#dndnext

[cabbagefaeriealt]

comm for @/JustADarkVesper on twitter

[nerdsdaycomic]

EP. 140 ATTACK

The fight with the Chicken Legged Pizza Oven rages on and it seems like our martial boys are finally starting to get the hang of things

[melancholia-ennui]

Well, that was all a bit stressful. Anyway, with the worst out of the way, I want to do something D&D related that's just a little silly, you know, as a treat. So anyway here's three silly "that's one of the 5e things of all time"s.

Casting Time Rules

Starting it off strong we have the slightly absurd contortions that come out of the rules around casting times. As a reminder, the text of the relevant rule is as follows (my emphasis):

A spell cast with a bonus action is especially swift. You must use a bonus action on your turn to cast the spell, provided that you haven't already taken a bonus action this turn. You can't cast another spell during the same turn, except for a cantrip with a casting time of 1 action.

Now, in the most common scenario of a bonus action levelled spell (either one with a base casting time of a bonus action, like spiritual weapon, or one that gains a bonus action casting time through an effect like the Sorcerer's Metamagic), this rule is fairly intuitive and works kind of how you would expect: if you use Metamagic to cast fireball as a bonus action, you can't cast a second fireball with your full action, but only a cantrip.

It gets a little strange when you consider cantrips with a casting time of a bonus action, such as shillelagh. In this case, even though all you cast was a cantrip, you still can't use your action to cast a leveled spell - so no shillelagh followed by call lightning.

This is especially bizarre when we consider the Metamagic Quickened Spell, because as a result of the way the rule is written, if you want to cast the same two spells on your turn, that may be allowed or banned based on which spell is affected by the Metamagic.

Consider a 5th level Sorcerer. On your turn, you want to cast both fireball and fire bolt, so you choose to use Quickened Spell. If you Quicken the fireball, then you can still cast the fire bolt - but if you Quicken the fire bolt, you can no longer cast fireball that turn!

This gets even stranger when we consider the fact that spells with Reaction casting times exist, and these can be triggered on your turn (for example, casting Shield to protect against an opportunity attacks triggered by your own movement). Reaction casting times have no limits on the spells you can cast during the same turn, but they are still subject to the limits of bonus action casting times - which means during any turn you cast a spell as a bonus action, you cannot cast spells as reactions that turn. This seems very strange, given reaction spells are meant to be faster than full action spells, but while you can do the latter with a bonus action spell (if it's a cantrip), you can't ever do the former with a bonus action spell!

Notably, however, this all only applies during the same turn - all such restrictions are off the moment the next creature starts its turn.

This also has interesting interactions with the Ready action. Now, intuitively, you would expect that given all these restrictions only apply on your turn, and the whole point of Ready is to take an action outside of your turn, they shouldn't apply to a readied spell, right?

Wrong! Let's take a look at the spell section of the Ready action (my emphasis):

When you ready a spell, you cast it as normal but hold its energy, which you release with your reaction when the trigger occurs. To be readied, a spell must have a casting time of 1 action, and holding onto the spell's magic requires concentration. If your concentration is broken, the spell dissipates without taking effect.

Because the Ready action specifically states that you "cast [the spell] as normal" when you take the action, and the bonus action casting time restrictions applies to all spells cast on your turn, any spell you Ready must also abied by the bonus action spell restrictions! (I.e., if you cast a spell as a bonus action, you can only prepare a 1 action cantrip if you take the Ready action that turn.)

As a side note, it's also worth noting that you can't Ready a bonus action spell - only spells with a casting time of 1 action can be readied. So again, even though bonus action spells are supposed to be quicker, it's apparently easier to prepare a release a full action spell than a bonus action one, at least as far as Ready is concerned!

Multiattack vs. Extra Attack

Now, you would think that Multiattack is basically just the monster equivalent of the PC's Extra Attack feature, and at one level you would be correct - monsters with class levels typically use Multiattack to repent Extra Attack. However, there are a number of important differences between Multiattack and Extra Attack, some more intuitive than others.

