#gotnf you are everything to me

[juniemunie]

"The sky was lonely, and you were the tail that I wanted."

[saturnniidae]

astrid for the character ask game?

(p.s deya you are so cool)

YAYAUAY I LOVE YAMMERING ABKJT ASTRID (ALSO TYSM???)

Favorite thing about her: the way she cares so deeply for people but is bad at showing it and has the most diabolical case of cuteness aggression I fear I've ever seen. She expresses her love for her friends through actions like protecting them.

Least favorite thing: How she only has like one episode (the flighttmare episode where shes trying to regain her famliys honor. off the top of my head) dedicated solely to her, and all her other development being linked to Hiccup in some way and how she's slowly just reduced to 'supportive gf' in the later movies.

Favorite line: "Our parents war is about to become ours! Figure out which side you're on." Because it just tells you so much about her character. She's essentially a child soldier, well they all are, but the others still goof off, yknow, like kids are supposed to?? Astrid allows herself 0 moments of weakness (respite) and puts everything before herself to ensure berks safety.

BrOTP: I already talked about her and Snotlout, so how about her and Fishlegs? Like they their moments of silliness in that one rtte ep where he helped her look for a betrothal gift and her helping him protect the dramillions. It shows they have such a bond you'd think would be kind of unlikely but then it's like. Never talked about again and it makes me mad bc they're such best friends :(

(let Astrid have friends outside of Hiccup challenge: FAILED)

OTP: Her and Hiccup. Or Heather. Heathstrid is more of a 'it's cute and makes sense' ship than one I'm genuinely invested in tbh bc I don't think Heather needs a love interest, so ig hiccstrid since I'm more invested in it. (or specifically the version that lives in my head)

NOTP: idk. I saw her shipped with viggo once. That was Interesting (boo throws tomatoes👎👎)

Random headcanon:

Now knowing their war with the dragons was essentially pointless, she feels like she wasted her childhood. Had someone only realized and ended it sooner, she wouldn't have spent all her time training instead of being happy. Also she's trans <33

(Astrid child soldier Hofferson you grew up too fast. The dragon war ended only for her to be thrust into another conflict (war with viggo) shortly after but it's not like she's complaining. I feel like she spent so much time training to fight, she barely knows how to just. Be.)

Also. She keeps a little handkerchief in that pouch on her belt to wipe her hands after holding Hiccup's. Sweaty ass palms.

Also also, I feel like she has a slightly strained relationship with her parents and siblings and her uncle is her closest famliy member.

Unpopular opinion:

Sheshould get to be silly and be allowed to kind of suck sometimes. Let her be kind of a bitch with no remorse!!! let her be goofy sometimes!!!

Song I associate her with:

There's a few

Crab - Alex g (specifically her and Hiccup in the 1st movie and before it), The Wedding List - Kate Bush and The Calling - The Amazing Devil

(I've always interpreting The Calling as moving on from a desire to please and being blinded to other important aspects of life due to to one's obsession with strength, reflecting on that and starting anew which I feel fits her)

Favorite picture:

She looks so happy here it makes my chest hurt (gotnf is fhe best depiction of Astrid in all of httyd outside the first movie. I'll die in this hill)

[h1ccvpxtccthl3ss]

sometimes I watch gotnf or rob and dob and it feels like DreamWorks fully intended for us to believe that hiccup and astrid were already dating, like obviously ik that it was eventually said in rtte and they weren't and the entire time they were just really good friends, but COME ON there's certain ways that they interacted in rob/dob that makes it feel like DreamWorks actually rlly did intend to give us that idea that they were a thing, but it was never verbally said cuz that's not the main focus of the series and they didn't feel a need to actually say it. it just feels so much like that and there's so much subtle interactions that strongly suggests that they definitely weren't just friends, like how they spent literally all of their time together when they weren't with they dragons or the rest of the gang, or how they talked to each other about literally everything, constantly helped each other with things they were going through. and YES YES ik those were probably just cuz they were more main characters than the others and it could just have meant they were best friends but that doesn't explain away the amount of times they just casually kissed each other on the lips like it was something normal that they did all the time (which they probably did) or the ✨looks✨ they would give each other sometimes, like in "heather report" when astrid was going to outcast island posing as heather and the way hiccup was so concerned and protective and all "just be careful astrid" and saying they would be right behind her on their dragons in case she needed backup even tho she didn't think she needed it, or how she looked at him when she reassured him that she would be careful ASKDJIWND idk it's just things like that like I'm sorry but you can't tell me ALL of that was platonic and them just being "besties"

[crazy4dragons]

Gift of the Night Fury Appreciation!

March of Dragons ‘21 Prompt: Drop a happy rant about an episode, scene, character etc. that you love (Mar. 16-18).

The first thing that popped into my head when I read the prompt was Gift of the Night Fury! It’s been here since almost the beginning, but I feel like it sort of gets buried under all the (still good!) newer content. GOTNF is my favorite HTTYD short ever. In my opinion, it captures everything that made me love HTTYD to begin with: Hiccup and Toothless’ friendship, Hiccstrid, everyone on Berk coming to know and love dragons. It also fits into canon very well! Oh and let’s not forget that it literally foreshadows HTTYD3 with Hiccup creating a tail for Toothless to wear and fly on his own.

I like how GOTNF shows everyone on Berk learning and adjusting to dragons and I absolutely love that someone (probably Hiccup TBH) told Fishlegs that Meatlug was a boy and the twins had to explain to him why she was laying eggs. Also, I love Astrid with her Snoggletog traditions. I feel like GOTNF is one of the few times we get to see Astrid’s full personality. She’s always up for a battle and she’s definitely tough but she can also screw up and be just as much of a dork as Hiccup. I’d kill to see a raw, uncut version of their household after they have children, haha. Oh, and Hiccup making the tail for Toothless while pretending to like Astrid’s yaknog is priceless.

Also, the way Hiccup wants what’s best for Toothless but has a hard time coping when Toothless actually flies away is so parallel to HTTYD3. As much as I enjoy the fun shorts like Dawn of the Dragon Racers and the humor in some of RTTE, GOTNF just fucks me over in a whole different way. I think part of it is nostalgia and part of it is just that it captures what I love about the franchise and the characters perfectly. It’s not trying too hard or trying to add a bunch of new characters (absolutely no hate to fans who love all the new characters in RTTE/ROB/DOB! I personally had a couple I liked as well but for the most part they just didn’t click with me for some reason). It just exists and does a great job rounding out/building on the characters and relationships that I loved from the first movie.

Oh and let’s talk about that Hiccstrid kiss at the end! Absolutely adorable. I like older Hiccstrid and I love some good mature Hiccstrid smut interactions but there’s something just so heartwarming and sweet about 15-year-old Hiccstrid having innocent crushes on each other. Too cute!

Anyway, love GOTNF! I watch it every Christmas to celebrate; it’s become one of my go-to holiday specials and is probably my favorite!

[harley-style]

@hiccups-peg-leg, this is for you (your fuckin username man, its glorious)

HI AND WELCOME TO 100 + 1 REASONS I'M BEGINNING NOT TO LIKE HTTYD:THW

Disclaimer: It might not actually reach 50 reasons because I have a healthy amount of concern for my fingers

​It makes sense as the final part of a trilogy, for them to separate, but the whole set up of how the separation goes was...blargh.

​Hiccup was not acting like himself.

​Neither was Toothless, actually.

​Astrid was weaker in supporting Hiccup. I mean, don't get me wrong, she was still as badass as always, but never have I been more uncomfortable with her way of "supporting" Hiccup throughout this entire movie.

