#and people still have the guts to hate him

[catcake24]

A Butler and the Villainness

(This is only a first draft FYI, just wanted to post it while I was still thinking about it.)

Lady Nightshade has never been the same since the day her carriage crashed.

It was an accident, no proof of sabotage, but Hawthorne would not have been surprised if there had been. Miss Nightshade was hated by all who knew her, from the village she tormented to the other nobles who only tolerated her egotistical behaviour and cruel indulgences due to her family’s wealth and influence. But even then, she had lost much of it over time from her behaviour.

Despite it all though, Hawthorne could never leave her. The late Nightshades, decent enough people, had been born into their wealth yet used it well. They lifted him from a mere homeless veteran into their butler who they considered a close friend, and he wanted to repay all the debts he owed them, and thus their daughter after their deaths.

She had been raised in the lap of luxury, and with the sudden passing of her parents at a young age, she only had governesses and distant family members to raise her. It was hard on her, and Hawthorne could see how it twisted the spoiled young girl into the monster they all knew. It was no excuse for her poor behaviour, but Hawthorne felt like he needed to stay by her side even as she squandered all the privilege she was gifted.

But after that crash, she had changed. She had a few days of confusion after, which the doctor explained as mild hysteria after such a head injury, but soon her personality had been completely changed even as she regained her footing in this world.

Lady Nightshade spent many of her days within the library, gobbling up all she could find despite never being a lover of books before. Some days, Hawthorne had to bring meals to the giant room just to remind her to eat, and the maids often had to ask her to bathe if she got too lost in her new studies. It was annoying but compared to the menace she was to the staff before, no one minded. She even thanked them every time they helped her, or when she asked for a meal it was meek and spoken like she could get one herself if she chose – which was madness for a lady of her standing.

She started apologising to those she had wronged within the village, and those at her school. Other young lads and ladies she had once tormented were often invited to play croquet or for lavish meals during a celebration. She gave out gold coins to young children who asked nicely, and those who didn’t merely got a silver or bronze coin.

Soon, Lady Nightshade had become the most generous donor in their town – tipping well to any service she received from them and only showed the utmost respect.

Even political enemies she had made started to soften, as she apologised and gave all she could when she could.

She also strangely took up new hobbies, such as gardening and hunting for sport. She even insisted on gutting some of the animals she caught, like her father once did. She looked disgusted by the prospect, but insisted she was shown anyways or even brought a book to instruct herself.

And the strangest habit was how she treated Hawthorne himself. Whenever he brought her tea, she insisted that he bring the tea bag separately and inspected the water beforehand. She was always careful around him, hesitant to have him be near her or to be behind her. Like he was a threat, an idea which punctured his heart at the thought of. What had he done to make her so distrustful of him, he didn’t know.

But even so, grudges did not die so easily.

Some forgave her, but a young woman refused to – bright blonde hair and electric blue eyes, she was a peasant who was ruined by Lady Nightshade, according to her, and would never overlook that with her new kindness. The men she attracted, princes and nobles of high influence, listened to the woman, and insisted she was not to be trusted – that this was all a farce, something even Hawthorne couldn’t completely deny. Soon she was made an outcast despite her generosity, with only a few staying by her and even fewer doing so for more than how they could use her.

Her generosity itself also didn’t go unpunished, as vultures just as well off as her started coming to their door and begging for help, saying they would be ruined if she did not, and the newly bleeding heart lady couldn’t reject their pleas. They were wealthy beyond measure, but she had to meticulously plan their collections to make sure she could afford to fund all the projects and people she could. It was like she did not care for herself anymore, only for others, and yet they only sought to take advantage.

Even the peasants who she tried to help and even mingle with during festivals still side eyed her, and often spoke in hushed whispers about how she must be hiding her true nature.

Lady Nightshade tried to bear it all with a smile, but Hawthorne could still hear the cries from her study some nights.

One night, despite the fact he was just about to take off his gloves and retire for the day, he heard her crying and couldn’t leave her there.

He took out the tea set, and resisted the urge to prepare it himself. He could tell the tea the Lady made was always over steeped, yet she always insisted on making it herself, and so he complied and set the tea aside separately and prepared milk and sugar.

Balancing it on one hand, easy for a well trained and old butler like him, he knocked on her door. She didn’t seem to hear though, and as he was about to announce his presence, he heard her talking through the door.

“Why?!” She cried, hiccupping. “I did everything right, so why am I still getting the bad end? Why does she still hate me, I’ve done all I could!”

