#just bc i as a lesbian like someone that doesn't automatically make them also lgbt

[1eos]

I started following you last year because you made a similar post about how Kpop fans treat idols' sexualities like a consumable product (not your exact words but you made SO many good points that I had never thought about before).

You also talked about the difference in how the public responded to Taylor Swift's alleged 'queerness' (bc she like.... named a song after a girl or something ajshdjfdhsjaf?) vs Meg's ACTUAL REAL LIFE sexuality.

I don't want to sound like a conspiracy theorist but I feel like social media has really aggravated this issue. Like, if you search an idol's name on Tumblr, a lot of the results are 'evidence' that they're secretly gay and it'll be gifs of them high-fiving their group mate. Same with YouTube and probably TikTok.

I find it interesting that Stans are obsessed with investigating and theorizing about these celeb's sexualities, but ignore or belittle an actual WLW (especially when Meg needed support more than ever last year). It's like they enjoy the thrill of it but not the reality of the situation.

at this point i feel like we can safely say social media has aggravated most issues in society (but also played a hand in most IMPROVEMENTS in society so double edge sword there 😔😗) but OMG YES i definitely think the mystery.... the investigation is what intrigues ppl more. nd it's like ofc we all make jokes abt so and so being gay or bi or this or that but after a few years ppl started forgetting to separate the jokes from reality 💀 like it's to the point where ppl are comparing ppl popularly theorized as gay to actually out nd proud lgbt artists?????? nd it's also to the point where these celebs esp the ones of color particularly idols have no worth to fans unless they're doing something seen as gay? nd i firmly believe public figures don't have to come out if they don't want to nd quite a few gay icons haven't called themselves anything but straight like mariah carey. but ppl can't just call their faves an icon to the gays instead they have to seriously fight nd theorize abt who these celebs are fucking when it's just not necessary. nd is fucking weird 😭 esp when real lgbt artists ESP the black ones are dismissed bc they aren't giving the yaoi fantasy. idk i just feel like we could be normal abt this but no im still getting ppl in my notes literally offended that im not saying with complete authority that taemin is gay like? i don't know him 😭😭😭😭 YOU don't know him

[commajade]

ik this is from before but ive been thinking about the trans man butch post and idk... i don't like the idea of including attraction to trans men in lesbianism and when i was reading it i was like well good for the author but im not...attracted to trans men...and thats not part of being lesbian. like idk when this was written and if its older I get how diff norms could have impacted her understanding but yea...and also the line talking abt how the lover wants her like a man bc his thinking changed after starting T stuck out to me as weird too. and i mean maybe the modern understanding of sex hormones is just a lot diff so i wont go on about how thats not how T works but i feel like lesbians are usually very off put by someone "wanting us as a man"? food for thought ig

the thing is though, that it genuinely does not matter whether u think that person's experience is valid. ur allowed to judge that person and disagree, and u would be probably be aligned with a lot of other lgbt ppl around them. and it's ok if u disagree with me! this is the internet not an in-person and long standing lesbian social community, u r not accountable to me beyond basic human decency. i personally don't see a problem with it because people have all kinds of journeys with their identity and within lgbt social circles and butch and femme are relational social roles within a specific social and political context and the issue of transitioning while being butch is much bigger and much more difficult than we know and the author expressed that struggle beautifully.

i am absolutely not saying that because i don't see a problem in that story i'm allowing attraction to trans men to be a part of the definition of lesbianism. there's a difference between what actual people historically experienced and what is a correct on-paper definition of sexualities and lgbt social roles. i agree that i am not attracted to trans men and attraction to trans men should not be considered a part of the definition of what a lesbian is. there are actually trans men on this website that call themselves butch and make weird posts about gay men and lesbians having sex being normal. and it's gross, really really gross. another example of this would be bi femmes. on the internet i'm gonna be uncomfortable when a lot of bi women with no affiliation to or knowledge of lesbian bar culture and no love for butches call themselves femme but historically, bi women were an important part of butch femme bar culture and gave up a lot and gained a lot from taking on the responsibility of that social role, which continual rejection of men and wanting butches instead is a part of.

queerness is by definition outside of words, everything we do is resistance to language and outside of language and breaks apart language. the danger in these kinds of stories is when people use them as proof for ideas that are trying to disrupt our social formations and community structures and make our words meaningless, make the word lesbian no longer mean what it does. but the story doesn't do that, there's a reverence for lesbianism and the butch femme community that the narrator is terrified of losing the subversive power gained by becoming a part of that community and social structure. and about that section the narrator was put off by that too, terrified in fact.

