#hes done everything to protect jimmy

[blndspotting]

hot take: i dont want jey to choose anybody but himself

[dykedvonte]

I think it’s so ironic that the Pony Express escapes a lot if not all blame in discussion. I can’t even say I am excused from it but it’s just how hard people circle back to the characters alone without considering the environment they were made to be in.

Why would they design a ship where only two of the rooms lock? Not the bathroom? Not the sleeping quarters? We assume that all the companies in the universe are this shallow and careless to their workers but we explicitly know the Pony Express in extra vile. They are fed processed slop pack they can’t even really cook and the ration of those pack is meager at best. They hired and made people with a plethora of conflicting demeanors and beliefs work together on a mission where cohesion is important if not an outright necessity and punish them for not being happy about it. There’s no social protocols, not chain of command other than Captain’s word/choice and the only way to enforce that is with a literal firearm. They don’t allow them to celebrate freely and even took away leisure activities that would make them less stir crazy. They are only allowed a few hours of sleep despite their being no other real responsibilities or work on the ship, no matter the position or its importance. With any crew, with any level of synergy, this was a powder keg waiting for a spark.

I’m not saying characters that made mistakes didn’t make huge ones, but I think part of the horror is that at least for some (this is targeting Jimathan) those mistakes are partly made by a force of the hand. There’s a running theme of lack of choice and being forced into something and the very nature of how The Pony Express expected them to function plays a big part.

[transhitman]

Ok I posted about this in anger a while back but I'm gonna say it more intelligently and actually tag it because I think it's something people need to hear. Something that bugs me about how people talk about the morality of the men in this game is that a lot of analysis totally glosses over Anya's motives and what she actually asks of people, and in doing so once again strips her of agency. Like. The reason Curly sucks isn't because he failed to properly punish Jimmy, it's because he ignored Anya in favor of her abuser. He didn't listen to her regarding how to move forward, he didn't give her a way to protect herself. No matter what he would have done to Jimmy, Anya is still traumatized and in danger, and that's the most important point of failure.

I think a lot of people are projecting a revenge fantasy on Anya, and while I'm not gonna argue about the validity of revenge here, for Anya specifically I think that's a major mischaracterization. She's the one who says that our worst moments don't make us monsters. And while yes, this could just be her trying to appease her abusers, she still doesn't strike me as a particularly vindictive person. She's a nurse, symbolically in a role associated with care and healing. Before the crash, she seems like a very soft-spoken and restrained person. Hell, she can't stand giving Curly his meds because she feels so bad for him. There isn't really a point in the game where she calls for violence at all. And even if punishing Jimmy or Curly is morally correct (subjective), saying that it's what anyone Should have done still glosses over Anya's wants and needs. It still centers the abuser, even in vitriol.

It's especially weird to see people judge Swansea on these grounds, because like... We don't know what his dynamic with Anya was like. We don't actually know what she said to him, if she even confided about her pregnancy or the SA at all! I honestly think Swansea's actions give more credence to the idea that Anya herself wanted a peaceful resolution. The whole "Oh, I'm holding it together" thing, him becoming more hostile after speaking with Anya... He waits until Daisuke AND ANYA are dead before trying to kill Jimmy. I think the obvious reading is that he wants Jimmy dead, but Anya asked him not to do anything crazy. Genuinely, I think Anya just wanted to be safe. She wanted out above everything. She didn't want more violence. The only violence she commits is against herself in the end, in order to escape this hell her coworkers made for her.

And like. Swansea is kind of the only one who actually did try to protect Anya in a meaningful way. I won't say that he couldn't have done more for her - all of the men on that ship failed her in some regard - but Swansea intentionally keeps the axe out of Jimmy's hands. He keeps the pod a secret, probably to give to Daisuke, but we can't say anything for sure. I joke that Swansea should have killed Jimmy from the start, but if we're being real that would have been an insane thing to do given what the characters know. But Swansea isn't the point of this post. Like. Idk I just think it's really bizarre that when people discuss Anya's assault, they still do it from the perspective of the men involved. It's weird and I don't like it. Like people have said before me: it's not enough to hate abusers, you have to love victims.

[peonypinksheep]

I like to imagine that the reason Scott (in character) is so prone to self sacrifice ties back to his inability to save Jimmy in third life. I just think it would be fun if that loss effected him so deeply that he vowed never to give up the opportunity to put his life on the line to protect someone he cares about again, to never be left to mourn and wonder what he could’ve done different.

