#adult gohan's age

[sonchiildren]

Also, just adding this...I typically ONLY am writing Goten, Trunks, and Saiyo as kids (basically ages they'd be during and up to Super before the Super Hero stuff), I might write them as Teens if requested but otherwise their kids.

[tumblingxelian]

There's this ridiculous narrative that going on in both RWBY subreddit: fans and critics alike are saying that Yang's memory is flawed (or even that she was lying) when she said that she basically had to raise Ruby herself when Tai shut down after Summer died. Their main argument is "Yang was 5! She couldn't even take care of herself, much less a toddler!"

Several works of fiction have five-year-olds whose parents are neglectful, emotionally defeated, or even abusive taking care of themselves just fine, like Matilda (Matilda Wormwood), Persona 4 (Nanako Dojima), and Kotaro Lives Alone (Kotaro Satou). Why are they willing to give them a pass for doing that, while saying that it's impossible in RWBY?

Yang's conversation with Tai before her sparring match in V4 doesn't work if this was the case.

I'm actually insulted by this argument because the mother of my oldest cousin was a complete and utter bitch who divorced my uncle, and cheated him out of as many supervised visits as she could by working overtime whenever she could. Combined with the fact that she worked an 8 to 8 job, my cousin had to teach herself how to cook, do laundry, change her bedsheets, and get herself ready for school since neither my uncle nor her mother were heavily involved in her life, kind of like Matilda, Nanako, and Kotaro. Gee, it's almost like fiction is at least somewhat based on reality. What a concept!

Sorry if I got a little rambly, but my cousin's experience and my own experience as an older brother cause this argument to REALLY make me angry.

I've had endless debates across Reddit, YouTube, Tumblr and forums alike with people who hold that exact stance and it is never not utterly asinine.

Even if we ignore the factual reality that lots of children, even very young one's often end up parentified and left grappling with adult responsibilities as a small child.

Which I need to stress we should not ignore and the fact these people do shows just how willfully ignorant they are being.

The fact of the matter is it makes no narrative, character or thematic sense for her to be wrong about this!

Like, really, what is the narrative end goal in these people's brains, to have one of the main characters most overtly emphasized sources of trauma. Not only brought up by herself but by the sister she had to raise. Be wrong?

It makes every scene discussing it, every aspect of her character it informs, every bit if dialogue that touched on it utterly meaningless. CRWBY don't have that kind of time to waste on a red herring that serves literally Zero purpose!

But of course these people don't give two fried fucks about things like basic common sense or competent writing.

They want Yang to be delusional or lying because in their mind the fact she 'dared' be traumatized, 'dared' to be something other than a ditsy party girl and 'dared' be even indirectly critical of a man, of her father, is an insult to them.

Thus they want to ignore what's on screen, what the writers say, what the characters say, what reality says about situations exactly like this to erase her trauma and depth, All our a blend of sexist offence and misogynistic defensiveness of a minor male character.

It sucks but then, since wen hasn't RWDE been awful?

On your example:

Extremely well said, very good examples, I would also add Gohan from Dragon Ball surviving in the wilderness for a full year at the age of 3/4/5 depending on translations.

There's so many conversations tat make no coherent sense if Yang was wrong, but as said, these people don't care about good writing.

My sympathies and respect to your cousin and exactly, reality is often stranger than fiction and frankly this fictional scenario isn't even that strange sadly :/

I am right there with you for my own reasons, it sucks!

Literally the only area in which one can reasonably argue that Yang might be somewhat misinformed I thin is in relation to what exactly was going on in Ruby's head at the time.

IE, believing she didn't understand what was going on yet. That doesn't actually undercut any of her own experiences, but could be the case as it seems Ruby's memories of those early days are perhaps clearer tan Yang realizes.

Of course this changes nothing about Yang being parentified from an incredibly young age, because Ruby herself outright said Yang raised her.

[tytarax]

Requested by: @lelewright1234

The sun had just begun to rise over the peaceful world when Goku, with a wide, excited grin on his face, cradled his newborn daughter in his arms. The warm light filled the room, the same way the love in Goku’s heart filled the room.

“Leah... I can’t believe you're here," Goku murmured, his voice full of awe.

Chi-Chi, exhausted but beaming with joy, watched from the bed, holding their son Gohan. "She's perfect, Goku. You’ve got another little fighter in the family."

Leah’s tiny hands gripped Goku’s finger with surprising strength, as if the tiny warrior was already showing her determination to grow strong. Goku’s heart swelled with pride, and for a moment, the world outside disappeared.

---

Leah sat on the ground, her small legs crossed beneath her as she watched her father train. The air around them seemed to shimmer with energy, and Goku, always eager to share his love of combat, demonstrated one of his classic moves, a Kamehameha wave.

“Leah, you wanna try it?” Goku asked, laughing at the way she watched, captivated but hesitant.

Leah, only five years old, nodded with determination. She stood, her small hands raised to mimic the stance. She concentrated, a fierce look on her face, but the energy barely formed in her palms before she lost focus and collapsed into a pile of giggles.

"You'll get it, sweetheart," Goku said, ruffling her hair. "I was the same way when I first started."

Leah smiled brightly, not embarrassed by her failure. She was determined, just like her father.

---

At ten years old, Leah’s training became more serious. While Gohan enjoyed a playful sparring match with her, she always found herself pushing harder, trying to catch up to her dad's legacy.

One afternoon, Goku and Vegeta watched from a distance as Leah tried to land a kick on Gohan, who kept evading her, laughing at her every missed attempt.

“You know,” Vegeta said, eyeing the young girl, “the girl’s got more determination than half the brats I’ve seen.”

Goku, proud as always, gave his trademark smile. “She’s got that Saiyan spirit. She won’t quit until she’s better.”

Leah turned to face her dad, panting. "I’m not giving up! I’ll get stronger!”

---

Leah was now fifteen, her skills honed through years of rigorous training. She had caught up with Gohan in power, but her desire to surpass her father was still unfulfilled.

The day came when Leah faced an enemy from another planet, a cruel and vicious fighter who had been terrorizing Earth. As Leah stood, bruised but determined, she heard Goku’s voice in her head, reminding her of the importance of protecting her loved ones.

“I won’t let anyone hurt my family,” she whispered to herself. With a deep breath, she gathered all her energy into one mighty blast, her energy crackling around her as she unleashed her most powerful attack yet.

