#and with how berdly and queen interact

[silly-salty-utdr-rants]

copy pasting my knight papyrus take from my main

ok so im bored and i know no one will probably read this so im gonna lay out my papyrus knight theory/au timeline

for simplicity ill break it into three segments: what happened before to set up this chain of events, how and why papyrus does it, and bare bones evidence

1 before deltarune

generally this is working off my "gaster is bad at math theory" which, to summarize, basically says gaster started as a scientist in deltarune with 2 kids (sans and paps) accidentily fucks up the math and teleports to undertale, uses deltarunes superior tech to create the core, fucks up the math and falls in, frisk/player pulls up, after a bit sans and paps dip but gaster fucks up the math postmortem and they get stuck in deltarune resulting in papyrus becoming a hermit who accidentally opens a darkworld in his closet and then does the fucking grinch smile and causes a ruckus

2 why tho

how papyrus does it: something something prophecy, destiny, gaster fuckery, what have you. effectively via the same plot convenient saving grace that allows us to close the darkworlds and control kris

why does he do it: same reason he spares frisk in geno. he sees that characters like kris, berdly, susie and noelle and knows that they can do better, they just need to try. and what better reason to try than life threatening adventure? (sidenote: i fucking despise when people make the excuse of "Oh HeS bEiNg ~MaNiPuLaTeD~ bY ______" like no shut up let papyrus be morally ambiguous dammit) he is also likely aware of the titan situation and is just deadass like "NO I CAN TAKE THEM IN A 1V1 I THINK" also it makes sense narratively due to his incomplete character arc

3 DA FAX

the closet the chapter 2 darkworld was likely started from can fit and i quote "a large person" (especially combined with the skeletons in my closet line in undertale), he has been set up by sans to have a late game appearance, no alibis in chapter 1 or 2, in chapter 2 the "trousling bones" mentioned when interacting with the door of sans' house grows distant as another darkworld closes, as mentioned in section 2 his arc is still incomplete and as mentioned in my papyrus backstory post we dont even have a clue as to half the shit he's hiding, as a more meta reason bonetrousle was originally the main theme of deltarune, the "secret name" line from papyrus qna 2, the jevil reference dialogue in papyrus qna 2, and probably the most solid motive out of the candidates. that being the fact he believes so much in that people can do good if they try, to exercise that from a more cynical perspective of these beliefs (i.e people wont try unless they have to) could look like forcing them by way of obscure supernatural prophecy and lifechanging perilous adventure

bonus: why other candidates are dumb

gerson is fucking dead

gaster, while likely behind the secret bosses, seems a bit occupied with fucking with reality and would rather cast someone else (like his son????)

dess is currently entangled in the code and likely cant have much effect on the actual world

mrs. holiday seems like a better candidate for character development by darkworld than creator of darkworld

asriel is at college

kris has been controlled by us for most of the game and i aint see them open a darkworld beyond the one post chapter 2

player, i dont know about you guys, but i have not opened a darkworld

new character sounds REALLY boring tbh

ralsei, rouxls, and any darkner candidate are ruled out due to queens speech

[susellesie]

what gets me is that noelle is used to being needed for something. there's the obvious- berdly uses her for academic success. the mayor likely needs noelle for her image as successful- expecting lots and giving little. even Rudolph, bless his heart, allows noelle's mother to continue this negligence.

they're all, in their own way, asking something of her. and the only people who didn't stopped talking to her, moved away, or went missing.

and so she just.. kind of forgets she can be a person, in that sense. routine is easy to fall into, and she falls.

even people who aren't asking anything of her have this idea of her. even susie.

in the dark world, her first interaction is with queen who wants something from her.

and if you play peacefully, normally, then noelle unlearns this. through you and susie and even ralsei, she learns there's no idea of a person she has to be to matter. you accept her unconditionally and she is accepted and that is everything. you teach noelle she is not just the culmination of everything she has given.

and then there's snowgrave.

and noelle has not only been taught she is a vessel, a continuation of someone else's demands, but that she can do this to others. she learns to give everything but gains everything in the process. it's falling into the void and becoming it.

noelle gives to others, and takes from the rest. that is how she survives throughout the snowgrave route. and the second she's back at the town, the denial kicks in, and all she's left with is the emptiness and nobody to take from.

[centrally-unplanned]

Finally caught up on Deltarune - another "on the list" media, making progress ~woo. Random thoughts

Having a "squad" makes for a very different game than Undertale, as the focus is constantly on the internal dynamic versus a sort of "neutral observer" on an exterior world. That internal dynamic is fun, and well done - Chapter 2 was much better for this, as Kris & Susie don't have much of a prior relationship, but w/ Noelle has a deep background with both Kris & Susie which makes everything here pop a bit more. Toby Fox continues to excel at blending the amusing & touching at the same time.

Speaking of Noelle is very adorable, code-swapping between straight man and lovesick deuteragonist. She pretty much elevates every character she interacts with by being someone you can't help but be a little authentic around.

The ways in which the Lightners/Townsfolk seem real is a mirror to how the Darkners seem flat. In Undertale Frisk is an outsider everyman in a lot of ways peeking in a fully cohesive world, which presents its motives and dynamics relatively upfront. In Deltarune the worlds are piecemeal as the focus is on the squad - Chapter 1 is largely spent on Susie, Chapter 2 on Noelle and even Berdly, none of whom are parts of the world you are exploring. King from Chapter 1 is a complete dud, and Queen from Chapter 2 is certainly far more amusing but is primarily playing second fiddle to Noelle & co. Since you spend most of your time in these worlds its a bit of an issue.

I think this is compounded by keeping Kris as a silent, neutral-seeming protagonist. Kris is clearly involved in w/e is going on with the fantasy worlds, but you get extremely little on their motivations or anything because they are very blank-slatey. Not entirely, you pick things up, but the point is the "stakes" for the conflict seem underexplored. Its clearly done to build mystery but generally mystery is built on a foundation of clear facts, and we don't have those yet. And since its a "interpersonal" game Kris also isn't giving much on that front either - everyone's friendship with Kris seems fake because they are a mute. Frisk worked better for the game they were in.

