Even if a creator is a bad person it's still okay to like their work. People need to mind their own business.
Honestly it's not really that sort of situation. I'll actively defend Steven Moffat here.
There was a huge hate movement for him back in the early 2010s - which, in retrospect, formed largely because he was running 2 of the superwholock shows at once, one of which went through extremely long hiatuses* and the other of which was functionally an adaptation of an already well regarded show**, making him subject to a sort of double ire in the eyes of a lot of fandom people. Notably, his co-showrunner, Mark Gatiss, is rarely mentioned and much of his work is still attributed to Moffat (and yes, this includes that Hbomberguy video. Several of "Steven Moffat's bad writing choices" were not actually written by him, they were Gatiss.)
People caricatured the dude into a sort of malicious, arrogant figure who hated women and was deliberately mismanaging these shows to spite fans, to the point where people who never watched them believe this via cultural osmosis. It became very common to take quotes from him out of context to make them look bad***, to cite him as an example of a showrunner who hated his fans, someone who sabotaged his own work just to get at said fans, someone who was too arrogant to take criticism, despite all of this being basically a collective "headcanon" about the guy formed on tumblr. Some if it got especially terrible, like lying about sexual assault (I don't mean people accused him of sexual assault and I think they're making it up, I mean people would say things like "many of his actresses have accused him of sexual assault on set" when no such accusations exist in the first place. This gets passed around en masse and is, in my opinion, absolutely rancid.)
On top of that a ton of the criticism directed at the shows themselves is, personally, just terrible media criticism. So much of it came from assuming a very hostile intent from the writer and just refusing to engage with the text at all past that.
Like some really common threads you see with critique of this writer's work, especially in regards to Doctor Who since that's the one I'm most familiar with:
A general belief that his lead characters were meant to be ever perfect self inserts, and so therefore when they act shitty or arrogant or flawed in any way, that's both reflective of the author and something the show wants you to view as positive or aspirational.
An overarching thesis that his characters are "too important" in the narrative due to the writer's arrogance and self obsession (even though this is a very deliberate theme that's stated several times)
A lot of focus on the writer personally "attacking" the fans or making choices primarily out of spite.
A tendency to treat the show being different to what it's adapting as inherently bad and hostile towards the original.
Just generally very little consideration and engagement with the themes, intent, etc. of the shows
This one's a little more nebulous and doesn't apply to all critique but a lot of it, especially recently, is clearly by people who haven't seen the show in like 10 years and their opinion is largely formed secondhand through like, "discourse nostalgia". Which. you know. bad.
I think these are just weird and nonsensical ways to engage with a work of fiction. I also think it's really sad to see the show boiled down to this because that era of who is, in my opinion, very thematically rich and unique among similar shows, and I'm disappointed that it's often dismissed in such a paltry way.
This isn't to say people aren't allowed to critique Steven Moffat or anything, but the context in which he basically became The Devil™ to a large portion of fandom and is still remembered in a poor light is very tied to this perfect storm of fan culture and I just don't agree with a ton of it.
* I'm sure most people have seen the way long running shows and hiatuses will cause people to fall out with a show, with some former fans turning around and joining a sort of "anti fandom" for it while it's still airing. That happened with both these shows.
** Doctor Who will change it's entire writing staff, crew, and cast every few years, and with that comes a change in style, tone, theme - the old show basically ends and is replaced by a new show under the same title. As Steven Moffat's era was the first of these handovers for the majority of audiences, you can imagine this wasn't a well loved move for many fans.
*** I know for a fact most people have not sought out the sources for a lot of these quotes to check that they read the same in context because 1) most of them were deleted years ago and are very difficult to find now and 2) many of them do actually make sense in the context of their respective interviews
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I do think it's relevant that Vyranoth & Iridikron's 10.2.5 epilogue cinematic is opened up with Vyranoth's narration establishing it as her telling us what happened in contrast to the omniscient spectator role we get to take in Secrets of the Reach and Opening the Way.
It's solidly inarguable that what happened in Secrets of the Reach and Opening the Way are the objective truth. Those cinematics are to establish the villains and what they're up to even when the champion is not around to witness or confront them. The parley, however, can be questioned: how honest is Vyranoth being?
She tells us she wants nothing to do with Iridikron or the Void or his 'trinket', but the objective truth is that the second he retrieved the Dark Heart from the Forbidden Reach she was all over it and wanted to get to work decoding what information it contained right away. The objective truth is that she already knew what Aberrus was, had at least an inkling of what horrors it contained, and delighted in the prospect of unleashing them upon the Aspects. She got herself a meeting with Alexstrasza specifically to swear vengeance upon her for the wrongs she and her kin suffered as a result of the Aspects.