Firstly, let's start with a summary of the two features. The basic text of the Extra Attack feature runs as follows, with slight variations in the Fighter class and Bladesinging subclass:

Extra Attack. Beginning at 5th level, you can attack twice, instead of once, whenever you take the Attack action on your turn.

For contrast, let's look at the adult blue dragon Multiattack:

Multiattack. The dragon can use its Frightful Presence. It then makes three attacks: one with its bite and two with its claws.

Now, a few differences immediately stand out which seem to just make sense when we consider one feature is for PCs and the other is for monsters.

Firstly, with the exception of the Bladesinging Extra Attack feature, Extra Attack only ever let's you make additional attacks, while Multiattack features can and often do involve the use of features that aren't attacks (in this example, the dragon's Frightful Presence ability).

Secondly, Extra Attack allows you to use whatever weapons you like to make your additional attacks, while Multiattack attack features often specify what kinds of attack you're making. When it comes to running monsters, this makes a fair bit of sense (see the dragon above - it makes sense the dragon gets more claw attacks than bite attacks, because it only has one mouth but many claws), but it starts to get a little silly when we consider NPC statblocks. For example, the Champion NPC has the following action text:

Multiattack. The champion makes three Greatsword or Shortbow attacks.

Now because this text specifies that the attacks must be made with a Greatsword or Shortbow, if you somehow managed to disarm the champion and they were forced to use another weapon (either improvised or acquired by some means), if that weapon wasn't exactly a Greatsword or Shortbow, that champion would now only be able to make one attack per round!

This is already pretty silly, but trust me, it gets sillier.

For one, Extra Attack counts as using the Attack action, but Multiattack does not - Multiattack is its own action. Now as far as I'm aware that aren't any effects which trigger when another creature takes the Attack action (as opposed to simply triggering when they make an attack), so presently this doesn't cause any issues - but it should be noted that RAW a monster with Multiattack can't benefit from features like the Polearm Master feat when using Multiattack. (Of course, you wouldn't normally just give a monster a feat in exactly the same way and wording a PC would have the feat, so this weird interaction should never come up, but it's interesting nonetheless.)

Then we get to my favourite interaction, which is how Extra Attack and Multiattack differ when making attacks off-turn.

As noted above, the text of Extra Attack explicitly refers to taking the Attack action on your turn; as such, if you Ready an Attack action to take on another creature's turn, you do but gain the benefits of Extra Attack for that readied action. Similarly, you do not gain the benefits of Extra Attack when making an opportunity attack, as this special reaction does not involve taking the Attack action.

Multiattack is the same as Extra Attack when it comes to opportunity attacks - you can't take the Multiattack action as your opportunity attack unless a specific feature or ability allows you to do so. However, it works differently when it comes to the Ready action: because Multiattack is an action in its own right, and not a modification applied to the Attack action on your turn, a monster can choose to Ready a Multiattack action - and if it does so, it will make all of its attacks when that action resolves. Thus, Multiattack does let you make multiple attacks off-turn, while Extra Attack does not.

Lucky

OK, this one's kinda easy mode, I know that, but it's still one of my favourite silly parts of 5e (and a major reason why I often modify Lucky at my own tables). For those fortunate souls unfamiliar with this abomination of a feat, the Lucky feat reads as follows:

You have 3 luck points. Whenever you make an attack roll, an ability check, or a saving throw, you can spend one luck point to roll an additional d20. You can choose to spend one of your luck points after you roll the die, but before the outcome is determined. You choose which of the d20s is used for the attack roll, ability check, or saving throw.

You can also spend one luck point when an attack roll is made against you. Roll a d20 and then choose whether the attack uses the attacker's roll or yours.

If more than one creature spends a luck point to influence the outcome of a roll, the points cancel each other out; no additional dice are rolled.

You regain your expended luck points when you finish a long rest.

Now we all know how this is meant to work - it lets you get a do-over when you roll a check, three times per day. All well and good.

