#also was not long past cancer arc and emily on my rewatch so basically

[nachosncheezies]

People like Bill Jr. got all kinds of things wrong about Scully but probably none moreso than thinking it was tragic that Mulder was dragging her along on some descent into madness, when actually the real tragedy was how few of the people she loved ever realized it wasn't a descent.

(It couldn't be bc 1. it's not madness and 2. she was already there.)

[twdmusicboxmystery]

Revolution Theme, Part 4 - The Governor’s Episodes

What led me to wanting to rewatch the Gov’s episode was a discussion with @galadrieljones. She talked about Lenny from 4b being an anti-Daryl, and that sparked something for me. I totally agree about Len, but it made me remember that, a long time ago, I remembered that Mitch (guy who operated the tank for the Gov and helped bulldoze the prison) was also an anti-parallel to Daryl.

Now, back when I first realized that, I didn’t have anywhere to really go with it. I mean, we had the leader (Governor) pitted against Rick and his right-hand guy (Mitch) pitted against Daryl. Mitch operated the tank, which Daryl blew up. And then of course Daryl ends up shooting Mitch in the heart. The thing that first made me realize Mitch was a Daryl parallel was the fact that he had no sleeves, lol. I know that’s goofy, but I think it’s intentional.

Anyway, I hadn’t thought about it in a long time. And while we’ve talked about Gov parallels to Beth in these two episodes lots of times before (like the stigmata walker in the yellow wheelchair) it suddenly occurred to me that there’s probably a LOT more to it than that.

Recently, especially since the bonus episodes, I’ve been big on looking at entire sequences and multi-episode arcs from a broad, bird’s eye view because I think they’re templates for future story lines. (It’s totally Find Me’s fault. Lol.) Anyway, I just realized I hadn’t done THAT with the Gov’s episodes, and I probably should.

Long story short, I was right.

Long story long, here we go:

So we start by seeing the end of 3x16 again, right after the Gov kills all his own people and takes off with Martinez and that other guy whose name I don’t remember. He doesn’t show up again and Martinez says he pretty much gave up and got eaten by walkers.

(We’ll skip the discussion about how Karen was a Beth proxy at this part in 3x16, because she was left for dead and even pretended like she was. In other words, she played possum. Then she returned to Tyreese and eventually became romantically involved with him. But that’s beside the point, right? ;D)

Okay, so we see the Gov and the two guys at a camp site and a very Beth-ish walker stomps through his fire, trips, and starts burning before Martinez kills it. I’ve always thought that was a Beth hint, and I still do. I think it’s just the writers’ way of signaling that this is a Beth template for the future.

When the Gov wakes up, his guys have abandoned him and he’s alone in this bright yellow tent that stands out against the bleak landscape. (Yellow.)

Then he goes and burns Woodbury. I’ve always tried to connect that to Beth, particularly because of the Moonshine shack. But looking at it now, there’s just something else entirely going on here. Emotionally, I mean.

We know Bethyl burning the moonshine shack symbolized something positive. Letting go of their pasts and moving forward. When the Gov does this, you don’t get that vibe at all. It’s more bitter and resentful. He’s angry and grieving over losing his leadership, the town he built up, and his people. It almost feels like a “if I can’t have it no one can” sort of thing.

So, this is total conjecture on my part, but I feel like there will be a Beth parallel to this. Probably not quite as destructive, but I’ve always had a head canon that somehow, after waking up, she’ll end up at Terminus, find the riot gear and Daryl’s poncho, and assume they all died there. That may be where the bitterness and sadness will come from. Just my head canon, though.

After that, the Gov starts on his long, lone journey (another thing we’ve always theorized Beth would do). Oh, and the song that plays over this part, which I’ve always thought was very pretty, is called The Last Pale LIGHT in the WEST (emphasis mine). I think the Gov goes west when he leaves.

Then we get voice overs, and this part is SUPER interesting and makes me very happy. We heard two women talking to the Gov about where he comes from and where he used to be. We now know those voices to be Tara and Lilly, but at this point in the episode, he hasn’t met them, yet. So, what’s interesting is that neither of them are named in the subtitles. They are just “woman.”

And where have we seen that lately? In 9x05, every voice (like Lori and Abraham, for example) was named, but Beth wasn’t. We immediately recognized her voice, but she wasn’t named in the subtitles as “Beth.” It just said “woman.” So, what does this mean? We wouldn’t have recognized Alanna’s voice yet at this point, unlike Emily’s, but we had yet to meet Tara yet. So, on a basic level, I think it shows that the unnamed “woman” will soon be a character on the show.

