#ecological culls

[clocks-divorcing-ticks]

(TW: Mention of animal cruelty) Is it OK to ask about kangaroo shooting? Kangaroos do seem to be the Australian ecosystem's equivalent of deer (in the northern hemisphere), have always had nonhuman predators, and of course First Nations people traditionally hunt them, and have been doing so for ~65000 years. But what do you think of Ray Mjadwesch's work? He claims that roo shooting isn't sustainable, that kangaroos are threatened and that their populations cannot increase by more than 12% a year. But his work doesn't seem to be peer-reviewed, he's associated with the animal rights movement and claims that the roo shooting industry have bought the official science on kangaroo populations like with fossil fuels and tobacco (both *far* bigger and more powerful industries). The only peer-reviewed article I can find supporting his contention is in the Animal Studies Journal, which is seemingly animal rights-centric rather than focusing on zoology or ecology. I've seen reports on the ABC about genuine animal cruelty by roo shooters, such as leaving joeys to starve after killing their mothers, when they're supposed to kill the joeys and try not to hunt females with large joeys. This could be dealt with in a similar way to cruelty to farm animals (e.g. in abattoirs)? But there seems to be a growing taboo among some people against *ever* killing kangaroos, considering it to be inherently cruel and wrong, that could be broadly adopted by society in general/ imposed on people who don't share it, likely ultimately affecting Indigenous people. The US is considering banning kangaroo meat and leather, for instance. Could this turn out similar to the Canadian seal hunt situation?

I think you've largely answered your own question in terms of the credibility of non peer reviewed science. You can hold it against the enormous body of peer reviewed science that talks about kangaroos (specifically eastern greys and reds) being overabundant and the reasons why (clear-felling and the creation of permanent water bodies for agriculture, removal of predation, their ability to prolifically breed, harvesting rules biasing the sex ratio of populations, etc). You will also see in literature on other actually endangered native species, or in their associated Action Plans, overabundant kangaroos being listed as a key threat to their conservation. The Australian landscape pre-colonisation was never capable of producing such an abundance of kangaroos, and it certainly isn't capable of sustaining it now. The thing is, anti-culling activists will never be satisfied by it. It's a matter of ideological differences. I absolutely understand the emotional argument. I used to be a staunch advocate against culling when I was younger. I remember walking into a lecture during undergrad on the overabundance of native species absolutely adamant that nothing said in that room could make me pro-culling. The weight of scientific evidence that supports it being the most humane thing to do was overwhelming. I walked out of that room knowing two things: one that ecological culls are important in managing healthy ecosystems, and two that I was capable of changing deep-seated ideals when presented with evidence. Not everyone is capable of the latter.

I'd love to take some of the activists to our field sites and show them what an overabundant population looks like. Teach them to recognise the signs of lumpy jaw, intestinal parasites, and the many other signs of starvation and disease that runs rife through these overcrowded mobs. It's truly horrifying to witness a population of thousands of slowly dying kangaroos against the backdrop of a dying landscape.

For many people, they would rather believe that no animal has to die and will staunchly advocate against both ecological culls and hunting. Not just for kangaroos. Here in Australia we see similar very emotional arguments against culling koalas and (feral) brumbies. While they believe they are saving animal lives, the result is that many of them die slow, awful deaths. Meantime many other unseen native animals are driven to extinction from the resultant land degradation (erosion, biodiversity loss, extinction of native flora, etc).

If an export ban happens, it would not be the first time a ban has been placed on kangaroo products abroad. And probably not the last. We dance this dance constantly. All we can do is try to present the science and the evidence, try to get better at communicating with the public, and hope that the governmental bodies in charge of these decisions actually listen to the science.

The worst part of being an ecologist is that part of your job is deciding which animals get to die. Something that came as an absolute shock to this starry-eyed girl with dreams of saving every animal. The reality is that sometimes to save a species, another has to die. Maybe it's because there's not the budget or the habitat or the public willingness to save both, and other times it's because one species is causing ecological damage. In this case it's the ugly reality that removing a few million roos, joeys and all, is imperative in the fight to save the fragile ecosystems we have left.