He’s been the Winner, he’s been the widowed husband, and he hated it. He hated being the last one standing, the one left behind in the wake of everyone he’s lost. He looks at his new allies, friends, lovers, and he sees golden hair and red eyes and a lifeless body spilling blood onto the sand, he sees someone he couldn’t save and he sees a chance to Try Again.

It’s a loss that he carries not just across games but across worlds, like a permanent chip in his very code. It’s the reason why he was so ready to give his life in empires s1, knowing that every moment he was still alive he risked losing someone he loved to Xornoth. It’s the reason his happiest endings are in his afterlife, when death can no longer reach the ones he loves. When he’s already done everything he possibly could. When he’s allowed to rest.

[thatstoomanysausages]

Does anyone ever think really hard about Grian's inability to team? To stick with the same people he'd allied with at first after it shows the slightest hint of going downhill? Or about everyone's knowledge to be weary with teaming with Grian as he's notoriously disloyal with his teammates?

Cause the gutting thing is, he isn't. He isn't disloyal. He doesn't have an inability. In fact, I'd argue he is one of the few people who are tragically loyal to a fault, at least in most cases.

In Last Life, although he killed both Jimmy and Mumbo, he still felt the need to return to his allies after he'd turned red, feeling betrayed when they threw him out for being red. After that, he stuck with Joel and didn't dare betray him.

In Double Life, although he cheated on Scar and constantly complained, he stuck by Scar almost obsessively. His aim to protect him, even if he said it was for his own benefit, was painful. He didn't try to leave Scar behind like Cleo or Scott, he didn't try to sever the bond between him and Scar, nothing. It was almost like he was desperate.

In Limited Life, he was beyond loyal to his boys. He was loyal until the very end. And although he immediately switched to join the Nosy Neighbours, he didn't try to team with anyone permanently until Jimmy and Joel were dead. His silence when he realised he was truly the last Bad Boy was deafening. He hid his grief by saying that he had a backup team, just to save face, even though he built a gravestone for both boys and grieved them meaningfully.

In Secret Life, it wasn't as if he was fine with having no allied, like someone would be if they truly didn't care for loyalty, he was desperate once again. Having no teammates later in the game would hurt him, yes, but his desperation felt lonely, not power hungry. He didn't dare betray Etho nor Cleo, and stuck by them until the end. He was losing his mind on his hill before he teamed with the two, he needed to have close allies to depend on.

Now, in Wild Life, Mumbo is out of the series and Grian goes to say he needs to find some more friends, even with Skizz still around. Now, I don't think this is a power play thing, it's a desperation thing. He's hiding his grief by pretending everything is fine because if it wasn't he'd be vulnerable. For the past couple sessions, he had been working tirelessly to help get Skizz a kill so he could get off of being a red life, even to his own detriment.

Grian doesn't half ass teams. He will not team with everyone. However, he gets vulnerable when the ones that he connects to die.

Because that's how it went about in 3rd Life. He allied with Scar throughout the whole game, it starting simply because Grian felt guilty about what he'd done to Scar. He felt guilty. He stuck with him the whole game, undying loyalty, and all it ended in was him standing at the top with his best friend's blood drying on his hands.

To him, being loyal to someone like he was in 3rd Life ended badly. So, to avoid that, he found a way to still stay teamed with people, but not be left at the top of that mountain again, alone, even if his teammates die.

But so far, the curse keeps following him. He will always outlive his teammates. And this season is following the pattern, again, Mumbo dying right in front of his eyes, so close, yet so far. Always in a distance where he could've done something different, and he'd still have a teammate.

He may move from person to person, but only when they are dead or reject him. He is the forever Widow, cursed to always face his consequences, over and over and over again.

[phemiec]

Mouthwashing meta underneath the cut (tw)

What’s fucked up is that Mouthwashing’s main horror belongs to Anya. Anya is living the Shining and Alien and a thousand of anyone’s worst nightmares, in space, alone, with no one on her side, a ticking timebomb in her own body, and not any of the characters, or the narrative, or even the players, acknowledge that to the extent she deserves. Because she’s a woman she’s just treated differently.

Other people besides me have pointed out, that Anya not only told Curly, who failed her, she also told Swansea, who also failed her, and people like to paint him as better than Curly. They want to see the best in the men around her just like she does, but Swansea ALSO belittles her, calls her a “so-called nurse” and says that “even she can’t ruin [opening the storage unit] with her presence” when jimmy walks in on Anya talking to Swansea in the cockpit she’s crying, and placating and again, reacting in resigned acceptance, which implies that Swanseas response to her was something along the lines of “suck it up”. Swansea didn’t give her the axe, he did nothing to help or protect her, he kept the cryopod for Daisuke, he never considered her.

and it is very, VERY intentional on the part of the writing, that we never get to see Daisuke and Anya really interact. They could have had a friendly companionship, given their shared doodles and his concern on her being locked in the med bay, but we never actually see them talk to each other in any real capacity. and even if she had gone to him for help, there’s very little he could do as the youngest and least senior member of the Tulpar. And besides that, the only time Daisuke mentions women (who aren’t his mom), he’s talking about “hot bikini babes”. I’m not bashing him for that, taken on its own it’d feel like harmless bro low-level misogyny, but it’s part of how the writing is very intentionally alienating Anya constantly in so many little ways.