The problem comes when you combine this feature with Disadvantage. In this case, you would normally roll 2 dice and take the lowest. Lucky lets you roll an additional dice, but it also lets you choose which of the dice you want to use. As a result, using a Luck point when you have disadvantage takes you from rolling 2d20 and keeping the lowest to rolling 3d20 and keeping whichever roll you want, including the higher of the two dice you rolled for Disadvantage!

As a result, if you have the Lucky feat and absolutely need to hit with a particular attack, and you have no way of gaining Advantage, a solid alternative is to close your eyes, granting yourself Disadvantage on the roll, and therefore letting you roll another die which you can then choose between with your Luck point!

[phae-touched]

well, r/dndnext is the latest subreddit to fall for john olivers sex appeal

[averyangrytissuebox]

The issues with Vecna: Eye of Ruin are foundational because they got Vecna himself wrong

If you either didn't know about this book or only vaguely looked at it because it is part of the content run that Wotc is pumping out before dnd 6e comes out soon, I can't blame you. A brief scan of *shudders* reddit shows that the it wasn't very well recieved by the die hard fans of r/dndnext and I've seen very little buzz about it in the general dnd zeitgheist. While I have lots to say about why this is probably due to lack of trust in Wotc after the OGL, official adventures being underwhelming and the community being fractured as all fuck, but I want to focus on one very specific thing to show what is wrong with the adventure: Vecna's statblock himself.

Here it is. If you downloaded the Vecna dossier a couple of years back, this will look very familiar and it isn't abundantly obvious where this goes wrong so I want to break it down.

The first is a flavour fail. Vecna in the lore is the archlich supreme, formerly a king and lich who ascended to godhood. Once considered one of the strongest liches to dwell in the Greyhawks setting, he has grown to be a scourge of the whole multiverse. An unmatched sorcerer and epic BBEG worthy foe (just ask Matt Mercer). Iconic to his appearance are four things: His eye and hand which were all that is left after he was betrayed by Kas, his right hand man. Just as synonymous to his appearance is the sword of Kas itself, the only blade capable of permanently destroying the hand and eye. Finally, Vecna created the most profane tome of them all, the book of Vile Darkness.

With all that established, there are some immediate flavour issues with this. Firstly, Vecna is not particularly intelligent as far as high level villains go. At 22, he is dumber than Auril (24), Zariel (26), Acererak (27), the demon lords and Manshoon (23), the guy who is well known for being paranoid enough that he created clones that turned on him. Notable wise guy. He isn't even the most intelligent character in his own book because Kas and Tasha are intelligence 23. Truly a bizarre decision for one of the greatest liches of all time.

Secondly, he isn't actually that good of a spellcaster. He is an innate caster and not a wizard for ease of use I assume but as far as spellcasters concern, he is lacking a lot of fire power that a CR 26 god should have. He doesn't have any 9th level spells, making him an inferior wizard to both Acererak and the humble CR 12 archmage. He doesn't have counterspell, instead having a non spell version (But I will come back to this later) and he doesn't have shield. He is not so sturdy that he shouldn't have it and there is no in lore reason why he doesn't have basic spell casting.

Finally, there is no mention of his eye or hand in the campaign itself. The blade of Kas gets an honorary "However, if the characters wish to find it and use it against the warlord, you might place the artifact somewhere in this adventure for them to find" in the introduction and can be acquired at the very end on an extremely high roll. The book of Vile Darkness is buried in his chest which is very cool though, I will admit.

The second and arguably bigger issue with the statblock is that it is bad to fight and lies to the DM because it is the wrong CR. Actual CR is calculated by averaging defensive CR (which is effective hit points and armour class) and offensive CR (damage dealt per round). So lets fact check those CRs to confirm the maths. [A quick side note before we continue, the closest approximation of Flight of the Damned is a dragon's breath weapon which assumes it hits two targets for offensive CR].

Offensive CR = 2(7+9+9) [From two attacks with afterthought] + 96 [Rotten Fate] + 10 + 10 + 10 [For all three reactions] + 10 [Vile teleport used offensively] = 186 dpr.

