#and astruc was barely involved with production

[agentoffangirling]

The Miraculous movie is x10 better than the show will ever be and I'll stand by that

Like, okay, here's the thing: Miraculous is the type of show that can only go on for so long. It's a superhero show, fundamentally, and so while the premise allows for so much creativity, the team behind it does not seem interestred in letting those possibilities play out. This leads to many of the episodes bring constantly repeated. The plot of every episode can be summed up with:

Marinette schemes to get Adrien/generally anything Adrien related, someone (differs on whether or not it's connected to her) gets akumaized, Ladybug and Chat Noir show up, Chat Noir usually ends up getting hurt in some way, Lucky Charm, everything gets fixed, Marinette learns a lesson. With the exception of a few episodes, this is the format they all do

And technically, that's not a bad thing as long as you make it enjoyable to watch. Your characters can learn and grow, becoming completely different people by the end. But as we've acknowledged, the MLB team doesn't want to do that

Chloe was set up for a redemption arc in season 2. She was on track to becoming genuinely likeable and a good person, straying from the bully role. What does Astruc do? Make her into an even worse villain bc she's "unredeemable"

Even though. She is a literal CHILD

Marinette, dear god, hasn't changed a single bit since s1. She's with Adrien now, yes, but still retains all her obsessive qualities and goes stalker mode whenever she sees Adrien hanging out with another girl (see Sublime). I see changes in Ladybug, but I hardly ever see that with Marinette. And it pains me so so much that they don't give her a chance to grow

And do I even NEED to go on about how it's been six seasons and multiple specials and STILL they don't know their identities?? Give it a rest!

Most people in the fandom fully recognize this and acknowledge that the only reason they watch it now is to see what happens, not necessarily because it's a good show

So yes, the Miraculous movie, with all of its cheesy lines and not-synced-up-singing, will always be better to me, imo, shows that Miraculous should've either ended a while ago or just had a movie series (3-4)

I suppose it's because Astruc had little involvement in it, bc Mari and Adrien (he has a personality now!! /lh) show themselves to be better people by the end. Gabriel here is just a broken father who wants to save his family‌, as opposed to series!Gabriel who is more than happy to kill his own son bc he's obsessed with his wife. Chloe is Chloe, but she's less superficial, and gives the vibe of actually being redeemed rather than toying with it

I would also argue that it being a musical works perfectly for the genre but I do wish they made that a bit more clear since so many were taken aback by it

Not to mention that the animation is GORGEOUS!! Every still and shot from this movie shows that it was made with love and care, down to the dust collecting on the benches in the sun (I could go on a whole thing on its own about the lighting, it is stunninggggg)

Just look at this asgycoitxruxxitcit

Oh, and props for solving the love square much faster. That is how it should be done

Point is, the Miraculous movie allows for proper growth and character building while the series is a train that's running low on track. I wouldn't say that we need a whole franchise of this, bc that would give us the exact same problems, but hey, a few movies? I would be totally for that

[actually-factually-anonymous]

That's the thing about the PV though, Tommy barely had anything to do with it. As I understand it, there's a decent chance that it might have been made without his involvement period, but as it is: it's just a minute or so music video presenting the concepts in one of the pre-series proposals.

There really wasn't much room for Tommy to screw up, and considering how many revisions Miraculous underwent at the instruction of the producers and the involvement of other people even in the concept- not to mention what he seems to have flat out copied from other prominent franchises: it's questionable much much of the PV was his to begin with.

And when you get down to it, most of what the fandom thinks of when they think about PV!Felix or "Bridgette" is fanon. The PV and what the marketing team release around it amounted to a concept presentation and vibes which ignited the imagination of the internet.

There's certainly no evidence that I'm aware of that Thomas Astruc is some good or passable writer resentfully confined from writing his mature masterpiece. In fact, given how the quality of the canon series has... wavered with his involvement; I honestly expect that if Tommy was given free reign and a budget to make a more mature story that he'd make a complete dumpsterfire that would crush the hearts of every PV!fan in existence.