Anya is the ONLY woman on the ship, and all of the men on the ship either abuse, belittle, degrade, objectify and dismiss, if not her specifically, than at the very least her gender, and by and large we ignore that because Jimmy is so comparatively horrible. But there was no chance for Anya on that ship, she did everything she reasonably could have done, and the reason it’s so hard to conceptualize a believable fix-it for the plot, is that the men around Anya and the system they all exist in, would all have to change on a fundamental level for anything about Anya’s situation to change, and even if the ship didn’t crash, Anya, unlike the rest of the crew, would still be living a horror story.

She is the actual protagonist of the plot, she is the final girl who died first. We are denied her perspective just like she is denied agency, control, respect, etc.

[verdantwyrm]

I want you to take a really good long hard think about why Curly's first reaction to Jimmy being pissed is to immediately please. We all talk about how Anya is a victim of Jimmy, and she absolutely is, but so is Curly. His first immediate concern to the way Jimmy reacts to Anya announcing her pregnancy is met with immense fear and anxiety with the added soundtrack of what could be equivalent to the sound of Curly's heart racing.

He is beyond terrified, and when he does finally get to Jimmy, he immediately fawns, he freezes. He makes absolutely no mention of Anya, no mention of anyone else, because all that mattered in that situation of panic was easing Jimmy down and resolving the situation. "We'll fix it, one day at a time. Just you and me" He is trying to eliminate all potential problems in the situation so Curly can take the full front of Jimmy's rage.

Just like how he told Anya that she should have waited for him before telling Jimmy, he places himself infront of everyone else to take the blows. And having known Jimmy for a while now, he would exactly know what that looks like. Which is also representative of the fact that he braces the asteroid head on in the collision.

He was taking responsibility, and he took it. He took that blow, he took that punches, the insults and the degradation. Which again, furthers the point of exactly why Curly wouldn't recognise the signs of Anya being abused as well because this is all so normal for him.

He is just so used to looking at the bigger picture and how it doesn't ruin the illusion. Because he knows its fake, he knows that its not real, but he chooses to look anyways.

He wants so desperately to see the good in Jimmy that he doesn't even understand the damage its caused. His biggest weakness was his own kindness, and how normal it was to be a continuous punching bag, to be the thing in between his crew to protect them, he gave his whole life desperately trying to fix something caused by someone he genuinely tried to see the good in, and only realised he was being played for a fool until the bright, hot, rock was hurdling right towards him.

Because in that moment, he knew what was happening, and what Jimmy had done. But it was too late for realisations, and despite knowing this, he still tried. He still went into the cockpit, he still attempted to divert the ship, he still tried.

Curly is just as much as a victim of Jimmy's mistreatment and abuse as Anya is, in their own unique and parallel ways, they both had everything taken from them. Both an act of sacrifice, nowhere near their worst moments. Far from it, and it was the best one they've ever made.

And Jimmy continued to violate them, take, steal and destroy everything.

[radioactive-mouse]

I get how tempting it is to just label flower husbands as “toxic” and move on, but god they can be SO much more nuanced than that, it makes me insane.

I think something that goes largely unexplored by the fanbase is c!scott’s obsession with composure. he’s clearly very proud of his ability to stay calm under pressure and be two steps ahead of everyone else— not that he’s afraid to rely on people, him and cleo very clearly have that unshakable trust between them, but i think that sometimes he gets so wrapped up in being steady, reliable scott, never hot-headed, never spiteful, or clumsy, or nervous.

and jimmy is a very real threat to that composure, more often than not.

