#iterator biology????

[mirwx]

ever since i read BTTS winged pebbles has been stuck in my mind

i was going to make a quick sketch but then I rendered the metal. so here.

[noodles-and-tea]

i had an idea but idk its a little out there. dipper is smart, but i was like him once and i think he’d get burnt out fast. mabel has been shown to be smarter than she lets on, as well as curious and interested in the strange and unusual.

relativity falls where mabel fell into the portal and dipper had to clean up and run the shack. mabel would adventure around space & time, surprisingly making lots of friends. theres a little short comic about how mabel went to the mabel dimension and allied with them to defeat evil mabel, so i think she’d be really good at making allies wherever she goes. also i’d really like to see mabel jumping over some frog dude as she runs from the time police.

dipper would be stuck at home, trying so hard to bring her back, while running the mystery shack, trying to balance all of these things and it overwhelms him to the point where he becomes a shut in, and nearly like a cryptid or urban legend he’d read about.

also your art is so gorgeous and cozy!!! i love it so much :D

IM SORRY I DIDNT DRAW MABEL JUMOUNG OVER A FROG DUDE

[carp3tpasta]

Neural

[sluglore]

Explaining The Iterator's Purpose (And Why They Weren't Made to Circumvent The Echoes)

Alright, I know there's already been a few posts like this out there, like this older one from @halvedforest, and this recent one from @noizepushr, which are both good posts, but I've been meaning to touch up and cross-post my own older misconceptions post from reddit for a while now, and provide a deeper, more expanded analysis as to why this misconception exists and explain what's actually going on, so here it finally is haha I'll also be using the term 'Benefactor' instead of 'Ancient', if people are confused about that, I intend to make a post about it eventually ^^

( If you're confused on who out there even believes this, this idea originated from Rain World YouTube lore videos, long before Downpour was ever a thing! It is unfortunately still quite prominent on there... but it's definitely getting better :3 )

This misconception stems from misreading the singular pearl to ever mention the echoes, being the Bright Red farm arrays pearl, so let me begin by attaching the specific section below:

“There were some horror stories though... That if your ego was big enough, not even the Void Fluid could entirely cross you out, and a faint echo of your pompousness would grandiosely haunt the premises forever. So even when the Void Fluid baths became cheaper, some would still starve and drink the bitter tea.” (Bright red Farm Arrays pearl dialogue)

Note the specific usage of “some” here. Echoes weren't presented as an issue significant to re-center Benefactor society around, (let alone build the iterators for) but as some horror stories which only "some" people (likely on the fringes of society) would believe in. Nowhere are we given anything that alludes to the existence of Echoes being regarded as a societal problem to address, much less have anything to do with the Iterators.

Additionally, although we know for a fact that echoes do exist, its fairly possible that most of Benefactor society didn't, as LTTM doesn't even know what they are either, regarding them as nothing more than superstition. On the very next line, LTTM confirms that the void baths continued all the same, while again mentioning that "some" would still choose to abstain from them, and drink the bitter tea.

Then what’s the purpose of the iterators if they weren't created to circumvent the echoes? What is The Big Problem that they are even trying to solve in the first place? Well, both FP, LTTM, and the Exterior colored pearl dialogue spell the answer out for you. In fact, it's the first thing FP even tells you!

“The good news first. In a way, I am what you are searching for. Me and my kind have as our purpose to solve that very oscillating claustrophobia in the chests of you and countless others. A strange charity - you the unknowing recipient, I the reluctant gift. The noble benefactors? Gone.” (Five Pebbles dialogue to Survivor) (Monk's version also hits similar notes)

Five pebbles introduces himself as a “reluctant gift," with his purpose being "to solve that very oscillating claustrophobia in the chests of you and countless others," meaning to solve the cycles for everyone and everything else.

If you bring Looks to the Moon a neuron, she has the chance to repeat the same exact explanation to you.

"We were supposed to help everyone, you know. Everything. That was our purpose: a great gift to the lesser beings of the world. When facing our inability to do so, we all reacted differently. Many with madness.”

FP, LTTM, and the rest of their kind were created to serve the rest of the world in finding a method of total mass ascension, of ending the cycle entirely for everyone.... and everything. Not only including the fauna of the world, like the slugcat, but the bedrock, microbes and even gases, as explicitly stated in this snippet from the Exterior pearl dialogue below:

“The Moral Argument: Five Pebbles is our Creation, and we have Parental Obligations towards him. As an Iterator, he is also a Gift of Charity from Us to The World (unable to reach Enlightenment by itself - being composed mostly of Rock, Gas, dull witted Bugs and Microbes - and towards which We thus have Obligations)” (Pale Green Exterior pearl dialogue)

