#enigmata

[zeryndell]

Mythus when X do his job better than him

[poeticcannon]

"Jellyfish on the Staircase": The Riddlers have a saying: every time that an enigma manifests in the universe, it will leave behind a "staircase" in the void. The dissolved realities will then drip down the steps, condensing into a mottled thing bearing semblance to a jellyfish. There was once a Nameless who claimed to have made contact with a "Jellyfish on the Staircase." In madness, he proclaimed that the jellyfish will activate the cognition regions within the gray matter of one's brain a vast place beyond the fathoming of mortal minds.

Really gotta dig around the wiki for this stuff. Seems like a nihility connection implied?

[starrailarchivist]

Convo with welt pt1

[enden-k]

yeahhh bbg yeah

[harmonysanreads]

[Crawls in after 100%ing 3.2 in one sitting]

M A N

You wouldn't BELIEVE the lore we got going on. Anaxa and Phainon content got us eating good.

Wow... I hope you took a lot of rest after that because I frankly could not do it in one sitting lol.

Each time they dropped a new piece of lore, it's as if I could hear the bomb sound effect in my brain. For such a lore heavy update though, I have criticisms on the storytelling. Now read the following with this in mind that this ultimately is my personal opinion. But in comparison to the way 3.1's arc was told, 3.2 did not feel as fluid. Hsr still has that unresolved identity crisis over whether it wants to be a visual novel or not and at certain points, it feels.. so lazy.

I thought they mentioned they'd figured out an alternative to the black screen? Only to replace significant moments that would've made wonderful cutscenes with it anyway? Trianne's official death, Oronyx's reveal of the TB's situation, the TB reclaiming their life in the sea of flowers... these would've made wonderful cutscenes. A shame, really.

Now, some points I really liked — the citizens' assembly. This trial was honestly what I was looking forward to the most personally and it did not disappointed. They didn't lie to us about Anaxa being The Great Performer. The way we were shown the stakes of Aglaea's position and the scalding inner conflict of this world.

So far, we'd only heard in voicelines about how Phainon is the only one capable of leading everyone to the miracle because of the way he understands humanity. So this demonstration that he truly is capable of shaking the hearts of people was amazing — even though he did struggle a bit in the beginning. But ultimately they succeeded in conveying his greatest strengths : sincerity and passion. From a technical standpoint, his approach reminded me of something else though. Sometimes, in academic debates, I'll see debaters using a personal experience and weaving emotions into them to sway the hearts of the judges and audience ; either alongside logic, or disregarding logic altogether. I personally hate this approach, but I'm nevertheless intrigued by how it actually works if pulled off right.

And Anaxa... oh Anaxa. Do you know what I found most interesting about his story? The whole time, both he and the direction of the story told us about how the only thing he cares about is his research and the truth. Which may not be wrong at all if you want to view it that way. But at the climax of the story, he's the one who makes such a huge ‘sacrifice’, the so called blasphemer is the one who vouched for the Flame Chase with absolute certainty at the end. Not only that, he also took the Council of Elders alongside him.

Now I'm not looking so deep so that I can find something less reckless to say about him. It simply seems that way if you view it from a certain angle in my opinion. He's not supposed to be a character who adheres by ‘morals’ when it comes to his research. Disregarding his passion for uncovering the nature of the world, so much so that he'll go to any length, would be a disservice to his character. He's reckless, “morally gray”, frankly confusing but his heart is not corrupt. Perhaps... that is why he was able to transcend the peaks of purity.

[b1adie]

okay these sunday boss drops are just fucked up 😭

[third--planet]

[riddler-elinoir]

Would you look at that? It's been a while since the last time I interacted with a Riddler. Why, my greetings, miss.

🌌 @masked-genie

Elinoir raises a brow, the voice catching her attention as he turns around to see the owner of the voice. She meets face to face with a stranger, seeing him bow.

She smiles. "Oh hello there." She greets. "Seems like someone knows that I'm a Riddler. Any business you want with me perhaps?"