​"You gave him his freedom, what did you expect?" BITCH WHAT

​THIS IS NOT SOME CALL OF THE WILD BULLSHIT WHAT THE FUCK

​part of the reason Toothless STAYED even when Hiccup presented him with an automated tail was because he preferred BERK. you know, a civilised, NOT WILD settlement even if Toothless himself was a wild dragon prior

​in fact NONE of the dragons were being forced to stay there. Which means they CHOSE to stay with humans.

​Why was there no internal conflict between Berk? Why are they all just following Hiccup after some discussion about "Berk is not a place, its the people and our dragons!"??? Just???? They didn't feel like a village at all, is what I'm saying.

​For the record, I think Valka and Cloudjumper would have been harder to separate because these two were together for like twenty years why wouldn't they stick together???

​Toothless should not have been the King of the Hidden world. there are several reasons.

​1 - he was already a bad fucking leader when it came to priorities. he chose his MATE over his FLOCK. what the absolute fuck. 2- in coming to the hidden world, he promptly forgot about the BERKIAN FLOCK THAT HE HAD RESPONSIBILITIES TO. 3- it just doesnt make sense for all dragons to have bowed to him accepting him as their king. Night Furies are deadly, but they are not of the Dragon king breed. Toothless only managed that title because he FOUGHT a fucking dragon of that SPECIFIC breed. 4- he's horny as fuck. I'm sorry, it had to be said. He and the Light Fury have met for, what, a week at most? And already he's in love? Give me a fucking break. but anyways, my point is, if he dropped EVERYTHING HE KNEW AND LOVED for a person he BARELY GOT TO KNOW, then he should not have been made leader in the first place. 5- this is more personal, but fuck the fucking fact that he left hiccup for this unknown stranger. its like his human didnt even MATTER to him at all. which brings me to my next point.

​why the ever loving FUCK did the team EVER imply that hiccup and toothless were SOULMATES if all they were gonna do is separate them and have toothless forget hiccup entirely.

​are the dragons intelligent, sentient creatures

​or are they just wild animals capable of replicating human behavior without understanding the deeper implications of it

​because if the latter was true, then what the FUCK was the first two movies for?

​the hidden world cannot exist in a geological scale. it cannot sustain itself either. if toothless did somehow recall EVERY dragon, then the ecosystem of the hidden world is suddenly shot to fucking hell.

​the movie basically spat to our faces that romantic love is stronger than the power of friendship. and family.

​im pretty sure GOTNF was canon, and THW just spits all over its message and story.

​what happened to my badass dragon riders, dreamworks?

​okay ill be honest A LOT of my issues with this movie are centered around toothless and hiccup

​berk did not need to be separated from its dragons. in fact, dragons leaving berk, realistically speaking, would actually be detrimental to berk.

​for one thing, theyd be totally cut off from the rest of the world -- they suddenly relocated without any warning, to a place where no one had actually explored thus far. traders would not have known where to find them and, if they were in the merchant thinking mode, would cut their losses and find some other village to trade to. so new berk isnt gonna get any support for a long while.

​berk chose an island than can only be safely accessed via dragons. do you see where im going with this?

​by choosing to LET DRAGONS GO, hiccup and toothless have now condemned Berk into a generation of hardship, one that will make its people struggle with getting supplies, rebuild their homes, and basically a lot of their basic survival needs.

​and MIGHT I ADD, hiccup has REVOLUTIONIZED the viking way of life by INCORPORATING dragons into it. what happens when that system suddenly loses a big chunk of what made that system work?

​may i also add that hiccup has also REVOLUTIONIZED the term BIG DUMBASS when referring to decisions that were made.

​im also salty about how quickly toothless forgot about hiccup when entering the hidden world. like, holy fuck, i cannot even begin to explain how dreadful i felt when toothless was just "oh fuck yeah" in that glowing neon underground while poor hiccup was like "do you think he's okay?"

​if it were me, toothless would at least be having a moment to himself, looking at his tail, and you can clearly see in his eyes, "what about my human? what about berk?" before getting distracted. I would have accepted at LEAST that.

​nope. we get a toothless reluctantly going back to hiccup and new berk, resentful and somber as he longs for, what, a home?

​goddamn it i hate the hidden world in the movie the hidden world. i like the movie, i really really do, but that fucking plot device grates my fucking brain.

​RTTE handled a dragon haven a lot better.

​Vanaheim was a perfect place for wild dragons to settle but dreamworks fucking abolished that idea

​i KNOW vanaheim is like a resting place for sick dragons but like

​if hiccup was half as smart as he was the first two movies thw wouldnt have been a thing in the first place.

​its really, really hard for me to defend a movie i liked the first time i watched it when the only things i can see from it are toothless not caring enough about hiccup and hiccup making the niggest mistake of his life.

​this movie honestly felt like emotional manipulation. watching it i always remembered the other two movies, which should NOT have happened. when i watched the second movie (and may i add i barely remembered a thing about the first movie at the time) i was so MOVED to the point of TEARS. i had no context and i was moved to tears anyway. THW constantly pulled at my nostalgia strings and indirectly and directly called back to the first two movies and that just....what???

and that's it.

i mean if youd like to add more feel free to, probably missed some there

and there are a couple of ao3 essays that depict the same reasons i have. just put the tag "the hidden world" in your filters uwu

one last thing: despite the reasons i mentioned above i did enjoy watching thw, im just sayin it took me a long time and a lot of reading to figure out that, no, thw wasnt as great as the hype made it seem.

this isnt meant as an attack to people who like THW. i understand that this movie is special to you and I have no right to take enjoyment from you. im just laying out the reasons of why I personally don't agree with what happened in THW.

[inhonoredglory]

My Itsy Bitsy Review of HTTYD: Homecoming

I sobbed actual tears watching this thing. It legitimately comforted me over the ending of HTTYD than anything in the actual third film. Some of the things I loved most:

Completely burying the idea that Toothless forgot Hiccup in the 10 years.

Toothless drawing Hiccup because HE wanted to remember his best friend. It didn’t start off as a story to his family; that drawing was for himself, and for his own longings for his best bud.

The Gift of the Night Fury connections––the whole theme of missing those who are gone. In GotNF it was Toothless and Valka. In Homecoming, it’s Toothless and Stoick. And for Toothless, it’s Hiccup. I’m sure the fact that he’s away from Hiccup during Snoggletog gives him separation anxiety, reminding him of the first time he had an auto-tail and left Hiccup and realized he didn’t want to be separated.

Light Fury being as much of a dork as Toothless. I adored this side of her personality, and made her feel much more relatable IMO.

Hiccup being pwned by Zephyr. She’s her mother’s daughter, but her father’s daughter by the fact that she’s so creative and inventive in her contraptions.

The Hiccup/Toothless of course!! Toothless saving Hiccup AGAIN. The fact that the writers dragged out the reunion because we all know they’re not supposed to see each other. Toothless hugged an unknowing Hiccup. But Hiccup did SEE Toothless again, saving the short from a Ten/Rose not-reunion in the 50th anniversary ep of Doctor Who (LOL). Of course Hiccup knows now that it was Toothless who saved him from the cliff!

Hiccup inventing that dragon costume in the first place. “Why would you include that functionality!” Bless that destructive Leonardo. That gave me lots of RTTE humor vibes.

Hiccup became Toothless. We all knew this was already true.

THE CHILDREN. This short completely sold me on the Haddock children and the night lights. I want a show with them now. They have such personality and fun. Zephyr is a spitfire and Nuffink is everything precious. Also, some Calvin and Hobbes vibes with that head-banging stunt. (Not to mention Stoick, bless.)

