with life again and again- Death is darkness, Kim has a light bulb halo. Death is a sunset, Kim is a sunrise. Death is where you are when the game start, it's ready to take you, and then- a clarion call, the sound of a motor carriage, a detective arriving on the scene, and you open your eyes.

Of course Kim is no actual saint, no guardian angel, but it's really telling that even in harry's deification the symbols of Kim's holiness are worldly, almost mundane, the matters of every day life- a celling's fan lightbulb, the engine of a car..

Or the way @binomech said it when discussing Kim's portrait: this is the only thing keeping you from the full brunt of the world in your mind #but truly you are already in the world #and he is just a man #and that's just a car and that's just a ceiling fan

The game is very clear about Harry being a ceaseless agent of the world, but he's not the only one. Harry stands at death's door twice, and Kim is his way back to the world both times.

3. After the world, the pale

So what is Kim's relationship with the pale?

As casual as he might try to appear, Kim is clearly uncomfortable with the pale, afraid of it even. When Harry brings up the pale, he intervenes, genuinely worried for the fragile stability of his mind, trying to protect him-

It's no more terrifying than water or death or that we're stuck behind our eyes for all eternity?? Sounds pretty terrifying Kim...

I think the key is in the moralist vision quest, When Harry attempts to reach the Committee of Responsibility, and he hears the pale crosstalk coming through the radio, when suddenly-

"Pale is a shroud of memories and it doesn't really distinguish to whom those memories belong to. You could hear anything." You could hear anything, but you hear Kim. Soona even says that the odds of us hearing him, out of all the voices in the pale, are astronomically low.

We know the past has not been harmless to Kim, we know it's full of ghosts and cold winters, but that's not the thing that's eating at him-

Kim is afraid of forgetting. He's constantly writing, he thinks through his notebook, always recording, so he wouldn't lose anything. That's why the pale is so terrifying to him.

4. After the pale. the world again

The world is what it is. God is in his heaven. Everything is normal on Earth.

That leads me to the expeditions through the pale-

Volta do Mar is a skill unique to Kim, according to the stats of this pilot jackets, and it's a Physique skill.

It's driving me crazy to think how Kim wanted to be revolutionary pilot as a kid, and is walking around dressed like a pilot as an adult, to give himself the ability to navigate the pale. To return from the sea-

DISTANT ENEMY OF HIMSELF?? kim....

Seeing how Volta do Mar is strengthened by his jackets, and the items' descriptions point out that most of the people who used to wear this jacket are long gone (alongside what they represented) and considering that the only real advance in pale transit is the speed with which an aerostatic craft can pierce it, is seems fitting that returning from the 'sea' requires the kind of armor that ghosts wear- the ghost of who you wanted to be but never could, of a home that was never yours. Glory to them.

@binomech said it best in this conversation we had about Kim's skills: "your traitorous race. your traitorous job. your traitorous parents. your traitorous senses. distant enemy of yourself: seolite, communist, cripple, faggot. and you wear it as armor"

Kim is equipped for Volta do Mar, he armors himself for it every day, for the thing that makes it possible to return sane, and discover a new world-

This is one of the most touching Kim moments in the game to me- putting his hand in the rain, looking up to the sky, mouth open, welcoming the spring rain, even knowing it'll bring death and destruction with it. He is devoted to this world and the role he has to play in it, or at least the role he thinks he has to play-

But we know Kim has a bigger role to play, he's trying to do his part right there, getting Harry to stay-

His connection to Harry can keep him on this world once again- keeping the two of them together. Their real work is down here, him and Harry are Revachol's only hope. If they stick together they might be able to keep her on this earth.

UNITY AMONG THE RANKS IS PARAMOUNT.

I NEED YOU. YOU CAN KEEP ME ON THIS EARTH. BE VIGILANT.

I LOVE YOU.

[earlofbats]

I love the subtle visual esc story telling that's presented by finding the conical hat and robe in the smokers apt.

The way the Sunday friend talks about buying them on some trip abroad as some kind of appreciation for other cultures, dodging the very clear fact that they're meant for his sexual gratification.

The way that it imprints the idea of fetishism as something that takes place amongst the same community Kim is part of.

The way Kim knew the term Sunday friend as being an innuendo.

Makes you gotta wonder if Kim's ever had Sunday friends. dealt with the fetishism alongside all the racism he talks about.

Kinda sad there isn't some kind of back and forth about the outfit you can have with kim, I feel like it'd make for some really funny dialogue.