When the dust settled, the enemy lay defeated, and Leah stood, chest heaving from exhaustion. She glanced at her father, who was watching from a distance with an expression of pride and admiration.

“You did it, Leah,” Goku said, walking up to her. “You really did it.”

Leah smiled, her heart racing. "I’m not stopping here. I’ll keep getting stronger.”

---

Now a young adult, Leah was no longer just Goku’s daughter—she was a warrior in her own right. Her power had grown exponentially, and she had trained under her father and Vegeta alike. She had the strength of a Saiyan, but also the kindness and heart of her mother, Chi-Chi.

One day, as Leah meditated under the light of a sunset, Goku and Goten approached her.

“Leah, you’ve really grown,” Goku said, resting a hand on her shoulder. “You’re stronger than I was at your age.”

Leah smiled up at her father. “Thanks, Dad. But I still have a long way to go.”

Chi-Chi, watching from the doorway, couldn’t help but smile. Leah was her daughter, after all, but she was more than that—she was a proud Saiyan who could stand beside her father with her own strength.

And Leah? She looked forward to the future, knowing that no matter where her journey took her, she had the legacy of her father’s strength—and the heart of her mother’s love—to guide her.

Masterpost

DBS Masterlist

[paganminiskirt]

Vegeta and Gohan both got exposed to an absurd amount of violence at a disgustingly young age but Vegeta was singled out for “privileges” by his enslaver and before that was placed on top of a highly stratified social hierarchy that encouraged him to look down on. Basically everyone. And that messed him up in its own special way, right - that’s why he disregards his own basic needs in favor of maintaining his self image by getting stronger, that’s why he distrusts affection and feels ashamed when offered positive reinforcement no matter how old he gets or how long Frieza stays dead.

But Gohan endured that same overexposure in an environment where the adults were being coerced as much as he was. They knew it wasn’t right, they knew it wasn’t normal; they just believed that it was necessary, and that one day it wouldn’t be. One day he could be a normal kid. And that part about the adults being coerced is what Gohan internalized. He learned to put other people’s needs above his own at all costs, even at an age where he really, really shouldn’t have been doing that. And he idolized his father, and Piccolo, who each displayed that same trait of self sacrifice for the good of others; for the good of him. Which both encouraged him to emulate them (as a baby!!) and created an emotional debt from constantly being protected and rescued. He’s auto-cannibalizing himself with guilt the same way Vegeta auto-cannibalized himself with “pride.”

I bet the coffee dates are fun!

[duhragonball]

Dragon Ball Daima: Oops! All Babies

I think the word is already out on this thing. Turns out all the rumors about a new Dragon Ball anime featuring a de-aged Goku were mostly true. But it's not "Dragon Ball Magic", it's "Dragon Ball Daima". And while the Supreme Kai is in the trailer, so are a lot of other characters, so it remains to be seen if he's in the lead like the "Magic" rumors had suggested. As far as the name goes, "Daima" is apparently a word Toriyama made up, so "Magic" may have been a best-guess attempt to translate it into English, or maybe it was a working title used behind the scenes, sort of like how they called "Return of the Jedi" by the name "Blue Harvest" during production.

Anyway, the trailer features lots of characters being turned into small children, not just Goku. Some characters are unaccounted for, most notably Gohan. I'm not sure how to interpret this. It could mean he's not in the show at all, and he was unaffected by whatever caused this. But my guess is that they only had so much footage they could put in the trailer, and someone decided Kid Gohan wasn't very helpful from a promotional standpoint. I mean, we saw a lot of Kid Gohan in DBZ. Showing a Kid Gohan in Daima might have led to confusion about the show's continuity.

I'm not... particularly interested in the adults-turned-to-kids gimmick. I don't hate it, but it doesn't mean much to me. The characters look adorable, and that's great, but it's not exactly groundbreaking.

What does interest me is the message from Akira Toriyama at the panel where they unveiled the trailer. I like it because it gives me some assurance that Daima won't fall into the same pitfalls as GT. Let's discuss.

A transcript, first, in case you couldn't read the image at the top of the post:

Hello. I’m Akira Toriyama.

I’m currently working on a new Dragon Ball. The Title is “Dragon Ball DAIMA”.

“DAIMA” is a made-up term, which in Japanese characters would be “大魔” or in English would be something like “Evil.”

Due to a conspiracy, Goku and his friends are turned small. In order to fix things, they’ll head off to a new world! It’s a grand adventure with intense action in an unknown and mysterious world.

Since Goku has to make up for his petite size, he uses his Nyoibo (Power Pole) to fight, something not seen in a long time.

I came up with the story and settings, as well as a lot of the designs. I’m actually putting a lot more into this than usual!

Things will unfold that close in on the mysteries of the Dragon Ball world. Hope you enjoy these different-from-usual battles that are cute and powerful!!

— AKIRA TORIYAMA

All that really matters here is the part where he says why the characters get turned into kids. "Due to a conspiracy, Goku and his friends are turned small. In order to fix things..."

I spent like two months this year complaining about Dragon Ball GT, and pointing out all its various flaws and shortcomings, and here Toriyama sums it all up without even really talking about GT at all. The big problem with GT was not that they turned Goku into a child. The problem was that they turned Goku into a child and then did nothing about it.

I know a lot of fans like GT, but that isn't the point. The point is that when Goku turns into a kid in the first episode, it's presented like a big problem, an obstacle the hero must overcome. The implication is that Goku has to go on a quest to restore himself to normal. Except that's not the problem. The Black Star Dragon Balls are the problem, and Goku can't even think about using them to turn himself back, because they'll destroy the Earth.

So the viewer might be led to assume that the show is actually about Goku learning to adapt to this second childhood. Well, no, because he very quickly decides that it doesn't matter much to him. The only real drawback to his kid body is that for some reason he can't teleport or use Super Saiyan 3. But then he discovers Super Saiyan 4, which can teleport and it's stronger and stabler than SSJ3, so yeah he's arguably better off than he was before.

So what was the purpose of making Goku a kid in GT? I don't know, I guess Toei thought he would look cool that way. Well, fair enough, but that's like giving Goku a haircut, or a new pair of shoes. You don't market a show on a mere cosmetic change. GT presented Kid Goku like a problem that would be central to the series, and then did their best to ignore it for the next 63 episodes. And this hurts everything else they tried to do with the show, because all of the villains and aliens and battles ring hollow when they don't have anything to do with Goku being turned into a kid. If GT could have fixed that fundamental problem, it might not have fixed everything I hated about GT, but it would have at least made the show feel more satisfying to watch.