And why would they do that with Beth when, like Lori and Abe and the others, we’ve already met her? I think it’s probably in line with the theme about her being a different person when we see her again. In a good way. “Meet the new Beth Greene.”

The next important thing about this part is what is actually said. I’m paraphrasing here, but Tara and Lily ask where the Gov was before and he says something about having been in a town. Tara asks if the monsters were there. He says no. It was a good place, with walls. But “he” lost it. She asks, “who?” And he says, “the man in charge.” So clearly, he’s talking about himself in the third person, and Woodbury.

But.

If this is a Beth template, then Gov = Beth, right? We always wondered why they would use him, being evil and stuff, as a Beth proxy. But keep in mind that Gimple took over as official head honcho and completely reworked a reportedly terrible 3x16. They were basically done with the Woodbury/Gov storyline, and they needed a good sendoff for him. In a way, this was Gimple’s first Sirius arc. Someone who leaves, is presumed dead, but then comes back. We know Daryl (and Michonne) searched for him, but lost the trail (kinda like losing Beth’s body) and the Gov is even down one eye. Siriusly.

So, my point about the voice over is that everything said there could be applied to Rick, especially during the S4/S5. He lost it. He screwed up. Beth was left behind/separated from them.

Okay, now I’ll jump forward a little faster. For the rest of 4x06, there are really only two big things of note. 1) Tara and Lilly = two sisters who eventually lose their father. A foreshadow of the Greene family dynamic. And even though Tara’s father dies of natural causes (lung cancer), the Gov does end up bashing his face in to keep him from biting Tara. I think that was supposed to be kind of like him “killing” the dad, and therefore a foreshadow of him killing Hershel by taking his head.

The second thing, in terms of future Beth arcs, is that he lost everything, was left behind/abandoned by his people, went on a long journey, and eventually found people that he came to care about and protect. And I think the same will happen with Beth. In fact, it actually works in line with the Charleston template I laid out. Just a community of people she cares about and protects/takes care of.

And I’m sure some people will wonder about the fact that the Gov finds a love interest in Lilly, and if that will translate to Beth. Well, it’s possible. She might have had boyfriends over the years. We’ve discussed this. But it’s also important that her *true* love interest, Daryl, is already back with TF. And that wasn’t true of the Gov. He was never going to return to the prison and have some beautiful relationship with…anyone. The closest thing would have been Andrea, and she’d already died by this point.

There are, of course, small clues in 4x06 that I haven’t gone over, and of course I’ve skipped the rest home with the stigmata walker, because we know about that. But a few highlights: At one point, Tara says, “Ray Charles could have seen it” about their truck out front. Blindness mention. Lilly used to be a nurse, which ties to Grady. And she even talks about being bored, which is a direct link to Edwards being bored. 

Pirate theme, of course. I do think Megan represents Beth, though perhaps not directly in the template. She wears a lot of pink and yellow, blond hair, etc. And I think she’s just another way to say that this template is about the blond girl who, apparently, dies.

We should also probably appreciate that the way the Gov’s arc ends (the situation in 4x08) is a prisoner exchange situation where a Greene dies, and both directly ties to and foreshadows Grady.

But let’s move on. The end of 4x06/beginning of 4x07 is where they fall into a pit and meet Martinez. Let’s be real. In the show they call it “the pit” and it’s just used to keep walkers from overrunning their camp, but it’s clearly a grave. So, we have the Gov and Beth—I mean Megan—falling into a grave with a bunch of walkers (death) but surviving and eventually getting out (resurrection). Side note: we also saw the Gov kill one of the walkers that went after Megan by ripping it’s jaw off. (Speak no evil.)

So, here’s where we get to talk about Mitch and Pete a little bit. And it’ll be fun. I promise. :D

Watching this with an eye toward them representing Daryl and Merle, a lot of the symbolism became a lot more obvious. Keep in mind that they’re anti-parallels, not parallels.

See, between the two, Pete, who actually represents Merle, is the more sweet, compassionate one. While Mitch is the more brutal one. But again, they’re anti-parallels, so in this case, Mitch, the brutal one, is Daryl’s antithesis and Pete, the kind one, is Merle’s.

