#and. I don’t know how I did it but it read perfectly as dialogue Susie would say. somehow

[susielesbianism]

The nature of being neurodivergently obsessed with a character is you’ll sit down and write dialogue for them and then read it over and go “wait how is this so in-character. what”

[azzy-the-christian-furry]

What’s your opinion on the theory about Deltarune’s secret bosses representing the seven deadly sins with Gaster representing Old Scratch himself?

I haven’t heard that one before. But now that I’ve got a captive audience, I’m gonna address this ask and apparently go off on a tangent (whoops).

I have heard that the normal final bosses so far have represented bad and overbearing parents for Susie and Noelle, respectively. I can see that. If I had to guess, Spamton is greed because he’s a scummy salesman? Maybe lust, considering the thing he kinda advertises. Jevil… I don’t think wrath fits exactly, but it could be. Maaaybe envy? He doesn’t seem proud, gluttonous, or sloth like. Dude bounces all over the place.

Now that Toriel is probably going to be in chapter 3- possibly with Undyne or even Blooky, I wonder if there might be some pent up Kris frustration. What with the divorce and whatnot. I’d imagine Kris is probably feeling kind of stuck in his brother’s shadow. If the guess that Asriel’s incomplete form/OC is to be the secret boss, I’d guess wrath or pride. Probably wrath. But that’s just going off of UnderTale, which may or may not have the same rules and ideas as DeltaRune.

Could also have a childhood theme for chapter 3? Like, Super Smashing Fighters or some other video game. Kris does seem to miss his childhood a bit. What with feelings of relief in the kid zone at the library (when you read “where a teen can be a kid”)- only real negative feels are from the town hall janitor telling Kris to ask cops to change his (Kris’s) diaper. Dude was kind of a jerk and using being called a kid as an insult on that one, though? So fair not to want to be called a kid on this one.

… yes, that’s real dialogue. Yes, I did the King fight again specifically to not look crazy. Same dude offers them in Ch2, iirc. Mentioned a school for it, too. It was a weird two days.

My two best guesses for the next boss are Asriel’s OC, who is totally not just edgy and is super cool in every way, Asriel’s main in Definitely Not Smash Bros, or Kris’s main in the same game. I think creepy TV smile might be the final boss, possibly as a manifestation of Kris’s issues.

Speaking of Ch2…

Noelle. We see Noelle as a child in Chapter 2 when you finish spelling “December”. If I had to guess, this is a similar thing with Kris. Missing their childhood because, I mean… has anyone ever enjoyed being an adult in the last 10 years? 20, even?

Dess went missing sometime between them being in the woods together- maybe even on that very night, or in relation to the bunker that Kris is creeped out by. This was when they were kids. Could be a kind of coping mechanism of sorts, or a trauma response.

In Undertale, Asriel swaps between his adult form (it’s called that in the art book) and child form. I don’t think I need to point out the massive trauma going on there. Losing your sibling is traumatic. Losing your sibling and then dying and being resurrected without love is even more. So this kind of thing wouldn’t be unusual.

Going from memory, I don’t think anyone except Kris, MK, and Susie wear stripes in DR. Which is seen as childish by UT monsters.

Yeah, I know I kinda diverted from “how about those secret bosses?” to “the kids want to be kids again or need some serious therapy”, but… whoops.

Kris wanting to be a kid again just doubles perfectly with my “Ralsei is Kris’s fursona” head canon. Which I will also talk about if you want

At least I answered the question :p

[animusbell]

UNDERTALE vs. DELTARUNE

A speculative post about what the relation between the two worlds might be.

If you read this post, you accept any spoilers that will happen!

[press J to skip.]

1. The Difference

At first glance, this game looks almost like a post-pacifist sequel to Undertale, and I’ve seen many people mistake it for such! However, even without Toby’s word saying that a “sequel” to Undertale wouldn’t be interesting, there’s plenty of ingame evidence to suggest that it isn’t--that many of the events of and before UNDERTALE never happened. It’s as though the monsters were never in the Underground at all!

To name a few discrepancies:

Asriel is alive (and... going to college?)

Mettaton still seems to be in ghost form (that makes sense: Alphys isn’t a scientist trying to impress a king, so she hasn’t made a robot...)

Undyne and Alphys don’t even know each other.

Sans doesn’t know Alphys or Toriel beyond their brief stops in his store.

Bratty & Catty appear to be enemies...?

Kris is... not Frisk. Though their names are almost-anagrams.

And some odd parallels:

Those seven flowers Asgore is preserving from his wedding... colored like the six human souls in UNDERTALE, and one “golden” flower.

(What was it that caused Toriel and Asgore to divorce, if not the events before UNDERTALE, I wonder?)

There’s an NPC who looks like that one Gaster follower who doesn’t have an ingame sprite from UNDERTALE:

Gaster’s theme in Undertale is called “mus_st_him” and is mostly hidden in game files. The Gaster-motif theme that plays during “character creation” is called “ANOTHER HIM.”