Gerard Butler coming back to voice Stoick, even in this. The dedication and love he’s got for this franchise. I had to do a double take when he was referred to as Grandpa. AAAAh my babies are multi-generational.

And finally... my beautiful Hiccup and Toothless. My precious, wonderful, shy, caring, understanding, humble Viking. Your heart has never changed all these years, and you have never forgotten your first and fiercest friend. You will always be here in my soul, forever. I love you with all my being.

[alostbeing]

It's going to be 2020,but my childhood is still not completed with the httyd franchise ending this way.....

Hey guys, this is my first ever post on tumblr. I downloaded this for one specific reason, and it's for httyd.

I've just finish watching the whole Httyd franchise before the year 2020,and I've gotta say, I won't be having the best year next year, knowing how my childhood franchise had ended. Like I said in my description, I've just recently entered the fandom of httyd, but there are 2 main reasons why :

Well it's the one everyone should know, which is the ending of httyd 3. I mean the idea that Dean had for the film is good, the separation and everything. But I personally think he didn't set it up correctly. Everything that happened in the past films/specials/short films, all the relationships and friendships that were built through out the whole franchise felt like nothing in the third film. Especially with Toothless and Hiccup. Im really really sad that my favourite duo just separated, without really having the best goodbye and an actual good reason to be separated. I could do a whole rant about it, but it would be similar reasons with other posts that I've read. For example : The stupid villain Grimmel. He's just a weaker version of Drago, and he didn't do anything other then threatening Hiccup to give him Toothless. Then because of that the whole berk had to switch locations? Wtf was that. Besides that, Toothless just leaving hiccup, without even having the intentions to return to him, using the tail that he hated in GoTNF.... The third movie felt rushed and messy, I could see why it was delayed twice. It felt like Dean just wanted to end the franchise quickly and leave. Even tho it ended peacefully, with Hiccstrid and Toothless both getting married and everything, I don't think it's really a happy ending.

My second reason is Hiccstrid. I love them, their relationship just hits my heart differently from other relationships in cartoon animations. I'm happy that they've gotten married in httyd 3, thats one of the few things I loved about the film. But it's the fact that there's no more.... The amazing Hiccstrid moments that we had in Rob, DoB and especially RTTE has now ended, which is what I'm really really sad about. My only hope right now is that Dreamworks somehow allows their series in Netflix continue. Like maybe stories between the gap of httyd 2 and 3, or stories between the 10 year gap of when Hiccstrid got married and them having kids. Just showing more of clips of them dating and hanging out in their teen years is very enjoyable to watch. I've just been rewatching the episodes on rtte where they have the most interactions together.

That's the 2 main reasons why I'm really sad about the ending of the franchise.

But in general, I'm just sad that my favourite childhood franchise has ended. I've grew with this franchise and with the characters, seeing them for the last time is just really depressing. But I do have some ideas for DreamWorks to continue their franchise :

Like I said earlier, a continuation of the Dreamworks Dragons series on Netflix would be cool. Not only have stories between those years like I stated earlier, but DreamWorks could allow the writers to make their own storyline and have an alternative ending. I mean rtte did ended with some plot holes, and I could see ways for it to continue on its own. It is non canon with the films, so I could see the possibility of it happening. I'm not saying that the writers of rtte could anyhow make a better ending than Dean, but maybe the writers could give an ending that the fans actually want?

This is generally what I wanted to talk about, I think I'll make more post that's more in depth about my opinions and thoughts about the franchise later on. I hope my post can reach out to some people, and I'll get to hear some opinions from you guys as well.

(Ps : Since I'm new, could you guys like maybe leave some links of people for me to follow? I would love to follow some people who are quite similar to me. Like maybe some about Hiccstrid, discussions about the franchise it self and thoughts about httyd 3)

I'm gonna end it off here, I wish everyone a great and happy 2020! My new year resolution is, I hope DW will continue the franchise, and really give what the fans want. I know there are many fans who liked the film as well, but I hope DW will listen to the others too.

[thethiefandtheairbender]

hello yes @ everyone who’s saying that httyd3 prioritized romantic love over hiccup and toothless’ friendship, i can’t hear you over the sound of hiccup and toothless’ bond being compared to stoick’s love for valka, for the second time

“what do we do when they can’t be here for the holidays? we celebrate them.” — GOTNF

“but i don’t want another. your mother was the only woman for me. [...] with love comes great loss [...] love is the greatest gift we can receive.” 

and that the only “i love you,” spoken in the trilogy is between hiccup and toothless. that, like valka and stoick, they reunite after years apart, one party — valka, hiccup — unsure, with the only only showing unconditional love — stoick, and toothless. that the reunion scene exists, that it shows the realism of friends growing apart as they get older, but that their lives aren’t actually complete without each other. that the only reason toothless manages to win over the light fury is when he acts like himself, and who he is is shown through what he’s learned from hiccup. that he takes hiccup’s advice in a scenario he’s very unsure in. that everytime he’s excited the first person he shares it with it his boy, who he gives big hugs and licks to, who he knows something is familiar about even if this human looks very different and wait — that’s his boy and he’s happier than we’ve seen him in the entire movie. 

anyone who is upset over the movie’s handling of the subject of love is upset that hiccup and toothless weren’t treated as one another’s life partners — and you can’t, and shouldn’t, have one person be everything for you, btw — and ignoring the fact that they were always treated as one another’s soulmates. that when they fly at the end with their families, their families are complete because they are also flying with each other.

[kingofthewilderwest]

Do you feel Hiccup’s personality in RTTE is different than his personality in the movies? If so, would you chalk it up to him still working on growing up, or say it’s the writing? Personally I just feel his personality is slightly more brash and self-centered than he is in the movies. I still love him with my whole heart of course and I LOVE RTTE but I can’t help but feel his personality is a little... off. Also apologies if you’ve already received a similar ask before.

It’s an interesting topic! I like to consider it from both a meta framework (Doylist) and in-universe accounts (Watsonian).

As you said, Hiccup’s personality feels slightly different in RTTE versus the movies. I agree. The difference is objectively there. The showrunners gave us a brasher, bolder, more aggressive Hiccup in the shows.

However, for me, difference doesn’t automatically mean OOC or off. I like to think about it as different flavors of Hiccup. It’s common for a character in a large franchise to have the same core personality and role throughout the franchise, but when you compare individual pieces of media, how the character is spun, or what traits are focused upon, differ from piece to piece. You’ll get permutations where the character feels more violent or confident or humorous, but it’s still the core character you can recognize.

Hiccup has brash moments in HTTYD 1, and that feature got highlighted in the shows more strongly. But it’s still emanating from his core character as a dragon-loving, out-of-the-box-thinking, revolutionary, impulsive, heart-on-his-sleeve young man.

Tony Stark and Natasha Romanova have different flavors depending on which comic series you’re going through with which writer. They’re different between the comics and the movies, they’re different between the animated movies and the television shows and the MCU, and heck, they’ve got different flavors for every MCU installment they’re in. You can still analyze and connect an ongoing consistent narrative from Tony Stark from IM –> IM2 –> Avengers –> IM3 –> AOU –> etc., but frankly, the different writers for the MCU give us obviously different Tonys regardless of continuity. It’s how it is.

So brasher rtte!Hiccup is an obviously different flavor. We can see that the writers of RTTE handle him objectively differently than Chris Sanders + Dean DeBlois handles him in HTTYD 1 + GOTNF, and how Dean DeBlois handles him in HTTYD 2 + HTTYD 3. Regardless of continuity, those differences exist.

