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phoenixtakaramono · 3 years

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Character Design Thoughts for Shen Yuan & Airplane Shooting Towards the Sky in ‘The Untold Tale’

(This is a Follow Up to This Post)

Hello, @averydrearydiana! Loved reading through your tags! I’m excited that you’re excited! Since I’m also seeing comments on AO3 speculating about how our transmigrators are going to appear as in The Untold Tale, I might as well give my current thoughts and have this archived on tumblr for future reference.

A fun fact about TUT is that a lot of the imagery in the story is inspired by Chinese PVs and popular C-dramas and literature. Since TUT is conceived as a lovestory to SVSSS, one element that I’d wanted to incorporate is playful attempts at satirical genre deconstruction. With that comes with me playfully poking fun at some clichés or things I’ve noticed in Chinese works.

Shen Yuan’s Celestial Design

Before I talk about his mortal appearance, I have to give a lil context about his celestial design in the story. We already know what he looks like as the celestial fortuneteller in TUT’s cover art that I’ve already posted on tumblr. As everyone knows, I was heavily inspired by this Chinese PV:

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(TUT ch1 - Excerpt)

Among the things I’ve noticed are the fictional characters with white hair. We have a whole subculture of fans liking male character designs with white hair in anime and animation. Taking that a step further, they’ve even shown up in C-dramas, i.e. Teng She from Love and Redemption (technically more blond than platinum white, but shhhhh, just let me have this), Dong Hua Dijun from Eternal Love of Dream aka Three Lives Three Worlds, Ten Miles of Peach Blossoms (rest assured, I’m aware of the source material’s controversy, but let’s not get into that here), etc. One of the tags for TUT is Opposites Attract. Luo Binghe’s color coordination is aligned with black and red mostly. Now, visually speaking, what’s the opposite of that?

The yin yang symbol.

Fun fact, besides black vs white, green (SY) is the complementary color of red (LBG) on the color wheel. Now taking everything I’ve said, to take it even one step further, my thought process at the time was, “why not go the extra mile then and just have SY be albino? Within context of the Heavenly Realm, that character design makes sense.” TUT is me subtly riffing off what I can (for the good ol’ meta humor), but making the content come across as a legitimate story experience. As Protagonist A and Protagonist B, LBG and SY have to look visually striking together. With all that said, let’s talk about....

(In reference to the original tumblr post)

Shen Yuan (Mortal)

I’ll keep some elements of his albinism from his celestial form (light sensitivity and pale skin mostly), but SY’s mortal form is essentially SY pre-transmigration but within context of the xianxia genre.

For his appearance, let’s just keep this Author’s Note^ and TUT’s summary in the back of our brains. This is the fanvid I was originally inspired by for SY’s mortal appearance:

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(TUT Summary - Excerpt)

For what he wears, I’m currently feeling very heavily inspired by this PV:

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His mortal appearance wouldn’t be considered as “strange” or “otherworldly” compared to the “ethereal fairy-like beauty” SY retains in the Heavenly Realm, but as a side-effect of the 【PROTAGONIST’S HALO】 and his +20 CHARISMA stat, he would still be considered attractive to people even when he takes on a mortal appearance. (Mainly, I like the idea of Bing gē taking large shots of vinegar seeing SY turning heads no matter which appearance SY takes on, and Luo Binghe glaring at these “insects” for even “daring to lay their unworthy eyes on his fated person.” The thought of it just makes me laugh.)

What I mean by how SY’s mortal form being very much based on how SY appeared pre-transmigration but in the xianxia genre context, I mean he’ll have his dark hair (but longer), a “scholarly air” (as a nod to his novelist background), dark eyes, and even his glasses technically (the divine monocle mentioned in ch3, which is also a subtle nod to Sha Po Lang and a riff on men wearing monocles in other Chinese works andit’salsoforeshadowingbutshhhh).

(TUT ch3 - Excerpt)

Shen Yuan originally was an author in his forties pre-transmigration, so I like the idea him having a mature air about him in the Cultivation World as well. So for both our Protagonist B’s celestial and mortal appearances, the idea is that you can look at him and immediately recognize him as a protagonist of the danmei setting. My only two prerequisites are that his appearance screams “hello, I’m Protagonist B” and that he appears in “scholarly” attire.

Airplane Shooting Towards the Sky (Mortal)

Keeping in mind the original tumblr post where I wrote my thoughts on who I’m transmigrating him as, currently I’m thinking it’s a combination of these two PVs for his mortal form:

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As a nod to him being a successful novelist, I wanted him to also appear scholarly. A scholarly crown prince, if you will. For his attire, imagine all the C-drama clothing you’ve seen actors wear in period dramas, and you already have a good idea already of the direction I’m heading down.

As the prince of the cannon fodder emperor, I very much like the idea of Airplane perhaps having a baby face and brown hair (as a small nod to fanon!SQH from SVSSS) but with a great body (a huge source of inspiration are clothing worn by Prince Yu and Prince Jing of the three princes from the C-drama Nirvana in Fire). Since Airplane will also be able to select his Character Creation stats like Shen Yuan had, one thing I’m fairly certain is that he will max out his CONSTITUTION—because “game logic” and not wanting to die. (For those who don’t know, the CON stat in tabletop RPs essentially indicates a person’s overall health, wellbeing, and vigor checks...so him maxing it out is equivalent to him being as invulnerable as a cockroach. A high CON means overall healthiness, which means your character probably is full of energy and vitality, can heal rapidly, and will rarely get sick—if ever. Low CON usually means a higher susceptibility to sickness and disease, wounds that fester and linger, and a general fatigue would haunt you, etc.) Like how SY zeroed in on his CHA, Airplane would have prioritized +20 CON (+5 modifier), especially knowing the fate that’d await him as a prince and the vicious environment that is expected for palace intrigue plots (the harem is a big factor, with concubines and consorts and even the empress sabotaging each other—just to win the favor of one man). Against poison or whatnot which is a cliché in palace intrigue plots, rather than relying on luck, you typically stand a better chance of passing the CON check if you have a high modifier aiding your checks. He’s basically become impervious to illnesses, most poisons (probably being able to spring back quickly), and is considered the healthiest prince in all the mortal imperial line. <- This could be taken both seriously and humorously simultaneously.

Airplane Shooting Towards the Sky (Deity/ Celestial)

For Xiàng Tiān Dà Fēijī’s “actual divine body” that is currently asleep and won’t be awakened until Airplane completes his mortal trial to “regain his cultivation powers,” the face should obviously be similar but, as Xiàng Tiān Dà Fēijī, he would appear regal and dignified as a god of this world:

Imagine something along the lines of mortal Airplane as the man on the right, celestial Shen Yuan in the center, and deity/ celestial Airplane as the man on the left. I envision a respectable appearance that would knock the air out of Mobei jūn and make him recognize Airplane despite any visual dissimilarities, and in a way we have the Four Beauties of China: Luo Binghe, Shen Yuan, Mobei jūn, and Xiàng Tiān Dà Fēijī.

I will say I currently have an idea of making Airplane have “golden” eyes in both his celestial and mortal forms. (Spoiler alert: in my notes, I’d written down to give Airplane yellow eyes as an Easter egg to Yanxi Palace, I believe, where there was an episode where someone of the imperial harem schemed against the empress and almost had the newborn baby killed because that and the yellow skin was an inauspicious omen. We later find out through a timely intervention that the true reason was due to jaundice—because of the diet/ pregnancy cravings she ate for a period of time which resulted in her son’s symptoms. With Airplane’s high CON and another trope I’m bringing in which’ll have to do with the Medicine King’s Valley/ Valley of the Medicine King, his yellow eyes are the only side effect that lingered from that traumatic event which would have killed him had they gotten away with their scheme. A lot of palace dramas have to do with the vicious harem plots, so this would potentially be one such example.) The reason being that this is the identifying marker for MBJ to clue in that they’re the same man he will have loved. And I think that has romantic potential.

Misc.

Now addressing the other tags, yes, essentially speaking, Mobei jūn might just very well experience his very own Big Damn Reunion trope that Bing mèi had suffered from SVSSS. Poor MBJ. He’s in a tumultuous ride of his own with him considering Airplane as his own fated person, hahaha. But for the Moshang dynamic, I want him—a demon—to find himself taken with Airplane in his mortal guise—and subsequently his true celestial appearance once he finds out. I very much also want SY to jokingly snark to his fellow transmigrator-and-writing-colleague about him getting in a relationship with his own “creation” (MBJ). And Airplane would jokingly snark back about SY “ruining his ‘first son’ as well” (LBG). If you can read between the lines of that, then kudos. I’m glad to hear you’re looking forward to the palace intrigue.

I’m especially very happy to hear you’re looking forward to the descriptions! I personally love worldbuilding in the stories I consume I’m an interior designer and realtor irl, so I’m glad my love of house details and landscape, etc shows in TUT. For the pseudohistorical vibe, in the Mortal Realm, I will be referencing the Forbidden City of our Chinese history and a couple popular period C-dramas. Take the settings of period C-dramas like Ruyi’s Royal Love in the Palace, Yanxi Palace, and Nirvana in Fire as examples for what will be awaiting us when we finally meet Airplane in his mortal body. In the Heavenly Realm, the descriptions will be heavily referencing shows that contain aesthetics such as those of Ashes of Love, Love and Redemption, and Eternal Dream.

Take this with a grain of salt just in case I change my mind later on, but in the chapter when we meet Airplane for the first time, I probably won’t say which character he is in the first scene. I’ll give plenty of hints in the first scene so that you all can make your guesses before the big reveal, but I’m fairly confident you all or most of you will be able to pinpoint who he is among the cannon fodders. We’ll meet the emperor, who is discussing with his sons about the matter regarding the approaching calamity that is Luo Binghe. Then when we transition into the second scene, we’ll know exactly which “royal prince OC” it is that our beloved Airplane has transmigrated into, hahaha.

(*Keep in mind, for everything written above, some details are subject to change. Nothing is official until it appears in the story, or I’ve actually drawn my ideas out and posted online to both my tumblr and twitter. These are just my current thoughts.)

A goal of mine for TUT is to make the story widely accessible, meaning it doesn’t matter if the reader is new to the SVSSS fandom or aren’t familiar with the Easter egg references or meta jokes or subtext or even the Chinese culture, or even if English is not their first language. Having knowledge beforehand might help someone notice more hidden details in TUT, yes, but it is a humble wish of this writer for her esteemed readers to be able to dive into the story and get the enjoyable feeling like they’re reading a genuine danmei novel. It really makes me smile whenever I hear feedback that I am able to emulate that experience.

Very exciting developments indeed are in store!

#svsss #bingyuan #moshang #mobei jun #bingqiu #the scum villain's self saving system #the untold tale #phoenixtakaramono #phoenix talks #ask #averydrearydiana #technically not an ask #but i like to categorize it there #it’s very much like we have 2 forbidden romances ay?#There is so much I wanted to reply back to #so just know I read them all #and treasured everything you wrote in your tags #there will indeed be a transmigrator reveal bt SY and Airplane #to their bfs they can only come so close #SY will come REALLY close but of course the System will filter his words #so SPOILER ALERT an example would be SY saying I remember things in my past life clearly #In Chinese reincarnation mythos you don’t typically keep memories of any of your past lives #in some tales and C-dramas you basically drink a potion/ cup of forgetfulness to wipe your memory #before you are allowed to reincarnate into your next life etc #ah yes war strategist SY will make plenty more appearances in TUT lololol #I love your tag about LBH showing off the pelt and being like LoOk At WhAt My Bf GaVe Me aka My Bf iS BeTtEr ThAn YoUr Bf/Gf #the scene when Airplane finds out his fellow transmigrator has screwed him over will be one for the history books #meaning I will derive so much amusement from it but we will be nice and help him escape the brunt of LBH’s malice #MBJ connecting through dots will be fun too bc HeY tHiS iS mY bAe JuNsHaNg #Jūnshàng meaning the Great Exalted One aka replacing Huangshang aka emperor

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phoenixyfriend · 4 years

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"this isn't quite what I expected" Hinata and [whomever you think would be funniest.]