[kryaaas]

a weird thing about Jean people rarely talk about is that the bitch just sometimes lies lol

there is his "no one is married in Revachol" line (while there are several married couples in the game and jean literally stands right next to the married woman at that moment)

But such occurance isnt not an only one. There several instances where Jean overstates the issue or omits the truth

anothee infamous example of this is in the timeline where kim got shot and jean claims: "kitsuragi is barely clinging to his life!!" despite the fact that jean had visisted kim in the hospital before knows that his condition is stable. To continue putting blame on harry for kim getting shot he also conviently does not mention the fact that kim was upset at JEAN and not harry

anothing thing I found is that jean tells different things depending on how harry responds

If harry is evasive with his answer:

YOU - "I thought the killer would be underwater. He wasn't."

JEAN VICQUEMARE - "Ha-ha-ha, ho-ho-ho." He grabs his stomach in mirthless laughter. "Underwater killer. So funny, Harry. Thank you for fucking me."

JEAN VICQUEMARE - "Thank you for destroying 45,000 reál of police property that's coming out of *my* payslip. You know that, right? You're gonna get fired. And I'm gonna pay till I die..."

JEAN VICQUEMARE - "It doesn't matter." He exhales to calm his breathing. "Your badge, Harry. Show me your badge."

But If Harry is truthful its:

YOU - "I drove it into the ocean when I was drunk."

JEAN VICQUEMARE - "So *refreshing*. He just admits it. Thank you for your honesty. Thank you for destroying 45,000 reál of police property that's coming out of *everyone's* payslip."

JEAN VICQUEMARE - "It doesn't matter." He exhales to calm his breathing. "Your badge, Harry. Show me your badge."

Jean choses to emphasises different things depending on circumstances.

Harry's evasive answer gets Jean annoyed so he is emphasizing *his* suffering and harry being *fired* to make him feel additional guilt.

In the second case Harry tells the truth so Jean is more reasonable. Now its *everyones* payslip. He still wants Harry to feel guilt but now its a lot less drastic.

There is also a line when jean claims that "harry is the reason why we have to take sensitivity trainings" and like.im sorry but this is such a fucking bullcrap. harry is the main reason?? really? what about mack and chester? lets be honest the reason why they are taking these trainings is because cops in their precinct are fucking assholes including jean

TL:DR jean is very very very emotionally-charged unreliable narrator. jean's lying (or exaggerating the truth, if we are being nice) is a pattern and not just isolated occurances

[stellarwing]

This post contains spoilers for Disco Elysium!

Ever since I learned what the good cop/bad cop score actually represents I have become obsessed with checking it constantly as I play through the game to figure out what makes Lieutenant Kim Kitsuragi tick. There have been many things here and there that surprised me but I would like to share my absolute favorite thing I have learned about this man.

First, lest I give you all the wrong idea, I want to make it clear that Kim does very much enjoy watching Harry do good detective work and cracking open a case. But everyone knows that already. It's much less fun and interesting than this:

Kim loves it when Harry fails in a way that gives Kim a chance to swoop in and comfort him.

I have two examples of this coming into play:

1. Billie's Husband

When you talk to Billie to break the news about her husband's death there's an Empathy check to see how well you do it. If you pass the check and do everything absolutely perfectly, Kim will tell you that you did a good job and talk about what happens next. You neither gain nor lose points at any point in this interaction.

If you fail the Empathy check Harry completely botches the death notification. You neither gain nor lose points for this. Once you step outside Kim wants to talk to you about how it went. If you say there's nothing to talk about, you lose 1 point. If you admit you fucked up and apologize Kim reassures you that it wasn't that bad and you gain 1 point.

Once again, there's no way to gain points if you do everything correctly. What this means is that the version of the scene that makes Kim happiest is the one where Harry screws up the death notification but is apologetic enough about it that Kim can feel good about cheering him up.

2. The Moralist Quest

During the climax of the Moralist quest when you contact Coalition Warship Archer you have the opportunity to earn a total of 3 points. If you tell Archer about the 2mm hole in the world but then refuse to go with them, regardless of the reason you choose to stay you gain 1 point.

Once the conversation is over and you are disconnected from Archer there is a passive Volition check. If you fail the check then you climb down off the statue and that's it, that's the end of the scene. You leave with your total of 1 point. But if you pass the check you are given the option to stay sitting on the statue a little while longer.

If you choose to stay, Kim asks you if you're okay and tries to reassure you that you made the correct decision. Simply for going through this scene and giving him the opportunity to talk to you about it you gain 2 points.

There are a couple dialogue choices you can make but you get the 2 points regardless of what you pick. There are very few actions in the game that earn you double points. This is the same amount you get for finding the bullet in the hanged man's head. And you get it just for giving Kim the opportunity to comfort you after your failed Moralist mission.

Kim wants Harry to need him so bad.