In fact, the first time we meet them, Mitch doesn’t want to let the Gov’s group in because they already had too many mouths to feed, and Pete says, “come on, man. They have a kid.” Just reminded me a lot of Daryl’s “they had a baby” in 3x10 after saving the family on the bridge.

So, they come back to the camp and start living in a trailer. The Hole in the Roof theory is huge here. The roof of the trailer keeps leaking water and, I shit you not, it looks like it’s dripping from a bullet wound. So, clearly��.

And while I stand by it being a symbol of Beth being shot in the head, I also think it represents toxicity of a sort. Things that are wrong and it’s just a matter of time before the crap hits the fan. That sort of thing.

Okay, obviously the most important part of this episode is when they go to the cabin, but let me mention a few things that happen along the way.

Mitch, Pete, Martinez, and the Gov go out looking for supplies for the camp. And they had a really interesting conversation that may give some insight into the spearfishing in Find Me.

They walk by the lake and the Gov asks if there are fish in the lake. They reply, no. The lake is totally dead. Mitch then adds that there are rabbits, skunks, and possums. Obviously, some symbolism in those animals. But it occurs to me that fish = life. Something they can eat, subsist and even thrive on. The lake is dead because there are no fish.

Now, clearly this is a foreshadow of the Gov killing Pete and putting him in the lake. And of the Gov already being kind of dead in his soul. And “dead water” might also foreshadow the poisoned water theme. Water that can cause death if you drink it.

But in thinking about Daryl’s reaction to both Leah and Carol finding fish in FM, it’s kind of interesting. Both times, he says, “no way,” and is pleasantly surprised that they caught the fish (life). So, I’m wondering if this is meant to be him being surprised that someone he thought was dead was really alive. And what if all the fish symbols we’ve seen represent life in some way?

Of course, it could also be that a mounted fish, like we saw near Dwight in S8 is technically a dead fish. So, it might have symbolized the death of his and Sherry’s relationship. Or that it would live again. I’m not sure how granular to make this. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Okay, so then they come upon a camp that seems to be doing well. Mitch wants to take all their supplies, but Pete refuses and they leave. Later, they come back to find the camp overrun, most of its people dead, and the supplies gone. Here, Mitch is just pissed that they didn’t take the supplies before someone else got them. (Very anti-Daryl.)

But I do think this points to some future arc. I don’t know for sure what it will be, but again, I think it works with the Charleston template. Like, Beth is in a community. She goes out looking for supplies, and when she comes back, the community has been knocked on its butt by the CRM. And this is one of those things that was never really acknowledged or explained in the show. Who killed off the camp? And why wasn’t anyone in the Gov’s group at all concerned that their camp might be next? Gotta be symbolism for sure. :D

Oh, and the Gov says it must have “just happened.” Just like Daryl said about the wolves and the girl on the tree in 5x15. And again, the wolves are very tangled up in the Native American symbolism.

Then there’s the cabin bit. Again, I’m not at all sure how this will fit into Beth’s arc, but I’m sure it foreshadows SOMEthing. So, we have two headless corpses, one of which says LIAR and the other that says RAPIST. And then a third that still has his head, but killed himself with a shotgun. He is, presumably, the guy who lived in the cabin and killed the first two, and he’s labeled himself MURDERER.

Now, on the one hand, all of these words describe the Governor. He says “Liar” just before taking Hershel’s head, which is what that first one points to. And it’s not too hard to figure out that he’s a murderer. We didn’t actually see him rape anyone in the show, but there were suggestions of it, especially as he attacked Michonne and manipulated Andrea. And I’m pretty sure in the comic books, he does actually rape Michonne. They just didn’t want that to be the case in the show. So, these do all work for his story line.

But I also think these may be things Beth encounters at some point in her arc. Maybe someone will lie to her (or even betray her, Lone Ranger-style) and she’ll have to take them out. We already saw her dealing with rape at Grady, and have long thought that it foreshadows a bigger, potential rape situation that she’ll have to deal with. You get the idea. So, it’s very vague and I don’t have any great inspirations about what these point to, but in general, I’m sure they’ll apply to her.

It's also important to note that all these guys are dressed in military clothing. So, we might be able to tie them to CRM, symbolically if not literally.

I didn’t find anything massive inside the cabin that we haven’t already discussed. You asked me to look for revolution/George Washington pictures, @wdway, and I didn’t notice any. I didn’t try overly hard to see every single picture in the background, but most of them looked too blurry to tell much detail anyway. The major one is of Abraham Lincoln, and I think that’s important. But I’ll come back to it.