Chapter 2's world was really aesthetically fun, in particular the cute like sonic references had me openly laughing at multiple times. Give me that Casino World energy any day.

Why was everyone obsessed with the frikkin salesdude Spamton when it came out? He was a total non-entity! He is cute enough as a one off badguy but come on. He isn't even Temmie levels of fun.

Overall its really good, Toby Fox has a very defined style and sense of humor, and this game delivers on the brand as it were. I don't think its quite as good as Undertale, but of course its only 2 chapters in, I won't truly judge till its done.

[inbarfink]

So ever since the Spamton Talking Plush has been Unleashed into the World, I’ve seen several attempts to decipher it’s mysterious 6th voice line (which seems to be a cleaner version of one of the rambling voices we hear on “BIG SHOT”). And while I, personally, don’t feel 100% confident about anything save for “it pulls the strings and makes them ring” - I see a lot of people hear something along the lines of  “I can’t explain it until you’re all alone.”

Which I find... quite an interesting possibility due to the way the theme of isolation plays into his plotlines. Like, yeah, almost every character in Deltarune is lonely in some way, it’s a very common theme. But both Spamton’s Normal Route plot and his Weird Route plot put a unique emphasis on this idea.

In a Normal Route, Kris is always all alone when encountering Spamton and progressing his Secret Boss Quest (first by happenstance and then they start asking their friends to wait outside the shop\basement) and this isolation only stops when the Spamton NEO Boss fight starts.

This is wholesale inverted in the Weird Route, Kris always has someone around in all of their interactions with Spamton (either Noelle or the rest of the Fun Gang)..... until the NEO Boss Fight. Which they do all alone.

And that also reflects back on Spamton’s character and how much his own isolation defines him cause like... regardless of the Route, Spamton ends up projecting hardcore on Kris’ situation. And despite all of their similarities regarding their respective lack of Freedom, the thing that always starts the projection is the loneliness. 

So the idea that in BIG SHOT, Spamton is saying something along the lines of “I can’t explain it until you’re all alone” is... an interesting addition to it. 

Like, when I talked about Spamton and the Isolation Theme before I described it as Isolation Through Knowledge. Kris feels isolated even when amongs friends because no one else knows about the situation with Spamton, Kris feels isolated because no one else knows about the SOUL, Spamton has been isolated because his knowledge about the nature of the world has left him unable to function as a normal member of Cyber World’s society. And now we’ve got the added possibility of Knowledge Through Isolation. 

Like, is the reason why Kris chooses to always interact with Spamton alone in the Normal Route (and they really do choose. We don’t tell them to do it and while Spamton told them to come alone to the store, no one told them to go to the basement alone. This is something they decided to do truly on their own volition) is because they feel/know that they wouldn’t be able to get information out of Spamton unless they are alone? 

Is this about how Spamton relates to other isolated people and thus he feel that people are only able to be-explained-at when they have been left ‘all alone’? Do you need to be lonely to understand the Nature of the World of Deltarune? Is this about isolation as a manipulation technique? Tempting people with the promise of an explanation and pull out the puppet strings when turned away anyone who could’ve helped them? Is this something Spamton himself experienced in his past with... whoever that was who contacted him?

There’s a bunch of questions this line raises, but my biggest one is probably:

DID Spamton actually explain all that he could explain whenever he interacted with Kris?

Because like, yeah, Kris only interact with Spamton when Susie and Ralsei and Noelle and Queen and Berdly aren’t around (and Lancer is but he’s not paying attention)

But Kris is never actually ‘all alone’

Because we’re with them in the Dark.

Was there something Spamton wanted to explain to Kris but couldn’t cause he could tell someone or something was watching them?

... hey speaking of which, you know what other character does actually only explains things to Kris when they are truly ‘all alone’?

[tramon81]

Berdly's Formula: Cyberworld.

Sooooo guess who's in the mood to get another essay on Berdly?

Now I am of the belief that somehow dark worlds have some sort of link to the chapter's main new duo, for example, Kris seems to be linked to the first one but the world seems to revolve around giving Susie character growth. The King is a representation of that as well and Lancer playing bad guys with Susie. Kris provides the theme while Susie is the focus, you can also see how everyone refers to Susie as a monster who wrecks things up, it's clear that the "Focus Character" always becomes a known figure in the Dark World they reside in.

Now onto the duo at hand, Berdly and Noelle. And their Cyberworld. Focus Character: Noelle. Theme Character: Berdly.

So let's break it down, Berdly is the Theme character not only because the world is so technological, but let's center around Queen for this post. for the lack of a better term, she's basically a reflection of Berdly while having elements potentially reflective of Mayor Holiday. Especially on how obsessed she is with "having Noelle help her with her plans" in fact she needs Noelle for it because, in Queen's eyes, Noelle is "strong".

Remember Berdly feels as if he needs Noelle's help in order to be considered a smart guy because Noelle is "smarter" than him. Berdly confessed so, that "She's... the real smart kid." it is my belief that there's a bit of idolization in that sentence as well as an inferiority complex.

They both think Noelle is strong and they need that strength to attain their perfect world.

Also, both Berdly and Queen can't detect what Noelle thinks of them Queen thinks that this new world she has planned will make Noelle happy, and after learning that it won't she admits "... Noelle... Perhaps My Computations Were Miscalibrated"

Berdly's case is different, Queen is assuming how to help Noelle while Berdly, in infamous timing, misunderstands why Noelle helps him in perhaps the most comical of his interactions with Noelle there is something very lonely about them "I know you only always helped me out because well... You had a crush on me, so..." Noelle to Berdly is the exception to the norm, the only reason people would even remember his name is because he was smart, but Noelle did so before he even became that smart kid and the only way he could explain it is the irrational, love at first sight. He doesn't understand that people just help one another (at least not until the teamwork mech) especially if they're friends.

They both thought they had a perfect formula in which people functioned, queen calculated the happiness of every Lightner, and Berdly the formula for everyone to remember his name, they were both wrong in the mere act of calculating a surefire way to those ideals.