and i think the way their relationship functions in 3rd life, while steady at the time, definitely set them up for complications down the road. scott, for as fiercely dedicated to his allies as he is, kind of tends to handle jimmy with kid gloves for the earlier parts of their relationship. he’s not very good at the death game, but that’s fine, he doesn’t need to be, scott will take care of it— he’ll get them set up with armor and potions and walls and jimmy can do… whatever it is he does when scott’s not around. mostly getting swindled, if he had to guess. but it’s fine, because scott can be steady, level headed, clever—

i do think most of scott’s ribbing about how he doesn’t know why he lets jimmy do anything when all he does is get scammed half the time is genuinely all in good fun, (jimmy is more than happy to play the fool most of the time, if only to bring a little bit of levity to things) it is super symptomatic of the way scott actually thinks about him. i don’t believe he thinks jimmy is actually stupid or anything, but i do think scott doesn’t quite trust him to get anything done. scott would never in a million years let himself lean on jimmy for any kind of support, because in scott’s mind jimmy’s job is to be bright and brash and only listen to that heart of his that’s too big for his body, too big for this game.

and i think too often we forget just how much losing jimmy destroyed scott in 3rd life. you ever think about how wrecked he must’ve been to place 10th despite being a consistent finalist in every other season? do you think about how all he has left is the burning, white-hot urge for revenge from the second jimmy’s body hit the ground?

i don’t think scott ever wants to feel like that again. i don’t think scott wants anyone to see him like that again. i think scott tries very hard to love jimmy from a safe distance where no one gets hurt. and i think that distance fucking kills jimmy, metaphorically speaking.

(also, tangentially related, i think there’s something to be said for how instantly tango goes “we only have a short time together, your curse will probably get us killed, and that’s fine.” and how jealous scott gets of that sentiment. as far as scott is concerned, tango and jimmy are of the same niche— they feel everything, loudly, even if it causes problems and even if it gets messy. and god that just makes his blood boil.)

i’m just so… entranced with the way scott carries himself with so much confidence and it’s not like he’s insecure, he really believes that, he’s a strong player and he knows that, but also revealing any emotion he deems to be “ugly” or “messy” makes him start to completely unravel. the driving force behind him is always love and loyalty and protectiveness over the people he cares about, but he’s juggling that with being dead set on never getting so close that losing them will completely ruin him.

anyway, this is getting away from me, but i think a lot of jimmy’s frustration with scott comes from the fact that he refuses to let their relationship go both ways, and i think by the time of the infamous “say i love you back” scene in limlife he’s just exhausted with throwing himself repeatedly against scott’s brick wall of perfectionism. that, and the whole Situation between them in double life, which i could honestly make it’s own post but good god i need to STOP typing or this will go on forever. forgive my completely disorganized ramblings i just have been trying to get all this down on paper FOREVER

[tumb1rprincess]

I know I’ve posted before about Curly and Anya’s relationship being my favorite in Mouthwashing, but I think I’m really starting to fall down the shipping rabbit hole with these two. I know some people don’t like shipping in Mouthwashing, or even this ship specifically, and I get that. But the dynamic between these two has been rotating in my head for a while now and I wanted to blab about it.

The tragedy of shipping these two is what really grabs me. Like, in an alternate universe where Jimmy wasn’t on the ship or where Curly made better choices, these two could have had something going. Maybe they had feelings for each other that were starting to show, but they hadn’t made a move yet. Or maybe they were waiting for the voyage to be done before they did anything. But unfortunately, they’ll never get to act on those feelings thanks to Jimmy hurting Anya and then Curly failing her. Any possibility of romance was taken away from them.

It makes any events post-crash more tragic viewing them through a romantic lens, for me at least. Curly has to live with the guilt of failing to help someone he cared about, and now he can’t protect her from Jimmy. Anya probably can’t help but think “I told you so” when it comes to Curly, but she doesn’t want him to die and doesn’t want to believe that he’s a monster for crashing the ship. She hates that she has to hurt him to get him to swallow the pain pills. And even at the end of it all, when she decided she was going to kill herself, she chose to die by Curly’s side. I know that she probably would have chosen the medical room anyway since it was the only place besides the cockpit that had a lock, but she probably wanted to offer Curly the same way out she was going. And when she decided to overdose, she didn’t want to die alone.

On the brighter side, I do love AU’s that have Anya survive and she and Curly both have to recover from the events of the game. They not only have the struggle of dealing with their trauma, but their relationship is broken by what happened. Curly knows there’s no way to make up for what he did and Anya would probably have trouble trusting him again. But they might rekindle what they had as they heal, as they both deal with everything Jimmy did to them. The two of them are the only ones who understand the horrible things they had to go through and that makes them the only ones that can comfort each other when that trauma rears it’s ugly head.

