#god i hope this post doesn't get my blog nuked

[wizardlyghost]

something very funny i just discovered while searching titan a.e. on tumblr

one letter in and already i'm being recommended nsfw content supposedly banned on tumblr

two letters in and the nsfw content is already starting to outnumber everything else! i wonder what will happen when i get to three...

hm? nothing? nothing at all?

not even stuff that was previously offered up?

must've been the wind. back to our regularly scheduled, child-friendly programming i guess!

[evilkitten3]

Hey, thanks for the reply! Also sorry for using comments instead of reblogging, I own only a blog with goofy fancomics and I don't want to mix plot discussions into it. I hope you don't mind. If you want, you can cite this whole reply in another post, but I'm ok with anything.

When it comes to narrator reliability, I go for "reliable unless proven otherwise" approach. I agree here, that picking Obito's statements was not the best way to prove things because he had been proved to talk nonsense before. On the other hand, with how few glimpses of Madara's PoV we have, they are consistent with Hashirama's tale except for VoTE fight where Madara intentionally tricked Hashirama about his goals and the outcome. So I'm going to consider Hashi mostly reliable, also because his account is the last one we get, so if Kishimoto planned it to be false, not showing Madara's contradicting PoV (or at least hinting at it, which we don't get either) would be plain bad writing (still doesn't give 100% certainty, but I'd take this over the "God of the gaps" approach).

Even if we don't consider the info on Izuna's dying words true, Hashirama says that Madara had claimed that Izuna had been killed by Senju (also states it as a reason for not being able to trust Senju enough to make a truce), and Madara later confirms that Izuna had been in fact killed by Tobirama (the "Tobirama pin cushion" scene in War Arc). Also, we were never given an explanation for Uchihas turning their backs on Madara other than

prolonging the war

Madara allegedly stealing Izuna's eyes. Both these things trace back to Izuna's death. One can try to give other reasons, but this would be entering headcanon territory at this point, so something that the reader wants to be true rather than something that the reader has actually been given.

As for Tobirama, he plays a way bigger role in his and Madara's paranoia than Madara, and his prejudice is largely ungrounded (however understandable because of his own traumas), but here are some things Madara did that could rile him up:

refusing truce for so long, stemming from Izuna's death (according to Hashirama)

pulling off the whole "it's either me or him" stuff twice (first one is when Tobirama calls Madara a lunatic, so this had started before the founding of Konoha): this also fits thematically with Izuna's death, because having no living brothers left would have put Hashirama and Madara in the same spot

attempting to nuke Konoha with Kurama (even if we assume that Madara didn't want to do it, he intentionally made this impression to lure out Hashirama, so Tobirama can't be blamed for believing it) which had been partially caused by Uchihas rejecting Madara which had been caused by… etc. Tobirama explicitly says that his persecution of Uchihas was to avoid the rise of another Madara, but this is Tobirama we are speaking of, so take this with a grain of salt. Also, through grooming Obito, Madara played a significant indirect role in Uchiha massacre, but I wouldn't necessarily consider it intentional on his side (we can't tell to what extent Obito was guided by "Madara's will"). So in the end, his actions do bear characteristics of a self-fulfilling prophecy, although I admit that it's debatable how much Uchiha opression could have been avoided without Madara fueling every bad stereotype, because the prejudice didn't start with him. No Obito and no Kurama attack could have at least remove a convenient pretext for the massacre from the story, but it's absolutely possible that Konoha elders would have found another one.

I'm not saying all of this to prove that Madara wouldn't have pursued IT with Izuna alive (in fact, it would be interesting to see BZ sway Madara without killing Izuna). My point is that there are too many factors that more or less directly trace back to Izuna's death to confidently state the opposite.