The weird audio that plays during Gaster’s ENTRY NUMBER 17 is the same audio as what plays when you try to use your Cell Phone in the dark world.

So... it’s weird! It’s almost like some kind of parallel universe. Or, perhaps you’ve discarded an old world and moved on to the next with your stolen soul...?

2. “You accept everything that will happen”: the antithesis of DETERMINATION

Now, I’m sure I’ve missed some hidden details that the datamining & mystery-solving crowds will find soon enough. HOWEVER, here’s what I have done in this game: spared everyone with [ACT]s  and fought everyone.

But this game isn’t like UNDERTALE, exactly! Sparing everyone with ACTs does make them like you, and in fact I got an ending where all the NPCs helped me with the ending. However, even without this, the ending is basically the same with just a few tiny detail changes.

Also, see, “fight”ing doesn’t work like it does in UNDERTALE. As far as I can tell, gaining EXP is impossible. Enemies run off when you beat them up. And, weirdly enough, Ralsei and Susie barely even address the fact that you’re beating everyone up. Ralsei still reprimands Susie for being the one obsessed with FIGHTING, and Susie still agrees to follow your ACT directions at the end. 

In DELTARUNE, everyone has the same arc, regardless of your actions. This is very different from UNDERTALE, where your run can make the difference between Undyne and Alphys getting together, and the Amalgamates reuniting with their families...

Also, unlike Frisk, Kris already HAS a place in this world! They have an established personality, and many actions & relations with people that predate our influence on the game. We aren’t some new person who just moved to town--most folks recognize our avatar as a kid they’ve met before, who covered their arms in ketchup to pretend to be bleeding, who went through their parents having a divorce & their brother leaving for college, who dislikes the way Asgore gives hugs.

So between the discarding of the “vessel” you made, the lack of “determination” addressed at save points, and the general idea that you can’t truly affect the events of this world... hmm. It seems like your influence on this world isn’t quite the same as it was in UNDERTALE.

3. The Dark World

Along with the main world of DELTARUNE seeming like an odd alternate universe that’s a haunted reflection of UNDERTALE, the Dark World seems almost like a second, even more distorted reflection from the former.

The place has an almost-imaginary-seeming quality to it, as though it was spawned from the items in the supply closet (like the checkers board on the ground), but I think we know better than to call the “imaginary”/”it was all a dream” trope.

There are several weird parallels:

“Ralsei” is an anagram of “Asriel,” and they seem to be the same/similar species

Lancer has a similar color scheme & body type to Sans, and his toothy grin looks very similar....

Kris and Susie look different when they enter the Dark World... Kris turns blue and they both get very RPG-adventure type gear out of nowhere! Also, did Susie always have an ax...?

4. “don’t forget”

So! Before DELTARUNE’s release, we had a recent update to the “Suzy” situation. Namely, the Clamgirl in Waterfall (who only appears at certain FUN values, which are implied to be Gaster-related) suddenly gained a few extra pieces of dialogue where she says “The time when you will meet [Suzy]... is fast approaching.” And she turns grey and vanishes like the other Gaster followers.

However, long before that (in the 2016 mass bug-fix patch of Undertale), a really weird detail was added to the Clamgirl phenomenon. Alongside the FUN values getting changed so that the followers appeared without datamining...

When you enter sans’ laboratory-back-room, ONLY if you’ve spoken with Clamgirl and gotten the “Suzy” dialogue, you get this:

As observed in this reddit post, those three smiling faces COULD be Kris, Lancer, and Susie (or perhaps some alternate version of the three, as suggested by the Suzy/Susie spelling discrepancy)...

Now, Lancer and Susie both smile ingame, but Kris doesn’t. HOWEVER! There’s an argument to be made that Kris’ facial expressions work like Frisk’s--we never see them as the player, but Sans himself observes that Frisk spared monsters “with a smile” in a pacifist run, and people are spooked by your expression in a merciless run. And in DELTARUNE, Kris is observed to have an “annoyed” look postgame when Susie is brought up by Monster Kid.

So maybe they did smile, at some point!

Sans is also the only character in UNDERTALE directly referenced to be aware of the timelines changing. Not necessarily remembering them directly, but he can tell when you’ve reset a save to listen to his speech twice (in a pacifist run) and knows how many times you’ve died in a merciless run (NOT perfectly--he says “eight” when it’s “nine” and addresses that he messed up, and he can’t tell how many it’s been past 11 deaths).

So is it much of a stretch to say that maybe, whatever happened to make Sans aware of these timelines might have also made him aware of some universe where he was in Lancer’s place, or perhaps just have strange memories directly from Lancer? Who knows!

--

Anyway... none of this is fully confirmed, but it is all very interesting! Hopefully the next chapter will give us some more insight into what the actual connection is between the two worlds.