Arranged Marriage Starters

Hmmmmm okay fuck it we’re doing time-travel.

Warning for... very odd attitudes about ‘breeding’ from clan POV. Like... you know what I mean. (The weird fanon eugenics vibes of the Hyuuga do not gel with me, so I’m just going to treat them like purebred cats.)

Also this did NOT end up ‘whatever is funniest,’ holy smokes.

She is seventeen, unsealed, and... perfect.

She is not a perfect warrior, no. She is not even a perfect lady, or a perfect spy. No, the woman from the future is the perfection of a Main Line child unmarred by the inbreeding they are so careful to avoid but so liable to run into.

The examination of her eyes leaves the medic breathless. Her skin is clearer than they think possible--apparently the formation of a village will lead to better nutrition, better hygiene, better hospitals. Her hair is like silk.

She is as perfect as a doll.

“I am not a broodmare,” she says, when the whispers first start. “And I refuse to allow the barbarism of the Caged Bird Seal to continue.”

“Hold your tongue, girl!”

She lifts her head. She watches.

She is far too calm.

“I promised my cousin, as he died on the battlefield, that I would abolish the seal. I keep my promises, Honorable Elder. It is my nindo.”

A porcelain doll with a backbone of steel.

-----

She was born the heir, and for all that she is an intruder to this era, Hinata is still an heir. The current clan head is young, and has no children. With Hinata unsealed and powerful, young and lithe and useful, she is easily slotted into the role of heir. Her blood befits it, supposedly.

Oh they titter, for sure. Hinata is capable of wearing the clothing of the time, but she prefers things in a cut closer to what she arrived in. She spent years building up her confidence to the point where she could bare her arms. She had months with Ino coaching her into taking pride in her muscles, teaching her to be unashamed of her chest. Hinata refuses to let them take that away from her.

They sneer, some of them, but Hinata is not the child she once was. She fought in the Fourth War. She attacked Pein alone. She has fought a Rinnegan and survived, if only because of the man she loved, and she is no longer the kind of girl that is cowed by an elderly fool with a cutting remark.

But she is still an heir, and not a clan head in her own right. There is no affection to hold back Hyuuga Hideki, not as there was with Hiashi or as there would have been with Hanabi. Hideki does not know her, for all that her genealogy lists him as her great-grandfather, and he thinks little of setting her up for a marriage.

“Am I to know the name of my groom?” Hinata asks.

(She does not worry for leaving the clan. They would not waste a Byakugan as clear as hers. They will bring in new, strong blood, for the so-called purity of Hinata’s line is a scant generation from breaking to something ugly, but they will keep her and her groom within the clan. Her children, her eyes, belong to the clan. They dare not let her leave, and to sell her off is anathema.)

“No,” Hideki tells her. “We haven’t decided.”

“I see.”

-----

There’s a pang in her heart, when she looks at the wedding kimono. She’d hoped for love, before. She’d hoped for Naruto’s hand in hers, or if he did not want her, to find and grow a relationship with another. She’d have been able to have her pick of the pack, so to speak.

Perfect, unmarred heiress.

(What a disgusting role, truly.)

Several branch members help her into the layers and layers of formal dress. They comb her hair into too-complex twists and paint her face in ways that feel old and unpleasant.

(Tradition is as tradition does, but to be nearly a century in the past is stifling.)

Hinata is not a broodmare, and she has been clear on such a point, but she is still a valuable piece on the board that the clan has received without expectation. They use her as they use anyone. She is here to battle on the field, if necessary, but she is far more vital in securing an alliance. Principled, they call her. Headstrong for ideals that barely exist yet, ideals that won’t be commonplace for decades yet.

“Silk hiding steel,” one elderly branch woman says, approval in her eyes and on her tongue. “I hope they keep you.”

Hinata never wanted to be clan head, but there is no Hanabi here to take up Neji’s cause and drive it to completion. There are no others willing to dedicate themselves to abolishing this wretched seal, and so it falls to Hinata. She will not fail.

Her groom makes such a thing more than feasible.

-----

The wedding is traditional, rigid, and ultimately successful. Hinata is ‘hitched,’ as Kiba might have said, and she keeps her face pleasantly disinterested for the whole of it. The party afterwards is livelier, but only because of the clan she has tied herself to.

They retire soon enough. The marriage is not complete, after all.

“I don’t suppose the Hyuuga are one of the clans willing to take a person’s word for consummation,” her new husband says.

“There are ways of checking after the fact,” she says. She passes a hand over the wall, and the designs painted into the wood glow faintly. “But for the act itself, we have privacy.”

She is eighteen, almost nineteen. She is newly wedded to a man who is a stranger in all but name, and she plans to change history every bit as much as he does.

He still grimaces. “You are... a bit young.”

“You flatter me,” she says. “But I am of an age to be wed, and so of an age to engage in... more carnal matters.”

This does not soothe him. “If you are to beget a child this young... it’s old enough that you’d avoid the worst of the consequences, but the risk is still there. Your body is still changing, as likely as not.”

She cannot help it. She laughs. “I’ve no need to secure a pregnancy as of yet, Honored Husband. While the contract may have stated we consummate immediately, my own clan’s elders have chosen to look the other way if we take a few years to solidify the alliance with a child.”

He’s less than five years older than her, and walks as though he expects and even asks to carry the weight of the world on his own two shoulders. The relief that breaks across his face is almost childlike in its openness.

“I was not informed,” he says. “I am glad to hear it.”

Hinata ducks her head and smiles. “Your concern for me is appreciated. I have some small medical training of my own, and can prevent a pregnancy with relatively little ease until the village your brother spoke of is formed. They would not want to waste a kunoichi with battlefield experience, after all.”

He nods. He hesitates. He asks, nonetheless, “Are you truly so firm in your belief of such? They said you supported the concept of the village, but to see you speak of it so confidently is a surprise.”

Hinata watches him for a moment, and then stands and moves to the armoire. She has very few things left from the future she cannot return to, but there are two she has kept for this situation.

She returns to her husband with her forehead protector in one hand, a ragged bingo book in the other, and a scroll tucked into her obi.

He looks them over. He turns the pages with a crease in his brow, feels at the woven mesh and linen the metal is riveted to. He looks up and asks, “How many decades?”

“Hideki-sama would have been my grandfather. However, as things stand, that is no longer assured,” she says. “You were some fifty years dead when I was sent back in time.”

“I see,” he says, and looks back down. “There are not many Senju or Uchiha in this booklet. Did they not defect at high rates, or...”

“Both clans were down to a single surviving member by the time I was seventeen,” Hinata tells him. “The Uzumaki down to two.”

“So the village system--”

“Was not at fault,” Hinata says. He looks up sharply, and she smiles. “I can tell you how it all happened, and what can be done to prevent it, but it will not be easy.”

“Such things never are,” he says. He looks back down at the bingo book, frowning. “You choose to help save my clan, after I have married into yours. I expect you hope for some aid in return?”

“Oh, to prevent the destruction the Senju and Uchiha is to prevent the end of the world,” she says. “I would do this even if it wasn’t, but as it stands, there is indeed something I will ask you to help with.”

“Something equal to preventing the end of the world?” he asks, and she thinks he may be trying to add a dash of humor to the heavy conversation. She appreciates the attempt, for all that it fails.

“It is to me,” she says instead, and pulls the scroll from her obi. “You are a fuuinjutsu master, are you not?”

“My sister-in-law is better,” he says. “But yes, I’m nearing such a level.”

Hinata nods. “The history books said as much.”

He eyes her for a moment, brows narrowed, and then unfurls the scroll.

She waits.

It doesn’t take long for him to inhale sharply. “This is barbaric.”

“Yes, I agree,” she says, calm and pleasant. “I’m not supposed to be showing you this. I hope you understand.”

He looks at her. “You want me to change it?”

“Removal first,” she says. “We need a substitute ready when we do so, to prevent at least one angle of argument. A seal that still destroys the eyes at death, but without the... more unpleasant aspects.”

“You want me to help you stage a coup in your own clan.”

“Not a coup. If Hideki is willing to allow for the changes to the seal, then I am uninterested in replacing him. I have no great dreams of leadership, Honored Husband. I simply wish to free my family of their bonds.”

“And to help me save my clan.”

“By saving the world, yes.” She smiles at him. “I’ll save your clan if you save mine?”

He closes his eyes and shakes his head. “I can’t... well. This isn’t quite what I expected.”

“Of that, I’m sure.”

"I agree to your terms,” he says. “Also... while I am like to officially outrank you on the battlefield and in the village that will be, I was under the impression that, within the confines of the Hyuuga compound, you outrank me, and outside of it, we are equals.”

“That is correct.”

“In that regard, please stop addressing me as ‘Honored Husband,’” he says. “It is surprisingly uncomfortable to hear.”

Hinata can’t help but laugh at him again. “Of course. Shall I call you Tobirama-kun instead, then?”

“Am I to address you as ‘Hinata-chan?’” He asks, a tad too dry. “Or simply dear?”

“Darling.”

“Sweetheart.”

“Beloved.”

“I’m not one for pet names.”

“What a shame. I am.”

Yes. She rather thinks this will turn out splendidly. She may not have the true love of her dreams, but this... this will work.

She’ll make sure of it.

#Hyuuga Hinata #Hinata #Senju Tobirama #Tobirama #Hinata Hyuuga #Naruto #time travel #arranged marriage #phoenix answers memes #TobiHina #lexlokiy #phoenix posts #pregnancy mention

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xiyao-feels · 3 years

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new tu and xiyao fan from earlier. i searched ao3 as per your suggestion and there's only 500 or so fics for them. :( however, i do have a legit question - what are the differences between mdzs and tu (i've never read the latter). and if you want expand on nieyao (or xiyao) please feel free! i love reading meta! one of the few reasons i miss old school fandom spaces lol. thank you!! :D

Hmmm, I see about eight hundred if I limit to English? But I take your point! But that was just as a way to start; once you do find an author you like, you can look at their bookmarks, for example. (Also I'm not sure if you're familiar with the AO3, but if not, sorting by kudos when doing a general search is a way to get stuff that at least lots of people thought was good. I'm not saying it's perfect, but when you're starting in a fandom it can be better than the default by-date-updated.)

Also I'll take the opportunity to plug my absolute favourite xiyao author, roquen. I didn't mention them last time because they haven't I believe written a post-canon fixit, and you should know that they're mostly sticking to MDZS instead of CQL canon, although with some sprinkling of CQL elements and characterization. Some particular favourites of mine include their AtLA AU and their Sunshot/on the run fics (both series with a couple of short fics), their what you might call a mid-temple hopeful fix-it (divergence where LWJ strikes to kill and LXC takes the blow), the baby LXC fic ("Lan Xichen reverts to being a fifteen-year-old junior, and immediately gets an epic crush on Lianfang-zun"; disclaimer that I was fairly involved with the creation of this one but it's GREAT) and, of course, above all, their gigantic canon fix-it verse, it's worth it every time. It's SO GOOD and the characterization is fantastic and the prose is excellent and UGH. It's so good!!!!! Disclaimer that the second fic in the series, which is the main work, is still WIP, but roquen updates regularly and there are only a couple of chapters left; if you're still wary of WIPs, I'd at least recommend the first fic, which stands alone and is brilliant in its own right.