[juststandingthere]

ISTG this game is making me insane, brainrot strong enough for me to make my first analysis post

One thing i love about the narrative is how distorted the characters, relationships and events are from jimmy's pov. Most posts discussing this focus on Anya, and it makes sense bc she's probably the biggest victim of this. She's seen as less than a person, she's an incompetent nurse, she has a meek personality, she'll let anyone(jimmy) step over her and she still follows his orders, despite everything he has done to her. We obviously see, from curly's pov, that she's simply too terrified of her abuser to act any other way, and when she's not with him she's way more confident and competent.

I haven't seen as many people talking about how this "distortion" affects Swansea and Daisuke as well, including the relationship they have with each other.

We see, in the first Curly section, that Swansea is a great mentor to Daisuke (one might even say they have a father-son/uncle-nephew relationship). He takes his time to teach him not just the basics, but also how to do his job as safely as possible. He lets him take notes, he himself writes stuff down for him to remember and even lets him doodle on those notes! Sure he is harsh with him, but he clearly cares about him and wants him to be safe.

And in return Daisuke looks up to him and has great respect for him, as both a mechanic and a man, while he also makes some jokingly offensive comments towards the older man, showing the close bond they have formed.

But that's not what we see when we play as Jimmy.

In his pov we don't see them interacting much, when they do we either see Swansea insulting Daisuke for no apparent reason or, in one occasion, we see him leading the kid down a "bad path" wanting to teach him how to "drink like a man".

When they aren't interacting tho, we do see hints of their actual relationship: Swansea asking where the kid is when he is "partying" in the lounge, confirming that he does not, in fact, hate spending time with him; him looking desperately for something, *anything*, that could help Daisuke with his suffering after he's injured; how whenever Jimmy tries to bring up to Daisuke how "badly" Swansea treats him, or how he "lied" to them about the utility room, Daisuke immediately shuts him down, because he knows what he's saying is completely wrong (i'm pretty sure those are the only times he doubts something Jimmy says), showing once again the trust and respect he has for his mentor.

(this part is kinda speculative but i think it makes sense)

There are two other times where we see them interacting, where we actually see how much Swansea cares for the kid, and coincidentally, neither of them is seen through Jimmy's eyes, but from a third person pov: what Swansea says right before they knock him out with the drink, about how he resents the people that let Daisuke, someone with his whole life ahead of him, with so much optimism and joy, board the ship for a job that would inevitably leave him "mangled" and "smarter in a worse way" (i could make a whole other essay on this part but i won't), and what he says right before mercy killing him. In that scene specifically, as the camera pans out in the corridor as Swansea raises his axe, ready to take the final swing, Jimmy doesn't see the hesitation in his body language, the way his body tenses, the way he comforts the kid, telling him to close his eyes, the heavy breaths (crying?maybe?) right after the act. He only sees the older man as a monster that would take away an innocent life that jimmy would have been able to fix had he been given the time to fucking think.

Hell, now that i think about it, Swansea's final monologue, where we find out that he is in fact a good man who tried his best to better himself, who simply wanted to protect the kid and give him "a chance off this goddamn rock"(implying that the Cryopod was meant for Daisuke all along) is also shown in third person!

A few other things i found interesting:

1-The missing pieces between what happened to Daisuke in the vent and when Swansea started attacking Jimmy. There's a cut from when Daisuke screams to when he's laying on (Swansea's) bed, bloody and in pain; from when Jimmy uses the mouthwash to disinfect him (which only causes him to suffer more) and two hours later; from after the talk the two men have and the moment Jimmy decides to go find the gun, the axe gone from Daisuke's face. What happened in those missing scenes? Was Swansea the one who helped the kid onto his bed, trying to make him as comfortable as possible? Did he try to comfort him, to distract him, and ease his pain as well as he could? What was his reaction when he had to take back the axe off the face of the young man he had started seeing as his own kid, whose life he had hoped he could save but that he ultimately had to take with his own hands?

I personally think those parts are blocked out of Jimmy's mind, as he couldn't fit them in his own narrative, where he was the hero, Swansea the villain and Daisuke the innocent, young man whose life he tried his best to protect from this "monster" that was now going to come after him.

2-Swansea attacking Jimmy with the axe, especially the cemetery scene, and how it can be interpreted in different ways.

We, the viewers, knowing everything that happened, will see it as a desperate man, Swansea, trying to avenge the lives that had been lost on that ship because of Jimmy (wether directly or not), with Daisuke's death being the last straw. But i don't think that's how Jimmy saw it. He saw swansea as a crazed, mad man, a ruthless killer, coming for him after taking an innocent life, Daisuke's photo and mausoleum as a reminder for Jimmy of what the older man had done, and a justification for what he was about to do.