[callophelia]

Cookie Run: Kingdom characters if they were HSR pathrstriders... (a ramble)

I caught a wild case of late-night thoughts recently where I started contemplating about CRK and HSR and began wondering what paths would CRK characters be on if they were pathstriders in HSR ᕕ( ᐛ )ᕗ

This is purely based on vibes and sleep-deprived thoughts, but gameplay wise, I think Pure Vanilla Cookie would totally be an Abundance character (though if you held me at gunpoint and told me to choose something else, I would pick Harmony as a second choice). Lore-wise though, I could potentially see him as a Member of the Genius Society (alongside White Lily Cookie pre-truth). I can totally imagine Pure Vanilla having... like... an alternate path form (kinda like the Trailblazer or March 7th) that's Nihility and based on his Truthless Recluse form ヽ(°〇°)ﾉ

I can def see Hollyberry Cookie as a Preservation character gameplay-wise, tho I'm not sure what faction she would be a part of lore-wise. ¯\_(- > -)_/¯

Dark Cacao Cookie, however, I can imagine as a Hunt character and a part of the Xianzhou Alliance, I think...

Weirdly enough, I can sort of vaguely see Golden Cheese Cookie as either a Remembrance or Harmony character gameplay-wise under the same logic as Jing Yuan being Erudition. Lore-wise though, I guess Golden Cheese gives me the vibes of someone who'd be a part of Penacony. At first I thought the Land of Festivities didn't suit her vibes, but then I remembered the appearance of the Golden City, so lore-wise, she could be a part of Penacony, probably a Dreamweaver.

Although I can see White Lily Cookie's gameplay path being Erudition, I think it would be more interesting if she (for similar reasons as Jing Yuan and what I suggested for Golden Cheese) were a Destruction character. Though as I mentioned before, I do think she would be a member of the Genius Society pre-truth. Post-truth, I do think it would be interesting if she had become a part of the Antimatter Legion (maybe even as an Emanator) or the Annihilation Gang.

Shadow Milk Cookie gives me Nihility vibes, tho I do think that, narrative-wise, he too would have been a part of the Genius Society during his Sage/Fount of Truth days (or maybe a member of the Intelligentsia Guild). After becoming a beast tho, I can see him becoming a pathstrider of Enigmata (the opposite of Nous' Erudition) or a Masked Fool ()giving in entirely to Aha's hedonism)

I think Cream Unicorn Cookie's gameplay path would either be Abundance, Harmony, or Remembrance. Don't know what they would be lore-wise tho. ᐠ( ᐛ )ᐟ

Tho I think Wedding Cake and Black Forest Cookie's gameplay paths would be Harmony and Destruction respectively

And that's all I got now lol (≧▽≦)

Thanks for tuning in to my ramble lol ≽(•⩊ •マ≼

[starcurtain]

One faction I want to know more about in HSR is the Riddlers. They fascinate me and I hope if we eventually met at least one and we get an option to have our character get mad at them because they find them incredibly annoying to talk to!

Sorry this took me one million years to answer because I had so many messages but yes!!

Honestly, I think Star Rail's universe-wide approach is fantastic for game design because it's so open-ended. Like Genshin feels like it has a relatively finite point--the seven nations of Teyvat, plus Khaenri'ah and Celestia (although of course, other worlds are also already hinted there). But Star Rail, on the other hand, seems infinite. We could theoretically never run out of worlds to visit and have adventures on.

And that's soooo good for world-building because it means you can just come up with completely random locations and cultures and factions and sprinkle them in wherever you feel like.

I love all the different factions that have been hinted at so far in Star Rail, just mysterious little blips that tantalize us with the idea that we might come across characters of those factions one day.

I feel very sympathetic to the Riddlers, having been a student of critical theory; the idea that language is not finite, the gap between signified and signifier, the inherently arbitrary nature of word formation--all very fun stuff.

But I think my heart is with the History Fictionologists. What a great concept because of course it's morally wrong to obscure and erase history! Terrible! But also it's completely logical to agree that the world needs mysteries to function! That all zest for existence comes from pursuit of unknown truths! That some conundrums must be unsolvable or risk the complete collapse of all drive for life into nihility!

What a complicated moral quandary with absolutely no easy answer. I think about this so much, you guys have no idea.

[arataki-neato]

Fuckin love how Mythus the Enigmata has almost an AI-generated sort of quality to their design considering the MO of the History Fictionologists is creating such a glut of completely fabricated information that truth is indistinguishable from fiction

[poeticcannon]

Mythus the Enigmata is interesting. An enigma usually involves questions. But the Enigmata seems to usually do alterations to truth that go unnoticed.

If there is an associations with questions too, then both Nous the Erudition and Mythus the Enigmata are gods of questions while being at odds.