But that doesn’t mean Hiccup’s character growth can’t be connected between film and show. I think that, if we want to, we can give a cohesive, comprehensive account of how Hiccup grows through the years. I don’t think it’s bizarre to say that a sarcastic, awkward, impulsive, sometimes brash teenager in a war-centric society (HTTYD 1) becomes more confident when he’s given responsibilities and fits in better with his peers (ROB –> DOB). As he’s faced with more enemies, his confidence continues to grow, and he understands his identity as a dragon protector who thinks outside the box, sometimes meeting enemies with violent solutions to save the day (DOB). But his newfound confidence and leadership skills get tested with an enemy who challenges his strengths, an undercutting experience that can make Hiccup more irritable and brash as he tries to process what’s happening (RTTE). After going through his most dangerous set of circumstances yet, he’s tired of fighting and wants peace, remembering how well that worked in his youth. But now that he’s no longer able to be that carefree kid flying with dragons, he’s questioning his identity and future (HTTYD 2). He’s forced into leadership, where he must mature into an adult who will selflessly give up dragons to the wild (THW).

I watched friends between the ages of 15 to 20 do drastic character developments like that. I had one friend go from an academically-centered goof to a rude cocky pothead to a mature selfless youth group leader in five years, and it all made sense why he changed as he did. And frankly, Hiccup’s more consistent than that. XD

While it’s a lot of smacking together official materials and intentionally reading those materials in light of “Let’s fit this together,” that’s the fun of experiencing any large franchise. Large franchises are always us choosing whether or not we feel like the latest character presentation fits in with the other pieces, and we as fans have the right and interest and valid right to put those pieces together. Stories are meant to be both critically analyzed (looking for where writing could improve) and accepted for our imaginations (bringing materials together into a cohesive whole). Fans have a right to look at Luke Skywalker in TLJ and say, “Yeah, I can see him growing into that,” or not. It’s not wrong to read it either way - or both ways!

So to me it means it doesn’t have to feel off when we see tetchier rtte!Hiccup. I think we can look at the in-universe world, see the circumstances Hiccup is in, and say, “Yeah, that kid’s still growing.”

Personally, I think it’s a lot more fun to say, “Yeah, that kid’s still growing.” I enjoy talking about Hiccup morphing through the years and going through that slightly cocky phase in his middle teens. It makes sense to me. A sarcastic kid who’s used to being ostracized is now given lots of respect in the tribe, everything is going “right” for him (beating bad guys and saving dragons!), and so his ego and temper might spark up to match. Once he realizes he was being brash, he could pendulum hard the other way (I had a pendulum moment in my own life when I was 21) and seek peace to a fault… only later coming to a balanced middle. And as someone who loves all things How to Train Your Dragon, from the movies to the television series, to me there’s nothing more fun than to read the world together as one!

[inke-ri]

It’s a little weird how Spirit Riding Free actually did a better job convincing me of why setting your animal friend free is the best choice for both of you than HTTYD 3. I’m going to reiterate that I don’t think Dragons 3 did it wrong, it’s just that SRF did it better. (Yea. I can’t believe I said it myself).

Allow me to explain.

In Spirit Riding Free, we learn from the beginning that Spirit (well, supposedly Spirit’s son, also called Spirit, really, that connection doesn’t matter, it’s just a wild west girls-and-their-horses show) is a wild horse. He doesn’t bond well with humans, he’s fiercely independent. The one person he befriends is Lucky, the human who:

1. Allows him to be semi-wild and live with his herd whenever he wants 2. Respects his needs when he doesn’t want to be around humans 3. Rides with him without a saddle, bridle/reins, or rope. Yes, it’s unrealistic for a city girl to learn to do that right away, but thematically it’s a very strong thing 4. Understands his strong responses to people who try to dominate him and never holds it against him 5. Doesn’t try to keep him cooped up in a stall

Throughout every. single. season, it’s stressed that Spirit is not a horse that enjoys being tamed. So (spoilers for those who watch it) in the latest season, possibly the final one, Lucky is supposed to move to a boarding school, a place that would require Spirit to adapt to being fully tamed, needing to sleep constantly on a stall, needing horseshoes, et cetera. Lucky finds that she can’t take Spirit away from his homeland, his herd, or try to make him conform to being a domesticated animal. She chooses to let him go.

Of course, it being a kids show, they don’t have the guts to have the season/series end with the two apart, but up until the last two minutes they really felt like they were going to do it. It was so well done I even teared up a lil bit.

Now, back to HTTYD:

Unlike SRF, Toothless isn’t shown to be a wild animal all the time. It’s partially the fault of him being very anthropomorphized. In Dragons 1 yes, he felt like a wild dragon. In D2-3…. Not so much. He accepts a saddle. He accepts living in the viking world. There isn’t a single scene that shows Toothless struggling to adapt or needing to be wild. In fact, GotNF directly squashes that notion when it has Toothless set free but his only concern is not dragon-ness, it’s just getting Hiccup’s helmet back.

So I think my point is just the implication that dragons are wild creatures that must remain like that, or that (very very beautiful) deleted scene with the bird, doesn’t quite work with HTTYD’s universe. It’s not like Toothless is a wild bird who will fly away the moment he’s released. Every time he did, before D3 anyway, he came back. It was his choice, the lifestyle that made him happy. It’s like if Spirit found that, with Lucky, he wouldn’t mind a saddle or a bridle.

And (sorry for hammering this point in yet another post, but the tv series really reminded me of it), it again boils down to not dedicating a lot of time to explore WHY Toothless should leave, to the point that many fans, despite understanding the reasoning behind the characters’ choices, struggle to accept them regardless. With SFR, alongside all the consistent character points that Spirit is a semi-wild horse, the episode before the finale’s runtime is split between Lucky’s shenanigans and, yes!, Spirit finding himself in a big city! He can’t handle the noise and the stress and people trying to pet him and someone trying to rope him and tie him to a hitching post, or how people whip their horses (as he gets protective). Lucky is forced to grab him and run back out of the city so he can relax.

In the finale we see Lucky indeed clinging to Spirit and trying to convince herself everything will be fine (something I personally don’t think HTTYD showed us- no, Gobber. Hiccup wasn’t clinging. He was just being his usual self and worrying about his friend, as he has every reason to given what happened just a year before), going as far as to try to get him used to the noise and the people. But he can’t. He’s, at core, a wild horse.

While I maintain that D3 could have been fixed with just a few scene tweaks, I think (given the bird deleted scene) if they had this sort of view in hindsight, of Toothless always being a wild animal and a small part of him always struggling with blending with humans, it’d make the finale even more poignant. The point of HTTYD 3 is that Toothless can’t go against his wild dragon nature even if he wants to, that he found his place and that Hiccup’s and Toothless’ friendship helped them both grow immensely but it was time to say goodbye. So to always portray it as if someday they miiiight just have to part ways would make it a lot more emotionally heavy, and wouldn’t lead fans to question if Toothless and Hiccup staying away from each other was the best choice for them.

Y'know, if Dragons 3 was a direct sequel to Dragons 1 (with minor adjustments like swapping Valka for Stoick and removing Eret/giving his lines to the other riders), it’d be a perfect ending :’D Because Toothless in Dragons 1 did feel like he’s semi-wild, and the idea of “taking care of him till he’s ready to fly away on his own” would match better.

Hopefully this doesn’t come out as negativity or even heavy criticism, it’s not really my intention here. I honestly just couldn’t stop thinking of HTTYD when watching the final season of Spirit Riding Free and couldn’t help but draw comparisons between the two :’) It’s more of an analysis than a vent or rant post.