A very impressive but decidedly not CR 26. In fact, his offensive CR is only 23. Vecna's attack bonuses are higher than average which can increase CR by 1 but not that much. Also he never wants to cast a spell unless he has to because it is a massive damage loss on Vecna

Calculating Defensive CR is trickier. Effective health is calculated by taking his actual health 272 and multiplying it by 1.25 because he has immunities to poison and non magical bludgeoning piercing and slashing damage. Then we add 30 to that total for each legendary resistence. (272 x 1.25) + 150 = 490 which is CR 22. Averaging both of them gives you 22.5

The issue with this is twofold: It means the DM doesn't actually know how strong Vecna is and if they take it at face value, they might nerf them or pull punches when they shouldn't making the fight feel cheap. The second and much bigger one is that Vecna's defensive tools allow him to dispatch a party of spellcasters with ease because of 5 legendary resistance, impressive saves and dread counterspell which cannot be countered but he gets easily overwhelmed by any martial. This is further compounded by the fact that players win the encounter by reducing him to 50hp or less so two fairly optimised martials (e.g. took the relevant combat feat and have maxed out their main stat) can kill him on the first turn, ignoring magical weapons which this adventure has a lot of. This makes the fight swingy and not fun because the martials get to party like there is no tomorrow but if you are a full caster, you do not get to participate.

Overall, the stat block is a failure of flavour and balance, feeling like it was thrown together after the fact because they needed Vecna here. Ultimately, Vecna: Eye of Ruin is less about Vecna and more about going through the most iconic places in d&d's history to get the rod of seven parts, which is perfectly fine but then why put Vecna on the cover when he isn't even the main villain. It feels like they shoved Vecna into this book because recognisability from stranger things and Vox Machina rather than him being an integral part of the adventure and that is reflected in the stat block.

I have a lot more to say about d&d balance, official adventure design and homebrew fixes including how to make a Vecna that doesn't suck but this post is long enough as is so maybe another time

[wizard-butch]

My favorite subreddit that’s in ‘John Oliver Mode’ is definitely r/dndnext, which contains gems like this

[qwertyjoebob]

Another one for people who want to help support independent artists/creators and have a problem with the proposed new OGL:

https://www.reddit.com/r/dndnext/comments/105qust/a_civil_callin_campaign_is_a_good_way_to_let_wotc/

the number is 425-226-6500. If you chose option 1 twice you can leave a message.

Or you can call Hasbro themselves at 401-431-8697

[clovercoffeebeanttrpgbullshit]

i can never post or r/dndnext because literally everything i have to say violates rule 2

[blackratbighat]

Trying to critique a non-5e system for not supporting the Three Pillars is a bad joke: 5e offers bad-to-mediocre support for those same three pillars. Combat: what 5e does best of the three, but still not particularly well in comparison to actual tactical wargames or more flexible or granular systems. It's a solved game: players worked out a long time ago that you need to be using all your actions, every caster wants counterspell, and martials care about naught but being able to do a ton of damage. This is the one that's actually suffered from the release of new content (though I'm not naming any names, SILVERY BARBS). Social interaction: The eternal, dreaded debate on whether to resolve the outcome of a social interaction based on the fiction (immersive in-character talking and direct player skill) or from the numbers on the character sheets, or in what combination / sequence. Every table needs to discuss it and 5e won't even tell you that it's a discussion that needs to BE had, let alone assist your table to make a decision on the matter. You want numbers to matter? Then players will be discouraged from actually talking - and resolving social interactions with a single roll is not particularly satisfying. You want player talking to matter? Any player that invested in those numbers will post about it on /r/dndnext. Look at Burning Wheel for an example of mechanically supported Social Combat. Exploration: Exploration processes are nonexistent. Light doesn't matter, supplies don't matter, noise doesn't matter, weight doesn't matter because bags of holding are a *class feature*. The system wants to pretend that you're not meant to have access to the Magic Item Shop, but doesn't give you anything else to spend your gold on. The thing is that exploration itself is not the draw here: you explore because there's something to discover. Exploration is meant to be a *process* and it should be fun to play out (5e doesn't do anything to make that true - go see what they put out for the jungle in Tomb of Annihilation, do a week in the jungle, and see how it feels), and players get a big emotional payoff from DISCOVERY. Again, 5e doesn't offer much to assist the DM in content creation there, and the quality of the published adventures is mixed.