[sunflower-dreamboat]

I am happy to introduce Enigmata, my recently completed Great God Grove OC! And with it, I'd like to introduce the fan project I alluded to on my last Bizzyboys post!

It takes place post-canon, on a (very WIP) island off the shore of the Grove. Godpoke goes there for a break from their abruptly acquired new life, by chance running into the former Bizzyboys and Razzmatazz along the way. Their little holiday is interrupted when they stumble upon a sleeping god.

The entrance of Enigmata's domain had been destroyed, cutting off their connection to their followers and the other gods. Unaware, they decided to have a nap and wait for someone to wake them up. As they slept for decades after decades, they slowly slipped out of the island's public consciousness. Eventually, they were nearly completely forgotten. Godpoke takes on the task of helping Enigmata reconnect with the world after their absence.

I will be sharing major developments bit by bit! I'm excited to share it as it's fleshed out further! I've included some conceptual doodles under the cut :)

They don't have a specific time of ascension, but they predate Cobigail and Inspekta.

[garmgeyr]

ENIGMATA: The Path of Storytellers, Skeptics, Poets, and Possibilities

(And Propagandists, but this meta looks at Enigmata through a more positive light)

Enigmata is - and will likely remain - a poorly understood path. Its philosophy, after all, defies the concept of “certainty” in favor of endless possibilities, so to understand it fully would be to eliminate Enigmata itself. So far the only factions we know of are the History Fictionologists, who embellish the past with fiction in order to inspire future possibilities, and the Riddlers, who use metaphors, riddles, and other circuitous language to forge multiple meanings in communication. This is not simply “the path of liars and misinformation,” as the fandom has taken to believing. That would be better fit for Elation. Enigmata is instead the path of “what if,” and sits in direct opposition to the cold, systematic omniscience of Erudition.

Defying Erudition does not mean that Enigmata necessarily aims to destroy knowledge or knowing. I would argue that “theory” is an acceptable concept within this philosophy because “theory” itself is innately uncertain. A theory is a theory because there exists the possibility for it to be proven wrong, given enough evidence, the right tools, and time. Instead, Enigmata reminds Erudition that nothing can ever truly be 100% known, and that science is filtered through biases, variables, imperfection, and misattribution. On top of that, reality is created on the individual level, and every single creature in this world experiences it differently. To the Enigmata pathstrider, it is in fact impossible to explain the world with generalizations.

Giving up certainty does not come at the expense of intellect, however. “To stop questioning is to ask pouring rain to relinquish its faith in the glittering stars” is the quote for Enigmata in the data bank, written by a poet who presumably follows the path. The quote itself obscures its meaning with metaphor and leaves its interpretation up to the reader, but also highlights the act of questioning, which by itself creates the unknown and opens the door to speculation. Enigmata is therefore the path of skeptics. Don’t take words at face value, it says. Even Gallagher, one of our only examples of an Enigmata pathstrider at the moment, is described at least once as being skeptical, and frequently warns the Trailblazer not to believe what they see. This is not the path of brainlessness, even if Mythus is represented as a jellyfish, but is ironically cerebral. If there is nothing left to question, doubt, or wonder about, then there is no Enigmata.

Like all the paths though, whether or not you find the followers of Enigmata “good” or “bad” is a matter of perspective. Altering historical records might be offensive to a Candelographo, while writing a story that embellishes the past would otherwise be seen as a work of art. As stated above, Enigmata is not merely a path of lies, insofar as fiction is not foremost labeled as a lie. This is, after all, a path of poets and storytellers, and most of us don’t throw away books because they veer from what we know of reality or truth. Historical fiction presents to us both fact and fiction simultaneously, and asks questions like “what if 17th century Europe had dragons?” Engaging with fantasy in this way allows us to indulge in a whole plethora of alternate worlds that are paradoxically real and fake.

For this reason, there is no better way to introduce Enigmata to us than with Penacony’s dreamscape, which represents dreams, imagination, and memory. All of these things leave real impacts on us, even if they don’t reside in the part of the world we call reality. While just about all of us would agree that dreams and imagination are inherently full of possibilities, what about memory? The path of Remembrance governs memory, and believes that it can be captured and preserved 1:1. Mythus was born from the aeon of Remembrance, however, and represents one of the ways in which memory fails: when we forget details, our brain naturally plugs holes up with fabrications. Enigmata’s corrosion (and it is indeed called such in game) is usually harmless to memory in small quantities, but larger holes lend themselves to more impactful fiction. There is a famous psychological study conducted by Loftus and Palmer in the 1970s that revealed how leading questions and false information can affect eyewitness accounts of car crashes. New information has the potential to overwrite memory - a green car suddenly becomes red in testimony - and Dr. Blues’ quest line illustrates this phenomenon: a person whose body has been “forgotten” by the dreamscape becomes an origami bird with Enigmata’s (Gallagher’s) help. Unlike its defiance of Erudition, Enigmata is a facet, rather than an enemy of Remembrance.

