#all the leander theories give me life.

[sundayeleith]

Leander theories : his route

On my last Leander post, I had a very interesting comment and my answer was getting so long I decided a post would be most digestible and it's more about Leander's route outcome which I've been itching to talk about more extensively. So here's the comment left by @bulletmedic !

I agree with this take, well mostly the first part. MC reacts very differently to Leander than the other 4. As I said in my previous post, they very firmly don't want to show or talk about their curse, yet look at them tell Leander anyways. Something is off and it's not bad writing, it was put there deliberatly.

As for the route itself, tldr : yes and no. I think Leander could fall in love with MC no matter what up a certain point in the story or that it depends on certain choices we make.

More under the cut !

Leander, Leander, Leander. Quite the man. I thought about his route structure and outcome so mainy times. As I said above, I have 2 ideas on how the route could go. Again I could be completely wrong but I'm not here to be right just give my 2 cents (and because I love talking about him dqojdqpojzdqzpoidjfqz).

First I want to talk a bit about Leander's goal. In v2.0, it's been made more clear that Leander wants MC's powers for himself, is it by keeping them alive or not. So the "basement wife" scenario wouldn't be impossible, especially if he falls for MC but his obsession around them and their power mix and twist into something more sinister. I don't think Leander is a yandere, or not one in the strict sense of the term but rather borders on the idea in a more complex way justified by the narative and his writing (not saying it's good, just saying that if written well and given logic explenation that could turn out better than just a plain classic yandere trope).

Now, the first posibility : he falls in love anyways but the ending we get depends on choices we make. My take is Leander will either chose his goal/plan or MC. Or try to stop the plan put in motion to save them and either fail or succeed. For the first one, I'd say if MC is too distant Leander won't hesitate too much to sacrifce them for his bigger goal and agenda. He'd hate it, but he needs to do what he needs to do. The second scenario works well with the first one and could be another bad end branching if he decides to save MC. Here I think if MC trusted him enough, he could succeed or something like that.

Then the other posibility : Oh that one would be absolute cinema. Imagine thinking Leander is falling for MC, that you made the right choices only for him to reveal he was lying this whole time and you got trapped. Oh the betrayal. Oh I would get my life if that's the case. The drama of it all. That could mean we need to get the right balance between being distant enough to survive and avoid an early bad ending but not to get a full bad ending either. Just like Leander, we need to play our cards right and chose when to open up and warm up to him in the right moments. Being receptive to his fake charms would get us in danger, while being receptive to a more authentic heart to heart conversation would get us more high in his esteem. Higher than a mere pawn at least.

He is such a complicated character in my eyes, he craves authenticity and a true bond even just friendship, but can't afford it. He can't let a single weakness settle in, and still he feels lonely to the point he tries to fill that void by being liked by everyone (tho he does so for his plan not just out of loneliness). Only to remember a friend to everyone is a friend to no one. Idk what his deal his I need to beat him to death

Me each time I try to guess Leander's motivations and main goal.

Hope that it made sense and was fun to read >:)

[kimiro-art]

My thoughts about the update!!!

Spoiler

●First of all. I LOVE THE BLINKING. It makes it feel more life like

●Leander gives me more uncanny vibes then before and oh my god he is the redest flag I have seen

Smug little shit

.... does he like being ignored? Bahahahah

The theory of ais findings our body and bringing us to kuras? Do we smell a bit like him?? Or does he smell the curse??? (Makes me wonder what it smells like tbh)

I love that line thehehe

[sav-less]

disclaimer: this is the inside of my brain so if you think different then that’s great! this is just to be silly / i’m procrastinating life, so we’re chill 😎

hogwarts legacy modern au: music headcanons

characters included: shadow trio, poppy, imelda, garreth, natsai, anne, also blurb about leander (ily lee but i was tired of editing)

sebastian sallow

Sebastian is that one insufferable guy (love him). He’s moody as hell and he uses music as a form of processing (im self inserting rn). A lot of his top music is reflective of what he’s going through. For the most part he’s into indie rock and alt rock, but if there’s a song that he can even sort of relate to then he’s all over it. He thinks he’s brooding, he’s edgy, he’s angsty. We all know he made 2014 tumblr his BITCH. And he has NOOO IDEA how ABBA ended up in his top 5. He’ll say it was Ominis. He’ll say he was hacked. (his fav ABBA song is Lay All Your Love On Me)

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ominis gaunt

Ominis wears his headphones everywhere, listening to some of the most beautiful music but also the most devastating music. He likes a genre to his music that gives off a certain “guys i SWEAR im fine haha..” vibe to the function. he’s nostalgic, he’s yearnful, he’s emotionally very connected to music and is one of those people that will cry when a song is really good (me too) (he’ll swallow the lump down, just know he’s feelin it). aside from his top artists he also listens to a bunch of instrumentals when he’s studying. we all know he plays the piano. yes Merry Christmas, Please Don’t Call by Bleachers is secretly about Sebastian (tea). yes She’s Always a Woman by Billy Joel is secretly ab my MC (TEAA!). yes ABBA is there on purpose! this man knows every lyric to Gimme! Gimme! Gimme!

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ella collins (OC/MC)

Ella really just wants to live in a cottage and be a fairy but she’s also just a girl. she has a song associated to every person she’s ever had a crush on and any person that’s ever done her wrong. she has a playlist for that one guy. she’s posting a screenshot of the song she’s listening to on her story for one person to watch. when she’s feeling petty she sends Sebastian songs DIRECTLY cause she’s mad at him. 4/5 of these songs are about him i fear. she loves music because she never has to get over anything. grudges are timeless. she’s crazy and this is a self insert.

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garreth weasley

#GiveGarreththeAux (Garreth wrote this). Garreth is a vibes guy and will defend those vibes with his whole chest. “How can you not like this song? Just say you hate me! High School Musical soundtrack is top tier. Kate Bush is a legend. Hozier is a wizard, have you seen his hair? I want his hair.” He’s fun as hell. Car rides with him are never boring, and as much as he loves his music he wants to hear your music cause he just wants to listen to everything. doesn’t care where the music came from. if he likes it he likes it. gotta party with this guy.

(Noah Kahan is his top artist bc even tho he’s a vibes guy, he has such a heart. peep My False Confidence. ily Garreth.)

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natsai onai

Natsai’s minutes listened is the lowest because she’s too busy dismantling the patriarchy and abolishing the system to listen most of the time. She grew up in the Katniss Everdeen generation. There’s not one man vocalist on her playlist because doesn’t really care what they have to say. She’s not super picky about the genre but listening to guitar riffs makes her feel like she’s ascending and so she loves that shit. She begged her mom to let her go to a Paramore concert when she was twelve and she has band posters covering her walls from corner to corner. She knows musical theory because duh. I love her.

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anne sallow

personally i HC as the coolest girl alive. she’s friends with literally everyone. if she smiles at you you think the world is spinning solely for her. she’s just effortlessly that girl. and even tho she seems sweet and a little quiet let it be known she is absolutely BLASTING hypercore or glitchpop or some stuff like that in her headphones. she just likes the way music sounds, she doesn’t GAF what they’re saying. she just wants her brain to go bzzzzzzz. my girl!!! (her and garreth are actually LETHAL at parties. like banger for banger, they’re besties. if they’re throwing a party you WANT to be there) (her and Natsai are fangirling about imogen heap bc she’s a musical genius)

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poppy sweeting

Poppy my love. I see you. I hear you. I love you and all your big emotions. she’s dissecting lyrics like it’s no one’s business. In another life somewhere she’s an English and Psychology double major. she’s telling me what a metaphor is and im listening because I’ll listen to anything she says. she’s telling me her attachment style is anxious and yk what hell yeah me too please don’t leave me. every song she listens to serves a purpose. her and garreth have gone to five different shows to see Noah Kahan and Lizzy McAlpine together. The Louvre is about Imelda. GODDD The Louvre is about Imelda. my heart.

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imelda reyes

Imelda is the manifesting queen. she is a confident queen. she’s cool as hell. she seems mean at first glance but that’s only because she is locked TF in. between her million high level classes, every sport she’s plays, and her social life— she has to be focused. she needs music that will put her in the headspace. her top 5 songs are naturally on her ‘pregame’ playlist that she plays before every game (with the exception of #4. she’s pregaming therapy with that one). shes gonna graduate top of her class and go pro at some sport and no one is gonna be surprised. you go girlfriend. my girlfriend.

honorable mention: Leander is THE rock man, specifically acid/psychedelic rock. He’s shaking his head and playing air guitar. he’s asking his parents to get him a drum set for Christmas still. He thinks he would’ve been asked to join The Beatles if they were still a band. big big fan.

to everyone that talked through this with me either messaging or on the og post, thank you 💚 @mrsgoofygracie your wonderful ABBA sebinis theory is now cemented in my silly post

[mayuslob]

Leander character analysis but i am 100% wrong

Okay so disclaimer this is most probably a huge stretch and me going insane over every detail BUT i need to get it out my system

Yapping below the cut be ready 🦭

Starting off with what made me start this, the Bloodhounds’ motto. When i was playing the demo for the first time, i was very caught off guard when they mentioned the sentence “as above so below” due to its religious context and meaning. This sentence is mostly linked with the character Baphomet, a satanic figure written by the author Éliphas Lévi on the book “Dogme et Rituel de la Haute Magie” translated to english “Dogma and Ritual of High Magic", written between 1854 and 1856. It can be portrayed in a lot of different ways, but the most embraced is that there cannot be heaven without hell (thus Baphomet pointing up and down), good without evil and viceversa. Now here it gets more interesting.