[moralomnivore]

You already know it's wrong to kill animals for pleasure.

If you can access, afford, and safely consume the equivalent nutrition in plant foods, any meat you eat is from an animal killed for your pleasure.

[plethoraworldatlas]

Dustin against Anti-wolf Hate

A wonderful commission from the great @magicratfingers!

They recently did a experimental test run on doing commissions and I snagged a spot and couldn't be happier with the experience and art! Lovely style, good communication, and quick completion; I'd love to do it again!

Check them out! They got tons of amazing things and little comics; Werewolf Regency House Party (how I found them!), spectacular Dimension 20 fanart, lovely Orc art, nice one-off comics, and more!

[asaxophony]

I love the insect pinning subreddit absolutely full of people going holy shit you killed that bug to pin!!!!!!!! That's fucking evil. What did you expect Jane. You want them to pin it alive like Jesus on the cross.

[lesbiansandgayssupporttheminers]

Been reading a bit about the idea of introducing lynx to Scotland, to help control the red deer population. And, to be clear, something needs to be done, about the red deer.

Lynx aren’t really native to Scotland, they haven’t lived on the British Isles since the Mesolithic. And there are really concerns that they’d negatively impact other endangered native species, such as pine marten and Scottish wild cats (more so than wolves).

Eurasian lynx are likely to kill sheep, especially given the way sheep are usually kept in Scotland (similar to Norway, where Lynx very often take sheep). They can, potentially, kill young cattle too, although this is rarer.

BUT

People have a strong emotive reaction to wolves. Lots of people are really scared of the idea of reintroducing wolves, because they fear attacks on humans.

So there’s definitely a school of thought that lynx are the way to go.

I don’t know what the right answer is- there may not be enough habitat left for either, anyway. But the numbers of deer needing to be culled is going up and up, and it’s clear a solution of some kind (beyond just shooting deer) is needed. 

And I know that irrational responses of the people who live there need to be taken into account.

[beeapocalypse]

torn between making ve-corpsis an isolated island (potential fun to be had with island syndrome and the way that would effect the wildlife in terms of less biodiversity+island gigantism/dwarfism) or making it a massive rainforest (humidity would better suit the drakes and theres a lot to be done with the Massive amounts of biodiversity+the idea of drakes having to compete w that). coughs

[hoofpeet]

Lady and her calf, Derby, circa 1998 🐄

Went down a rabbithole reading about Enderby Island cattle earlier so..... This is currently the rarest breed in the world flat out- with only ~27 existing as of 2019 (Supposedly, since it's a little hard to find any info on these guys)

Enderby island cattle existed in the mid 90's as an isolated herd living on Enderby island, off the coast of NZ. They were culled down from a herd of about 50 (to conserve native flora) until Lady was the only one left from the original herd-- after which she was transported to mainland New Zealand and artificially inseminated to produce Derby.

After this a handful of enderby cattle were cloned to bring the population up to ~27, with ongoing conservation efforts. The most recent reference I can find to an extant population is from an NZ Journal of Ecology article published in 2022 so. Make of that what you will 👍

[fagcrisis]

cars are the result of unethical crossbreeding of bicycles and buses

oh my god im so sorry i forgot to respond to this. cars are actually an invasive species they have their ecological niche theyve filled but theyve not been responsibly culled and they r now actually threatening smaller species like bicycles! theyre not actually similar species i dont think, bicycles are insects

[lsdoiphin]

Hares, as you may already know if you've been following my better half @broncoburro or @forevergoldgame (if you're following neither, you're missing huge amounts of context for the setting!), are nothing like the hares of the real world. They are massive leporids from Northern Vestur and one of the few meurian animals remaining after a historic event known as the Great Hunt where humans wiped out most of the planet's remaining meurian species in order to harvest their meur for relics about 350~ish years ago. They are obligate carnivores and known to hunt humans when the opportunity arises.

