#it’s just so interesting that that’s some people’s entire conception of tgcf bc to me

[muqingapologist]

it’s always crazy to me when i meet somebody who has only watched the heaven official’s blessing donghua, and sometimes they don’t even know there’s a novel. im just like, do you know?? how much you’re missing out on?? do you know?? let me help you. here’s a 2000-page pdf of the entire story. or would you rather an epub? what’s your email?

[olderthannetfic]

https://olderthannetfic.tumblr.com/post/739683077572395008/kids-in-my-anime-adjacent-fandom-discoursing-over

Reminds me of the time I found out that most East Asian BL writers actually have a set bottom/top dynamic and that switching is very very rare. I think the author for MDZS/The Untamed said that the main couple shouldn't be switched, and that the Chinese Danmei fandoms do follow that for the most part. As in, most Danmei fandoms do not switch the dynamics of the top/bottom in general, nor do they do much switching at all? Which makes it absolutely hilarious how the Western fandoms keep insisting certain Danmei boys to be switches or switching their dynamics and claiming it's canon. TGCF/Heaven official's blessing seems to be such a case, from the same author as MDZS. Author says Red dude is the top, and White dude is the bottom. Western fandom starts arguing dynamics because there's no porn in the books. (Apparently Chinese censorship bc one of them is a God.)

And just to be clear, I'm just sharing what I got told, so if you don't like it, that's not my problem. If I'm wrong though, I'd welcome the clearing up.

--

Sighhhhh.

Anon... Yes, this is roughly correct, but it's also just tonally kind of wacky. It's like if someone sent me an ask going "Apparently, some women ship m/m, but don't quote me on that".

If I don't like it, that's not your problem?

Really?

What a whiny bitch-ass thing to say in someone's inbox, dude.

--

Anyway, on the actual topic, yes, 100% strict top/bottom roles have been the norm in many Asian fandoms and, to some extent, foreign fandoms for Asian media.

That doesn't mean nobody ever likes switches there though. There are terms for that. It's just not as common and doesn't sell or get clicks as well.

Yes, you can generally tell from BL/danmei canons exactly who the top and bottom are even if there's no sex. It's like reading a Regency romance novel and figuring out which love interest is "the rake" or whatever. It's more than just who sticks it in: It's a whole constellation of character cliches that go together.

The only reason Western fans can't tell is 1. bad translations that lose the flavor of the original, 2. n00bs not knowing the tropes, 3. willful blindness.

It's like that post from a while back about shizun-fuckers. Yeah, there are tons of ships where the older partner is the top, but this trope is about reversing that, and it's so unbelievably unsubtle.

I've heard that Yami no Matsuei's set of leads is so wacky because the author changed direction on who was the main lead and who was supposed to read as more of a bottom and thus this one dude doesn't read as quite the trope he was probably originally supposed to be.

(Cue reheated zombie wank about who's the bottomiest bottom out of all of the abused woobies in YnM.)

--

Re Chinese censorship, it has varied over time. I'm no expert either, so people are welcome to chime in, but basically, a lot of horny stuff is straight up illegal on the mainland and they've been cracking down in recent years in a way they didn't a while back.

A lot of danmei novels will have the less censored version printed in Taiwan.

It's not just about some character being a god: it's about the entire concept of pornography being illegal.

Some decades, you can push the boundaries a lot; some, you can't.

[llycaons]

finally reading the last book of tg/cf and maybe it's an unpopular opinion (I'm not really in the fandom) but the way the female characters are written is a complete let down. Like words can't describe how much I find them lacking. Don't even get me started on the racism (Banyue arc was a slugfest and it took me days to suck it up and read it)

hi anon! I can't speak for popular opinion - I'm not really deep in the fandom either and i get the sense most people just care abt hualian (🙄) - but...yeah....famously almost ALL of the female mdzs characters die, and while that doesn't happen in tgcf, they're not the most impressive. it's not something I think of as mxtx's strong point, tho I do love jyl and rain master and ling wen and jian lan. there's things I liked about a lot of them - lets see how they end up *quickly googles tgcf female characters bc it's been so long*

ban yue: part of the famously extremely racist arc and also a VERY very contrived and boring one. nobody enjoys this arc I think. its a real drag to read and it perpetuates horrible stereotypes. how does she end up...not very memorably I think

ling wen: while I really liked the brief exploration of workplace misogyny, the brocade immortal stuff always baffled me from a character perspective. she ends the story just as overworked and unhappy as before. okay!

