#Wyvernrider101

[monstersdownthepath]

Hello, there, awesome explainer of D&D logics and creatures! I have a query for you.

Pathfinder treats vermin as mindless creatures, not because they have no mind, but because their minds are completely alien to people.

Frankly, I don’t like it, and I’d rather assign them Intelligence scores like animals get - they’re still thinking creatures, after all, that’s at least how I see it.

At the same time, I don’t want to potentially have a down-the-road catastrophe for such a decision. What’s your thoughts on vermin being ‘mindless’?

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I wouldn't call them "too alien," more like "too simple" with a slight dash of too alien. Spells can't affect their minds like they can affect an animal's mind because they're entirely guided by instinct with no room for any more complexity. While that sounds silly on paper, imagine for a moment a mage's frustration when they find out their Spell That Can Drive A Car won't work on, say, a carriage, or a scooter, or a loose wheel on the ground. Charm Person and Charm Animal can work because a person or animal can always be mislead or appealed to, but a fly or scorpion interprets all stimulus that isn't "food" or "mate" as "danger," something which requires specialized magic to overcome.

And for fun, I've thought of a supplemental in-universe explanation you can use: The mind of a Vermin is, essentially, sand passing through the holes in a net! Most nets are designed to allow sand to pass through them, because if they weren't, they risk becoming bogged down and useless at catching anything as they rake through the water. Thus, most spells simply exclude Vermin as legal targets entirely, because if they didn't, it'd be awfully inconvenient for mages attempting to blast their foes, only for the spell to veer slightly to hit the beetle that suddenly buzzed between the two combatants.

[thecreaturecodex]

Primal Inevitable, Safitsel

“Platinum Emperion” © Wizards of the Coast, by Chris Rahn. Accessed at InPrnt here

[Commissioned by @wyvernrider101. As far as I know, this is the first appearance of a stat block for a primal inevitable, which were a relatively late addition to PFRPG canon. The flavor text here is inspired by Concordance of Rivals, which states that most of the primal inevitables designed to fight in the Chaos War are dead, to the point that some of them represent concepts that are entirely lost to reality.]

Primal Inevitable, Safitsel CR 26 LN Outsider This humanoid titan appears as a gleaming statue of silvery metal, broad-shouldered and armor plated. A single eye glows in the center of its forehead, and a similar core is set in the center of its chest. It clutches a double weapon, with an axe head on one side and a spear point on the other.

Safitsel, the First Forged, Wardeneye Concerns defense, vigilance, fortifications Domains Law, Protection, Strength, War Subdomains Defense, Inevitable, Resolve, Tactics Worshipers architects, guardians, soldiers Minions inevitables, golems, lawful dragons Holy Symbol a single eye over a wall Favored Weapon dwarven urgrosh Obedience stand watch over your home, encampment or allies for 1 hour. Make a detailed report of everything you have seen, no matter how trivial. Gain a +4 sacred bonus on all Perception and Sense Motive checks. Boons 1: Bulwark of Defense (Sp) shield of faith 3/day, see invisibility 2/day or magic vestment 1/day 2: Hold the Line (Ex) The DC to successfully move past or through your square with Acrobatics increases by a number equal to your character level. You qualify for the Disruptive feat and other feats in that chain even if you are not a fighter. 3: Selective Interdiction (Su) As a swift action, you can radiate an aura in a 30 foot radius that blocks teleportation effects, as per a dimensional lock, except that you and your allies may ignore this effect. You may use this aura for 1 minute per character level, breaking up this duration in 1 minute increments as you see fit.

Legend states that Safitsel was the first inevitable ever constructed. As the forces of chaos made plans to seize Axis, the axiomites crafted a single giant of platinum and quintessence, who helped to construct an entire army of inevitable soldiers and build fortifications to defend the Eternal City. Although greater primal inevitables were created during the Chaos War, and many of them fell in battle, Safitsel continued to work in the background, shoring up defenses, securing tactical advantages and leading counterattacks.