The baku is a large, lumbering omnivore with a similar ecological niche somewhere between a panda and a regular bear. They're a rare species, endemic to a single far-flung region of the world, having only just barely escaped extinction. See, while the Great Hunt was headed and funded by the Tri-Kingdom, its reach spanned the entire known world - but the further from Vestur it travelled, the less discriminatory the hunts became. The local peoples who were paid to hunt on the Tri-Kingdom's behalf had little idea of what meur was and what meurian animals were actually useful, leading to mass to mass culling of "useless" meur-touched animals like the baku, whose unusual sleep-inducing abilities cannot be wielded by humans. Regardless of their uselessness, the damage had been done to the species, and only the mundane offshoot survives - though rumors persist about meurian baku.

Sphinxes are scavengers that can be found across the deserts and savannas of the mainland. Unlike their meurian cousin, the manticore, they never evolved meurian flame breath, and their 'stinger' is no more than a vestigial sickle buried beneath the fur of their flowing tails. Instead, they specialized further into human mimicry, using their ability to copy human speech to hunt domesticated animals, naive children, and drunkards.

Now you might be thinking: "why would a teenage girl want to own any of these as pets? None of these sound like animals that should be pets." Well, first off: you'd be hard pressed to find a young girl that doesn't want a wolf or a tiger as a pet, that's just how they are, c'mon.

Second, there are three primary reasons Rhea thinks this is a more realistic idea than it is:

Exotic "pet" owners among the upper class: While exotic pet ownership isn't big in Vestur as a whole, it has a notable presence among the Southern upper class, both noble and common. Rhea is the duchess of the Southern Kingdom so she is well aware of every instance of somebody paying excessive amounts of guilder to import something they shouldn't and stick it in their courtyard. As I've mentioned before, this is a sin Ancha is guilty of, having gotten swept up in a past "teacup baku" craze/scam some 4 decades ago. Unlike her peers, however, she kept her baku, Fig, even after he outgrew his alleged "adult size" of 1'9" at the withers. Others culled theirs once they became large enough to cause mass property damage. Ancha knows Fig is a massive, terrifying wild animal and does not recommend anyone repeat her mistake, but being raised in captivity he cannot be returned to the wild and so she's committed to caring for him for as long of his estimated 70~ish year lifespan that she's here for.

Haretouched Northerners: The "haretouched" is a strange phenomenon that exists in the North. Now, we haven't posted a formal explanation of what exactly being haretouched means yet - I'll save that explanation for Dan to write at a later date. In the meantime, to very briefly summarize what it means: occasionally, a hare will bond with a specific human. Those who have bonded to a hare are said to be "haretouched" - or more bluntly, cursed. The haretouched are treated as pariahs by broader society, though they are begrudgingly tolerated in the North itself and destigmatized by Northern nomad clans. While Northern nobility has done its best to keep the haretouched out of their bloodlines (save for the Lord of the Nomads, who is seldom acknolwedged, much less counted), occasionally a fluke will occur regardless and you end up with someone like Quincy or Lamonte. Rhea, of course, is just a Southern bystander who thinks the idea of having a murder-bunny for a friend would kick ass.

Captive beasts performing in circuses: Self-explanatory. Sphinxes especially are a popular choice for exploitative entertainment because of their mimicry abilities, and are often trained to have "conversations" or "sing."

[mixotrophics]

forcing ecology to conform to human squeamishness -- a source of continuing harm

image source - SCOTLAND: the big picture

rewilding -- you may have heard of it. Letting native species (or similar enough ones) do their thing. Bringing back locally-extinct species. letting life, Live but part of nature is also death. Decay. Rot. Blood, gore. Fungus. Maggots. Death breaks apart the Body and lets its nutrients, borrowed during life, re-enter the cycles and nourish more life.

