#how did JFM not favor WWX when he LITERALLY SHOWS IT WITH HIS ACTIONS??

[arikeia]

...how was JC not a victim? How did JFM not favor WWX? How was JGY not gentle, nice or loving toward LXC or his wife? HOW WAS WWX A MORAL IDEAL?

It's almost as if the OP is the one taking everything at face value ("WWX is the hero so he is morally ideal and untainted, while JGY is coded as the villain and therefore evil and bad in every single aspect").

To me, the BEST part of MDZS is that the hero is ultimately good but still morally grey, which makes him feel more realistic and (in my opinion) a much more interesting character, and that the main villain is not pure evil (I'd argue he shows plenty of genuine kindness to some people) but still makes terrible choices and hurts others for his own gain (justified or not).

In fact, if you pay attention, you'll realize that the main hero and main villain are so much alike - both are treated poorly by some (or most) people because of their family background and in a way feel like outsiders (WWX with the Jiangs and later in Cloud Recesses, JGY with the Nies and later with the Jins), they are both far more capable than their peers DESPITE their background, both are praised and admired while in a position of power and are made into scapegoats for every bad thing that happens in the cultivation world after their deaths (I can't remember if this happens in the novel, but in the live action drama WWX literally comments on how after JGY's death everything is blamed on him, even things he could have never done, just like everything was blamed on the Yiling patriarch when he was dead), and they both form a close bond with a Lan (WWX with LWJ, JGY with LXC) because the Lan brothers are the only ones who treat them with respect and ever bother to truly get to know them beyond the "that annoying but really talented drunkard kid/big scary Yiling patriarch" WWX and "son of a whore/chief cultivator" JGY.

The OP also seems to forget that while we, the readers, know that a big portion of the Wen family never agreed or wanted to partake in the horrors commited by WRH, most of the outsiders DIDN'T. In fact, your "morally ideal" WWX also reacts negatively toward them at first, before he is forced to let them help him and realize they are, in fact, good people in a terrible situation. Literally the WHOLE POINT of the WWX + Wens vs. the rest of the cultivating world conflict is that WWX is the ONLY ONE (well other than LWJ and JC briefly) who spent time with the Wens and truly got to know them, while the rest of the cultivating world only knows that they belong to a family that commited GENOCIDE. You're also ignoring the cultural differences - Nie Mingjue is literally considered by everyone to be a just leader, you might as well say his middle name is just and righteous, but he's just as happy and eager to have the remaining Wens executed. This is what is considered justice, a well-deserved fate for the members of the Wen family, and it's mainly because WWX opposes it that he becomes everybody's target. His growing power was becoming a problem for many, but I'd argue it wouldn't turn quite so violent quite so soon if not for the Wens.

I hope that at some point this fandom grows enough to accept that not all heroes are perfect and morally ideal, and not villains are pure evil.

I think some ppl don't realize the novel wouldn't exist if all the characters did as they said, MDZS is a novel that requires the readers to be able to read between the lines. When characters like JC, JGY and XY bring up their sob stories and claim they justify their evil, we're not supposed to believe them. A lot of what JC, YZY, JGY and XY say is contradict what actually happens in the story.

The entire plot is about misleading the readers with rumors and lies told by some characters and making us believe WWX was the villain in his past life only to find out WWX was always the moral ideal while everyone else was willing to condone torture and murder of innocents (in peacetime), or was actively targeting WWX out of greed for his power.

So no, JC isn't a a good person or a victim, JFM didn't favor WWX and he didn't hate JC, JGY is not actually gentle, nice or loving towards anybody, and XY isn't in any way fair. Those ppl all lie to justify their shitty behavior, and if we pay attention to what we're reading beyond just believing everything every character says, it's kind of obvious.

[llycaons]

ep9: it's impossible for me to be unbiased about this, but I'm trying to enjoy it on its own merits

sometimes I look at jfm and myu and go ah yes. this is familiar to me. actually in the donghua jfm's expression and mannerisms around his wife is eerily similar to my own father's. hm. moving on

wait nhs wasn't in this scene in cql. he fainted back at nightless and then we didn't see him again. right? I wonder why they did that. anyway he's here now

mm and wwx are flirting and having a lot of um romantic-coded interactions for want of a better word so it makes total sense than lwj thought wwx liked her. slightly less clear about it in cql, as most things are

it's helpful that lwj talks more openly. for the plot

oh fuck wwx got shot. who is that su she? and OHHH fuck they've been ambushed. im fairly sure this is donghua-only

this show's wen chao is more megalomaniac sadist where in cql he was more of a slimeball. again I literally do not remember my impression of him in the novel. I think he was cartoonishly evil

ugh the cgi on that tortoise is not so good

oh god the infamous "I'm hot so people will like it if I harass them" what an asshole truly. donghua wwx is such a dick

okay little wound-tending scene. I loved that lwj said "you're welcome" in cql that was so funny. but lwj saying thank you not once but TWICE is very welcome here