xuan ji: overly-emotional woman obsessed with getting a man's attention despite him not being interested. I've seen her character being praised as a depiction of 'stalking isn't romantic' but 1. hc's obsession with xl literally IS portrayed as romantic and 2. this entire character concept is rly misogynistic sorry. she ends the story giving up pm and moving on after he basically yells at her iirc, which is nice in the sense that she finds peace, but it's an anticlimactic finale for her after hundreds of pages of strife

sqx: I don't want to give mxtx credit for creating a trans women/genderfluid character here bc she explicitly ties sqx's gender with shapeshifting and then leaves sqx unable to shapeshift at the end of the story and at peace with her fate. so like. idk EYE think it makes sense to read her as genderfluid or a trans woman but I don't think mxtx sees her the same way and I think leaving her unable to take the form she loves so dearly is a bit sad given how strongly tied her gender has been to her shapeshifting, even tho leaving her explicitly disabled as a happy ending did make me feel some kind of way

yushi huang: YUSHI HUANG!!!!!!! I love rain master I truly do think she one of mxtx's best characters. I do think she's a bit more static and less developed/deep than she could be but her cool disinterest in pm and pm's desperate inept floundering posturing machismo is truly SO so funny to me I love her so much and her backstory is really neat. she doesn't undergo much change in the story either tho so while I do love her she's not really a dynamic character

jian lan: I actually really love jian lan and I think her arc is great. like her personality rules, she's funny as hell, she's very independent and self-reliant and refuses what she sees as pity and fx settling in the end even tho she's a working mother and he's a powerful god offering his support to her. and it foils nicely, if simplistically, with xl being like 'no...true love DOES exist...' and it can be a letdown if you were hoping for her and fx to get back together but I never got the sense they felt that way about each other anymore...I was glad for her to get her baby back and return to her life. she might have the most satisfying arc in the story and that's not saying a lot bc even then it was really barely an arc 😭

re: misogyny in tgcf I always get so pissed off when people praise hc for ~looking out for the abused ghosts~ because let's be real he is such a piece of shit to them and any altruism he shows them is externally imposed by his idolism of xl. I know I've made posts about this before but in that gambler's den scene he fully was allowing men to bet THEIR DAUGHTER'S LIVES being like 'yeah people can bet whatever they want it's their choice' THOSE ARE NOT THEIR LIVES THEY'RE BETTING AWAY!!! WOMEN AREN'T PROPERTY!!! and the way he used those female dancers as props/set dressing to to be ignored when xl showed up and the way he literally ignored jian lan when she KNEELED TO HIM in gratitude because he was too cool to acknowledge her I guess he's actually such an asshole and I resent how the fandom hypes him up so much and how in-universe he's so adored for like???? running a city that shelters ghosts ig but on a personal level he's so narrow-minded and such a mean-spirited and petty dick for NO reason.

sorry I started ranting abt hc. h/l have insane chemistry and their scenes are fun but the way hc acts (esp towards women) and is treated by the narrative is like one of my least favorite parts of the story.

but yeah I feel you. the women are not treated as well as they could have been 😔 but at least most of them are alive! I can't even recommend fgep, which does have great female characters, without serious disclaimers that the main character advocates for genocide against her political enemies (central asian peoples). like I read fgep and I did like it but some of the scenes I had to be like. what the fuck am I reading. also it's a political/military/court drama so there's no fantasy elements

my actual recommendation is to watch the double which is about women in a big way but I'm only like 16 episodes in so idk how it ends either 😭 either way, thanks for the ask! and thanks for reading, please take a look at this campaign to raise money for the family of a journalist in Gaza

[zhuhongs]

Upon rereading tgcf, one of the biggest complaints I have is how lackluster all the extra chapters were. literally none of them were good and all contained rlly gross and harmful sentiments (like the amnesia one which.. yea.. or all the things implying xl should get pregnant for hc thus equating gay relationships with hetero ones and playing into the wife thing and just GOD I HATE MXTX) 

There were a lot of little plot points i wish that had been further elaborated on more in the extras as opposed to hualian being ... like that. I had enough. Like mdzs had actaully good extras (minus the incense burners) that were nice side stories that elaborated more on the characters. Like the hook one with the juniors was so cute and i loved seeing them grow more. Or the lotus pod extras omg.. im such a lotus pod extra stan. those were so cute and gave us a lot of good insight into just how lovestruck lwj was during the times when he didn’t see wwx. mxtx should've stuck to those sorta extras in tgcf but NOOO. SO I have a list of so many other more interesting things those chapters couldve been spent on like:

A resolution on He Xuan’s revenge and his character arc. Bc its implied He Xuan is still hanging out and watching over sqx and that taking revenge didn’t fully satisfy him bc ok.. yea shi wudu is dead but he xuans family will never come back. Now what does he have to live for?? i wish we couldve seen a look into his life during the entire ordeal. like a chapter from his perspective while he was posing as Ming Yi  and maybe a look at a conversation btw he xuan and the real ming yi or a chapter after SQX was banished to see what he’s doing now. Also what did he xuan owe hua cheng money for anyways?? Like ik not every little thing has to be explained but I Want to Know. PLEASE more goth boyfriend content now I just wanna see him :,((

a better resolution of yin yu and quan yizhens storyline. im still mad abt how that plot point was split btw books 3 and 5  when it was rlly out of place and  there were other more pressing plot matters and it just rlly deserved more time. Also i thought yin yu died!?!?!? but apparently one of the extras says he’s alive and man... i;m not reading any more of the extras to see that, give me a full yin yu and quan yizhen chapter.. fuck.

a day in the life of the guoshi fangxin or general hua PLEASE especially like one where hua cheng was SO CLOSE to meeting xie lian but had no clue that xie lian was there at the time but the two did smth that inadvertantly helped the other and they still were connected even though they hadnt met omg pls that’d be so nice. like imagine Hua cheng catching a glimpse of the guoshi in public in yong’an while he’s trying to follow some lead that points to xie lian or maybe following a lead to capture qi rong bc he said he knew qi rong was a part of the yong’an stuff and originally thought the guoshi was one of qi rongs pawns. like can you IMAGINE him getting so close. but at the last second he did smth small that impacted xie lian. like they bumped into eachother on the street or smth. god i’d go crazy

OR vice versa.. like a day in the life of the young ghost king hua cheng. Like again, one of my biggest issues was that hua cheng just knew everything and its never really explained how he got all of that info. like yes he’s been alive very long and has eyes and ppl working for him everywhere but like... how did he build that network?? I’d love to see a chapter of young ghost king hua cheng travelling around trying to learn as much as he can abt the world and how it can help bring him to xie lian. and the two maybe are in the same kingdom for a bit and they don’t meet exactly but hua cheng stops some fight or something and helps xie lian indirectly or maybe xie lian is performing on the street in some costume and hua cheng doesn’t recognize him and smiles and gives him a coin or smth. idk i’m just dying for any sorta extra chapter or fic like that. i’m honestly so tempted to write my own but i cant write

also!! we’ve seen how xie lian picks up people down on their luck near him and show them kindness (like banyue, lang ying, xiao ying, he tried to with san lang but we know how that ended lmao) so i’d love to see another little vignette of him doing that on his travels and how every person he meets teaches him smth about life and being a good person and idk, i just think it’d be rlly sweet. i love this facet of his character and feel like we didn’t see enough of it towards the end.

ALSO hua cheng only seems to respect one heavenly official besides xie lian and thats yushi huang.. i assume thats mostly bc she was the only one to help xie lian and let him use the rain master hat to bring water to yong’an. I was thinking maybe when he was a new supreme he had run into trouble and maybe was picked up by the rain master and helped him heal and in return he promised to help protect her village from harm in the future. Like i know a heavenly official wouldn’t cooperate with a ghost like that but yushi huang is different and doesn’t really care about the heavens so i think she would protect him if he could do something to benefit her village. ik this is kinda far fetched but when he first became a supreme I’m sure a bunch of ppl probably tried to mess with him and didn’t rlly believe him to be undefeatable bc he hadn’t proved himself yet also i doubt all his power came overnight. he had to learn how to use it once he escaped the kiln. and some group probably thought they could weaken him somehow. I’m thinking maybe a rlly well formed group of ghosts actually caught him off guard once and he had to retreat and was picked up by the rain master and stayed with her and learned from her a bit. i think it’d be a cool concept also i just rlly want more yushi huang content and i’m on their friendship agenda bc he rlly did seem to actually respect her when she first appeared and i think it’d be cool if the two had some history together.

Also idrc if this was addressed I couldve missed it But!! Did xie lian ever tell Hua cheng that the reason he got the curse shackles and was banished again in the first place wasnt bc jun wu wanted to punish him, but because he requested it. And specifically requested it bc he felt guilty abt letting wu ming take the human face disease and disperse for his sake. So he took the shackles and descended to atone for that?? Bc I dont recall hua cheng learning that bc his soul was already dispersed at that point so it didnt follow him and xie lian didnt say anything so uhhh... someone should tell hua cheng that. Like I dont think xie lian rlly said how much hua cheng meant to him and didnt show him he was loved in grand ways. Like xie lian did always care for bc in other ways but I think if hua cheng learned abt this on screen it wouldve been such a great moment and I'm rlly surprised mxtx didnt address this iirc!?!? Like imagine jun wu telling Hua cheng this in the kiln bc xie lian wouldnt say it himself. Imagine how cool that would be.