The Calculations to a perfect World where everyone enjoys your presence and there is happiness to be found everywhere are by nature a catastrophic oversimplification.

Furthermore, there's a note to be had in that while Queen is a foil to Noelle, Berdly is, in turn, a foil to Queen. Noelle runs away from Queen runs away from "Burghley". I feel this is a reflection of how Berdly perceives how the world sees his true self. Unwanted unless proved useful. You can see how much Berdly is fighting over Queen's affection the "Gamers delight" and especially the statue, Berdly is trying to use his formula by demonstrating "I am smart my IQ is high and you can depend on me" to Queen as well as including her in the same definition.

Berdly's formula is not one that works and he is none the wiser.

Well, that's all for now, next chapter of the Berdly analysis we'll take a look at the Cyberworld's puzzles, the Positive Character arc of Berdly, and its resolution. Stay tuned to the Berdly tag gamers. "May the smarts be with you."

[the-meme-monarch]

Okay Honestly theory maybe the reason kris made another dark world was because they actually enjoyed going through them. Like they built stronger bonds with there friends (mostly Susie) that they wouldn’t of thought to make before. Or just maybe they are just too invested in the diff worlds lmao. Also you think Scc will have a bigger part at the end or will they just be side characters?

yeah i think they’re having fun with the dark world stuff!! i imagine their idea is “I’ll make a dark world, go through it, fix it, everything’s good” or maybe they straight up don’t believe ralsei about the roaring or they think he’s hiding something regarding it, I really don’t know ! but i definitely don’t think they’re being malicious in doing this

anyway I’m like dead positive scc are just gonna be side characters but also i so so dearly hope they get little implied side narratives going on like they did in chapter 2 (like how they were following you (and seemingly queen) around, saw you “help kidnap” noelle, interacting w berdly, rouxls, and spamton, and making the berdly statue, fixing the thrash machine, helping build your mech, etc it’s just so fascinating to me how much stuff throughout the chapter links back to them :’] like I hope you get to talk to them and they tell you more abt the music ban So We Can Find Out If It Was Even Real (I don’t think it is for a number of reasons, such as they’re the only ones to talk about it, no one in the mansion does, the only person to want to join their rebellion doesn’t mention it being over music (they’re a plugboy, and probably want to join bc of the Plugboys Getting Wired going on)

[plasticine-deer]

gummy's deltyrun ship chart bonanza.

OTP Kriselle - easily one of the most fascinating relationships in deltarune to me, both normal route and weird. I love them dearly and can’t wait to see where they go. I also think in a more canonical continuity a traditional romantic relationship wouldn’t feel right for them and perhaps they would thrive as queerplatonic partners instead. Y'know, they're “something else” Adspam - *arrow pointing at me* guy who got really invested into addisons as his ocs. You know how it is. Of course I love my adspam I made it up in accordance to what’s interesting to me Gasterspam - little guy meets eldritch grampa beyond his comprehension. Ten dead thirteen injured.

I enjoy

Krusie - I was team krusie in ch1 days and I still like them but nowadays I see them more as friends who might smooch if they’d like to. Krerdly - funny and cute. Addison polycule - see adspam above.

It's good Kris/Catti, Noelle/Catti - can't wait for the Catti and Jockington's spotlight. i think these ships might end up pretty good. Catti/Susie would probably go crazy too but she doesn't like her sighhh Queenkaard, Kingkaard, Queen and King - liberal family: female dad, beautiful fat husband, aging twink. Jevseam - they were a court magician, he was a court jester, can I make it any more obvious? Don't think it was ever official but there was *something* between them. Also queerplatonic. Tasque Manager/Swatch - I just like to imagine they like each other y'know T_T Could also be a brotp idc

BROTP

Fun Gang - no explanation needed. Ralsei and Susie specifically - Ralsei and Susie!!!! So glad to see them bond in ch2. Noelle and Berdly - screw everyone and everything I want to believe they genuinely like each other. Kris and Spamton - I'm not sure if they honestly feel anything positive for each other but boy do I need to see them hang out.

Meh

Su/se/l/le - nothing wrong about them but I usually don't care for canon couples much. I think I'm not in the demographic for the "awkward teen crush" either. Happy for those who find comfort in them though!

Complicated

Kra/ls/ei - it's a thing in the game and I think it has interesting elements to it. The way Ralsei always wants to provide an enjoyable and fun fantasy experience for the lightners, him possibly being based off of some Kris's belonging and such and so. However I'm certain Kris doesn't want their relationship to have a romantic context. Just look at Ralsei and what he represents xd As such I guess it's more like a Weird Route situation.

Dislike

I don't seeeeeeee it.

I think Spam and Swatch were polite to each other during the bshot years as a resident and the head butler and afterwards they don't think about each other much aside from feeling varying levels of contempt.

I can't imagine Spam and Jevil meaningfully interacting and also their designs clash if you put them next to each other.

[deltarune-au-domain]

DeepGrave AU (Ralsei Weird Route idea?)

Super proud of this one I made it all while I was in class

You have to have Ralsei pacify every enemy he attacks (Kris and Susie cannot make their enemies run away, do this at least 6 times, and then that snowgrave weird sound will play), then when you get to the trash area, you have to answer "Go with Ralsei", after that, Ralsei insists Susie goes on to the north alone, saying she's strong enough while he goes with Kris. You still allow Noelle to join the party, but she cannot make enemies run either. You make him attack every enemy after that with FlameBurst, a newly acquired spell which deals damage and makes enemies in a special state of tired called DOZY and make him pacify them, leaving them sleeping in the overworld. Interaction with them says

"...They're in deep sleep."

After enough enemies put to sleep, reaching Spamton, you can buy "SleepScarf", which raises Magic up to.. let's say 30? It also lets Ralsei cast a certain spell at 100%, like Snowgrave.