(not to talk about the implication that the fight against swansea was not as intense as we saw it, only confirming the idea that jimmy was looking for a justification for shooting him)

[ccrypticcorvidae]

RE: Mouthwashing, Curly

I wanna talk a bit abt Curly's so-called "punishment" because I like the symbolism an immense amount and I think his character is really complex.

Before the crash, when Anya tells Curly that she's pregnant, he feels like he's powerless to bring her justice because of the circumstances. Jimmy was his best friend, who he believed to be a good person despite his past mistakes, and who he was able to get a decent job by having his employers look past the criminal records. The team is stuck on the same ship without locks in the sleeping quarters for months, and he wants to do everything in his power to keep the peace so that everyone would make it out of the less-than-ideal situation mostly unharmed. As the captain, he's protective over his crew, and he's already failed one of its members directly by inviting a dangerous man to live amongst them without room for the potentially severe repercussions he would face in society (i.e. "take responsibility"). When he does confront Jimmy, he sees his true colors, having expected him to take responsibility for his actions instead of covering things up. Curly is kind to a fault - sees the good in people - and for this, he takes the brunt of the ship's crashing due to his own selflessness in trying to save as much of it as possible.

Now he's physically powerless; he can't be there to protect his crew mates, to act as a mediator between them via verbal communication as opposed to violence. He can't assist Anya in her deteriorating mental status due to the trauma she endured, and she's ultimately consumed by it - all while he watches on helplessly, wishing he had noticed her struggles sooner. He can't stop the fight between Jimmy and Swansea once Anya reveals to the latter what was done to her, and consequentially, the deaths that followed. The plight of his character is to witness the downfall of those he was supposed to lead and be the only one to survive in the end, continually tormented with the knowledge that Pony Express would likely sweep these horrid events under the rug the same way they did Jimmy's criminal history. If he is successfully rescued, Jimmy's framing guarantees he will be blamed for everything, without any real way to defend himself. In the end, he had no decision in whether he would live or die as the others did, his personal liberties taken from him. Curly is left alone and vulnerable, in parallel to Anya, the cycle of endless pain starting over once again. In the end, Jimmy would never truly take accountability for the pain he caused, and in one, final, selfish move, he sentenced his only real friend to live with it under the pretense of "fixing things."

[imnotokayhru]

I love Daisuke with all my heart, but Swansea has to be my favorite character just because of how layered he is

Like, everything he says in the beginning of the game makes so much more sense once you’ve seen the ending

For example, him defending the utility room from everyone after the crash

It makes so much more sense after you see what he says about Daisuke after he’s dead

He was saving that last pod for someone younger than him, who had his whole life to live

He never wanted to save himself, he knows he’s washed up, his life has already served its purpose

The birthday scene; Jimmy says “How many years does Swansea have left in him?” acknowledging the fact that Swansea’s old

He’s been working for Pony Express for god knows how long, he has no reason to be that selfish about the pod

He wanted Daisuke to live, to be better than him

In Swansea’s monologue, when he knows he’s gonna get shot, he confesses things he knew no one but Jimmy would ever hear

And at the very end, he mentions Daisuke

“…I should’ve been able to protect the kid. If I could have done one thing right, I wish it had been to give him one small chance off this goddamned rock.”

This makes me think that either 1. Daisuke and Jimmy were never supposed to go into medical to see Anya because she was already dead, or 2. Swansea was gonna go into the vent himself, risking injury, to make sure Anya was okay, but also to give Daisuke a chance at getting in that pod and seeing the end of this

Another example is him and Anya talking in the cockpit

Whether we know Anya had told Curly she was pregnant before or after this, we can tell Anya trusts Swansea

Aside from the fact that Swansea has been working at Pony Express for way too long, Anya trusts him because she knows he won’t tell anyone

She knows he won’t immediately go talk to Jimmy about it

She can’t trust Jimmy for…obvious reasons

And she can’t trust Daisuke because he’s just so new and he wouldn’t know how to handle the information carefully

When Swansea mentions he talked to Anya after Daisuke’s death, he never says what she said to him, just that she “said a lot”

Which further proves Anya’s trust in him

But also cuz Swansea knows damn well that Jimmy knows he’s talking about

Even if Daisuke was alive in that moment, I feel like Swansea would say the same thing

He wouldn’t explain even if Daisuke asked

And that’s why I love Swansea sm

But also Daisuke is just so silly :P

[jams-sims]

Curly victimhood and how 2 things can be true.

Curly was a good Captian, a good friend BUT he was also willing to hide Jimmy wrong doing, Failed Anya by not taking action sooner and in general relying to heavily on the "we are friends we understand one another." The thing about Curly is nothing that he says, he's going to do, when we play as him. Ever comes to fruition, we never make it to Earth, we never make it to the drop off point. His sin or inactions stay on the ship and in a way, him getting hurt like he did is his punishment for his sin. He is as much of a victim of Jimmy as others on the ship.