Also a small thing adding into the whole young ghost king Hua cheng stuff. Its implied and p much stated that hua cheng isnt his real name. That he likely doesnt have a real name bc his parents died? (It's not clear. I'm still mad at mxtx for not making his childhood clearer). So I'd like to see when and why hua cheng chose that name for himself. The new tgcf ending song kinda hints at its meaning with the lyrics "for you I'd fill a city of flowers" as xie lian is the flower wielding martial god so it's probably inspired by that. Also xie lian saved hua cheng from leaping off the city walls but I'd love to hear him say it bc the implication of his name didnt dawn on me for quite a bit and I dont know if everyone made the connection. Again I sure as hell didnt. So itd be cool to see a chapter that takes place in his past after just ascending as a supreme

Overall I rlly think tgcf had a lot more potential to be even better and a lot of that comes down to fleshing out the side characters and letting hualian have more of a storyline independent of one another. like i know the appeal and message of tgcf is that through love, people can overcome anything, but fuck man. i just wanna see what these two (mostly hua cheng) where like in the absence of each others presence. Part of what I really liked abt mdzs is that we got to see that longing develop btw wangxian when the two weren’t together and how they thought about each other and did things in thei others spirit bc they knew the other wouldve done the same thing. but whatever, mxtx was too consumed by her own unhealthy idea of what devotion and true love looks like but still. i rlly think the extras couldve helped the story be better rather than be fujoshi fuel that i try to bleach from my mind -_-

[xcziel]

get to know me

tagged by @vishcount (thank you!!) and i'll follow her format bc making two posts seems a little much - i'm not that interesting!!

(hilariously, this post shows up as blocked for me bc of the tag 'joker' which? tumblr?????)

Part I

name: i'm an internet old, so i never use my real name online, mainly because it's spelled in a very unique way (thanks mom & dad) - i mean like, if you googled it you could find my home address in a few seconds kind of unique - but also, though i do enjoy the spelling, i actually don't like it very much when it's said out loud? (is it weird that my name written down is 'me', but my name aloud has never felt like 'me'?) always wanted a nickname but never acquired one :/

at any rate, i've had the username xcziel forever and i go by that 😊 (pronounced ex-SEE-zee-el, similar to etc. or ex-SET-er-ah! thanks @xia-xueyi for pointing out that it can be confusing to guess!)

rest behind a cut because it got long!

pronouns: she/her

star sign: i don't ... really *do* astrology? but technically saggitarius

height: 5'4" (162.5cm for the intl folks)

time: 5:43pm but these thing take me forever to type out so ... ???

birthday: playing the 'internet old' card again .. but it floats around american Thanksgiving depending on the year

nationality: american

fave bands/groups/solo artists: lumping these together because i just .. don't really do music much anymore. if you had asked me this back in my 20s i'm sure i would have had all kinds of opinions and things to share, but these days i actually mostly prefer to listen music from when i was a kid. part of it is also that as an old, i prefer to buy my music, even digitally, and i don't really use spotify - which does so much to enable diverse music exploration i admit! but i mostly have earplugs in all the time and music does not work for me as background noise, so...

so i guess my answer would be 70s disco and classic rock and 80s new wave artists? i've never liked any artist's entire discography and prefer greatest hits-type compilations, but i guess duran duran and def leppard and depeche mode would be considered formative? i love new order but specifically late 80s new order, NOT joy division. the only concert t-shirt i've ever worn was the cult? i loved sonic temple but i can't listen to most of it anymore though i still adore love removal machine. i think maybe if you get old enough, for some of us there's TOO MUCH good music and we can't pare it down anymore

song stuck in your head: jamiroquai's canned heat

last movie you watched: re: the above, i re-watched center stage, the 2000 one with zoe saldana and the mandy moore soundtrack, bc it's a happy comfort movie and i just got a digital version

last show you binged: i can't really "binge" very often bc after a couple of hours i need a break, so i guess i'd say the tgcf donghua on netflix since it was short enough to get through all in one go

when you created your blog: in 2012 i stopped lurking so i could post about the avengers movie

the last thing you googled: 5'4" in cm? lol before that it was chinese wrapped street food

other blogs: everything is here! i discovered i compartmentalize about as well as i tag reliably (😓) but i do have several automated ao3feed-tag style sideblogs. and i did, very briefly, have a *winces* hockey sideblog too

why i chose my url: ooh i know i've done this before, sorry if it's repetitive, basically it was the username i picked back when my family first got aol: short, unique combo of letters - 14-year-old me really thought about it! and then it wouldn't let me use anything other than my name. thirty-some-odd years later, trying to come up with a livejournal username that wasn't already taken and getting fed up, i plugged it in and went: good enough!