[zarinaa113]

Favourite Hiccup and Toothless moment? And favourite Hiccstrid moment?

 Anon, thank you a thousand for this question! Sorry this took so long, it’s just a bit of a hard question for me, in the best way! I’m not doing one of those ‘ask posts’ at the moment but that won’t stop me!Favorites are too hard, can I do top 5? Thanks!I haven’t seen HTTYD 3 yet so it’s not included in these assessmentsHiccles:

1) Forbidden Friendship scene: It isn’t really a fight for first place, Holy Feeling trump’s feels. If I have to be specific I’ll say from when they start drawing on. And more specifically The Hand Touch. It’s so incredibly iconic and feels so organic. You can see them breathing and that breathtaking music! I just… No words!

2) The scene in RTTE when Hiccup drowns in the dumbbell: What I love here is that both characters really think that Hiccup is going to die. Somehow this fake-out worked when the others in the shows didn’t. The way Hiccup wants Toothless to go but he won’t leave. Hiccup’s slight hand curl when Toothy pushes his nose into the glass. It feels so real for the characters. I believe that Hiccup believed he was about to die. I can’t say that for some of the scenes like this in the movies! The music here too is amazing.

3) Come back to me: There are just so many emotions in this scene. And what’s beautiful is that they are sharing the same emotions! Will he forgive me? Dose he still love me? Am I strong enough? Can we even start over? This is the whole point of the movie. After so much, is their love strong enough to break the natural order? Of course it is. Nothing, not even literal attempted murder that ended up murdering a loved one instead can change that. They love each other.

4) GotNF Destroying the new tail: What Toothless dose here is huge. He’s saying to Hiccup: “I don’t want even the option of flying without you. And if that means giving up my freedom then I will give up my freedom. Because that’s how much I love you Hiccup. I love you more then freedom.” And coming from a wild animal, that says everything. Hiccup’s almost scared expression while Test Drive blasts, just staring as he struggles to grasp what this truly means is amazing. Then that tiny grin he gives, it says everything. I don’t think Hiccup truly knew how smart Toothy was before this scene, neither did we, and you can see him almost reassessing their relationship here. Now that Toothless has chosen to rely on Hiccup it changes the power dynamic. He isn’t staying to fly, he stays for Hiccup. He stays for love.

5) When Hiccup and Toothless reunite in Valka’s sanctuary: I didn’t get this part for a while. Why was Hiccup so worried? Then I realized that he thought Toothless might have died and that it’s been an unknowable amount of hours. But in movie time it hasn’t even been two minute? And we’ve stayed with Hiccup or Toothy the whole time? Either way, it’s amazing bonding. The way Hiccup whispers “It’s okay” over and over again to soothe them both. And how he touches different parts of Toothless over and over again to make sure he’s all there cause he can’t really see him. Then he never lets go, and his tail wrapping around Hiccup. Also Toothy is fairly calm once he sees Hiccup. He can immediately tell he’s okay. Then he’s like “If you even think about touching my boy I swear I will claw you to death with my claws!” It’s a great bit that might not have worked story-wise but is perfect for the Talking Fishbone and Useless Reptile.Hiccstrid:

1) The entirety of Blindsided: Specifically the kiss. They took a fanfiction staple and made it work! But seriously, the first true Hiccstrid kiss! They’re too cute!

2) The whole Itchy Armpit scene: It’s rare we ever see such a beautiful and real relationship in cinema. Period. And that it’s a romantic couple and that it’s animated! The detailed body language in this scene is stellar and they are simply adorable. I hope I have a relationship like them one day.

3) The bit in RTTE when they’re alone on an island bonding and Hiccup twirls her: This scene is great because they’re love birds! The little twirl he gives her for no reason other then he can makes me swoon! There’s a lot of intimate affection in this bit and I’m just a sucker for that!

4) Romantic Flight: Because I have to! The music and lighting and cinematography and animation are stellar. If she wasn’t in love with him after that I’d send her to The Grounded Dungeon! I will add that the quick shift to The Nest from this scene really helps make The Nest seem even more terrifying without being too a drastic tone shift. That’s how ya do it!

5) The Sparring scene: It’s the best! I love that Hiccup’s gotten so good at fighting that he can hold his own with Astrid when she’s going easy on him. They are so burning off sexual tension you will never convince me otherwise. I love that he gets cocky just a bit and then she gets him. Also his slow-mo cackle as he trip’s her. The fact that they didn’t notice that they had an audience, that they had an audience, and aren’t bothered by it also shows how comfortable they are not only with each other, but with everyone else knowing about them. The flowers are just the icing on the cake. But honestly there’s too many moments that I love. The Hiccless when they walk out of Hiccup’s house and we see the leg and tail framed together so beautifully, the Hiccstrid 'wouldn’t’ talk, the Hiccless trust fall with the Whispering Death, the quick Hiccstrid cheek kiss in HTTYD 2, that time Toothless took an arrow for Hiccup and then Hiccup jumped over him so if they were gonna die at least it would be together, 'What took you so long?’, Test Drive, that kiss and tease at the end of GotNF, all of Enemy of my Enemy, that kiss at Dagur’s wedding, the reunion scene in GotNF, those dorks hugging in the snow, when Hiccup leaves Toothless on Dragon Island and when they play-fight in HTTYD 2 and more! It’s mostly the little moments in the background and looks they share. Telegraphing hours of time spent together. And HTTYD 3 will only add more!Thanks once more for this question! I hope you and everyone else remember that my ask box is always open! ;)

[saturnniidae]

YESS YOU GET IT. girl failure Astrid my beloved. She's competent on the battle field, but so lost in social interactions.

And yeah she deserved so much better. I think the best Astrid centric episode we got was the rob/dob one the flightmare was introduced in, and still Hiccup was kind if the secondary protagonist of it. Though it was mostly about Astrid and her mission to restore her families honor and hiccuo played more of a supporting role iirc, and that was SO refreshing because I'm tired of Astrid just being reduced to 'the supportive girl friend'

She has has so much potential it's devastating everytime I think about how the writers wasted it. Like, she's so complex??? Astrid 'our parents war is about to become ours!' Hofferson, Astrid 'It's okay stormfly, I'm a soldier I'm used to being shot at Hofferson. She's a child soldier who wasted her youth training for a war that ended so abruptly she probably felt relieved only to be thrust into another one (albeit not as intense, considering the previous one lasted centuries) during rtte.

I hate how she's also just reduced to 'the angry girl' when she's so much more than that. I do think regardless of how she was raised she'd always have a passion for fighting, but that doesn't mean she likes it.

She's a protector first and foremost, she puts her training before everything else because she thinks she has to, because she needs to defend her loved ones. And she's been doing this her whole life, which was why seeing her get to be silly in those little moments in the series and in gotnf (though to me it also read as a bit manic) is so important to me!!!

Astrid Hofferson has autistic resting bitch face

[frostyviking]

Hey, maybe you could check out a counter pov for the whole light fury romance plot which is posted on my Tumblr? It's too long to fit in an ask box. I know you might not like the fact that the light fury is being used as an excuse to separate Hiccup and Toothless, but I have a feeling Dean will be able to develop her as a decent character and convince us all that she is indeed something that Toothless is currently missing in his life, in the same way that he showed the need for Valka.

Post here

my reply is under the read more because oops this got long

My issue with your argument is that you’re kinda reducing Toothless to be a basic animal. You’re saying that it has to be a female night fury so that Toothless will be interested and choose her over Hiccup. “it can’t be just any ordinary night fury either as Toothless would surely pick Hiccup over any random night fury” I’m sorry but that just rubs me wrong. Animals (Toothless too) can be motivated beyond sex. If the cons of staying is more than the pros, animals will leave. 