Astruc's previous claim to fame was Totally Spies, which was often completely nonsensical, but it was forgivable specifically because the show was a wacky comedy. I'm not sure Astruc could keep hold of a more ambitious narrative, even if he really wanted to and got the freedom to do so.

Really it's a mercy that he has so many restrictions in place. Left on his own, he'd have precious few excuses to save his ego.

saw someone point out how Harry's struggle to get a dramatic movie made when everyone wants him to make a comedy could be Astruc's own frustration expressed through the Harry character.

Then perhaps the real lesson of that episode was that Harry Clown should have stayed in his lane and appreciated being a celebrity creator with a more than generous income. Because he had a good thing going, he had legitimate success beyond what others could even hope for, and because for all his complaints Harry had done nothing to show that he could make a dramatic movie.

He could have tried making a shoestring-budget stage play based on hsi concept, just to prove it worked at all. He could have branched out and maybe proven his chops as a serious actor in other productions so that other producers might take his claims to dramatic prowess more seriously. Who knows, maybe he even tried at some point in the past. But he gave up on that, because he didn't want to do those things. He wanted a full scale production with all the bells and whistles.

So he tried to bank on his reputation as a clown to get something entirely different from his previous official work made. Because why else would a producer give him the time of day if not for that? What credibility as a creator did he have outside of that?

And I think for Harry's sake, it's for the best that he was rejected. Because the only thing he has going for him in terms of creative credibility was his comedy work, so the producer probably would have insisted that if he was involved that the production would play to his established strengths. The producer might have insisted on altering the concept further to try and get funding from other organizations, who might demand certain changes that Harry might not have liked. Harry might have been forced to make studio-demanded change after change, might have had to sell his concept outright as part of a deal to get it made.

Harry might just find that when his idea finally reaches the big screen: it's actually changed almost entirely from what he'd hoped it would be, and that after all that struggle he'd wound up making a comedy after all.

And he'd probably resent that quite a bit.

Do you think ML would’ve been better if the writers followed the PV instead or do you think the PV would’ve been poorly executed as well?

I usually see people say ML would be a more well-written show if the writers went with the PV, but I personally disagree with that. The issues with ML is the poor writing and I think if the writers are not good at bringing their ideas to life, a different concept isn’t going to save them.

Looking at how the writers messed up a show that had good potential at the start, I just think if we got the PV instead, the writers would have messed it up too. And that’s actually why I’m kinda glad we didn’t get the version in the PV instead, because even though there’s not much, I’m really fond of it lol.

You know how the quality of ML right now ended up ruining the episodes in the earlier seasons for you? I feel like if it was the PV, the writers would’ve messed it up so badly that a good amount of people who adored it wouldn’t be able to enjoy it in the same way. So when I see people say the show would’ve been better quality if they went with the PV instead, I can’t help but think they should be more careful for what they wish for. I mean, I can still see where they are coming from, though. But I just remember how many fans were saying they wish they got Felix instead of Adrien, and then when Felix was introduced in Season 3, many of them were disappointed, saying “This isn’t the Felix from the PV” or “Felix isn’t supposed to act like this.”

As someone who likes the PV but has zero faith in the writers, I couldn’t be more glad ML doesn’t use more elements from the PV. I mean, I don’t want to see the parts I like being botched in the show by the writers. It’s different enough that I can enjoy it as its own thing without being reminded of the current state of the show.

What do you think? Would the show have been better if it was more based on the PV and not the actual show we have right now? Or would it be equally as disappointing, just in a different way?

---

I really don't think the starting concept being different would have made the show better. Because there's one big factor in the creative process for Miraculous that's constant that you also brought up, and that's Astruc as the head of the creative process and the writers working under him. I just don't think Astruc is capable of writer-directing a serious, long-form story the way it seems he really wants to. Like, Miraculous is really meta in the way that characters say a lot of stuff that relates to the creative process whenever they work on a movie or something. I saw someone point out how Harry's struggle to get a dramatic movie made when everyone wants him to make a comedy could be Astruc's own frustration expressed through the Harry character.