What I'm driving at here is that Toriyama understands that you can't just de-age your characters for no reason. There has to be a plot-driven reason behind it, or it's just a cheap gimmick. And there is a reason in Daima. There's a conspiracy, and somehow it led to Goku and the gang getting turned into kids. This isn't just Emperor Pilaf making a stupid wish without thinking. Someone did this on purpose. I don't know why someone would do this. Maybe it's an unintended side effect of some other action, but it's still a deliberate action that will set the plot into motion.

And this version of Goku may not care about being de-aged, just like the GT Goku didn't care, but Daima Goku is still going to do something about it. We know this because "In order to fix things, they’ll head off to a new world!" The conspiracy is a problem to be solved, and Goku's going to go to this "new world" to solve it.

This is important. I can't stress it enough. This is why Akira Toriyama is so good at what he does. I'm not saying he's flawless, but most of the criticisms I see leveled at Toriyama don't hold water. The guy knows how important it is to connect all the story beats together.

Of course, Daima could still fall flat. I mean, the Zamasu arc was terrible, so maybe this thing will turn out to be a stinker too. But at least I can rest easy knowing this won't just repeat all the mistakes GT made.

[cuttyclowngirl]

DAIMA EP.10 (Spoiler)Review/theories

• NOW we've seen every shot from the 2 minute trailer.

• Majin Kuu immediately made it clear they're not the big bad Majin Dr Arinsu hoped for, as some of us suspected. Poor silly goober. I hope we hear him sing someday.

• It's a little easy to lie to Warp-Sama. I wonder if that'll tie into the plot later on somehow. Warp-Sama letting Goku & crew pass also implies that Panzy's single jammer worked, since their Gendarmerie ship wasn't reported stolen. Nice. Though Hybis still has a collar on, so...

• I do think Goku is right in prioritizing getting everyone's adult bodies back. Their kid bodies are still holding them back a bit. Best to skip all the time it'd take to get used to them & go straight back to prime.

• The bit about Piccolo mentioning that Earth's D balls will be useless since Dende's a baby is a little pointless since they were already forced out of cool down & are already on cool down again. Everyone should be back to normal by the end of this Demon Realm adventure anyways.

• Vegeta showed an impressive amount of restraint. Hybis was seriously pushing it. Also, confirmation that Vegeta & Bulma are legally married. Cute.

• While the 2nd demon world is pretty at first glance, we see more & more evidence of Kid Buu's rampage everywhere. So many archipelagos with nothing on them, long empty stretches of ocean where maybe islands or even continents used to be. Same goes for the Namekian home world. It's a somber beauty. At least the air isn't heavy. One less nerf.

• Seems like the legend of the Kraken doesn't exist on Earth. Odd. Unless this is a case of Goku's ignorance outside of fighting.

• The plane trouble's never gonna end, huh?

• So now, if Goku & friends manage to get to 1st world, they'll get to fight an entire army of Gendarmerie, then, maybe, King Gohma, Degesu, & Dr Arinsu+ Majin Kuu, & then Tamagami #1. Good thing Goku had Glorio buy so many bugs. Only 3 revive bugs left though... But how many Join Bugs?

• The first kraken attack scene was so well done that I was legit worried for Panzy & Goku, even though... you know... It's Goku. Also Panzy can fly. She did fly much slower than everyone else, probably due to a combination of age, experience & magical strength. She should really ask for those ki control lessons... She saved the Dragon Ball, though!

• Since Porunga made a brand new Planet Namek back in the day, did he restore the trees the ancient Namekians brought from the Demon Realm, or are they basically replicas made from scratch? (This'll never be officially answered...)

• The way the Revive Bug forced out Goku's aura is clearly a callback to the scenes where Elder Guru unlocked Gohan & Krillin's potential.

• Panzy apparently already knows how Revive Bugs work. They must be used by soldiers at Kadan's castle.

• Goku's not great at charades.

• Krakens jumping out of the water is a terrifying thought. Plus, Goku mentions that he, Vegeta & Piccolo aren't strong enough to fight one yet, which I hope is an exaggeration.

• Being treated "as little more than slaves" coupled with some psycho demon demolishing their home world, plus everything that happens down the line... I hope Namekians will know peaceful days forever after Frieza gets axed again.

• Cameo from other Supreme Kai's was cool.

• People are probably confused, but it seems to me that this "Super Majin Rymus", much like the Yin Yang system between Kaio-shin & Hakaio-shin(Gods of Destruction), Majin Rymus, a being capable of creating entire universes, is clearly Zeno-Sama's counterpart in the same way. I mean, heck, Rymus looks like an old guy while Zeno is practically a toddler. Also, Goku is clearly never paying attention to these lore drops.

• I hope we get some lore behind former Supreme King Abura's seemingly arbitrary fear of outside threats.

•I hope those poor Glind trees get restored at some point.(mainly for the sake of everyone's Kai OCs)

• I hope we get a figure or something of this "Good Supreme Demon King".

• If you listen closely, you can hear Majin Kuu saying "Kuu" during his fight, similar to the way Majin Buu shouts his own name. It'll probably be more obvious in the dub.

• NEVA JUMPSCARE?! (but not, because he walks slow) Will he make it to the plane? Will he chat with the group? I can't wait to find out!

• The next EP preview looks Shintani AF. (I mean, he did work on this EP , but you know what I mean. (Also, it's not him at all, I'm wrong.))

[silverynight]

I'm drawing up what I think the Hashira and Tanjirou's pups would look like. But I already have their names and personalities done.

Giyuu's Daughter: Eimi (影美): Meaning “Ocean” Age: 11

A calm, mature, and sweet girl who takes her task as the eldest seriously, much like her Mommy Tanjirou. She tries to keep a close eye on her younger siblings and keep them from overwhelming their parents, as well as help around the headquarters and home whenever she can. She tries to follow her mommy's ways of helping out those who need it. Though Eimi wishes her sire was more sociable.