As to the differences between MDZS and CQL…ho boy. There are quite a few, both major and minor, and I'm by no means familar with all of them—especially the ones that don't involve 3zun, lol. I tried to google around but unfortunately the ones I found tended to be either short or, if more in-depth, contain inaccuracies about JGY/LXC—I think people tend to be more interested in the Wangxian, and then this stuff goes by the wayside. The wiki can be a good source for differences for specific incidents, and although I think it's not always accurate it /does/ usually cite chapter or episode, which can be pretty helpful.

This, by hualiann, looks like a good overview, though I'd add that JYL, WQ and WN didn't study at Cloud Recesses in the novel and that more generally MDZS has a lot of actual undead.

In general my advice is to take things people say about the novel with a large grain of salt, myself included. And about CQL, too! I have no idea if this is you but when I joined the fandom, if people asserted stuff about CQL I tended to just kind of take it as fact—oh, I thought, I must have misremembered! My memory is pretty terrible, and honestly there was absolutely stuff I did misremember. But also sometimes other people misremember, or fanon gets taken as canon, and then there's stuff like—I mean, I'm certainly not going to blame people for not realizing that "JGY conspired with XY at the Unclean Realm" is a lot more uncertain than you might guess at first, especially if they're more Wangxian focused which most people in the fandom are, but I'm still not going to present it as straight-up fact. (veliseraptor has a recent post examining this here which I would very much recommend).

Honestly I think I'd recommend reading the MDZS NMJ Empathy flashback—chapters 48, 49, and the beginning of 50. That gets you a lot of the JGY, LXC and NMJ backstory, and then you can compare for yourself! I'm also going to recommend Mercy's thread, here, listing common fanons about MDZS (I will add to the list, since it's a bugbear of mine, the idea that LXC recognized NMJ's fierce corpse by his abs).

Okay with all that out of the way, and in no particular order, Sun's extremely idiosyncratic and particularly- aka mostly JGY-focused differences list:

-In MDZS, LXC doesn't become Sect Leader until the burning of Cloud Recesses by the Wen, when his father is injured and then succumbs to his wounds. In CQL, he's Sect Leader from the beginning of the show, his father having apparently died not too long before the show started.

-In MDZS, MY wasn't working for the Nie at all before the beginning of Sunshot; he joined the Nie forces just after Sunshot began. NMJ didn't instantly promote him to be his deputy when he's telling at the Nie men for bad-mouthing him; it takes a few more encounters and/or battles with the Wen (after which MY clears the battlefield and helps the commoners).

-In MDZS, xiyao's first meeting happens when LXC is on the run with the Lan books after the burning of Cloud Recesses. We don't see it happen on the page, and we don't know any details of that time beyond, like, MY helped LXC.

-NMJ willingly sends MY away from the Nie, with a letter of recommendation for JGS, after, uh, an extended overhearing of a conversation between MY and LXC wherein MY's desire to be recognized by his father and gain a proper place in the Jin, the opportunity offered for that by JGS recruiting talent at Langya, and the possible difficulty of obtaining permission from NMJ are all established.

-NMJ sees MY stabbing a /Jin/ captain, at Langya, after he goes looking for MY. Rather than taking a blow for NMJ, MY stabs himself, faking suicide, then immobilizes NMJ (who's trying to save his life) and flees. This is because NMJ wants MY to go turn himself in for killing the captain; MY thinks they'll kill him, while NMJ says that if the captain has actually been mistreating MY as MY said, MY won't be killed. Personally I think that all the evidence suggests that MY is right, and NMJ is blind to the effects of his position to the extent it's a not insignificant moral failure.

-Okay, so, you know how in CQL MY stabs WRH while he's distracted with WWX, outside on the steps with the Sunshot alliance right outside? In /MDZS/, they're in the Sun Palace, WWX isn't anywhere near the place, he does it to save NMJ's life, and then he starts lugging NMJ's unconscious body out of the palace. And then NMJ comes to consciousness amd demands his sabre and tries to kill him. He likely only survives because of NMJ's wounds, and if LXC hadn't shown up (responding to a message MY sent for aid for NMJ) NMJ might easily have killed him. If you want a more in-depth analysis, I take a close look here in my response to someone's, er, imaginative interpretation of NMJ and JGY's relationship in MDZS.

-In CQL, NMJ's qi deviation happens at the stairs incident. In MDZS, it happens later, when he overhears JGY being upset to LXC about how NMJ treated him at the stairs, and, overcome with rage that JGY would dare (arguably in combination with being polite and pleasant to NMJ's face, although the last time he was confrontational to NMJ's face NMJ kicked him down the stairs and tried to kill him so), he kicks open the door and tries to kill him. He also kills several people as he's qi deviating (seeing them as JGY—while in CQL he also sees several JGYs they seem to be just illusions), and injures NHS.

-In MDZS, NMJ sets fire to all of NHS' nice things. I don't think we're told either way in CQL, although it's worth noting that in MDZS this happens after the stairs (and before JGY starts playing for him again). (I think they do something in FJ?? But I don't take FJ as canon for CQL; see confusion-and-more's post here).

-In CQL, JGY suggests to NMJ that he's always played the corrupted Clarity for him (though granted this is in Empathy, so it's hard to say for sure if this is what he actually said, but in any case it's the only version we're given). In MDZS, it's strongly indicated that JGY only started playing Turmoil for NMJ /after/ the stairs—there's a variety of evidence, but I think the most objective is that WWX, who in MDZS Empathy can literally feel NMJ's anger, actually observes it working beforehand:

Since [JGY started playing for NMJ], Jin GuangYao would travel from Lanling to Qinghe every few days, playing Sound of Lucidity to help quell Nie MingJue rage. He tried his hardest, without speaking even a single word of complaint. Sound of Lucidity was indeed effective. Wei WuXian could clearly feel that the hostile energy within Nie MingJue was being suppressed.

(Exiled Rebels translation, ch. 49)

And then the next scene is the stairs incident, so.

-In general, the degree to which JGY's position is completely awful is played down in CQL. confusion-and-more talks about it a bit here; I'd also note that some of JGY's dialogue defending himself is removed ( “Some trivial achievements?” He spoke in a shaking voice, “…What do you mean, some trivial achievements? ChiFeng-Zun, do you know how much work I put into such trivial achievements? How much I suffered? Glory? Without the handful of glory I have nothing!”, for example), we don't hear about his mother at the guqin scene, the temple flashback where his mother is dragged naked outside by a client and he's kicked down the brothel stairs is eliminated, etc etc.

-There is absolutely no second flutist in MDZS; also JGY tells us in the temple that QS was already pregnant before he found out about the incest. I think even in CQL it's questionable whether he actually intended to kill Zixuan (see this whole conversation), and significant unveiling or no CQL never actually says QS wasn't pregnant before their marriage so I tend to go with that too, but certainly it's easy to walk away with the impression that he definitely did both deliberately, especially if you aren't familiar with the novel.

-(In general, I think CQL JGY is a lot more sympathetic than most people think once you look closely, but he's also very much set up to look upon a more casual watching as Villain, so.)

-In CQL it's All A-Yao All The Time but in MDZS we see LXC calling him san-di after the sworn brotherhood, and then it's back to A-Yao in the present day (see my last addition on this chain here).

-In MDZS, JGY doesn't shove JL out of the way of the incoming attack.

-The LXC lifting JGY out of his bow thing is from CQL

-The watchtowers! Oh /man/ the watchtowers. God the watchtowers are so much. Uh, confusion-and-more has a post about how much they're mentioned in MDZS vs CQL here, and see my last addition to this thread for an argument that the watchtowers were indeed a force for good. God. Twelve hundred watchtowers. He must have saved so many lives...

-confusion-and-more's watchtower post also reminds me that CQL has the Guanyin temple giving out medicine, while MDZS does not

-The episode 23 scene where Sect Leaders Jin, Nie, and Lan agree to spare some of the Wen doesn't exist in MDZS (though I'll take the opportunity to observe that I disagree with popular interpretations of that scene, see point three here).

-In MDZS NMJ's fierce corpse is literally trying to kill JGY, there's no saber spirit. And like, it's been trying to kill JGY for a long damn time, that's why JGY dismembered him.

-The XY plotline—in MDZS, JGY recommends a young XY (who at thay point has a reputation but is not known to have committed any massacres) as a Jin cultivator, as part of an effort by JGS to recreate the Yin Tiger Seal. JGS has multiple people trying, but most of them aren't getting anywhere and XY is getting furthest. It's during this time that XY kills the Chang clan, and is discovered as guilty by XXC, who brings up the evidence at a conference happening in Lanling; the Jin are stalling, MMJ gets angry and shows up, he almost kills XY on the spot and gives JGS a lecture such that he's forced to relent and sentence XY to death (and incidentally scares JGY, imho quite seriously, while he's at it). Then JGS turns it into life imprisonment once NMJ has left, and then NMJ is extremely angry and attacks JGY at the stairs. (Ch. 30 and 118)

-I mentioned before but I'll add it here too: in CQL JGY asks LXC to stay and die with him, and LXC agrees.

-The CQL ending in general is...hmmm. Despite having most of the elements which complicate MDZS' ending (JL is in a terrible position!), it kind of presents as...happy ending all is fixed now? In MDZS I think it's presented as—more complicated, even though Wangxian do very much get their happy ending.

-Also LWJ is a lot less. uh. Okay, so in CQL he's more Mr Morality, and in MDZS it's much more Wei Ying Right Or Wrong. Also, he doesn't become Chief Cultivator in MDZS! I think that's my least favourite change, because it's like...LWJ hates politics, hates compromise, and never attends the cultivation conferences. At least one of 'this is going to be a major diisaster' and 'LWJ is going to have to go through some significant shifts in his worldview and approach' are going to have to happen, but that's not the vibe CQL gives off at all, and I think it really works against some of the major themes of the text :/

-OH RIGHT I knew I was forgetting something—in MDZS MXY's revenge is focused solely on the Mo; JGY is not part of the curse.

Okay I don't want to go too much on about xiyao or nieyao, because this is already quite long and I don't want you to be waiting forever, but broadly although I certainly think NMJ cares about JGY a great deal it seems to be about his competence and potential; he doesn't really seem to, like, actually like who he is as a person. JGY, meanwhile, is at first very grateful to and then increasingly exasperated by and very much fucking terrified of NMJ, but...well, he doesn't seem to be into him or interested in spending time with him for the sake of it or etc etc.

On the other hand—xiyao. Man, xiyao!!!! They just—they get each other so fast, they're /partners/, they work together so well, they like and they respect each other, they're both like—LXC and MS are on their own tier for JGY, LWJ and JGY are on their own tier for LXC, they're for each other in a way neither is for anyone else, they care a lot about the same things—it's not perfect overlap, obviously, but it's more overlap I think than either has with anyone else, they—invest, they're builders, JGY was planning the watchtowers project from way back and although I have no doubt he was driving it LXC was with him and!!!! ugh!!!!! xiyao are REALLY GREAT, okay.

#the best of men #more than one tag could contain #a gentle warmth filling the deepest of needs #anger burned in his heart #long meta #sort of #we can't change places #j #mostly jgy-focused discussion of differences between mdzs and cql under the cut

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thehollowprince · 5 years

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Another reason why I’m against IronDad/Uncle Tony is also the fact the relationship we see on screen is borderline toxic and highly neglectful. Only time Tony was a somewhat decent mentor was at beguine of Infinity War when he told Peter go home, but even that gets thrown out the window when he drags Pete raking his highly stupid “ Take the Fight To Thanos!” Idea.