At first i thought they just chose this sentence for other motives, but then i started to dig a little deeper and realised that every single detail in Leander’s character is very much on purpose, specially his color palette and abilities. Let’s start with the colors which are directly linked to his powers:

Leander’s distinctive color is green, a dark desaturated emerald green to be exact. Emerald portrays good luck and balance in common symbolism, but it also can be tracked to this. See the thing is, the sentence “as above so below” doesn’t come originally from Baphomet, rather Lévi quoted it from a — not known to really exist— text called “The Emerald Tablet”, a story with different theories around its origin; the story revolving around a fictional character named Hermes Trismegistus (this is important for later). So here we have that the color emerald is directly connected not only to Leander’s palette but to the Bloodhounds’ motto. But wait!

there’s more

See this is where you ask, okay but what does The Emerald Tablet tell? well around the years it was most referenced, it was used by the islam and european alchemists and considered fundamental. Of course as time went by, the text was implemented in other practices such as occultism and magic. This is where the figure of Hermes is pretty interesting regarding Leander, due to his character being described as a “physician, a magician and a spiritual person”. That’s right guys, a fucking magician much like our beloved Leander.

Going further into Hermes’ character, he is a syncretic combination of the Greek god Hermes and of the Egyptian god Thoth, the god of the night, wisdom, magic, and the final judgement (plus others but these are the ones we’re gonna focus on). With this we have some things that could describe Leander, specially wisdom and magic due to his vast knowledge surpassing the Senobium (as mentioned by MC if you choose The Alchemist path) but we still have two things left, the night and the final judgement.

We know from the game devs that Leander is not a good person to say the least, just showing a façade of his true self. So i think that the fact that his fatal flaw is crossed out and this fundamental detail could be related to those two attributes Thoth has. PLUS if you see Leander’s outfit he is wearing a belt decorated by two moons, linking him to the night.

Leander is mysterious but strangely sweet to the MC, even after being aware of their power and danger, even to a point of growing overly interested in them. He promises us balance, a normal tranquil life, the answer to all of your problems. From what he has shown us so far he is very protective and even a bit obsessive, always insisting on Mc coming to him for help, giving us an impression that maybe he is more than meets the eye.

In conclusion, i think Leander will be a wayyyy darker character than we expect, greedy for knowledge — fact shown in his trailer silhouette quotting “mages lust for power, it’s always their downfall” — which is why maybe he’s so obsessed with MC. He wants wisdom he’s thirsty for it to insane extents we might see in his route. Also not forgetting Bloodhounds’ motto and its meaning, i believe we’ll see his version of what justice is and how if he is so good with us in the beginning, how dangerous is he in reality?? specially if both Vere and Ais have tried to kill him. I’m super excited for this game.

Im a 100% sure there’s things i’ve missed, so if anyone wants to add any info or theory they have PLEAASE do id love to hear.

Little detail i left out because i think it would be too much but Leander wearing a key on his outfit is so made on purpose i can’t elaborate.

[jasmine-tea-biscuits]

Everyday I fight the urge to write a Leander fic inspired by the Darkling’s “fine make me your villain” line. Everyday I struggle not to rant about how he reminds me of that shadow wielding little shit.

And today’s the day yall get to hear about it. Sorry.

I’ve mentioned before that I think his kindness comes with another motive, which could involve studying the mc’s curse and potentially using it to his advantage. Perhaps against the Senobium? Perhaps his beef with them has to do with whatever he thinks is the greater good but perhaps he also believes he’s the only one capable of leading everyone there, and that’s why he needs you indebted to him and trusting him specifically.

And plenty of people have talked about the life and death imagery related to him, especially where immortality is concerned, which also makes me think he’s been biding his time for a LONG while, so losing the opportunity you present is NOT an option. He might’ve had perfectly good intentions when he began but maybe time and the isolation that comes with power has made him secretly very jaded, even if he’s not as crazy old as part of me likes to theorize.

Add to that the charisma and droves of followers despite (or maybe even thanks to) the mystery of where he came from and how he got this powerful?? On top of the fact he was already so fascinated with the curse, even calling it YOUR POWER, while seemingly being unaffected by it as if that shit wasn’t REALLY that out there for him to experience??? Like he could be familiar with that sort of power to begin with????

AND THEN THE SCREENSHOT OF HIM IN THE MC’S ROOM??!!!

ITS GIVING LIKE CALLS TO LIKE, ALIKE AS NO ONE ELSE WAS OR WOULD EVER BE, YOU AND I ARE GOING TO CHANGE THE WORLD, YOU WERE MEANT TO Be MY BALANCE TYPE OF OBSESSED!!!!

So yeah, I’m hoping Leander’s potential obsession with mc has something to do with him planning to use them till he realizes they might be the one person who gets him and he’s just desperate not to be alone again, even as he does terrible things for what he thinks is for the greater good.

But the part of my brain that hasn’t gotten rid of 17 year old me screaming about her questionable ships might be reaching and the very tense hand holding during the first meeting with him sure as shit ain’t helping my mental state. That screenshot could very well be a bad ending and all my theories and comparisons could mean nothing for the rest of his story. I could be delulu.

But I’ll be delulu till the game comes out.

[torao-chan]

here's leo's lil ramble on the touchstarved demo update (from what we've been able to put time into so far) for anyone who wants ittttttt

I've spent a fair bit of time ruminating on the updated demo for touchstarved. haven't played it extensively yet (aka focused on leander [no one is surprised] and played the new background while doing so) because of real life restrictions, but i have played leander's section through and fiddled with his dialogue options at the latter half.

and my conclusion on the changes is that it's going to be hard for me to give solid feedback on it.

it feels, to me, as if they're attempting to shift what one's first impression of leander is.

they've changed his speech patterns- his lexicon, his boldness in giving opinions and taking a stance, his demeaner- in his introduction scene. There is, I think, only one line I can recall (off the top of my head) that I know hasn't changed in this demo...

(and it stand out to me because of that; the magical flower quote, about how they fade so quickly under closer inspection is the general gist. a line that feels quintessential to how leander's route will play out, based on my interpretation of everything redspring has put out so far.)

The mood has shifted in this whole introduction scene; Leander comes off as more obviously well educated, his 'business student bullshit' talk levels are higher, and in the scenes involving the other adderstones, he commands more more obvious level of respect (and, as a result, a less 'buddy-buddy we're all equals here' vibe). even his connection with the senobium is outright stated, though the degrees to which are not. i remember when that was just theory.

the change from bloodhounds to adderstones i'll address in a sec, but also i think the person who addressed the removal of dog/wolf references from both the player and leander's sections, but the way it remained in ais's was onto smth too

past the introduction scene (which, as I've said before; first impressions are essential, and character introduction scenes even more so as a result), the impression we get of leander... is both the same, and very different.

I feel like, if I were less 'me', I would pick up the vibes I got from the first version of the demo- which is good, because when play testing with my friend who is less uh. media literate??? media analysis brained??? than I am, she dismissed him as 'boring guy with nothing dangerous or interesting about him'. which is to say, in this demo, it feels more 'obvious' that he's a lil' sly, a fair bit yandere, and absolutely attempting to promise intimacy and 'love', but that it's empty-ish and self-motivated to an unknown degree.

however, because I am me, Leander in this demo- feels less dangerous to me. less competent, actually, might be a better word. this may be intentional, it may not, but its through the exact 'slip ups' that happen to clue in 'not-me' into Leander's 'wait... something funky is going on here' that make 'me' me go 'oh. he's not that good at this, huh? it's... really obvious what he's trying to do here.

to elaborate on these slightly....

during the intro scene, he doesn't turn to greet us until we go 'kuras sent us'. it feels intentional to me me, and heavy handed- but to not-me, it feels frustrating and forces us to be aware of 'other things' going on. (other things being the group dynamics internally and to outsiders, the weight of kuras' name, the power and sway leander holds, ect)

post group meet up, he pulls us out of the crowded pub for our lil one on one bonding session. this is nice, sure, because leander was previously the only person never really alone with the player in the post section. but it's in this section that he slips up- becomes more comfortable in the room too fast, self-corrects, and then forces intimacy too intentionally after.

his dialogue on the other characters is more flirty for all except kuras in my interpretation- and if I hadn't been looking directly at this prior to the demo update coming out, I may not have caught it- but there we have it.

lastly, not a slip up, but- the change to adderstone feels heavy handed, as someone who looks up symbolism and already has A Thousand And One Theories on leanders backstory, his other symbols, and the like. h o w e v e r to not-me who hasn't looked into these, and doesn't do so, however, the name is merely a "huh. that's a word" situation.

all this, as i've said, has lead me to the conclusion i've already stated-

the changes made to leander feel like changes i am ill-suited to give proper feedback on- because i already have a very solid opinion on leander, and have already experienced my 'first impression' of him.

that means I feel they're going to struggle to find proper feedback on the changes because it feels like it's trying to target that-- though i've tried my best to do so through this with my me/not-me versions.

me, as i am, would find him less intruiging at a glance- because, as an intro, it makes what he's doing feels so obvious to me that it's not worth a deeper look.

not-me, however, still likes these character tropes and would know what i was getting into, and would want to pursue it further.

overall, my conclusion is, I think the changes made are not made lightheartedly, and are a good change for previewing what Leander's route will involve to a wider audience. However, I solidly feel that they are changes that the longstanding fans are possibly ill-suited to review, and it would require newcomers to properly make that evaluation, simply because the change impacts first impression so much.

with that said.

there is one change however, that i noted, that gives me hope that when i have some more goddamned time and energy more of a chance to examine the demo update as i want to do so, i'll find that the 'less competent about what he's doing' is simply another deception.

