#emphasizing once again i dont think hes a black and white villain

[astergore]

context: i interpret inspekta as having Known that he was eating cappy's heart but in the context that he Didn't know i think it would be ridiculously funny

[wordsoflittlewisdom]

Watching bop again

I kinda forgot Cass was at the roller derby game. Love how all the characters are connected

Why does Roman’s voice...sound like that

Boss Bitch is weirdly nostalgic now

I like that the whole roller derby team is wearing like. team jackets. and harleys got her whole fringe sleeves thing going on

YES LOVE WHEN SHE THROWS THE NECKLACE AWAY

The chemical plant blowing up as fireworks was a very Harley choice

“So I’ll start where I fucking want” four minutes ago

huntress huntress huntress huntress huntress

I read somewhere that this huntress and Montoya scene was one take and they just changed the lighting to show the change

romans middle name being beauvais is probably the clearest clue they could have given that he was from a rich family

Love that Renee finds the necklace and knows Harley and the joker broke up. I like this idea that superheroes/villains are kinda like celebrities in this world

The egg sandwich scene is great what more can I say

Love that there’re cars and people just living their lives in this city

It’s a crime that we never see Harley wear this glittery fanny pack

The music is really good in this

It’s neat how the line between her narration and her dialogue is blurred, like how she’ll say the first part of something in narration and the second part in dialogue

Huntress’s little flute theme

And Montoya knows Cass; c o n n e c t i o n s

Montoya’s been going after Roman, too

And now we’re flipping back to the bertinelli massacre and diamond

Even if the whole missing diamond plot isn’t that unique, everything’s woven together so neatly

And now Dinah and Renee are on the phone about Cass and the diamond

It’s all connected

Harleys whole “I’m here to report a terrible crime”—she could have just run in there but she wanted to be Dramatic

I do wish the vocals were a little louder here maybe?

Big fan of this fight choreography

Harley pausing on a frame where she’s making a weird face before rewinding to explain about the diamond—it’s so rare to ever get to see women like. making weird faces in movies. All the women in his this are gorgeous but they don’t always have to be; they look beat up after fights and get dirty and make weird faces and it’s great

Dinah singing? Exceptional

“Loans, liquidity, laundering” ah yes the three L’s of illegal business

I unironically listen to Black Canary’s man’s world.

I like that everyone just calls Dinah “Canary”

“I’m all on my lonesome. It’s great” Harleys even an unreliable narrator when she’s just talking

I’ve really never seen a movie that feel like it’s from the female gaze visually as much as this one—all the rings and earrings, the hair, the makeup, it feels like what women might fantasize about dressing like

Dinah yelling “you motherfucker!” While beating some creeps up is quality

What time of day is it? Dinah would probably be leaving early in the morning, but I Refuse to believe that Roman would be awake particularly early any morning

She either canary is leaving her nightclub singing gig in the late morning/early afternoon or roman is still awake from the night before and is going to go to sleep soon

Cass and Dinah in the same building. (Bernie voice): I am once again talking about the connections

I’ve riffed on this before but i refuse to believe that Roman can drive

This Dinah and Renee scene establishes character, backstories, and moves the plot along all at once

Jesus some of ewan mcgregor’s acting in this is painfully bad

I love that Cass has a big bomber jacket and longer, looser shorts

Jurnee’s abs wow

The lights from behind the hands with the eyes behind Harley, who’s surrounded by people and then Roman and Victor emerge from the back, whispering to each other? Beautiful

One of the grievances roman has against Harley is “constantly interrupting him, like I’m doing right now”

Harleys “you’re really not as complicated as you think” bit is almost satirical of this cult we’ve created of “complicated” white male movie villains who have massive fan followings (cough cough joker)

Interesting that Roman holds the knife to Harleys face but hands it off to Victor to do that actual cutting

Someone handed Roman a bowl of popcorn

Harleys pocket tampon

It’s diamonds are a girls best friend yeah babey!

The male backup dancers are wearing muzzles/masks (Roman has one too for a split second) is an interesting flip on the way women are typically the ones being silenced, as well as Harleys desire to silence the men around her and be the one telling and controlling her own narrative

“Hey! you’re that singer no one listens to!” “Hey! You’re the asshole no one likes!”

Harley with her glitter gun

Harleys reaction when the sprinklers go off is perfect—Margot makes her feel like a living cartoon

This cell block fight scene is a showstopper

I like that cass doesn’t immediately want to stay with Harley. It gives her some agency in a story where she’s mostly just following the curveballs life throws her

Harleys little stare straight into the camera when cass admits to eating the diamond

Harley at the grocery store really emphasizes that she’s a total weirdo

I think I heard somewhere that the pic of child Harley with the nuns is a pic of young Margot??? Not totally sure though

Cass not knowing who the joker is goes with the whole supers are like celebrities thing—cass probably follows a whole different group of them (like how most kids follow different celebrities than their parents)

Huntress huntress huntresssss

“Give me number 32. Mild”

This kid in helenas flashback doesn’t really look like she’s grow up to look like Mary Elizabeth Winstead

This filming in this flashback has so much style

Helena practicing in the bathroom mirror with her drawing and her multiple bottles of travel mouthwash

We’re in the scene where Roman makes the girl dance on the table and oh god it’s so uncomfortable