Here we have the Benefactors define it very clearly, that as an iterator, Five Pebbles is a "Gift of Charity from Us to The World." It's important to note that many misinterpret the next section in parentheses as being about FP himself, but if it were, it would be the only time FP is ever referred to as “it”. What's really being described is the world, “unable to reach enlightenment by itself, being composed mostly of rock, gas, dull witted bugs and microbes” The world is unable to reach Enlightenment on it's own and therefore, that's why the iterators were created. (Also- when you think about it, the description of "being composed of rock, gas, and dull witted microbes" doesn't even really fit FP's description lol)

Quick but necessary tangent, the concept of non-living things being apart of the cycle is a little confusing, and tricky to quickly answer without going deep into cycle lore discussion, (I have an entire post in drafts dedicated to clearing this up) but it's actually incredibly important for understanding what The Great Problem is! To shed some light, it's not that non-living matter are able to somehow comprehend the cycles, but that the entire physical world itself is actually an intrinsic part of the cycles.

If you leave a stone on the ground, and come back some time later, it's covered in dust. This happens everywhere, and over several lifetimes of creatures such as you, the ground slowly builds upwards. So why doesn't the ground collide with the sky? Because far down, under the very very old layers of the earth, the rock is being dissolved or removed. The entity which does this is known as the Void Sea. If you drill far enough into the earth you begin encountering a substance called Void Fluid. The deeper you go, the less rock and more Void Fluid. It's believed that there is a point where the rock completely gives way - below that would be the Void Sea. When that stone you placed on the ground has finally done its time in the sediments, it meets the Void Fluid and is dissolved, leaving the physical world. (Teal Subterranean pearl dialogue)

There's a reason that 'Cycles' is always plural in Rain World, because there's multiple of them! Organic life is in cycles, the physical bedrock of the world is in cycles, even the very concept of civilization is in cycles. In order to ascend everything, that means ascending not only all living things, but the entire physical universe itself! That's what the Great Problem really is :D (Also technicallyyy it's only ever referred to as "the big problem" and not "the great problem", the latter term stems entirely from the community but it's whatever i just wanted to quickly mention that. great problem definitely sounds cooler LOL)

In conclusion, Iterators are described as "Gifts to the World" not once, not twice, but three entire times throughout base game Rain World's dialogue, one from FP, one from LTTM, and one from the Benefactors. Rain World lore holds many unanswered, purposefully ambiguous questions, but the Iterator's purpose is not one of them!

If you're confused/interested in analysis of the Benefactor's motivations and perspectives on Ascension, I made a post a little while back containing my thoughts right here :)

[ressioo]

Slug doodles!

Spears is a creepy lil test tube baby. Local cryptid

Been playing inv recently. Absolute hell but also very entertaining. Brain workout

[mothsakura]

hi hello *throws a sketch of speculative biology of an iterator puppet's chest cavity, and runs off*

[thatturtleleon]

as its getting colder, naturally i connect things to transformers, and im wondering if the bots have a way to regulate their temperature? in TFP we see arcee and optimus almost freeze to death but that was EXTREME cold temperatures.

so when its just slightly cold, do they have a way to warm themselves up? or do they have to? do they have an equivalent to shivering like humans do?

and also on that note, when they see humans shiver or shake because of the cold are they curious or concerned? i can imagine if they were unfamiliar with the concept then theyd probably be worried it was some medical emergency.

it also makes me wonder what the average temperature for the bots is too

[snailfen]

sniffs

[rain-world-headcanons]

the various parts inside of iterators are purposed organisms that take the roles or like our own cells, so like the inspectors/hydras/axons are similar to our white blood cells, the dark blue wavy things are like nerves that receive signals from the neuron flies. So when a scug is moving through their systems and occasionally crashing into things and eating neuron flies in the normally sterile environment it’s like when a pathogen gets into the blood stream. For pebbles, in the parts that have been rotted, he has no sense of them, so it’s kinda like losing a limb or an organ in a sense. An iterator’s body is that whole building!!!!!! I just think that’s so cool!!

-

[echosian]

small thing

i got bored in environmental and made myself an explanation on how iterators fit in they cloaks with their big spikes

[infin-8-morphosis]

It's the Guy

i should probably hold off on a big long anatomical explanation of them until I've actually finished the model but. Guy Hype.

take a good look at that snoot

However, do consider in the meantime

that these are the ears

[delta-orionis]

Some of my assorted theories and headcanons about iterators:

In no particular order:

I think that overseers are all part of one large iterator organ rather than discrete individuals.

A microscopic, thread-like structure similar to mycelium can be found all throughout an iterator's surrounding complex. It spreads through tiny gaps in soil, rock, and metal. All the threads are connected directly to an iterator like a nervous system that extends far outside their cans.

Overseers are a bit like the fruiting bodies of a fungus; they're able to emerge from this network of threads via small holes in surfaces. Similar to nerve endings, they can collect stimuli about the outside world, and send signals down the threads similar to the way nerve impulses move down a nerve.