His brow furrowed, confused by her language. She made it sound like she knew what was happening, and desperately wanted it to stop. “This isn’t fair,” she sniffled, “I don’t want to die.”

He had to sit with that proclamation for a moment, shocked by it.

Many had troubles with her, but most were minor now. Even those she had horribly offended like the king had given her another chance and had only seen change from her, so why would she think she was going to die?

Unless… the peasant girl threatened her?

Steeling himself, he knocked again, speaking up, “My Lady, I have tea for you. May I enter?” He said.

She made a surprised noise, there was some shuffling, before she told him to come in.

There were tear stains on her face, which was flushed from crying, and she was trying to wipe away her makeup with a handkerchief. She wasn’t sitting perfectly lady like, legs spread and wearing pants of all things, but he did not say anything – these were her quarters after all, and many had strange habits when they were alone. Part of being a butler was seeing these vulnerable moments sometimes.

As he served her though, he could only think that maybe he should keep his musket and bayonet nearby, in case of any attacks in the night.

His lady was still not perfect, but he made a promise to her parents.

At one time, before the crash, he was feeling his resolve slowly chip away over the years. He might’ve been just a few years away from quitting or letting the woman reap was she had sewn. But no longer.

She was a changed woman, however the carriage crash changed her. She wouldn’t dare harm even a fly and had done everything within her power to make the world better – even more than her parents did.

His resolve was restored, and he would never betray Lady Nightshade no matter how many riches were offered.

(The idea of this was that the butler originally betrayed the villainness, with a few different ways depending on the ending of the original game, and so Lady Nightshade was kind of terrified of Hawthorne. If I made this into an actual longer story, it would probably have her slowly come to trust him and even see him as a male parental figure, and the same with seeing her as his daughter. I hope this came across well enough.

Also I went with the idea that fate is still pushing her towards a bad ending for her, with things still going wrong even as she tries to do good or from before she was isekaied, but some things have completely changed like Hawthorne defending her not betraying her.)

A butler notices his lady of the house has changed—meek and kind instead of evil. One day, he overhears her crying: "Why?! I did everything right, so why the bad end?! This isn't fair... I don't want to die."

[steelbluehome]

Thoughts regarding the Thunderbolts* credits scene under the cut

ETA: turned out to be a long rambling rant, you have been warned!

Tldr: Please don't be hateful to each other. Marvel is ultimately in it for the money, but your fellow fans are real people.

Okay, now I know that there is starting to be a bit of fandom discourse regarding the Sam and Bucky meeting that "didn't go well", the lawsuit, and the New Avengers.

Fine with me so long as it stays all in good fun. But before you decide which character is "right" or "wrong", and definitely before you go all in with the hate, remember that we don't know all sides yet. We don't know yet how the MCU is going to continue with this storyline, or if they even will, considering how many characters are going to be in Doomsday. It's possible that they just show up at a fight, nod at each other, and all fight together with everyone else, Endgame-style, without resolving anything.

But, sometimes, the facts in the comicbooks come into it, and the roster of the New Avengers, as found on Wikipedia, does not include most of the characters in Thunderbolts*. It includes Captain America and Sentry. But in the comics, team membership is more fluid. Members come and go. The idea that there can only be one team doesn't come up a lot. More often there might be a clash of who is the leader.

But the MCU is different. They need to have continuity, and the idea of belonging to a team, expressly telling a new member that "you are an Avenger now" has been given importance. So it is possible that the MCU does really want to make a thing out of this copywrite issue.

If the MCU goes that way, will the determining factor be that one team is backed by the government and one is not? If they try to re-hash the Accords debacle all over again, both Sam and Bucky were Team Cap, against the Accords. So would this bring them together, maybe under yet another name?

It seems to me that CA:BNW had a theme of proving yourself. And Thunderbolts* has a theme of found family. TFatWS, IMHO, had both themes.

With the mass amount of characters which have to be accommodated in Doomesday, I assume that if this is addressed at all, the theme will be more like the enemy of my enemy is my friend.

I would certainly enjoy many long, character conflict driven scenes of Sam and Bucky, but I really don't see that happening in Doomsday.

If it is going to somehow be a major part of the storyline in Doomsday, it is possible that there will be some sort of twist that we can't possibly see coming at this point.