No no no no no not this hate this

Alright that nightmare’s done

“and that’s why you should never pay federal income taxes”

Harley offering to bring cass to Roman after hearing doc say “business is business is interesting

OH ITS HIT ME WITH YOUR BEST SHOT TIME

Dinahs car is yellow because it’s...canary yellow

Roman putting on the mask is cool and all but he’s just gonna have to take it back off to get changed

This Harley vs Renee fight is fun because they keep mirroring each other—they’re fighting each other, but they’re really on the same side

The way the women all kind of circle each other at first and don’t immediately get along

Cass popping up with the gun also gives her some agency—she’s at the end of her rope with the diamond and being betrayed by Harley

“I am nOT THE CROSSBOW KILLER”

The way Huntress sounds so uncertain when she says “...and now I’m done” Mary’s acting really popped off

Roman’s a bitch but I like his outfits

Helenas little smile when Harley says “you just killed his BFF”

I love how excited Harley is when they all agree to work together

Roman’s giving his little speech in the back of a pickup truck?

When all the guys turned around with masks on I got chills

“I love this chick she’s got rage issues.” “I DONT HAVE RAGE ISSUES”

Huntress stabbing the guy while going down the slide is peak cinema

This set lights up as the scene progresses and reveals more

I love love love that Helena is genuinely caring towards Cass and recognizing that children shouldn’t have to go through trauma like her

“When the fuck did she have time to do a shoe change?”

THE HAIR TIE YEAH

Forgot to mention this but it’s a stroke of genius for this place to be called the booby trap

Love me some canary cry

“Told ya she had a killer voice”

Harleys chase was a real group hurrah—the canary cry cleared the way and pushed her forward, Huntress towed her, Renee gave her the gun with one bullet

Cass and Roman are just sitting in the back seat. That must have been an awkward car ride

Cass pulling the gun away from Roman when he tries to shoot up at Harley when Harleys on top of the car is elite

Damn this is one foggy pier

When Harley starts with “your protection is based on the fact that people are scared of you” you expect her to say that it’s wrong or something but she says “I’m the one they should be scared of” this movie messed with tropes so much

That also includes the whole “one bullet” thing—Harley misses with her one bullet, and you don’t really know what’s gonna happen next

“I took your ring”

You can pinpoint exactly when Harley and Roman realize what Cass did

I’d put the entire taco scene here if I could

Renee moving the drink away from cass shows her caring side—she doesn’t want a kid to get into alcohol and make the mistakes she did

“Does she always talk like the cop in a bad eighties movie?”

Harley and Cass stealing the car is a fun way to show that she may be on the side of the good guys sometimes, but that doesn’t necessarily make her one

“Woman” by Kesha

Wow the outfits in this scene are iconic

I mean they are in the whole movie but I especially like these

Cass riding around with Harley and a hyena, wearing cute outfits and learning the ways of chaos

Harley got her sandwich!

The credit art for this movie is cool

Especially how they represent each character

In conclusion this is still my favorite movie

I know I’ve been kinda absent recently, but watching this again has really reminded me how much I love it. I got really busy but I’m going to Make An Effort to be a contributing member of the bop fandom again.

[nbapprentice]

You said a while back that while Supergiant games (Bastion, Transistor, Hades) was mostly okay, you had some words about them. I was curious as to what those words were, since Hades' full release is soon.

okay. alright. ive been playing hades lately so i definitely want to give my two cents (or dollars by the size this is gonna get). but let’s go Step by Step

the good: i want to throw a whole Endorsement over supergiant games with the art direction and its characters, which is what keeps me coming back again and again, and what i can assume is that most people are attracted to. 

gameplaywise, they have a Format they stick to which has become their staple, not to their detriment but to their advantage, like... gameplay tropes, so to speak, that they stick to (such as the addition of special conditions that give a disadvantage in exchange for more long-term rewards)

i fucking adore that they take one concept per game, go for it, and when they’re done they are Done; they don’t bother with sequels, they don’t want to run things to the ground and i fucking respect that. They have their themes, and they stick to them (to various degrees of success).

that said, like every piece of media, they are not perfect and this has to be analysed and spoken about

CONTENT WARNINGS: genocide and ethnic cleansing, antisemitism, misogyny, homophobia, suicide, and mentions of incest, and a general Spoilers warning

bastion: touches on ethnic cleansing, and not in a way i’d say is satisfactory. our narrator and one of our Sympathetic characters is one of the men who worked on a world-ending weapon meant to use against the Ura (a group of people coded as East Asian) which after a bit of googling is literally called “the final solution” if there was ever a war between the Ura and the Cael (who feel like rly tan white people to me). jesus fucking CHRIST.

we also meet more Ura other than our two named characters and we have to kill most of them. so that fucking blows.

the game tries for “being a genocidal monster will get you fucked up and blown up” which duh, but i feel we shouldn’t have had a person responsible for war crimes be one of our friends no matter how bad he feels about the whole thing, or the people victim of war crimes become villains in the latter half of the game. zia’s father could’ve taken ruck’s role ez pz.