2. Kyojuro's Daughter: Rie (りさ): Meaning "One whose laughter is like the sun" Age: 10

An excitable and playful little ball of flame that adores her family and learning how to cook for her father. Rie is always looking at the bright side of everything and can never have a negative thing to say to anyone. When she's not helping her Nee-Chan and Mommy care for the younger pups, she's learning new recipes to make for her father's huge stomach.

3. Tengen's Son: Habiki(はびき): Meaning "Sound" Age: 9

This boy is truly his father's son. A rebellious young (wannabe) shinobi, who tends to practice his ninja skills on his siblings, his parents, any other suspecting target EXCEPT his darling Mommy. He gets A LOT of timeouts. Habiki tries to follow his sire's way of flashiness. He's not quite there yet, but he'll get there.... eventually.

4. Shinobu's Son: Jiro(次郎): Meaning: "Second Son" Age: 8

The most intelligent of the pups. Seeing how his mother helps out so many people with her medicine, Jiro can't help but be inspired to learn medical science. Constantly studying herbs and remedies, as well as reading literature books in his spare time. Jiro often talks more like an adult than a child, due to his large vocabulary. Aside from his siblings, other pups don't really interact with him.

5. Gyomei's Son: Goro(五郎): Meaning "Enlightened Son" Age: 7

Born with terrible eyesight, Goro walks around with his eyes closed the majority of the time. Though he is not the oldest, Goro already towers over all his brothers and sisters. He's basically almost the same height as his Aunt Nezuko. Goro is quiet and likes to listen to everything around him. Although he won't hesitate to use his height to intimidate anyone who messes with the people he loves. Will sit on Gyomei's lap while he meditates, even have Tanjirou sit with him.

6. Iguro's Daughter: Kameko (亀甲): Meaning “tortoise-child” Age: 6

A timid child with Tanjirou's gift of talking to animals. Especially reptiles. One of the few people not put off by her sire's scars and loves to cuddle and chat with Kaburamaru whenever she's sleepy. She does hide her ability from people outside her family as not to be ostracized. Kameko is more comfortable interacting with animals than people, with the exception of her family.

7. Mitsuri's Son: Gohan(悟飯): Meaning "cooked rice’ or ‘meal of any sort" Age: 5

Fiercely protective of his Kameko-Nee. Has a black hole for a stomach. Loves going to different restaurants with his Mama Mitsuri and trying all different types of food. Believing that the more he eats, he'll be as strong as her! Strong enough to keep his siblings and Mommy safe! Gohan's a growing boy after all.

8. Sanemi's Daughter: Satsujin(殺人): Meaning "Murder" Age: 4

A feral little albino girl who bites people to assert her dominance. Often ridiculed because of her appearance, Satsujin has a low tolerance for bullies and insults. Be it towards her or her family. But she gets in trouble often with the people she bites. Tanjirou scolds her for resorting to violence, (and Sanemi for encouraging her), but calms her down afterwards.

9. Muichiro's Twin Son and Daughter: Niko (二湖): Meaning "Two Lakes" Nao(なお): Meaning "Docile" Age: 3

Niko is alert and hyper-focused while her twin brother is sluggish and has a case of narcolepsy. Nao would end up bumping and falling into a lot of things, if not for his twin sister and his Mommy to keep his eyes open. Niko has always got her eyes on her brother, to keep him safe and secure.

10. Kyojuro's Son: Yinjuro (No meaning. Just following the naming pattern of Rengoku's family) Age: 8 months

Just a cute chubby baby, who loves being carried around by his Mommy and older siblings. Also, enjoys his Uncle Senjuro rocking him to sleep.

Sweet pups that are very much loved by Mommy Tanjirou and all their Dads and Moms. 💕

[colorsofinquiry]

One Speculation on Daima Episode 1

Okay, I just watched episode 1 of Dragon Ball Daima. One thought that struck me when the Demon King makes his wish to reduce Goku and others to children, Shenron asks about those who are already children and the Demon King responds to it by saying that they be reduced to toddlers. So, as we know from the trailers, Goten, Trunks and Marron are reduced to toddlers.

What would strike me as interesting is Gohan's position in this. We haven't seen Gohan in the trailers. But the wish will impact him too because he was involved in fighting Majin Buu. Gohan would probably not be a toddler, because he seemed closer to adulthood, but rather around the same age that the adults were reduced to. The same applies to Videl as well.

I think, we would see both Gohan and Videl as 6 year olds like the other adults, and not toddlers like Goten, Trunks and Marron.

[davekat-sucks]

About the question about aging characters in hs^2. They are adults and some of them are parents, it is common in sequels to put a time skip where the characters age and hs^2 candy route follows the (mercenary) trope of "next generation". I think it is tremendously serious to make such an accusation when the art of hs^2 itself at the moment is stylizing the original characters differently from their child forms in the original series. Imagine using this same argument for Goku for example.

But it doesn't help on the fact that when it was originally in WhatPumpkin's control, they kept the same child-like sprites because laziness and easier for old fans to recognize. That's what made people assume that they were still kids/teens even after reading shit like Epilogues. It wasn't until James Roach and HICU decided to go an update the sprites to make them older to fit in-canon of what adult guardian sprites look like. And when there is mention of time passing in Epilogues like XX years passing, ages of characters are not confirmed unless we hear it from the author behind it or fandom making guesses based on the age they were when the original webcomic ended. The latter can be difficult if you include technicalities like the fact that the kids time traveled 1000+ years ahead so they can see the society already developed. Does their age number go up because of the time passing around them? Or does it not? I also think using Goku for this is a little different. One is that Saiyans would stay youthful after a certain point, so they don't grow that much older like humans can. They can also still be killed if they let their guard down, so they aren't immortal. Dragonballs are there for a reason. Gohan and Goten looking like Goku in some way is also to show who is the father of it. And of course, Goku becoming a child again happens a bit for the sake of nostalgia of the original Dragonball series and a plot for him and his family & friends to find a way to change him back. Homestuck Epilogues and Hoemstuck 2/Beyond Canon wishes it could recreate nostalgic moments of our fave characters.

[parkersgeorg]

Forgive me if this should have been a dm, but may I request that essay about Gohan and Vegeta’s relationship?

Ohohoho well SINCE YOU'RE ASKING.