The rose colored glasses are torn away when Curly is put in a position of helplessness. When he loses the status of friend and becomes someone Jimmy had already disliked into someone below Jimmy. The 5 people in this fandom have already mentioned it, Curly can be a allegory for the mistreatment of people who are disabled, rape connecting to Anya and helplessnes.

But what i think the real connection is, is that Curly represents those real friendships where you have a close bond with someone who does something horrible. I think it also represents, how some men will just stay friends with a horrible people. Even though they know that person is horrible.

In Curly case he made a few statment that showed he was willing to work things out. He would "Take Responsibility." Could it be he was simply trying to keep everything together by pacifying both Jimmy and Anya. They are on a ship that still had 200+ days left to go. Yes. But we'll never know the full scope of Curly character because we only ever get his view in flash back or from Jimmys warped perspective.

Edit:

I forgot the gun scene- it is the foundation of two things can be true. Curly can talk to Anya on day 0 when Curly looks for the gun. Its not explain why hes looking for it. But when you talk to Anya, Curly assumes she is going to hurt herself. He tells Anya that they can work this out, and that he would have done ANYTHING for her.

Anya calls him out saying "I know you wouldn't have given me the gun to protect myself but atleast he doesnt have it." Which just puts Curly firmly in the middle. He wants to hold on to his friendship with jimmy, while also trying to "Take Responsibility". Its adds another level of tragedy and why he starts laughing when Jimmy finds the gun. It was staring him in the face the whole time. An maybe he should have given Anya the gun to protect herself.

[blissfulrain12]

When talking about what curly should’ve done about Jimmy, it kinda seems like a lot of fans are more focused on what would be satisfying for the themselves (the audience) to see, and not on what would actually help Anya herself in that scenario.

They seem like that cause they are like that. It's not about the actual story or Anya it's about what would make them happy. It's also important to note that what they want not only obscures Anya, it's misogynistic and simplifies the story. They want the story to be how bad men failed to protect the poor female victim. Where everything would've been solved if bad man #2 had just grown a spine and committed murder or assault to protect the damsel.

Every what if about what Curly should've done focuses on Jimmy and violence. Anya is a second thought. It's always he should've done something. Just a vague and useless Something. Actually engaging with the scenario and coming up with viable reasonable solutions is too much. Doing that would mean coming to terms with the fact the horror game put it's characters in a no win situation to highlight how capitalism causes circumstances like this all the time. Doing that would require deviating from the theme of rape culture where we're only concerned with the actions of individuals even if it doesn't fit the entire narrative. And they can't do that.

Though I will give them one thing Anya didn't want him there anymore. Though then we'd have to deal with the fact that that's not possible and not everything a victim wants is viable unfortunately.

No what Curly should've done is coordinate with Anya better from the moment he figured out what happened so she didn't feel like she was unsupported and had to do things on her own. Maybe they could have come up with a plan together about how best to keep her safe. But that's easy to say from the outside looking in with hindsight benefit.

[deadbydad]

Captain Curly (Mouthwashing) - When You Can't Fix Everything and Why He's a Victim of Jimmy

There are many discussions surrounding Captain Curly all around the internet on whether he is a good person or not.

Some say he isn't while some say he is, but the question simply has an easy answer.

Curly is a morally grey character.

Captain Curly, when we first play as him and see through his perspective, we come to learn a lot about him with the short amount of sections where we do play as him.

We know that he is very optimistic, he cares deeply for his crew and always tries to look on the bright side of things. He just wants everything to be fine, and will always try to fix it if it isn't because, well because he's the captain.

But him being so optimistic is what was his downfall, and I think that's what makes him such a well written and realistic, morally grey character.

Curly isn't innocent, but he is a victim of Jimmy just like everyone else on the ship is.

Let me explain.

Curly was the first person Anya told about when Jimmy assaulted her and how she was pregnant, and Curly told her he would talk to Jimmy.

He would fix it.

I hate when people say that he didn't care about Anya or didn't believe her. Curly never said he didn't believe her, and he never said he was defending Jimmy either.

This is one of the examples of his optimistic views doesn't work out for him.

We know that Curly invited Jimmy to work with him in Pony Express and we immediately assume that because they're friends, then Curly is defending Jimmy.

But if you replay and really pay attention to Curly and Jimmy's conversations, you come to realize that Jimmy is borderline controlling and abusive with the way he talks to Curly.