This whole post was actually inspired by the Otherworldly Delights readable, which I haven’t even touched on yet and probably won’t spend much time going over it anyway. This readable describes how one of the Luofu’s storytellers acquired a parrot from a mysterious fan, and how the parrot learned to recite and eventually create stories of its own. This parrot was Youci (the Pure Fiction bird), and while not outright stated to be related to Enigmata, its penchant for reinventing the past all but confirms it to be some sort of History Fictionologist, even though its owner doesn’t believe it has the capability of thought and imagination that humans possess. This story and the description on the Jade Feather (tl;dr : a Candelographo was discovered to have fabricated all of the history she’d recorded since creating a quill from the feathers of her dead parrot) have something notable in common beyond just the parrot: a writer or storyteller acquires some kind of muse that coincides with when they begin creating fiction, but the writer themselves is never attributed as a History Fictionologist.

Mikhail was a prolific storyteller and most of his work was based on his own history. Despite everything he created being clearly fiction, he’s never described as a History Fictionologist. Gallagher is though, and is frequently represented as the statue of a hound. Mikhail even calls him "[his] hound." So I had to wonder — might he have been Mikhail’s “parrot?” Gallagher's purpose would have been to reinvent Penacony’s history, and he does that twice that we know of (first in turning the planet into the “Planet of Festivities,” and second in freeing it from the Order). As we see in Otherworldly Delights, Youci becomes a storyteller itself by first mimicking its master, and then observing the world around it. This echoes Gallagher’s character stories, which shows through a series of notes how he’s created his persona by observing people in Penacony. If he’s not the History Fictionologist himself, then he was a gift from one to Mikhail during the War of Independence. Under this theory, Mikhail - and likely Micah - both knew what Gallagher was, and relied on him for the power his stories held within the dreamscape.

This has gone on too long now, and I still have other theories to write out at some point, but all this is to say that Gallagher continues to be a phenomenal representation of the path of Enigmata: who and what he is remains full of endless possibilities in the face of so much information.

[aelusnovaamora]

Yk, the aeons in honkai star rail really seem to come in pairs

The Hunt & the Abundance - Life and Death (cycle of life) - This one is the most explicitly stated in game, with the followers of the hunt hunting down the abominations of abundance on the xianzhou

The Destruction & The Preservation - Ties to entropy, perhaps? - this one is fairly obvious the preservation preserves things and the destruction destroys.

The Erudition & The Enigmata - Knowledge and Mysteries - This one is also one of the more obvious ones, what the genius society works to document, the History Fictionologists work to obscure

The Harmony & the Elation - Unity and Chaos - This one seems to come out in penacony the most, with sparkle doing a terrorism and disrupting the peace.

The Beauty & The Nihility - Meaningful and Meaningless - The followers of the Beauty strive to see the beauty in everything, in all life, death, journeys and destinations, while followers of the Nihility believe that everything is meaningless

The Propagation & The Voracity - Production and Consumption - The Voracity was all about consumption, ravenging worlds in endless hunger, while the Propagation was all about endless reproduction. In other words, endless hunger and an endless food source.

The Trailblaze & The Finality - The Journey and the Destination - This is one that I'm less confident about, but the trailblaze is all about the journey of charting new paths and revisiting old ones, while the finality is all about, well, the final destination.

The Remembrance & The Permanence - Mind and Matter - This is the weakest one, but I'll describe it the best I can. The Rememberance is all about memories and collecting them, and storing them. The Permanence is all about keeping the state of the world permanent. The Remembrance seeks to preserve the minds/memories, while the Permanence seeks to preserve the physical state of the world.

This leaves 2 left, which are unpaired.

The Order - The Order has technically been assimilated into the Harmony, so perhaps it doesnt have a pair?

The Equilibrium - Maybe the equilibrium can be paired with itself? I'll have to look into the lore for the equilibrium but that's the only explanation I can think of.