Tony Stark is one of those characters that the fandom doesn't actually love, even though they claim to. The evidence is the fact the fact that the version of the character that exists in fanon is not at all what actually happened in the movies. You can't point that out to them, though, because then they get really upset and insist that you just hate Tony because he's "everything Steve Rogers isn't!"

... which, I mean, is true. Steve Rogers never imprisoned and abandoned his friends or let his ego stand before rational thought in a life-threatening situation.

The problems that arise from this Irondad/Uncle Tony bullshit are another matter entirely.

I've stated multiple times, as have others, that the Peter of the MCU is Peter Parker only in name and nothing else. They completely erased the core of that character and replaced it with Tony Stark, whether at RDJ's insistence or not, and its royally fucked over Marvel's most iconic superhero. I've been seeing those people doing the whole song-and-dance of "but Uncle Ben isn't important to Peter in the MCU", and I'm left just gaping at my phone wondering how they can be so dense.

Like, the point just flies right over their head that Uncle Ben is SUPPOSED TO BE IMPORTANT to Peter. Hell, what happens to Peter is his origin story! It's what made him decided to stop selfishly using his powers and really become everyone's "friendly, neighborhood Spiderman."

By removing Uncle Ben (and not even mentioning him or his impact on Peter in any significant way) we have this Original Character that bears Peter's name, but lacks any of the things that actually make him Peter Parker. By completely removing the man that raised Peter and gave him the morals he used in his life as a superhero ("with great power comes great responsibility"), and replacing him with Tony Stark, we have a completely unrecognizable character that they're trying to pass off as a decades-old fan favorite, and a lot of people are observant of that.

The real problem with replacing Uncle Ben with Tony is that we now have a character that bears the name of one of the very few self-made superheroes, but has no actual resemblance to said character or his source material. He's not "one of the people, fighting to protect the working man from the corruption of corporations" and their ilk. No, no, now he fights for those corporations, putting those pesky poor people in jail because how dare they oppose their corporate overlords! That's also why we have things like Tom Holland (who I am 100% positive has never picked up a Spiderman comic in his life) saying that, given a choice between his parents, Uncle Ben, and Tony Stark, Peter would being back Tony.

Aside from completely misunderstanding the character, it does being up the uncomfortable truth that so many Irondad fans don't want to even look at, and that's what you mentioned about Tony and Peter's toxic relationship.

The very fact that they started this whole "mentor/mentee" relationship with Tony by having him stalk a fourteen-year-old should have been a red flag to some people but too many overlooked it. Then there's the fact that he smuggled said underage child out of the country (without a passport or his guardian's permission), despite that being against the very laws they were fighting to uphold, dragged him into a battle with some of the world's most trained and dangerous warriors, and then just discarded him after he served his purpose. And that's all just one movie!

After that, he ghosted him, continously belittled him, forced him off on someone else while continuing to dangle the prospect of becoming and Avenger in front of him, and even ignoring him when he tried to warn the Avengers about a very real threat. Sure, he did tell and even try to get Peter away from the fight after Ebony Maw attacked Manhatten looking for the Time Stone, but considering he decided to go in to what he thought was going to be the big fight with the mastermind pulling the strings behind-the-scenes all of these years with just him, a teenager, and a wizard he just met was just too much. We all have to remember that they didn't know the Guardians were going to be there on Titan, and considering the fact that Strange could have very easily portaled them back to Earth to regroup with the other Avengers, it makes that plan all the more stupid.

The fact that the actors and even the studio tried to hype up this Irondad bullshit, and that the fandom bought it, is so very displeasing. Here's hoping that the rumors of Toby and Andrew coming back to do a live-action Into The Spiderverse with Holland are just rumors, because I don't think I could handle them destroying the only two live-action Peter Parkers we've had.

#ask and ye shall recieve #anti mcu peter parker #anti mcu spiderman #anti irondad #anti irondad and spiderson #anti uncle tony #anti tony stark #anti tony stans #anti mcu #i've said it before and i'll say it again #mcu peter parker is not peter parker!

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aerltarg · 3 years

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2, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 26, 27 from ask game

2. Are there any popular fandom OTPs you only BroTP?

oh, it's actually hard to answer bc pretty often my otps can work as brotps for me as well. it also means that when i can't ship some characters they don't work for me as friends either. not to mention that in asoiaf i'm open to many ships, and if i'm not very passionate about some it's not a sign i can't see them in romantic light.

5. Has fandom ever ruined a pairing for you?

may i say any sansa ship? 😭 as well as sansa herself lmao. idk generally i can't ship characters i don't like because i'm just not interested. and it's not to say i don't like book!sansa (show!sansa is another case 💀), i just don't find her arc as intriguing and epic as arcs of some other characters. however, it's absolutely her obnoxious fandom's fault that i don't want to touch anything about her now, pairings including. sansaery? pass. sansan? i used to have a soft spot for them in my heart but now? nah. sansa x anyone? pls have mercy, she's already a fandom bicycle.

and jonsa ofc. i would never mind some crack ship as i do this one if not for their obnoxious stans that did way too much to list there right now. but this burning desire to persuade every rock on the street that your crack ship is canon will never stop being ridiculous lmao

also braime. tbh i used to low-key like them but some of their stans weirded my away lol. i get that not all of them are like that but still. it's generally my great pain when i see braime/brienne/jaime stans who are also dany/targ antis. every time i see them i cackle and run away as fast as i can crying from disappointment lmao. it's really a pity because i'm either very neutral or like in my own way all three of them.

6. Has fandom ever made you enjoy a pairing you previously hated?

jonrya it is! i never hated them, you know, but they never were more than siblings and brotp to me. however, later i encountered the deluded crack ship fandom that shall not be named and understood that if there is any possible romance for jon with any of his sisters-cousins we all know which one it will be lmao. also their stans are very sweet and i really like many of their takes on arya and jon! i generally love relationships of jon and arya very much so it wasn't that difficult in practice to see them in a quite different light.

7. Is there anything you used to like but can't stand now?

meta culture lmao. reading different analysis and interpretations of the text used to be very interesting to me (and still is tbh but in other fandoms) though asoiaf is a different case. imo many people aren't honest in their so called theories and analyses. i get that all of us are biased but some "meta writers'" denial of their own biases influence fandom in a bad way. it looks like too many people run to them to get answers to their questions about any minor detail as if they were grrm himself. yk instead of using their own reading comprehension lmao. you see how this meta culture ruined fandom just looking at the most delusional stans and shippers who spread their agenda by writing endless text posts full of nonsense and bullshit but styled as oh so intellectual and thoughtful analysis. it's insane how many people actually buy it and don't check canon accuracy of such claims themselves. it got to the ridiculous point when random people try to argue with you with some far-fetched embarrassing "theories" as if they were canon facts or quotes straight up from a fanfic because they read somewhere some other confused soul's post and got from a context that this quote is canon (despite the fact that it wasn't written in grrm's style at all but some people can't use their brains even if their lives depended on it it seems).

anyway it's become too long and rambly already so tldr. because of such "neutral unbiased" analyses i got the habit of fact checking almost everything i see in such posts. there's only a small amount of meta writers from targ/dany/jon/arya stans that i trust because i know by practice and following them for some time that they don't pull anything out of nowhere, back up everything they say with canon quotes, don't decontextualize anything and (that is the most important thing to me) are reasonable and open to discussion unlike so many bnfs nowadays.

8. Have you received anon hate? What about?

ah, not in this fandom yet, god bless! i think i'm not loud enough for the needed amount of time to deserve it lol. but since i'm not going anywhere soon maybe one day i will 😂

9. Most disliked character(s)? Why?

robert baratheon and tywin lannister, obviously. tbh it's pretty hard for me to hate any characters because you know. they're fictional lmao. just lines on paper, they can't hurt you. and even such dudes as tywin or robert don't get real distaste from me if they're written well enough. my problem with them lies not only in their canon crimes and shitty consequences of those but in fandom's (or at least some parts of it) unwillingness to acknowledge that they're canonically written as shitty, not as stan/pity/worship material. tywin isn't as clever as some think and robert is a coward outside of battlefield, not to mention some absolutely disgusting denial of his nature from targ antis only because the man happened to be the most vocal targ hater in-universe so these folks feel like he is their main book representative and whitewash him completely lmao

10. Most disliked arc? Why?

uugh idk even. i'm either low-key interested (or used to be at least so i can stay pretty neutral for the sake of nostalgia lol) or too indifferent to really care.

11. Is there an unpopular character you like that the fandom doesn't? Why?

all my faves have their own crowd of haters i'm afraid 😭 but let me say rhaegar. even among some dany/targ stans my man is so misunderstood lmao. it's not even his fault i dare say it's fanon about his half-imagined crimes that somehow got widespread to the unbelievable degree. and when i say they're half-imagined i'm being very generous actually. ofc he isn't perfect, no one in asoiaf is. and yes, he's a pre-series dead minor character but almost all little information about him is actually positive, not to mention the narrative itself that doesn't paint him as a villain or just a shitty dude. on the contrary, he's an idealized to some degree dead prince who could've been a good king (like some other historical targaryens, jacaerys, baelor breakspear, aemon son of jaehaerys, etc.), a mysterious yet tragic figure. i have much to say about why it's so popular to shit on him in fandom but yeah. his haters should send their complaints to grrm instead, no one forced the man to write him like that lol. and i mean that no one has to like him ofc. but it's misinterpretation of the text to claim he was intentionally written as a villain or smth by grrm.

12. Is there an unpopular arc that you like that the fandom doesn't? Why?

i don't know if it counts as unpopular but i would say tyrion's arc as a whole because i enjoy his character and like in my own way. i can get why some people don't like him but this man will always have his own place in my heart i must admit.

13. Unpopular opinion about XXX character?

is this unpopular tho?.. ok but renly wouldn't make a terrible king. i dare say he would be better than both robert and stannis. yes, he wasn't shown as perfect and i don't claim this. he wouldn't be the best or the most brilliant or the most just or noble. yet still better than his brothers. his flaws weren't anything other high lords didn't have, his mistakes weren't anything other lords and kings didn't do. in many ways he would make a better job than robert or stannis, too bad he died so early, even though i get why it was important for the narrative.

26. Most shippable character?

well generally for me it's the ones i love the most lol. jonerys/snowstorm is my never dying otp but i admit my sins, sometimes i just see dany with other characters (often from other fandoms pls don't @ me). however, since dany is THE fave of mine it means i would rather twist the other guy or girl to fit into the good match for her than twist her for another character in my new born crack ship lol. and i never stay for too long with the ships with which i feel they don't really fit and don't do justice for each other lol. maybe that's the reason i'm not much of a rare shipper / crack shipper afshdjdb

27. Least shippable character?

everyone i don't like? 😭 as i've said sansa for the reasons above lol. you can insert many others in her place lmao

#thanks for the ask!#.txt #mypost #ask game #anonymous #*answered

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incarnateirony · 5 years

Text

Time for a rant

And some hard fucking truths about this fandom. And shipping culture. And related LGBT issues.

Edit for reblog: Since everybody’s trying to be highkey mad about everything right now, if the cut didn’t warn you, or the title, that this is going to be an unpopular AF opinion you should read all of before jumping to any conclusions, let this edit notice be that. But this post includes a bunch of shit. History I more recently and more fully talked about. The LGBT men I know that won’t touch this fandom with a ten foot pole because of shipping dialogue. And the accidental two season canon Destiel RP troll that we finally snapped and voiced beyond the meta wall from PURE EXHAUSTION.