Leander's dialogue tree, at the end of the demo, feels infamous to me. Well known for it's 'positive/negative' flip-flopping, but perhaps I'm biased. But it was the section I was studying right before the demo came out--and Leander's lines that caught my eye right before have changed.

Leander presses sexual passes into comments on all the other LIs one way or another- besides Kuras. We know Kuras has been a constant in Leander's life "since he was young", and that their relationship is "admires him professionally" from Leander and feels very parental from Kuras.

Which is why, in the prior demo, Leander slipping up and forgetting to comment negatively on Kuras when the player was positive about him up until the player reminds him that Kuras is a threat to Leander's grip over them was both in character and hilarious a chance to see the mask slip slightly.

he doesn't do that in the update.

I can't remember the exact new line- Imma gonna have to go through and compare all of them when I can (and I did take screenshots but have since had to get a whole ass new computer for Reasons™️) but he doesn't do that now.

and I find that a fascinating development.

But my fascination aside, that gives me hope that despite the 'dumbing down' of Leander's intro (so to speak; i can't find a better term atm pls forgive my tired brain) and the hints it gives to his path, the team haven't actually dumbed down Leander.

They've just more heavily sprinkled the chances for the player to learn more about what his route may contain.

And that, I can appreciate, is a smart move.

That's about as concise as my thoughts have gotten, with what I've gotten to play so far, and what I've been seeing floating around my dash.

I don't have much more to say about the update yet- simply due to a lack of chance to thoroughly explore it all- but I will comment that!! I do like the new background option!!

I didn't appreciate how all the prior backgrounds had to have the 'you have been betrayed and bitter by it' running in the background, and I also felt that they were??? Mildly unbalanced???

Not in the 'there's no option that Fits Me Better' way (though the new one, the Exile, has rung closest for me yet [it was the Unnamed prior]). But in the 'pick a skillset' way.

It was 'sixth sense' OR 'street smarts' OR 'bookworm smart'. You couldn't pick a 'moderate' options, there was no 'in between', and all of them felt very strongly like you were assigning a weak point/strong point that may cause a dissonence clash between you and the player character if you were, per say, a more balanced and moderate individual.

which is, in and of itself, a weak point, but like- there was no 'jack of all trades, master of none' option.

The Exile taking the hound slot, and being described not as 'STREET SMARTS', but as 'experienced with multiple cultures and experiences, so good sense and wide general knowledge, but not Trained In Anything' feels like a very good sub in for me.

I like that it was added, and where it was put.

But again, perhaps I'm biased, because I saw it and immediately went 'oh!! that!!! thats me!!! thats me right there!!!!!!!'. and, as anyone who knows me irl will tell you, 'well traveled hermit' is almost exactly how most would describe me OTL

I didn't want to leave that unsaid, cause I've seen a lot of differing opinions on the new background add in, but also. it's less 'analytical' compared to my leander commentary so.

mildly different section but!!!

had to be said.

overall, from what I've seen!

love the update, love the changes made, and can appreciate what the changes were going for. super geared up and excited to see the game when it's finished, and I'm loving all the lil breadcrumbs we're getting in the meantime!!

and last but not least!!

love this stupid lil mf and his lil stupid mf puppy eyes.

15/10 i am consuming him whole.

thank you for coming to my ted talk uwu

EDIT: OH AND ALSO! I like the blinks that were added in. and I like that they were tied to Specific Points In Dialogue.

[cacaobean760]

Leander Characteristics

So for the past posts about Leander I have been talking about the lines that stood out to me but now I am going to be talking about his character design. I am also not sure how into theories I am going to be going into with Leander because there are a lot out there but I think I am just gonna be talking about the main things or facts that I think are heavily implied.

So lets first talk about Leanders name because I think that is the biggest hint we have for his background.

So I am just gonna throw a bunch of screenshots talking about Leander the Greek Mythology and also the flower and then I will talk about it after

OK, so we know from this Greek Mythology that Hero and Leander were in love and that Leander would swim over to meet with Hero. We also know that Hero is a priestess of Aphrodite. And what is Aphrodite the Goddess of?? That is right, Sexual Love and Beauty, Which Leander shows throughout the games demo soooo, take that as you will. Also I might bring up the virgin point later but for now im just gonna leave it here. Also in the third pic, Leander is describes as using charm(which again, Leander uses a lot though out the demo) and that, Hero being a virgin, is not something that Aphrodite would want being the goddess of love and sex. So once they become a....Situationship????? Leander keeps visiting Hero every night, but one night he gets drowned. Now as of right now, I don't think the torch or light thing is super important because I don't think there is anything in the game that mentions it so im not gonna talk about it right now either. But we then find out that Hero finds Leander's body dead on the shore but he is holding flowers in his hand....Remind me again what the first thing Leander gives to us is hmmmmmm*sideways glance* So then Hero starts wailing "O Lender" over and over, and so that is how the flower, Oleander, Got it's name. And guess what, Oleander just happens to be super toxic. Uhhhhh does this imply something for Leander's character, I'll let you decide. And even though this is known to be a super toxic flower it is still used for landscape because it is considered pretty or attractive, beautiful even. And we all know by now what Aphrodite is the Greek goddess of. I also don't know if it will become a big thing later in the game with the fact that Hero then also joins Leander in death but again, as of right now, ill just leave this here. So then you may be asking, If Leander died then how would he be alive in the game?? Well I am glad you asked.

Through out Leander's character, there are multipule instances of the idea of youth, or rebirth. Again if we go back to the flowers Leander gives us, they are noted to be white Lilles, now what do white lilies symbolize???

Ok so if Leander did die, he somehow came back to life so yes, rebirth.

While looking for Leander at first we are looking out for his dagger shaped earing, but what is this dagger going through exactly? Well, I think it is the Ouroboros symbol. And what does that mean exactly?

We can see this design on Leander's earring like I said

Actually without closely looking at this, it just looked like a normal circle but up close, it is a snake eating itself. Again with the theme of rebirth.

Now when we go to look at the symbol on Leander's belt, the whole entire structure of the belt looks like the symbol that represents the mother, maiden and the crone.

So the main point for this symbol is youthfulness or in a way, rebirth

Now when looking at the middle of the belt the symbol looks like the symbol for Aphrodite which Leander's lover, Hero, was a priestess too, they look....pretty similar right? Also just another note that doves and sparrows are also a symbol for Aphrodite andddddd what does Ais call Mhin and the MC for their nickname hmmmmmm???

okokok, so there are a lot of symbols for rebirth on Leander but what else. By now one can assume that Leander died and had been revived or rebirthed. But is there something that also leads to this conclusion without it being a symbol, why yes there is. In fact, we can see that a core color of Leander's character is green and we all know that green is related to growth or growing or rebirth??? Thus the green color leading us to talk about Leander's eyes. So lets actually talk about Leanders eye color

I actually saw a post about this so this is not my discovery but his eye color is Paris Green and guess what a fun little fact about this paint is. Yep! you guessed it, it is indeed, toxic.

So that is so slay for Leander. In fact, it's not even used now because of how toxic it is

So, so far we have a toxic flower AND a toxic Paint that goes with Leanders character.

But I want to stay on Leander's eyes for just another sec because there is also something more interesting going on in them then just the color. When we first see Leander in the CG Leander is using magic and so along with all the other sparks around him that are happening while doing his magic, there is also a "spark" or a glint sort to speak in his eye

Now, this is not super unusual because in other games or novels, the characters eyes or hair have been describe to "light up" when using magic but.....This glint never goes away

Now I can understand while using magic there would be a glint but when he is not doing anything? Unless...he is using magic constantly. I mean if he was dead, and he did get rebirthed or revived, who says it was a one time thing. What if he constantly has to use magic to keep him alive or something along the lines of that.

So if Leander did get revived or has been rebirthed but has kept all his knowledge it would explain some of the lines that stuck out to me when interacting with Leander. I mean if he is not actually in his 30's like people think he is but he is actually much older, old enough to have Greek Mythology about him, it would explain why he is so powerful or such a good mage. Like I said, I have talked about this in my previous posts about Leander and the lines that were weird to me but there are quite a few lines or situations that tell us that Leander is very strong. So lets look at a few of these situations...

First when Leander initially summons the flowers, if you choose the Alchemist background, you note that he did not need a spell circle, he just straight up summoned the flowers. And from further dialogue we can come to the conclusion that this is not normal and Leander must be a "very gifted mage"

Second when we tell Leander we are cursed and then he seems very curious and asks us if it is "ancestral or more recent". We know that Leander did not go to study at the Senobium soooooo how would he know about curses. I can kinda understand the "more recent" curses. But ancestral.....How would he even know about it and why is he so interested in it?? I mean if he really is the Leander from the Greek Myth then, Leander would be pretty old, old enough to learn about curses and even more so for ancestral curses.

Then when we talk to Leander about picking fights with Ais and trying to kill him, he just brushes it off completely and he is not the least bit worried. I mean I feel like any normal mage would be worried even if they were very good at what they do. Soooo I feel like you would have to be around a pretty long time to not be the least bit scared or nervous about messing with a monster.

And this will finally be my last point about Leander's character. It is his motto on the Bloodhound poster which is, "as above, so below". At first glance it does not seem that significant. I mean the Bloodhounds are all about helping the lower class so it is more equal to the upper class so that is probably what the motto means. This is also reinforced when you learn the fact that Leander is the son of an old Hightown Family and then runs away and joins in with the Lowtown so ya, they are trying to bridge the wage gap. But maybe, just maybe, If Leander is the Leander that died in the Greek Myth, it actually stands from something like...Heaven and Earth? Two different planes where one is above and the other is below??