transistor: the weakest of their games, imo; the lore and writing are fairly flimsy and i did not come out feeling Satisfied, especially because it had this rly good build-up that did not pay off. not to mention... their villains? 3/4 were gay people. lol. two married guys (not even explicit, you only realize by their shared last names) and the ps*cho lesbian trope (iirc she wanted to kill the protagonist’s lover or something). the female protagonist also ends up killing herself to live forever in a digital paradise with her dead lover. it’s. god. 

very Aesthetic, GORGEOUS music, interesting gameplay; had potential, i do not feel like it lived up to it at least as far as the story goes.

pyre: now this one. this one’s BEEFY. where transistor felt flimsy, pyre is rich; lots to sink your teeth into, rich in lore and loveable characters, again w the beautiful music, themes of cooperation and togetherness. my favorite of the cast is volfred sandalwood, the only Black (or, well, Black-coded) revolutionary i’ve ever seen portrayed with this amount of sympathy.

onto the bad: they literally have a Class of character named “Savage”; there’s the “mystical mentally ill person” trope; there is an overwhelming amount of explicit m/f pairs (one of them being. a romance that formed in a single day and then both of the characters were somehow willing to risk it all for each other? PLEASE) while the only hints of gayness are... hints. especially when Jodariel (another of my favs) is teased to have feelings for the player regardless of gender then only gets an ending with a male character with whom she has nothing in common 🙃

hades: and now. this one. music: gorgeous. character designs: spectacular (aphrodite is straight up naked but it’s so... natural and casual, it doesn’t feel sexualized at all). voice acting amazing. character interactions charming and endearing. as a greek mythology nerd, it was nice to see them go for the obscure shit like Zagreus at all, NOT portray Persephone and Hades as a loving couple, AND portrayed the gods as the bunch of petty assholes (some more benevolent than others) that they are. imo they’re too generous with their portrayal of achilles but i’ll allow it.

and finally... it seems all those criticisms about having all the gay characters hidden in the shadows paid off, cuz we got (aside of patroclus and achilles) a bisexual polyamorous protag. Holy Shit! and it’s not even playersexual, romance whomever you want shit without the routes recognizing each other: he explicitly talks about how he’s thinking abt them both (though it’s like “yeah usually mortals take one lover but gods love many huh” polyamory is a human thing too bro!!!!!)

and this is where it all goes, well, at least vaguely downhill lol. ok so the incest warning i gave up there? well. it’s not... outright incestuous. but it has some ugly implications. i want to emphasize: the characters never refer to each other as siblings, nor do they treat each other as such (thanatos, in fact, only recognizes hypnos as his brother, and megaera only sees the other furies as her sisters), but they were all raised by the same woman, Nyx... zagreus and thanatos even grew up together (im assuming megaera didnt meet zagreus until he was fully grown).

this is complicated even worse by the fact that they tried to trick zagreus into believing Nyx was his mother. he realized pretty early on this was not true but like... adoptive mothers, anyone? granted i can believe that bc of the attempt at deception that probably ruptured any attempt at actual familial closeness, and it’s not like hypnos and thanatos saw zagreus as their brother at any point, so they were p much aware of the truth too. with the fact that thanatos even looks like goth miles edgeworth (im not kidding you can google him up right now its literally edgeworth in a cowl) i rly feel they were aiming for Childhood Friend Anime Rival Man than the “surprise kiss bc ur not actually related <3″ shit. zagreus never once refers to nyx as his mother in-game, and also refers to thanatos and hypnos as her sons, never his brothers.

so yeah, like. if one’s feeling generous, zagreus and thanatos are more of a “my father is emotionally closed off and neglects me so my best friend’s mother basically raised me” kind of situation... just pulled off in, perhaps, the worst way possible (why didnt they just say Zagreus was told Hekate was his mom, that’s such an easy fix? or that he was born of nobody other than Hades??? [gestures at athena])

but then, the gods. aaaaaaaahhhhahahahh the gods. demeter shows up! and she calls zeus, hades and poseidon... her foster-brothers. which somehow would make the persephone thing less fucking awful, apparently. they really. really really did not need to do that. she could’ve just said “my fellow gods” or whatever. or my “god-brothers” or something, to pretend it was just a weird god alliance thing??? i dont know but implying that foster family isn’t family is just... bro, the dynamics still exist.

Don’t Like That.

i even contacted supergiant games over this. they reassured me they were even trying to avoid the incest of the original myths bc they didn’t want to mess with such a heavy theme. i believe them... but i really think they didn’t think this through. compared to something like fire emblem fates this is nearly benign, but the implications don’t look good :/

tl;dr of the tl;drs: i admire their artistic philosophy and the heavy emphasis on fresh gameplay, characters and their relationships; i appreciate that it seems that they listen to criticism?; i don’t appreciate that they didn’t think to at LEAST talk to adoptees when making a game about family.

[extraposts23]

Female fighter. Dont reblog.

It seems like an offense to women to not use their skills. For instance, Katrina Law has experience in dancing and has a black belt in Tae Kwon Do, Muay Tai and Krav Maga. She is capable of learning the fight choreography that they need her to do. Katie Cassidy has also proven herself capable of learning the fight choreography they have had her do.

The fights for women are hardly ever well choreographed and when they are they are always shown as being less brutal as the men. Why is it that only men are allowed to have brutal fights with Oliver/Green Arrow? Women can be just as brutal as men. Yet they show Nyssa as nothing more than a baton twirling ballerina. That is offensive. Edit: Another point by someone else.