Reaching Berdly, Ralsei has grown almost entirely silent, rarely speaking. Noelle, since she's not the one being manipulated, joins Berdly, hoping to calm Kris and Ralsei down, and after attacking and pacifying Noelle and Berdly with Ralsei, you are automatically given 100% TP, and are given the choice to fight, act/magic, use items, spare, or defend. Choosing to spare them gives Ralsei some hope in the human hero by his side, and breaks him from his depression, and he's back to normal. It also makes Noelle and Berdly believe Kris and Ralsei were calmed down and Berdly leaves, with Noelle joining once more. The route plays out as normal.

But if you choose to use magic, you can force Ralsei to cast Deepgrave, an extreme version of Pacify, which makes it's targets go into a DEEP sleep, like in a state of "falling down". After telling him to cast it 5 times, Ralsei uses it and puts both Noelle and Berdly in a state of falling down. He doesn't leave the party, and follows you still. Interacting with either one will give you the text:

"...They're in a deep sleep. Try not to wake them up."

You will then climb the manhole and reunite with Susie, and she notices how distraught Kris is and how unusual Ralsei is acting. The route continues as it does in Snowgrave, and Ralsei never speaks. No matter how much Susie tries to get him to speak, he doesn't. The route continues even throughout the Queen encounter, with her noting how she could not find Noelle or Berdly. It's up to Susie alone to recruit Queen. Since she doesn't know of The Roaring at this point, she does at least remember the titans from Ralsei's legend. If you did not listen to his story in chapter 1, she refuses to speak about how she learned about it. You can then save your file next to queen, and you can proceed to the fountain.. well, you try, but Kris is held up by Susie to talk about what happened while they were gone, while Ralsei feels the need to go to the fountain, with the intention to look at it. He'll find the Puppet Scarf and equips it, noting that it looks like it was dropped in haste. Reaching the fountain, Spamton interrupts and the fight proceeds. How your soul is controlling him away from Kris, same logic as why your soul is helping susie in her fight with Lancer. After depleting enough HP regardless of how you attack, Spamton raises his Defense and lowers his Attack, and gives you extra dialogue, and which Spamton growing more tired. After 5 turns of dialogue, the screen goes black, and the Deepgrave sfx is played. Your soul, even still visible when the screen goes dark, moves up and seals the fountain.

Ralsei doesn't speak in Castle Town after Deepgrave, and the music gets slightly slower.

Neither Berdly nor Noelle leave the library.

Lemme know what you think and if you have anything you'd like to add, I'd love to hear it

__________________________

I think it's pretty good! I don't really have anything to add at the moment. Here's a drawing.

[corals-corner]

Headcannons it is :D

Starting with Queen:

She is a Clash of Clans goddess (look the game up if you don't know what it is)

She's responsible for making some of the most difficult Geometry Dash levels--again, look up the game if you SOMEHOW don't know what it is xP

Despite being a Windows XP computer, she can somehow change her own background theme in Hometown, causing anyone who sees it to get utterly confused and distressed

She cares for Noelle so much partly because she can sympathize with her on a level nobody else can

Going off the previous hc, I think she may have had a parent of hers die when she was young, assuming she had parents lol Idk

She secretly thinks Berdly's pretty cool despite all she did to him

She knows things about Kris, Susie, Berdly and ofc Noelle, partly because all of them have used her Lightner computer form at least a few times

Water wouldn't harm Queen, she's too OP for that

Queen didn't show up in Card Kingdom until she was in her early 20s, and likely didn't stay there for even a decade

Queen's in her early 30s by the time we meet her in-game, in my eyes 31-33

Now for Spade King, some might be the same as yours :>

Spade King didn't have the best parenting growing up and was always under heavy scrutiny/criticism, likely from a combination of anger issues and his parents having super high expectations

He hung out with the other kings but always felt like an outlier and felt left out, but never mentioned it to them. He never fully trusted them in terms of leadership skills and general competence

Spade King's parents either passed away or vanished somehow when he was a late teen and he had to learn how to be a ruler at a younger age. I personally think all the kings come from royal families, and Spade King's parents were the first to go. This forced Spade King to cooperate with the other, much older royals, which he did not like at all

C. Round was kinda Spade King's version of a family pet and one of the very few Darkners he actually enjoyed hanging out with as a child, and because of this he later let C. Round roam free as it pleased and never put any restrictions on it

Spade King absolutely hated Jevil even before Jevil went insane. I like to think Jevil went insane while all four kings were in charge, and before that often did acts for the kings' parents. Jevil would often target and tease Spade King when he was young, albeit in a silly and playful manner, but Spade King always held grudges against him for it

Seam is one of the very few Darkners Spade King respects, hence why Seam is just chillin' in their shop with no need to attack or imprison Kris & Susie in the first chapter. Spade King always liked Seam because Seam would often interact with him in a calm and compassionate manner when he was a child

Spade King always tried to make room for Lancer despite his very busy job, and was often the one who cooked for his son

Spade King knew how incompetent Rouxls Kaard acted but always believed Rouxls had tons of secret potential he was wasting away, hence why he promoted him to Duke of Puzzles in an attempt to get Rouxls to show his true colors, albeit it didn't work lol

Spade King mandated that all Rudinn Rangers wear visors to protect their faces so they don't accidentally hurt themselves with their longer knives, guards aren't really competent if they accidentally harm themselves all the time xP

One year for Halloween Spade King had Lancer dress up as a pumpkin while he himself dressed up as a blueberry, who says kings can't have a little fun sometimes?

Spade King's in his mid-to-late 30s in-game, likely around 34-37

Spade King is a coffee addict, Idc if you don't like coffee you have to admit the guy needs something to keep him functioning during the day

That is all :)

A LOT :DDDDD

Queenie my beloved

1. As someone who used to play that with certain hacks and cheats, she would absolutely spend hours attacking other clans and villages whenever she was bored. She'd like the Pekas and maybe the Archers

2. I will never forgive her for her crimes against my eyes and self esteem when it came to those levels.

3. Hehe she likes confusing people

4. AUGH FUUUUCK. Ok, this reminds me on the trans Noelle hc people have, and that with my own trans Queen hc, I can totally see queen maybe seeing a bit of herself in Noelle and wants to help her in many other things

5. Personally, my hc is that her parents were quite neglectful, not usually out of melisious intent, but because they didn't really understand how to take care of a child, but she always held them close to her heart, so despite everything, she would have still been really upset when this happened

6. BERDLY! Ngl, I always imagined that she wouldn't have minded spending more time with him, but because her objective required Noelle and not him, she kinda pushed him away in order to achieve her goal.