entirely fair! and don't worry, plenty of people prefer commenting for various reasons; no offense taken

honestly, i tend to be more or less the same, although i actually think hashirama's story was probably pretty solid; he doesn't try at all to make claims for the stuff he wasn't there for. he doesn't even say "madara was definitely standing outside the window" he says "tobirama looked out the window and i found a leaf that looked like the one madara looked at the village through"

having said that, from what i remember, at some point kishimoto did end up pressed for time, and that seriously affected the quality of his work (and... let's be honest, the war arc was never naruto's best writing. the war arc wishes it had what the wave arc had)

i think the reason we never heard hashirama's take on why madara's clan distanced itself from him is bc hashirama can't really,,,, comprehend that? like madara explicitly says "no one in my family likes me :(" and hashirama goes "i don't believe that" like he has any way of knowing XD

personally, i'm fairly certain that tobirama killed izuna, and i have no reason to think otherwise (i guess it's possible that black zetsu personally snuck an infection into his wound somehow just to make sure he kicked it and madara got his eyes, but like you said that'd just be headcanon territory, and also it kinda doesn't matter since neither madara nor hashirama would have any way of knowing that, so neither would we)

frankly i personally like the idea that tobirama was just scared shitless of madara, but it's also possible that he held a grudge over the whole "kill u or ur bro" thing. probably not the other stuff tbh, since tobirama never seemed all that invested in the idea of a village before it was founded (probably just. didn't think it could happen), and madara trying to nuke the village didn't happen until after he'd left, so while it may have affected tobirama's relationship with the other uchiha, it didn't really affect his relationship with madara.

obito's role in the massacre was,,,, really badly handled tbh. and also part of why i suspect that the original concept of "tobi" (from a meta perspective) was meant to be madara's ghost possessing obito's mostly dead corpse. madara had a reason to resent the uchiha clan (although i don't think the character we meet in the war arc would've done that, even if the character we met after tobi's "reveal" might have), but obito never really got one. there were fan theories, but not a lot of solid canon evidence. it might've happened, since both obito and madara were justifying everything they did with "well they'll all be fine when the infinite tsukuyomi kicks in, so whatever"

if you keep izuna alive and don't remove black zetsu from the equation, then it's less of a "would madara still do this" question and more of a "how long until black zetsu manages to cause izuna's death and lead madara to do this" question. zetsu needed madara to get the eternal mangekyou sharingan, after all. if it was possible to do that while keeping izuna alive then that'd certainly be interesting, but it's not something zetsu would particularly care to pursue, especially when izuna dying makes it much more likely that madara will take his eyes. but black zetsu is black zetsu, so i'm sure it could figure something out.

if you take out black zetsu entirely, then it's hard to say if madara would've come up with the eye of the moon plan on his own, but i do still think he would've seen the village as a failure and left in the end. like you said, it's hard to say for sure, though.

[kawaiijohn]

@staffatemyblog ask and ye shall receive

This list is long. Songs that were canonically in Homestuck or featured on an album aren't included.

Some videos may not work, some comic posts may be broken. I'm gonna try to give credit as best I can. But this is what happens when someone like me obessively collects videos and never deletes shit no matter what.

I apologize if I am reminding someone of their cringe Homestuck days by tagging them, but these videos mean the WORLD to me.

Nattoppet - Music used in the wonderful animation, "A Lullaby for Gods" I remember vividly watching the artist @guzusuru posting it bit by bit in gifs and short updates, and I remember the feeling of pure elation upon seeing this glorious animation completed. I actually use this song on a playlist for a Time God in another fandom now bc of how iconic it is. Here's the Tumblr post!

Fancy Footwork - This song was fucking ICONIC. The only bit of this that gets used in anything Homestuck is the last minute or so of the song, which was used in the "what now" gif meme. I actually put this on around my old OLD Homestuck friends and wait until the very end of the song for the payoff of them telling me to die lmao. Here's a video that still exists!

Nilili Mambo - MAMBO STUCK! It's a dope ass animation by @toastyglow, and even has an unofficial part 2 bc people wouldn't stop asking them for more. The original post doesn't exist bc iirc Toasty's entire blog got deleted a while ago and they had to remake, but the animation lives on in reposts, reblogs, and on youtube here. They were able to find the original post despite the deletion, it's here!!

Just Lose It - This was originally a Flash animation on Deviant Art and someone fucking uploaded it on Tumblr uncredited, but OP actually uploaded it on youtube! I used to just have it on in the BG for when I was vibing. But it still exists here!! I think their username is @notheterium (I owe u my life, thank u for this wonderful shitpost)

Oh No! - This was a dope as FUCK Vriska AMV using canon panels. It keeps getting fucking nuked into oblivion by copyright. I think the most recent re-upload I can even find is here. It's such a damn good AMV and I hope OP knows I will kill for them.