For instance, I thought that the whole point of the entire series, The Falcon and the Winter Soldier, was the end point, where Sam had decided that he could be Captain America without betraying his core identity, and that Bucky's core identity was a good man who could be accepted by other good people, not only Steve who knew him before he fell into the hands of Hydra. And I thought the final scene of them both together at a cookout with Sam's family and friends, where Bucky seemed to have been fully accepted, and was totally comfortable, was meant to show that they had each found what they were looking for in the support of the other, and that they were now in this superhero thing together. BUT then CA:BNW was released and Bucky was nowhere to be found. That made no sense, what WAS the point of TFatWS then?

BUT, they threw in a scene with a hug and an "I love you, buddy" which made me feel a little better about the situation. At least the good, supportive, friendship had survived and thrived, even if I still didn't understand why Bucky was campaigning for Congress instead of working with Sam. "Maybe it would become more clear in Thunderbolts*" I thought.

Well the joke was on me because no, if anything Thunderbolts*, with no mention or cameo of Sam whatsoever, only made things more confusing as far as the friendship between Sam and Bucky. And then Marvel really punched me in the gut with this argument between the two, and even a lawsuit being brought having to do with the team name.

So my point is, though argument and debate if respectful, are fine, and supporting your favorite, and even coming up with reasons that they may be right, or posts about what they may be thinking and why, are wonderful and creative, please refrain from bringing any real heat or hate into it, because Marvel can do some fucked up shit for no reason at all. Or for reasons that have nothing to do with what fandom thinks is important.

With any of those, ymmv, meaning I know not everyone will agree with my opinions, and that's okay.

Here are some idiot things that I think Marvel has done; not remaking a stand-alone Hulk movie with Mark Ruffalo, or at least putting some of Bruce Banner's background into one of the movies. Not coming out with the Black Widow movie sooner. Not making the Hawkeye series, or an independent movie, about Clint's Ronin period. Not continuing the Thor movies in the classical style of the original. Having Steve go back in time and stay there, which invalidated all of the Agent Carter series and the family Peggy had, as well as having him abandon Bucky. Not letting Tony and Bucky come to some kind of reconciliation. Zemo engineered that fight between Tony, Steve, and Bucky to happen just as it did, in order to tear the Avengers apart. They should have written a scene showing that they could work out their issues and not remain victims of Zemo's manipulation for the rest of their lives. They are smarter than that. At some point they should have seen through it and saw it for what it was. What was the point of Tony inventing BARF if he was still going to be a prisoner of past events? Why would it only be used once to show how Tony was still being affected by his parents' death and not used again to help him deal with this new information? Could it have helped Tony if Bucky was the subject of the memory and Tony could see how Bucky was either totally suppressed like a zombie, or actively trapped without any way to control his body or influence events. Did they really need to give Tony a wife and kid only to kill him off? He already heroically did something to save everyone that could have killed him twice before. Did he have to die to finally be seen as a hero? If they hadn't killed him off, there wouldn't be this division in the fandom over RDJ playing Doom now. They should have just recast Kang, instead of leaving the Loki series as a build up to nothing. (Okay, wow, that got super off on a tangent, and on to a rant!)

Writers, directors, actors, producers and editors all try to make a coherent project with certain messages. But sometimes the final product is seen quite differently by the audience. When there are several writers, directors, actors, producers and editors trying to create a coherent series of movies over several years, the chances of the differences in their intentions and the audience's point of view are greater with every film. Actors or characters emerge as fan favorites, and the company leans into that to the detriment of the group dynamics. Actors have chemistry that the company didn't count on, but the audience sees it and runs with it. If the fandom celebrates something that the company finds controversial, they may do nonsensical things or have characters written a different way in order to keep the fanon clearly delineated from canon. And, of course, the company does everything with the ultimate goal of making money. Anything else will be sacrificed to that goal. They don't care if they have to contradict themselves, ruin a character, invalidate a storyline, anything for the money.

So whatever Marvel eventually does regarding Sam and Bucky, know that it might be amazing or it might make no sense at all. So actively being hateful to eachother due to it is a bit reactionary. Again, debate, argue, state your opinions and your corroborating evidence, definitely. But don't try to ruin anyone over it. You don't need to try to run anyone off of the platform, or take your differences onto other platforms. Don't stalk each other. Don't try to take things into someone's personal or professional life.

There is always fix-it fic.

[raven-at-the-writing-desk]

I know that Malleus is a sensitive topic here. Even though, he has his weaknesses (which is made very apparent in the canon material); he also has his strengths. One of the things I could immediately think of revolves around his familial attitude towards his family (Lilia, Silver, Sebek). Malleus cherishes his family very much. After all, his fears of losing Lilia was so immense that it ultimately lead him to the overblot. At the core of his character, I see him as someone who is fundamentally familial at heart. Most of his actions in Book 7 are rooted in this aspect of his character. This contrasts his tendency towards self-isolation and enriches his story.

Hey, I want to clarify that Malleus is only a sensitive topic if an ask's tone is aggressive or pushy to begin with. For example, I've previously been spammed with demands to explain why I dislike him + reasons why I should change my mind, told I was "hate criming" him (gross misuse of the term, by the way) for expressing those opinions (I would link to the post, but I actually never publicly responded to this ask or really talked about this publicly), and accused of "[wanting and expecting]" the worst out of him". It's a loud minority that has made me wary when Malleus is brought up. I can't help it, it's sort of gut reflex at this point/j But I'm generally fine with people wanting to discuss him, gush about him, critique him, whatever, so long as things stay civil and open-minded.

I also want to make it clear that even if someone personally dislikes a character, that is not the same as them disregarding the character's positive traits or claiming that the character has no positive traits to begin with. Malleus is certainly no exception to this. (I have a post going over some of the things I enjoy about him, although please keep in mind that it's not meant to be an exhaustive list of his good points.) Personally disliking a character also doesn't mean that you're automatically flagging a character as flat or poorly written. A character could be the best written thing in the entire world or the most complex character ever and people could still dislike them for any reason. Design, vibes, whatever.

That being said, I don't think "familial" is an adjective I've ever personally associated with Malleus? I definitely get those vibes when I browse romantic Malleus fandom works (it's very common to see him being portrayed as a loving, protective father and husband), but not that much with canon content. That's not me claiming Malleus feels nothing toward his Diasomnia members (he definitely DOES care for them), but I don't get the sense that he views them as family or that he’s overtly warm towards them??? At best, I see him perhaps viewing Lilia as a guardian or father figure, especially since it was the fear of losing Lilia that kicked off the major conflict in book 7 + his grandmother seemed too busy with royal duties to raise him. Furthermore, we see that Malleus hatched because of Lilia's magic and how excited he is to see Lilia in multiple flashbacks to Malleus's childhood. He clearly respects Lilia a lot and associates him with the few genuinely happy parts of his childhood. However, I don't see him breaching professional boundaries with Sebek and Silver and skirting into familial territory. (I discuss this more in detail in an older post, so I'd suggest taking a look if you're interested!) Lilia does refer Diasomnia as “not related by blood [but] we are still family", and I believe even their VAs referred to Lilia as a father and Malleus and Silver as brothers. Problem is, I don’t see this reflected in Malleus himself and how he behaves.

It's obvious that Malleus seeks companionship, but that he doesn't realize this about himself without outside help (he couldn't even identify that he was lonely until Yuu pointed it out to him early in book 7). He's so enabled he has become used to the isolation that comes with being at the top and never really thought to question it. This comes through in many of his behaviors: he becomes upset at being left out or uninvited to ceremonies and meetings, when his grandmother (his only living relative) fails to spend time with him despite promising to, and constantly faces struggles connecting with his peers (he tries to, but usually fails in these attempts). And because he fears being left behind, he tries to stop everyone from leaving him. Malleus is also pretty emotionally stunted and awkward due to his growing up alone. This could be a matter of our individual POVs differing, but I think Malleus's loneliness and longing to be with others--despite being raised in relative isolation--is being conflated with being familial?? I genuinely do not recall any standout moments in which Malleus acts familial towards Silver or Sebek, or even towards other peers (though if you can think of any, please share). The only thing that comes to my mind is when Malleus helped Lilia with raising baby!Silver... but even then, I sort of wonder how much of that was intentionally arranged by Lilia to expose Malleus to humans + combat the bigoted worldview he might otherwise develop. Their current day relationship dynamics just don't read as familial to me.

But also 💦 “familial” is a pretty vague term and could mean different things to different people. I think it assumes that families have amicable dynamics within themselves, and I don’t think that’s always the case. Maybe our definitions are entirely different and that’s also contributing to our conclusions looking nothing alike.

[fall0utmind]

🪺 <3

Re Valentino still going on about Marc

I can't remember where I saw it/who said, might have been a friend of mine or I saw it here. But someone said that it's like when someone realises they fucked up but doubles down anyway to not seem like a dickhead. Theory is he realised he fucked up early on, I'm talking right after The Accusations™️, and thought "oh shit, if I now double back people won't take me seriously anymore" and decided to just double down on the crazy. So now 10 years later he's too deep in and is probably just so used to slagging off Marc at this point that he doesn't know any better 😂

Yeah you're probably right. My man is doubling down.

It's also because people keep on bringing it up. Like, PLEASE, it was years ago. It's really not a good look but also like it's so immature and petty??? And boring - it's getting boring like yah yah yah Valentino hates Marc what's new??

Like, I bet the people around Vale are either constantly bringing it up (Uccio) or are so fucking fed up with it. It's giving immature, though. Like tell me you're not over it and not well adjusted.

Marc is catching strays constantly because of something that happened when he was 22...

Ugh, idk why it bugs me so much. I think mainly because it's so one-sided? And there were the HUGE power imbalances in their friendship. If i was Marc i would be gutted. Im hoping he has good support and has managed to move on from his fucking idol hating him and still being petty about it.

Idk idk just my thoughts.

Vale seems like a very.... interesting person from a psychology pov.

[tim-drakes-missing-spleen]

Wait, what if after Danny meets Talia again or what ever, Ra's tries to summon the ghost king to find another way to stay forever immortal (or something like that) . Only to find out that the Ghost King is the same boy he once loathed for not being good enough. Like just imagine:

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Ra's stared at Danny in shock after he emerged from the summoning circle.

Danny glared at Ra's while still wearing his pajamas. "Hey, asshole" He hissed.

Talia also stared at him in complete shock. "Danya-?!" She tried to say, but was quickly cut off.

Danny, who is now glaring at Talia as if she killed his family interupts her. "Shut up. Shut the fuck up." He tells her eerily. "I told you to stay away from me and my family, and yet here I am! You're both such pieces of shits, you know that?! Before you all hated me and treated me like an abomination, and yet you have the nerve to stand here and ask me for some sort of favor?! And before try to defend yourself, I know for a fact that you didn't just summmon me for fun, you want something, and I'm not going to give it to you."

Ra's face started to twist with annoyence rather than shock before he started to talk, venom laced in his voice. "Danyal, you are being unreasonable. You shall not prevent me from earning what I already deserve simply because you feel petty. You were once a disgrace to the Al Ghul bloodline, but now-"

Danny yet again interupts him, but now he looked downright pissed "Didn't I just tell you to; Shut. The. Fuck. Up!"

Th other members of the league watched in horror as the temperature in the room drastically went down, and a bone chilling wail escaped Danny's mouth. Danny took a deap breath to try to calm himself before he straightened his posture, and stared blankly at the people he used to call his family.

"I am done with you all constantly discriminating me for simply being human. I am done with looking up to you as if you were some sort of God. I am done with trying to prove myself to you both despite the fact that I will never be good enough for you. Most of all, I am done with the both of you. I was a child, I didn't deserve being treated like that." Danny spoke with a blank tone that got more and more vulnerable the longer he talked.

Talia tried to ignore the burning guilt in her gut as she listened to the boy who once adored her. She was once his inspiration, why could she only see that now? She looked at his empty face, and mentally compared it to the face of the boy who once looked at her with constellations in his eyes and a smile full of admiration.

Danny sighed.

"I am done. Don't ever contact me again." And with that Danny transformed into his ghost form, and left. Talia continued to stare at his retreating for even as Ra's voice registered in her brain. She simply just stared, and wondered why she never returned his love back when she had it.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

But I don't know, that's just some random crack idea. However, if anyone has any fic recs for either the original post or this one, please comment them!

Danny and Damian are related, with a twist.

Danny is the son of Talia Al Ghul, however he is NOT the son of Bruce Wayne. Ra’s has had his eyes on various people across the world that have either impressed him or show a unique skill set that he’d like to have. One such person was under the both categories and he got Talia to collect a DNA sample and as a result Danny was born.

This was before Bruce’s time with the League by a few years, but very quickly Danny was not meeting expectations. And by the time Bruce did show up Ra’s had lost all interest in Danny, moving on to better things.

Talia always hated Danny because she was forced to have him with a man who she never liked in the first place. Furthermore, because his skillset was lacking she found that even more reason for her distain. In her eyes, he wasn’t worth even considering her blood.

Danny, knowing that he was doomed if he didn’t make an escape, left the league sometime around when Bruce was moving up the ranks and was making waves within the organization. Perfect timing honestly, any attention he might have had was quickly gone when this prodigy showed up.

Danny escaped the League and went into hiding quickly after, settling on a rural area of the United States after bouncing around countries for a few months. This was mainly because Jasmine Fenton saw a young boy pick pocketing strangers while her family was visiting Chicago and scolded him. Her mother and father saw the boy and also lectured him to which Danny responded it was his only option (he was trying to get this loud family off his back so he could sneak away). Eventually the Fentons decide that if he has nowhere to go he might as well go with us, and Danny decides blending in with a Nuclear Family is the best way to ensure that his peaceful life away from the League stays that way. Oh how little did he know.

Flash forward a few years, Talia, who was visiting Gotham to check on Damian, sees a glimpse of a boy (now man) she thought she had forgotten. Her blood runs cold, if this abomination is in Gotham then her son is likely in danger and she would never let anything happen to Damian.

[friendsdontlieokay]

Mike Wheeler jumped off a cliff to save his friend if you even care

[schemelin]

More of my Lone Wanderer!

[starry-bi-sky]

mmm throwaway conversation between Dan and Danny that popped into my head that I had to write out:

"You spent ten years being a one-man mass extinction event, then went back in time and fought me, and lost." Danny snarls, arms crossed and throat tight. His mouth pulls back to bare dagger-sharp teeth, and his eyes burn with the familiar thrum of ectoplasm heating up behind his eyes. "If I didn't believe you were half of Vlad before, I do now."

His other self -- and really, can he even call him that? He's half of Vlad too. Two halves severed from each other and welded together to make a new whole, -- snaps his head over to him. Wild-eyed and furious, he looks unlike the man Danny fought before, the one unruffled and untouched, unbothered by the world around him. It's familiar, but not like the way a reflection is.

"What's that supposed to mean." The Other hisses, matching Danny's scowl one-for-one with fangs much bigger and sharper than his.

But there's a reason lions fear hyenas. Danny matches the rumble in The Other's chest with one of his own, and shoves his face close to his. "I don't lose."

[kinbedo]

@carmendeiact2whenplz I just wanted to say that I love people who respond to my essays with essays of their own <3

Regarding your second last para, it's ironic how I've noticed the exact opposite. Under official genshin posts, there's so much hate that I stopped bothering with the comments. There was a time when I came across a comment under Varesa's post on insta along the lines of "I'm just hating on genshin bc I want to."

I just look at the post, look at the description, and scroll away after getting what I need. On the other hand, some unofficial genshin content receive a lot more positive feedback. And if it is something that is openly criticizing genshin, then everyone under that post is going to hate just for the sake of hating.

I'm also glad that my point about the story organisation and pacing made sense to someone. I thought I was going crazy when I kept thinking about how much cooler it would have been if the the entire Natlan cast was involved in the war, rather than having Ifa and Varesa come into the picture later.

I also agree that the Interlude quest we had with the Flower Feather Clan should've expanded to the other tribes as well. Everyone had been through so much and despite them mentioning that the Flower Feather Clan was struck the hardest, the region itself not being involved in the quest didn't make that statement weigh hard enough. I remember the hot air balloon taking us through the Scions of the Canopy and watching the rifthounds tear apart the things there made my heart clench. If the apparent destruction of the three involved tribes wasn't "bad enough", then what happened to the Flower Feather Clan for it to have gotten that extra attention?

I really wish we had gotten to see the full extent of the war, its effects on each of the tribes, and the everlasting effects of Natlan having been a war-stricken nation for the past 500 years. (more ruins to explore pls I loved regions like Enkanomiya and the Chasm)

Also regarding the "high" and "different" expectation point, thank you so much for pointing that out! I'm not so active on social media, so I didn't keep up with people's expectations. But I did hear about people expecting a well-told story with insane cutscenes, and they made Fontaine their reference point. I had seen comments along the lines of "the story-telling has improved a lot since Sumeru and Fontaine's quests hit really hard" and "I'm still crying over Fontaine and am scared of Natlan bc Natlan is literally the nation of war". These statements made me believe that people had high expectations from Natlan's quests- that they were expecting a gut-wrenching story. And yet, the deaths in Natlan just didn't hit hard enough for people to care.

Though now that I think about it, I can see all the "different" expectations people might have had as well. The war stricken nation of pyro, with no npcs throughout the rest of Teyvat... they made Natlan sound oh-so mysterious but didn't give us enough environmental and cultural clues to keep that mysterious, war-stricken air around Natlan up.

I also completely agree with your Kinich obsession, I need more of that man. The only reason hoyo didn't give him scars is because they knew that I would have gone feral

Have we been too critical with Natlan? Too harsh?

This art actually made me realise that Natlan isn’t as “modern” in terms of design as people put it. With Kinich and Wriotheseley right next to each other, you can easily say that Kinich’s bandana and earrings make him look pretty old-fashioned compared to Wriothesely. Even in the background, the Fontaine girls’ fashion has a completely different vibe while Ororon and Ifa do look like they’re from tribal settlements.

“Kinich looks like he should be in zzz.” The more I look at it, the less likely it seems. Sure, Kinich’s design doesn’t give that same ancient vibe like some other characters from other nations do, but he doesn’t feel “modern” enough to fit into zzz either. He’s stranded somewhere in between.

I’ve seen some people say that they don’t know what “Natlan” is supposed to be, as in it’s difficult to group the Natlan characters as part of one nation. Well, I believe the very “Natlan” thing about the characters (minus Mavuika and Varesa) are their accessories and the patterns on their clothes. There is a certain tribal vibe to each of the characters-

Kachina’s little forehead accessory, her top, and the arm cuffs

Mualani’s beach theme along with her bangles and the patterns on her skirt

Citlali’s clothes, her hair accessory (especially with the feathers) and her bangles and arm cuffs

Kinich’s tattoos, earrings and bandana

Chasca’s earrings and her cape with tassels

Iansan’s arm cuffs, necklace and the feathers and tassels

Ifa’s necklace and feathers

Ororon’s tattoos, scarf and cape and the patterns on them

Xilonen’s bangles and rings and her excessive hand accessories

What is Natlan? Flamboyant earrings, tattoos, feathers in the designs, tassels on their clothes, bangles and arm cuffs. Natlan character designs are not simple, they all have a bit too many tiny patterns all over them.

The main problem came with Mavuika’s design. I don’t remember Natlan hate being as overbearing as it is now before Mavuika’s bike was revealed. On top of all that, she is supposed to be from 500 years ago. And yet, she was seemingly the most modern character in Natlan.

As for Natlan’s technology, no, most of it is not more advanced than Fontaine, except Mavuika’s bike which was pretty uncanny (and Varesa’s stickers).

Chasca’s gun feels like a very primitive, very risky, attempted two-in-one version of the Antoine Roger Aircraft and a gun. Xilonen mentions that her gun is harder to tame than the wildest of qucusaurs.

Ajaw is an ancient dragon, and according to the lore, the dragons were highly advanced. Ajaw can also be referenced back in the “Little One” world quest in the Sacred Mountains. Also, during Tighnari’s quest, Abattouy’s experiments were recorded and were displayed through a projector. We also have film makers in Fontaine, and to present films, we need screens where they can be projected. So, we can say that the ‘projection’ technology is not a sudden thing unique to Ajaw.

Another problem with Natlan was the pace of the story.

Being released after Fontaine, people had high expectations for Natlan. Those high expectations only led to people being more disappointed with the archon quests. In Fontaine, every character got enough screentime or mentions for us to learn about their character. They made us grow attached to the characters and created a very emotionally immersive experience where the traveler wasn’t the main character. Almost every Fontaine character was the mc in their own rights.

Natlan, on the other hand, leaned into the typical “otherworldly hero saves the day” cliché with the traveler. The quests were also much shorter, not giving us any time to sympathise with the characters.

Giving credit where credit is due, the 5.1 war quest was phenomenal. The voice acting conveyed panic and the environment showed the destruction of war. Hoyo, overall, was heading in the right direction. And yet, Chuychu’s death didn’t hit hard enough because we barely knew her.

I don’t think most of the people would have minded it if the overall quest was 2 hours longer but elaborated more on the characters. Hoyo should have given us more time, more instances to familiarise with the cast while slowly building up for the war.

Commissions with Kachina to clear out hilichurl camps, visiting the Scions of the Canopy with Kinich where we’re shown how much busier they’ve gotten, searching for Xilonen only to realise she’s all over the place trying her best to get the weapon ready. Nature is very sensitive to changes and animals are highly perceptive to disturbances and this could have been conveyed through Ororon and his farm and Ifa and him noticing the saurians getting more restless.

The war arc should have been after all the tribes were released. This way, we could’ve gotten to know the characters better and the situation would’ve had even more of an impact. What made the desensitisation worse was the fact that the tribal chronicles, the supposed story quests, barely focused on the characters themselves, thus making us even more disconnected.

They didn’t have to give all the tribes their own, major region. They could have made the tribe areas smaller and released them as part of one region and instead given us land with destruction. This part comes under environmental story-telling. We could have gotten map expansions showing how some places have become inhabitable, like the islands in Inazuma.

We also could have gotten a really cool cutscene with all the characters during the war. Natlan has introduced new travel mechanics and a cutscene where we see the things in first person through another character’s eyes would have been really cool.

We could’ve had Mualani surfing over the water and falling in as she’s trying to get to places that need her, the camera angle switching to finally show Mualani, getting back on her surfboard. Kinich traversing through the thick woods, the leaves getting in his face. He turns to look at the destruction around him, knowing that the people laying on the ground may never wake up. Xilonen roller skating and trying to rescue people. Varesa rushing up the volcano and breaking the rocks along her way. A cutscene like this could have conveyed the sense of panic everyone felt during the war. It could have ended with Chasca, stumbling to the ground in front of the Stadium with Chuychu in her hands.

Also, you’re telling me the power of the six heroes was enough to break through the false sky, and yet Mavuika only needed the traveler to help her put an end to the 500 year long struggle? When the traveler needed to get to the hotspots, they had to wait for the hot air balloon to slowly take them there? While Mavuika, the only person with a bike, the fastest vehicle in the nation, stayed back in the Stadium?

If Mavuika didn’t have a bike, perhaps certain parts of Natlan wouldn’t feel so odd.

What could Mavuika have had instead? I was imagining her abilities to look like Bakugou’s from My Hero Academia. To put it in simplest words possible, Bakugou can create explosions from the sweat on his palm, and can use those explosions for movement and attacking. Mavuika’s abilities could have revolved around thermodynamics.

Another thing I wish they had highlighted with Mavuika was why the pyro archon is human. Perhaps they could have added points such as “the fire power burning away at the weilder’s body, and since it gets too much for them to handle, the pyro archon has to be switched regularly, and is thus human.” They could have added other clues to this in her design, such as making it seem like her skin is slightly burnt near her hair.

I will add more to this as and when I notice things. This was just me clumsily putting together my thoughts on Natlan’s design and story. And the more I think about it, the more I realise that my distaste for Natlan was more heavily formed by community opinions rather than my own. “Complain impact” really does feel apt when all the people have done is point out the shortcomings rather than appreciate the overall details.

If you got this far, thank you for being patient with me. I would love to hear your thoughts too!

[taw-k]

Hc: Loki's Nordic runes are really good, he writes them like they're stamped on, but his English is the most incomprehensible ancient calligraphy you've ever seen and his math is even worse.

He writes like this

And his math looks like this

He insists it's completely normal and entirely readable.

[noelles-legacy]

Ignorant?

Let’s just say this was Noelle’s breaking point into why she can’t stand Sebastian… the audacity of this bitch. I know a lot of people really like him (and I for one absolutely love him as a character💚🤍) but Sebastian gets on my nerves SO much playing the game, and to that I reflect that onto Noelle.

but also when he almost forced Ominis to cast Crucio in the scriptorium, like bro stfu cause like hell are you making my baby do that, that’s messed up😭👿

What I wish my choices were

>that was cruel

>you’re not thinking straight

>I WILL TURN YOU TO ASH YOU FOOL

[ulteri0rm0tives]

WORST part of replaying this game. Is that i actually *have* to progress through (most of) it to see Kerry again... Like having to wade through little chocolate gold colds to get to the real shit that ACTUALLY matters.

It actually sucks you meet him so late in the game and only get so much time with him :( especially because I (personally) find his romance and plotline to be one of the more developed slash more enjoyable ones and I just :( wish they gave us more time with him ugh I jUST MISS HIM OKAY GUYS I MISS THIS OLD MAN!!!

[dootznbootz]

I honestly get a little annoyed that people will act like Penelope wouldn't be in the Fields of Punishment alongside Odysseus :P

Because she'd either go with him or literally be there because of her own things. I mean...She's not that nice either. They're literally "likeminded", all the war crimes he would tell her, she'd be thinking "Oh!!! Good thinking!!!" The only thing is, she just didn't GET to do those war crimes because she wasn't in the war. She would scold him for the stupid things he did acting like she's never done the same or wouldn't do the same.

Also as if she wouldn't also tell Polyphemus her name? Maybe not exactly, but she'd do something JUST as prideful/dumb eventually. BECAUSE THEY'RE SIMILAR. SAME MIND!!!

[spock-smokes-weed]

When I do eventually get pregnant, I want to go to Bill Maher’s house and hope the shock of a seeing a pregnant man in the flesh will be so severe it kills him.

[worriesndoodles]

i did not carefuly saved every tgaa related material to look into in detial after finishing the games to open all the reddit posts to see poeple shitting on the games

[lemonynuggets]

honestly I’m still not over the HOO Cupid scene