#arsenokoitai

[tenth-sentence]

These words, which carry a great deal of cultural baggage to do with ancient sexual practices, were over-simplified to make it sound like the Bible contains a sweeping condemnation of homosexuality.

"In/Out: A Scandalous Story of Falling Into Love and Out of the Church" - Steph Lentz

[oh-dear-so-queer]

The clincher was the discovery that the word 'homosexual' first appeared in the Bible (1 Corinthians 6 RSV) in 1946, following an error in the translation of the Greek words 'arsenokoitai' and 'malakos'.

"In/Out: A Scandalous Story of Falling Into Love and Out of the Church" - Steph Lentz

[brantheblessed]

Veteran of the tumblr arsenokoitai discourse.

Circa 2011 (colorized)

[anamericangirl]

I'm honestly really lost about something.

I've heard people claim that the Bible verse that said "A man lying with a man is an abomination" actually said "A man lying with a boy is an abomination" in the original language(s).

And since I don't speak any of these languages, I have no idea if this is true. To me, it's just as likely that there really was a mistranslation (if not a deliberate agenda) as it is that people are just trying to make the Bible more politically correct (since unlike homosexuality, an adult having sex with a kid is something that we can all agree is wrong).

Is there any, like, further debate on this, I guess? Like, you've got what we originally had and agreed on (that being that this Bible verse says being gay is wrong), and then you've got people saying "Oh, that's actually not true!" Do you know if anyone's made a response to that? And if someone made a response to that response, and so on and so forth?

Thank you in advance. This is tearing me apart...

It's very easy to get lost amongst those claims so I don't blame you and it's hard to know what the truth is if you don't know where to look.

That claim, however, is not true. It's a claim that's been around for a while and many biblical scholars and theologians have devoted their lives to studying that exact claim and they all always come to the same conclusion: that it's a direct condemnation of two grown men have sexual relations with each other.

In Corinthians, when Paul is talking about homosexuality, the word he uses is "arsenokoitai" which is actually a word he coined. He created a compound word with the words "arsenos" and "koiton".

"koiton" means to lie with or "bed" and "arsenos" means "a man" and was in fact the word used in the book of Leviticus for "a man." Paul knew what he was doing here and used that word specifically in his creation of the new word because the people he was speaking to at the time would have understood that to be a condemnation of two adult men sleeping together.

Jews who lived during the biblical time period considered homosexuality to be sinful because of that verse in Leviticus. No one who was living around that time interpreted that law as a condemnation of pedophilia or men sleeping with boys (although that absolutely is condemned in the Bible just not this particular verse), they all saw it as a condemnation of homosexuality. The idea that it's a mistranslation is a more modern take. But the fact that people of the time period understood it as a condemnation of homosexuality is a big hint that that's what it was.

Also, if you read the Bible and are looking to understand what it says about homosexuality, it's not insignificant that every time it's mentioned it's mentioned in a negative way. There is not a single positive reference to homosexuality anywhere in the Bible, which is another big hint that Leviticus is not a mistranslation.

And again, the idea has been debunked by scholars who have spent years studying it and you won't find a serious scholar who was able to conclude that Leviticus is talking about men taking advantage of boys and the debate is still only had by people who don't really understand the historical context and haven't done any real research into the topic. The claim has long been debunked by actual scholars.

Hope that was helpful and was able to provide at least a little insight into the issue for you!

[truth-has-a-liberal-bias]

What if all the anti-gay, homophobic rhetoric that has come from the Christian right over these past few decades was rooted in a mistranslation of the Bible?

In the documentary, 1946: The Mistranslation that Shifted Culture, researchers and scholars delve into the 1946 mistranslation of 1 Corinthians 6:9 and explore how it fueled the Christian anti-gay movement that still thrives today.

The film hinges its premise on the fact that the word “homosexual” appeared for the first time in the Bible in 1946, in an apparent mistranslation of the ancient Greek words malakoi – defined as someone effeminate who gives themselves up to a soft, decadent, lazy and indolent way of living – and arsenokoitai – a compound word that roughly translates to “male bed”.

While people could take it to mean man bedding man, within the context of the time, scholars believed that arsenokoitai alluded more to abusive, predatory behavior and pederasty than it does homosexuality. [...]

[she-is-loved]

jesus doesnt support homosexuality..?

Jesus makes no mention of homosexuality. The only type of sexual immortality He refers to during His ministry is adultery & lust (Matthew 5:27-32) I am not going to reference any verses from the Old Testament as we are no longer bound to it's laws.