If this interpretation is accurate, Astruc is most likely the “clown that wants to make a serious drama movie but is stuck making comedy skits”. Like, maybe, mayyyybe, if Astruc got to make the show the way he wanted, instead of having to worry about what's marketable to executives, small kids and parents, he wouldn't be taking his frustrations out on the characters he made and the fans who dare to like them instead of his precious pretend daughter. That could fix the spite problem visible in the writing of the later seasons.

But, like, Astruc also just isn't a very good storyteller. His team can't keep their plot consistent for a single episode, let alone a whole season. The characters say the opposite of what they insisted half an episode ago when they don't start talking about something completely different being the point of the episode than what was set up. Not all of these problems happen because the crew is forced to sneak in the longform narrative while keeping the show mostly episodic. The inconsistency is caused by a lack of ability to stay consistent. Astruc's previous claim to fame was Totally Spies, which was often completely nonsensical, but it was forgivable specifically because the show was a wacky comedy. I'm not sure Astruc could keep hold of a more ambitious narrative, even if he really wanted to and got the freedom to do so.

Instead, I think he's just going to be stuck being jealous and envious of everything everybody else is doing. Have you noticed how he can make any movie or show that's making a buzz turn around to somehow relate to Miraculous? I really am wondering if that's actual evidence of him being dissatisfied. The Barbie Movie is a big hit? Astruc is on twitter insisting Adrinette is just like Barbie and Ken. The new season of Arcane is being praised? Astruc comes out with a detailed explanation of how Arcane is just so expensive to make because they spend so much time rewriting scripts, all the while acting weirdly smug when he admits Miraculous' script is almost the first draft like that's better just because it's cheaper. The Miraculous movie is praised for its satisfying conclusion to the Agreste Arc? Astruc tweets a weird, incorrect and nonsensical Dark Knight reference about the movie being what fans want but the series being what we need. He also spent that week hating on movies in general.

He also absolutely hates any other magical girl show, most likely because they did what his team is doing, better, at least a decade earlier. If he cared as much about little girls having role models as he claims, he'd be clad there are so many popular cartoons with female leads. But he can't be happy, probably, considering how much he praises his "unique" ideas, because these other shows existing make his show less special.

[whenimgoodandready]

(patriotic music plays) In 1777, Lafayette was commissioned by General Washington to lead his troops in the American Revolution which led them to victory! This alliance between the French and Americans was what brought the holiday, The French-American Friendship Week🇫🇷🇺🇸. (record scratch) Okay, so it’s not a legit holiday cuz it was strictly made up for plot purposes on the show, but the events did happen as Americans and French are allies. History repeats itself so let’s see if our French heroes can ally with the American heroes in this very first Miraculous World trilogy of traveling:

Miraculous World

•New York – United HeroeZ-We start with a big damn intro that Thomas was probably inspired by other movie productions such as the “20th Century Fox” with its spotlights, “Universal” with its globe and even “Disney” with its Enchanted Castle. They even had an orchestra with the “Miraculous Ladybug” theme song playing (they went all out!). With the millions this show made it’s no surprise am I right or am I right!? Huh? Huh? Huh? HUH!? There’s a lot that went on in this special, and I know you’re all informed by it, even with the side stories, but I’m not gonna type all that went on and just put in the Pros and Cons so it can be faster. Let’s go:

Pros:

•The Space Powerups-Meet Cosmobug and Astrocat! Finally! We got to see their space forms and they looked pretty alright. Except they never really went to space and I would’ve preferred they did while battling some alien akuma, but it was still nice to see it. I liked Ladybugs space look best.

•The Native American Miracle Box-The final treat of the special and we see another miracle box and it’s guardian! Our first look is the Eagle miraculous which is a talon necklace that has an eagle like Kwami named Liiri who grants the user the power of liberation (which can be used for both good and evil). This was given to Sparrow who got promoted from sidekick to an independent hero! Congrats Sparrow! Fellow miraculers, I give you, Eagle! (trumpets sound). There was no eagle in the Native American zodiac, but I guess it’s part of the five pack and not the main duo like the Chinese Miracle box with its zodiac. There’s always the basic 12 zodiacs, the five elements and the two most important good/bad luck miraculouses. The guardian for the Native American miracle box was a chief like man who was stern, protective, and serious, but with a sense of understanding as he allowed Sparrow to keep their miraculous and start a new generation of supers with the rest thanks to Uncanny Valley.

