#it's because the way he viewed it you couldn't be catholic AND queer

[freakyfreak01]

kind of dawned on me recently how much of mac's character is his inability to be his own person and how he will always have to rely on someone else (luther, dennis, god) to tell him what to do and who to be. he's always trying to label himself as something to avoid being nothing, and he cannot separate himself from being an extension of someone else. he is luther mcdonald's son, he is dennis reynolds' roommate, he is charlie kelly's best friend. he is catholic, he is gay, he is irish, he is the brains. and he accumulates a many number of titles to form his identity because without them, he doesn't know how else to function.

[worrynoodle]

I think part of the reason I identify so closely to aziraphale is that he had also deconstructed and doesn't believe the same things he was "brought up" to believe but he is attached to an environment/'family' that is deeply entrenched in those beliefs and he knows he will suffer consequences if he let's them find out that he has changed.

I grew up Christian, my dad's side was catholic and my moms side was Presbyterian, and both their families have been that way as far back as we know.

After I discovered I was queer I started to deconstruct my beliefs and it was HARD. it was gut-wrenching and I tried everything to hang on to my faith, white-knuckled. But at some point nothing added up anymore and I just simply couldn't justify trying to believe anymore.

But if my family knew... they'd make my life hell. It would be constant bible-bashing, shunning, and verbal abuse. I'd lose them all. And I just don't want to go through that.

So seeing aziraphale be who truly is with crowley and then mask himself to heaven really reaches me. I know how that feels. Wanting to view them as good but knowing what lurks beneath and wanting desperately to change that. Not fully breaking off because you feel safe with the attachment to what is familiar.

I see good omens, especially season two, as aziraphales deconstruction story. The story of job is actually one that really put the nail in the coffin for me, too.

I hope we get to see aziraphale finally let go because then maybe I can too.

[devoursbears]

So I go to a gay church in my area because I like the community and it is honestly incredible to see old queers every week. But I've been thinking recently about this particular dynamic in the bible study group.

in the group there is this gay catholic and and a nonbinary communist who are both retirement age and butt heads on every topic, with the Catholic very adamant in his positions and being sure of his being right about How To Christianity. Then the Communist who has studied other religions and is much more concerned with the Divinity found in humanity than some invisible Patriarch making all the rules. and it as me thinking about the Uber Right Wing politics of a buncha christians, and how 'traditional christianity' really does make sense with their political views (and lets be honest, it was designed that way)

because like, the Catholic. He means well, but basically always falls back to "Yeah God is easy. He is perfect and mysterious and we can't understand him but we have to follow his rules and those rules are the Bible and the Catholic Doctrine." Which. Every time I hear him talk I cant help but hear right wing rhetoric about not questioning established authority and how those in power got there in the first place.

For example, there was a discussion about Sin. and the Catholic goes on the expected spiel of "Sin is these actions as defined by bible and to be rid of sin you have to do the 3 step plan that the church made up which goes like admit guilt, apologize, then repent by not doing the thing again and also pray about it. Bam Done. Easy Peasy."

He kept repeating this line of reasoning even when this other guy, a New guy who specifically doesn't like Christianity because of people who prescribe how to think and act, as it is a trigger for New guy. But the Catholic couldn't tell that. His Catholic Programming wasn't able to compute any other way of a Correct Relationship with Religion. It felt incredibly reminiscent of something along the lines of "oh its easy to not get arrested, just don't to a crime sweaty :))))" type rhetoric.

and I don't have the writing skills to make extensive conclusions and tie all the strings together but I just wanted to share this pattern I see. where right wing Evangelical Christians have their view on life baked in in every aspect of their beliefs. and its frustrating!!! because religion even including Christianity can be a helpful tool for spirituality/hope in the world/ community for people but just like any system of power, it is important to question the structure, and who is in power and why. And like most power structures that want to maintain that structure, Christianity and Right Wing rhetoric often go hand in hand in their ability to drive any questioning out.

Anyhow, shoutout to Alien the 70ish year old nonbinary racing champ with an intersex cat they are my hero and I love them for having the energy to push back against the Catholic and his rigid power structures.

[daughter-of-sapph0]

May I ask what helped you decide you wanted to convert? For me, there's always been a fascination with Jewish culture that grew into a lot of love for all of the aspects of religion. As a queer person, the celebration of survival against all odds really spoke to me as well as the deep philosophical nit-picking of the Talmud and what god even means. The fact that you even be Jewish and convert as well without even fully believing in god is very meaningful to me.

I haven't started my conversion process yet because the only synagogue near me has some pretty bad politics but I really hope to be able to start one day

Anyway I hope you have a nice day💖

I've had this ask in my inbox for days because I've spent forever just thinking about how to answer it. I'd say it's really two big things that made me want to convert. the first thing being the people around me who were Jewish and had a love for their religion, and the second being my catholic mother.

let me explain the my mother first. I was raised catholic. my mother comes from an Irish catholic family, so from birth to about 8th grade I was raised as a catholic. I never really questioned it any. my dad was lutheran, and even though he wasn't religious, we sometimes went to mass with his parents. and we also had lots of friends who were all different flavors of christian, so I had a pretty diverse experience of what it ment to be christian. but that's the thing, I only knew about christianity. I mean, I knew other religions existed. I knew that other people believed things that were different than the things I believed. I knew there were different traditions and holidays and such. but I knew basically nothing about it until I got to middle school.