The only use of the word "homosexual" is in 1 Corinthians 6:9. The two Greek words that are often translated into homosexual this verse are "arsenokoitē" and "malakos". The word "arsenokoitē" is also used in 1 Timothy. Malakos is a fairly easy word to translate as it's found in multiple times in the bible; it translates to "soft", "meek", or "weakling". This word was often used to describe those who were weak in battle or man who lived very pampered lives. Arsenokoitē is a bit more of a difficult word to translate because it's not found in any other Greek texts. It's very possible that this word was a created by Paul by combining the words "arsén" (male) and “koité” (bed). Through the 16th-20th century, this word was translated to "abusers of themselves with mankind" and "liers with mankind". In the 1940s, arsenokoitē began to be translated to homosexual despite the fact that the word homosexual or anything similar to it didn't exist during biblical times.

There is also Romans 1:26-27 which is a must longer breakdown of the translation that I don't have time for right now (I'll attach a website that breaks down the translation of these two verses)

My final, and most important point, is that Jesus said nothing about homosexuality but He DID say for us to love one another. In Matthew 5: 37-40 He says, "Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind. This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: Love your neighbor as yourself. All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.”

Let me know if you have anymore questions. Lots of love and God bless you!

References:

https://www.believeoutloud.com/voices/article/clobbering-biblical-gay-bashing/

https://www.rwuc.org/2020/03/20/arsenokoitai/

https://www.bible.com/bible/59/MAT.5.ESV

[anniflamma]

It always makes me laugh to think that the Apostle Paul's Hebrew name is Saul and his Roman name is Paul. Considering that Jesus healed the centurion's servant, he had no interest in homophobia, but considering that Paul left that infamous homophobic letter… Paul (Saul): I don't know why, but I feel like I lost my crown, which I never had, because of my gay son and bisexual son-in-law.

Hehe, I'm going to dump my knowledge of the Bible now! XD

I guess the 'infamous homophobic letter' you mentioned is the Corinthians, right?

Paul says that individuals who continue in sinful behavior will not attain heaven and among these 'sinners' were drunkards, people who bangs alot, and cheaters. He also references two Greek words that many translate and associate as expressions of same-sex behavior. These two words are malakoi and arsenokoitai.

Of course, these are the words throughout history that translators have had the worst time translating, and of course, homophobes change the meanings of what these words actually means.

Malakoi directly translates into 'soft,' and it was usually used to describe someone who lacks self-control and is weak, cowardly, and lazy.

Of course, people being sexist and all translate this word to 'effeminate' instead. Because women are lazy and cowards, I suppose... 🙄 Instead, the word doesn't really have anything to do with gay men, but it could have a connection when you use the word in a sexual context. However, that word is frequently used to describe men who were seen as lacking self-control in their love for... women.... For the past centuries, English translations used the word 'weaklings'. It's only in the past century that they connected the word with same-sex relationships instead.

Arsenokoitai comes from two Greek words: arsen (male) koites (bed). This is the word that makes many speculate that this term was used to condemn same-sex behavior. Alas again! CONTEXT 👏 ALWAYS 👏 MATTERS! 👏 The word likely relates to sexual or economic exploitation, due to in ancient literature, the word only appears in lists of vices. Some historians even think that this was about temple prostitution. So yeah, it probably relates to same-sex behavior, but not in a consensual way.

And then we have the whole deal that many people points out... The dude was a Roman who could speak Greek... Why didn't he just use the words Erastes and Eromenos if he wanted to be really clear to condemn same-sex behaviors? Malakoi and Arsenokoitai have never really been used as a pair by other ancient writers.

So again, why didn't Paul just use the already existing term that was associated with same-sex behaviors? Why not the latter? Hmmm... Mystery.... 😶

And I'm not going to talk about the Romans letters because there he just slut-shaming EVERYONE!

I'm definitely wanna/gonna talk about Paul's sexuality! But that will be later... I need to rest!

(ps. I don't really know if you even wanted to know this, but here we are... I also feel like I spiraled a bit… Sorry!)

[godlovesdykes]

but how does the gen z bible translate arsenokoitai

[ziggy-solarecreator]

The Bible and Homosexuality

Many Christians have heard that the Bible says “homosexuals” will not enter the kingdom of God. But the term “homosexual” wasn’t used in any translation of the Bible until 1946—and the head of the translation committee that first added it eventually admitted they had been wrong to do so. (Watch the video here to learn more: reformationproject.org/case/1-corinthians-and-1-timothy.)

In 1 Corinthians 6:9-11, Paul warns that those who persist in sin will not inherit God’s kingdom. He lists thieves, adulterers, the greedy, and slanderers, and he uses two Greek words that began to be translated in the mid-20th century to refer specifically to gay men.