7. What has she seen in these guys search history

8. Thank god. Lancer would probably have done the water bucket above the door prank lmao

9. I always imagined darkners could travel between dark worlds, but I do see her not going to Card Kingdom until later, most likely due to a arranged marriage with King

10. That's actually pretty close to where I see her, but I tend to see her and King in a similar age, so personally I'd say between 35-40, but you're age seems more likely lmao

Now to Kingy :D

1. Abso-fucking-lutely. This man did not have a stable childhood which affected him with how he patented Lancer. Not even the previous monarchs liked his parents too much

2. I feel like he and the other king fought alot, both as kids and as adults. None of them fully trusted each other

3. Yeah, I imagin he was crowed between 17 or 18, so he was still very young and waa definitely not suitid to rule, epessilly along side monarchs he would have otherwise avoided. Not to mention they probably dismissed him since they were all older and experienced in ruling and didn't think he had any good input.

4. THATS SO CUUUTE!!! I can see baby king outside playing with c.round trying to teach him silly tricks and showing him off

5. Ngl, I see why you(and alot of other lol) think this, but personally, I like to think they were close. Historically, kings and jester were actually pretty close and the kings allowed jesters to do alot, so I like to implement that into dr.. it is fucked that he went after King when he was just a child. That is fucked and I understand why King held grudges (I would too lmao)

6. Lowkey, I love imaging that Seam is old as fuck and they often took care of baby king, sort of the same way Rouxls cares for Lancer, and he began referring Seam as a parental figure, sometimes accidently calling them "Mom" when he was tired

7. YES KING ALWAYS TRIED TO MAKE TIME FOR LANCER DESPITE HIS JOB IDC WHAT ANYONE ELSE SAYS HE LOVED HIS SON. Also hc king loves cooking for Lancer and always tried to cook himself, though it was rare considering he was usually busy

8. My man thought. Rouxls is definitely op but he's also pretty stupid when it comes to his powers and doesn't know how to use them to his full ability, despite the help and, let's be honest, threats from King, or hell, maybe even the other kings.

9. Now I'm just imaging the Rudinn Rangers out there fighting without any protection and the king are like "That's fine" while king flips his shit over their safety.

10. PUMPKIN LANCER AND BLUBERRY KING!!! King crying every time he sees Lancer in the costume because he's so god damn adorable. And King in a bluberry costume because fuck those people who think kings are always supposed to be serious and not have any fun

11. Absolutely. A chaotic son as well as a naturally chaotic kingdom and castle? He needs something to keep him going. This with his sweet tooth means he would Absolutely love mochas because of the added sugar and chocolate.

Oh boy this was long :'DDD

It was fun though :D

[teammateswap-au]

Honestly interactions between noelle and queen are kinda hard for me to write. noelle is still noelle but she’s also… berdly…. i think queen would still care tms!noelle like she does with the og. but would probably not like how bratty and annoying she can be. (which make sense because that’s how her mother feels about her). And also I have NO CLUE how to write queen with it sounding off. so there’s that—

queen basically have to deal with 2 berdlys. one is significantly less annoying than the other and more tolerable and the other is just a more hands off berdly.

[trg-deltarune-quotes]

Okay so this is just a rant about Kris and Berdly’s relationship but from Kris’s perspective. This isn’t really how I do analysis but I just needed to rant a bit.

In the SpamtonSweepstakes Kris is seen on Noelle's blog prank calling Berdly until he accidentally deletes his MInecraft game. That’s when Kris helps him get it back up and plays with him. Now some people think that Kris isn’t doing this because they like him but because he’s the only person they can go to to play multiplayer games with but I don’t believe that is the case. Berdly is an asshole towards Kris but so was Susie and they still wanted to be friends with her. They saw through her bully persona and knew that she isn’t that bad. It’s not too far-fetched to assume that they are doing the same with Berdly since they saw him try to help Noelle out and even gives credit to them for helping him, even if he doesn't know it's them. They do get annoyed by him from time to time but that doesn't stop them from pursuing and trying to be friends with him. 

They also show genuine concern for his well being after the Queen fight and have special dialogue if you interact with his room in Queens mansion.

[offbrand-deltatraveler]

You ever wonder why fan content of Deltarune’s future Chapters never really hits the same way as the real thing?

Like, no matter how accurate it can get to how things could go down in the original game, it always feels like something that you just can’t put your finger on is missing?

Or is that just me

If you are like me and do wonder why you feel that way, you’re in luck. Because what you’ve stumbled upon today an analysis post about it

Spoiler Alert: It’s not because of the ideas present in the Chapter 3+ take in question, nor is it because none of us are Toby Fox (Not directly, anyway)

It’s because we don’t add anything

—————————————————————————————————————

Not in the sense that we add nothing to the game’s story, considering we literally hand-craft the entire hypothetical story by ourselves. I’m talking about the… Revealed stuff, I guess

You know how in Chapter 1, when you check Asriel’s bed, the game console under it has two controllers? One official and one knockoff?