Anyways that it all but let me know if you guys liked this and if you have something to add on!

[vidyagamereference]

I just watched the cinimatherapy "10 things we hate about romcoms" video and ITS GIVING ME SOME THOUGHTS ON LEANDER

theory under the cut

OKAY SO!

in 50 shades of gray, twilight, like... every hallmark movie where the guy is the main pursuer (most of them), and SO MANY MORE!! it is stated by those who look at the relationship with a realistic lense that "if [male love interest] wasnt an attractive white gazillionare he would 100000% be in jail for this!"

Um.... who do we know who has a bouquet of red flags, is community confirmed sexy and desirable (even to people who dont like him), is untrustworthy (but only if you get close), has seemingly infinite money, helps out the community professionally, is professionally endorsed by THE FREE FUCKING DOCTOR, and is basically the sole reason that a "benevolent gang" like the cops 2 electric boogaloo: guards dont love me so I'll make my own Bloodhounds exist? BASICALLY MAKING HIM IMMUNE TO MOST IF NOT ALL CRITICISM AND CONSEQUENCES?????

His reputation is golden in the community from what we can see and infer but everyone close to him REFUSES to trust him and encourages others to do the same. Especially those who seem to have had previous romantic or "escapad" experience with him! Legit the only one who even TRIES to put in a good word (Kuras) is also the only one who seems unaware of him in any capacity other than "he sure is Leander. Dont trust him too much but you can ask him for help."

Mihn: possible ex, at minimum ex fuckbuddy, wont even try to talk to him. Leander is actively trying to get back in their good graces and they are NOT having it.

Ais: idk but they have HISTORY, have probably done it, and hate each other

Vere: may or may not have banged him, definitely has a personal grudge

Kuras: has never considered him as an option. Distant. Professionally reccomends him, but encourages you to not get too close

I think hes going to be a realistic romcom style love interest (threat)

Basically a socially acceptable yandere who "would never do that hes too sweet! Did you know his Bloodhounds saved my sons life? Yeah, so i really dont appreciate you spreading such rumors about him, he is a gift to this town."

So yea i think our slut may be wanted for more than thotting it up. I mean Has anyone seen his ex in the past since they broke up? How did he get my address and phone number? The power of love isnt an answer! how do i get a restraining order in Lowtown???? T-through him? Oh... hes been following me all day. Hes waiting for me outside my work isnt he. Please dont tell him when i get off shift I'm begging you - no i know he helped your grandma bu- NONO WAA-heeeyyyy Leanderrr youre heerre!!! whaaaat? Ihadnoidea haha (im in danger)

[redstrewn]

The 7 august 2023 redstrewn perception of Leander

Before you read:

Nothing in here is new. It's all things I've already rambled about and theories others have already shared. I'm just dumping all my thoughts in one place.

I'm crass so there's gonna be sexual jokes in there

Disclaimer 1: This perception is based on many theories by other people. I don't claim to be the original speculator for these ideas.

Disclaimer 2: Plz don't yell at me for my insane delusions of Leander. You dont have to agree and I don't expect you to.

Onto my perception of Leander.

In my opinion,

His hogging of MC is due to the following:

Primarily, their power.

He has plans for it I think. The hands could have connections to fogfall (Vere, paraphrased from memory: "You're like me: not quite human, not quite monster." Vere emerged from fogfall. The soulless that attacked MC seemed more interested/distracted by their hands).

Leander could be interested in fogfall serving him—increasing his ability with magic, which is a distortion of/messing with reality. He's got motifs of what's often considered the territory of god(s) that mortals aren't to meddle with, lest they suffer terrible consequences. (Heaven, underworld, life cycle/resurrection, immortality/eternity, crossing planes/boundaries, dislike of the unknown.)

Along with his apparent egotism from his uquiz result, his erased fatal flaw, repeated use of the word "hero," and "Mages lust for power. It's always their downfall," I think it's not unreasonable to assume he intends to meddle with exactly the things mortals are told not to mess with. He's described as a rebellious mage after all (I think. Going from memory here).

Leander is taken aback by MC's power, noting its contrast from other curses he's dealt with. Considering it can completely overtake another's mind and, in my opinion, also affected Leander before he got ahold of himself (his expression dropping and seeming to reach for MC's throat), it seems to be highly powerful and thus...something exactly a mage would lust for.

Secondarily, their vulnerability.

People have many differing opinions on Leander: whether he's a yandere, if he treats MC like special or if he's just like that to everyone, if he's actually an asshole or just naïve, etc. But there's one thing that's pretty much indisputable and canon: he's got a mad savior complex. He and his Hounds act as Lowtown's helpers and his attitude to Vere in his relationship chart spells this out clearly.

Enter MC. Completely hopelessly clueless on even the most basic customs of Eridia. Desperate and broke and with nobody to turn to. To top it all off, he can give them something no one else can: normal touch that they're starving for.

If that isn't the ultimate wet dream of a guy with a mad savior complex, I don't know what is. Pretty sure he would've cum on the spot after MC responded "yes" to his question, "Am I the first person you've touched like this?" if he didn't care about weirding out MC LMFAO.

Thirdly, his egotism

Truthfully, this is related to his savior complex—it derives from egotism.

He loves attention and dislikes being ignored canonically. To MC, he is special to a metaphorically and literally magical extent: because only he can continuously, over a possibly infinite future, offer them something they've never had in their entire life.

Won't an egotistical guy get excited over that?

MC is special to him because he knows he is special to MC. He knows his magic can't cure them. But he can offer a taste of it the way no one else can.

Fourthly...loneliness?

"Despite his popularity, he isn't close to anyone." Like the saying goes, being alone in a crowd (Bloodhounds in his case) is the loneliest feeling of all.

So why isn't he close to anyone?

It's on purpose

Eridia's currency is information. Baring oneself (metaphorically at least) to anyone poses more risk in this city than elsewhere. He's a leader. Leaders need followers. Followers need someone to believe in. For people to believe in someone, they must have good reputation. Baring his flaws poses risk to that.

Nobody want him lol

I think it would be funny if he's popular and has a good enough reputation that people respect and adore him...but know that they're better off not getting with him lol. Vere looked into his soul and fucking hates what he saw. I don't have enough evidence for this take. Just that it would be fucking hilarious.

Was he chasing after the other LIs because he's lonely?

He seems to be the type to chase anyone down (or at least anyone that may be able to offer him something) whether that's just to gather information talk over drinks/dinner or recruit them into his Bloodhounds.

So, okay, yeah maybe it's not just that he's lonely but he also gets to gather more information by picking people's brains. And also he gets to add onto his growing gang that does his bidding. And also he could convince and influence others to do things he wants (like he does with MC! "Noooo haha MC stick with me the rest can't help youuu").

He could be both lonely and networking like the business major that he is 🤷‍♀️

What's his fatal flaw?

"Mages lust for power. It's always their downfall."

🎵 Love's gonna get you killed. But pride's gonna be the death of you, and you and me 🎵 — "PRIDE." by Kendrick Lamar

God complex! Savior complex! Egotism! The deadliest of the seven deadly sins! The sin of Satan himself that caused him to be cast out of heaven! The cause of Icarus's great fall! The damnation of Faustus! Give it up for HUBRIS everybody!

It's all about arrogantly believing you can handle or know better about greater powers you're told no one should or can.

Gosh, how embarassing this would be if people knew your fatal flaw was considered the worst of all flaws...and about being the biggest failure too. If I was an egotistical guy worried about my reputation, I'd scratch out my fatal flaw too.

Does he care about MC at the time of demo?

He cares about them a lot! Because of their power, his savior complex, and his egotism! The loneliness probably helps. He's special to them so they're special to him!

So he likes them?

Sure! He loves how much their power can do for him and how much they feed his ego!

Wait what? Is he just using them?

😬🤭 Don't worry, he's lonely. He'll probably end up actually caring enough to honestly think about what's actually best for MC and not just his selfish intentions...eventually...at some point...maybe?

But he's jealous! He likes them then, yes?

I mean...I wouldn't want to lose a source of great power and ego boost to anyone else as an egotistical mage, personally. Especially not my rival that I'm actively trying to kill.

This perception of Leander is too dramatically horrible. He can't be as uncaring as you think.

I think he likes to think he cares! He probably likes thinking of himself a hero who does no wrong and only does what's best. Even if the means might be a little unconventional or reprehensible to some people.

But I also think he's highly fucking delusional about it all. Probably why people get deranged/insane vibes from him.

I think his head is so far up his own ass he can't fucking see he's clearly being more selfish than he might like to think. He's so convinced he knows better, runs away from his cushy home, runs away from enrolling into the elite institution to do his own thing and make his own group to run his own set of people. He says something like, "I'm just as good as the Senobium. Better, even."

That's some audacious shit! That sounds like a man who doesn't know his own shortcomings. And he is according to his uquiz and the fucken slashing of his fatal flaw. HUUUUUUUBRIIIIIIIIS. He's delusional about himself: his feelings, intentions, knowing what's best, whatever.

I want to fucking swing a bat against his thick skull, honestly. He'd make a great piñata.

End note

Honestly thought this post would be longer but I don't know what else to ponder about this rascal.

[6okuto-moved]

OK SO GURL !