I've heard of a term, I think it was re-dead-ing, but cannot find the post... I do see, now, Death Gives Life , referring to the same thing.

we (broadly) are disgusted by the presence of death. 'Dead stock' -- dead animals, dead plants, so on -- are often removed from the scenery in places like the UK(1). This is often done in the name of disease control, with the idea that dead bodies in nature cause disease(1) even though the work of scavengers & decomposers clear up the germs(2) , -- main concern is, if the animal was very sick before it dies, its carcass may carry that disease. But that is not a corpse problem, that is an animal health problem, which lays in problems like artificially high & concentrated populations (e.g. deer, chronic wasting disease). Just keep them away from waterways and livestock, probably(3).

The carcass(of tree and animal alike) is a node of concentrated nutrients. When left in place, those nutrients return from the ecology from which they came. When the carcass is taken away, those nutrients are gone elsewhere(3). And now, detached from the life that has mechanisms to eat-rot(2), we humans have to do something with it. Like with manure, compartmentalizing these "wastes" away from growing life turns them into a problem(4).

Fallen trees & rotting meat are the homes for so many species, sometimes species only raising their young at particular stages or specializing to particular parts -- fur, bones, meat, bark(2). disallowing the dead & rotting from resting where they lay where we can see&smell them, is disallowing these species to find a place to live.

image source - ARK Rewilding Netherlands

& it's not just bugs. Think vultures, Think scavenger-mammals(2) ; Not only these, but predators fill up on already-dead meat, allowing endangered prey like the capercaillie to nest successfully(3).

and "cleaning up" this "ugly thing" that is the dead may deprive animals of their chance to mourn(1). Not all animals do -- many don't care much, many eat their own babies -- but some do and they should be given that chance.

...

greenwashed environmentalism thrives on the beauty of nature, operating in very narrow definitions of beauty and what is correct ... mud, rot, death, disease, bugs, stench, shit, these are all fundamental aspects of the inbuilt reciprocity+interconnectedness of being alive, and things we reject at the peril of so much.

image source - How death gives life

to all dead things: we, the living, love you, and thank you for giving back to the natural community at the end of your time with us. If only such ideas were not so opposed in the current era.

...

1 ) King, S. How death gives life. Rewilding Britain, 2023. 2 ) Beekers, B.; Meertens, H.; Reiniers, K.; Helmer, W.; Colijn, E.; Krawczynski, R.; and Meissner, R.; trans. Righart, A.; and Allen, D. Circle of life: A new way to support Europe's scavengers. Rewilding Europe & ARK Nature, 2017. 3 ) Ferraro, K. M.; and Hirst, C. Missing carcasses, lost nutrients: Quantifying nutrient losses from deer culling practices in Scotland. Ecological Solutions and Evidence 5(3), 2024. 4 ) Moore Lappé, F.; and Collins, J. World Hunger: 10 Myths. 2015.

[johannestevans]

watched lovely dark and deep and i'm so grumpy about it

it's important not to overexplain a horror concept because overexplaining or providing too much information can end up removing the fear aspect from your premise

but here it's just like. ok. why would she do that though

if she doesn't want to shoot someone in order to escape, why would she just stay in the woods and let it continue to keep other people? are we to assume that killing a deer is equivalent to a human life - and if so… what about many areas of wilderness, where hunting is permitted? what about the fact that most national parks do allow for some animal death even if not hunting, like necessary deer culling?

especially because this story is explicitly linking itself to and referencing the reddit SAR series and separately paulides' missing 411 work, it seems absolutely absurd to me for the story here to take the premise that the rules of the national park are somehow according to a spiritual law or practice or whatever set by "them" rather than a human thing put on signs to remind people not to litter or to accidentally cause damage to ecosystems within the parks

the problem with some of these films is that they're very attached to a white american's idea of ecology and particularly to like. nature-based spiritualism

and subsequently it ends up like "WELL IF YOU KILL AN ANIMAL… THE FOREST WILL KILL YOU BACK… LAW OF NATURE…" and it's like. no, animals die. humans die. death is fine and normal. humans are part of the broader ecosystem.

if you want as a storyteller to ascribe a higher meaning to humans dying or humans killing, you have to do it for a purpose or with some sort of reasoning in mind - trespassing, spilling blood on specific, sacred ground (not large swathes of wilderness), attach a reason as to why humans are more important than any other animal, particularly any other predator or hunter

because otherwise you end up with this fucking nonsense that's like "mmm mother earth wants us to go vegan because she feels bad for the deer <3" and it's absolutely fucking facile.