Of course, we have all the Native American symbols in this cabin. So, here’s the thing. Because of Tonto in TLR, I feel like whoever the Native American symbolism points to, whatever group that is, good or bad, it represents the group that Beth found after she woke up/lived, who nursed her back to health. And the reason I say good or bad is because the Claimers do theoretically fall under this same symbol theme for Daryl. The first group of people he ran into after he lost Beth. After the big disaster.

And here, I think Martinez’s group works in that regard for the Governor. He wasn’t hurt badly but he was in need of help after falling into the pit. You could say the same of Daryl after losing Beth. He just needed people to pull him out of his slump.

Now, here’s the other thing I’m not entirely sure how to interpret, but it does lend credence to the idea of the guy who lived in the cabin, who took out the two headless corpses, being representative of Beth. Once they’ve cleaned the walkers out of the cabin and are all sitting down talking, the Gov finds a picture of the guy who lived their and his family. The guy’s left eye has been colored over with read. Like red pen or marker. But it’s clearly a Sirius symbol and the red looks like blood.

So, I thought about what must have happened in this cabin. I kind of thing it might have been sort of like what happened with Abraham’s family. We were told after 5x05 that he killed the people who were actually part of his group. People he trusted. That’s because while he was out on a supply run, they raped his family. They just couldn’t show that in the show.

So, for the cabin guy, taking out a rapist and liar who might have harmed his family is straight forward enough. But why would he kill himself if his family still lived? And the Gov’s group found them as walkers in the house. Why would they continue to live there if the husband/father had shot himself on the porch? So, I’m thinking that these two headless corpses not only raped but perhaps murdered his family. So, he beheaded them and, in his grief, took himself out.

Or, because he labeled himself a murderer, maybe something happened where his family went crazy, or just got bitten, and he had to put them down. And that made him feel like a murderer. Because I don’t think justly taking out bad guys would have made him feel that way.

This may feel largely irrelevant, but it’s in the episode for a reason. Once again, I think this probably points to some part of Beth’s future arc. I mean, this sort of thing, the kind of thing Abraham went through, since it happened at the hands of people that were part of his community and that he trusted, is the ultimate betrayal, right? So maybe it will be a matter of someone in her community that she trusts betraying them to the CRM or something. IDK.

I keep saying it’s the west/lone ranger stuff that = betrayal, but the Native American theme always seems to be tangled up with it, doesn’t it?

Some minor details.

They find *beer* in the cabin.

We find out that Mitch and Pete were in the army before the turn happened. And in this case, I don’t necessarily want to link that to the CRM. We could, but given that both of them are now dead, it doesn’t really matter.

But it occurred to me that this is more evidence of them being anti-Daryl and Merle. Daryl and Merle were nobodys and drifters before. So, their opposites were in one of the most disciplined professions one can enter. Daryl started in an unproductive place and evolved. Mitch started in a disciplined place and devolved.

Of course, they’re playing GOLF when he kills Martinez. After doing so, he sits like Daryl at the crossroads. Then when Lilly finds him in the RV, he says he had a bad dream. He doesn’t remember. (Memory loss mention.)

They tell the camp he was hitting golf balls, got drunk, and fell into the grave/pit. *coughs Bethyl*

There were some interesting mushroom mentions. I noticed that before they met up with Martinez’s group, they were talking about Tara’s ex girlfriend (who was named SAM, btw) who lied to her about her feelings for Tara. Lilly says, “Yeah, then you went camping, ate mushrooms, and the rest was history.” Or something like that. I wasn’t sure what to make of that, but then later, we see the same mushrooms on the trees around the Gov that we saw in Still. Hmm.

I’m also a little unsure of what to make of the walker pit they reach when they try to leave the camp. Remember they all take off in a car, including Tara’s girlfriend, but they have to stop because the road is impassible. It’s turned to mud and is full of walkers. I’m sure that’s symbolic of something, but I don’t know what.

Of course, the Gov kills Pete and recruits Mitch. You could say he has a very Negan approach, ruling through fear. He kills Pete specifically BECAUSE he’s the compassionate one and Mitch is the brutal one. Very different to how Rick ever approached things.

Okay, that’s most of what I have for the Gov. Except that at the beginning of 4x08, after he takes Michonne and Hershel prisoner, he says, “they’re the key.” (Key Theory).