I've heard the donghua is at times more homoerotic than cql and I just don't see it. in fact, by leaving in the jokes about mxy-wwx liking men and wwx using flirting as a way to digust and offend lwj (albiet unsucessfully), it just kind of comes off as homophobic. I mean, at least they cut the line about wwx saying he's not into men in this cave scene because that would really be shooting themselves in the foot without the payoff later

not to sound like a broken record but I just thought it was so cool how cql implied wwx was bi without using being gay as a threat...like for the most part they were really careful and smart how they went about it but a lot of the scenes where it implied lwj or wwx liked men weren't based on the novel at all and came off as a lot less comedic, with more gravitas and more respect. because like. it's important! it's not a joke!

I guess with the exception of wwx and xy's little conversation when xy was tied up. that was hilarious, but I always thought of it as wwx owning his bisexuality and treating it with pride rather than it being the butt of the joke, because that response he gave was uhh how do you say it. triumphant? defiant? UGH that show is so much. how did it transcend its source material even while being censored. scream

anyway this little animation sequence with the ink drop in the water is really neat

EYYYYY LWJ CRYING. thank GOD I thought this was sorely missed in the drama. weirdly it's even more lifeless and static than in the actual novel. how DO they do it

the landscapes are gorgeous omg it's autumn

jc having to escape an ambush and getting to LP while injured is a lot more impressive than just popping out and running there. his coming pissiness about his achievements being ignored in favor of wwx's is going to feel a lot more earned

I don't feel any real affection between jc and wwx but I can tell they're close and I can appreciate the tragedy of their inevitable estrangment. but actually I don't think wwx is losing much compared to in cql. but the flashback is young. there's time to change my mind

ugh this cgi really is so bad

going to be real this fight scene is a shitshow in the novel. there are good action and drama scenes in that book and this is not one of them. it's just. it's a mess. it's hard to follow. the pacing is atrocious

this show took that scene and made it not only comprehensible, but actually exciting. four for you, donghua. the music was sick. animation was cool. cgi was ehhh

in cql I'm going to be real it was kind of a mess too. the special effects were not in this scene's favor. but eh, it was fun

I forgot about the evil sword too damn

here's another episode it took me too long to watch. I'm just not really invested in seeing the novel animated I guess. but the exciting bits should be coming soon

unrelated to the donghua, but I've started a folder for all the art I like. I have a meme folder now. so that's been my morning. I'm feeling very productive

[kitanomanako]

arikeia's tags: #what a terrible take this is#you had me in the first paragraph#but then you just said shit that makes me think you never truly engaged with this story#what a way to oversimplify complex characters because you're unable to accept that people are not either good or evil#WWX literally reanimated CORPSES#this would be considered immoral even in the West!#how did JFM not favor WWX when he LITERALLY SHOWS IT WITH HIS ACTIONS??#why would his own family and even OUTSIDERS think he favors WWX if not for his actions?#do you really think people would just believe Madame Yu's word on it?#the general public even made fun of her for how JFM treated WWX and started rumors that WWX might be JFM's bastard son because of it#HOW IS JC NOT A VICTIM???#he grew up with a toxic mother (who loved him sure but was STILL toxic and abusive) and a distant father#he lost his golden core (!!!) and was then given WWX's golden core WITHOUT HIS KNOWLEDGE OR CONSENT#HIS ENTIRE CLAN WAS MURDERED??????#LIKE#WHEN HE WAS STILL A TEEN?#not that it would be easier if he was an adult but jesus HE WAS A KID#HE SAW HIS ENTIRE FAMILY GET SLAUGHTERED#HE HAD TO WATCH HIS SISTER DIE#the only family member he had left other than WWX#listen I'm not a huge fan of JC but damn#just admit you hate him for whatever reason and move on#what a terrible terrible take this post was

I think some ppl don't realize the novel wouldn't exist if all the characters did as they said, MDZS is a novel that requires the readers to be able to read between the lines. When characters like JC, JGY and XY bring up their sob stories and claim they justify their evil, we're not supposed to believe them. A lot of what JC, YZY, JGY and XY say is contradict what actually happens in the story.

The entire plot is about misleading the readers with rumors and lies told by some characters and making us believe WWX was the villain in his past life only to find out WWX was always the moral ideal while everyone else was willing to condone torture and murder of innocents (in peacetime), or was actively targeting WWX out of greed for his power.

So no, JC isn't a a good person or a victim, JFM didn't favor WWX and he didn't hate JC, JGY is not actually gentle, nice or loving towards anybody, and XY isn't in any way fair. Those ppl all lie to justify their shitty behavior, and if we pay attention to what we're reading beyond just believing everything every character says, it's kind of obvious.