Consider Vegeta. He has always prided himself on being, even as a child, stronger than all adult Saiyans, and that without training under anyone. He was a prodigy! He was unrivalled! And then he meets Gohan who 1) is probably even younger than Vegeta was when he was declared the best 2) never had any training whatsoever either AND wasn't even born and raised in a warrior culture. When do they first meet? Oh, that would be when Gohan absolutely trounces Vegeta's ass at the tender age of four years old (or five years old according to some Western translations, or three years old according to Toriyama's original concept), eliciting in Vegeta the same response Gohan gets from just about anyone: disbelief. For all that Vegeta has become the archetype of the shonen rival who always comes second, we tend to forget that he did beat Goku the first time they met -- and he beat him by a lot. He was torturing him to death when Gohan and Krillin and Yajirobé intervened, and without them Goku would be fucking dead (again).

Vegeta has thus been rattled not just by Goku but also by Gohan, who displayed enormous amounts of raw power at a ridiculously young age. And for all of Vegeta's posturing and pride, he noticed. After he allies himself with Krillin and Gohan on Namek, he shouts at Frieza that they're worthy allies because they're constantly becoming stronger, "especially the young one [who has] powers he can't even dream of". Gohan looks noticeably struck by this comment -- in the middle of the chaos of Namek where everyone is five times his height and a million times his power, Vegeta's acknowledgment would in a weird way probably mean a lot to him, especially since The Prince Of All Saiyans wouldn't say that kind of thing lightly. Gohan remains terrified of Vegeta's immense power and ruthless violence; but he takes Vegeta's profession of alliance seriously and doesn't hesitate to dive into danger to drag Vegeta out of the way, a move which completely baffles and infuriates Vegeta -- it was probably the first time anyone ever saved his life in combat. Of course he shouts at Gohan for what he can only perceive as a humiliation. And yet later, against Frieza, Vegeta does exactly the same thing for him, for no clear reason other that he considers Gohan an ally worth preserving.

So from the beginning, despite Vegeta's pride on one hand and Gohan's fear on the other, there's a warriorlike respect between them, and they're changing each other. Vegeta loathes Goku and dreads Frieza, and despises just about anyone else he fights... but not Gohan. That doesn't mean he's nice to him; when Gohan adorably tries to thank him for his help post-Namek arc, Vegeta batting his hand away is basically the continuation of his confused anger at Gohan trying to save his life. He cannot see that extended hand as anything other than an insult to his strength. But with that move, Gohan is literally the only fighter who tries to... befriend Vegeta. All the other Z-fighters keep well away and Goku sort of lost interest the moment he heard of someone stronger. But Gohan takes the time to thank him and acknowledge that Vegeta went out of his (admittedly very narrow) way to help them. I like to think that his wounded surprise when Vegeta rejects him would quietly shock Vegeta in turn -- shit, that kid really was trying to make friends. So his mental Gohan file would boil down to 1) Incredibly strong and worthy ally 2) Too sweet for his own good.

During the Cell arc, Vegeta's posturing endangers everyone. Once again, Gohan's amazing untapped strength comes out in full force, and once again he risks his life to save Vegeta's. But instead of blowing up at him this time, Vegeta apologizes (which shocks everyone who hears it). Is it the only time we see Vegeta apologize onscreen? I think it is. And he calls himself dead weight! Calls himself a burden on Gohan! Even in the deepest depths of his self-hatred, he would have never said something like that to Goku. No one but Gohan could have ever elicited that from him; no one but Gohan was both strong enough to actually protect Vegeta, and sweet enough that not even Vegeta could resent him for it.

So the little seed of respect planted during the Namek arc has been quietly growing during the Cell arc, and we see hints of it during the Buu arc too -- when Gohan is presumed dead, Vegeta is straight-up distressed, basically saying that Gohan didn't deserve it, getting hit by the guilt of what he's done. Gohan was the only Z-fighter to acknowledge Vegeta's humanity, and in return Gohan is the only Z-fighter whose humanity Vegeta acknowledges.

And then Buu is defeated, Vegeta concludes his character arc, and has his last interaction with Gohan in DBZ: they meet before the final tournament and Vegeta coldly tells Gohan he clearly hasn't been training. And Gohan seems intimidated and embarrassed. It's clear that for all of Vegeta's repeated fuck-ups, Gohan has never stopped respecting him: in his mind, Vegeta is still that pillar of strength that almost annihilated them all that first time on Earth, and saved their asses multiple times on Namek when Goku was nowhere to be found. The fact that Gohan is so vulnerable to Vegeta's judgment harks back to that moment on Namek when Vegeta casually acknowledged how awesome Gohan's power could become. Gohan remembers that -- and now, having abandoned his training, he clearly feels that he's disappointed Vegeta.That he didn't live up to his hopes. And Vegeta, in turn, clearly tells him he expected better -- that he did have hopes of Gohan, and that Gohan is fully capable of (and therefore responsible for) upholding Saiyan pride.

This is when we leave canon and depart for the mad fevered realms of my brain. The Namek Chief and Old Kai both saw deep untapped potential in Gohan but could only attempt to bring it up to the surface through magic. Gohan is basically, repeatedly confirmed as the strongest DBZ character ever... if he could only manage to actually unlock that strength. But it's locked up tight.

I wonder if anyone could HELP WITH THAT.

Being drafted in a terrible war at an absurdly young age? Vegeta knows how that feels. Being hindered in your ability to get stronger because of psychological issues stemming from trauma and self-doubt? Vegeta also knows how that feels. Feeling like you can never unlock your abilities when you need them? Vegeta also knows how that feels! He can even relate to being disgusted with fighting -- he swore to renounce fighting after Goku's second death and essentially kept his word right up until Goku came back. Most importantly, Vegeta would be uniquely suited to recognize how both Piccolo and Goku's training approaches fucked up Gohan. Piccolo didn't reassure him enough, turning the fight into this terrifying non-negotiable obligation. Goku reassured him too much, basically taking the fight aspect entirely out of Gohan's training -- to the point that Gohan experienced the actual fighting as a betrayal when the time came to face Cell, and terrified himself when his Saiyan ferocity came out unbidden and uncontrollable.

As the only person alive to remember Saiyan culture, Vegeta could see that what Gohan's been missing is the sheer joy Saiyans are supposed to experience when fighting. And post-Buu arc, Vegeta has grown enough to acknowledge he can care for other people. He would allow himself to actually use everything he knows to further someone else's development. His skills as a prodigy, his understanding of Saiyan nature, his own exploration of trauma, his respect for Gohan and his faith in that famed potential -- all that could come out to play big time. He could help Gohan; he would help Gohan. And thus finally return the friendship Gohan dared to extend to him all those years ago. And when I think of how Gohan would react to that, I CRY.