Not really theorie but mainly ideas i got here and here only based with my love for a good old mercenary ( aka protector ) x alchemist ( aka 0 chance of survival alone )

So my brain is thinking and thinking and like that one flower scene about how they are pretty although they don’t last long, but at least they leave quite an impression. What if this could be used for his dynamic with mc ? As like, him trying to give a good impression for mc to have a pleasant time, making them able to live normaly for a moment and enjoy life but deep down that just a facade. He tries to but something is here and because it can’t be real he just tries to at least put a font for them because he wants mc to enjoy life ?

That way too much of analysis for a simple interaction about flower but really the «  you seemed like you need some luck » what luck ma boi ? What do you have in mind ?

So hear me out hear me out, Leander who have a little thing for mc and knowing their situation, wants to help them because sure people deserve nice to get better but especially THEM. Like, the softness and desperation with wich they hold his hand when he offered them and like how the « make happy » instinct kicked in. Or like even at the bar when at first it’s letting mc touch him to feel better but in a way he enjoy their touch too, he too appreciate the confort (sorry but leaning into their palm ??? I know alcohol was here but still !)

Anywhoozie know that like… if you ask i will doodle him !

OHH I get it. like it relates to how he can't cure u but he can give u a sense of normalcy in it all...love the line "if you need a reprieve from what haunts you, come find me." I SEE THE VISION!!! + tangent but the flower scene's important for sure i agree. lilies meaning purity, innocence, rebirth... does the disappearance mean those things are fleeting or are they more meant to relate to who he is in some way yknow.

i think/hope he can help us but also my rose tinted glasses and i don't care if he can't bro i'm twirling my hair anyways 😂😘🫶 there might b smth w mc's physical reaction to touching him maybe...like ofc it has to do w being Touchstarved. but i guess i found the wording of their head feeling like it's stuffed w cotton or how hard their heart was pounding after touching his face interesting. filled w cotton isnt rlly the description id go for. the imagery + connotation is... anyways

AND OMGGG LEANDER DOODLE...u could draw like..mc/an oc giving Him a flower... or erm. not sure. maybe him w a cute headband. u know the fuzzy ones u wear to wash ur face and keep hair out of the way. sorry thats really specific im wearing one rn

[actuallylorelaigilmore]

general life update

today was my second morning giving kinnie insulin. (@actuallylukedanes and i are trading off, they give it to her after dinner.) it definitely went better than the first time, though i was even more aware of my anxiety this time, and my hands shook even worse. but the first time kinnie jolted and tried to escape, and this time she sat in my lap and was honestly calmer than me til it was over. so that seems like good progress.

she’s already got more of an appetite and to my eye, isn’t as overly thirsty anymore. the insulin has been making her sleepy, but i had to remind myself today that after i get up and begin my day, she has always demanded her morning nap in which i’m not allowed to do anything but hang out with her. so it’s not concerning that she does that now after her breakfast and insulin. and of course, we’ll get things adjusted later this month. it’s early stages yet.

myself, i’m having a weirdly good day! i volunteered to take the morning shift because leander has a pretty regular wake up time that wouldn’t mesh well with 12-hour shifts for kinnie--whereas i have basically no sleep schedule. much easier for me to put myself on a new morning routine when i didn’t have one to start from. the sleep deprivation hasn’t been fun (i have a bit of a headache from it atm) but on early days, i always feel extra clearheaded. 

things with kinnie have been so stressful and so frantic, all while we’ve been trying to get ready for a short visit from the 9-year-old next week when i also had an invasive procedure coming up on monday. i learned at the last minute that the procedure wasn’t happening locally, just adding more stress to everything, so i rescheduled it for next month and here in our city. i think that might be part of why things feel calmer to me now, in addition to being out of the ‘oh god kinnie is sick’ stage and into the ‘taking planned action’ daily routine. 

whatever the reason though, i got up today, gave kinnie and mellie their breakfast (they’re both getting wet food now), took care of kinnie’s health needs before she cuddled up with me, and then i realized: i feel clearheaded today and calm and like i could get things done, for the first time in a week. and i hadn’t even taken my adhd meds yet! so maybe my theory about mornings will turn out to be true. 

i’m naturally nocturnal and always have been, which is why i can never convince myself to get up early every day just for life improvement reasons. even though it gives me quiet time to get chores done, and focused work on things like writing...i need that external motivation or i default back to thriving at 4am. kinnie loves her new delicious (lol i find wet food so gross, even the kind she eats that smells like human food) breakfast and she likes me being up early to provide a reliable lap, so i’ve got excellent external motivation now.

i have a bunch of chores to get done (mainly cleaning my bathroom before i start sharing it next week) and not a lot of energy as i adjust to this new schedule, but i have faith that i will manage it, now that i’m not planning on being out of commission starting monday. if day two is surprisingly cheerful, maybe i’ll be almost at maximum functioning again by tomorrow or the next day. 

[thelastranger]

Crowley and Pauline Fake Date au Part 2.

Minor spoilers for The Early Years. This is the second chapter of my “Fake dating au” where Pauline and Crowley fake date in an attempt to make Halt jealous. It doesn’t go as planned...

The next morning was not what Crowley was expecting. If he had thought that Halt would have brought up last night, he was wrong. Halt did not say a word until he got his cup of coffee and that wasn't that unusual for Halt. Granted, there was a chance that Halt had blacked out and did not remember anything from last night. Crowley kind of hoped that this was the case. The way Halt avoided him disproved this theory.

They rode off on their horses before the rest of the castle had woken up, something for which Crowley was glad for. He didn't think he could look Arald in the face. The lack of sleep and the shame Crowley felt had practically destroyed his poker face.

Halt and Crowley didn't exchange more than five words before they got on the road. It was terribly awkward, but they made it work. The tension between them dissipated once they met up with the other rangers. The situation was too dangerous to have tension dividing the rangers and Crowley and Halt knew it. They could put aside and compartmentalize and personal matters until the mission was done. Plus, both of the young men had bigger

All things considered, Crowley thought he and Halt hid everything pretty well throughout the evening, though he was pretty sure Pritchard had picked up on the tension between his two apprentices. Pritchard had taken Halt to the side after evening dinner and the two had talked for an hour.

As Pritchard was talking to Halt, Crowley was staring morosely into the fire when Leander and Farrel plopped down beside him. Norris was close behind them.

“What’s got you down, o fearless leader?” chuckled Farrel, polishing his battleaxe. He didn't mean it to be threatening, but it sure seemed that way to Crowley. Crowley tried to push that thought away.

"There's nothing besides the fact that we're facing Morgarath in two days." Crowley retorted. As one of the youngest of the rangers and the newly elected Commandant, he had to keep up with the more experienced rangers in both skill and wit. Farrel just gave a chuckle and Leander gave Crowley a side look like he knew something was wrong. Knowing Leander, he probably did.

"We'll beat Morgarath, don't worry about it Red." Farrel sounded flippant, but the undercurrent of anger in his tone made it clear that one way or another, Morgarath would have to deal with his actions and their deadly consequences. Leander turned toward Farrel who, Crowley had noticed, was sharpening his axe blade even more viciously than before.

"Don't get cocky Farrel." warned Leander. In response, Farrel stopped sharpening his axe and in a blur of motion, threw it in the air. The silver blade shone in the firelight before thudding into a tree across the clearing. Even from across the way, it was obvious that the blade had sunk deep into the tree and with precision. Farrel gave a grim smile that almost looked feral.

He strode across the clearing, everyone looking at him. When he got back to the fire, he simply said "Morgarath will regret the day he messed with the rangers." and turned on his heel back to his tent.

Leander gave a long suffering sigh while all Crowley could do was stare. The fire crackled for a bit before Leander spoke to Crowley. Every other ranger had followed Farrel’s example and gone back to their tents. They were alone, at least so it seemed. One could never tell with rangers around.

"What did you do to mess with Halt in that way?" No one could say that Leander didn't beat around the bush. Crowley couldn't lie to the older man, but there was no chance that Leander would understand the situation Crowley was in. He decided to give a selective truth.

"I don't know what's bothering Halt," Technically true. "I didn't do anything." At least, not yet thought Crowley miserably.

Leander gave another grunt. He knew the younger ranger was lying. "Does it have anything to do with Pritchard taking Halt away to talk privately?"

Crowley didn't have a good answer for that.

"Nevermind boy. You're going to tell me that you have no idea or some other bull like that. Pritchard loves you and Halt like sons. He bragged about you all the time. If the three of you aren’t talking up a storm together, there’s something wrong.” One didn’t become a ranger without having incredible observation skills and those skills were handy, but Crowley wished the older rangers wouldn’t use their skills to figure out what Crowley was hiding. Leander continued on.

“In the short time that I’ve known you and Halt, you two boys seem remarkably close. Like brothers almost. Now, in my experience, and trust me on this,” He leaned back a little bit, shifting closer to Crowley. The fire illuminated half of his face. “There’s one thing that divides brothers faster than a greased pig can run; a woman.”

Crowley cursed Leander and his intuitiveness. In the firelight, Crowley was tempted to spill everything to the older ranger. It had been one day and already Crowley was tired of the deception. He hated lying and hurting Halt. Maybe he was in over his head. He opened his mouth to speak.

“You’re-”

At the same moment, Halt and Pritchard came out of the woods and back into the clearing. Pritchard had a comforting hand on Halt’s back and Halt looked like his normal self. There was no chance Crowley was going to tell Leander now. He clamped his mouth shut. Leander shifted back dissatisfied. Pritchard smiled warmly at Crowley and despite everything, Crowley felt better.

