#and 2) the assumption that chacters who spend time together and help each other and are not explicitly enemies and are major recurring

[angelinthefire]

I actually have a basic philosophical aversion to any discourse around whether character A just sees character B as "useful", and have for a long time. (I'm speaking vaguely because this could apply to Cas, or Jack, and also Kevin, and probably some other characters who aren't explicitly enemies too).

Because

Back around s5/6 (back when different sides of Fandom would interact more) Cas haters would come up arguing that Dean doesn’t even like Cas, that he sees him as another monster, etc. And when casgirls would come back with examples of Dean obviously being friendly, their response would be "he's just doing that because Cas is useful." This would happen repeatedly. Like if you weren’t around at the time, you need to understand that casgirls were constantly on the defensive. And how frustrating it was to be called "delusional" as a matter of course. When the Cas haters couldn't even recognize the most surface-level read of a scene, that Dean is being friendly towards Cas because he feels friendly towards him. And that they had constructed this - frankly, insane - narrative where the main character manipulates a major recurring character into thinking they’re friends because he had useful powers. Like, who would want to write a show like that? Who would want to watch it?

So that's my baseline that I come to this issue with. And the thing that I carry with me in all my interpretations is that the main characters care about each other on at least some basic level. Because otherwise, what is the point? Literally what is the point of these relationships, why would we care about them, why are there stakes in the characters fighting and making up again, why are we supposed to enjoy watching it?

And I'm not down with how I've seen it presented in fics and in posts that either A cares about B as a person, or A wants B to be useful in a fight and these are two mutually exclusive things. This is a show about killing monsters and saving the world. The main thing that characters do together, the way they build and show camaraderie, the way they self-actualize even, is by killing monsters and saving the world. It is therefore inherently a good thing when characters can participate in that, and an obstacle to the plot when they cannot. I think that's just something you've got to take for granted when approaching the show. Furthermore, being "useful" is not just for the sake of the character asking for help, it's also for the sake of the character doing the helping - they're contributing to saving the world, they're being heroic, it's generally framed as a positive step in their character development, etc. Like I don't understand it being framed as a one-sided exchange.

It's also important that this is a show that's obsessed with its own masculinity. Even if it developed a small amount in later years, that kind of masculinity where using an umbrella is seen as too gay, that's what the show is fundamentally rooted in. So it's to be expected that characters don't show affection in a normal way, that they can only do so when the world is ending, or they're dying, or they're breaking down, etc. That it happens in these big emotional bursts -- that also happen to coincide with peaks in the plot, when it's necessary for characters to band together and fight.

There's a sidebar about the loss of angel powers. It's been over a year since I've actually watched the show, so I'm not sure if the show itself contributes to this. And I'm pretty sure that Misha has made emo comments about Cas feeling useless without his powers. But I absolutely hate the "Oh no poor Cas (or Jack) feels so useless without their powers they have such low self esteem" thing. (Like Cas does have self worth issues but that's another point). Angels losing their powers is akin to a person suddenly losing their arms and their sight. It's entirely normal to feel shitty about that, and yeah, to probably deal with feelings of uselessness.

It being a normal response also means it's not the fault of the Winchesters or whoever else that whatever angel character feels useless. This is something that I see in fic way too often. Like Cas thinks he’s so useless and such a burden that it's not even clear that he knows Dean likes him, and it's all Dean's fault that he feels that way. Which, at bottom, does not make sense. Like, these characters need to realize that they're all friends, otherwise, on a very basic level, none of this works. Again, there’s nothing to be invested in, nothing to care about. (And obviously depression does things to your brain, makes you feel like a burden, makes you worry that no one actually likes you. But that's not how the fics I'm complaining about are written).

Aside from the fact that there are actual examples of the characters helping/caring/confiding/spending time with each other, and acting like they know they're friends. Despite the masculinity diseases.

If there is a problem of a character not feeling useful I tend to take it as a problem of the show elevating the position of hunter above all else rather than as an absence of basic friendship.

The one exception that I'm willing to grant, where feelings of uselessness come from a broken relationship, is Dean and Jack at the end of s15. Specifically. That's it.

But yeah, I generally cannot stand "usefulness" discourse.