The ACTUAL pillars of game enjoyment are: - Doing the cool thing - Having an interesting story to recount later - Breaking the system (getting ahead of the "intended" capabilities for your character's wealth/level/class) via valid means - Making decisions that count

Positioning, Market Dominance, And Having A Conversation In A Loud Room

So I'm reading Middle Earth Roleplaying 2nd ed. It's part of giant stack of tabletop I got from a publishing friend---and one of many systems I probably wouldn't be reading if I hadn't gotten it as part of a giant stack of tabletop from a publishing friend.

MERP 2e was released in '93, by Tolkein Enterprises, and is a pretty thorough book. It's packed full of nice B&W art. It lets you play as everything from a hobbit to an olag-hai. It uses a d100 system that allows for success with a complication. It's a book that feels intensely and simultaneously like it's ahead of and behind its time.

But that's not what I want to talk about.

MERP 2e has an alignment system, much like dnd at the time, but with twelve axis instead of two. Everything from whether your character is a metaphorical thinker to whether they're a literal thinker to whether they're a socialist or a libertarian is tracked.

Similarly, MERP has a classic six stat spread, but the explanations of the stats are all like "Strength(ST): Not brute musculature, but your ability to use your muscles to your greatest advantage."

And MERP has classes, called Professions, that each come with a little parenthetical explanation after their title. The Warrior's is (Fighter). The Scout's is (Thief). The Animist's is (Cleric).

What you might notice is that this is an officially licensed Middle Earth game *aggressively* defining and contextualizing itself vis a vis DnD. "Here's how our stats are different. Here's why our skill rolls are more granular. But don't worry, you can still play the same party roles. We promise we're not unfamiliar, just different."

Now, I don't know how intentionally-as-a-market-strategy the designers and writers were doing this---DnD's headlock on the industry was certainly less intense then than now---but it's reflective of a kind of design pressure that not only hasn't gone away. It's gotten way more intense.

DnD is roleplaying games. Anything that's not DnD might not be roleplaying games. Or at least, it's suspicious, it might taste weird, it might ruin your ability to have fun or speak english forever.

So in order to be a roleplaying game, you have to ask yourself "how do I fit into DnD?"

A critique I've seen leveled at indie systems sometimes is that they don't properly represent all of the three pillars of DnD. The three pillars is a modern creation. It's a 5e thing. It's specific to DnD. But DnD is roleplaying games, and to be a roleplaying game you need to be DnD.

So you get games as chameleons. You get endless "DnD killers" hoping that what people like about DnD isn't the name but the mechanics, and if you can just do the mechanics *more*, people will like you better. You get five hundred 5e splats. Power Rangers and GI Joe and Stargate all trying to fit into the same engine about swinging at and then missing a large rat. You get Adventure Time throwing out its original system and self-converting into a 5e hack because the market doesn't want things that don't look like DnD---even things that already look like DnD.

And back in '93 you get MERP 2e telling you don't worry, we still have the Thief, we just call it something different in our house.

[tdrumm3d]

Has your town been captured by pestilence? Do you need someone to rebalance your humors? Send a raven for the Plague Doctor! With Halloween getting closer you can be sure I will be adding related content. Check back at the shop frequently for new listings 🎃 #readyforhalloween #pumpkinspice #plaguedoctor #plaguedoctordicerower #plague #fatesend2 #dicetower #tabletopgaming #pestilence #dnd #dndnext #dungeonsanddragons #inlandplaplus #purple #rebalanceyourhumors https://www.instagram.com/p/CUJgRqPLkL0/?utm_medium=tumblr

[nerdsdaycomic]

EP. 136 Attractive Martial Studs

Sweet sassafrases we are back, FINALLY! Life has been full bore go for months now and it just wouldnt stop. Between a cross country move, a hurricane, new jobs and new cars there has been a lot of change in the Nerdsday household. Despite that we still got you covered on long form slow releasing Dungeons and Dragons content.