Apparently, the idea of having a woman as a the main villain would then bring about the theory that it would turn into Oliver being a woman beater as if he has not beaten woman on the show before. Apparently, the idea that having a woman win or be the big bad would result in us thinking that Oliver is a woman beater? It's not always cut and dry plus if they had numerous female villains then you guys will complain he's a women beater.[these sentences are the same] But the fact that he has already defeated the various female bad guys; low-level women on the show does not count as him beating on women? How is it any different? And the fact that Oliver in the comics seemingly does not have female bad guys; big bads ( correct me if I’m wrong I believe he does and could have been used. Or used his low-level female bads as big bads in the show) is a reason to not have a female big bad in the show. As if the show has not stolen characters from Batman, so they cannot use some of other characters as big bads?

Thea – Was not a fighter, to begin with but yet after a few months with Merlyn is all the sudden a martial arts expert. Capable of taking on and very nearly besting Merlyn. She defeated Anarchy, who beat Oliver twice. Apparently, because she is the daughter of Merlyn and the sister of Oliver she is an MA expert or at least now portrayed as one. She even beat Oliver arguably, since he was attempting to teach her, lecture her. And she had Blood lust.

Shado - Was the daughter of Yao Fei who was a Martial arts expert. She was also an expert capable of wiping the floor with Slade. With no explanation of how she became that aside from that she is Yao Fei's daughter and that he taught her. But what happened to this badass female, martial arts fighter? She was killed off because we cannot have a woman, who was clearly the only one at Oliver's present day level, who can beat Oliver. Certainly not a woman. She was killed off to further some lame “choice” story arc for the supposed hero.

Dinah Laurel Lance– (One of the worst offenses of the show given who her character is supposed to be. She is Dinah Laurel Lance aka the Black Canary). One of the best fighters in the DC universe, but has been dumbed down and reduced in skill. I say that because she is supposed to be Black Canary. Oliver’s partner. Not talking about having to be a love interest. Talking about being his crime fighting partner and equal. That is the character. She was clearly shown to be able to fight in S1-2, capable of throwing a punch and taking down men with swift efficient moves but gets dumbed down to the point where she cannot even know how to do that anymore. To the point where she needs to learn how to throw a punch. Now it has been said that self-defense classes are not enough to be able to survive on the streets. Okay, but she was clearly adept enough to fight in self-defense in the first place. So instead of simply adding on to that skill she already had. Instead of having WildCat add to those skills, hone them and make her into the Martial Arts badass that she should be she gets reduced in skill. Supposedly they did it, took away that skill because they wanted it to look real. She gets reduced in skill to a weak woman who cannot fight at all. It has also been said that her body type the character and actress means that she should not be able to be that good.

For one thing Thea is just as petite and thin as her, and Thea was trained by Merlyn and Oliver; later on. Yet Thea is shown to use many badass moves and take down goons bigger than her but gets no crap for that. Secondly, Shado is also just as thin and petite. Shado wiped the floor with Slade; a man twice her size. She is also treated like she has no right to fight for her city. As if only Oliver is allowed to fight for the City. Then bitches to her that she needs more training. But refuses to actually train her!

Sara- Who has far more actual fight training than Oliver, nonstop training via the League of Assassins. As opposed to his ridiculous globe hopping non training. She who should be his equal (because of the way her fighting is portrayed, her training. Nothing to do with the who is the better Black Canary.) of not his better, can't be allowed to beat him. Even in the tie in comic 2.5, she beat him in a fight but that is never actually acknowledged on the show. She can beat Merlyn, after 2 extra years of training with Ra's Al Ghul himself. But cannot beat Oliver? The fact that she was mind controlled via the Dominators should have made Sara more dangerous, harder to defeat. In the crossover when she was mind controlled she logically should have been even more difficult to beat.

Cupid- She bested Oliver in season two, arguably, because she technically got him down and had him handcuffed to a train rail. But yet this is brushed off as he was holding back or he still won the fight. Even though she did beat him canonically. So if that is true.

If a former member of the Swat team can is allowed to beat Oliver but Nyssa; a lifetime member of the LOA, trained since birth cannot be allowed to beat him once? However, if it is not true that she beat him then it simply serves to prove that no woman has been allowed to beat the white male hero. (You don’t need parentheses only use them in a quote not to emphasize something same with uppercase.)

Huntress- Another in S1, possibly S2, that has sort of come close to being able to defeat Oliver. Or rather being on his level. But she was written off, and her skills yet again being brushed off as being emotional, or not thinking clearly or reckless. Also got treated like she has no idea what killing is, even though she went on a murder spree with both the triad and her father's family. But only Oliver knows what killing means because he has killed. As if the people he killed were more important, rather that he was killing it was more important.

China White- The only woman we have ever gotten closest to beating Oliver in a fight. Though technically tying him. She was also not allowed to beat him. Even though she clearly had some sort of natural skill.

