#and well canonically i interact with . basically shallan.

[femmefaggot]

you dont like kadolin??? youre my only......? deliciously naive???? whitespine uncaged?? lesbian shallan? bwahh?

[theothersecret]

I need to say this so bad guys have you seen Nimona? Balister. Balister guys. I’m about to spoil the movie so spoiler warning for Nimona, this is also and primarily about Kaladin Stormblessed btw

First of all Jessie Gender made a review of this movie and the new Spiderverse movie and she described what I’m about to attempt to way better than I ever could so here’s the link to her explanation.

But basically watching Nimona gave me so many feelings and also a great example of what frustrates me about Kaladin’s character, so here I go again-

What frustrates me the most about how Kaladin is treated in canon is that we see how much Alethkar has failed him, and every darkeyed person, and every Parshman, and yet Kaladin’s badassery arch is supposed to be how he proves himself as a Knight Radiant. This system that’s failed him continues to do so throughout the whole series, getting better at times in portrayal, but that’s the way Alethkar has functioned for so long. We’re meant to see that not all lighteyes but to be perfectly honest it frustrates me that the people still making the big decisions in this series are the people the system brings into power, not Kaladin, not the other “underdog” types. He still works under them and constantly deals with the ways Alethkar’s rules about eye color have shaped all of the people he interacts with. Like Jessie says, nobody’s made to change for Kaladin. He has to change for them.

And even worse is that the other huge conflict Kaladin faces is his internal struggle with mental health and his relationship to himself. Kaladin’s perspective of his worth and what he deserves is royally fucked because of the trauma he’s gone through and the ways he’s dealt with it. Kaladin does not believe that he’s a good guy who deserves to be happy and deserves respect. He’s a depressed lower class darkeyed soldier, previously enslaved, that saw his brother die in war, something that is part of Alethkar’s very foundation and core values, something that is undeniably out of his control and built so deeply into the system, and yet Kaladin feels like he failed his brother. He assigned himself the guilt and responsibility for what happened because he was in the battle, not realizing that the anger he holds toward the men in charge is completely called for. Not realizing that he was a teenage child soldier who literally could not have done shit to control anything about that event.

All of this build up for his character could have been so well executed—and that’s such a fucking shame. The stormlight archive is far from finished, but is Sanderson going to actually give Kaladin the arch that he, and the people who go through things synonymous with his struggles, deserves to see?

Going to my actual point bringing Nimona into this, Balister is a great example of what I wish to see be done with Kaladin. It’s a completely different scale of a story, but what I love about him is that he comes to realize that he was never going to be what he was promised he could be as a knight. He was recruited as a diversity hire and trained as a show of good faith towards “inclusion,” not justice. Not change. He realizes that the system he serves isn’t what he cares about, but instead what he cares about is the way the person he loves sees him. His focus shifts from earning his respect through serving a system that was never made for him, to opening his eyes to the pain he and others like him have had to endure, and sharing that pain whole heartedly to make a change.

If I could wish anything for Kaladin, it’s that he’s shown some damn respect. I want somebody to walk in on him getting frustrated with Dalinar, with Adolin or Shallan, and say, “What you’re thinking is right. You do not have to accept this.”

Because Kaladin’s struggles are so real, and Sanderson somehow managed to convey that, it’s so entirely possible to tie his arch together with those beliefs he has about himself and Alethkar being brought into the spotlight and reevaluated. I feel like Sanderson will probably (hopefully) do this with Kaladin’s struggles with guilt and shame, his pattern of assigning himself the blame for things outside of his control, and the aspects of his turmoil that are internal.

But my fear is that the same won’t happen for what’s happening outside of Kaladin. And this is where my opinions come into play, because I do not believe that a few good guys are going to enact the systematic change that needs to happen for like, half of Alethkar and probably beyond. I don’t think Kaladin can swear an oath to protect those who can’t protect themselves, and then sit back and aid the people who did this to them try to figure out how to not be bad. No, I think he should give those powerless people that power to protect themselves. I think the very best thing Sanderson could do with Kaladin as a character is to have him realize that he can’t save everyone, but he could fight for them to have a chance of defending themselves. That he’s been looking in the wrong places for what he needs. I would love love love to see him reprocess his memories, his internal beliefs about himself, and while he heals those long-ago formed wounds, come to reprocess alongside the lies he believed about himself, the lies he’s believed about how to save the world, and his place in it. I want his self love to be intrinsically tied to this. Imagine how fucking fantastic of an arch that would be for him.

[moash]

i am curious to hear the other directions u didnt like about row! u have good takes ♥️

aaaaaaa thank you, idk honestly, my brain wheels are just sort of spinning tonight about different things. row for me was probably the weakest book of the series, just organizationally there was a lot going on and characters disappeared for a long time and then by the time they showed up again you had lost the forward momentum for their arc. i saw a review of row that also mentioned that none of the original main trio (kaladin, shallan, dalinar) actually really did much that was plot important. the stuff w kaladin in the tower, much of what he did didn’t actually change much, shallan didn’t really actually help adolin in the trial he plot was personal, and dalinar... well like dalinar did basically nothing except that one bit at the end where he went to see ishar and ishar was like “follow me for a plot thread for the next book ;)” thinking about dalinar especially, like we’ve talked before about how following ob dalinar in row is so colossally disappointing. i also saw a post recently about how cool it would have been if moash had had a scene where he saw what venli was doing for the singers, and acknowledged it without turning her in, bc it would fit w his character so far, and help round him out a little. and i was struck by just like.... yea.

it also doesn’t help that i have a friend who’s reading wok rn and texting me updates, and she got to the chapter where dalinar is digging the latrine (one of my favorites!!) and this is something she and i have talked a lot about wrt our dnd games, but like when he says “if they had the technology to make shardblades, why didn’t they make shard-tools to help the common people? why are there only weapons?” and it’s like that whole idea of like how do we get out of a mindset of thinking only about war and violence, and move to thinking about how we can build and make life easier. i just feel like that idea hasn’t been carried through as much as i hoped when i first read it, and being reminded of it today reminded me of where dalinar is at now and so on and so on.

also also i’m working on this fic and it’s a moash redemption arc right, but the more i get into the more i’m like, ok well so i do think there’s going to be a moash redemption arc in canon (brandon sanderson do not interact) but i bet it’s just gonna be like, so regret self-flagellating, you know? which is a mindset i (catholic) am trying to get out of more and more in my writing. i don’t think he should feel too bad about killing elhokar or roshone, but to be clear, the other stuff in row is fair game.

idk!!! im just sort of thinking about the book, and like. i think i would like to reread ob and row back to back, bc in my head there’s so much disconnect between where we left the characters in ob and where they started in row, part of that is the time skip, part of that is the way i marathoned the first three books and then had to wait for row to come out, but idk there’s just thoughts bouncing around!!!! that post about lirin was good, honestly i didn’t really know what lesson we were supposed to get out of those kaladin and lirin scenes. i’d like to reread w more of a focus on those things.

[moiraineswife]

Jasnah Meta - The Importance of Context

AKA: PLEASE stop saying that Jasnah is pro-genocide when she is. Not. At all. In any way. Shape or form. Whatsoever. 

TL;DR: Nowhere, at any point, in four ginormous books of text, does Jasnah ever say ‘you know what’s great? Genocide.’ She never even implies. It she never even actually, seriously, suggests it. Please stop saying she does as though it’s canon I lose 12 years of my life every time it’s mentioned. 

AND NOW FOR THE LONG VERSION BECAUSE Y’ALL KNOW I CAN’T LEAVE IT AT THAT!!!!! 

PLEASE NOTE! THERE WILL BE SOME MINOR RHYTHM OF WAR SPOILERS IN HERE. PLEASE AVERT YOUR EYEBALLS IF THIS IS A DISTRESSING CONCEPT TO YOU.

So first things first, let us discuss The Scene Itself: 

“Yes. The answer is obvious. We need to find the Heralds.”

Kaladin nodded in agreement.

“Then,” Jasnah added, “we need to kill them.”

“What?” Kaladin demanded. “Woman, are you insane?”

“The Stormfather laid it out,” Jasnah said, unperturbed. “The Heralds made a pact. When they died, their souls traveled to Damnation and trapped the spirits of the Voidbringers, preventing them from returning.”

“Yeah. Then the Heralds were tortured until they broke.”

“The Stormfather said their pact was weakened, but did not say it was destroyed,” Jasnah said. “I suggest that we at least see if one of them is willing to return to Damnation. Perhaps they can still prevent the spirits of the enemy from being reborn. It’s either that, or we completely exterminate the parshmen so that the enemy has no hosts.” She met Kaladin’s eyes. “In the face of such an atrocity, I would consider the sacrifice of one or more Heralds to be a small price.”

“Storms!” Kaladin said, standing up straight. “Have you no sympathy?”

“I have plenty, bridgeman. Fortunately, I temper it with logic. Perhaps you should consider acquiring some at a future date.”

So the only time Jasnah actually brings up this concept it’s to, hyperbolically, point out that asking the Heralds to return to Braize and trap the Fused may not be the worst idea.

She’s not actually suggesting this as a valid or legitimate tactic. It’s to contrast the plan Kaladin just called her ‘insane’ for suggesting (I bet that’s gonna hurt a million times more than it already does in 900 years when we get Jasnah’s book and backstory but hey. Back on topic) and point out that, in the face of the apocalypse, this is the kind of level they have to think on. 

I’ve already talked about the nuances of this scene at length here, so I’ll just do a quick summary: Jasnah is not as composed about any of this internally as she makes out to be - even what she suggests with the Heralds. 

When we see her alone with Ivory, reading Taln’s repeated mantra, Ivory notes that she’s troubled. The words (and where he was/how he was being treated when they were recorded) is enough to trigger a twenty year old flashback in her. 

This scene is one of the clearest moments (along with the Kharbranth thug scene, I suspect) where Jasnah’s outward projection of her internal feelings and thoughts least matches up with reality.

In spite of the inflammatory remark that sparks this all off,  she doesn’t want to assassinate any Heralds. She quite clearly says she wants to “see if one of them is WILLING to return to Damnation.” She wants to have a conversation with them, understand the Oathpact, and see if any of them would consent to buying them some time. She is not suggesting they knife one of the Heralds in a back alley. That’s Moash’s job.

This is supported by what she does in canon. Jasnah is actually the one who recognises Taln and Ash and, somehow, manages to persuade them to join her at Urithiru and help. She treats them with nothing but dignity and respect in her scenes with them in Rhythm of War, and tries to find out more about the Oathpact and their options - as she said she wanted to do.

But since Jasnah is a Kholin, which means the ‘D’ in her DNA stands for DRAMA, she doesn’t say that, instead she says: “let us find the Heralds and kill them.” (I love her so much y’all. Ahem. Anyway).

But there’s method to this madness, too. Please click the ‘keep reading’ button to discover why! (have to turn my own posts into clickbait bc they’re so long I have to put in a cut to spare ur dashboards). 

Jasnah likes to push people. She likes to force them to think, and consider all angles of a problem, and come to terms with their own thoughts and opinions. This is one of the things that frustrates Shallan about Jasnah in TWOK: 

Shallan caught a victorious glimmer in her eye. She wasn’t necessarily advocating ideas because she believed them; she just wanted to push Shallan. It was infuriating. How was Shallan to know what Jasnah really thought if she adopted conflicting points of view like this?

-TWOK 36

Jasnah doesn’t want to brutally murder the Heralds and force them to return to their maddening idea of hell. But in phrasing it as she does, she can get an insight into Kaladin. Despite the fact we know him very well at this point, this is, this is the first time Jasnah has interacted with him on-screen, and only the second time she’s met him ever. 

“That Windrunner. What do you think of him, Shallan? I find him much as I imagined his order, but I have only met him once. It has all come so quickly. After years of struggling in the shadows, everything coming to light—and despite my years of study—I understand so very little.”

Oathbringer, 33

Jasnah in that scene is deliberately being as exaggerated, ruthless, cold, and harsh as she can get away with. She’s trying to push Kaladin. She wants to bait responses from him, to get an idea of what kind of man he is, and what he stands for. She focuses entirely on him on that scene, and the reactions we as readers get see that as well. 

“If you wish, Captain,” Jasnah snapped, “I can get you some mink kits to cuddle while the adults plan. None of us want to talk about this, but that does not make it any less inevitable.”

“I’d love that,” Kaladin responded. “In turn, I’ll get you some eels to cuddle. You’ll feel right at home.”

Jasnah, curiously, smiled.

 Jasnah likes to be pushed as well. She likes to have people push back with her, and stand up for themselves, assert themselves, make their arguments. She all but encourages Dalinar to publicly do so in RoW. 

Socially, in spite of Kaladin’s rank or status as a Windrunner, it’s probably 100% Not Acceptable to ask an Alethi princess if she wants a basket full of eels to cuddle because she is one, effectively. But Jasnah’s unphased - and even pleased - by Kal’s response. She likes that she’s seeing this from him, that he’s unguarded, and passionate, and more than willing to go toe-to-toe with her, which few people are.

Also, because I foresee potential problems in this meta that I would like to nip in the bud right now, I don’t think that Jasnah is doing this to play with people? That’s not really in her nature or who she is. There’s a purpose to everything she does, and there’s a purpose to her doing this, too.

With Shallan it was to encourage her to think for herself and form her own thoughts and opinions. Just before in that scene, Shallan asked why Jasnah couldn’t just tell her what to think and what was the right philosophy to have in life. Jasnah replied it was something she had to discover for herself - and that’s how she approaches all of their studies. 

Jasnah never teaches Shallan what to think, or even what happened, despite that being the meat of her study. Instead, she teaches Shallan how to think, how to study, how to learn, how to critically reason, and how to form and argue her own thoughts and conclusions. 

With Kal, I think it’s a quick and brutal way of quickly getting to grips with a new, very important, element in what’s going on in her world. Remember, too, that one of Jasnah’s most obvious aims, aside from protecting the world, is protecting her family. And Kaladin is very close to everyone that she loves and holds most dear, while she knows nothing about him. 

However, something else that’s important to note, which, for me anyway, RoW all but confirmed: Jasnah has low cognitive empathy.

She’d come to realize, early in her youth, that she didn’t approach relationships the same way everyone else seemed to. Her partners in the past had always complained that she was too cold, so academic. That had frustrated her. How was she to learn what others felt if she couldn’t ask them?

Chapter 99 really was an absolute fucking gift, I mean really. Asexuality AND low empathy, all in one go. What a delight.

This little snippet can be read as her being asexual, potentially, but I actually think it reads more heavily and obviously about her being neurodivergent? And specially low cognitive empathy. Brandon says that, to him, Jasnah is not autistic spectrum, but you just keep giving me more evidence to say she is buddy!! Anyway. Diagnostic debates aside. 

I would guess some of y’all don’t know what the heck I mean by ‘cognitive empathy’ (I didn’t before I researched all of this a couple of years ago). 

There are two types of empathy, in strict psychology terms (and then there’s the colloquial way we use it to just mean ‘a good person with feelings’ which drives me BANANAS but that’s a rant for another day): 

Affective empathy - which basically means ‘this person around me is happy/sad/excited, I am also now feeling that way. Because emotion is infectious like a cold! How thrilling’. 

Cognitive empathy - is the ability a person has to pick up on/know what others are feeling without having to be told. Using tone/body language/facial expression etc etc. It’s something I, and a lot of other autistic people, are bad at. 

So is Jasnah! 

Her previous partners disliked her probably verbally vibe checking them every other week to find out where they were at. Jasnah was frustrated because how the heck else is she meant to know wtf?? What an absolute mood this woman is. Anyway. 

This revelation/confirmation makes a LOT of Jasnah scenes make a lot more sense. Including: chapter 64, and her insistence, to the point of it almost being illogical, that she fight without her Surgebinding to try and get as clear a picutre of what her soldiers are facing as she can. Jasnah starts off that chapter by saying she’s never actually been in a war before, and states throughout that she wasn’t prepared for what it was actually like. 

Her low empathy means that, without a personal context/experience to relate to and draw emotional experience from, she struggles to understand exactly what her troops are going through. 

Obviously she knows that ‘war is bad, battles are scary and not fun’. But she has no way of emotionally relating/truly understanding what they’re feeling. This is one of the reasons I think it’s so important to her, despite Ivory’s chiding, to do it that way so that she can understand. 

Similar thing is happening here with Kaladin. Jasnah struggles to instinctively Get Vibes from people, so she goes about things in a very scholarly way. 

She does research and makes notes (see: her little folio on the highprinces (which, by the way, misses out on several important aspects of them Shallan picks up on pretty quickly by the power of Intuition), she asks questions - and she sets up scenarios that push people into blatant emotion so she can observe and get an idea of what makes them tick. 

TL;DR TAKE TWO: Jasnah does not want to murder all of the Singers. Jasnah never says she wants to. Jasnah only uses it as a ‘see, asking the Heralds to go back to Damnation isn’t actually that bad now is it?’ hyperbolic counterpoint after Kaladin asked her if she was insane. Jasnah is not actually what she pretends to be in that scene. She is but a hapless gay who cannot detect emotions so she has to conduct her Vibe Checks differently from other people. She is highly valid in every way and i stan her.

[athalwen]

4, 6, 10, and 27?

4. Who is your favorite cosmere character and why?

Aw, man. There are so many good ones. But anyone who keeps an eye on my blog probably knows that I’m unhealthily devoted to Hoid, so that’s always going to be my go-to answer. And the reasons for that are very complicated, but basically I’ve spent a lot of time with him figuring out text and subtext and reading dialogue out loud with @brightnessrandom (okay yes it’s super nerdy but actually really helpful if you’re trying to catch stuff). She came up with the line “everyone knows about Hoid, but no one knows Hoid” and it became our goal to try to know Hoid as a person, not just the things about him, and we’ve been doing pretty okay. So I’m very attached. 

6. What order of knights radiant are you?

I’m a Lightweaver! The only one that might compete is Willshaper, but we don’t know much about them and I’ve done so much thinking/analysis about Lightweavers with Brighty that I’ve solidified my place with them pretty well. 

10. Do you ship anyone in the cosmere? 

Low-key yeah, but they’re mostly canon ships anyway. I always liked Shallan/Adolin, and Siri/Susebron are a good, and I’ve gotta put Wax/Steris in there (I did not see that coming but man it hit me hard). 

27. What do you want from the next Stormlight book?

Well obviously I’m gonna need more Hoid/Shallan interaction because that dynamic is my absolute favorite dynamic. More development for Kaladin, because he’s an amazing character but has a lot of potential to go farther. Jasnah’s Soulcasting. Shallan starting to learn Soulcasting. Lift and Szeth being unlikely friends. Renarin. Timbre (whose name gets mispronounced and it makes me sad because it makes a whole lot of sense for the name to come from the musical term, pronounced “tamber”). Sooooo... a lot of awesomeness? Also, and I know this probably won’t happen, I would really like to see Hoid either completely out of his element or being totally awesome (seen both and can’t decide which I like more) but we likely won’t get that for a while, because it’s too cosmere-centric...

Thanks for the human interaction! I love it!