(related posts in reference: (x) (x) (x) )

we know season great we know season 9 and its potential we know season 10 -- and most of us know its cut scenes humanity, being human, colette, the altar of winchester, the secret admirer, the boyfriends that strapped into the abaddon/colette parallels, all of it we know carver himself wrote the s10 finale and got it to film and then it got cut we know s9 he gave misha a note to play as jilted lovers from the showrunner but then we ask why did this never make it well nobody in fandom was paying attention nobody paid attention to SPN struggling the first seasons nobody paid attention to gamble's era almost getting nuked they all swore up and down this outdated americana show was about to have a queer pairing go canon because, yes, at that point *reads crumbled note* wallpaper

In fact that last one, to this date, no much how much legitimate structural meta or even deadass text current meta fandom breaks down, whether they just study the microcosm of Destiel or the macrocosm of the text with Destiel as a piece of it, can not escape the claims of *reads note again* wallpaper and T-shirts.

one year into Carver who was pulling the show out of the cancellation trashcan and vying for it to continue now that it was on netflix a DUMBASS EXEC wandered into twitter and opted to talk to fans

the goddamn network CEOship had just rotated even

”Well I blame” [disembodied force outside of our own]

no honestly I blame (parts of) pre S9 meta fandom, and I say that as a meta author they had been convincing people of intent for years When these showrunners and even rotating network execs were thrashing for life Like literally even the heads of the CW were changing not even just SPN but some fucking how the “sages” of that era didn’t have any gat damn insight onto how that might influence future engagements So out of the blue a newish network crew gets BLINDSIDED by accusations of queerbait and giant danger articles that are huge PR bombs and it turns into protect the product mode which turned into the new S10 press releases with the spontaneous sexuality field on the characters and half the filmed content ending up on the floor the short end of it is fandom fucked up hard Carver was fighting for them But in result he got a corporate shut down on a product he had ironically exploded globally too well that was earning too much profit too quickly to catch that kind of bad PR Chad Kennedy was a fateful fucking day Ever since then showrunners have had to pitch the idea at corporate when it was a nonissue before And prove why it's a valid move with test groups and marketing You can say "prove it" I really don't have to in this rant, I really do not give a SHIT if you believe me, I don’t CARE if you want to reject what is otherwise logic because I’m not about to throw anybody under a bus I really like not getting people in trouble, but this alone is a glint in the fucking RADAR of how I'm going off.

hell ask yourself why we went from Robbie calling Destiel canon to being eviscerated by queerbait claims because it didn’t fulfill what a specific audience wanted or expected, to deleting his post, to only annual actors free of their contracts daring to talk about Destiel, to corporate shutdowns where it’s crickets until Emily’s return where she’s started YOLO posting about it -- but why, why, why did we go from actual support and discussion to silence that you still rage about

Without the season nine kennedy explosion I'm pretty sure we would have had inarguable destiel canon in season 10 like late s10 Carver passed his torch to Dabb mid S11 where they kept stringing it out and ramping it up within restrictions which is why Dabb runs a very weird fucking line Dabb knows he has no promise of getting it as far as his forebearer wanted or even had written AND FILMED but he will hedge out as many lines, esp with the hand of Berens that Carver originally passed the directorial note with, as he can Wayward was a huge factor in that and tbh my hope died when Wayward died that was a HUGE weight in the network Berens was pulling

I'm at a point where i've conceded to our jane austen novel but want to see how far they take that to completion, though in reality that completion was 13.5/6 that's when I went from like, I passively enjoy and accept this content to screaming into the dumpster it's not the landmark people wanted but story structure wise within how SPN handles it's the sufficient one Recalling Dean's implicative hookups since like season six I mentioned on one hand The fact that they went full circle and bookended it in direct script mirror to Lisa after the S13 lead in would be amply sufficient to het drama and I refuse to enable hets running around the goalpost on queer people I would love better open blunt representation but I also recognize the genre of the show It's something Dean and I struggle with our server actually DeanCas have been canon for a season and a half here but maintaining that without taking a distracting romantic genre tilt or whatever is its own form of challenge We write established relationship openly, without bars, to the point we DMed each other for months like WHEN WILL THEY CATCH ON WTF but the problem, ironically, is that it's so parallel to the show nobody caught on

which really, though it didn't start as a conscious experiment, and was natural tells me everything I need to know even wiping what I knew on production and itk ends even if I just had that it says e v e r y t h i n g I have literally watched people laugh track completely serious content, because it's gay ergo it's funny LGBT people. Shippers.

I wrote subtle lines. They got ignored. I wrote blunt lines. They flew past heads. I wrote lines designed to be overt to the point of painful. They got laughed off. Het culture is a hell of a drug. Both in this RP and in how we interpret romances like DeanCas, even LGBT people and shippers, because people are expecting performative results and statements where either for the former they don't fit the show or genre or for the latter, there's some sort of restriction or imposition but there's authors writing their gay little hearts out and tearing their hair out after.

I've been the author tearing my hair out until I wrote a Cas, explicitly, in a moment, to be as blunt and straightforward and unmistakable as I could, to the point I felt I was bending the character to even make it happen, and debated my options for like ten minutes before doing it, just to free myself of this purgatory. And STILL got a wash of questions wanting me to *confirm* the content they just saw instead of going, gee, that’s PROBABLY WHAT IT LOOKS LIKE.

Dabb is fighting the good gay fight and being woefully under respected for it, with Berens as his copilot, carrying a torch given to him by Carver, but people are too wrapped up in a mix of prior bitterness, performative culture, personal demands and shipping culture to see the forest for the trees, because he's deadass just writing an established fucking relationship but people would rather yell either queerbait or destroying the relationship. PR deadass pitched Absence like a het breakup drama and nobody blinked, just yelled how mean it was

Am I hinging my hopes on hammer-on-head-overt-canon-kissing-scene-DeanCas for the final season, no. Would I be surprised if it happened, knowing the execs? No, beyond breaking past corporate walls fandom dropped like a curtain in S9

But considering how "fuck performative culture" Berens is, as a gay man, fangirls absolutely should not fucking expect that either in even the most wild "the chains are broken, burn it all" method

Every queer man I know ships Destiel. Simultaneously, every queer man I know fucking loathes the sum of shipping culture with a vengeance.

Because it's grossly out of touch with MLM and is mostly WLW people trying to speak for what they think MLM should be when we already pretty much have the MLM right there.

YOU WANNA KNOW HOW THE ACTUAL QUEER MEN I KNOW SEE HOW THIS FANDOM HANDLES DESTIEL DESPITE BEING AVID SHIPPERS WHO SEE IT AS CANON ALREADY AND GET SCREAMED DOWN?

And since everyone likes to imagine the straight male audience as some borg, have a straight male friend exploding when someone called a fandom speakpiece a trainwreck. Bless his heart for not getting what queer or bi really mean situationally but his heart’s in the right place

I’m tired. Tired of trying to illustrate this to an audience I realized I have never once in my life been straight-coded enough to incorporate myself to much less understand the lensing of. Tired of watching queer men that I know who love this shit hide away in the recesses of DMs to hide from conversations lest they be accused of being homophobes or whatever by people refusing to read context, and/or just be smacked down by actual homophobes or just deadass rival shippers that refuse to see anybody be happy with something they don’t like in something that was never realistically a rivalry to begin with, because rivalry implies relative equality-ish and while all ships are equal in fanon, they aren’t necessarily in canon, and despite the thrashing and baying of antis this isn’t and will never just be a “fanon ship.”

Unpopular opinion but the biggest enemy to LGBT people isn't hets, it's the LGBT community, because we're too busy invalidating own own content and creators to make a truly unified front against het culture (or in this case, the network), and waving a flag with a lot of letters doesn't do anything to fix that. Yelling online into tumblr doesn’t fix that. @’ing creatives who have no power in this beyond the option to drop any attempt at queer resonant content cold turkey for you all to yell at them about THAT too doesn’t fix it.

No, yes, DeanCas are perfectly valid as Thebian warriors where one is clearly ace spectrum and the other is bisexualish if repressed as long as they are clearly enamored with and engaged with each other; no, nobody needs to fulfill anybody's migrating quota list when every romantic checkbox has been hit already that would be respected if they're het; would coming out statements in this sort of complicated relationship be great, sure, but they aren't in the kind of show that even addresses that and there's no way to make them even perform as the isolationists that they are without breaking or damaging the characters, not in the public eye, not in a show that hasn't shown a single sexual dean encounter for six-plus seasons for any other reason than to highlight a major traumatic problem in his life.

No, I wasn’t “hiding my gays.” My gays just didn’t have their bedroom times put on blast while they even openly made comments about the nature of their relationship everybody flagged down because they weren’t making out in front of everyone, even if that hand *did* drag a shoulder too long, even if Dean *Did* inexplicably drag a naked flatlining human Cas into the FUCKING med bay out of the Dean Cave at like 6 AM in the morning. Yes, your dedication to talking down content is that fucking loud even if you don’t realize it.

SPN is never going to be a show where the characters distinctly identify "I'm a nonbinary demiman ace-spectrum demisexual" and "i'm an aromantic bisexual with a female inclination", it's just not, stop trying to make it happen, it isn't gonna happen, realistically they are not the kind of people to engage gender politics, they're just going to be themselves. And it's queer, and it's beautiful. Fandom needs to stop moving goalposts because it's becoming more and more transparent. They just need to __. Go to dinner, check, have lingering touches walking past each other, check, admit love for one or the other, check, watches the goalpost run off into the horizon Kiss, you mean kiss, you want them to kiss, but Dean hasn't had that in how many years and what was the framing of the last moment of that.

SPN isn't about romance. Antis are right in that. But romance exists in SPN and one needs to mind the framework of it to not tilt the entire central focus of a genre show. One can have romance without being about romance, but people need to be conscious of what that means before they advocate about it. When Ruby or Anna were around they were dangerously close to becoming "about romance" which is why there was such a goddamn fit because these women were clearly tailor crafted to be plugged into a light/dark parallel in the back of the Impala

They haven't had a kissing-based romance in SPN for eight years. Ten if you cut past Lisa as a literal prop.