“I have to head off now to Gorlan,” All three men nodded. Pritchard had to be at Gorlan earlier than the rest of them for his part in King Oswald’s rescue. Crowley was sad to see him leave so soon though. “I wish I could stay longer, but duty calls.”

Leander got up to clap Pritchard on the back and Crowley followed suit. Halt hung back until the other two men were done and then hugged Pritchard himself. Pritchard really was the best of them and Crowley hated to see him go. It should’ve been Pritchard who was elected Commandant, not himself who didn’t know what he was doing and hurt his best friend. Almost like he was reading Crowley’s mind, Pritchard pulled his former in apprentice in for another hug. In Crowley’s ear, he whispered some praise.

“You are going to make a great Commandant. Trust your instincts and trust your training.” He released Crowley and smiled, the laugh lines on his face evident. Leander affectionately waved Pritchard goodbye and Pritchard rode off on River into the dark night. If it had been anyone else riding into the woods at night, the rangers would have stopped them. But it was Pritchard and Pritchard was the best of them all.

Leander yawned and stretched his arms. “I’m going to patrol around for a bit. You two boys get some sleep.” Halt and Crowley looked at each other. It had been a long day and they were both tired. Leander’s offer was generous, but Crowley suspected that he just wanted to get them in a good mood so they would tell him what was wrong. Crowley didn’t care what Leander’s motive was as long as he got some sleep this very instant.

In the tent Halt seemed like he was going to say something, but changed his mind. Crowley decided to play dumb a little. He found he was doing that a lot lately.

“How was your talk with Pritchard?” There was a quick spasm on Halt’s face but it disappeared as soon as it appeared. Halt’s talk with Pritchard had gone fairly well, they had talked about how Halt was adjusting to Araluen and towards the end, talked about how Halt was feeling towards Pauline. Pritchard was an intuitive man and he could tell that Halt (and Crowley) was struggling with something. Halt hated talking about his feelings, he’d rather eat some poisoned shrimp again, but Pritchard had a way of making Halt feel comfortable. By the end, Pritchard had told Halt that if he really was this torn up about Pauline and Crowley, he needed to talk to Crowley about it. “The rangers have already been split. We can’t afford for internal affairs to divide us even further.” Pritchard was right and Halt knew it. He had made Halt feel slightly better about the situation, but there was no way Halt was going to tell Crowley any of that.

“It was good.” Crowley waited for Halt to elaborate more, but no words came. After a minute, Halt seemed to gather his thoughts and continued on. “He asked how I liked Araluen and if I missed home.” This was some of the only information Halt had ever given Crowley about his life and it shocked and saddened him.

“Do you miss home? Droghela, right?” Halt imperceptibly tightened his eyes. He hadn’t told Crowley the truth about where he was from and why he had left Dun Kilty. He hated lying to Crowley but he feared that if Crowley knew the truth, he would treat Halt differently or somehow Ferris would find out that Halt was alive. He couldn’t let that happen. So Halt kept lying to his friend.

“Yeah, Droghela. I miss the landscape and not much else. My sister mostly.” Crowley noticed that there was a slight hesitation before Halt said Droghela and Halt’s accent had gotten less pronounced as he was talking. Halt hadn’t meant to make his Hibernian accent less pronounced, it just always happened when Halt was talking about Hibernia. Crowley also noticed that Halt had finally mentioned a family member. He was honored that Halt trusted him enough to tell him one thing at his personal life, something which Halt held close to his chest. Crowley had heard the fake version of Halt Arratay’s life that Morgarath had been told, but never Halt O’Carrick’s life.

“Does she know where you are?” asked Crowley tentatively. He sensed that there was something else Halt wasn’t telling him but he didn’t want to pry.

Halt shifted uncomfortably, shrugging off his cloak. “She doesn’t actually. I left in a hurry, but if I know her, she’s still looking for me and not taking people’s words at face value.” An interesting way to phrase things thought Crowley. “I plan on letting her know at least that I’m alive.” That was true. Halt wanted to wait until things died down in Clonmel and in Araluen with Morgarath before taking a quick trip to his home. Caitlyn needed to know he was alive, if not in person then through note, and she could be counted on to keep it a secret from Ferris.

Crowley nodded though Halt could not see him in the dark tent. He could understand being distant from family members. Being a fabled ranger, especially during the time of Morgarath’s rangers, meant that people, even family members, suddenly became scared of Crowley. There were a few cousins that had conveniently stopped sending Crowley letters once they heard that he was a ranger’s apprentice. People thought that rangers used magic to achieve everything which Crowley found ridiculous, but Pritchard had used those expectations to his advantage more than once.

Getting uncomfortable with the way this conversation was going, Halt cleared his throat and pretended to go to sleep. He laid on his back and evened out his breathing, eventually letting out a few snores for good measure. Crowley just sat in silence, unconvinced. After a long time, Crowley laid down next to Halt on his bedroll and went to sleep. Halt didn’t try to wake Crowley, instead electing to lay there with his thoughts.

Halt was torn up about Crowley and Pauline. Even after two meetings, Halt was sure he loved Pauline, well maybe loved wasn’t the right word. Halt was greatly interested in Lady Pauline. She was graceful, competent, and anyone who would risk their life to help beat Morgarath was okay in Halt’s eyes. He wanted her to be happy and if she wanted to be with Crowley, then that was her decision. He hadn’t made his intentions clear and apparently Crowley had. Crowley was a good man who would make Pauline happy. It wasn’t much comfort to Halt, but it was some. It didn’t soothe his hurting heart all the way. Halt was fine though. He could push emotions and things down like a champ; it was how he dealt with Ferris for so long. This is fine, he thought to himself.

Maybe that was why he was impacted so much by Crowley courting Pauline. Crowley was like a brother to him and Halt hadn’t had good experiences with brothers before. Halt sneered at himself. That wasn’t it and you know it O’Carrick, he thought. To put it plainly, he was jealous, he realized.

Halt hated himself for being jealous. Neither Pauline or Crowley deserved that and Halt felt like a bad friend for even thinking about it. He couldn’t take much more of his thoughts so he rolled over on his blanket, closed his eyes, and did his best to banish any thoughts of Crowley and Pauline from his dreams. It didn’t work.

This is also on AO3:

https://archiveofourown.org/works/20925626/chapters/49747391

[fatedkings]

“What’s the matter, little soldier? Aren’t you having fun?” Killian asks mockingly, his & Icaruna’s voice echoing with laughter. Two-colored eyes seem to glow with mischief but knowing the two it wasn’t going to be something benign. The little god grew closer as his smirk grew despondent, as though he was truly hurt by Elleon’s inaction. Nothing but a ruse. “I thought you would have lots of fun. Icaruna worked really hard on these games. You wouldn’t want to make her sad.”

@rcprobate​  //  likes elleon to suffer along side me.

rasp crackled the words  without lifting the sarcasm from an underlying tired tone, lifting fingers waving off the voice so casually.  hearing that familiar voice once more whispering against his ear, the throbbing pain in the abdomen beat like a drum.  un-moving, unresponsive to killian’s demands of a puppet to amuse their other bodily guest though only her presence was faint compared to the god of chaos.  “ busting my balls over here having a blast. ”

fear, the empowerment of being in control, a theory to drive madness razing arun and it’s people.  twice had enthrallment sundered the heart, like string wrapped around the finger killian remained dormant within.  the god could smell it,  his insecurities, the uneasiness of his heart, the petrification of what was life to be now for him, for leander. fear was not enough to summarize the state of being: a foreboding anxiety that tore him down emotionally, mentally.  he would never give killian satisfaction of watching any trepidation.

“ is she sad? you never let her talk for herself. ”  not for a moment did he believe a word the other spoke, whether icaruna had any influence of having a separate consciousness at all remained unseen.  clearing his throat,  “ i apologize, icaruna, perhaps our game can continue when your brother is not driving me mad with childish sport at twilight hours of clawing at my throat.  i’m sure you are a far better friend when he is not your keeper. ”

elleon was planning to ride it out,  unsure of the future and what it held for him now.  an agonizing slow death,  to let killian watch his only chance to live once more go back up in smoke. 

[temproustotoo1979-blog]