finally, note that the passage never did firmly establish whether the narrator's partner considers himself a trans man completely. he could be a nonbinary transmasc lesbian like me that went through medical transition. he could be a trans man that still considers himself butch and that would be none of my business, he has def already been taken to task about it by his own community based on their own definitions of what being butch means. these terms come with sacrifice, they come with automatic rejection from society, they come with punishment both physical/legal and emotional, they aren't taking this shit lightly.

lesbian and trans experience is complicated and not going to fit neatly into any kind of narrative because we're communally writing the stories and definitions as they suit us and the community we have made. in general yeah saying lesbians are attracted to trans men is transphobic and lesbophobic but this is real people we're talking about, with real experiences that do in fact happen. it's not an idea, it's just what happened to those people. they're people of incorrect gender and incorrect desire which is the definition of what being lgbt is, and they should be considered as real human beings living through hell just to be who they are and survive. i don't think it's my role as a reader to further punish this person who's lived through more hardship for being gay and trans than i have, whose story is being very vulnerably told so i can benefit, so i can see some of myself and feel some connection in the past as a young nonbinary transmasc butch lesbian.

[slutauthority]

Hi, I guess this is venting because I don’t really want to talk about it on my own but I’m that anon that talked about saying biphobic things when I was in denial and identifying as a lesbian and everything like that. I think back then I believed that being bisexual was easier because bi ppl are most of the community according to numbers. That how could You possibly feel ignored when you make up the majority. Now it feels so strange because I do feel utterly isolated and forgotten about (p1)

Part2. And villianized at the same time. I wonder a lot if I’m being defensive and overly bitter and exaggerating things in my head. I feel like some sort of class traitor, and that there’s something wrong with me. Like if I was a more well-adjusted person, I would be either be a lesbian or straight, that something is broken inside of me that I can’t describe. I don’t really think of other bisexuals like that, at least not verbally.

hey friend, i have a lot of loved ones who generally feel the same. I pretty much felt the same for most of my time of like...id'ing as bisexual, in the beginning years lol. but even STILL Im just now starting to be more assertive about bisexuals in lgbt discussions, but like. that doesn't make it automatically easy, bc you do really get like...dismissed as annoying and privileged.

making up the majority is obviously going to make people want to ignore specific experiences of biphobia. and you don't feel like there's anything that bisexuals are facing that could need any more attention than other LGBT matters. I felt v in the background when i came out as bi and i just thought that's what it was. and i say that like, i just naturally thought when i came out as bisexual, i didn't need room or space for my issues bc i was in the end, bisexual. i was...i guess, supposed to be more in the background. obviously i knew bisexual ppl didn't just show up in the 1970's, lol. But I didn't care to look at anything truly like. focused on it. i didn't want to insert myself if someone was MORE gay than me. and it IS very isolating. so many people in my life have just eased into id'ing as bisexual, despite having no change in their lifestyle, it just finally was something that they were ready to approach more like....idk tenderly bc its not something they want to think too much on. bc its uncomfortable and thats v normal for bi ppl coming to terms with themselves. I think people who are questioning and MAY be bisexual, struggle with feeling like they'll be taken seriously or that it's even worth a conversation bc a lot of them don't want to even really have a label, least of all bisexual. and a lot of people ALSO don't like to look at why it's a word they don't like. and why they are so hesitant to use it openly.

i don't want you to think that these are feelings you brought upon yourself in any way. honestly, what you're saying is like. very much exactly what most of us grapple with when it comes to internalized biphobia. seriously, its something that hasn't been treated with kindness and when ur coming to terms with being bisexual, you have to come to terms with all the biphobic insights and stereotypes you've internalized. which unfortunately just informs all the biphobia you will deal with if you come out as bi.

i didnt mean for this to be so long winded, but honestly i dont have the perfect words to like...make it all feel better, bc it stings and still does, even when you've spent time with it and unpacked it. i can only reiterate that there ARE a lot of loving and supportive people and resources within our community and i know, i kno, i kno. it really doesn't feel like it sometimes, but i do know from experience that they're out there. I hope you have some comfort and peace with this at some point. <3