And if we wanna demand creator confirmation before we consider ace-y romances valid we'll talk about the biromantic commentary of S8 or the jilted lovers of S9 or the confirmed parallels of S10 or any of the overt shit after that, which got hit by marketing walls. We had that. They got yelled at for queerbait. Because it didn't hit people's quota. So we yet again hit a wall. Shipping fandom exhausts me. And I say that as a DeanCas shipper

I am literally watching people run their own goalposts around all the goddamn time Cas is so much more than becoming background commentary in the back of the impala like ruby and anna were geared to be He's his own goddamn individual, currently all but free of the wants and lusts of man from food to sleep to drink to urination to sex to PBJ, but deeply enamored -- per actual citation on the S8 DVD -- with humanity by proxy of a man he's given everything for Dean is a complicated individual who is growingly aware of his tug and pull with Cas on all emotional spectrums but has never once cheapened him to just being a sexual tool, reasons of which we can headcanon away, but he's never turned Cas into one of his bad coping mechanisms like Porn Star or Amazon or Deanmon's Fling And those, plus one waitress and a vague strip club incident in grief he came home from, sum up his post-lisa excursions, from a man who used to lay a different woman every episode in early seasons WelCoME to mlm cuLTURE In the actual L for love, not lust because kinda like jensen's headcanon of prostitute Dean there's even a chapter of feeling tossed away that's not what it's a b o u t and never was so performative DeanCas enrages me genuinely And if people have a genuine kink okay I guess but like, admit that's what it is. Otherwise assess the actual state and stasis of the characters in play and the cultural/gender issues involved, because it's soooo often either WLW or straight girls looking at MLM and deciding what they think it should be and it m i s s e s t h e m a r k b y a a m i l e and then the gay dudes hide in nooks or get besgieged by fangirls or are a Ben and avoid fandom entirely best Deans I've ever written with were with gay dudes tbh Kemi got the art of it enough to pre-write some scenes before they ever aired but there's elements that just vanish into the aether with either queer women or straight dudes. Different parts disappear Never had a straight girl write a Dean, don't intend to ever try wE nEed RepResEntAtiOn [sweeps hand at the show] if people stop running their goalposts around to the calls of straight girls, homophobes, and shipping culture it's right there. Is it monumental and groundbreaking, no, but SPN started as an outdated callback piece to begin with and has vaulted into the almost-current, so let's check ourselves in what we expect out of it. It's not gonna be a banner. But it's content actual queer men AVIDLY invest themselves in only to be told it's not enough/whatever in a world where there is dangerously low bi male representation, most is gay male, and most of that is hugely problematic stereotype easily replaced by a rainbow lamp wearing a boa and a sticky note pointing people towards plot. And in generous cases, are like Malec, which are a mix of creepy and stereotype. Yes let's nevermind the ancient warlock drawing the 18 year old dude into the allure of his thick eyeliner and glimmer and spandex pants, nothing to see here folks. but somehow we've reached a point as a culture that the above is considered better than "ageless deity becomes enamored with humanity through bond with one man, falling into him regardless of gender, surrendering all it knows to become like that man and protect that man, and becoming like unto a man, and learning the ways of man, through all classic romantic tropes known to man, and even classic endings and bookends of all romances given to man, only to settle in to a stable relationship baseline with a man, after sharing courtship gifts with a man" just because somebody, some fucking where, in a mix of bitterness, homophobia, and goalpost moving decided "public kiss or it doesn't count" even if we're left to wonder how that timeless thing knew what was under his pillow he kept safe that he came into his room and played him to get after a classic romantic gift.

Stop. It.

Yall may be wanting to victim pose because somebody else convinced you that you were a victim here but I’m a middle aged person willing to view history and accept basic FUCKING responsibility.

Because there’s a distinct fucking difference between “victim blaming” and “have some perspective and some basic adult responsibility in the unfolding of history as it happened rather than reframing it post-event because somebody else convinced you that’s what happened”.

The only people anyone is victims of in this fandom is people they took the word of as gospel without them having any sort of actual developmental insight at the time.

You wanna play victim?

Take it up with them.

As a modern meta author that primarily deals with actual legend and theology mytharc with a side of DeanCas structure I STILL run in to walls from antis erected by the people before me that did, indeed, use the methods they whip up as excuses, so if you’re gonna victim pose, I’m just as much of a victim of those people as you are, difference is I wasn’t enough of a follower to believe them when they preached “performative queer canon gospel to meet fangirl hetnorm performative demands of MLM we mainstreamed into our basic expectations because somebody told us to” at the time or now or ever.

In fact, here’s the conversation that LED INTO THIS RANT.

CastielToday at 12:27 AM Old SPN has its values in a form of nostalgia or genre-searching it had a sort of drifter grifter americana vibe the later seasons lost

GarthToday at 12:27 AM Ah, early 2000's

CastielToday at 12:28 AM Well it's more than just year it was definitely a genre piece back then

GarthToday at 12:28 AM No, I know, but shows that span a long time you can track in it where you can tell writers styles started clashing in a way

CastielToday at 12:28 AM and that genre was pretty much dead at that point so even when it was new, it induced nostalgia "This is familiar I miss this where did this go" but in being so oldschool as it aged forward it aged worse and worse against the modern and Misha was the first bolt that really sparked a dynamic shift it was a breath of fresh air that carried it through kripke's plan and almost doubled its respective viewership in scale but still kept the old spirit Gamble desperately tried to capture that spirit but did not understand the actual essence of that spirit and budget restrictions didn't help due to twitter buzz she thought that spirit was "just duh brudders" which is dangerously reductionist

GarthToday at 12:30 AM Hey, Misha saved it in more then one way.

CastielToday at 12:30 AM the brothers were ironic vehicles for that spirit that gave it faces but it was a weird form of american dream that america hadn't realized its dream had warped into 50 years ago the american dream was a 3/2 bed bath and business degree

StarfiraToday at 12:31 AM I don't get how Gamble thought Misha's Cas was expendable. She just couldn't get her mindset out of s1-3 mentality I guess.

CastielToday at 12:31 AM but as that became labored with culture and debt the american dream drifted into freedom, exploration and the road with some sense of familiarity in classics, be it cars or music

GarthToday at 12:31 AM Funny, I can watch some episodes and go "huh... well... it gets better" and that says a lot that I view Se1-3 like that

CastielToday at 12:32 AM Once security was no longer a security, and people became anchored by their illusions of security into desperate survival to maintain that illusion of security, the idea of roadster americana was the new american dream

GarthToday at 12:32 AM Hmmm good point

Aryn Prime #TokenStraight😘Today at 12:32 AM I just looked at spn Facebook comments and geeeezzz

GarthToday at 12:33 AM I keep having to remind myself about a few details outside of SPN because being able to just wait for Netflix to get a new season then rewatch it all from the beginning has made me have a different view then others.

CastielToday at 12:33 AM So especially to the older generation older SPN has a strong nostalgic value you were lik six when it aired so that era is gone to you

GarthToday at 12:34 AM Yeah, 1996 Nov is me

Aryn Prime #TokenStraight😘Today at 12:34 AM One dude on Facebook said he resents that the actors have kids since he heard that part of the reason that it's ending is because J2M want more time with their families Wtf

CastielToday at 12:34 AM Whereas when it first aired

GarthToday at 12:34 AM I first watched when I was 14

CastielToday at 12:34 AM it was reflecting an age lost

GarthToday at 12:34 AM Aryn, wtf?

CastielToday at 12:34 AM to people desperately trying to find it but in reflecting old times it aged very poorly Gamble still didn't understand what made the appeal so regressed it to brothers without that true americana vibe while culling Cas which was a disaster

GarthToday at 12:35 AM See, it's like the same thing on how I can enjoy some older shows while understanding that it no longer works anymore. Older shows don't age well normally. And yeah, Se7 hahahahahahahhahahahahaha man once I stepped back and looked at the details of season 7 during the third rewatch I was like "hmm..... yeah. this sucks."

StarfiraToday at 12:36 AM I graduated high school in 2000 so those of you were kids when you watched SPN make me feel old. LOL

GarthToday at 12:36 AM lmao

CastielToday at 12:37 AM MOOD STAR MOOD

StarfiraToday at 12:37 AM AT LEAST I'M NOT ALONE WITH THESE YOUNG WHIPPER SNAPPERS

CastielToday at 12:37 AM You were probably in the generation that if you had tuned in when it was fresh you would have been like OH I REMEMBER THIS

GarthToday at 12:37 AM LMAO

CastielToday at 12:37 AM I MISS THIS it's not by fluke that Dean's theme song is literally titled Americana

GarthToday at 12:38 AM Ah yes.... the theme song....

CastielToday at 12:38 AM It was a whole beautiful craft

StarfiraToday at 12:38 AM I'm actually in between Dean and Sam's ages

CastielToday at 12:38 AM But it had to get with the times and Gamble took it in the worst direction possible

StarfiraToday at 12:39 AM I was born in 82

CastielToday at 12:39 AM Carver... people have their issues with carver but IMO he recovered the show as well as he could with the plate he was handed in the times he was There were still problems sure

GarthToday at 12:39 AM It's gone through some ups and downs, yep.

CastielToday at 12:39 AM but to boot out of Gamble era into the modern world was no small task The WAY HE HANDLED THE PR he basically was like THAT SHIT WAS A HOT MESS AND I FLUSHED IT but eloquent it was some shit like REWATCHING THE LAST FEW YEARS I REALIZED THAT OUR LORE HAS BECOME A BIT DIFFICULT TO FOLLOW SO I DECIDED TO REVISIT MORE FAMILIAR ELEMENTS

GarthToday at 12:40 AM When the people working on the show go "shit, I forgot to make notes"

CastielToday at 12:40 AM It's not that Carver didn't make notes

StarfiraToday at 12:40 AM Oh man were so ecstatic when Carver was announced as a showrunner. Ultimately, he let me down in s9 and s10 but s8? Season 8 will always have a special place in my heart.

CastielToday at 12:41 AM it's that there was no kind way to voice that Gamble was a disaster He had a three year plan and for reasons™ got even derailed in that plan and half of it ended up in the cut footage Destiel fandom do not like hearing my take about it I'm a shipper but I recognize

StarfiraToday at 12:41 AM Is season 8 perfect? Nope, but I don't think it's easy to describe what breath of fresh air it was after the shit show of season 7 to those who weren't there when it was airing live and binged through it

CastielToday at 12:41 AM yall fucked up b a d nobody will ever own responsibility for it but carver's intent is clear as day on the creatives wall and season 9/10 became a fustercluck as a result I want everybody in this room to think about this from a creatives angle, first carver then corporate Carver said when he joined he had a three year plan with final notes on his desk from the second he walked in the door again he entered in season eight We know what happened seasons eight, nine, ten on screen

GarthToday at 12:43 AM Yeah, Star, I don't have as many problems with the seasons as others do because hello Netflix, but I can see where the issues are after some explaining and some insight into the PR stuff that happened with the fandom points at Min and others like her

CastielToday at 12:43 AM we know season great we know season 9 and its potential we know season 10 -- and most of us know its cut scenes humanity, being human, colette, the altar of winchester, the secret admirer, the boyfriends that strapped into the abaddon/colette parallels, all of it we know carver himself wrote the s10 finale and got it to film and then it got cut we know s9 he gave misha a note to play as jilted lovers from the showrunner but then we ask why did this never make it well nobody in fandom was paying attention nobody paid attention to SPN struggling the first seasons nobody paid attention to gamble's era almost getting nuked they all swore up and down this outdated americana show was about to have a queer pairing go canon because, yes, at that point reads crumbled note wallpaper

GarthToday at 12:46 AM Urgh, gotta go help with dinner prep. Mom doesn't like me being on Discord lately so I'm going to have to cut out now guys. Min, I'll catch up to your info drop afterwards lmao

since that still surprising some people too.

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mychakk · 6 years

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Hello again my dear friend. Your very own SSS is back with questions regarding your gift(s). I was actually wondering how you feel about au's fics. Do you like them? And if yes, do you have a favorite one? And after that please tell me your favorite hc about all of the ships you love and you have included in your ship list. I would like to know more about them and how you see them all.

Oh, I love AUs! I love the what if stories that explore a canon divergence or a similar but different path due to some one change (although I don’t like swap fic like swap lock with Molly as the consulting detective, just no.). I also love the AR like Potter’verse for Sherlolly, Victorian, Pirate, Medieval, Regency etc. I love AUs they allow to explore the characters in a new way. It’s also tricky to keep them in character but some leeway is always allowed ;) I love arranged marriage and marriage of convenience trope a lot.

Oh, my, hc for my beloved ships, well I think I listed a lot of them XD ok, here it goes: (I think it’s more view/feelings bout them than hc per se, sorry!)

