#i genuinely hope this helps bc its NOT internalized sexism

[vexingwoman]

Uh not actually here to hate but to say thanks???? Ive been thinking alot on my self expression and trying to figure out how to word it, and seeing some of your comments with other people really helped to put in perspective what I was trying to come to terms with. Ive always struggled with my gender but acknowledge fully that I'm biologically female. (Stay with me here till the end please i know lol) I genuinely dont care what pronouns I'm called either and none have ever felt right if I'm honest and nothing I've read or tried has been adding up for me over the years to help me feel any better.

Kinda realizing over the past year or so that I just have this deep ingrained idea from being surrounded constantly my whole life in a woman hating environment that I just have a *really* heavily masked hatred for what general society treats women as and was trying to remove myself from it hoping itd somehow save me from the terrible shit we all go through daily. And it just made me feel even more alienated doing that to myself. Its been a long time of coming around to this and I know how it sounds but I dont wanna consider any of my time wasted. I dont remember what it was but something you said to someone in a long ass comment fight clicked for me and rn I'm sleep deprived and wont even remember what it was in the morning either but I feel like some kind of weight has been eased off me. Im doing my best to unlearn the sexist misogynistic bs ive had shoved down my throat my whole life that made me think being a woman was something to be shameful of and better off without.

Its been hard trying to look into this radfem community and find someone who didn't immediately just insult and exclude ppl that werent already on the ball agreeing. Basically I appreciate your ranting with strangers. Amd indulging some of their curiousity as clearly as you can+defining everything you say constantly so I dont get lost in a whirlwind of hard to understand metaphors. Idk you get it. Something clicked and i dont feel ashamed for the time gone bc I know it was heavily influenced by the oppression of all things normal-human-womanly around me. I hate that we're all so tied into these stereotypes. Its painfully hard to unlearn. Thanks for the help. Have a fat block of text as thanks cause I'm not sure how to sound as genuine as I feel rn. Have a nice day and an even better tomorrow. Im gonna get some sleep now💀(stayed up WAY too late painting lol) bye!

This is so wonderful to hear. I know how dreadful it is doing serious introspection and making yourself aware of how deeply and unconsciously your internalized sexism runs. I’ve been there, and I know it’s even more difficult to deconstruct the subtle sexist attitudes which have been ingrained into to us since birth. Often it seems as hopeless as chasing smoke, because some of our internalized sexism is so deep that it’s invisible, and worse, inarticulable.

Some women will never think on these subjects beyond their surface level—will never dissect their preferences, will never concede that their choices are influenced by sex-based socialization, will never seriously reflect on why they are so desperate to identify out of womanhood. And in a strange way, I sympathize with these women, because I understand that it’s easier to shut your eyes and convince yourself that you were born in the wrong body than it is to open your eyes and acknowledge how much sexism has seeped into and corrupted our own minds.

Basically, I’m proud of you for putting yourself through the pain of deconstructing your own internalized sexism. You are better for even attempting it, and I hope you continue to do so.

P.S. I know exactly which long-ass comment fight you’re referring to, because I only put myself through that once. At least someone benefited from the literal month I spent arguing with that stranger. They blocked me, so unfortunately I can’t even go back and analyze the conversation if I ever wanted to. I would love to know what you took away from it, if you ever do remember.

[yaoiadderall]

@thepigeondrivesthebus hey there! i’m not a he/him or they/them lesbian but i am a lesbian who has complicated feelings on womanhood so maybe i can shed some light on this.

historically, in western culture at least, womanhood has been defined by a woman’s relationships to men. for a long time women were considered property to be owned by men, and even though the culture is not so extreme nowadays, there’s still an overall idea that women are defined by the men around them. for example, some popular phrases to try to combat man-on-woman sexual assault is “shes someone’s daughter,” “what if she was your daughter/wife?” or things similar. it’s an example of women being defined by their relationship to a man, instead of by their personhood. do not assault her, not because she’s a person who doesn’t deserve it, but because she is a man’s daughter, because she could be a man’s wife.

now, this is obviously an issue for lesbians, who have no desire to form relationships with men. i really don’t think it’s a form of internalized misogyny, bc i’ve dealt with that and it’s a lot different than how i feel about womanhood as it’s presented in western culture. it’s likely an attempt to separate from a culture that tells you you’re nothing other than how you interact with the men in your life. lesbians are women or woman-alligned by definition, but society’s definition of women is one formed by misogyny and focused on heterosexuality. we love women, but it’s because we see what it means to be a woman differently than society has. our definition of womanhood is one that views women as people in their own right, no matter what relationships they have.

i imagine it’s something similar to gnc, butch, and femme lesbians. society defines femininity and a female gender expression in a heterocentric, male-focused way. lesbians who express themselves as gnc, butch, and femme are saying “i see what you think women should be like, and i’m saying i don’t want to be that. i’m not performing my gender for men, i’m performing it for me.” pronouns may be slightly more complex, but in my (limited) view, i believe it’s the same general principle: i don’t exist for men, i exist for myself. there’s also nonbinary lesbians who may not fully identify with any definition of womanhood, but still feel connected to it in some way and/or find it helpful in defining their sexuality. i’m cis, so i definitely can’t tell you the intricacies of being non-binary and i’d encourage you to look for resources by nonbinary people or specifically nonbinary lesbians if you want to learn more about that.

(also before ppl clown me abt including femme in that paragraph: im a femme lesbian and i assure you my expression of femininity is way different than the norm, as i think it is with most femme lesbians. our femininity is not and has never been to attract men, and that’s an important distinction. plus, if u just look at femme lesbian fashion vs mainstream women’s fashion there’s a huge difference. they’re both feminine, for sure, but there’s a LOT of little differences in what we like to wear generally. if u tell me femme lesbians look straight or conform to patriarchal beauty standards i’ll steal ur toenails for lying)

i just wanna say that this is just my opinion and view on this kind of thing based on my own personal experience and things i know about lesbian history, because lesbians have definitely had some complex views on gender and womanhood throughout history. again, i’m not a he/him or they/them lesbian, and so i can’t speak for them and any lesbians who use he/him or they/them please feel free to correct me if i got something wrong or you’ve had a different experience. i hope this helps you understand at least a little more about this kind of thing.

tl;dr: lesbians tend to have a complicated relationship with gender bc society’s view of being a woman is inherently misogynistic and heteronormative and that may be a reason to use “male” or neutral pronouns. also nonbinary lesbians exist and are valid. take everything with a grain of salt bc i’m not nonbinary and i don’t use he/him or they/them, i’m just a lesbian with complicated feelings abt womanhood who can 100% understand why someone might wanna use pronouns other than she. lmk if i’m wrong abt shit if ur better informed than me. trans women are women and cops are bastards. stay frosty, babes

lesbians: i think...i will use a little he/him (: a they/them...teeheehee

literally everyone, simultaneously: shut up you’re not real you’re harming the community shut up you’re hurting me you’re literally killing me