... but she turns around, says she feels bad about the destruction her brother has caused, and becomes our friend in two seconds despite none of her deep-rooted fundamental issues with the Aspects or the Titans being resolved.
(also, I ought pause and point out that Vyranoth is fairly inexpressive with her brothers, but immediately starts emoting like a tiktok PoVer when she's interacting with Alexstrasza, which feels incredibly... fake)
Now the question: is this deliberate writing on Blizzard's part — whether intended to set up Vyranoth to pull a double-cross on us, or just to establish her as being both temperamental and in possession of the moral spine of half-cooked spaghetti — or did they just get scared partway through her storyline and had to change it?
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who are the dragons for the "Love is some kind of punishment" post? and why did you choose them for that autogenerate pic? /eyes emoji
EEEEEHEHEHE SO XANTHIA AND CAMIR! this is going to be so long
For Xanthia, she was previously Pentes' wife! The two were married in order to unite Pentes' kingdom with a country that would merge with his own, and she had been the firstborn daughter of this country's previous leader. Because Pentes himself is an immortal, and he LOVES himself some consistency, Xanthia was granted a shared immortality upon this marriage in order for her to be his wife for eternity. Which wasn't exactly something she had wanted at the time, but over the first couple of decades of their marriage she grew to genuinely love him as at the time Pentes was good to his people, and in turn good with her.
But. Pentes isn't a good man. He is the physical embodiment of mud, the Lord Alluvium specifically, and was given his sentience by pure exposure to King Norve, who was very pissed when he was digging underneath the Scarred Wasteland. He inherited this anger and the want for power that King Norve had wanted at the time. So, after their multi-decade-long honeymoon phase, Pentes began to try and gain more and more power by taking over the land around him. Much of this land is actually where the Quarantine Zones are in the Scarred Wasteland now, and if he could overpower someone, he would do it without hesitation; so the peak of his rule expanded for this entire area and then some. Xanthia didn't like this.
The Thing about Xanthia is that she's very straightforward and blunt about her opinions. She thought this drastic expansion was unnecessary and greedy, and would only hurt their people in the long run, which was NOT something Pentes wanted to hear. For most of these expansions, because she loved him so much, she kept her mouth shut and did what she could behind his back, but it wasn't much because (motions to the mud part) he quite literally had eyes everywhere there was dirt.
She would become more defiant though the more it started to affect their kingdom negatively. Pentes was solely concerned about gaining power, for what he never knew, but he knew he needed it and wanted it. He was becoming more and more aggressive, more arrogant, and while to the outsiders perspective his kingdom might have been thriving through this, the reality was that it was tearing apart the inner councils and that the kingdom was very near collapse. So Xanthia decided she had QUITE enough of it and finally, publicly, denounced what Pentes was doing.
Pentes to the public eye took the speech she made gracefully. He acknowledged what she had qualms with, and announced that he would make a formal speech in return, and address any problems his people might have as well. but well actually he was pissed as hell.
The Thing Is Though. he couldn't just kill her. she honest to god wanted to rest, so it wouldn't scare her to threaten to take her immortality. On top of that, it would ruin the image that his kingdom was Fine Actually for the Queen to suddenly die in some way, so soon after she made a speech against him. So he keeps her alive. but he doesn't keep his people alive, and that is what hits her the hardest. Before they married she was in schooling to become a doctor, and was notorious for helping those around her no matter their status/relevance.
The title of Bell is one held within King Norve's Council. The Bell is a warning signal, to take on the dress of the Bell is to announce that there imminent danger that is unavoidable, and no one will escape the incoming tragedy alive, and typically this dress is given by King Norve himself and the title holder will act as a messenger. Each Bell title holder usually has its own moniker, and Pentes' title would come to be the Blood-Ridden Bell. Six months after his response to Xanthia's claims and soothing his kingdom, he very suddenly has an "outburst of magic" after donning the Crown of Pins* that leads to a very violent slaughter of a GOOD portion of the inner kingdoms people. His end goal was to devastate Xanthia so horribly that she fell into a deep depression, and become something malleable for him to manipulate-- because she has power of her own! While she's wasn't a god like him, she was becoming one through exposure to him, and she could've very easily be turned into a living weapon just like King Norve himself.
But she doesn't devastate like he intended her to. After "coming back to his senses" and "realizing what he had done", Xanthia is already making moves to leave this kingdom. Of course she's in pain about what had just happened, but she knows Pentes after well over 200 years of being married to him, and knows that he is just Too Powerful to have an uncontrolled outburst like that. His power is well cultivated and precise, but he didn't account for the fact that Xanthia knew him so intimately as she did-- because while she loved him, he didn't love her fully. She was a prop for his kingdom, and he believed her to be just as knowledgeable about his power as his people. But she is insanely smart! And Again! Loved Him Deeply! so she would pay attention to these things!