[3liza]

the most humane, realistic thing to do about the feral cat problem would be massive, targeted culling using methods that cause the least amount of suffering and collateral damage, ie, very skilled hunters with adequate firepower and good aim. the most humane, pie in the sky thing to do would be mass trapping and relocation programs that took extant ferals to escape-proof colonies that controlled pregnancy through oral birth control and allowed the ferals to live out their natural lives being fed and sheltered without reproducing. this would still require culling any escapees that missed the sweep or got loose from the colonies. option A seems to be working in some island environments, notably Dirk Hartog Island in Australia. option B isnt actually possible with the level of backing that ecology projects have anywhere in the world rn.

owning and loving animals means being responsible for controlling their population and health, which includes administering culling and euthanasia as necessary. there is no alternative to this. humans made domestic cats into the incredibly resilient, successful animals they are today, and now they're our joy and our responsibility. allowing cats to eat and kill their way through indigenous ecosystems isn't ethical and results in significantly more suffering than controlling the cat population. that's just the math of this issue and you cannot argue against it.

part of the issue that is rarely addressed even by leftists is that domestic cat predation is also a colonial effect that destroys the livelihoods and land of indigenous people occupied by European settlers, who brought our cats with us. this isn't true everywhere in the world, domestic cats didn't originate in Europe after all, but it is very true in places like the Americas and Australia.

[plethoraworldatlas]

The Center for Biological Diversity filed a lawsuit today challenging the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service’s decision to classify the world’s last wild population of red wolves as ‘nonessential.’

The red wolf is listed as endangered under the Endangered Species Act and is among the most imperiled species in the world. Just 13 known wild red wolves survive in eastern North Carolina.

“It’s absurd for the Fish and Wildlife Service to conclude that the world’s last wild population of red wolves isn’t essential,” said Perrin de Jong, Southeast staff attorney at the Center. “It’s time for the agency to acknowledge that this persecuted population of endangered wolves is an irreplaceable part of Southeastern ecosystems. These severely imperiled animals deserve the highest level of protection.”

Today’s lawsuit, filed in the U.S. District Court for the Eastern District of North Carolina, notes that the Endangered Species Act defines an experimental population as ‘essential’ if the loss of the population would significantly reduce the likelihood of the species’ survival in the wild. Because the red wolf experimental population is the only wild population of the species, its loss would eliminate the species from the wild.

The law therefore compels the Service to designate the population as ‘essential’ and provide greater protections to the red wolves, the suit notes.

[alliswyattonthewesternfront]

idk how people in my life keep being surprised by the fact i am an environmentalist first and an animal lover second. we should cull the feral cats, dogs, mustangs, declare open season on deer, and reintroduce natural predators to the environment. sorry that y'all love ecological devastation but i'm built different

[cyberbun]

someone should start culling the toskaclones they're causing ecological harm

Let them breed.

[cyliph]

(Old art from 2021)

Flara - (Semi) Sentient Race

A curious and noble race pulled forcefully from their homeworld: the arctic planet of Guep. They have a unique ability to adapt to new ecological niches in as little as a single generation, which has lead to their quick rebound following the red sun collapse. Once among the most detested races, their vital role in the Reconstruction has garnered much respect in other sentient races.

More info below the cut (its a long one)

HISTORY

Flara were among the most disdained of all sentient species prior to the red sun collapse. Only a handful of the eight recognized sub-types were considered "sentient" by legal standards. They originated from the arctic environment of Guep where they survived in deep burrows and hunted at night. The Flaran genetic code is unique and have the internalized ability to adapt to almost any environment from generation to generation, suggesting that their home world had experienced significant and rapid climate shift through their evolutionary history.