I think the opposing ideas is because we’re seeing this issue differently. You’re trying to see what will entice Toothless to get him to leave, while I’m seeing what will happen that will force him and the other dragons to leave. Just note that in the books, Toothless never leaves Hiccup. All the dragons are leaving, but Toothless chose to stay with Hiccup for the rest of his life.

And this is exactly my issue with romance stories. The romantic interest is seen as more important, more valuable, than friends or family. It’s still choosing to abandon platonic relationships to pursue this romantic one. 

I believe there doesn’t even need to be another night fury. The books didn’t have any love interest to convince the dragons that they need to leave. Hiccup and Toothless didn’t need some other dragon to be willing to explore their world further. I personally believe that posing the issue of the dragons leaving as something that is personal wants vs needs of the society to be much more powerful than including a love interest.

“I have a feeling Dean will be able to develop her as a decent character and convince us all that she is indeed something that Toothless is currently missing in his life, in the same way that he showed the need for Valka.”

I trust Dean, I really really do. But I don’t want there to be a new reason to explain this female dragon. I don’t this to appear so everything is okay now. It’s not. I think we have different thoughts on Valka’s purpose. Valka in the books was also never really a mother figure. She’s not here to be a mother. I really believe she’s to take on the position of a world of dragons away from humans. “People can’t change” and maybe she’s right. How many nice words and forbidden friendships do we need to change people like Drago? People who will use dragons for their own gain.

What is Toothless missing? We were never shown that he even slightly misses other night furies. Is he even aware of this type of thought? That he may be the last of his kind? A cat wouldn’t know, wouldn’t care if it was the last one on earth. That’s an advance form of existential thinking that not many animals possess. The only thing we’ve seen Toothless miss is flying on his own from gotnf. But that was just to get Hiccup his helmet. He gave up that gift right after. As far as we’ve seen, Toothless has everything he needs already.

Honestly trying to convince me a potential romance being okay is moot. I’m personally very against romance. I don’t ship things, I simply despise it. There’s no convincing me. I also want to address other parts of your post

The thing about your comment about the “carbon copy Forbidden Friendship” is that there’s already rumors that Toothless meeting this light fury is going to be a forbidden friendship-esque scene. 

Also yes, httyd2 showed that Hiccup can do more when it comes to the whole “A chief protects his own”. He was able to save the dragons from Drago and Berk. But at what cost? Hiccup ran away, so Stoick, Gobber, the other kids went after him. Berk was pretty much left defenseless. Hiccup saved the dragons, but what about the Vikings? We never learned if anyone got hurt from the ice. And what if “his own” are the ones that are hurting the dragons? That’s the dilemma Hiccup and Toothless have to deal with. httyd is all about Hiccup showing other people that humans and dragons can live in peace. It’s possible. But proof of it just isn’t enough. 

I believe that the ending of httyd is a comment on the selfishness of human nature, and how our stubborn refusal to change can be harming to others. Just like how we’re a cause for the extinction of animals. We just take their homes, have animals as pets in spaces that are much too small for them to live in. I think having this romantic component is not necessary, there’s already so much here to use. It just muddles this issue.

As for the light fury design, too many people are trying to find reasons through biological examples. But this isn’t real life. People deliberately made each choice to design this light fury exactly as she appears. Even then, this post brilliantly explains why the biological reasonings people have been using don’t work. Of course there are exceptions, but this doesn’t make sense when considering what the majority of animal patterning looks like. (I won’t say anymore, the post covers it perfectly). We shouldn’t be justifying things as an exception. “This woman in engineering is just an exception, all other women aren’t capable of this” calling the woman an exception is ignoring the larger question “why aren’t there more women in engineering?” Saying this light fury is an exception to natural patterning, is ignoring “why did the artists choose to do this?”

I can’t accept this light fury because 1) she’s been described consistently as a love interest and 2) she is following the female-anthropomorphized animal trope that too many companies do. The first point is already hard for me to accept but the second one is just making this impossible. I love and trust Dreamworks, but not Universal. I’m afraid they had influence in this film. 

I hope you don’t see this as me just ignoring your thoughts. I just cannot accept any justification for this. Especially not when comparing to how the books approached the issue. I know different mediums, different ways of approach, but this is still imo way out of whack to how httyd usually is. Hopefully the movie will prove me wrong, but everything we’ve gotten is just the opposite of what I’ve been expecting in the past 4 years. 

[avannak]

Hey AvannaK! I'm genuinely curious what you would've liked to see in a canon-consistent bridge series between HTTYD/GOTNF and HTTYD2? Do you have specific "should haves" and "would have been nice if..."? Sorry if you've answered this before. 😕 I'm not around as much. Take care!

Heya!!!

This is a really fun ask and it led me on a journey through a lot (a lot) of old posts. Some I’ve quoted, some I’ve linked to, but hopefully I’m managed to peace together a readable summation of things/events I like to imagine happened in between HTTYD/GotNF –> HTTYD2. Thank you!

Hiccup’s awakened to a whole new world; in the span of a month or so his entire life has been flipped and he’s got no choice but to hit the ground and run with it because, as of now, he’s at the forefront of Peace. The village is not only paying him positive attention (for being him) but also looking to him for direction. He’s lost a leg. He seems to have gained everything else.

In the following months, years even, his father does a lot of directing within the village, as Hiccup learns to lay out a plan. It’s not long after Hiccup awakens that Stoick sits his son down and says “Tell me everything”. Stoick wants to know Hiccup’s history with Toothless, his desires, his personal thoughts on where Berk is and move on from here and, to Hiccup, its a moment he’s been waiting for his entire life. His father has always loved him, but its felt like years since he’s openly valued his opinion. Stoick wants to be a team with Hiccup, because Hiccup is Berk’s first and only step into this new territory, but Stoick has the pull.

Stoick is openly impressed with his son after hearing the full tale; he says as much. About how brave Hiccup was, to make himself vulnerable like that, purposefully, and to come out victorious. The sort of bravery few vikings show anymore. The sort of bravery his mother had.

Hiccup and Stoick’s relationship had started to take a dive as Hiccup grew out of childhood and into a disappointing vision for a viking. It’s being restored, heftily, as they walk an entirely new path together (though, not at all without disagreement; both will continue to claim the other “doesn’t listen” until the very day they part ways).

Right from the get-go, Hiccup struggles with his leg or lack there of. There’s heavy frustration with limb loss and the adjustments Hiccup has to make around it leads to flares of temper – moments where he snaps at his father in misplaced anger, or Toothless, before he’s struck by reality and apologizes. Sometimes he pushes himself too far, insistent on maintaining independence, and Astrid, or Toothless, need to help him back, and he’s left sweaty, and angry, and embarrassed. Hiccup would have periods where he felt so helpless and it killed him because losing his independence for a time makes him feel like he’s Hiccup the Useless all over again. Phantom pains and feverish nightmares plague him often at first; times when he grows testy and stressed as this burning sensation runs up his leg like its still on fire, and Gobber has to sit him down and help him work through it. These episodes manage to crop up again and again in the following years no matter how comfortable he’s become on his feet.

In fact, late winter of that year, not long before Hiccup’s 16th birthday, when he’s just begun to feel physically normal, a common sickness is taken to an extreme for him. He can’t shake it, he loses weight, his leg pains him constantly. It has his father besides himself and Toothless acting out and Astrid furious with the gods.