Originally, people thought the knockoff controller was used by Kris, and that this interaction was meant to further symbolize how the game frames them as a bit of a loser compared to Asriel. But it was actually revealed in Chapter 2 that this wasn’t the case. The knockoff controller was instead used by Asriel so Kris could have the real one

And you know how prior to Chapter 2, we didn’t have as much of an idea that Dark World food didn’t actually count as real food? We had that one Susie line to work with about nothing she eats there mattering, but it was more solidified once we saw that Kris ripped their Soul out to eat a pie because they were starving from how little they had eaten that day (And didn’t want us going outside to harass people in the middle of the night)

Or how, again, prior to Chapter 2, we had no clue that Berdly could’ve ever been into gaming? All we knew is that he was an asshole smart kid that likes to put Kris down about how much of a loser they are. He could never BALLIN’. Or so we thought

And or so we no longer think, now that 2 years later we’ve discovered not only that he and Kris are actually speedrunning rivals and that was just lighthearted banter, but also that he really was BALLIN’ after all, and that he and Noelle are a lot more than just one-time project partners

Something about Sans

You probably get the point by now, but in case you didn’t:

We don’t just add things

It’s because while we do do a lot of building in terms of Dark World stuff, that’s because it’s an unexplored Dark World. It’s new inherently, you can put literally anything you want in it as long as it follows the theme of that Dark World’s room. Unlike adding new Dark World characters, going wild as we explore the completely uncharted territory in front of us, everything we do with the characters we already have, Darkner or not, is ultimately based solely on that which we already know

Takes on future Chapters don’t have things like Catti & Kris’s occult studies, or Jockington’s zine. Or Noelle’s fear of mice or love for scary things. Or Queen sipping battery acid to the beat of the music after every text box (As well as Rouxls being her lamp). Third Dark World example (Hold On It Will Come To Me)

For whatever the reason may be, we don’t just make stuff up the way Toby does. We always either recycle old stuff or add references that are way too modern to be included in the real thing. And that’s why we don’t have that same “Literally anything could happen at any time” flair. Because anything can’t happen at any time, anything only happens in the times we know they’re supposed to happen

Not that you can really blame the makers of this fan content though, to be fair. It’s not something we really think about immediately and I’d imagine there are some concerns about how poorly some things might age, especially after what happened with Mike

Though I think the biggest contributor to that is how in the scene of future content, there’s just generally a lot of “This person is barely a character. Get outta here with that shit” instead of “Is there a reason this character would have a Dark World or fill this role?”. When talking about the future of a game who’s creator is famous for pulling complete 180’s, we can’t be shooting down ideas left and right because “Lmao this dumbass thinks Jockington will have a serious story”. We can’t be telling each other certain ideas are unlikely based on stupid things like “This character can’t be important! They don’t even have a unique text sound!!” or “This is a single door. Dark Worlds don’t appear behind single doors”. This kind of limiting logic just isn’t something the creator of the real thing would adhere to

Unless the person in question thinks that like. A character or version of a character that originates from UT’s universe affects DR in any way, or Rouxls is secretly Gaster and will betray you, assassinating Seam (who actually turned out to be the real Queen of Spades) as he transforms into The Angel in the secret 8th Chapter. Or anything else that either goes back on something Toby said previously or is just bad storytelling

But yeah, that’s why. With limited information comes limited results. Who’d’ve guessed /lh

And nobody’s to blame for that, it just is. That being said though, I’d hope reading this post has inspired at least one person to go crazy. Go out and like. Find this really insignificant detail and just add the shit out of that

Like be that one guy who made that theory that the kitchen could end up being an Undertale throwback in the Dark World. Unironically have Rouxls make Mac & Cheese in such a manner that nobody can stop him. Make the Yoshi Kris sacrificed for an extra jump a Secret Boss. Give Napstablook a tragic backstory. Include your wildest headcanon. The possibilities are almost endless

“I am cringe but I am free” and so forth

—————————————————————————————————————

I actually forgot I was terrible at ending posts for a sec

[mar64ds]

For the character asks, Geek, Queen, and Firestarter?

Geek

First impression

Impression now

That’s sam and max’s canon daughter

Favorite moment

I love when sam and max are like ‘thanks geeks you are awesome :)’ but that’s all the times they interact with her

Idea for a story

Father’s day and she invents some dangerous obstacle course because sam and max find that fun

Unpopular opinion

I actually like the idea that she was friends with Sam and Max at first and then became their daughter instead of being immediately their daughter

Favorite relationship

She and her dads

Favorite headcanon

Trans Geek is canon but sure lets say is a headcanon. Aro Geek too

Queen

First impression

Immediately loved her

Impression now

Queen is and will always be the funniest character in the game, toby fox is not going to write anyone funnier than her. She’s also genuinely really interesting and a good antagonist, it’s going to be really difficult to make a final boss character better than her

Favorite moment

Insert every funny line of Queen here

Idea for a story

I like thinking how her life was before moving to the library, in the card kingdom, I think it’s an interesting concept

Unpopular opinion

I don’t think the represents the mothers of everyone on the group, I think she mostly represents Noelle’s and most likely a bit of Berdly’s

Favorite relationship

Her and Noelle but also her and Lancer. But also her relationship with Toriel that I made up

Favorite headcanon

I think Queen likes women (Toriel)

Firestarter

First impression

I really thought he would have another personality based on his design, he seemed like a stoic cool guy, his face does not read like a shy nervous person. Same thing happened with Bellringer because his face also read to me like a clumsy nervous guy but he turned out to be a gossiper that knows everyone secrets lol

This is not me saying ‘bad character design’ or anything, I think they are both awesome and two of my favorite designs

Impression now

The second i realized what his actual personality was like I was sold, what a sweet guy. Love that he can’t stop setting things on fire i think it’s a really funny character trait. Plus canonically has a boyfriend he is so awesome

Favorite moment

I like the comic where he bakes cookies with Mouthpiece and sets the oven on fire and he just smiles and is so proud of himself :)

Idea for a story

I want him to be friends with Rainmaker I think they would get along so well… She’s water themed and he is fire themed and both have anxiety and are very sweet people, awesome friendship

Unpopular opinion

I don’t know what could be considered unpopular with this game so I’m just not going to answer this one lol

Favorite relationship

Him and Pacesetter of course :) I saw that portrait and thought wait? are they? Then I looked it up and yes :) Their personalities bounce off each other really well, I would love to see more of them they’re really sweet

Favorite headcanon

Not sure… Oh maybe he likes cats, the whole rescuing cats from trees and all of that. If Pluto used to exist in the toontown universe I assume there are regular animals in this universe too

[spellboundspook]

OK I had an idea for a snowgrave route involving K_K it's called Power Up (this is long just needed to get all my ideas for this au out there)

So to start the route you have to beat all the enemies with violence up until you fight Sweet Cap'n and K_K. You have to dance with K_K and only K_K and then buy the Mecha Saber from if you did I right you'll hear a ding

You fight Berdly as normal and Ralsei and Susie will leave you party as normal but after they leave a text box will appear saying

[For some reason you feel like you need to go back to the trash pit]

You can't go forward for here until you go back to the trash pit where you'll find K_K diging though the the trash she'll explain that she come here to find some cool stuff and got split from Cap'n and Sweet

K_K will then suggest to join your team cos kris friends have also split for them so you both can work together to find em so K_K will join you party

Their is then a Virovirokun in the next room kris and K_K fight it truly kicking off the run

I've always thought K_K would like the support/healer of the group who can't really deal good damage He has two moves Heal song and Power up

Heal song is just almond milk not much else to say

Power Up is a move that will will power up all ally moves depending on have much TP you have the more TP the stronger the move will be

You Truly start the route you need to use power up at max TP doing this will deal a lot of damage to the Virovirokun they won't run away and instead will turn red and then disintegration into dust

A text box will pop up with K_K looking horrified before they ask kris

"Kris did we just..."

The snowgrave ding will play you and K_K will can now progress forward

You keep progressing forward kill all the enemies with K_K powering up your moves noelle won't be in the room where you meet her though because you took a lot longer to get to her because you know

K_K will also sometimes just refuse to do what you ask the only thing they'll do all time without exception is using Power up or spareing

nothing happens story wise until you get to the Addison they'll talk about the Freeze ring but K_K will say that they don't really think they need a ring

When you walk away the Addison will ask

"You know you two may not want a ring but can Interest you in a brightlet?"

(The following interaction will then happen)

K_K: "a brightlet? Aww that sounds cool but I don't have that money?"

❤️:Get it :Let's go

K_K: "Oh your gonna get it for me? Thanks Kris how much is it?"

(Same as the freeze ring it is be one more D$ then you have)

K_K: "oh... we don't have the money sorry"

❤️:Get it :Let's go

K_K: "...get it? Kris we both don't have the money..."

❤️:Get it :never mind

K_K: "k-kris w..we don't have the money do you what me to steal it cause I will n-"

❤️:Get it :never mind

K_K: "K-kris... we can't just..."

❤️:Power up :never mind

K_K: "..."

(The screen will go black followed up by the sound of K_K using power up then a slash then the the turning to dust sound before they screen fade back)

(K_K: "did I just... do that... did I just help them... no no Kris must be doing this for a reason...)

K_K: "hey kris why are we doing this?"

❤:we need to get stronger to beat Queen :...

K_K: "...that... that makes sense ok let's go find somemore enemies..."

The snowgrave ding sound will then play

Their will be no music after the the conversion

K_K over world sprit will change from a happy smile to a more unsure smile this include all their battle sprits

The sprit they use for magic will also change from K_K throwing her hand in the air to silently praying

Now the Brightlet is an interesting item ìt ups K_K magic makeing so you need less TP to use Power up but it will also add the trance affect to K_K so they begin to question your judgement less but still have some control over their actions K_K will also auto equip the Brightlet and they will also no longer refuse to do what you say

The laser wall puzzle is the same kris stands on the first button and K_K will stand on the second one but K_K starts thinking to themselve after the puzzle

(K_K: "getting this bracelet was good right... its fine... we're just getting stronger...but why is it getting harder to think...why do I just wanna see kris... no no thats horrible")

:It's horrible ❤:it's natural

K_K: "huh I umm"

(K_K: "w...was I thinking out loud...)

The snowgrave cyber city music will start to play and until you get to spamton you won't get anymore dialogue

Spamton will tell you your kill count but when your done killing you can buy the Dazband from him for 1997D$

When you equip the Dazband to K_K their talk sprites overworld sprites and battle sprits will change their pupils go from the yellow colour they are to white and their expression will become more blank they also will do anything kris says without exception

Their will be no Berdly fight and you and K_K go through the snowgrave short cut to queen mansion their will no npcs and no susie and Ralsei

You defeat every enemy up to queen where she will be waiting for you she'll fight try and fight you but susie and Ralsei will show up tell up there some "dangerous freak" running around

Queen is just like why can't I fight them Ralsei explains why the fountain needs to be closed she like "oh didn't know that" but you make kris pull out their sword and they tell K_K to use Power up

K_K is just about to but Sweet and Cap'n show up panicked cos they where looking everywhere for her K_K at first is extremely confused as they don't remember anything after they equip the Dazband

Susie seeing how confused K_K is says

Susie: "kris told you to do something call power up? Don't know what that was about what have you two been doing"

K_K realising that they where just about to help kris kill queen and they can't even remember doing it they fall to their knees sobing cap'n and sweet immediately starts comforting K_K

Ralsei will say that now is probably a good time to seal the fountain

You can try and interact with K_K but the text will say

[he's just say "I'm sorry" over and over again now would be a good time to seal the fountain]

Like in snowgrave spamton is here and you have the boss fight with him the reason he got in cos queen was really distracted with the crisis going on

You call for everyone

Susie

Ralsei

Noelle

You then call K_K

The screen fades to black you hear the sound of power up being used a slash and then the sound of dust spreading

There are a few more differences like Sweet cap'n and K_K still have a shop in Castle town they still sell ya stuff but they all like a little down especially K_K

K_K also won't talk you can ask about K_K but they'll just tell you that K_K won't even tell them what happened

[lancerious]

I know your not big on shipping, so I wanted to ask,

What are your favorite strictly platonic relationships in UTDR?(besides Lancer and Susie obvs)

Ooooh, this is an interesting question! I haven't thought too much about it, but there are some platonic relationships I do like. These aren't in any particular order :P.

First is Susie and Kris! I really like seeing Kris and Susie slowly bond together over time. At the beginning of the game, Susie bullied Kris to no end, but they're honestly legitimate friends by now, and I'm sure their friendship will only increase the more the game progresses.

Next is a bit of a controversial one, but I really do like the relationship between Kris and Spamton. Sure, Spamton tries to kill Kris and their friends by the end, but for some time, Spamton was a silly little man. Did Spamton have malevolent intentions? Yes. But Spamton doesn't try to outright harm Kris until he turns into NEO, at least from what I remember. For a while, Kris is just interacting with a desperate and corrupted salesman.