•New York Heroes/Villains-Get this folks, Majestia, that superwoman Alya is a huge fan of, is real! Yeah! And Knightowl, Principal Damocles hero, is real too! Yeah! There’s barely any fiction in the Miraculous Universe and all we see, is real! These supers are amazing! There’s other heroes too, such as Snowflake, a snow elemental hero, Hurricane, a weather hero, Doorman, a portal traveler, Victory, a patriotic hero and Hot Dog Dan!? (record scratch). He’s uh, uhhhhhhh, a temporary power bestower through magic hot dogs?.............riiiiiiiiiight (clears throat). They’re enemies are a pirate themed technopath named Techno-Pirate (we already have Captain Hardrock for that, but I guess this is their American equivalent of it, so okay. (mutters under breath disappointedly) Wanted something more unique, but okay). Unlike the French heroes, the United Heroez don’t fall under the cliche of secret alter egos bulls*** and everyone in New York knows who they are (even the villain). I guess it’s cuz they’re mostly composed of courageous and righteous adults whereas Team Miraculous, are a bunch of insecure and awkward teenagers. Whomp! Whomp! Whomp! Not giving teens a bad name! The sidekicks of Majestia and Knightowl are Uncanny Valley, a robot girl, and Sparrow, a gadget wielding/combatant masked hooded youth, respectively. They’re the only ones who have to hide their identities (minus Knightowl for spoilers below) cuz they’re just children, but still badass cuz Aeon (aka Uncanny) figured out who Ladybug and Cat Noir were and reunited them to help save New York and Sparrow earned their wings to fly solo as a real hero.

Cons:

•Mr.Pigeon-(face palms) Hawk Moth, do you seriously want your wife back? Or are you just f**king stupid!? 51 TIMES!? (groans loudly and exasperated) You ARE mad and desperate! I understand it’s a kids show and some would find it funny that he keeps showing up, but older kids (and adults), would not! It’s no wonder we’ll be getting a new Hawk Moth in the future. One that actually creates formidable villains and not constantly recycles their old ones!

•Unnecessary Drama-So the plot said Marinette “convinces” Gabe (he had villainous intentions) to let Adrien go to New York, but Ladybug told Cat Noir to stay in Paris to watch out for any akumatizations while she’s “away”......well, we know that’s gonna be an issue, but there was no need. Adrien thought he had a plan to solve this by using his Akuma Alert app to check up on any danger in Paris and fly back quickly as Astrocat to signal Ladybug with this tiny black cat alarm she left him to come and help. Really? That’s the drama Hawkdaddy put in to spice up the special? Why couldn’t Ladybug just download the same app and use the Horse miraculous, which grants the power of teleportation, and fix the possible emergency herself!? If anything, she didn’t need to tell Cat to do jacks***! I understand the Akuma Alert back in “Riposte” cuz that happened during the show where the Parisians were getting accustomed to these attacks, but now, after what’s been a year already (in-universe), you’d think Marinette/Ladybug would be prepared to have that app like Adrien/Cat Noir, but no! She didn’t! Instead, we get this ridiculous, utterly ridiculous little black cat gadget that’s used for a dumb joke! Did Astruc not remember what he did on the show in the past seasons? Look back on your work, honey! IT’S CALLED RESEARCH! Ugh!