Safitsel rarely battles mortals, instead turning their attentions to the constant incursions of proteans into Axis. Their presence disrupts teleportation and summoning only for hostile creatures, granting the inevitables precious seconds to mobilize and call reinforcements. They wield an immense urgrosh, and those dwarves that wield this weapon do so in homage to its efficacy on the battlegrounds of Law. They may also act as a siege weapon, firing a concentrated blast of crushing metal into the ranks of the enemy.

Safitsel has little interest in pomp or theatrics, and his cult among mortals is similarly no-nonsense. Their worshipers do not build dedicated temples, instead crafting small shrines in the temples of other lawful entities or academy settings. Most of their followers combine an interest in warfare with a keen intellect, and they are popular among engineers, architects and learned soldiers. Safistsel’s teaching is that the best offense is a good defense, and rarely considers proactive warfare a valid strategy. Some other divinities of war see their teachings as stogy and reactionary, but the truth of the matter is that Safitsel has endured while other powers have waxed and waned.

Safitsel   CR 26 XP 2,457,600 LN Gargantuan outsider (extraplanar, inevitable, law) Init +20; Senses darkvision 60 ft., low-light vision, Perception +53, true seeing Aura interdiction (60 ft.), shield of law (DC 27) Defense AC 45, touch 25, flat-footed 42 (-4 size, +4 Dex, +4 deflection, +12 insight, +19 natural) hp 615 (30d10+390 plus 60); regeneration 20 (chaotic and epic) Fort +34, Ref +20, Will +33 DR 20/lawful and epic; Resist acid 30, cold 30, electricity 30, fire 30, sonic 30; SR 37 Defensive Abilities constructed, freedom of movement, perfect prediction Offense Speed 50 ft., fly 70 ft. (perfect) Melee +3 defending keen dwarven urgrosh +46/+41/+36/+31 (4d6+22/19-20x3), +3 defending keen dwarven urgosh +46/+41/+36 (3d6+22/19-20x3) or 2 slams +45 (3d10+19) Ranged siege shot +30 (20d6+19 bludgeoning) Space 20 ft.; Reach 20 ft. Special Attacks supreme opportunist Spell-like Abilities CL 26th, concentration +35 Constant—detect chaos, freedom of movement, shield of law (self only), true seeing At will—banishment (DC 25), greater dispel magic, greater teleport, order’s wrath (DC 23), true form (DC 23), wall of iron (DC 24) 3/day—dictum (DC 26), quickened greater dispel magic, greater spell immunity, guards and wards (DC 25), move earth, summon inevitables, wall of force 1/day—freedom, imprisonment (DC 29), mass heal, shield of law (DC 27), wall of suppression Statistics Str 48, Dex 19, Con 38, Int 30, Wis 35, Cha 29 Base Atk +30; CMB +53 (+57 bull rush); CMD 71 (73 vs. bull rush) Feats Awesome Blow, Combat Expertise, Combat Reflexes, Disruptive (B), Double Slice, Greater Bull Rush, Greater Two-Weapon Fighting, Improved Bull Rush, Improved Initiative, Improved Two-Weapon Fighting, Lightning Reflexes, Power Attack, Quicken SLA (greater dispel magic), Spellbreaker (B), Stand Still, Step Up, Two-Weapon Fighting Skills Diplomacy +42, Fly +39, Intimidate +42, Knowledge (dungeoneering, history, religion) +40, Knowledge (arcana, engineering, planes) +43, Linguistics +40, Perception +53, Profession (siege engineer) +, Sense Motive +53, Spellcraft +43, Stealth +25, Survival +53; Racial Modifiers +8 Perception, +8 Sense Motive Languages truespeech, telepathy 300 ft.SQ primal inevitable traits Ecology Environment any (Axis) Organization solitary (unique) Treasure double standard (+3 defending keen/+3 defending keen dwarven urgrosh, other treasure) Special Abilities Interdiction Aura (Su) This functions as a dimensional lock effect in a 60 foot radius of Safitsel, except that Safitsel and their allies may still teleport into and out of the effect. In addition, any enemy attempting to use a summoning spell or effect must succeed a DC 37 caster level check or the spell is lost. Perfect Prediction (Su) Safitsel adds their Wisdom modifier to their AC and initiative as an insight bonus. Primal Inevitable Traits (Ex/Su) Safitsel is a primal inevitable, a quasi-divine being of great power. As such, they gain the following traits

Safitsel can grant spells and has access to domains as per their divine entry above

Safitsel’s natural weapons, as well as any weapons they wield, count as lawful and epic for the purpose of overcoming damage reduction

Regeneration (Ex) Only epic and chaotic damage, or damage from a creature of greater or equal power (such as another quasi-deity) can overcome Safitsel’s regeneration

Resist 30 to acid, cold, electricity, fire and sonic damage

Summon inevitables (Sp) Three times per day as a swift action, Safistsel may summon any inevitable or combination of inevitables whose total combined CR is 20 or lower. This functions as the summon universal monster quality with a 100% chance of success, and counts as a 9th level spell effect.

Telepathy 300 ft.

Siege Shot (Ex) As a standard action, Safitsel may fire a chunk of metal at a single target. This is treated as a ranged attack with a range increment of 200 feet. A target struck takes 20d6+19 points of bludgeoning damage. All creatures and unattended objects in a 10 foot radius of the target take 10d6+9 bludgeoning damage (Ref DC 38 half). This 10 foot radius is considered to be difficult terrain due to the rubble left behind. The save DC is Constitution based. Supreme Opportunist (Ex) Safitsel uses their Wisdom modifier instead of their Dexterity modifier to determine how many attacks of opportunity they may make in a round. In addition, Safitsel deals double damage on any attack of opportunity it makes.

[monstersdownthepath]

You have dropped mysteriously into the world of Golarion. The Core 20 gods are focused on you. For the purposes of how strong Rovagug actually is, we’ll throw him to one side and pretend Dahak takes his place.

Each god has access to its realm and armies, naturally. You may choose four to defend you. The other sixteen will try to kill you. Which gods do you choose to place your faith in?

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[gets halfway through the second paragraph]

Gorum. Wait there's more text here,

[reads the rest of the paragraph]

For the purpose of this challenge, I'm also removing Pharasma as a choice of ally OR enemy; it'd be too easy to choose her as an ally and have the rest of the gods risk destroying the universe if they tried to attack the Boneyard.

As for my answer:

Gozreh and the Prismatic Ray (Desna, Shelyn, Sarenrae). Sure, I could have stuck with Gorum instead of Gozreh, but no army can compete with a hurricane. I'd rather have the skies and seas on my side. "Each god has access to its realm," you say? Cool. Gozreh lives inside the material plane. They're always nearby!

As for the Prismatic Ray, I trust in the strength of the universe's most powerful polycule (and two of the eldest Core 20 gods) more than literally anything else. You may laugh at the choice of picking Shelyn rather than kicking her out and replacing her with someone else, but fracturing the Ray is more trouble than it's worth, and I'd certainly trust her to have my best interests at heart more than I'd trust the likes of Abadar, Nethys, Norgorber, Calistria, or Lamashtu (who were my other potential choices).

The only other possible replacement for Shelyn or Gozreh would be Asmodeus, if only because of the absolute authority he possesses over the Archdevils, but I hate the guy personally and no amount of hanging out with Barbatos could make me okay with putting in my lot with the God of Tyrants. ... okay maybe. Maybe. Maybe there's a universe where I swap Gozreh out for Asmodeus, but I'm letting Desna into Hell through the back door to mess around in his office the instant the danger to my life is gone.

[monstersdownthepath]

Not monsters, but spells.

As a person who loves to play spellcasters - especially wizards - I wanted to ask your opinion on the offensive cantrip spells, acid splash and ray of frost, specifically.

They just seem so … useless. I get that unlike manufactured weapons, they use touch AC to hit, but 1d3 damage that never changes or increases at all? Seems rather weak. Low-level wizards who run out of spells are effectively reduced to walking encyclopaedias. 5e cantrips scale with level, but naturally 5e monsters are also generally tougher.