[fantasypictures]

I hope you won't mind, but this immediately put me in mind of something I saw on Reddit: https://www.reddit.com/r/dndnext/comments/jiuxum/my_creative_endeavour_to_reflavour_hags_that/

Not saying it's the exact same thing, but Bluebeard as a fey being beholden to Rules is something I really like.

Hmmm hm. Cinderella retelling where Bluebeard is her stepfather. Is that anything? Her mother marries the baron, and she’s given a key, and she goes where she shouldn’t, and there are no brothers to rescue her, and that leaves Cinderella with Bluebeard.

And it’s. Strange. He apparently hasn’t dealt with stepchildren before, and it’s like a pebble in his shoe. He doesn’t entirely know what to do about it.

And this is a problem for him, she knows. Her mother is in the basement, hidden away where he can ignore, but she is unavoidable. He should kill her, she knows, but she also knows that there are rules here that even he can’t ignore. She never broke the rules. She never goes where she mustn’t. She must live. He cannot touch her. He must remember.

For now, obedience turns out to be an acceptable rebellion.

[new-clemency]

doing 26d10+39 damage as a level 6 fighter

* Warforged Fighter * Take the Tunneler fighting style from the “Light, Dark, Underdark!” UA * Take the Echo Knight specialization at level 3 (from Explorers of Wildemount) * Take the Polearm Master feat at level 4 * Take the Sentinel feat at level 6 * Use a glaive (1d10+3 if you allocated stats well) At level 6, here’s what you can do: * you get unlimited opportunity attacks for you and your echo * in spaces up to 40ft wide, you can entirely block enemy movement (by placing you and your echo 20ft apart and each using a reach weapon), in that each enemy will have to spend two turns trying to get past you, with up to 2 opportunity attacks taken against them each turn. * in spaces that are 20ft wide or smaller, you will get up to 4 opportunity attacks against them before they can pass * during each turn, if the enemy is still in your zone of control, you can use action surge, extra attack, and one of your echo attacks to hit an enemy another 5 times. So theoretically, over an enemy’s movement through your zone of control: You’ve prevented an enemy from moving more than two squares per turn, and by the time they’ve escaped you, you’ve done up to 26d10+39 damage to them, not including crits.

This obviously isn’t perfect math, but the core ideas hold.

[sleeping-raccoon]

laughing at the idea of a PC jumping into the river styx so they can become invulnerable like Achilles and having their intelligence reduced to 1 lmao

[mousertwo]

Y después de mucho esfuerzo y dedicación al fin han llegado al castillo de Nano, rodeados y en desventaja, nuestros héroes han de intentar la hazaña imposible... Evitar que el mal futuro de apodere del reino entero. . . . #JuegosDeRol #Rol #Mapas #JueguenRol #rolplaying #rpg #DnD #DnDNext #gameplay #cultistasforever #cthulhu #cthulhulovers #clubrathsedge #juegosmolones #juegosentreamigos #juegosenraths #jocs #jogo #bgg #bggplay #entretenido #jugandoenraths #dungeonsanddragons #cultistas #cthulhufans #play #gaming #geek #nerd #fun (en Rath's Edge) https://www.instagram.com/p/BviyX2SjlMD/?utm_source=ig_tumblr_share&igshid=1ktrluthwova4

[onemorepagethenbed]

DnD with younger siblings

Eldest of my younger brothers, 15 years old, chops head off an enemy and kicks the head with a horned helmet into the face of the second enemy. Makes me wonder what kind of a role model I am. (More like a ROLL Model if you know what I’m sayin)