I feel like this topic has been beat into the ground on this sub repeatedly. I think outside of the YouTube community and BGC, people don't really know about his past, you know? I've seen acquaintances of mine that aren't that into makeup (I don't think they watch beauty YT videos) RT his tweets and like his instagram photos, etc. To people who don't research into him, he probably seems like an edgy, non gender conforming makeup artist with cute dogs and lots of money. It just another chick with a good voice. For all intents and purposes, she closer to an American Idol winner than anything else. And I get the popularity. That never really happened to me before. Everything that moves is now back on table. I think I pulled in around $300 last night just wandering and chasing deer. Another dispatch of slavedrivers slithered towards the commotion. Bxby couldn help but notice this unit seemed less staffed than the earlier. And they were smacking their lips with fear.. Third Tier Schools (roughly down to 50) are the state level ones. Going 진주출장샵 to a school in this tier will give you an advantage over everyone else in your tier in the state your school is located, and depending on the market and school it may be as well respected as a degree from a school in a higher tier. Once you out of your state though, your advantage disappears quickly.. It definitely more complex than filling out boxes, and i glad we having this discussion and grappling with these questions! I think you should perhaps reach out to adcoms on SDN about what exactly they would think, and maybe how it would vary from school to school. I think gender dysphoria is a very different sort of mental health issue than generalized anxiety or depression or something like that. This would definitely be something that requires more advise than we can give here. Charles Nicholls expounds on one theory in his book The Reckoning, but that not the only theory. Other Marlowe biographies include Poet and Spy, by Park Honan; The World of Christopher Marlowe, by David Riggs; and Christopher Marlowe, A Renaissance Life, by Constance Kuriyama. Marlowe wrote Tamburlaine, Doctor Faustus, Edward II, The Jew of Malta, Massacre at Paris, The Passionate Shepherd, and Hero and Leander before his death at age 29. 3 4 cents is up to 5 cents. 6 7 cents is down to 5 cents. 8 9 cents is up to the nearest 10 cents. I noticed someone replied HERE to go off social media, and I have to agree (especially now!). I recently got rid of Facebook and it helped a lot. You are protected from seeing some really bad sides of people and therefore have less negative thoughts about others. The club will go for the partner that will pay them the most, but I prefer to avoid Nike and Adidas. There no two ways about it, we get basic templates. Boring. There a very specific reason why there an "Applause" sign at the end of "A Friend Like Me." During various previews of the film, the audiences weren applauding at the end of that production number, which frustrated Disney producer Jeffrey Katzenberg. In an effort to both appease and likely annoy Katzenberg, Goldberg put 진주출장샵 an applause sign in at the end. "It actually worked!" revealed an amused Musker. Acne bacteria food), working synergisticly with Retin A. When your acne starts getting better you can consider using chemical exfoliants to help fade your pih and remaining clogged pores vit c, aha, bha are all good choices. All said and done your final comprehensive routine may look like this:. Witch hunting him and sharing this everywhere will only unnecessarily ruin it for the people involved, plus, it breaks several roles of this subreddit, such as keeping comments kind and civil. In the worst case, she can still dump him if she really feels uncomfortable with the whole situation, but there are also people who embrace this kind of thing and like knowing how much they were loved even before getting together. Me and my girlfriend constantly discuss how heels over head we were for each other before finally talking and what led up to it.

[thatgothlibrarian]

but Jay, should Hamlet's death by poison be an elaborate metaphor for orgasm aka la petit mort? Horatio helping him make peace with his death etc. ANALYZE IT

This is borderline an essay, so please read my flailing after the cut.

Actually, Horatio isn’t helping him make peace. Hamlet is weirdly calm about his death as it is happening. It is Horatio who is in fact distraught.

Through the play, Horatio has been our voice of reason. He is steady, stable, calm. He is the perfect balance to Hamlet’s keyed-up emotions. We don’t know what Hamlet was like at Wittenberg, but right now he is emotional. His father is dead. His mom has married his uncle a little too soon. He finds out his uncle killed his father and he is tasked with seeking revenge. And he knows how that will end.

I like to think that Hamlet has always been very intense. Horatio doesn’t seem to be disturbed by how like, Extra Hamlet is. And Hamlet does the whole “Give me that man that is not passion’s slave, and I will wear him in my heart’s core, ay, in my heart of heart, as I do thee” while speaking to Horatio. Horatio being a touchstone, a stabilizing factor, for Hamlet seems pre-established. Another reference to this is the “O Damon dear” line, alluding to the story of Damon and Pythias; Damon being a man who was willing to die for his friend, not even thinking twice about it; and it is obvious this is not the first time the two of them have called each other such.

Before the duel, Horatio is like “idk man maybe you shouldn’t do this,” which prompts Hamlet to give the “we defy augury” speech. Hamlet has accepted his death, and has known it will happen, since that ghost spurred him to his revenge. “There’s a special providence in the fall of a sparrow.” Hamlet knows there is really nothing he can do to stop his own death; it’s gonna happen eventually, right? And he’s so tired. And his revenge is so consuming.

So we get to Act V scene ii. The queen is dead. Claudius is dead. Laertes is dead. And Hamlet, after Laertes admits he poisoned the blades, simply says:

Heaven make thee free of it. I follow thee.— / I am dead, Horatio.—Wretched queen, adieu!— / You that look pale and tremble at this chance, / That are but mutes or audience to this act, / Had I but time (as this fell sergeant, Death, / Is strict in his arrest), O, I could tell you— / But let it be.— Horatio, I am dead. / Thou livest. Report me and my cause aright / To the unsatisfied.

To which Horatio immediately is like OH FUCK THAT and, since he is “more antique Roman than a Dane” (the name Horatio can be the adjective referring to things that are like the poet Horace, after all, and also this is often read as a “I’m too gay to live without you and I love you”), he picks up the poisoned cup to drink, to kill himself, to follow Hamlet into death. Indeed it is Hamlet who takes the cup from Horatio, who keeps Horatio from killing himself. It is Hamlet who helps Horatio make peace with his death, not Horatio who helps Hamlet. “If thou didst ever hold me in thy heart,” Hamlet says to Horatio when asking him to stay alive, to tell the story of what happened.

As Hamlet takes his final breaths, he uses them in fact for mundane things: let people know that Fortinbras has my vote for taking over, because I will be dead before I hear news from England, and I hear Fortinbras coming now. The rest is silence. Death is silence. Death is peace. Death is freedom. The rest, indeed, is rest. And this breaks Horatio’s heart:

Now cracks a noble heart.–Good night, sweet prince, / And flights of angels sing thee to thy rest!

SO. If we want to try to make this an orgasm metaphor, how would we go about this? We must first link death and love within this play, and Shakespeare has quite the track record for just that.

1. This almost suicide recalls the end of Romeo and Juliet: Romeo sees his lover dead and drinks poison to kill himself, and then Juliet sees her dead lover and kills herself with his dagger (indeed, what could the dagger be in our extended metaphor). So the death of Hamlet mirrors both deaths: poison, and the second lover killing themselves with something of the first’s.

2. Shakespeare was such a big fan of Christopher Marlowe that the only thing in all of Shakespeare’s plays that he directly quotes is the Hero and Leander poem of Marlowe’s, another tale of tragic love. This poem is also uh gay, and the Chapman addition directly following Marlowe’s death even more so. For an excellent analysis of this poem and particularly the addition, see Queer Philologies: Sex, Language, and Affect in Shakespeare’s Time by Jeffrey Masten, which I am reading right now.

3. Hamlet is full of references to classical lovers and friends separated or almost separated by death. And I use “friends” here in the context of the time: same-sex friendship held different connotations than it does now, and the lines between romantic, sexual, and platonic relationships were not as clean-cut as they are today. Hamlet calls Horatio Damon, thus making himself Pythias. In the Yorick speech, Hamlet calls up Alexander the Great, and particularly his death. The speech Hamlet asks the Player King to perform is the slaughter of Priam, and the thing that strikes him after is the ability for the Player King to show such emotion “for Hecuba! What’s Hecuba to him, or he to Hecuba, that he should weep for her?” Again, two lovers separated not just by death but by tragic death.

4. There’s this essay called “Hamlet: Letters and Spirits” in the book Shakespeare and the Question of Theory that discusses a small throwaway line given by Laertes, where he says the name of the Norman man is “Lamord.” This essay points out how that sounds like “la mort” and indeed also like “l’amour.” Love and death, and the audience would hear both since they sound so alike.

We have our death/love precedent set, then, in a play defined by death, and especially the death of those people love, and then the death they deal out because of it. We have Horatio almost killing himself as Hamlet dies. Indeed, joining him in death. In our orgasm metaphor, I feel I don’t even need to explain that symbolism.

So let’s lay out our metaphor further, so that it culminates in Hamlet dying, and thus some form of cathartic release from life, and what else is orgasm but a release?

Our play opens with a ghost, yes, but Hamlet is introduced to us in a wedding/funeral. He’s upset. He’s grumpy. He’s pissy and sassy. “A little more than kin, and less than kind,” indeed. He’s defensive. And as soon as he is alone, he releases. “Oh that this too too sullied/solid flesh would melt.” Tension, release. We see a similar tension/release with the “rogue and peasant slave” soliloquy. He’s been fucking around with Polonius. He’s been fucking around with Ros and Guil (having some “foreplay” of our release with “what a piece of work is man”). He’s been Extra and requested a highly emotionally charged speech of death and love from the players. When Hamlet is then left alone on stage: “Now I am alone. O, what a rogue and peasant slave am I.” Tension, release. And each of these releases, they are not pleasurable. They might be cathartic, but they are not releases of ecstasy but rather releases such as lancing a wound, a morbid release. They show how much performing Hamlet is having to do, and then he finally can stop that performance and rest. But those rests are never restful.

Until the final rest. Two men duel with their swords (indeed, Hamlet says the rapier and dagger or whatever the hell he names are only two of Laertes’ weapons wink wink nudge nudge), and through this act of homoerotic violence, everyone on stage dies except Horatio. And only because Hamlet begs him not to die. The psychosexual fiasco that is Hamlet culminates in the final release of death, of la mort and l’amour. Hamlet is dead long before that release and he knows it. And in his death, his la mort, he begs of Horatio out of love, out of l’amour, to “absent thee from felicity awhile” so that this story can be told. The rest, and the rest, is silence. The rest is rest. Death is the ultimate release. Death is the ultimate reprieve, the ultimate sweetness, the ultimate pleasure. Man delights not Hamlet, no nor woman either, but Death comes as a welcome friend, the skull of a jester spoken to with fond remembrance.