And then there’s the growth spurts. He’s just sixteen when he gets a new leg fitted by Gobber. And then sixteen and a half when he adjusts that same wooden leg. Twice more before his seventeenth birthday he makes even more adjustments and it’s when he’s 17 and four months, after a fortnight of an aching back and pinched calf that Hiccup fashions himself a full new prosthetic of his own design. He happily braces it to his stump, sighs in contentment, and stands to look directly over his girlfriend’s head… who had merely come to accompany him to the Mead Hall and not be ridiculed for height disparities.

Gobber’s relationship almost immediately starts to transition from Uncle-figure/Blacksmith-master to confidant and therapy guide. Every other viking on Berk seems to have lost a limb, but Hiccup feels safest around Gobber to be open and vulnerable and actively seek help. Gobber teaches him the tricks to fastening a prosthetic, the mental and physical exercises to better deal with limbloss, holding his hand through the hardest of times and listening to his rants patiently. Limbloss is a way of viking life, but that doesn’t make it any easier watching a familial child go through it. At the same time Hiccup’s being pulled out of the forge more and more, and Gobber, like a distant, proud father, will both needle him about it and be supportive all the same. Gobber takes on another apprentices from time to time — capable young’ns, a few old hands with good experience — but he’ll miss the back and forth banter, and the exasperating ingenuity, of his honorary nephew.

Toothless takes it upon himself to get Hiccup into shape on his leg. He pushes the boy to exercise, to be physically stronger, just as Hiccup pushes him to tolerate silly human manners (like to not nest on Stoick’s bed or help himself to any fish netting in sight). Hiccup and Toothless have, by far, the best human-dragon relationship yet to be seen on Berk, often and unwittingly acting as ambassadors to their respective species with the goal of making cohabitation as seamless as possible. They also are still learning about each other, and the differences in their behaviors as humans and dragons; where they’ll compromise and where they simply won’t. The subject of Toothless’s tail come up between them. Hiccup has it confirmed that Toothless knows… he knows it was him. Just as Toothless understands, as well as any dragon could, that Hiccup’s learned and accepted that he too took his foot. It’s not instant forgiveness. Not when Toothless still bears the scars of the bola canon, and not when Hiccup is still freshly relearning how to walk, dealing with a new upheaval of emotion and pain, but both find the results well, well worth their suffering, and finding each other even more so. They forgive each other. They communicate through touch and two different, one-way, verbal speech habits until they’re able to make “we got even” jokes about it five years later to some rando, feral dragon lady.

Hiccup’s relationship with his peers is another thing that takes an immediate 180. Much like the village in its entirety, Hiccup finds himself saddled with their positive attention and respect. It carries a past of longing, heartache, and anger. Hiccup can’t find it in him to hold onto his resentment; not when they’re so willing to learn, so sets aside his unease and pushes them. He pushes them to fly, and to bond, and to listen to their dragons. He’s barely aware of a protective element building between the teens and himself; a rapport born from fighting a battle unlike any other. He doesn’t stop to question if its out of guilt for their recent past, or if they’re that singularly minded. Whenever he stops to think about it he starts to get overwhelmed by the reality that this is all happening, he’s “one of them” (or they’re one of him?), so he tries not to. …Even though they sit with Hiccup in the Mead Hall, and hang out with him beyond dragon training, and pull him into battle spars when just months earlier they would have shoved him down a knoll first. The twins show up at the forge from time to time, seemingly just to mess with him. Fishlegs will spend hours with him pouring over text discussing dragons, gushing about possible revisions to the Book of Dragons. For once, Snotlout gets to laugh along with Hiccup’s biting, witty retorts as they’re finally directed towards others: stubborn, withered old vikings set in their ways and still battling dragon integration.

Ruffnut quickly figures that her attention to Hiccup is hitting a stone wall, and her interest that came so fast and hard is easy to shrug off almost as quickly (though losing to Astrid, even in a one-sided, unacknowledged battle, still smarts). Instead she keeps up with the uncomfortable attention a while longer simply for her own amusement. Snotlout too learns to let go of Astrid. She so easily rolled into this new life (not that he’s fighting it), and, perhaps, she was never the ideal woman for him in particular. Still admittedly hot, though.

And then there’s nights in the Mead Hall. They grow older, stay out later, test the limits of Mead and foreign ales. Engage in drinking games they’ve only seen older warriors participate in. There’s a streaking incident. Brawls. Hiccup finds himself pushing to ban drinking and flying (because if vikings want to be idiots, then fine, but don’t endanger the dragons). Stoick enforces it (someone needs to look out for his idiot vikings). A more sober variation comes of it over time: Dragon Racing.

Debates within the tribe about spreading peace break out almost immediately. For the first year of peace, well into late summer, the tribe was nearly unanimous about focusing on integrating dragons: learning to fly, acclimating to the benefits (and drawbacks) of sharing space with dragons, and loose plans on altering the village to fit their new needs. As they grew comfortable Hiccup, and a few others, started to push towards communicating with their distant neighbors about bringing on this way of life. Frienemy tribes (the Meatheads, the Bogs, etc) were opening communications once more, and all Hiccup sees is an opportunity. Hiccup’s on a high over many platforms; he wants to expand peace, knowledge, and understanding between dragons and humans. People are listening to him and he’s good, really good, at what’s passing for impressive these days. He’s ready for more. But this is one area where the older generations has more experience, more assurance. It is almost unanimously agreed to keep the pro-dragon lifestyle secret, and it’s not to punish Hiccup, or dragons around the world that still battle humans, but to protect their own, very new way of life. Especially as it develops, and they’re left vulnerable, off-footed, all the while very much aware of how tribes once were long before violent dragons had forced humans to keep a united front.

It’s confirmed in HTTYD2 that Berk keeps their dragon lifestyle a secret from other tribes. Berk manages to shirk hosting an annual Thing year after year, claiming repairs for being the most devastated by the dragon war, that they’ve had to travel for timber and food given the ruin dragons laid upon them before the war mysteriously ended. Instead they travel, by boat, to meet old allies, testing the waters of old friendships, waiting for a time when an opening will come forth to bring dragons into their lives as well…

Hiccup must go to these Things, and does so without his dragon, often wary at familiar faces, nervously making up stories about his leg, wishing he had Toothless with him. Snotlout goes as well, meeting up with old playmates, but shocking them with a more protective attitude towards Hiccup. Astrid starts to accompany him when he’s seventeen; both having decided their relationship is concrete enough to make known outside Hooligan territory.

Following the events of HTTYD, Astrid (and the others’) focus is on learning to fly dragons ahead of the curve so that they can continue to master and teach. Beyond number one priority, and beyond keeping up with traditional physical tasks (as she’s still Very Viking, thank you very much), and a bit beyond helping out her village adapt to dragons, is Astrid’s interest in Hiccup. Yes, a lot of it has to do with him being the best and first dragon rider. He’s actually impressive. He’s impressed her. He has a future as a chief, and not just any chief, but the chief. The one that changed everything. And, it turns out, he’s pretty funny (and frustrating) and incredibly ingenious (but impractical at times) and he genuinely cares about her (but he’s probably being as impressed and disillusioned by her as she is him). She’s learning a lot about Berk’s heir, and she intends to continue to do so.

Astrid starts out by planting a kiss on Hiccup’s cheek from time to time. Sometimes in front of others as she tries to subtly secure a claim she’d thrown down in a moment of rapture. Sometimes in private, where she actually feels embarrassed, and vulnerable, because its more intimate than some public decision.