[romantic-ageru-yo]

Wow, it's so neat to find people who draw Krillin and 18 together! Seems like everyone these days likes to depict her with Gohan, Trunks, or Vegeta instead.

They do?? (I've never really been in DB fandom spaces before) None of those make any sense to me o-o

Gohan she met when he was like 10? and she was already an adult, that's creepy

Trunks always has a knee-jerk 'KILL ON SIGHT!!' reaction to her, even years later in Super. I don't think he could even stand being in the same room as her, let alone a relationship (... unless we're talking about little Trunks here, in which case that's an even grosser age difference than Gohan)

Vegeta... they absolutely despise each other xD He violently attacked her, she beat his ass in self-defence, and then he assists Cell in murdering her... I can't remember either of them even acknowledging each other since then, despite being on-screen together multiple times, if they have any sort of 'vibe' it's mutual hatred/animosity towards each other (because Vegeta's petty, and 18 shouldn't have to tolerate the man who threw her life away)

Even if any of those made sense, 18 is clearly not interested in anyone other than Krillin, that man makes her SWOON. She has other guys hitting on her in canon, and she always tells those guys to fuck right off, she's not interested, she's happy with her man <3

[potaracandy]

Ngl I feel like some people take the "Saiyan hair never changes from birth" tidbit in canon too seriously. It's fine to believe that the overall texture never changes, though it's been indirectly proven the length of it does "scale" with the Saiyan's age (e.g. if adult Raditz' hair was exactly as long as his kid self's, unchanged in every way, it'd look extremely short which it obviously doesn't canonically).

But I saw one fan take the other day along the lines of "Saiyan hair also can't be styled or groomed". That literally doesn't make any sense to me. It's hair. Not stone. Like there's nothing preventing Goku from combing or brushing his hair, whether his hair spikes will "snap" back into place or not.

Tbh I personally believe the hair thing was implemented just as an excuse for Goku & Vegeta to maintain the exact same hairstyles throughout their lives, and therefore wasn't done with any Saiyan worldbuilding in mind, but w/e.

EDIT: This isn't including the wishy-washyness when it comes to Saiyan/Human mixed characters to boot. We've seen Gohan's hairstyle change throughout Z, but somehow this Saiyan fact doesn't apply to him (and thusly the other Saiyan/Humans)? It only applies to pureblooded Saiyans? Why? Feels arbitrary.

[dballzposting]

Dballzposting rant

In the DBS:SH movie they came out with the statement that Saiyan children will be little until one day they sprout up like weeds. This was the case for Goku. But this was not how Gohan was handled. But with Goten & Trunks they were like .... No yeah let's get back to that. Let's recontextualize Goku's past into Saiyan canon. Gohan was just a freak of nature and should not be taken as the standard

And for all I know this could have already been an implicit decision done when they made DBS, they just never outright said it but elected to show it.

Or maybe they just didn't want to change Goten & Trunks's designs or personalities too much (more than likely).

Personal story time. Some of you may be aware of my pipe dream of ask-tarble my silly rabbit ask-tarble. When I conceptualized ask-tarble it was April of 2022, and the DBS:SH movie didn't air until August of that same year.

I decided back then to have Goten & Trunks to be around 13 & 14 on ask-tarble (timeline reasons, and also I wanted to portray Trunks with braces for some reason. I did a lot of random things that summer for "some reason." I was kind of off my rocker.), and I also decided to - unlike on DBS - actually show Goten & Trunks maturing in a more human way. I felt at the time that this would be more relatable to an audience, would ameliorate the conceptual infuriation of how that wasnt the case on DBS, and -- ultimately, essentially, long story short -- I Thought That It Would Be the funniest possible thing to do.

Okkkkkkkkkkkk cool fine. But then the movie came out and I felt real fucking funny about my decision (that was already put into motion and that I felt couldn't be taken back). I knew that I COULD retcon the few posts I had going and honor the newfound canon, but, I didnt really want to. I decided to push forward with what I had.

But it still bugs me. And then they recently reinforced that little Saiyan fact AGAIN on Dragon Ball Daima, when Krillin tells Trunks that he doesn't look like he's aged a bit.

Which is fineeeeeeee. Except for the fact that I really don't like to be outright contrary to canon without a solid cause, and I've had hoards of doubts over the past few years about the chosen characterizations for Goten & Trunks on ask-tarble, even though it's all theoretical and in my head still, I just kind of hate what I've set up.

And ultimatelyyyy. This is the big one. I've changed a lot since summer of 2022. I've gotten stronger and better and faster and wiser .....

I thought then that teenage age groups are funny and thats not wrong. But whats also exceedingly funny, that I just couldnt understand back then, is Goten & Trunks as they are now.

Walk & talk with me. Goten is at his absolute funniest when he expresses a negative opinion. It's what makes him real & believable. Most of the time on screen he is happy go-lucky and naive, he is trusting, he is excitable, and this is great fun, but it means that when he DOES think that something is shit, it's so funny. Like when in DBS he thought that The Great Saiyaman was totally lameboat. And then he put on a pair of sunglasses about it.

He's at his funniest when he embodies the conviction of an old man sitting on his porch, as young children sometimes do, learning how to be human by mirroring the adults in their lives - but still putting their own spin on it.

I mean ... If you have an ask blog then you have total creative freedom of what you do. There could be so many funny moments. Extended Son Goten screentime.

It could be precisely like that Tails Gets Trolled bit when Shadow was talking about his gruesome and morbid experience in time jail or something and Sonic was just like "Ok well that's stupid."

That's Goten. He overlooks everything you just said becasue there were a few joints in your story that felt derivative or cheap and so he's just like "Ok well that's stupid."

That would be so funny. And real as well

I mean he could (and will) still be like that as a young teen but it's just funnier if he's a child. He contorts his brow like an old man and makes his evaluation your problem

[lilacqiqis]

🌙~Mod Lilac's intro and rules~🪻

Back to pinned post

Hello~ my name's Lilac!!

I'm Viet 🇻🇳

She/her

No specific boundaries... Just don't be a weirdo!! I answer any ask that's just some conversation ❤️

English is not my first language, so stuff might seem out of place , most of my work is not proofread

Ask to be made an anon and me or Mod Qiqi will assign you your requested emoji or name <3

Rules + Fandoms under the cut

! Rules !

-I do not write sexual non con

-No 1ncest (i will write platonic family only.)

-No age gap

-No full blown nswt fics, but i will write nsft headcanons and suggestive

-I am more inclined to write headcanons rather than fanfics, so if you request a full fic Mod Qiqi may answer instead of me as i tend to lose motivation. I'll try my best though!!

-Yandere is OK to request, I don't condone the behavior irl however

-No specific appearance requests (ex:chubby reader, reader with brown hair)

-I don't write for specific clan reader or reader with a specific pokemon

-Boruto doesn't exist in my mind 🤕 All is written up to Naruto TL

-Nothing with p1ss or scat 😭

-I will cut out some characters you request if it gets too long, but you can always request those characters again with the same scenario <3

-No pregnancy hc's implied is alright (a request like "reader asking to have kids" is okay but i don't want to write reader during pregnancy)

-No crossovers (ex:S/O who came from the KNY world into Naruto, reader with MHA quirks in stardew valley)

-No full blown angst, sorry!!

-No cheating or character pining over taken reader

-Be specific with requests no "general hc's for ____" or stuff like that

-GN! or fem! reader only

-No OC's

-No ships

-My rules may not be the same as Mod Qiqi's, so check theirs and perhaps you can request something and they'll answer it

-Rules can change at anytime, always check before requesting

! Fandoms and characters I write !

Naruto (for Uchiha's specify non massacre or not, I will assume the latter if you don't put "non massacre" in the req)

~Whitelisted~(please request! My absolute faves ❤️)

-Itachi Uchiha

-Naruto Uzumaki

-Kakashi Hatake

-Minato Namikaze

-Obito Uchiha/Tobi (If you request Tobi you are also requesting Obito! I will write for his Tobi persona and may add Obito as well. Requesting only Obito will not include Tobi. Non massacre Obito will have a personality more like his boyhood ver)

-Hinata Hyuga

-Sasuke Uchiha

-Sai

~Will write for~

-Rock Lee

-Sakura Haruno

-Tsunade Senju

-Might Guy

-Iruka Umino

-Karin Uzumaki

-Kabuto Yakushi

-Kiba Inuzuka

-Shino Aburame

-Deidara

-Jugo

-Suigetsu Hozuki

-Yamato Tenzo

-Shikamaru Nara

-Ino Yamanaka

Dragon Ball

~Whitelisted~

-Mirai Trunks Briefs

-Trunks Briefs

-Son Goku

~Will write for~

-Vegeta

-Goten

-Android 18

-Piccolo

-Adult Gohan

Pokemon

~Whitelisted~

-Blue Oak

-Red

-Hop

-N Harmonia

~Will write for~

-Bianca

-Cheren

-Barry

Stardew Valley

~Whitelisted~

-Harvey

-Sam

-Haley

~Will write for~

-Sebastian

-Alex

-Penny

Don't ask if i write for a certain character if they aren't here I don't write for them.

[paganminiskirt]

Something upsetting about Bulma’s reaction to Vegeta’s suicide - and it was a suicide, no matter the grandiose aims he assigned to it - is how it reflects the state of their relationship at the time of his death. That sacrifice is meant to be Vegeta’s first moment of real selflessness and maturity, growth which is contrasted by the way Bulma seems to almost regress when she gets word of it: she’s so consumed by her own ugly, undignified grief that she doesn’t react to Chi Chi collapsing about Gohan's death at all, as understandable as it is. In the anime, Bulma shouts “no,” and she shouts his name, but in the manga it’s just a shapeless, agonized wail. Reminds me of Vegeta weeping when he realized he couldn't beat Frieza. Vulnerable. Childlike.

And that comparison could almost make you think that the grief Bulma is expressing is, itself, shallow or childish. King Kai isn't there to explain the depth of her feelings, the way he was when Frieza tortured Vegeta. Bulma was introduced to Dragon Ball as a young girl, and her characterization back then revolved largely around vanity, pettiness and selfishness. When she wasn't acting that way, the story was demonstrating her precociousness and abnormal intelligence - and having adult men casually sexualize her, as if she were a grown woman.

If we've learned anything from the previous arcs, it's that slotting children into adult roles has disastrous, counterintuitive consequences. Gohan is forced to fight Cell at age eleven and almost loses the fight because he gets caught up in his own immature sadism. Vegeta is introduced to us with little to no detail on his face, making him look younger than he is, especially since he's under five feet tall. It's no surprise, when the story shows him slaughtering total strangers and old friends alike like he's ripping the wings off a butterfly. It's no surprise, when the story tells us that the whole time, he was a child soldier and a slave.

So there are themes that could potentially make you read Bulma as having stunted emotional processing skills as an adult. There's also the fact that, when Bulma and Vegeta's relationship first started, it was fulfilling needs for both of them that weren't especially healthy or mature. Bulma was breaking off a romance and potential engagement with Yamcha, which was likely somewhat codependent, considering they'd been together since youth and were each the other's first lover. Vegeta was coming off his aforementioned death-by-torture from a lifelong abuser, and Frieza himself had only just died. With that in mind, who could forget Puar and Yamcha gawping at Bulma as she gives Vegeta an order and he obeys her, trailing behind her like a pet, pouting, but doing it anyways. What’s the line in the original Japanese version? “Vegeta is completely under her control?”

So it didn’t start off particularly healthy. Bulma is feeling wounded and vulnerable, she wants some reassurance and to make Yamcha jealous. Vegeta wants reassurance as well, and underneath that, to be told what to do. The offset of their relationship has Vegeta using Bulma to soothe the part of him that still needed to be apart of that structure, that control, that obedience. He objectified himself to her, even if she didn’t know it.

But Bulma’s reaction to his second death rejects that reading of their relationship entirely. Rejects the idea that Vegeta’s self-destruction could ever be a positive thing, even though he was doing it in defense of her, this act of willingly placing his own needs behind someone else’s which a more self-centered personality would’ve gobbled up. Did gobble up. Vegeta’s fought for the sake of other people before! He fought for Frieza! It’s just that those acts of violence were exclusively destructive and exploitative, never defensive, and no matter the attitude Vegeta adopted while doing it, he wasn’t allowed to say no.