MCU:

Pepper/Tony - I think it’s all about her quiet but unmovable support of him and yet the ability to call his bullshit. (sounds familiar, doesn’t it? I have a type I suppose). And once he realises what he has he’ll do everything to protect her. That scene in Iron Man 2, when instead of taking to armour onto himself he puts it on her… Yes, those two are just perfect. As for hc, I like to think that Pepper was already pregnant at the end of Avengers 3, so when Tony returns (and I don’t accept any other option, Marvel, you hear, they deserve a happy ending!), There’s going to be small little being (I’m leaning toward a daughter) around Pepper’s legs to greet him as well. :)

Peter/MJ - Oh, this is my OTP since my childhood as I’ve always loved Spider-Man. I love the new dynamics in MCU, and I cannot wait to see their romance. My fav part is that she’s eventually aware of his true identity and supports him (see, a type, I tell you). In the animated version from the mid 90s their story was quite a tragic one and I think I liked it a lot too.

Gamora/Peter aka Starlord - Oh my, they are two hurt by harsh life, wary people, especially Gamora, and their romance was such a sublime precious thing. Not overtly done but there. And how he managed to win her over, how reluctant she was but he persisted first with steadfast friendship then something more (once again sounds familiar, doesn’t it?). I cried like a baby while watching Avengers 3, both times. I also cry at the Guardians Movies (yes, the movies, both of them, because they are about friendship and family above all else). Guardians are my top favourite movies of the whole franchise, duh,

Steve/Natasha - Here it’s a little tricky because I’m a little multishipper for those two. Steve/Peggy was a tragic romance that pulled at my heartstrings, but I really wouldn’t want it to be revisited, tbh, I liked how star-crossed they were. I definitely do NOT ship Steve with Peggy’s niece (was it?), nope, no feelings about them whatsoever. But, Natasha… Now, Winter Soldier, and ever since… There is such a potential for those two. They work so well together. Yes… And once again it’s about her quiet but efficient support of him. Burce/Natasha didn’t do anything for me, sorry. But I was intrigued byt Natasha/Clint and kinda shipped them until we learnt about Clint’s family. I love that he had a family.

Harry Potter

Harry/Hermione - God, this ship. This is my OTP. Only Sherlolly rivals it as my OTP. Atm, Sherlolly is top one, but Harmione is close by and I still revisit the fandom just for the two of them. I love that they are such a close friends. The trust between them in unmovable, unshakable; she follows him and supports him, but isn’t afraid to call his bullshit, he encourages her and is there for her, he was the first one to see her as someone with feelings (it for sure wasn’t Ron no matter how much I love the redhead). He taught her to see past books and cleverness, he taught her about friendship and love. And she was onle of the very few and probably the very first one who saw him just as Harry (it took time for Ron and way too long for Ginny, to lose the fangirl/fanboy attitude). I love how complementary they are. For me they are perfect. I like to hc they have always been in love with each other just didn’t realise it at first. I like to imagine that post war, instead of the epilogue, all the characters managed to truly find themselves which led to a more suited pairings (for me the series ends before the epilogue obviously ;)

Ron/Luna - I have a major issue with Ron and Hermione and it’s how he treats her. I’m sorry but he always belittles her and she does the same to him! But for me, Luna has a lot of Hermione’s traits (inteligence for once), but never bellitled Ron, but always supported him. Hermione does it too, of course, and yet Luna’s support seems more like a fuel for Ron to reach his potential. Hermione will always be better than Ron and for Ron who always craved greatness it’s a huge thing to overcome. But Luna seems to follow her dreams yet support Ron in his. That’s how I have always seen them. That’s what is my hc.

Neville/Ginny - I definitely prefer this pairing for Ginny. It’s mostly because once again I felt that Ginny’s support could have helped Neville become the man he could be (thankfully he managed it without her, but before book 7, I always felt she could be the key for Neville and it stayed with me), I always felt that his quiet nature and less flamboyant self would be a lot more calming for her fiery temperament than Harry ever could…

Draco/Ginny - Here I am for the fiery combination of the two XD I also like a redeemed Draco theme. And sometimes ship him in a onesided Dramone too. I also like their kinda Romeo/Juliet situation.

Lucius/Narcissa - that ship took me by surprise, tbh! I’ve read a couple of fabulous Harmione fics with them, and two of the greatest broke them apart making them more an arranged polite pairing than anything else and I realised I actually ship them as in love. I don’t know why, I just like the idea of them, even being on the wrong side of the light, to still being able to experience love. In the end it was that love that redeemed them. Sometimes I like to hc they fell in love after they were arranged.

Remus/Tonks - the way she fought for him, and in the end their true love won. Even if for a short while before being cut of tragically. I like that they are actually quite an unusual pair and because of their age difference too. Sometimes I like to hc that if they survived they’d struggle as a married couple but overcome all the obstacles and learn how to be truly happy together

Bones

Booth/Brennan - this is another major OTP for me. I love their friendship, mutual, trust, support, their ability to compromise and being opened to the other and their life/word view. Their love story was the greatest feature of the whole show. It was so nice to see them reach a happy ever after and live through it. I love how they both grown as characters thanks to this wonderful relationship they shared over the years. And how faithful, how loyal to each other they have always been.

Angela/Hodgins - this is another story of true love can prevail everything. God, she was such a free spirirt, it looked like he didn’t stand a chance, but his persistence, his love for her, his support as she were with someone else after their break-up, and then their happiness. God, I love them so much. And I want a Hodgins of my own ;)

Sweets/Daisy - they were so cute as a silly version of Booth/Brennan. They also learned a lot about themselves and each other during their relationship. They grew both as characters and as a couple. And I really liked it.

How To Train Your Dragon

Hiccup/Astrid - first of all they are friends. And based on that, they support each other, trust each other, back up each other, but also talk and point out flaws. I like to hc they’d have always ended up together.

Ruffnut/Fishlegs - this one is a tricky one as it’s only fanon based. But I like the idea of Ruff, who is a wild spirit, and Fishlegs who is the scholary type, to find some kind of connection and appreciation. It’s a little similar to Neville/Ginny I suppose. I really love them, and how they could truly balance each other.

Anne with an E

Gilbert/Anne - oh, I have always shipped them, but in this version it’s all about his devotion. He’s so completely in love with her. They also try to be friends and support each other and be there for each other and I think that’s wonderful.

BBC Sherlock:

Sherlolly - oh, my. I think the thing about them for me is their mutual trust and a certain tender approach toward each other. I think that Molly is the only one who truly sees Sherlock as a man and not the Sherlock Holmes and it’s something that’s very attractive to Sherlock, very addictive and that’s why he can be himself with her, and show his vulnerability. There is also a lot of respect between them in their quiet companionship. I also like that they are kinda hidden from everyone else. Only the audience truly knows what really goes between them and that’s very precious to them. I like how they support each other. They work together, they trust each other even if they don’t like what they see. But they work together.

Warstan - Mary is just perfect match for John. They work so well together. I hate that John almost threw it all away. It shows he’s human but it was a very painful plot. I like to hc, that Mary would have eventually forgiven him, but he would have to really work to get her trust back. I will also dare to say, that maybe there were some huge issues on both sides to work through and John’s wayward thoughts toward E were a result of that. Don’t get me wrong, he was the one who did an awful thing. But maybe Mary wasn’t such a saint either, after all she left him and Rosie without a second thought (to protect them sure), but she wasn’t willing to work with John. Maybe she subconsciously pushed him away? Maybe she was afraid of his reaction based on how badly he took the news about her past? It doesn’t change the fact that both were at fault and didn’t have enough time to work through their issues. They were faulty real people and that’s what I love about them. I wish I could see more of them and their fight for their happiness.

Mythea - Once again an example of a ship with a woman supporting a man. I like to think he is very protective of her but also kinda shy about his feelings. I don’t know, I see him also viewing himself as unworthy of her affections. While she is kinda helplessly in love with him. In the end they take their heads of their arses and have their happily ever after. I like to hc that Anthea’s been moved away from Mycroft to protect her and maybe because they did start a relationship and she was on maternity leave so that’s why we didn’t see her in s4 ;)

So, I hope you don’t mind me being talkative about my ships XD

Do you share some of mine? Do you have complete deferent views on the characters? Feel free to tell me :)

#sherlolly secret santa #sherlolly secret santa 2018

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inceptionbigbang · 5 years

Text

The day has come! The Second Round of Fic Claims for the Inception Big Bang is here. It's a second chance for you to work on any fics that you missed on the first round, and a chance to take on a secondary project.

Claims will work on a similar way to the last round, but we will give priority to fics that haven't been claimed and to artists that couldn't get any of their choices on the first round.

Fics have different numbers for my own organisation, to separate the rounds. Make sure you send the right numbers!

Without further delay, here they are:

21. When dreamshare is first developed, no one has totems. They've always gone into dreams for short amounts of time and always with another person, so there's no chance of someone forgetting their reality. Mal's friend Pip has consistently been pushing the boundaries of dreaming, and one day she decides to go a later deeper without Mal. When Mal wakes up, she realizes that Pip is still asleep and she has to go down after her where she basically incepts Pip with the idea of totems.

Gen

General audiences

No content warnings apply

22. Arthur is a flight attendant. Eames is a passenger.

Arthur/Eames

Teen and Up – Mature

No content warnings apply

23. Arthur learned a long time ago that he was special, and no else could see the strings.

Or, ‘everything is still the same, but Arthur can see Red Strings of Fate’ AU.

There are moments when Arthur thinks he needs to tell Eames about the strings. Owes him the truth, he thinks, Eames deserves to know. Other times – well.

Eames knows enough, and he has secrets of his own. Arthur is allowed this one.

Maybe someday it will come up on Sunday brunch, or something.

“Oh yeah, by the way, I can see red strings that I’m pretty sure are tied up to being literal soulmates and we have one. Get it? Tied up hehe. Anyway, no pressure or anything. Love the sex.”

Yeah, Arthur, that would go lovely.

Arthur/Eames

Teen and Up – Mature

No content warnings apply

24. Eames on vacation after inception and stumbling upon Arthur; floppy haired, tanned and just completely the opposite of how Eames has ever seen him before.

Hawaii looked good on him, no better than good...

Arthur/Eames

Teen and Up – Mature

No content warnings apply

25. When Eames first moved to America, he was at a loss for things to cook. He wasn’t used to the supermarkets and ingredients he needed were expensive. So he Googled food bloggers and found Arthur’s blog. The weekly updates keep Eames going in his boring office job. It takes him a few months before he gets the courage to comment but it’s all downhill from there. Eames is lost with Arthur’s sardonic commentary and when Arthur’s next recipe is one Eames requested, he knows he’s in bad.

Arthur/Eames

Teen and Up – Mature

No content warnings apply

26. Arthur and Eames meet as trust fund teens in a Manhattan private school. Eames is a new student who's just moved from overseas, and him and Arthur hit it off immediately. Friendship turns to a whirlwind summer romance, until Eames is forced to move back to London. They meet again many years later when Arthur has to kidnap Eames for a job.

Arthur/Eames

Teen and Up

No content warnings apply

27. Arthur is in love with Eames, and he's pretty sure Eames is at least interested in him back. Only problem? Arthur is ace, and not at all sure how Eames is going to react to that. But Arthur's going to talk to him about it, because the alternative is to lose even his friendship with the forger, and that's just not on.

Only the team is also determined to set the two of them up. Will that end up being a wrecking ball to Arthur's fragile attempts at making things work with Eames?

STORY OUTLINE:

Arthur is ace, and no one knows. When Eames invites Arthur to join him for Christmas, Arthur panics and says no - and spends the whole of Christmas regretting it. The team comes back from Christmas break, and everything is awkward. Arthur knows he has to say something or ruin his relationship with Eames forever, and he's going to do that at the New Year's party where Eames will hopefully be in a good enough

But unbeknownst to him, he's not the only one who's realized something needs to happen. Cobb, Ariadne and Yusuf agree that an intervention is in order. And when better to set their two friends up than at New Years? Get them kissing and surely the tension between them will resolve itself.