The majority of overseers are found on the outside of an iterator's can and in the surrounding area, becoming less common farther away. However, with some effort, an iterator can extend this network beyond the normal limits of their complex (seen in the fact that Seven Red Suns is able to send an overseer all the way over to Five Pebbles and Look's to the Moon's complex in order to follow Spearmaster).

Iterators have many more pearls than the ones seen in their puppet chambers.

I personally think data pearls are analogous to files on a computer, or maybe USB drives, which move data between systems. Given the fact that iterators are capable of running many different processes at once, it makes sense to assume that they have much more storage for data than the pearls that can be found in their chambers.

The majority of pearls an iterator uses are probably stored somewhere inaccessible in the game. However, the Light Yellow pearl can be found in Looks to the Moon's Memory Conflux, suggesting that pearls are used in that area as well. I believe iterators are able to access the data stored on pearls in their memory conflux without needing to bring them into their puppet chamber. If you bring the Light Yellow pearl to Moon, she remarks that it contains her personal notes, but suddenly forgets what they are about, and then asks you to put the pearl back where you found it. This suggests to me that moving the pearl from its intended location prevents Moon from accessing those memories.

Iterators are probably able to move pearls around the interior of their cans, most likely through the use of purposed organisms. These organisms can sort through pearls in storage and carry them from one location to another. I'm not sure what they look like, but I'm going to call them Couriers. They might be a distant relative of slugcats, albeit much more specialized. They might have appendages similar to a slugcat's arms for sorting through pearl caches, and are capable of storing pearls in their stomachs for transport. Couriers might move through a system of pipes and can deliver pearls directly to and from an iterator's puppet chamber. Kind of like getting your mail via pneumatic tube. Fwoop.

The pearls in an iterator's puppet chamber are likely there because they are actively using the information stored on it for some process, or they are altering the data stored on it. Pearls might be an equivalent to non-volatile computer memory (such as in a hard drive), used for long-term storage. Perhaps the data stored in pearls can only be altered by an iterator's puppet, so if they need to change something, the pearl needs to be transported to their chamber.

I also think that iterator puppets are analogous to a computer's I/O devices.

When you use a computer, you use a mouse and keyboard, and look at information on a screen. However, the actual computing takes place in the computer's processors. If you unplug the mouse, keyboard, and monitor from a computer, it can still compute just fine, but you as a user lose the ability to interact meaningfully with the data stored within. These peripherals are called Input/Output (or I/O) devices.

Similarly, an iterator is much more than their puppet; both their biological and mechanical processes are carried out in the larger superstructure as well as the outside area surrounding it. However, if their creators want to be able to utilize these processes, they need something to interact with: an I/O device. Similar to how a computer monitor turns ones and zeroes into pixels on a screen, iterator puppets communicate via body language and speech. Puppets can also observe and interpret things in their chamber, like how a keyboard and mouse interpret inputs from a user into information the computer can use.

Iterator puppets aren't perfectly analogous to a computer screen, however. I think the puppets (and the rooms surrounding the puppet chamber) also function similarly to a human brain, which is the most important part of the central nervous system. Obviously humans are much more than their brains, but they also can't function without them.

The rooms surrounding Moon's chamber are called the "Neural Terminus", which supports this theory. The analogous rooms in Five Pebbles are called the "General Systems Bus"; in computers the System Bus connects the major parts of a computer, allowing the CPU, memory, and I/O devices to communicate with each other. This supports the theory that puppets also function as I/O devices. The Neural Terminus and General Systems Bus serve very similar functions, but their different names probably reflect the differences in Five Pebbles' and Moon's construction. (Note: in Rivulet's campaign when Pebbles is overtaken with Rot, the General Systems Bus is replaced with the Primary Cortex, which sounds a lot more similar to Moon's Neural Terminus. I personally think that the General Systems Bus and Primary Cortex are next to or near each other in Pebbles' superstructure, but the Primary Cortex is inaccessible in earlier campaigns, and the General Systems Bus is blocked off by rot in Rivulet's campaign. They likely serve similar purposes.)

The music heard in the General Systems Bus/Neural Terminus is diegetic and reflects an iterator's thoughts and state of mind.

I made a post earlier about how Random Gods, the theme heard in Five Pebbles' General Systems Bus, is the sound of Five Pebbles performing a sorting algorithm. I was mostly joking, but I do think that theory holds some weight.

I've seen people theorize before that Random Gods is literally the sound of Five Pebbles thinking, and I really like that idea. It makes sense that you would hear it in the General Systems Bus, which is basically his brain. Similarly, Reflection of the Moon, which plays in Moon's Neural Terminus, is also the sound of Moon's thoughts.