how many people are you following: like 760-something last i checked? although many, many, many of them are deactivated

how many followers do you have: idk i don't like looking at that stuff, but way fewer than i am following

average hours of sleep: it varies too much day by day, my sleep schedule is too wonky, i have no idea what the average would be

lucky numbers: 7? cliché i know, and again not really buying into it, but somewhere in my hindbrain i like it that my first, middle, and last names all have seven letters

instruments: none. i like singing

what i'm currently wearing: giant black t-shirt and baggy black drawstring shorts, standard sitting around the house gear

dream job: don't have one. if i did it would give me something to be working towards *sigh* this is how you end up in retail for decades, kids! but also, to quote a random post i saw in true tumblr fashion "i simply do not dream of labor"

dream trip: covered this one before but: back to the uk and some railway daytrips, or a really fancy northern cruise, atlantic/pacific either one

fave food: uhhh, don't really have a favorite but i'm almost always in the mood for pizza

top three fictional universe you'd like to live in: none really, if i had to still be me..maybe some kind of actually utopian future? but the pandemic has confirmed for me that i do NOT like living in interesting times, so most fictional story universes are RIGHT out. my favorites to read about like discworld or diana wynne jones' worlds would be way to chaotic for my comfort. possibly diane duane's young wizards universe would be safe enough to be okay?

Part II

last song: watching center stage made me think of my dance playlist so sunrise by simply red

last movielast stream: i don't watch streams or youtube often, so it was the same as you, vish! liu chang's birthday stream was SO enjoyable i screenrecorded the entire thing just so i could play it back (and maybe gif sometime if i ever get the drive to actually do it)

currently reading: well i just finished the translated quan qiu gao kao or global university entrance exam novel, which was sparked purely from catching a single rec post here on tumblr and basically just *falling* into this 166 chapter epic that is *amazing* and not coming up for air until i got to the end, which is typical novel-reading behavior for me (yes i was the kid who read through lunch period and got hassled by people who kept pestering me with "what're you reading" questions and yes i realize probably a lot of you on tumblr were too) plus, the new murderbot novel is out tomorrow!!!!! so that'll be where i end up next!

currently watching: the entire dmbj verse (that i can get my hands on) but ... sporadically and stopping at random different parts because the thing is ... this type of show is not really the kind i enjoy so much? so since it's more for "research" and learning character arcs (and let's be honest: shots of liu sang), etc. it's easy to get distracted by other stuff. i'm also watching the sleuth of the ming dynasty, mr queen, bromance, the expanse, re-watching farscape and stargate sg-1, just finished the falcon and the winter soldier, and then anytime something new and short gets introduced it jumps the queue. there are just. so. many. things. to. watch! (now i have to look into anti-fraud league too!? you all are cruel ...)

what is antipoetry to you: i ... don't really think much about poetry? i know what i prefer is usually the more basic rhymed kind like lewis carroll, emily dickinson, poe, coleridge, etc. so i suppose i don't have much use for classifying non-rhyming verse? i can appreciate stuff like rupi kaur which i guess would qualify? or that william carlos williams plums poem? but it doesn't really stick with me the way lyric-like verse does

currently craving: i never know what exactly this is meant to be in reference to ... hmmm, i would love a new high-concept, high production-quality movie like say, pacific rim, to be released, just for that massive, excited energy that comes with something new that hasn't already got tons of disappointing or conflicting history behind it - that would be so fun!!

other than that, right now, i mostly kinda want some fried fish? but that will have to wait until i go to get my second vaccine shot on wednesday since it's on the way there. i'd also like my internal body parts to settle down and fly right but it's been more than a month and they don't seem inclined :(((( maybe once i'm fully vaxxed i'll think about consulting somebody about it

tagging @foxofninetales @xia-xueyi @momosandlemonsoda @memorydragon @thewindsofsong @elvencantation @mylastbraincql @hesayshesgotboyfriend @aurawolfgirl2000 @smaragdine-galaxy and anyone who wants to! but never feel obligated and if you don't get around to it for like half a year that's totally fine, i am still interested!!!