They get into arguments. Their priorities don’t always align. Astrid challenges Hiccup on his dragon knowledge (but it’s not just knowledge like Fishlegs has, where it can be categorized from books, but a silent empathy that can’t be taught. It takes her years to truly figure that out). Hiccup gets irritated when Astrid chooses Vikings over Dragons (as he often views it, but it’s not so black and white). There’s miscommunication. And Guilt.

Astrid goes through her own self reflection, and acknowledges that the man Hiccup’s becoming is worth her respect, just as she reaffirms that the boy Hiccup was, or who she knew him as, was not. She can forgive herself. Same as Hiccup gets to really know Astrid, beyond the shallow crush he had on her (which had been all but driven from him in the throes of discovering a life’s purpose).

They’re juggling a relationship (that didn’t have the most wholesome start) in the background of readjusting their worlds and taking on tasks and roles most adults wouldn’t be asked to. But they’re giving it a try, and it’s harsh at times, and sweet at others, and they “take breaks”, sometimes unhappily, and they meet other people (not court, or ‘date’, but there are other heirs who look at Hiccup as potential alliance material, and other Vikings, many other vikings, who are impressed by Astrid).

But through it all, as they learn about each other as people (and not crushes, or heir figures) they discover that they are a team. They were a team the moment they were forced to work together, and they remain a team throughout the rest of their lives.

Hiccup’s at the cusp of 16 and Astrid well already when Hiccup initiates a kiss with her. Kissing becomes more casual, but still soft, and sweet, from there on out. He fumblingly asks her on a “date” of sorts shortly after (having to insist that, no, this doesn’t involve the rest of the gang. Just her. She has an ‘oh!’ moment).

Hiccup’s 16 and a half, it’s the anniversary of the Death’s demise, when he allows Astrid to see his stump for the first time. She’d helped him through leg pain in the past–supporting his limps, staying by his bedside through fever–but this time he willingly removes his prosthetic and bares a scarred and ugly part of himself to someone who’s opinion matters. Astrid reacts to the breathtaking moment of trust and exposure with tender hands and speechless assurances, and Hiccup relaxes in her presence. I imagine it wasn’t sexual or humorous, but a terrifyingly intimate and vulnerable experience that launched them into a deeper level of their relationship. He allows her to touch the hard tissue, and to ask questions he hadn’t felt comfortable answering before. 

A couple months later Astrid learns of the scars on his back, the ones she’s never considered before, from when he fell backwards into the explosion.

Not long after that Hiccup’s allowed to see her hair down, and to touch it. They grow more interested in each other as budding adults, and make more time for each other. Kissing intensifies. Groping and exploring follows. Sometimes they take things a little too far and it ends in giggles or, on occasion, an older viking yelling at them.

Astrid takes to grooming Hiccup. She braids his hair. Comments on his scruff. Gets involved with his wardrobe.

The flight suit is in development and Astrid finds it ridiculous; both a point of hilarity and something that scares her (though she’d never admit it outright) and Hiccup learns to hide it in one of the few white lies they’ve picked up in regards to one another.

They’re 18 the first time they exchange “I love yous” and the intimacy of their relationship continues to rise from there.

At just shy of twenty, and after much needling from his father and not-so subtle hints from Astrid’s family, Hiccup proposes.

The entire village is on a high in the following weeks. Heartened, Stoicks makes a weighty decision.

[poutinedragon]

Salt =/= hate.

Criticism =/= hate. 

It is possible to appreciate effort put into a project and still not enjoy the end product. We can be grateful for a TV show and still entirely disagree with the content. The point of fandom is to interact with the content as much as possible, and this includes analyses and criticisms. 

To accept all source material at face value and NOT criticise or deconstruct it in one way or another, would be doing a disservice to the fandom and to the creators. To act like (entirely valid!) criticism is a form of hate or anti speech is very narrow-minded. If you presented a project to your teacher in school, she wouldn't be doing her job if she didn't give any criticism for the work you've done. It is even possible to thoroughly enjoy source material and still completely disagree with it. 

When it comes to a story as grand and majestic as HTTYD, people genuinely care about the story and continuity. To trivialize honest concerns and personal opinions as 'hate' would be incredibly condescending. But that's not how it has to be. 

 I've personally made peace with the fact that the RoB/DoB/RttE storyline has major problems and holdovers with the HTTYD 2 continuity. My personal 'coping method' is to accept only 'fully animated' content as canon (HTTYD 1, 2, BoD, TLotBkD, and GotNF), and all else as superfluous. That's just me, I wouldn't force my opinion on anyone else. 

If you want to accept everything as canon, by all means, go right ahead and enjoy yourself! But please don't think that disagreements equal hate. 

That's a dangerous line to tread....

[inke-ri]

*winces* yea. see, I think this hits the nail on the head. After a year I finally found the post that really explains my big issue with the hidden world. I remember back when the movie came out, and I had a minor breakdown (okay, little more than minor, might have cried a bit) over the fact that Dean constantly called the dragons "wild animals" and that directly clashed with the way I saw them (as intelligent thinking creatures capable of making their own choices). I even quoted the exact two things in OP's post, but it was in the sense of "did I seriously misunderstand the plot so badly? were Valka and Hiccup just projecting onto the dragons after all?"

I was very confused and very upset but I kept putting the blame on ME, the viewer, thinking I had missed a key part of the way this story was written... But now, after having many months for this movie to settle in the back of my head, I can see that it... Wasnt really me. It wasnt my interpretation that was faulty. I had thought so, I think because it had been hammered into my brain that Dean had thought of the ending for so many years.

It's honestly kinda funny because I went off specifically about this several dozen times - how HTTYD1, GotNF and HTTY2's themes directly contradict 3's, that the WHOLE POINT was that love > instincts - but I always missed the fact that no, it isnt just love > instincts. Its the fact that those instincts were never violent in the first place.

The movies can sometimes throw you off, because of the Alpha's control on Toothless in 2 and the way the Queen was an aggressive little tyrant in HTTYD1. But the whole point of the movies was that "everything we know about you... is wrong" (or however the quote goes, it sucks that 3 has soured even my constant rewatching of the first movie). That dragons when left on their own arent naturally distrustful and aggressive, they're kind and curious and playful and respond to trust with trust of their own.

And I guess I had forgotten, I guess I took 3's canon as hard canon and thought the problem was with me as the one analyzing it. And now my tiny little brain was just blown once more, as I remember the lesson HTTYD 1 taught us all over again. Is this how the berkians felt when Hiccup showed them dragons werent inherently evil? hah! It's almost worth it, for the delight of feeling how they felt |D

I guess its just... good to know that the problem wasnt me, y'know? it takes a weight I didnt know I had off my shoulders. It isnt really us being salty for "no reason bc the movie was great you just dont see it". Its the fact that they literally changed the core of how dragons think and behave, and slapped a HTTYD-esque coat of paint and setting over it. Of course everything is gonna feel off and weird for a fan, because they're moving and talking like Hiccup and Toothless but theres a subtle underlying difference making them out of character. and thats it, thats exactly what made all these scenes feel so off! Its cause they changed the most important rule of HTTYD's universe. When you change the very core of your world lore, its literally impossible to keep the ripple effect of that from affecting every single character. And its just so freeing, to finally understand that it wasnt just a bunch of weird decisions and scenes that dont make sense. To stop wondering how all those changes were approved of when the message of THW is so contradicting of the rest of the series. Its literally just one change- a massive one, but so subtle that you dont really realize how much it impacts the plot until someone in tumblr whacks you over the head with it.

Valka: This wasn’t a vicious beast, but an intelligent, gentle creature whose soul reflected my own.

THW crew: