#and i cant draw without a lot of aggressive referencing

[the-cookie-of-doom]

i could sleep. or i could do more drawing studies

[wollfling]

Thank you for taking my ask seriously, and I'm sorry if I came across confrontational. This is a bit of an emotional subject for me so it's hard to explain what I mean. I don't think you came across as mean or rude.

Do you really believe that making AI art can never be a creative process? I'm sorry if again this comes across aggressive, like you said tone is hard. But if someone spent hours trying different prompts, tweaking the phrasing until they got an image that communicated an idea they wanted to communicate… isn't that a contemplative, creative process? Isn't that art?

To be blunt, I'm not a creative person. I have tried to change and learn but I'm not an artist and I've never made anything that has had any value, to me or to others. When I say it's accessible, I mean that someone like me could use it to make something meaningful, which would otherwise not be possible. Why is it that when people try to make technical fields more accessible, it's about introducing tools that let you produce good results with less skill, but the most I've seen in creative fields is people pushing for bad results to be accepted? Is it wrong for me to want good results?

I'm sympathetic about artists losing their livelihood, but I don't think that's a good argument against it. When the sewing machine was invented, lots of people who would have made a living sewing would have lost their livelihood, but that doesn't mean the invention of the sewing machine was bad.

This is a bit of a fraught discussion so I'll understand if you need to stop at any time. I really want to come to an understanding but it's hard for me not to feel like this is a new tool that can produce good results without years and years of experience being dismissed out of hand by… people who have years and years of experience. Maybe there's just some fundamental gap that in experience and understanding that I can't cross because I'm not an artists?

Of course, it's a serious topic to me! And an important conversation to have since ai is becoming more prevalent.

Creative processes doesn't exactly equal art, or visual art, for example I like to be creative when coordinating my outfits but my outfits are not art. (I've sewn some of my own garments that I designed- though they were more for function than art so I still wouldn't count them. There's a fuzzy line that devides design and art I feel)

Referencing the article about the winning ai work again, the creator sees himself more of an author than an artist. Creative writing can be art (like poetry for example) but it's just not the same as visual art. So in my opinion it's not art. Typing keywords into a ai generator no matter how specific is not art. As they article also said, the creator likened it to a word game.

Why is it not possible for you to make something meaningful on your own? Why do you believe you've made nothing of value? Why do you need the ai generator to do it for you? Do you mean you can't create your own images, because you don't like your drawings?

The reality is that art is a skill, communication is a skill. There are so many things I, as an artist, want to say with my art. And want to depict in my art. But i "cant" because of my lack of ability. So I work to get better, so I can say more and how more, and be concise or as vague as I want in my pieces effectively. This is the reality. And there are people who have improved way more in just a few years than I have over most of my life. That's the reality. Doesn't mean my work is worth any less.

What are the bad results you are talking about? Ugly art? Like the art community is pushing for bad results... so ugly art? And the good results are the ai generated images? You can want those "good results" but they ultimately aren't yours. Again, please don't take this as mean or an attack but it's not your art. A computer program made it for you. Artists are pushing for these bad results, which I am assuming again is bad art, because bad art that you've made with your own hands and heart is worth infinity more than an image generated by a soulless computer (made for you. Not by you.) Because art is about connection too. It's complicated of course, I'm sure other artists will say different things, but this is my opinion. If you don't understand why art made by people has value and that a pretty image made by a computer (guided or not) does not have that value, I'm not sure I can.

The sewing machine is a tool. You still need design the garments, construct them yourself, physically sew the seams with the machine. It just makes it faster, and easier on the hands. I think that a sewing machine is comparable to a drawing tablet, it's a tool that can help the process but everything else is made by the artist. This is so different than ai generated images from keywords. I'm not entirely sure, again, how to explain this difference either..

Again, I don't mean to offend or anything. I don't think it's about experience as an artist, rather how you view art. Art isn't just pretty pictures. If you view artists work as such then I understand not seeing the difference.

Sorry if my response is messy or if I missed something, I don't mind having the conversation but I didn't know when I'd get the chance to reply later today (and I had to type this a little quickly;;;) I don't mean to be dismissive or anything!!!

Edit because I forgot something important, if making ai art gives you a feeling of creative accomplishment and an outlet, nobody can take that away from you, and I don't mean to either. If this is important to you, you should do it! I just feel it doesn't belong in spaces with paintings, illustrations, etc because it's just not the same. I don't think that's elitist of me, they just aren't the same thing and shouldn't be treated as such. Again, I hope I didn't come off as mean at all.