•New York stereotype-Like I mentioned up there with the United Heroez, Hot Dog Dan iiiiiiiiiiiiis not the most useful of supers cuz he sounds too stereotyped what with the setting being in New York where you can find a hot dog vendor (there’s even a hero named Captain Redlight who controls the traffic signal lights!) and he uses his powers for fun. That’s not all! Alya romanticized the theme of New York for Marinette and most of the time, we don’t picture that when we think of The Big Apple. When most Americans think of New York, they think crime, honking traffic jams, (911), big corporate businesses and the whole, “Hey! I’m walking here!”. Guess since this is a kids show, they didn’t wanna plant that idea in their young developing minds and just put in the “fun” aspects of New York! I get it. Don’t poison their heads.

That was our first Miraculous World special people. It was “interesting” and I’m sure you’ll agree with it too. I’m gonna elaborate more on the pros and cons of this and then mention the side stories in it. Now that we’ve seen the Native American miracle box, I think we’ll be seeing the American one next. Possibly in the Brazil special. Wonder how they’ll work with that since we have people and an object for our signs. Hmmmmm. I was real glad to see Sparrow cuz we all thought they’d be a scrapped character from the Quantic Universe, but no! They exist! (this was so much better then Felixs introduction). Mercury was even there too! Wow! We got to see the concept art come to life with members of the Quantic Kids! (wonder if Kid Mime might show up later?). Perhaps the whole United Heroez team is what inspires future Ladybug to create her own future Miraculous Justice League from “Timetagger”! What really surprised me was the LGBT Representation! The reveal that Knightowl was a woman along with Sparrow being a girl and that she (Knightowl) and Majestia are life partners with Aeon and Jess (Sparrow) being their children! For the longest time, we the fans thought Knightowl and Sparrow were male when in fact, they’re female! Nice twist there Astruc! The Knightowl and Sparrow are actually legacy heroes where the sidekick would take over for Knightowl and find a new Sparrow all with regardless of their race/gender/sexual orientation. I like that. What I didn’t like was the whole Mr.Pigeon running gag (it’s actually becoming a literal gag! >:P) there’s gonna be a moment where he’ll get called out on it, wait for that! However, it transitioned from overused creators favorite to super anarchy and nuclear war! What a dramatic climatic change! Like I mentioned, Ladybug didn’t really need to involve Cat in the whole emergency situation, but just to emphasize the trust issues between them and input drama into the special (ignoring the plot holes), Astruc gave us a near death scene with poor Uncanny Valley and thank God she was a robot or Cat would’ve gotten a can of whompa** from Majestia. Knightowl wanted to confiscate the dynamic duos miraculouses, but I don’t think they had any jurisdiction to do so. They’re an American super and they’re Parisian supers. However, since this does take place after Season 3, and Ladybug is now the guardian, it’s her choice whether they should or not and her idea was just for the two to run. This also brought the headscratcher of fans on how Ladybugs powers work? She said her “Miraculous Ladybug” power only works on a specific villain and not all villains (like the sentimonster that was shown during Techlonizers attack). Does her power not bring back the dead (that aren’t robots?), can it only fix a cataclysm power from Cat Noir? (shrugs). Unlike “Syren”, Cat quits for real this time! (for about 5mins) It hurt Marinette/Ladybug thinking she was all alone now. A Yang without her Yin. Not a good sign. What Marinette/Ladybug needs to understand is that Cat has a double life too, she shouldn’t assume it would be a breeze for him to watch Paris by himself and that he might have friends and family he can’t explain why he can’t do this and that and make up insane excuses like she does all the time. This wouldn’t be “Miraculous Ladybug” if we didn’t have shippers trying to make Adrienette happen, Alya tries to get Marinette to confess and Nino tries to get Adrien to open up. They get double ship help from Aeon and Jess, but even with the Americans allied with the French on this, Hawk Moth still co*kblocked it. Course with all the major plots involved, they added in several sub plots just to expand the special and fill the gaps such as Ms.Bustier revealed to be pregnant (who’s the daddy?), Ms.Mendeleiev trying to win over the class, Adriens Bodyguards fear of heights and Sabrinas love interest. The special foreshadowed that Marinette/Ladybugs conflict for Season 4 will be learning to move on (same w/ Adrien/Cat Noir) now that it’s strongly implied that Adrigami and Lukanette are canon. See ya all in 2021!