Like, I’m sure Goku told her that Vegeta did what he did out of love and altruism, but it doesn’t help. Because Bulma doesn’t want to hear that Vegeta loved her enough to kill himself. She just wants him to be alive.

[bliss-wily]

Can we know more about Bliss? The Majin girl that is. I remember seeing her back in the day interacting with Jr.

Bliss? She’s still around. I’ll just list some facts about her. To preface: This is kinda based on Xenoverse 2. I won’t mention much about Jr simply because my friend has left the fandom. Gacha Life, Xenoverse 2, and The Sims 4 have been used for illustrative purposes. I have tried over the years to make her believable. I didn’t want her to be flawless, I have tried to give her flaws and make sure she’s not overpowered. But anyway…you guys don’t need to read these long posts as they are just full of nonsense.

Name: Bliss

Age: Adult, age unknown

Height: Around 170cm

Species: Majin/Android (can freely switch)

Orientation: Pansexual

Pronouns: She/Her/Hers

Mentor: Zarbon

Everything else is under the cut.

Bliss is a yellow majin with blue eyes. She has the ability to switch between two forms, one majin and one more human/android like.

She had worked for the time patrol and was the future warrior selected for the special mission but…

At some point she gets a little too close to the Frieza Force, much like Taino she ends up idolising the members. She’s kind of a free spirit in the sense that Bliss does what she wants. Elder Kai and the Supreme Kai of Time don’t frighten her.

That fearlessness is probably quite the flaw though. I imagine that would get her into a lot of trouble and a lot of scoldings from Zarbon.

Therefore, I imagine she ends up betraying the Time Patrol in favour of the Frieza Force. I think like Trunks she may have also attempted to alter the time line only for less noble reasons - Trunks did it for Gohan, but I think Bliss would get herself involved with the events of Namek.

Being part Majin means Blissy has a sweet tooth. Candy can cause problems, and she’s easily lured by it. Milk chocolate especially, and ice cream.

That would definitely get her into trouble as well, Bliss may be smart but she’s easy to distract.

Again following Xenoverse 2 and the little Frieza Force sub quest, I’d put her position in the ranks somewhere between Ginyu and Zarbon - but she still acts like Zarbon’s aide or subordinate despite outranking him.

I do this because I don’t want to make her overpowered - sure she’s a Majin but, it’s key to remember in terms of lore; the elites of the Frieza Force are still stupidly strong. As almost everyone now is god level - these elites are people who could probably destroy a planet without lifting a finger.

Also to note: rank ≠ power level. Besides power scaling is nonsensical at this point.

Know how Buu is protective over Hercule? That’s Bliss with Zarbon. She’s feisty as well. Even messing up his order will result in the staff at the ship’s mess hall will result in one of her outbursts.

Another flaw I give Bliss is that she gets swayed by her emotions a lot, if she’s mad her thought processes are out the window.

Android/human Bliss is more stoic and serious. Still, she’s overprotective. I don’t necessarily ship the two, but she just cares a lot about those she comes to respect.

She’s a bookworm, the woman can read for fun and loves to do so.

Research is another thing she loves to do, she loves gaining knowledge.

Can be a bit lazy though, will use her majin form and her stretchy limbs to reach things on the other side of the room (and to whack people part way across the ship).

Therefore, not uncommon to also see her taking long naps much to the disgruntlement of her mentor who has training planned.

In terms of uniform, I think she would have:

Sleeveless black jumpsuit with leggings.

Or two piece black tank top and leggings.

Maybe something on her wrists, or fingerless gloves.

Standard battle suit.

Plain white boots.

No scouter - as she was future warrior she can detect ki.

She can definitely test her mentor’s patience as she can go from serious to lazy at the drop of a hat. Has definitely decided to nap or eat sweets part way through battle before.

Liked by many of the grunts as she doesn’t care about rank. Be nice to her and she will be nice to you.

Try and be creepy towards her though and Zarbon will be less than kind (already established that he’s confirmed to be overprotective of his student).

She is a hoodie lover and quite often breaks the standard uniform to wear the hoodie. I’ve decided this as Majins are seen as acting odd by basically everyone else and this is odd! Even Frieza wears the battle suit in his first form.

The reason for hoodies? I think I recall something about Majin females being modest. Besides I’m sure Zarbon has influenced Bliss over the years too. Not just in her Majin form though, I’m sure the two have plenty of bitching sessions about the others.

Plus I think they would do each others hair and discuss skincare seeing as Majins have such smooth skin - I like to think that translates to her more human form too.

With that said, he did find her repulsive at first. Then again Majins are weird and can manipulate their bodies.

Oh! Bliss is also a big time vegetarian. Her diet is purely sweets, vegetables, rice, and soda. I’m sure this causes tension between her and her mentor but it’s fine. Could definitely see her freaking Zarbon out if she were to indulge herself in mass amounts of junk food. Dodoria would be encouraging it though.

She is well mannered despite her short comings, such as her lack of fear, her outbursts, her laziness…

She loves dogs. That’s another way she gets distracted in missions - if she sees a dog or an animal she can befriend, she ends up with a very annoyed mentor! She’s definitely snuck many pets back. And yes, she manages to care for every single one of them.

Squishmallow-in verse-equivalent, hoarder too, Bliss can be such a liability. However, at the right moment she can step up.

Note: Her non Majin form is much more mature. She’s not as impulse driven and is more calm and reliable. She’s the same height in both forms.

She’s blonde, and switches between hair down with a braid crowning her head or she goes for a ponytail.

Her combat style is mostly ki based and she does hang back. She can fight in hand to hand, as she isn’t afraid to get her hands dirty but she can strategise better from afar.

This very of Bliss can stay more calm under pressure as her impulse control is much better.

However; she has shortcomings like this too. She can be overly stoic which can result in her misreading situations or becoming frustrated with her comrades when they won’t listen to her.

She’s also lacking in confidence and is quite anxious. Her Majin form suppresses these flaws though. She’s not perfect but she doesn’t care.

But in either form she and Zarbon seem to be tied at the hip. I’ll leave their bond up to perception. I like keeping things open ended.

Hobbies: Reading, sleeping, calculus (because why not 😂), being a pest, shopping.