So he scrambles. He's apologetic to his peoples and seems to be deeply ashamed of what he's done and immediately goes to repair what's been lost to the best of his abilities, even putting in significantly more work to rehabilitate everyone in the kingdom and bring back people to the inner kingdom. But Xanthia is missing. and people notice this quickly. But he never gives a proper statement as to what happened to her, because truthfully, for a very long time he genuinely didn't know-- only that she was definitely still alive.
This ofc pisses him the fuck off even after King Norves gives him the little Bell promotion in titling him the Blood-Ridden Bell, because while he has technically gained power, he could've had a LOT more power if he had kept Xanthia and turned her into the weapon he wanted her to become. But alas.
So, Xanthia is exiled from Pentes' rule, and in turn is exiled from the Vermin Court, which pins a very large target on her back if she is to be rediscovered by the wrong dragons of this court.
Right now, Xanthia is actually taking shelter under Anura's eye in the Clan of Phrauge, and has been since the Clan was first originated. Not many within the clan actually know who Xanthia is at length, just that she's an immortal doctor and was said to have known Anura when he was the Clans leader. Pentes, as of the present storyline, is actually aware of this and visits Xanthia VERYYYYY very downlow.
It's usually to taunt her. She is still sickeningly in love with who Pentes was before he become who he is now. She always seems to be in a state of mourning of this version of him, and it doesn't seem like she'll stop mourning him anytime soon, especially when he visits her. Some days he'll come to her and basically lovebomb her into confusion, other days he'll be cruel and accusatory, threatening to expose her to those who want her dead for abandoning him, etc etc etc. It's really bad. Anura unfortunately isn't in high of enough rank for his actions to sway Pentes any, and because he is still affiliated with the Vermin Court he can't completely keep Pentes out of his clans boundaries-- especially not without exposing the fact he is still alive to his own clan.
So. Xanthia is just very tired. She'll always love who Pentes was, and he will always dangle this over her head.
*- Crown of Pins: This was a crown made by some of the first organized Religions around the Plaguebringer, specifically when she was still known as Jhortanas to the common people. It was worn by religious leaders while performing rituals in order to communicate with her, and became a weapon of destruction after being imbued with ancient plague magic. King Norve stole this crown after running off on his own, and gave it to Pentes to form his physical body. Pentes only brings out this crown when he intends to do mass destruction, ie, the Blood-Ridden Bell Murder.
Now. 1. imagine if i had this in a bio. 2. Camir's situation is. significantly less convoluted. HELP.
Camir Moreno is the second husband of "Arianwyn" Craftwood aka Crafty, but the two divorced somewhat recently and on less than neutral terms. It's rumored that the two had children and that well he didn't get custody, but given that the Craftwoods are so vigilant about keeping their family members anonymous within reason, no one actually knows if there's actually any kids. But
Camir grew up with Crafty in the burrow market. For as long as he can remember he's been in love with her. He fell for her REALLY hard and continued to love her throughout a shit ton of Burrow Market Tragedies:tm: and even the War of Flies which VERY much fucked up things for them. but hes also a narcissist and has a shit ton of his own problems and while the love he has is genuine, he never actually got along with her that well?!?!?
They had conflicting interests for the Burrow as they both climbed in leadership. They had conflicting customers, ethics, literally everything, and it came to a point where he very legitimately questioned Why he loved her, but came down to like 'heh i just like women who stand their ground' which like. sure whatever.
he was very difficult to deal with in marriage, and the only reason why they even married was for political gain. The Morenos and Craftwoods on the surface are very influential families in the Gabbro (old city in phrauge) and having these families come together would only bring each other customers. The second this shit was proposed Camir agreed. But it took craftwood a LOOT of hefty talking into because she had actually, previously, been married to fucking Patriarch Feir (guy who made Bawkrya the Patriarch with no warning) which is A BIG DEAL!!!!!!!!!!!!! and that marriage obviously led to divorce as well, and she just didnt want to waste her time with more political marriages (and also she was preoccupied banging women and sopping wet men (neither of which is camir))
but she would relent. and immediately regret.
They made the marriage work just long enough for her to get some important contracts that she wanted out of the marriage, but she very quickly handed him the divorce papers the second she knew she could safely break off the marriage w/o severing what she built Off of the marriage. and Camir found this really insulting. Because again, he really liked her! he's had a fascination with her since he was like fifteen! but he absolutely didn't have the words to express this, and didn't feel like it was necessary to do such because oh you're my wife now.