What could possibly go wrong?

At the New Year's party, Ariadne suggests playing a game of spin the bottle. Arthur is less than enthused, but Cobb and Yusuf both back up the idea. They play a few rounds before it lands on Eames, whom Ariadne dares to make out with Arthur.

There's an awkward beat before Eames moves to do it. Arthur reacts by freezing and shying away physically. Eames takes this a rejection and leaves the room. Arthur sits there, frozen, and then leaves too.

He goes to the bathroom and breaks down, blaming himself for being so stupid and backwards. Eames hears him, and comes in and comforts him. Once Eames realizes what the problem is - that Arthur is ace - he promises Arthur that it doesn't matter to him, he just wants to be close to him. Cue happy end credits.

Arthur/Eames

General

No content warnings apply

28. A songfic featuring Aubrey by Bread, studying Arthur and Eames and what their relationship might have been like before the Fischer job. The characters aren't going to resemble fanon (Arthur's closed-off persona and Eames's flirtiness). I'm going to try to expand more on what Nolan gave us during the movie (Arthur's straightforwardness and Eames's aloof/cold personality). Basically, Eames is distant and Arthur chases.

Arthur/Eames

Side: Dom/Mal

Teen and Up – Mature

Graphic Depictions of Violence*

* There might be a torture scene, but I'm still debating on whether or not I want that in the story.

29. This is an academia AU! Arthur is a struggling young professor trying to find his niche, Eames is the mysterious colleague he keeps (inadvisedly!) hooking up with at conferences.

Arthur/Eames

Mature

No content warnings apply

30. A fic about arthur and eames and their first meeting in the military to all their other meetings in the criminal underworld of dreamshare. not that long, i'm aiming for 2.5k or maybe 3k if i can. i wanted to focus on their totems and how eames could use forging as a totem (because if he can't forge then he must be awake, right?) but he has a totem just in case. and arthur has a totem (the die from the movie) that he uses a lot more except when he happens to be taken and tortured for some secret or another and the only thing that convinces his brain that he isn't dreaming is the way eames stands when arthur aims a gun at him? if that makes sense....

here's a little bit of what i have written so far:

he’s more surprised at the lack of surprise he feels when eames digs a poker chip out of his desk. its blood red with gold and white accents, worth five thousand dollars at the particular casino it came from, disregarding the fact that it was arthur’s shitty first and last attempt at a real world forge after he participated in a poker game eames held on base many years ago and realized half the chips in the set were fake, pocketing a one thousand dollar chip to use as a reference.

“our totems match,” eames murmurs, flipping the chip over his knuckles with a concentration a bit too intense for something he could do in his sleep (ha).

“match how?” he asks, sipping a glass of orange juice, freshly squeezed because eames wanted to use the electric juicer. he's tempted to pull out his die from his pocket and roll to see it land on five, even though he knows this isn’t a dream.

“i have something that you made, and you have something i made. also, there’s some significance with the number five.”

Arthur/Eames

Side: Dom/Mal

Mature

Graphic Depictions of Violence*

*I put the Graphic Depictions of Violence just to be safe but i think it's less than what's shown in the film? because it's supposed to be like an after-torture scene where arthur is like "ouch i'm super hurt and drugged and don't know if i'm dreaming" but again i don't think it's any more graphic than the film at least. might keep that tag just to be safe though idk

31. There was a small lake behind Arthur's house. The following night, he sat at its edge and stared at the moon's reflection in the water.

See something you like?

Arthur turned. A man was sitting next to him.

"Hello," Arthur said. "Thank you for helping me get home last night."

The moon smiled. "How did you know it was me?"

Arthur rolled his eyes. He picked up a pebble and tossed it into the water, watching the waves ripple the reflection. "How can you be here and there at the same time?"

The moon leaned back on his elbows and stared up at the sky. "Same way I can be in the lake and the sky at the same time."

Arthur frowned. "That's not the same thing. The lake's just reflecting the light from the moon. From you."

The moon turned to smile brightly at him. "Well aren't you a smart one, hm?" He leaned in and whispered, "I'm a reflection, too. We all are, at the end of the day."

Arthur thought about that. It didn't make sense, but that didn't mean it was wrong. He looked up at the moon in the sky, then at the moon sitting next to him.

"My name's Arthur," he offered. "What's your name?"

The moon looked at him strangely. "Eames. You can call me Eames."

"I'm going to be an astronaut, Eames," Arthur said. "Then I can come and visit you in the sky."

Eames smiled again. Arthur wouldn't have thought the moon liked to smile. "I would like that very much," Eames said. "Very much, indeed."

Arthur/Eames

General – Teen and Up

No content Warnings Apply

*This fic is a canon AU and will ultimately include the events in Inception.

32. It’s a follow up story to Cat Person.

https://archiveofourown.org/works/11040948

First story summary:

Arthur misses his cat and would very much like to get another. He gets Eames instead.

Arthur/Eames

Teen and Up

No content warnings apply

Set in the Star Trek Universe

33. Haunted House AU. Arthur’s working at a popular horror maze escape place to make some extra money over the summer. It’s far from his dream job—making minimum wage crouching behind dark trap doors and chasing random couples and tourists—but at least he gets to vent his frustrations about his coworkers (who are, frankly, driving him insane day by day) by literally screaming at customers. Then there’s Eames, who finds haunted houses boring, overrated, and not the least bit frightening, but is willing to humor a friend (Ariadne?) by accompanying her. But an encounter (and some painfully obvious flirting) with the cute guy under the ghoul mask is enough to make him want to come back again, and again, and again—

FEATURING:

- Cobb as the owner/boss and the only guy who actually takes his job seriously. He probably squints a lot because sunlight genuinely hurts his eyes lmao - Mal as his wife, who used to be an actress but left to start a business with Dom. Super sweet and kind of protective of their employees. Plays the main ghost. She’s terrifying. - Yusuf doing their costumes and makeup!!!!

- Arthur getting the job in the first place because his screams are so full of rage (let! him! rest!)

- Eames blowing all his cash on haunted house admission fees so he can flirt with Arthur (who plays different roles on different days, maybe? but Eames can always recognize him, even under the masks/makeup)

- he’s not trying to be creepy, he just wants to ask if he can see him outside of work/get his number—but something always goes wrong before he can

- Arthur being frustrated because Eames is a) distracting, and b) not easily scared, which doesn’t look good for his job. And it annoys him because he has a track record of being able to freak out anyone. He takes it upon himself to make him scream at least once (I haven’t decided how he does, but he does, eventually. Eames probably jokes about screaming with something other than fear, but i am too babey to write any sexytimes)

- maybe??? mild h/c?? Dumbass Drunk College Students coming in all wanting to prove to their friends that they're the Alpha Male, picking a fight and being super violent/rowdy/destructive, + arthur getting hurt/generally kind of shaken up; that’s the first night he lets eames really talk to him outside of the job, maybe even lets him take him home (i dont know if im including this scene for sure but..perhaps)

- Ariadne getting them banned from the haunted house after reflexively slapping Arthur in the face with a rubber snake (Cobb takes the ‘no touching the actors’ rule seriously—especially after what happened^). Eames thinks he’s lost his chance for good, but Arthur finds him outside and finally makes the first move :)

Arthur/Eames

General – Teen and Up

No content warnings apply

Ok folks, the next fics are or may eventually get explicit. Minors, we love you guys! Stay safe.

34. Arthur is an undercover narcotics officer posing as a high school senior. Eames is his teacher, who is taken with Arthur and who feels terrible for lusting after a student. Arthur takes down the bad guys, saves Eames' life, then they smash (after Eames finds out he's a fully grown adult person).

Arthur/Eames

Explicit

No content warnings apply

Eames is (shamefully) interested in Arthur, who he thinks is 18 and also his student.

35. Summary: Eames hasn't seen Arthur in almost four years.

Pseudo- Winter Soldier AU.

There's no response from Arthur, no recognition in his eyes. No banter, no teasing – a coldness that would leave any lesser man with severe frostbite.

"... Arthur?" The words sound so raw, so gutted in Eames’ mouth. "Are you-" are you alive? Are you dead? Am I dreaming?

He reaches for his poker chip.

But before he can trace the ridges for the familiar grooves, a shot rings out loud like a crack of lightning.

And the last thing that Eames sees is Arthur and how he always remembers him: in his whip-black suit and a smoking gun in his hand.

Bang.

A single bullet tears through Eames' temples, and he is ripped open, pain lighting every nerve in his body like a pinball machine – and he prays to god that this is merely a dream so he can finally wake up.

Arthur/Eames

Mature – Explicit

No content warnings apply

36. Pre-movie: Dom and Mal are a dominant/dominant couple who want to find a sub they can play with together. Arthur is interested in trying to fill that role.

Arthur/Dom Cobb/Mal Cobb

Mature – Explicit

No content warnings apply

BDSM, dominance/submission, bondage, spanking/flogging, roleplay.

37. Arthur has a goldfish which, long story short, he has convinced himself he only needs to keep alive to prove he is not a hot mess. Except now it’s not looking so good and has a weird sore on its side and he doesn’t know what to do but he can’t just let it DIE. So he takes it to the vet and is scoffed at and told it is a feeder goldfish, they cost less than a dollar, just get a new one.

Two vets later and he’s at the end of his rope when he meets Dr Eames, whose dog is introduced as his PA and goes on all his rounds with him. Dr Eames doesn’t even question it, just starts the exam and tells Arthur to pet the dog and start at the beginning while he works.

Arthur/Eames

Teen and Up – Mature - Explicit

No Content warnings apply*

* Discussions of parental death.

38. “Taxiing an injured delivery boy around the neighbourhood to help him complete his remaining orders had not been a contender on Eames’ list of potential scenarios for the night. Instead of the morose teenager bleeding onto the synthetic leather of the passenger seat, and the short stack of pizza boxes sliding to and fro across the backseat, the Brit had rather imagined his rental car would serve far more nefarious purposes tonight." -- Essentially, Pizza Delivery Porn Guy Crack A/E AU. Aim: comedic tone with bowchikkawowow.

*Arthur isn’t the teenager. He is a customer who ordered pizza.

Arthur/Eames

Mature – Explicit

No content warnings apply*

*There is mention of a traffic accident - no detail, but it might not be someone's cup of tea. Also, not yet at the sexual scene so don't know whether I'll stop at M or go to E.

39. Eames is working with Arthur the first time in a long while, only now it seems that he has a huge crush on Arthur. He doesn't know how else to get rid of the crush and he really can't concentrate on the job when he's thinking about Arthur all the time, so he asks Arthur to have sex with him, to get the crush out of his system. Arthur agrees surprisingly easily and sex is great, but afterwards Arthur doesn't seem happy and Eames' crush is worse than ever. The more Eames tries to get rid of his crush, the more it sticks, and the less Arthur is talking to him. After the job, Eames has some time to think and he realises that maybe neither of them really wanted for him to get over Arthur. He goes to see Arthur to talk to him about it, but they end up kissing and stuff as well.

Arthur/Eames

Mature – Explicit

No content warnings apply

40. In the court of the vampire supreme Saito, ambitious human noblemen Eames and Arthur battle for the coveted position of favorite bestower. Winner takes life everlasting.

Arthur/Saito

Side: Arthur/Eames

Arthur/Dom Cobb

Eames/Saito

Explicit

Graphic Depictions of Violence

Bloodplay, Extreme Sadomasochism. Possible Necrophilia

If you've got any questions, send them our way!

#inception big bang #inception big bang 2019

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