Stealth 零号式JPN - Remember back in like 2013 when everyone was drawing screenshots/panels as anime? Because Homestuck is our favorite anime! There was a really really lovely AMV using a bunch of the art being made. It slapped honestly, but the audio kept getting every upload taken down, but @twinkgami was able to send me a copy of the original file, so it lives on! There's no safe place to upload it unfortunately :( But the song is on youtube too! I'm not sharing it bc I don't want those videos to get absolutely clapped by copyright.

Girl With One Eye - Another baller Vriska Lyricstuck from 2012. It was EVERYWHERE and it FUCKED. Here it is on youtube and also on @kingdomzelaybli's blog

Welcome to the Show - This one was an MEP that I really loved! There's a part with Aradia I found a gifset for and it's lived in my mind rent free since 2013. Here's a link!

Kill the Lights - ICONIC. LYRICSTUCK. I knew people who had images from this as their icon as recently as 2019. It's my fave use of this song, and it still exists on @xamag-homestuck's tumblr and there's a few edits still on youtube, though my fave edit is gone :(

Fergalicious - KARKALICIOUS, DEFINITION: MAKE TEREZI LOCO. Broadway Karkat, y'all.

Combination Pizza Hut and Taco Bell - COMBINATIONQUEST. Or "Quest of the Highbloods" Brodyquest was BIG back then, and this version is my fave of all of them.

Teenagers - This one is more 'on every fucking 8tracks playlist of any troll'

I can't Decide - If you made a Gamzee playlist without this song, you weren't a real fan /hj. There's a pretty good lyricstuck for it but I can't find the original post, so here's a youtube video.

Blue Lips - Okay this one. Cannot be understated how iconic it was. I cannot find OP anymore, there's a lot of broken links, BUT the original youtube upload is there. Broadway Aradia even made a cover for this!

Dirty Night Clowns - Another standard 'Gamzee playlist' essential. There's a very old (2011) AMV with a bunch of uncredited art that has like. More than 1 million views. Here it is.

Discord - Listen, if you were around in 2012 you knew this song could be used for like every fandom, even though it's an MLP audio. There's a wonderful lyricstuck that I can't find bc OP changed their URL, but this youtube version has extra animation!

Turn Me On - [S] Everyone have a sweet rave party ==> [cw for flashing lights!] People drew DOZENS of gifs of characters raving, as we did back then and octopimp uploaded an edited version with as many different images as could be found. He actually has a master credit post here!

Eet - Very good Strider angst Lyricstuck! Youtube and Deviantart links!!!

Volatile Times - Another really good Lyricstuck! This one is also by @xamag-homestuck. This is the link to the youtube and original post

Na Na Na - GLUB GLUB-A-GLUB Another broadwaystuck cover! And it's still pretty good!! Youtube!!

Castle of Glass - You remember that time Caliborn entered and murdered all those ghosts? Well there's a lyricstuck for that upd8 and this song legit slapped me in the face bc of the comic. Same artist who did the Discord one above, but again- changed URL. But here's a youtube edit!

Sloppy Seconds - Every damn Dave Strider playlist had this on it.

Centuries - [S] Ancestors Remember Me. A very well done CMV about the Ancestors!

This is War - This song was REALLY popular to make AMVs and MEPs to back in like 2011, so there's a bunch of these around. Personally this one is my fave.

20 Percent Cooler - A MLP fansong by ForeverPandering/Ken Ashcorp. Everyone used this for Dirk bc he was a canon Brony lmao.

Wine Red - Aradia playlists loved this one.

Love Me Dead - Kismesitude theme song! There's an Off-Broadway Aradia cover of it here!

Infinitesimal - I have 0 idea why this is on here besides the fact I see people shoving it on Homestuck playlists.

Angel with a Shotgun - If I had a nickel for every Homestuck character this song gets used for, I'd have two nickels. Anyways, I cannot unassociate this song from Roxy or Eridan. But it turns out there's a Lyricstuck for this???? OMG It's not deleted??? Here's the original post! And Here Youtube!

Little Lion Man - This song goes on fucking. Every gd Strider or Karkat playlist.

Ready To Die - Very good Lyricstuck of the Condesce and GHB! Youtube and Original Post!

You're Gonna Go Far, Kid - Vrsika arc AMV!