Katana/Tatsu Yamishiro- To an extent. In Season 3 she was shown to be a badass swords woman. Also in the comics, she is an expert martial artist. But when it came time for the team to escape in S3 in Nanda Parbat, they reduced her to having to have Flash rescue her and then she simply walks away to disappear after killing her husband. They shoehorned her in the Flash rescuing the team in Nanda Parbat simply to have a small crossover that really served no purpose, it made zero sense for the reason that Flash is the fastest man alive and could deal with the entire situation in a few minutes if not seconds; Save the team, stop Ra's and stop the whole league. Plus the show has always prided itself on being grounded, and the fact that there was, in fact, a deleted scene of Katana escaping herself. Kicking the crap out of the League members and saving the team. A scene that would have made more sense given the grounded theme of the show and not have to have a shoehorned Flash scene. They reduced her to needing to be saved when she should have been able to escape herself.

Add link.

Nyssa Raatko Al Ghul - One of the two worst offenses in the show. A lesbian woman. A woman who has clearly been shown to have been training since she was a child. Trained by Ra's Al Ghul, her own admission in S3 episode 4. Trained to torture, however being the Heir to the Demon I really doubt that is the only thing her father taught her or even that he only had her train with one master/mentor.

In the Arrow dossier book that was released recently, it is stated that she trained Sara, so I would think that a lot of the moves that Sara knows Nyssa knows. But we have never seen that. Every time we have seen Nyssa fight it’s no more than a baton twirler. She has been regulated to nothing more than a baton twirling ballerina. Which could be construed as insulting to some women, because that is saying that women can not be that good, or rather that we can not be as good as men.

We have seen brutal fights between Oliver and the male villains but hardly ever between the women and him, most especially him and Nyssa. When she was introduced in S2 it was stated that her skills were supposed to be well matched to Oliver. Yet we never got to see that. She only landed maybe one or two punches and that was it. Yet when he fights the men it always lasts longer and is more brutal. She fended off both Merlyn and Oliver the two best fighters on the show at the same time. But this was brushed off as Oliver was holding back and not going in for the kill. She defeated Merlyn himself in S3 brushed off as everyone has done that, alone; a man that Oliver lost to twice. This was before Oliver was even trained by the League. Now granted the actual fight was a bit lame; bad choreography. However, it canonically happened. She defeated Merlyn and held off Oliver and Merlyn at the same time, and before Merlyn intervened she had the upper hand. but between S2 and 3 she cannot be allowed to beat Oliver once?

She even held her own in the male fight or group fight before she is literally dragged away to be the stand in Talia. Then in the latter half of season three, she gets beat by Oliver/Al Sah-him just so she can be used as a stand in Talia for the blatant Batman Bride/Son of the Demon story ripoff. What is even more horrible about the treatment of Nyssa and her fighting is that they have basically made it that women are weak and emotional and cannot win the fight because of that. Then to make matters worse Nyssa escapes a dungeon she herself admitted she got herself into. At least she can admit to and take the consequences, which is more than can be said of the white hero who walked away after S3 like he had done nothing wrong. then she goes to Oliver and asks her husband for help? All we hear throughout this episode is I cannot beat him and you cannot beat me and you cannot beat him. Nyssa is literally reduced to needing a big strong man/husband to fight for her. A woman is reduced to needing a big strong man to fight her battles for her. Disgusting and sexist. As if a woman cannot be allowed to defeat her own enemy. One she sparred with before and held her own against.

Now it was stated that she had been starved or malnourished in the cell. However, Nyssa herself was the one turning away the food. It is also stated that or explained that she could not defeat Merlyn because of the fact that he had been using the Lazarus Pit because it made him stronger. That doesn't match up with Oliver being able to defeat Ra's as he had been using the Pit for decades, nor should he have been able to defeat Merlyn for the same reason. Instead of letting a lesbian Asian woman( Just say Asian) fight and win her own battles, no we get the white male, husband, and hero taking over and fighting in the place of the weak woman. All for the sake of that he is the hero and too horribly parallel the season one rooftop fight between Merlyn and Oliver.

It was not even a fight Oliver hit him like once or twice and Merlyn went down. They ripped away Nyssa's agency for a crappy attempt at a season one fight rehash. Then after Nyssa becomes after this, instant friends with Oliver, a man who is responsible for the majority of what happened to her. A man who has never shown her any kind of respect.

Now if they are stating that Shado has that level of skill because she is Yao Fei's daughter, and Thea is supposedly that good because she is Oliver's sister and Merlyn's daughter. Then why not have Nyssa be that good since she is Ra's Al Ghul's daughter? Why can’t she be allowed to have that same natural skill? Again her personality and skills are brushed off as being reckless, naive, and with a lot to learn. Her defeat of Merlyn is also brushed off as it’s not that big of a deal since Thea did it, but the fact that Oliver sort of did it is, in fact, a big deal. It’s only a thing if Oliver does it but if a woman does then it’s nothing.

I would like to point out that both Nyssa and Laurel; two women who were considered emotional and reckless, were clear headed enough to see that Thea was not the one responsible for Sara's death. And neither took revenge on her, even though Oliver thought that both emotional women would. Laurel went after Merlyn, the one rightfully responsible, even though she couldn't beat him. Point being she went after the one truly to blame. All the while Oliver put his own personal issues in the way, his ego. When going to rescue a mass murderer, because he could not stand that someone beat him!

Her losses are also brushed off as she is not really a villain. when people are confronted with the fact that she is, in fact, the closest thing to a high-level female villain we have ever gotten. She may be a guest character but so was The Huntress and China White. They were the closest to being the ones to actually beat Oliver. I state this because it was season one and two and that was as close as a brutal fight as we have ever gotten with women. She is a guest star, but so is Merlyn, even in S1 regardless of the fact that he turned out to be the big bad. He was a guest star. All the characters are guest stars! Merlyn I believe it was is when a villain became a regular. Nyssa has been back plenty of times and could very well have been shown to have brutal fights.

Someone once said that it; “Would have been stupid for Oliver’s character to lose to Ra’s daughter” (If this is a direct quote then it needs a source if not then remove the parentheses and the quote doesn't fit with your paragraph. I think you mean something other than what you say. Since he was going to be the Batman stand in Heir to the Demon. Why? Ra’s did not care about Oliver until Nyssa came back to the LOA and told Ra’s that Oliver was protecting Merlyn. He may have been on Ra’s’ radar but in no way did he care. In season 2 Ra’s agenda was only for Sara to return. Since the LOA thought Merlyn was dead until Moria told them otherwise. Ra’s still did not care about Oliver until after the duel because of a prophecy that is utterly illogical. So how would Nyssa defeating Oliver in season 2 or once in the beginning half of season 3 where Ra’s never even cared about Oliver have been stupid?

Edit: Adding the fact that Arrow completely took away Nyssa’s agency in her return during season four. The fight that happened between Oliver and Merlyn should have been between Nyssa and Merlyn. For all the shit that The 100 got for killing off Lexa; the killing your gays trope. They did do one thing right, one thing that Arrow failed at. They gave Lexa agency in her fight with Roan. She specifically states; “I am commander and no one fights for me.”. (needs a source.) Knowing full well she might not be good enough and may die. The writers let her fight her own battle. Arrow went the sexist route and had Nyssa’s big strong husband step in to fight for his weak wife/woman. Making a woman look weak and unable to win her own battles.

All for the sake of that moronic attempt to parallel the season one fight between Oliver and Merlyn; and failing miserably at it. That even takes into account the fact that by letting Oliver fight for her Nyssa would not have really earned the title and probably no one would be loyal to her for that reason. Instead of giving Nyssa the ability to defeat Merlyn, the same natural skill that Oliver has, or even allowing her to have gotten better and then be able to fight and win against either of them. They went the sexist route and made her need a big strong man to help her.

Edit: new point brought by someone else. Apparently, Nyssa could not have been allowed to fight and win her own battles because Oliver is the hero. Apparently, allowing a woman fighter agency, allowing a woman to win for a change would do nothing for the show.

As if they the writers could not come up with a way to have Nyssa and Oliver team up against Merlyn or have Nyssa get The Lotus with Oliver. That it absolutely had to happen the way it did in the episode because it had to be Oliver the one to fight Merlyn and make Nyssa look weak. Apparently, her looking weak, her needing her big strong husband was needed, was necessary in order to keep Merlyn, an overused character around a bit longer.

A character that really serves no purpose throughout the rest of the show. Everything that he has told them could have been learned from Nyssa, a woman who grew up in the LOA. As if keeping Merlyn around for no reason other than the fact that he is played by John Barrowman is a nonsense reason that in no way furthers the story or Oliver. Because the character serves no purpose on the show anymore. He lost his purpose in season three. Edit: Also see the post on the fact that she is not actually Nyssa but in fact Talia.

Edit: ( might be repeating myself) It is stated that, by some fans who love Nyssa and by some who like her and agree that she should be more of a struggle for Oliver in a fight, that the reason that she has lost repeatedly is that she is grieving for Sara, or that she loves Sara so much that she was distracted by it in her in the episode. But can we not see her overcome that? Can we not see her return a better fighter and be able to keep emotions out of it? Because by using that as in excuse it plays into that women are simply emotional and cannot be good fighters because of it. Oliver actually states that in season four to Thea some lecture about men being better fighters being able to keep feelings out of it. Then later Thea is capable of doing so. So why can’t Laurel and Nyssa? Especially if their intent was to make Laurel into her comic counterpart who is a fantastic fighter.

Now Flash did what Arrow was utterly incapable of doing in regards to two villain fighters. They did it with gorillas! The Flash was not part of the actual fight at all. That proves that you can have two side characters fight and not have the main character involved in the fight. But Nyssa can’t be allowed to fight Merlyn and win because Oliver has to be involved.

Nyssa now recently was brought back to ( get this ) fight her sister. In S5 finale. She was actually allowed to fight her own battle ( perhaps a bone tossed at the fans who were upset that she was not allowed to fight her own battle in S4. However note that the person she is allowed to fight on her own is a woman. Also a off hand comment upon returning to the group in S5 when speaking to Merlyn that he “ would try” to cut her throat. But yet no actual fight allowed to happen to prove that off hand hinted comment.

Black Siren- Who in Flash was capable of defeating Flash. She had some martial arts skills. And her powers were extremely powerful and destructive. She is capable of leveling buildings and making ears bleed. It’s stated in Flash that had she kept it up she could have killed Flash. Yet in Arrow, her powers are reduced. Oliver and Felicity survive a close-up attack of her powers with no protection when earlier Curtis himself states that their ear protection is useless. In other words, there is no way that Oliver or Felicity should have survived that, or at least gotten away with no hearing loss. Where was the bleeding of the ears in Arrow? Then when the new Canary shows up? Dinah Drake ( not talking about her character only her powers), her cry is more powerful? They reduced Black Siren's powers in order to make The Arrow look good.

Talia Al Ghul- Now possibly the second worse  female character treated on this show. She is the older sister of Nyssa in this universe. She canonically ( said only, not shown) trained Oliver and the Season 6  villain Prometheus. Also trained by her father Ra's Al ghul . She should we would think be on level with Merlyn or even Oliver. But she was also nerfed in skill. None of these fighting skills she supposedly taught Oliver were ever portrayed. In fact the opposite. She was used for speech only. And the ONLY fight she was for a viewer bait sister fight. And a ridiculously horrible choreographed one at that. This supposed badass female fighter goes down in one or two hits. And that is legit the end of her fighting in the show as of her introduction.

Oliver- Was only trained by Slade for a few months between S1-2, Shado's words. Trained by Shado with the bow before she is killed off. Slade went insane. Yao Fei only taught Oliver that he needed to kill to survive on the island. Nothing more, because he was working ( unwillingly) with the bad guys for the majority of the season, then was killed off. Then Maseo never taught him anything because he was more concerned about keeping Oliver in line and protecting his family. Tatsu hated his guts and only taught him that breathing technique. This is all proven via S3 -4 and now S5 fights. Oliver has gotten his butt kicked by a martial arts guy in a market place in S3. Now if he was trained by Maseo then that guy would never had been an issue. Even Maseo repeatedly kicking the crap out of Oliver for attempting escape.

Had Oliver been extensively trained by Shado or Yao Fei then Maseo would never have been an issue. Then in S4 Oliver gets his ass handed to him by a petty drug dealer. Literally thrown off a building by said drug dealer. As bad as it was to Oliver die hards, it canonically happened. I.E he was not trained very well and if he was trained extensively then he is clearly not as good as people think. Then gets stabbed by Conklin in S4, defeats him but the guy was the same level as Oliver. and Oliver was wounded. Oliver only ever uses the same neck snap move over and over again as if that is the only move he knows. Then most importantly. In S5; the final year of Oliver's journey, Oliver is facing off against Russian thugs. Russian thugs who clearly have no martial skills that we have seen. These guys are literally just throwing nothing more than boxing punches, and lifting Oliver off the ground and slamming him on the ground like WWE people. Even Kovar ( the main flash back baddie.) is not even any kind of special fighter, he is a boxer. And he wiped the floor with Oliver; a man who was supposedly extensively trained by Yao fei, Shado, Slade and Maseo in fighting.

Now if Oliver was then these Russian guys, this Kovar would be nothing. A guy literally walked up behind Oliver and hit him over the head with a gun. Where were the heightened senses? He got gang beat by some Russian guys who did nothing but throw him to the ground and repeatedly kick him. Where was his extensive training then? Oliver walked into a trap in an alleyway and the same thing happened. They threw him up against a wall and then the ground and he got beat up. Where was the fight skill then? The supposed natural skill. Plus Sara, Oliver, Maseo, Merlyn, and Al Owal; all were given brutal, LOA style fighting that proves how great they are. Nyssa has not been given that courtesy.

And now they, the writers/EPs are bringing in Talia Al Ghul or should we say the real Nyssa since they have flipped the back stories. Further proof that they have used Nyssa as a stand in Talia. That they have simply made her Talia. To be Oliver's Flash Back Russian trainer. He will be trained by a former member of the LOA. A woman who is decades old and a warrior, clearly if they are having her train him to fight. So essentially Talia will have given Oliver LOA training, possibly, and he will have then lost to Merlyln later on in S1. Or possibly she will have only taught him some acrobatic moves since in S5 Prometheus used a flip that Oliver learned from Talia. In other words, they are scrambling to explain how Olivier became oh so good in the present since they have failed to explain that in the last 2 seasons.

Add more female characters if can think of any.

What is interesting is that Anarchy, a man beat Oliver twice. We have no idea where he got his skill from, his fighting. Now if we are talking about some people being better than others, having natural skill, then anarchy's defeat of Oliver should have never been questioned. It should have been accepted as someone having natural Skill and simply being better than the hero. However, it was fixed quickly. Why, because die-hard Oliver fans complained that this guy cannot be allowed to beat Oliver; a man who was trained by Ra's and the LOA, Oliver beat Ra's, Oliver has X amount of years of experience and training. Then the actor has a talk with the Eps and the next time we see the two together Oliver throws him into a wall or some such like Oliver is on steroids. This is interesting to me because the Stunt Coordinator James Bamford went so far as to state that some people are just better than others. I mean Anarchy's fighting could very well be construed as natural skill. It’s interesting that when it involves a man's fighting and losing, then if people complain then it’s adjusted and fixed because we cannot have a man/hero lose. But when it concerns a woman, then it is simply brushed off as she cannot possibly be that good. Or that she is simply not on that level.

I would like to point out that a few of these women have also faced off against Slades Mirakuru soldiers. It was not just Oliver that did that. Nyssa, Sara and arguably Laurel. In fact given Sara's LOA background she should have been able to hold her ground against Super Slade; in the lair when Oliver fights with her escrima sticks. Given that she has way more training than him.

The only ones on the show who have been canonically allowed to beat Oliver have always been men; Slade, Merlyn, Damien Darhk, Ra's and Prometheus.

S1 - Merlyn.

S2 - Slade Wilson.

S3 - Ra's Al Ghul. (For a unoriginal batman ripoff.)

S4 - Damien Darhk.

S5 - Prometheus.

Even the Flash. Though I would like to state that it is about time they acknowledged this fact. There is no way that Oliver would have defeated Flash. There were a few instances where Oliver would have lost both his arms in that first fight, dislocation or broken.

It was stated in the S5 crossover that Flash has in fact canonically beat Oliver. The following. Oliver Queen AkA Green Arrow has canonically lost to the Flash in a fight. He never once beat Flash. The first fight in the S3 crossover was a tie. The second fight when Oliver challenged him to see who would win, Oliver lost.

As per the S5 crossover bar scene. Legends episode 2x07   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cCp82DaAfPg 

Oliver: “I’m just saying next time I’m going to get you.”

Barry: “I’m just saying I beat you twice.”

Oliver: “The first was a tie.”

Barry, while smirking : “ And the second?”

Oliver: “There were no witnesses.”

The closest thing we have ever gotten to a high-level female villain has been Nyssa. Being the daughter of the demon. But she was simply not allowed to be on their level because she is a woman and emotional. It is also worth noting that in S6 currently we have yet again a male big bad, a man by the name of Richard Dragon. All this after the Eps claim they were all for a female big bad and were planning one.

We could have had one or two female main Villains.

Nyssa is an obvious one; They could have actually adapted Nyssa’s comic storyline, leaving out the craziness. Hell Sara was dating the daughter of the demon, the heir they could have gone with that she was dating Ra’s herself. Instead of running from Ra’s and the LOA; leaving behind the daughter, it could have been Sara running from the girlfriend who was the leader. Actually made her more like her comic counterpart. Perhaps instead of ripping off and copying The Bride of the Demon storyline. They could have had Ra’s and Oliver team up against Nyssa since the writers were already adamant about ripping off Batman’s story or have Nyssa be the main big bad and only keep the allusion to Ra’s, have her be the second in command. Or last and even better have her be Ra’s like her comic counterpart, and Oliver had to face and defeat her, and kept the crazy bit and left out the part about her being a lesbian. (I only say that; her not being a lesbian in this situation, as a way to make her the bad guy without doing the crazy lesbian trope like they did on Battlestar Galactica.)

Talia that they are bringing in(Reword this and update it as the season has ended.), granted it’s possible that she will turn out to be the one behind or rather responsible for Prometheus, maybe manipulating whoever Prometheus really is into fighting Oliver, using X person’s rage. Maybe to get back at Oliver for Ra’s death. In which case it will be a rip off of The Dark Knight Rises.

There is also Shado they could have used instead of using her, a badass fighter, as a prop to fulfill some lame “choice” arc to then make Slade go crazy. All they had to do was leave out the “rape” part of her Arrow comic story.

China White a main bad guy.

Huntress a main bad guy. There are female villains, in Huntress situation, a comic anti hero perhaps, but a villain on the show. It could have been done but they refused to try.

Isabel Rochev (need more on her)

They could have used Slade’s daughter, the real ravager.

Actually made Waller a main threat. Imagine Oliver having to face off against the Wall as a main bad guy. Take everything they tried to do in the flashbacks with her and him and put it in the present. Added into that the stuff with her and him in the present. No woman has been allowed to defeat Oliver. Because the trend has always been women are weaker than men in fighting. It has also been stated that he has to win because he is the title character, or because he is the hero.

That is nonsense. Because Flash and Supergirl has also constantly lost fights to lesser level villains. It has nothing to do with being the title character. Even Daredevil on Netflix has lost to lesser/lower level villains or rather been bested for a time. He even lost a sparring match to Electra.

Supergirl lost to:

Voltrox.

Banshee.

She lost to the alien in the fight ring.

Sort of against Bizzaro.

Sort of to Indigo.

Alex if you think of her as the bad guy when she was controlled, and she wiped the floor with Supergirl in training and she is not the main.

Flash has lost to:

Cold and Heatwave. (When they tag teamed him)

Cold by himself.

Girder. (The steel guy.)

Cold, Heatwave, Weather Wizard, and Deathbolt. (When They tag teamed him.) All of those being low-level villains.

In conclusion, the writers have used women as fools and weaklings. Their inability to fight is either brushed off as them being not as good,  Not on the others level or not having natural skills (you don’t need parentheses). Or if a woman like Nyssa or China White gets close to beating Oliver it gets brushed off again as he was not trying or he was holding back or it was a fluke. In the case of Nyssa and even Laurel, its brushed off as simply a woman who is emotional. As if women cannot be as good as or better than a man because they are weaker and emotional. Which is the repeated trend on Arrow. Not to mention sexist. Further proof is that we have never been given a female villain, big bad female villain. We have never seen a woman be able to defeat Oliver and there be nothing he can do about it. Like with Ra's. Oliver lost to him twice, technically 3 times since that last battle was ridiculous since Oliver was on his knees and beaten, and only defeated Ra's by using the same trick that he used on him. Oliver admitted that he couldn't beat Ra's. But then with the power of love managed to use the same trick on him.