I went to a very small catholic school for middle school. I had previously gone to a public elementary school. but at 6th grade, my mother really wanted me to go to the school she went to when she was a kid. it was a tiny little k-8 brick building connected to the local church that couldn't have had more than 200 kids in the entire school. it was basically the same as public school, although the math program was a year ahead so I was doing geometry in algebra 1 in 8th grade instead of 9th. we had a religion class that was basically history revolving around early christianity. I say that because although they said it was the history of Jewish people before Jesus, it was taught in a very christian-centric way.

I wouldn't say it was a bad school. there was never any forced political views. there was an optional field trip to go to the march for life anti abortion thing in DC, and I wanted to go (because I was a stupid kid who had no idea what abortion even was and just wanted to visit DC) but my mom told me I really shouldn't and explained why she's pro choice. I distinctly remember this conversation with her, because it was at that point I realized that christians, even of the same dinomination, have wildly different views, but you aren't really allowed to talk about it.

I can't remember a lot about the school. I just remember that I was bullied a lot. I had severe undiagnosed adhd and autism, plus I was struggling with my own sexuality and gender. although the school wasn't outright homophobic, it wasn't like they were hosting pflag meetings either. so I kinda bottled my emotions up until high school. it was at that time I became an atheist. I was questioning the concept of an all knowing and all loving god who would make a world with so much hate and violence and sadness in it. I couldn't accept that god loved me, knew everything about me, made me the way I am, but also hated me because I was gay and disabled. obviously I wasn't taught this at middle school. but I heard it online from homophobes and ablists using religion to harm others, and I associated this with all christians. I didn't hate christianity, I just didn't want to be a part of it.

so anyway, I was an atheist for a while. for about two years in high school. I wasn't a reddit atheist or an antitheist. I still respected other people's religions. I just didn't believe in any of my own. I was still questioning my gender at this time, and I struggled a lot with grades especially in my freshman year. I finally started going to therapy and taking meds to help focus, and my grades drastically improved my sophomore year. (I just realized that those terms probably mean nothing to non-americans. freshman is first year of high school, or 9th grade. sophomore is second year of high school, or 10th grade. junior is third, or 11th grade. and senior is fourth, or 12th grade)

my mom was always supporting me through all of this. she accepted me with everything that was going on in my life, whether it's religion or sexuality or disability or gender. she was the first family member I came out as trans to. and she has been nothing but supportive and loving for my entire life. she like, the exact opposite of a conservative christian. she uses her religion and her faith to spread love, and not hate. and even though at this point I wasn't a christian, she still supported me because of her being raised as a catholic to love everyone. and she never forced me to go to church or change back to catholicism or anything. she let me do my own thing and supported everything I did.

anyway, I came out as trans during the middle of my junior year. I had just been through a rough breakup with a really nice guy, but he helped me figure out my gender shit and made me realize I could be whatever gender I wanted to be as long as I was happy. we stayed friends for a while after that. but he was a year older than me so we didn't really talk after he graduated. but he helped me realize I was trans. and now I started to feel better and more confident about myself. I made friends with a lot of people online. I specifically made efforts to make friends with all different types of people. I had always been a pretty liberal person and social justice advocate. but I wanted to try and learn more about the world beyond my very limited experience. and either by coincidence or fate, I ended up being friends with a lot of transgender Jews. I spent a lot of time learning about Judaism and what it ment to be Jewish. idk what it was, but I felt a really strong connection to my Jewish friends.

but anyway, I'm going through high school, in my senior year, while also taking night classes at community college. just going about life, taking sociology and psychology, while also being a social justice advocate online. when BOOM, pandemic. everything stopped. I graduated high school, but college switched to online and my grades tanked again. it was just like freshman year, except now I was paying nearly two thousand dollars a semester. so I quit. I would have became a total shut in if I hadn't met some really nice people who lived nearby. they helped me be more confident with my self image and personality. I went out more, safely of course because it was the pandemic. I decided I wasn't going to quit college, but just take a break until in person classes started again. I had a few jobs in retail and restaurants, which all absolutely sucked. and I spent a lot of time meditating and thinking to myself about philosophy. since I had a lot of free time, I read a lot. different religious texts and commentaries on those texts. I started to realize that I was religious, but I just didn't know how. I told my current philosophy to some of my friends, most of whom happened to be Jewish, and they said it sounded very similar to Judaism. so I looked into it. in fall of 2020, I reached out to a local rabbi, and told him I wanted to convert to Judaism. he denied me three times as per tradition, but finally said that if I wanted to be Jewish, I had to make sure it was the right religion for me. I had to study and ready and learn. converting is a long process, and usually takes years. I'm almost two and a half years into my conversion process. and from reading and talking with other Jewish people, I'm learning more every day. I've had times where I've doubted myself. where I felt like I had imposter syndrome, or like it wasn't my choice to convert. it's been hard sometimes. but I haven't given up. I'm staying with it because I truly love Judaism and Jewish people and traditions and culture and the thousands of different approaches to god and faith.

converting is gonna be different for everyone. but in general, it's not easy. and it's not supposed to be. you're not really supposed to convert out of Judaism. you can be a Jewish atheist. but once you're Jewish, you're intended to be Jewish for life. so all that time you spend studying and learning is supposed to make you ask yourself over and over and over again "are you sure". and every single time I've asked myself that question, the answer has always been "yes".

sorry this turned out to be more of a life story than a simple answer as to why I chose to convert. but there is no simple answer. I didn't just wake up one day and decide to be Jewish. it was a long process from the millions of decisions and choices by me and the people around me that lead me to where I am today. in religion, philosophy, art, and life in general, there are no such things as simple answers. so, find beauty in the complexity of the universe.

thank you, anon