He isn't and doesn't see Curly as a friend, but Curly being too nice and tends to look past that type of stuff, that made it easy for Jimmy to manipulate Curly.

After Anya told him, Curly did talk to Jimmy about it, but he went about it in a calm way. I think what he did is pretty realistic for the situation they're in, but I'll talk more about that later.

Curly talking to Jimmy is what led Jimmy to crash the ship and get Curly injured and fuck everything else up. Not to mention that Jimmy wanting to get rid of Curly so he could be captain also played a huge part in it.

Jimmy never saw Curly as a friend, he only saw him as someone he could use to get what he wanted.

Curly trying to fix what happened by talking to Jimmy was his wake up call, his karma in a way.

Because of the crash, Curly understands Anya in a way when Jimmy starts to hurt and force him to take the pain meds. Curly being brutally hurt and injured can only lay and not do anything to stop it.

He finally understood what Anya had felt in a way, and he probably hates himself because he didn't do something to protect her.

And her killing herself in front of him and watching the rest of his crew die to the hands or consequences of Jimmy, even Jimmy himself, was what made Curly realize that he simply can't fix everything.

Curly is absolutely a victim of Jimmy like everyone else on the ship is.

He was manipulated, abused, and not to mention Jimmy literally ate some of his body. All of this was because Curly was too optimistic.

Curly is one of the most realistic characters, and I think people saying that he's as bad as Jimmy just aren't thinking about the fact that he was a victim of Jimmy himself.

Yes, he could have done more to protect Anya, most likely by switching her over to a room that has locks.

But I believe that he couldn't do anything besides that, especially when it comes to Jimmy.

He knows how crazy and angry Jimmy gets. He was probably thinking that he couldn't just go up to him and start a fight because, let's be real, Jimmy was going to kick Curlys ass and he was probably going to crash the ship no matter what.

Curly, in my opinion, while yes, he didn't do anything to protect Anya, he wasn't protecting or defending Jimmy.

Curly was trying to look at how he could fix it, but I think no matter what he did it wouldn't have mattered.

I see people saying that Curly could have shot Jimmy with the gun or locked him up in another room or contacted the higher-ups of Pony Express. I don't think any of this would have realistically worked.

One, he can't kill Jimmy because he is the co-pilot, and they needed a co-pilot for the ship, and locking him in a room wouldn't have worked either.

Curly couldn't have called the higher ups either because Pony Express wouldn't have done anything because they simply just don't care about their workers.

No matter what Curly did or what he could have done, none of it realistically would have worked or done anything to solve the problem.

I'm not defending Curly at all, I'm a victim of assault myself, so I understand Anyas feelings, I'm simply saying that we should look at the other possibilities and should start thinking about what Curly was actually thinking before saying he was as terrible as Jimmy.

Curly isn't innocent, but he was a victim of Jimmy.

His optimistic views on life and on people are what caused his downfall.

[pigeon-butch]

SPOILERS FOR MOUTHWASHING THE VIDEO GAME and also cw for sexual assault

for whatever reason I scrolled through the comments section on a couple youtube videos of people playing the game (bad idea do not do this) and it's so weird to me how people are writing like. full essays arguing that jimmy couldn't possibly have raped anya or that it was obviously consensual or someone else did it or if not then its not important to the story anyway. and most of these arguments seem to stem from the fact that in anya's interactions with him she's nice to him? which i pretty clearly read as appeasing behavior seeing as how everything she says is sandwiched between him being incredibly cruel to her and her trying to protect herself (eg. taking the gun so that even though curly won't let her use it to defend herself jimmy won't be able to hurt her with it). I think the reaction to anya is also kind of a mess since the character pov you have after the crash is jimmy, a person who anya might as well not exist to but is nevertheless the lens that the player is introduced to her through. like I think it's very telling that what haunts jimmy during the final nightmare sequence isn't anya herself but instead the horrible horse baby centipede thing and also the fact that, unique to her death over any other crewmate, the view of her is completely blocked off, like he fully refuses to even consider her as a person which tracks with his need to see himself as the hero! there's no justifying what he's done to her so to him her life can't be worth anything. personally (and tying into the argument of oh why even include it when it doesn't even matter) i think jimmy's treatment of anya is a really good representation of how misogyny and a mindset like jimmy's overlap, how that desire to hold power over other people and to be respected and to get everything he wants without taking anyone else into account gets directed at what he perceives to be the most vulnerable member of the crew even before he crashes the ship and kills them all. it's an attitude that reflects the real life conditions that often lead to sexual assault and it's part of what makes anya's story feel so real :(