Still Alive - So this was used a LOT for Aradia stuff. No AMVs but just the association is there.

We Ran out of CD Space - "LMAO What if Gamzee sang this bc he's hiiiiigh" There's a really good AMV to this.

Hatef--k - Kismesitude song :)

Be My Game Boy - I used to see this song used for Roxy ships a LOT.

Tight Pants / Body Rolls - Okay so Danny Cragg animated this fucking video and learning that fact sent me to the Shadow Realm. I don't wanna tag him on this to remind him, but that video fuckin LIVES IN MY BRAIN rent free. It seems to have been mass yeeted off the internet but I have this gif :(.

Heart and Soul - Sadstuck, Lyricstuck :) Here's the video :))))

If We Were Gay - I've seen like, four JohnDave fanarts drawn to this.

The Future - Okay so MiraculousTang made this when the upd8 with Terezi knocking sense into John came out, and this was my first exposure to this song before MysteryBen made an official video for it. Anyways, the post is here!!

Hide and Seek - MMMMM Whatchya say. There's a pretty good CMV for this one based off the SNL skit that started the meme, but god I cannot understate how frequently this got posted everytime so much as something fell on the floor in canon.

Radioactive - Okay so the CMV this was for got delisted bc of various reasons and the people in it don't want it reposted, but it was based off of [S] Cascade of all the kids going Godtier.

Dance (A$$) - This one is also fucking lost to the ages. It was an old Lyricstuck with the Alpha Kids that involved a lot of dumb fun stuff.

MANiCURE - Another ToastyGlow product. It's Cronus time babey.

No Homo - This one is by Feastings, but it's been reuploaded bc I think they deleted the OG post. But I live for this dumb AMV.

Cooler Than Me - As an old school JohnDave shipper, I couldn't fucking escape this damn song. Honestly every damn Dave shipper used this.

Skinny Love - Off-Broadway Aradia, BABEY.

Brodyquest - Hussiequest, man. Youtube link.

We Didn't Start the Fire - You can't fight the Homestuck, by Miss Kylee Henke. Not tagging her bc she doesn't want her blog associated with HS anymore. But here it is on youtube.

Black Sheep - Okay so context- Scott Pilgrim was HUGE in 2010 and Hussie tended to use the sprites from the video game in canon animations bc he was friends with the author iirc?? And this song got shoved on to HS videos A LOT.

Spider Girl - I heard this song and thought it was about Vriska for like months. I only found out it's an Undertale song like a week ago OTL

Cannibal - Vriska spins her head while I play fitting music.

Too Cool - This fucking Dave animation, man.

Exile Vilify - God this one is fuckin' iconic too. The lyricstuck is great and here it is on Youtube.

Protectors of the Earth - Used in ToastyGlow's "AfterUs" animation! It's really REALLY good.

Scale of the Universe - Another song that I've personally related to Homestuck the last like 5 years.

Cake is Gone - This is a super cool AMV edit that's lived in my head since Act 6 was just coming out.

Internet Friends - You blocked me on Facebook, and now you're going to die. Another super cool AMV from the same person as above!!

Requiem for a Tower - There's a really dope AMV that was made right up until Act 6 that showcases all the coolest panels/flashes, and this song has always related to that specifically for me. Here it is!

Whatcha Say - Again, Everyone Dies, the meme! Here's a version put to [S] Game Over :)

The Phoenix - @orangelemonart I only slightly apologize for tagging you in this, I know you're busy with Naruto Shippuden retellings (fantastic art btw, pls follow them!) But they made a fucking AMAZING lyricstuck put to this song! The Youtube link is here, and here's the original post!!!

How Far We've Come - You cannot say this isn't a Homestuck song. It was made like right after Cascade dropped back in 2011, and the OP actually UPDATED it for the end of Homestuck. If I'm not mistaken, this AMV started the trend of putting series finales to this song! Ever since I've seen one for Gravity Falls, and Steve Universe among others. It's just. Iconic. Here's the Cascade version, and here's the updated version

Edit: Added Counting Stars by popular request! Here's the Animation for it! OP has a whole tag for it!

And that does it, I hope everything is accurate, and if anyone has file versions of missing videos I would die for them

Hey Guys Rate my Playlist :)

if you wanna listen heres the link lmao