#YOU have to unlearn the cis normative view about how bodies look

[muirneach]

i would like to express three blanket statements for everyone in the notes:

- yes i obviously know that calling people ‘family’ is a way of referring the other queer people. this is evident in the fact that i used that fucking word in the post jesus christ guys you don’t need to try and inform me of this

- related, but this was a rhetorical post. i do not need advice on how to talk to people. i am involved with real life trans groups and am well versed in how to subtly talk to people. i literally made this post while on break from my bad customer service job after seeing multiple trans customers

- maybe this is a me problem but people having dysphoria from being seen as trans is sad to me. like i sorta get it but also hm maybe work on ur self hatred idk. being trans is a joy

reading comprehension questions:

consider the targeted demographic of this post. then consider, do you dislike this demographic? if so, please try changing your opinion or at least scroll away and stop bothering me about it

did the author make reference to old forms of queer communication? if so, it seems like he is familiar with the concept and perhaps refrain from informing the author about it

why might have the author, at first glance, described dysphoria as self hatred? did he really do this, or does he rather acknowledge that one facet of dysphoria stems from depression and deprecation? consider why someone might not want to be seen as trans. is it for safety reasons, or because they have yet to unlearn the perceived shame of being trans, or any other multitude of reasons? any reason is perfectly valid but one may wish to examine their opinions on the cis view of the trans body

seeing trans ppl in public is literally life giving. wish there was a normal way to express to other trans people in public that we’re family and that i love them

[velvetvexations]

I think in terms of trans stereotypes about topping vs bottoming there's not really one that's better cause all trans people are extremely sexualized and fetishized. but from what I see transfemmes (en mass) face à combination of fetishization where one is like "exotic version of woman" (and woman are always bottoms of course) and "has a dick" where transfemmes are viewed as living dildos ((in part) because "real sex" has a dick penetrating someone and if that's not happening what's the point). Both forms of fetishization and objectification are negative and harm trans women, but they also often come from different places. Implying only one of these stereotypes exist ignores the ways that transmisogyny can vary depending on who it comes from and what the goal is(framing Trans women as less than cis men or less than/as tools for cis women). Trans women who spend more time with cis men, for example, might see more fetishizing, targeted at cishet men porn whereas those in lesbian or female dominated spaces might come more in contact with "built in strap" objectification. Both are harmful stereotypes, but in different ways. Trans women will be objectified for their body and/ or their gender and it often depends on how they can be used by the target audience. Cis men are assumed to want to dominate women (and under cishet sexual norms topping is dominance) and cis women will often just objectify trans women based on their presumptions of how bodies with penises work and how trans women are then simply "useful" to them.

Transmascs on the other hand largely face pressure of "has hole, is hole" where since transmascs generally don't have any form of "built in strap" (bottom surgery is so expensive etc) there's far less of a stereotype for transmascs to top except in much nicher lesbian communities where that overlaps with butchphobia (and other forms of "masc equals top and vice versa bullshit)(and only ever paired with cis women). Instead, in any interaction where there is penetration and the other partner has a dick regardless of gender, it's just assumed that the one with the hole "meant for sex" will bottom because of (patriarchal) societal views about vaginas and also "pegging" in general. Sex toys and dildos are often viewed as lesser compared to "the real thing" so in the eyes of a society that is largely bioessentialist and even communities that diverge from that (because not only does no one immidiately and totally unlearn social biases, but many of our sexual interests are inextricably formed by socially biased perspectives of what is sexy) transmascs topping is just inherently "lesser" compared to a "real" dick. Transmascs face the combination of sexist perspectives on vaginas and social stigmas around non traditional forms of sex/use of sex toys/ prosthetics and straps, on top of the view of trans men being "less of a man" (particularly compared to cis men) in a society where man equals top. (This can even be seen when trans men are written by cis women in fiction for like fanfic and stuff where there is virtually no content where trans men top or are sexually dominant. The idea of "penis goes in hole" as the Truest most Ideal form for sex permeates the sexual landscape in ways that harm all trans people and many cis people too)

No form of fetishization is positive, but the ways trans people are fetishized (largely by cis people (though not entirely) and since when do we think cis people en masse respect trans people) is highly influenced by cis, bioessentialist expectations of trans people's bodies. For example you look at (mainstream) porn and how often are post bottom surgery trans people portrayed? Almost never because it is specifically the deviation from cis, perisex(I think there's also a term for all sex characteristics "match" that doesn't necessarily imply born that way or vice versa I just don't remember any) norms that they are there to fetishize. A "chick with a dick" without a dick or a "bonus hole boy" with only one hole doesn't check the box of how cis people can fetishize us. we're all dehumanized and objectified, just in different ways because society is oppositionally sexist, cissexist, and transphobic. Bodies with dicks are just for penetration unless theyre women (aka holes for men) and bodies with vaginas are just holes

(obligatory disclaimer cause I know there's idiots out there:this does not mean porn/ trans porn is the root of all evil or the root of all transphobia)

(this got longer than planned lmao I just have opinions about how trans bodies are viewed and objectified by cis people)

Yeah, none of us really have it better or worse.

[gettin-bi-bi-bi]

(1/?) I'm afab and really confused abt my gender. Calling myself a woman doesn't feel right for me but calling myself a girl is totally ok. I have a feminine body (curvy but not fat) and long hair and I'm mostly fine with that but I'm super dysphoric abt having ovaries. I've always felt like this and I've known all my life that I would never want to be pregnant. I used to have really bad confidence but it got better after I lost a lot of weight. I started questioning my gender at age 13 but

(2/?) I dropped it when I started feeling better about myself and bc I didn't think it would be possible to pass as anything but female no matter what I did due to my body shape. I'm 15 now and I've discovered that I have trouble dating bc I'd prefer "the mans role" in the relationship no matter the gender of my partner which has made me doubt that any of my relationships (especially with guys) will work out and it's doesn't help that my reproductive organs feel wrong. I talked to one of my

(3/4)cis-female friends and I said that if it wasn't implausible and seen as abnormal I'd honestly be fine with my current body just with male reproductive organs and she said she'd hate that. A lot of the ways my cis-female friends describe their sexuality just doesn't apply to me at all and it really scares me bc I know that I couldn't transition even if I rly wanted to and I'm worried I'll do something I'll regret. It still makes me really sad to think abt how

(4/4) I still have to live the rest of my life with a body that's just 75% correct. I want to get sterilized when I'm older cuz I feel like it'd help w dysphoria but I'm still worried I'll have to repress my identity. Can you identify as non-binary even if you look like a cis-girl? How do I know if I'd feel better presenting as male? Is it abnormal to feel like this abt yourself? (sorry for the rly long ask btw)

There’s a lot on here so I’m trying to get through it bit by bit.

“I've discovered that I have trouble dating bc I'd prefer "the mans role" in the relationship no matter the gender of my partner which has made me doubt that any of my relationships (especially with guys) will work out”We’ve got a couple of asks in the past of people not knowing with “role” they should take in same-gender relationships and I think some of my advice from there also applies to you which is: try to unlearn the idea that there’s such a thing as “roles” in relationships. I know it’s hard and society’s been telling you this for the past 15 years but in a healthy relationship you should treat each other as equals and not resort to gender roles. Ideally you and your future partner(s) will be on the same page about this but to be sure these are the kinds of things you’d talk about before the relationship even properly starts.

“I talked to one of my cis-female friends [...] A lot of the ways my cis-female friends describe their sexuality just doesn't apply to me at all”I think it’s really good that you talk to your friends about this and it can definitly help you to separate your experiences from those of people who are certain about being cis. No matter what gender you’ll end up being it can help to talk to people of all sorts of genders, trans people, cis people, non-binary people... read and hear a bunch of different experiences and see if there’s something you can relate to.

“Can you identify as non-binary even if you look like a cis-girl?”Yes, definitly. Non-binary is not the same thing as androgyny. Some nb people dress and present in an androgynous or gender neutral way but not all of them do. Appearance and gender are not the same thing; gender is so much more than just looks. Think of it this way: I’m a cis woman with short hair. I could put on a suit and dress entirely in masculine-coded clothes but underneath all that I’d still be a woman because that’s how I feel. Putting on “men’s clothes” wouldn’t suddenly make me a man because I don’t feel like a man. So for you to look like a person that most people read as a woman/girl doesn’t mean that woman/girl is what you have to be. You can be everything you want.

“How do I know if I'd feel better presenting as male?��You just gotta try it. Honestly. You can theorise about it all you want but you’ll probably get a lot more certainty from trying it out. If it’s possible to you now (or at least when you’re older) you could cut your hair short - worst that can happen is that you don’t like it and it’ll take some time to grow it out again. Maybe you can try on some clothes from the men’s section at a clothes shop. It might feel weird and you might take some time to get used to the view in the mirror. Maybe it feels totally wrong - then at least you can cross that off your list. It could also feel super awesome. If you have a friend that you trust they could help you with all of this.

“Is it abnormal to feel like this abt yourself?”No it’s not. Though there are hateful people who will use the word “abnormal” to describe non-binary genders but those aren’t the ones you should give a fuck about. “Abnormal” has a very negative connotation to it; I prefer something like “uncommon”. But non-binary people very much exist so they are normal. They just might be uncommon though honestly we don’t really know just how many people would truly be non-binary if it were more socially accepted. That’s why we need to work on creating an environment in which people can choose freely which gender (if any) feels right for them. There’s non-western societies that have or had (until white people killed it) a completely different understanding of gender. So try not to fall for an arbitrary categorisation of what’s “normal” because more often than not this is used as an oppressive tool against people who dare to deviate from “the norm”.

Maddie

[iamthestrangerinmoscow]

my thoughts on the ‘are genital preferences transphobic’ controversy

[warning! includes discussion of reproductive anatomy and may cause dysphoria in some people]

I don’t want to spend four paragraphs on the introduction so I’ll just say it now - no, I don’t think genital preferences are transphobic because it is not a trans only thing. (However, making generalizing statements like ‘I would never date a trans person’ is definitely transphobic, and I’ll explain why in a minute’).

When people say they wouldn’t date or have sex with a trans person, they are making a generalizing statement which they think makes sense - but it actually doesn’t. What they actually mean is ‘I wouldn’t date or have sex with a person whose anatomy doesn’t match societal norms of what their anatomy is supposed to be like’. And the problem with that switch is that it is profoundly inaccurate.

So let’s say a cis straight man doesn’t want to date a trans woman because she doesn’t have a vagina. Well, first of all, he is already making a categorization mistake because some trans women have vaginas! Bottom surgery is a thing. Sure, it is not accessible to all trans women, and some trans women don’t want it (and that’s okay!), but it is still a categorical mistake. Same goes for trans men since they also can get bottom surgery. ‘No trans woman has a vagina’ is an incorrect statement, just like ‘no trans man has a penis’.

And the second categorical mistake here is ‘all cis women have vaginas’ or ‘all cis men have penises’. And this one is rarely mentioned in the debates, and I don’t know why, because it is probably the more important point. Not all cis men and women have the same reproductive anatomy because of many different reasons and it seems like nobody is aware of that.

Some women are intersex. For example, women with CAIS (complete androgen insensitivity syndrome) are born with external genitalia that isn't in any way ambiguous, but with no uterus, no ovaries and internal testes. And women with partial AIS might have a small or narrow vagina and an enlarged clitoris that resembles a small penis. Women with CAH (congenital adrenal hyperplasia) can also have an enlarged clitoris, a small vagina, even labia minora that resemble testicles, and a uterus and ovaries at the same time. There are a lot of possibilities.

Some cis women aren’t intersex, but still have anatomy that doesn’t match our societal ideas of what biosex female bodies are supposed to be like. Some women just have a really small vaginal canal that makes penetrative sex impossible. Some have high testosterone levels due to conditions like PCOS (polycystic ovarian syndrome) which can also cause an enlarged clitoris (up to 5cm!) and labia minora, and fragile vaginal walls that make penetrative sex very uncomfortable and potentially dangerous. Hell, 1 in 20 000 biosex females is born with a cloaca! Nature isn’t binary!

Some cis men have micropenises, for various reasons - intersex conditions, hormonal differences, physical trauma to the testicles, etc. Some cis men have no penises - due to accidents or cancer. Some cis men have persistent erectile dysfunction that makes penetrative sex tricky or impossible. Some men just have small penises, for no reason other than natural variation in the human species, but it might still make penetrative sex difficult.

So what I am saying here is that if a cis woman were to tell you ‘hey I have CAH so my clitoris is really big and vaginal sex is very uncomfortable for me’, would you immediately dump her? If a cis man were to tell ‘hey I am an army veteran and I lost my penis in an accident’, would you immediately dump him?

Maybe you would. I’m not saying you wouldn’t, or that it is necessarily a bad thing (though you have to agree, it is a little bit shallow). What I’m saying is, you are making a semantic mistake by equating ‘I wouldn't date a trans person’ with ‘I wouldn’t date a person if I can’t engage in penis-in-vagina sex with them’ or any other similar statement.

It’s simply an incorrect logical argument. It’s like if you didn’t want to date someone with red hair and made a chain of conclusions like this: I don’t like people with red hair; there are many people with red hair in Ireland; therefore I don’t want to date Irish people. And the problem with this is that not all Irish people have red hair, and not all people with red hair are Irish. See my point now? And if you made a video titled ‘why I would never date an Irish person’, what point would it achieve, apart from making Irish people feel bad?

And like, I get it. Maybe you really don’t want to date a woman with a penis, so you exclude some trans women and some intersex women and some other women as well, and that’s fine. You can’t change your preferences. Maybe you only want to date a man who has a large biological penis, so the first thing you ask them on Tinder is ‘how big is your dick?’ - I get that. Some people only want to date people who will beat them with a baseball bat and keep them on a leash - that’s fine! As long as it’s safe and consensual. None of those preferences are inherently bigoted.

It all kinda goes to hell when you start making generalizing statements based on ignorance, misinformation, and stereotypes. When you say ‘I would never date a trans person’ and then run to us to ask if that’s okay so that we can validate your preference and make you feel better. When you make a video after a video telling us again and again how unlovable and undesirable we are and expect us to not react to that. That’s when it gets transphobic.

And look, it’s fine. We all have transphobic ideas to unlearn, even trans people. If you really, really don’t want to ever date a trans person, for whatever reason, I’m not saying you have to change it. Is that transphobic? Yes, but that’s fine, because those are just your thoughts that you can’t control or fix. What you can fix is what you say and how you act. Just don’t go around telling everyone about your preferences and how you have a right to have them. Of course you do! You also have a right to, I don’t know, eat pine cones. Doesn’t mean you should eat pine cones just because you have a right to.

(Also, who cares? If you enjoy eating pine cones, do it, but don’t make videos yelling about how you are so oppressed because of your preference for eating pine cones...)

If you are dating someone and then you find out they are trans, or intersex, or infertile, or whatever, you have every right to break up with them for any reason - but you can be nice and civil about it. Instead of saying ‘I’m breaking up with you because you are trans’, try ‘I’m breaking up with you because sex is important to me and I need a partner who I can do certain things with’. Yeah, exactly - it’s that easy!

And finally, if you just, you know, really want those juicy views, try making videos titled ‘why I would never date a guy with a tiny penis’ or ‘why I would never date a girl who has facial hair’ or something like that. I’m sure you will get much more views and comments and will make much more than 2% of the population feel bad, and at the end of the day, isn’t that what you really want?

End of conversation.