Another platonic relationship I like is Noelle and Berdly, and by extension Noelle and Kris. Noelle is honestly a character who gets along with everybody, and I really respect that. Berdly seems like the type who doesn't have many friends, so being buddies with a kind and patient person like Noelle is definitely positive. And Noelle and Kris have known each other for quite some time! They used to hang out a lot from what we know. Some more background on their friendship would be cool to see!

This next relationship isn't really positive lol, but I LOVE how Swatch and Rouxls Kaard get along, or should I say DON'T get along. Most of it is due to Rouxls Kaard's arrogance and silly nature. I don't think we've seen those two characters interact directly--again, at least from what I remember--but boy, I would REALLY like to see that.

Another controversial platonic relationship is Jevil and Kris, Susie, and Ralsei. Jevil was definitely dangerous and certainly could have killed those three--I for one had to spend hours to get through his boss fight--but I don't really believe it was of purely malevolent intent. I think Jevil was trying to show them the truth, was trying to help them be free. Jevil had long since been insane, and his perception of right and wrong was twisted. And in the end, if you battle him the right way, he warns you about Queen before any other character. Nice!

Sticking with Jevil, I REALLY like his backstory with Seam. I can't say for certain if Jevil and Seam were legitimately IN a relationship--hello, Seavil fans--but for the sake of this post, I'm going to assume they were just friends. Close friends maybe, but friends. The pain of having to lock Jevil away must have been soul-crushing for Seam. Those two worked together, and knew each other really well. It's a shame their friendship had to end in such a somber way.

Rouxls Kaard. Rouxls Kaard and literally everyone. No, I will not elaborate.

This is more of a "hoping they become buddies later on" platonic relationship, but man, I really like the dynamic of Spade King and Susie. I really think Spade King is similar to Susie personality-wise, and they could genuinely get along if not for the current...issues put in place (Spade King despises Lightners, Susie despises Spade King, etc). But even now, seeing those two go back and forth is still refreshing with every playthrough.

This is definitely another controversial one: I really enjoy the dynamic amongst Spade King and his citizens in Chapter 1. The Darkner citizens fear Spade King to no end, and most are forced to attack your party. Well, all of them are forced, but not every Darkner outright attacks you. We even see a Rudinn who refused to fight get imprisoned later that same chapter. It's super sad, but incredibly interesting at the same time.

And for the final few platonic relationships, we have the one and only Lancer! I won't mention Lancer and Susie again, but I will mention other platonic relationships.

Since I've already mentioned this before in my Lancer document, I'll simply state it here: Lancer and the Darkner citizens in Chapter 1 has got to be one of the saddest dynamics ever. It's even making me sad thinking about it :(.

Lancer and Kris/Ralsei. Lancer may like Susie the most, but he gets along with Kris and Ralsei too! Both Kris and Ralsei do their best to treat Lancer well and be as kind and friendly to him as possible, and I really like that. Lancer deserves those three, for sure.

Lancer and Queen! What interests me most about this particular one is the fact that Queen...doesn't really know how to be a parent. Queen's a computer, while Lancer's not. They're both very different characters. It'll be interesting to see how they get along as the game progresses!

Okay, I know I already mentioned Rouxls Kaard, but I need to mention this specific relationship. Rouxls Kaard may be the king of goofing up, sure, but he does legitimately try to be a good father to Lancer. He might complain about Lancer from time to time, but he does care and wants to do his best. Part of it may be because of Spade King looming behind the scenes, but honestly, I think that's a minor reason. Rouxls Kaard seems to be a character with a lot of heart, even if he messes up a lot.

And finally, last but certainly not least, Lancer and Spade King. What can I say about this father/son relationship that I haven't said already? Spade King may be a...questionable parent, at least from what we know, but he does care about Lancer. He wants what is best for his son, even if his methods for showing it are highly controversial. And seeing Lancer care for his dad after everything he's done is so heart-warming. I really want these two to establish a proper, genuine, healthy father/son relationship by the time the game ends.

Well, that's everyone I can think of! This list ended up being longer than intended lol. I guess I had a lot to say.

Thanks for the question! I enjoyed answering it :)!

[zombvibes]

Hey since ur correct all the time, I just wanted to know your take on. Queen deltarune. And how she would interact with the tms! kids.

Though I have NO CLUE how write or characterize Queen yet (just like…everyone else who isn’t susie and noelle), I like her!! Her design, her character, her dialogue, the way she interacts with the rest of the cast (and she felt like a threatening villain at times), it’s all great honestly! I could more into depth but I’m not good at articulating my thoughts when it comes to character analysis— (or…arguably literally any subject). I will say “I just want everyone to be happy and if I have to be a villain to do so, is that bad?” really really does describe her. That’s basically the tldr of what I was gonna say anyways—

ALSO YAAAYY TEAMMATESWAP ASK!!!!

Susie was VERY aggressive to Queen at first. She tends to be very protective of her friends (or just…anyone she doesn’t automatically hate). So of course if she sees someone she likes in danger, she would automatically go into “KILL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!” mode when she sees the person or thing endangering her friends. Afterwards though she becomes her normal self around pretty girls…you know :

(Though she’s still a little protective over Noelle when it comes her…)

Because Noelle hates authority figures and hates being told what to do (outside of school), she was basically acting like a brat towards her (on purpose) and insults her behind her back too. (Like I said before Queen was just getting her ass handed to her by 2 lesbian teenagers…) Noelle wasn’t really taking anything seriously and humors Queen from time to time. Like asking if she gets paid for being a peon (she does not) and was also being very sarcastic to her as well. But even then, she joins with Queen because she wouldn’t leave Noelle alone. (Btw yes, Noelle still hides from Queen because she’s annoyed by her and yes she still uses the robo face box.)

Berdly acts the same way normal berdly acted to Queen except maybe a little more focused on finding Noelle than sucking up to Queen. (Though he DEFINITELY still sucks up to her. He sucks up to everyone he sees as an authority figure unlike Noelle.)