But, he perceives anything she does that he doesn't like as something to spite him and is generally very petty about the divorce, and Quite Literally has beaten the FUCK out of someone for bringing it up in a manner he didn't like. On the surface, he holds an amicable relationship with her, but its something he Has to do as they're both burrow masters.
anyways he was just in love with the idea of her that he made in his head that is absolutely nothing like what Crafty's actually like as a person, and she is very well aware of this. The marriage isnt the first time he's brought up his feelings for her. Hes just one of those guys that cant take no for an answer
to Craftwoods delight though, Xidorn aka her sopping wet man her little rabid ring dog her sweet cinnamon apple, ends up getting a hit on Camir and kills his ass after provoking him during a VERYYY large fighting tournament in the death rings. They both coordinate his assassination even getting vasyl in on it, and uhhh i havent planned anything beyond this but camir gets whats coming for him.
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VAMP ROGER AU QUESTION! how would he and barnabas interact together (if they ever interact)? :3 💜
tagging @tortoisesshells because she's my co-conspirator <3
excellent question! this family and their sharp-toothed men will be the death of ... well, several community members of Collinsport, i suppose.
to start — Barnabas gets out of the box slightly differently than in canon, which colors his relationship to Roger and the rest of the household. Roger kills Willie after his attempted assault on Carolyn and Vicki (who is, by that point, his wife); Willie's mysterious disappearance and Roger's suspected involvement makes Jason that much more panicked, desperate, and correspondingly aggressive. Liz goes searching for the lost family jewels in a last-ditch attempt to buy Jason off, and, inadvertently, lets their ancient family sin out of the tomb.
ergo she's made Barnabas' thrall instead of Willie, but this goes unnoticed for a while — even though her brother would, in theory, recognize the signs, and his suspicions are raised, but she's already acting so much unlike herself with Jason around that he doesn't suspect anyone else of doing her harm. yet.
at the start, he and Barnabas get along very well, even before they discover their shared affliction: they're both relatively sophisticated, well-traveled, intelligent people, and for all that Roger decries Liz's emphasis on the Collins name, he leans towards familial connections instinctively (Roger hasn't got much in the way of friends outside of the house even in canon, and he's even more isolated as a vampire).
after he finds out Barnabas is also a vampire, things get a little more complicated, but overall, they're still friendly. Roger doesn't have much sympathy for Barnabas' relentless self-pity and decrying his doomed fate to live as a monster, because Roger on the whole enjoys his vampirism and has made a decent un-life for himself out of it (thanks in no small part to Vicki). but having someone like him around is a comfort in ways he wouldn't have expected, he's no longer solitary or uniquely monstrous out of the Collins family, he has someone else around through the night, and someone who understands the sufferings of bloodthirst and being shut out of the sun.
furthermore, Roger's very much interested in his family history and stories of the past, the building of Collinwood, Jeremiah's ships – and Barnabas was there. there's potential for some very interesting conversations about the past, and the arc of the Collins family history to the present, not to mention literature, travel, fashion, politics and the rest. Roger's his cousin's mirror in modernity in many ways, and that's something potentially interesting to explore: the world changes around them, but Collinses do not.
as an aside, they both have a funny sort of relationship to Burke. Barnabas hates him for his resemblance to Jeremiah and envies his friendship with Vicki and thinks he's crude, and Roger ... well. it's complicated. it's closer to antagonism than not, and Burke has tried to kill him once in this au, and Roger resents his flirting with Vicki, but then there's everything else with their past. so I don't think Barnabas' treatment of him would sit particularly well with Roger, he'd take the attitude of hey, only I can be a dick to Burke >:(
the definite fracture point is Barnabas imprinting on Vicki. Roger's already jealous and possessive by nature, and it's amplified by the supernatural nature of his relationship to Vicki (being closer, bodily and mentally; being necessary to each other; being, quite literally, sustenance) so he's already a little on edge when Barnabas starts paying attention to her, giving her presents, and appreciating the scenery — Barnabas doesn't, exactly, tend to have much in the way of moral inclination to leaving women alone when they have prior engagements, but it's fair to point out the irony of everything Roger was doing with his bloodbag governess when he was still very much a married man.
anyway: Roger finds foreign bite marks on his wife's neck, and he's understandably immensely upset by this. partially out of territorial sentiment, but he also knows Vicki, and he knows that she wouldn't have invited another vampire willingly — which means that she was forced, or hypnotized, or attacked in secret, and there's only the one potential suspect. this is already enough to lose his good will, but he might have been willing to let Barnabas go with a "hands off," had this discovery not lead to finding out what he'd also been doing to Liz. the combination of the two is unforgivable, and it's Barnabas' error to have made an enemy who is very personally aware of all his vampiric weaknesses, and Burke's already carved a stake.
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