Random Gods is cacophonous and frenetic, which I think reflects Pebbles' obsessive nature. Reflection of the Moon, on the other hand, is much more melodic, which I think represents how Moon is much more levelheaded. However, the sound of a ticking clock can also be heard, which I think represents the fear Moon feels about her imminent collapse. After she collapses, Reflection of the Moon becomes Moondown, which I also think is diegetic. It reflect's Moon's severely damaged state and her inability to function or think like she was able to before.

I think every iterator has a unique theme that plays in their General Systems Bus (or the equivalent), which reflects their personality, thoughts, and state of mind.

My iterator oc, Three Stars Above Clouds, was built primarily to collect astronomical data, and they spend most of their time sifting through this data and analyzing it. Because of this, I think their analogue to Random Gods would be fast paced but repetitive, representing their ability to process a lot of data at once, and performing repetitive analyses on it extremely quickly.

I heard the song "The Dream Is Always The Same" by Tangerine Dream recently, and I think it captures the feeling I was thinking about. TSAC's Random Gods equivalent probably sounds very similar to this, with repetitive synths as they access files over and over and over.

(I listened to the entire album earlier and honestly I think the whole thing is pretty iteratorcore, listen to it if you like retro synths that evoke what a computer thinking would sound like.)

.... that's probably enough thoughts for one post. I could go on. I really like thinking about iterators and how they work, Rain World does a very good job of establishing them as enormous, complex, thinking, and breathing machines. I'll probably post more thoughts at some point.

[slugcatmusings]

Iterators = Colonial Organisms

I’ve been thinking a lot about the iterators lately.  Not any one in particular, nope, I’ve just – been thinking about their biology/structure.  How they might’ve been built, what they’re made of, how the frick the Ancients made them so big that they built entire skyscraper cities on, etc.  First two things are most interesting to me though, how do you build an iterator?  What’s the process there?  How do the metal and organic bits fit together?  Are their metal parts even metal at all, because Pebbles’ robot cancer seems to be mutating directly out of the metal????  

Probably not, honestly.  Because metal can’t get cancer.  It’s probably, I dunno, weird bone or something.

ANYWAY I think iterators are colonial organisms, like siphonophores. Think the Man ‘o War jellyfish – it’s actually not one creature, but a bunch of physically connected creatures, each with a specialized purpose that helps all the other creatures around it survive, and all working together.  You’ve got critters that work as a digestive system, others for respiratory or circulatory, others that act as the outer shell/layer/skin, others that act as a skeletal framework, that kind of thing.  

Iterators are like that, but on a MUCH larger scale, built by human(?) hands, and maybe with some fully mechanical parts mixed in here and there.  I mean, just look at these examples of what all we definitely know they have:

Neuron flies, which store memories and I think carry signals/messages between other neural organisms.

Those weird red squiggly things that grow out of some walls and free-drift in other places – I’ve seen neurons connect to the tendrils coming off those things and give off little electrical flashes so those are more neural organisms.

The small hair-like tendrils that glow blue growing out of the wall are probably another version of the red squiggly things.

Inspectors are DEFINITELY acting as the immune system here.  They attack you if you grab/harm neuron flies, they just throw spears and toss you around instead of eating you alive like OUR immune cells usually do.

Those weird red structures attended to by lil white spidery things in the Memory Conflux of Five Pebbles are probably some kind of long-term memory storage, considering the title of the sub-region.

On top of these, we’ve probably got some sort of circulatory system equivalent – in some places you can hear what sounds a bit like a heartbeat pulsing in the background.  (Just, you know, if you were hearing it from right outside the vessel walls and hearing all the liquid rushing past on every beat.)  There’s probably some sort of specialized system for sucking up and processing the water that the iterators canonically use as coolant, ending in some sort of respiration that lets out all the water vapor from that process. There’s GOT to be some sort of digestive system equivalent because I seriously doubt that the “bio” part of “bio-tech” can survive without SOME sort of nutrients, but Void if I know what that might be.  Maybe they’ve got some of that glowy mold being cultivated somewhere in their structure, that stuff seems to grow on their probably-not-metal framework pretty well.  

Then there’s whatever the rarefaction cell in Rivulet’s campaign is plugged into... it’s called the “Heart” in Moon’s structure, maybe it’s connected to a circulatory system, or maybe that’s a mechanical part versus an organic one, I don’t know.  More food for thought.

About the only thing I think the iterators DON’T have is any kind of reproductive system.  Iterators too close to one another can suck up all the water and leave another high and dry, so too many iterators in the same region would probably cause a drought.  On top of that, lust is one of the earthly urges the Ancients are trying to let go of in order to ascend – no way they’d leave their giant holy supercomputers with the ability to do THAT.  They’d probably have aneurysms even thinking about it.

[ardienothesieno]

[ressioo]

Random doodle sharing time yet again. Pebbles such a creature

I should draw sunstone again, i reckon. Been a while

[mothsakura]

guh... my back really hurts