They were initially pulled from their home environment to be used as slave workers by the Kokonic, but their ability to do seemingly the reverse of learning lead to a rapid culling. This extermination effort however lead to the spontaneous morphing of juveniles in to a form that was able to board ships undetected, causing even more havoc. This new morph is called the Basal morph (pictured, teal) and is still common today.

In fact, every subsequent attempt to drive the species to extinction has lead to a new sub-type of Flara. Studies of Flara genetics seem to estimate that there is potential for over 72 sub-types. After the discovery of the massive "Goliath" sub-type the offending individuals were promptly isolated for the public's safety and it was agreed to never attempt Flara eradication again. This agreement is often a term in treaties even after the collapse as a form of skeuomorph.

Flara are able to achieve these sub-types due to their unique metamorphosis. As an adolescent, environmental triggers and the presence of other Flara determine which morph the young adult will become.

Flara are not obligated to wear apparel though many do. They likewise seem to have only a minimal grasp on language, tool-use, and cause and effect despite their competency in modern culture.

An interesting trait of the Flara is that if they see another Flaran individual of their morph in anything perceived to be a house, room, or den that is not their partner or immediate offspring they will simply forget all about the non-related individuals present in the housing and feel compelled to walk away. This has lead to much difficulty employing Flara as if any other individual is seen in their working "space" they will forget all memories associated with that space and the individual seen. This is speculated to be an adapted behavior to prevent inter-species violence.

Before the collapse a type of population control was enforced across many territories to promote "lawful marriage" in more competent Flara types. Under this guise couples are encouraged to seek a marriage license before reproducing. On seeing the receptionist they will forget about marriage and continue about their day.

Flara do not recognize other sub-types as their own kin, with the exception of eggs they witness hatch. Any Flara that witnesses any egg hatch will classify the newborn as "immediate offspring". Flaran eggs have a short incubated time of anywhere from 1.5 to 3 weeks, where both parents will remain in a unique vigilant state.

PHYSICAL

Flara possess a scaled hide and bipedal posture, as well as a long tail. Digits vary by sub-type, but are commonly flattened with diminutive toes. They possess forward facing eyes and sensory organs located at the side of their muzzle. Typical scale colorations include, from most common to rare: black, navy, blue, yellow, green, red, gray, white, orange, and iridescent purple. Bold black stripes (or in the case of yellow coloration-red) are common in individuals with less stable access to food. Eye color varies by sub-type.

SUB-TYPES

NEOBASAL MORPH (Pictured, dark purple)

Considered the smallest of all Flara types but no one is willing to test that theory. Was observed after the second extermination attempt following the discovery of the basal morph. They have limited thinking processes and are very small to the point of becoming pests on ships living a primarily insectivorous diet. They are frequently used as subjects in lab settings.

BASAL MORPH (Pictured, teal)

The first discovered morph following the first extermination attempt on the Flara race. The basal morph is the most common Flara sub-type and holds limited ability for language and complex thought. They have loose flesh around their neck and this is believed to be a holdover from an ancestral species and not actually serve an adaptational advantage.

NEOFLARA MORPH (I had a picture, but apparently i didn't upload it)

A sub-type that originated from another independent extinction attempt on the Guebmorph. It seems to hold slightly higher intellectual capacity than the Guebmorph and is notably smaller and thinner framed. This species only possesses the black, blue, and purple coloration.

GUEBMORPH (Pictured, yellow)

Believed to be the original Flaran morph at the time of outside intervention. Adapted to an opportunistic hunting lifestyle. Guebmorphs are also the only Flaran sub-type to hold on to the original language "Guebian" which is a series of gutteral bellows and whistles. It is unique language in that the meaning of words varies with volume.

SSIRAMORPH

The only quadrepedal Flara sub-type. It had a notably extended torso, excess skin around the neck, and limbs adapted to digging. No organized extinction event is known to have created this subtype. The most common theory believed it was an attempt by villagers of Ssira to eliminate Flara from their planet.

GOLIATH MORPH

A large morph created from localized extinction efforts. Assumed extinct followed the red sun collapse.