The first word—malakoi—literally means “soft,” and it was widely used to describe a lack of self-control, weakness, cowardice, and laziness. Although most uses of the term in ancient literature were not related to sexual behavior, men who were seen as taking the “passive” role in same-sex relations were sometimes called malakoi. But the term was also applied to men who were seen as lacking self-control in their overzealous pursuit of women, and most translations until recent decades were fairly generic: “weaklings,” “wantons,” and “debauchers.”

The second word—arsenokoitai—is a more likely reference to same-sex behavior, as it comes from two Greek words meaning “male” and “bed.” But the contexts of the word’s usage in ancient literature indicate that it likely related to sexual or economic exploitation. So while that may have involved forms of same-sex behavior, it would have been exploitative forms—nothing like most same-sex relationships today.

The word “homosexual” didn’t exist in any language until 1869, nor did the concept of sexual orientation itself. That’s why the head of the Revised Standard Version’s 1946 Bible translation committee later admitted their use of "homosexual" was an error. Unfortunately, their mistranslation had already been adopted by other Bible translators, and many parents continue to cite it to reject their children. But it isn't what those two Greek words actually mean, and it's imperative for translators today to correct the record.

Learn more: reformationproject.org/case/1-corinthians-and-1-timothy.

[kaitykat20]

Hello folks! After a hiatus on making my own posts (that went for almost 5 years apparently wHOOPS😂) I’ve come back with one that is very important to my heart: the case for homosexuality in the Christian religion.

I was raised in the church, specifically the Southern Baptist denomination, and my love for Jesus hasn’t swayed in all 22 years of my life. Not even when I believed homosexuality was ok and realized I myself fall halfway into that boat as a bisexual (technically biromantic asexual but close enough)

That being said, I fully intend to post my studies on various mistranslations and such to share with you all, starting with 1 Corinthians 6:9!

If the forgetfulness with my mental issues kicks in please know I’m sorry and genuinely did want to post more verses as I was writing this😅

Lastly, please know that no matter who you love or what gender(s) you identify with, Jesus loves you and would apologize for any Christians who have hurt you in His name!

[shatar-aethelwynn]

arsenokoitai

[mayra-quijotescx]

yeah, no, still angry, may well be angry forever, could rant for days on this general subject until my voice is hoarse and my carpals are tunneled, but let me just say this one thing, and it's a thing that I myself had to spend some time struggling with because it's just so convenient a thing to want to fall back on when someone pisses you off, it's so tempting and seductive like that, hmm, i wonder if that's one of those red flags we were warned about several times in the text... anyway:

If you are a Christian and you believe that Hell is still a genuine threat, you are committing a heresy.

Argue with the New Testament, not me. Yeah, sure, even the shitty post-1946 English translations that mistranslated arsenokoitai and malakos as 'homosexual', thus heavily contributing to mainstream Christianity's utter frothing derangement against queer people. What was the reason given for Jesus dying? Go. Look it up. I'll wait. What was he allegedly doing, in text, those three days before he came back?

Was it defeating Hell?

It was, wasn't it.

So if Jesus gave his life as the ultimate death penalty victim to vanquish Hell and free all souls... where the fuck is Hell? Shouldn't be anymore, am I right? Who's going against a literal self-sacrificial act of God to give this canonically vanquished institution all its horrible power back, then? Who's going around terrorizing little kids into thinking Jesus, the guy you're calling their Savior, as in 'one who saves you', who died in the worst way there was to die at the time to allegedly, per the main reference text of the religion, defeat Hell, actually either couldn't get it to stick because his sacrifice wasn't enough (?!), was secretly undermined by his own believers (?!) or pulled the shittiest uno-reverse ever and re-established eternal torment specifically for little boys and girls who didn't perfectly exemplify the roles their hateful pastors, politicians, and families started demanding from them at an inappropriately young age?!?

[jellyfishhhhhhhhhhh]

A really good thesis that goes in depth into this (as well as Scripture) is Carolyn V. Bratnober's Legacies of Homosexuality in New Testament Studies: Arsenokoitai and Malakoi, fornicators and sodomites, in the history of sexuality and scripture Not only does Bratnober make note of the fact that homosexuality was not a concept that the ancient Romans or epistles had, they also go into the racialized aspects of slavery in the Roman Empire that are often ignored during the queer-washing of history, and by queer-affirming Biblical scholars. They do this while addressing and making cases for queer neutral and queer-affirming scripture. Very interesting read if you have the time! (Or just check out the works consulted to add to your TBR)

the way gay ppl online talk abt classical um. faggotry is interesting. every time i see a 'ancient greece/rome was a queer paradise' im like girl lets separate fantasy and fact. we can all imagine two beefy bearded warrior type guys blowing each other. we can even jerk off to that. but that was NOT what was going on back then

[marie1-kersaint]

https://www.facebook.com/share/unbSPUWyaGE667uB/?mibextid=WC7FNe

SORRY 😢women started wearing pants 👖 during WWII at the factories 🏭 because we had to start 🛫 doing “men’s work”

From the movie 🍿 TO LIVE i understood that lower class women wore pants 👖.