For Horatio, we see heightened emotion and almost complete loss of control in this moment. He attempts to join Hamlet in death, in release. Without l’amour of Hamlet, the rest is la mort. Horatio does not get his release, at least not in the same way that Hamlet does. Although Hamlet’s death is a tragedy, it finally allows Hamlet to rest. Note how he says the rest is silence. Horatio is denied sharing the release with Hamlet, and now cracks a noble heart. Horatio has been calm this whole play, and so Hamlet in fact has to help him make peace with what is happening. When Horatio calls Hamlet “sweet Prince,” it echoes back to “Here, sweet lord, at your service,” the only other time Horatio uses that epithet for Hamlet. And yes, sweet had homoerotic connotations when used between two men. Horatio is a service top confirmed. But in this moment, Hamlet is at Horatio’s service. Hamlet has the release of death, the post-orgasmic state of release where the mind is empty. How else is Horatio supposed to address him then if not as a lover? Good night, sweet prince, and flights of angels sing thee to thy rest. Again, we see this theme of rest. The languid, empty-minded rest that comes from orgasm, and indeed this is the final form of that, and it is heavenly. There is this perfect, clear moment of Hamlet’s death. The rest is silence. A beat. Nothingness (and remember what nothing was a euphemism for, kiddos). The entire play has prepared us for this moment. This entire play is foreplay for this moment of release. The rest is silence. Sure, in a Shakespearean tragedy, the climax is in Act III, which is in our case the confirmation of Claudius’ guilt, the ultimate moment of Hamlet’s indecision, and the murder of Polonius (which triggers Ophelia’s madness, which triggers Laertes’ own need for revenge, the duel, and death). But the climax of our metaphor is here at the end, in Act V scene ii. The rest is silence.

But we don’t get an afterglow. With Horatio, we too are left unsatisfied. Now cracks a noble heart. But we see that Hamlet ascends through his release, and flights of angels sing thee to thy rest.

I like to argue that this play is in fact not Hamlet’s but Horatio’s. After all, he is the one telling the story. And I like to think that he, not Hamlet, is our audience analog. We end the play the only people left on stage alive, holding Hamlet in our arms, coming down from the release. And then Fortinbras shows up and Rosencrantz and Guildenstern are dead and it’s a whole bunch of shit nobody can quote and sometimes gets cut out completely. What people remember is an almost pieta like image of Hamlet dead in Horatio’s arms. The rest is silence. Good night, sweet prince. La mort and l’amour.

[firstumcschenectady]

“The Stories We Have to Tell (and tell, and tell)” based on Psalm 145:1-5, 17-21 and Job 19:23-27a

Several years ago I had the honor of celebrating the life of a woman who had spent her life as a nurse.  She was fiercely independent, had never married, was wonderfully fashionable, and LOVED being a nurse.  At the end of her life, she had dementia, and it took almost everything from her – knowledge of her loved ones, words, mobility, and the rest.  All that was left of HER at the end of her life was one simple motion.  It was the careful, life-saving motion of surgical preparation - washing her hands.  After she'd lost even her own name, she kept on washing her hands.

I often wonder what that piece of me would be – the one last lingering aspect of myself that would go last.  Truthfully, I've never figured it out, but it feels like an important question. Similarly, when I am spending time with a person earlier stages of dementia, I pay attention to what stories come up time and time again.  My theory is that those stories are core identity stories, they are key to how the person understands themselves.  As such, I try to notice what stories I'm telling repeatedly (hopefully to different people), and figure out why those are the stories I'm telling.

Not to give away all my secrets all at once, but I also pay attention to the phenomenon of repeated stories in groups – because I think stories that more than one person tells are likely stories that matter.  Also, I find the nuances and differences extra interesting.

The stories that we repeat are the stories that are important to us.  I suspect there are at least two aspects to why we repeat them:  first because they are part of how we make sense of the world and secondly because we're still trying to make sense of the stories.  Telling our stories, and having others respond to to them, helps us figure them out.  

A few years ago I came across a distinction between two types of stories we tell.  Most of us, most of the time, tell what this theory calls “ego stories.”  Ego stories make us look good, focus on life's high spots, portray us as having control in our own lives, are well practiced and linear, well told, and sometimes well spun.  These are the stories of interviews, of parties with people we don't know, of invulnerability and image crafting.

The other option, according to this theory, is “soul stories.”  Soul stories are the stories underneath ego stories, ones that tell about both shadow and light, suffering as well as gladness.  They have a lot of twists and turns, including telling about when our plans were undone by life.  Telling soul stories allows us to integrate the fragments with the whole, in part because they are unafraid of change, fear, loss, failure, shame, mystery, passion, or ecstasy. They are often told in poetry, music, or art.  They are the stories we hold onto in the hardest of times, and the ones most important for our loved ones to know.  Soul stories are likely to be the ones we are revisiting at 3 AM, or when we have dementia, or when we die.1

The truth is that in most settings, soul stories are hard to tell.  They make us vulnerable, and they tell about things we are afraid of or ashamed of.  Yet, when we don't tell them, they get told through us without our awareness.

All of this thinking about stories started for me with the language of Job and the desire in that passage to immortalize Job's story.  For a little context, we are hearing Job himself speak in this passage and, “Since Job has parodied and rejected the language of prayer (vv 21-22) and realized that his outcry brings no response or justice (v. 7) there appears to be no way for him to bring his words before God.”2 In part, Job worries about how his story will live past his death. That's what this is about – preserving his words as a testimony to the injustice of his life.  “It appears that Job describes three materials on which his words might be recorded – scroll, lead tablet, engraved rock – each more enduring than the last.”3

The phrase translated “For I know my Redeemer lives” refers to a “kinsman redeemer”, that is “It designates the nearest male relative, who was responsible for protecting a person's interest when that individual was unable to do so.  The [kinsman redeemer] would buy back family property sold in distress, recover what has been stolen, redeem a kinsman sold into slavery, or avenge a murdered kinsman blood.  The [kinsman redeemer] is the embodiment of family solidarity.”4 Now, just to be clear, this means that what Job was actually saying was “I have a family member who will avenge me, and even after I die, he will be working for justice on my behalf.”  And, further, the assumption is that the kinsman redeemer will be working towards justice for Job against Job's opponent: God.  Which is to say that this passage means exactly the opposite of what I thought it did when I first read it.  It is NOT the same gist as the Psalm from a different angle.  This is a passage really angry with God.  (The fact that I missed this means I wasn't really thinking about this being the book of Job when I read the passage, definitely a poor choice.)

In terms of understanding the passage, there is one more important piece.  The very end is distinct from what comes before it.  The commentator in the New Interpreter's Bible suggests it makes the most sense to read it this way, “'I know that my defender lives, and that at the  last he will arise upon the earth – after my skin has been stripped off!  But I would  see God form my flesh, whom I would see for myself; my eyes would see, and not a stranger.”  That is, Job returns to his constant refrain in the book:  that he wants to be heard by God, that he wants justice from God, and that he wants a REPLY from God.  Even having his kinsman-redeemer fix things after his death, or having his story be immortalized isn't enough.  He wants to take up this issue with God directly.  

In function, the book of Job is one long soul story, interspersed with some ego story assurances from Job's friends.  Even God's answers take the form of a soul story.  The yearning that Job has to have his story heard fits with the description that they are the stories we want the people we love most to know – and I think in this case that includes God.

I've always assumed that God knows my stories, in fact thats one of the assurances of life – that even if I forget my own stories, they are still alive within the Divine.  But that means I don't tend to tell God my stories as often, even though the telling of stories to God is inherently good.  And, the book of Job is the great reminder in the Bible that God is big enough to handle our anger, and it is OK to RAIL against God.  God doesn't punish us for expressing our anger, and God knows the injustices we've experienced, and yet we are welcome to keep on telling them to God as long as they need to be told.  Because God, of course, can handle our vulnerable soul stories with shadows and light, and doesn't need or expect things cleaned up into ego stories.  This is sometimes one of the weaknesses of formal worship.  When we have hymns, anthems, and prayers in poetic and formal language it can lead us to thinking that God requires us to be able to express the inexpressible.  When in fact, God can handle any communication, including “sighs too deep for words.”

Have you tried telling God your stories, instead of just going over them again and again in your head?  Sometimes it can really help.  For me, it is most helpful when I WRITE to God (longhand!).  I keep a prayer journal and I find that all the things swirling in my head and smashing into each other can be extricated one by one, examined, and a bit of order can sometimes be found among them.  Or, at the very least, I can find out what things are in conflict within me.  What seems massive within, when written to God, becomes less heavy and more manageable.  I also notice, as I write, what themes I go back to.  Which is helpful because it helps me to have a better idea what my version of handwashing might be.  

I thought, before I did my research, that I'd be ending this sermon talking about the stories we have to tell of God's goodness.  Our versions of “I know my redeemer lives” before it became clear that was NOT God after all.  (Oye).  I do actually think those are important stories, imperative ones even.  None of us are here without a good reason.  That's just not how life works.  But do others in your church family know the core stories of your personal faith journey?  Do they know why you trust in God, or what you are struggling with in trying to trust God, or why you keep showing up at all?  Are these some of the stories you keep on telling?  (Why or why not?)  Those might be interesting stories to start telling – even if they are soul stories and more than a little vulnerable.  So here is your homework this week.  (Homework!?!)  Tell one member of this community one of your personal faith stories – why you are committed to being a part of this Jesus-movement.  Together, these are the stories we have to tell, and tell, and tell.  Amen

1  Parker Palmer and Marcy Jackson, “Ego Stories & Soul Stories” © 2012 found at https://www.clearpathcounsel.com/files/4313/3029/8683/Ego_Stories__Soul_Stories.pdf

2  Carol Newsom, “The Book of Job” in The New Interpreter's Bible Volume IV ed. Leander E. Keck et al (Nashville: Abingdon Perss, 1996)  477-8.

3  Newsom,  478.

4  Newsom, 478.