The woman shall not wear that which pertaineth unto a man, neither shall a man put on a woman's garment: for all that do so [are] abomination unto the LORD thy God.

https://kjbo.org/Deuteronomy-22-5/

1 Corinthians 6:9 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, 10 nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, of God.

“Effeminate”= “Malakos”è “A person who allows themselves to be sexually abused contrary to nature” (Zodhiates) [It could refer to male prostitutes, or transvestite—"Drag Queens”]

“Homosexuals”= “Arsenokoitai”è “A man who lies in bed with another male” (Zodhiates) [Literally: “Man who beds with another Man”]

THE BIBLE ON HOMOSEXUALITY

(cf. Genesis 19 and the story of Sodom’s doom)

Leviticus 18:22 'You shall not lie with a male as one lies with a female; it is an abomination.

Leviticus 20:13 'If there is a man who lies with a male as those who lie with a woman, both of them have committed a detestable act; they shall surely be put to death. Their bloodguiltiness is upon them.

Deuteronomy 22:5 "A woman shall not wear man's clothing, nor shall a man put on a woman's clothing; for whoever does these things is an abomination to the LORD your God.

Deuteronomy 23:1 "No one who is emasculated or has his male organ cut off shall enter the assembly of the LORD.

Isaiah 3:9 The look on their faces testifies against them; they parade their sin like Sodom; they do not hide it. Woe to them! They have brought disaster upon themselves.

Romans 1:26 For this reason God gave them over to degrading passions; for their women exchanged the natural function for that which is unnatural,27 and in the same way also the men abandoned the natural function of the woman and burned in their desire toward one another, men with men committing indecent acts and receiving in their own persons the due penalty of their error.

28 And just as they did not see fit to acknowledge God any longer, God gave them over to a depraved mind, to do those things which are not proper, 29 being filled with all unrighteousness, wickedness, greed, evil; full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, malice; they are gossips, 30 slanderers, haters of God, insolent, arrogant, boastful, inventors of evil, disobedient to parents, 31 without understanding, untrustworthy, unloving, unmerciful; 32 and although they know the ordinance of God, that those who practice such things are worthy of death, they not only do the same, but also give hearty approval to those who practice them.

1 Timothy 1:8 But we know that the law is good if one uses it lawfully, 9 knowing this: that the law is not made for a righteous person, but for the lawless and insubordinate, for the ungodly and for sinners, for the unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers, 10 for fornicators, for sodomites, for kidnappers, for liars, for perjurers, and if there is any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine,

1 Corinthians 6:9 Or do you not know that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, 10 nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, shall inherit the kingdom of God.

Jude 1:7 just as Sodom and Gomorrah and the cities around them, since they in the same way as these indulged in gross immorality and went after strange flesh, are exhibited as an example in undergoing the punishment of eternal fire.

🔥

[automatismoateo]

"Hateful homophobic christians are just a tiny minority the bible isn't homophobic actually" via /r/atheism

"Hateful homophobic christians are just a tiny minority, the bible isn't homophobic actually" In the past few years I've seen this statement get popularized with 'progressive' christians. Personally, I feel gaslit. A couple of decades ago (and that's stretching it, it's more recent) there were literal 'family values' christian politicians getting elected just because they opposed gay marriage. It wasn't a tiny minority, it wasn't 'some weird sect' within christianity, it was the popular school of thought. Every time I see progressive christian be like "ummm... actually, christianity isn't hateful, it's just a tiny minority of bigots using christianity as a bludgeon". They can't even acknowledge that, actually, progressive branches of christianity are the minority. Also who the hell cares if the 'arsenokoitai' passage of the bible is about pedophiles (it isn't) or not? from decades on now it has been used to justify violence against queer men. Submitted January 13, 2024 at 05:19AM by dumbocolgate (From Reddit https://ift.tt/VQBE1RG)

[jwood718]

Sure to be at the top of many lists of films to see or abhor, 1946 documents the search for The Mistranslation That Shifted Culture.

The documentary posits that a huge portion of our current "culture wars" center on a word in the Bible that only first showed up in a 1946 translation: homosexual.

"...in an apparent mistranslation of the ancient Greek words malakoi – defined as someone effeminate who gives themselves up to a soft, decadent, lazy and indolent way of living – and arsenokoitai – a compound word that roughly translates to 'male bed.' While people could take it to mean man bedding man, within the context of the time, scholars believed that arsenokoitai alluded more to abusive, predatory behavior and pederasty than it does homosexuality."

Full story by Vivian Ho for The Guardian