What’s your thoughts? Are those cantrips useful? Could they be stronger without being game-breaking for spellcasters?

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If they seem useless in battle, that's because they are! Most of the time, attacking a creature with cantrips is strictly worse than just using a crossbow or similar.

Operative word: "Creature."

Now, say, if you wanted to freeze a drink or a small amount of hazardous fluid (such as a vial of poison), burn a rope, clear out a patch of hazardous mold, burn off a leech, clear out webbing, or do something similar to that, you'll be glad you had them. There's also niche uses against monster abilities, such as an entanglement being destroyed by "any amount of Fire damage" or a bloodsucking creature being forced to let go if it takes any Acid damage, in which case suddenly your useless cantrips are saving you time, effort, and bigger spell slots.

Cantrips are also... well, training wheels for low-level caster, both in and out of story. By the time your Wizard or Witch reaches 8th to 10th level, their spells should be changing the tides of encounters with singular casts. If they ever get anywhere close to the point where offensive cantrips are starting to look good, you know things are getting bad. Getting to that point reveals the trade the caster has made when they selected their class; their candle slowly burns down over the course of the day, but the martials are still going strong. It's the balancing factor, really; 5e's cantrips are stronger because spells are less numerous.

also, there's something to be said about cantrip damage needing to be low because of the specific interaction it has with Arcane Tricksters Sneak Attacks...

[monstersdownthepath]

This might sound like a stupid question, and if it does I apologise, but can an individual use Astral Projection from the Material Plane, take a tour BACK onto the Material Plane in a different place, and affect things from afar?

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Yes. There's nothing stopping a caster with access to both Astral Projection and Plane Shift from simply shifting themselves back into the Material, and the spell does not block more difficult avenues of travel (such as permanent gates or planar tears) either.

AP is one of Pathfinder's earliest "wordy" spells, and thus it carries a lot of unclear language, but your astral self is a direct copy of you and all your gear. If you have a way back to the Material, you can take it.

[monstersdownthepath]

I’m currently fascinated by Hell and devils, as they’re going to play a large part in the south of my homebrew world. My question comes in two parts, I suppose - firstly, aside from Lorthact and Furcas, both of whom you have covered, do you know of any other officially statted internal dukes or malebranche? And secondly, I’m creating a homebrew demon called a “lilin”, an enchantress devil who acts as a lawful counterpart to succubi and embodies the desire of Hell. They use their shapeshifting to appear as a target’s perfect match and slowly corrupt them over years or even decades, killing their victims once they have successfully damned their souls. To my knowledge, no other devil has the purpose of corruption by desire. Can you suggest some potential spell-like abilities that would help set it apart from a succubus?

As far as I'm aware, no other Dukes besides those two have stats, and none of the Malebranche have anything but lore blurbs sprinkled here and there. Not even Alichino, the Malebranche in charge of conquering Golarion, has directly starred in anything. You'd think the guy specifically tasked with taking over the game's setting would get more of a spotlight! Perhaps there will be more room in 2e.

... i wonder what happened to him in Starfinder...

As for the second part of this: There is actually a devil of seduction, though not quite to the level you're wanting. The Sire Devil seeks to corrupt entire bloodlines, rather than just one soul. Other than them, the only devil that bothers with seduction is Archdevil Belial, but he tends to be too busy corrupting mortals he seeks out to bother with corrupting mortals who seek him out.

A diabolic seducer would get a lot of mileage out of Detect Desires, steering victims away from whatever they wished for the most and using Diplomacy and Bluff alone to shape that desire. Implant Urge goes a long way to steady corruption because it's not an overriding desire like Suggestion; such measures wouldn't be accepted during their judgment the Courts of Purgatory. A canny mortal can argue their case in the Boneyard to get a lighter sentence if it's found that their will wasn't their own, such as if they were directly controlled by magic, so a devil hoping to claim a soul can't directly control its target, but can use means like regular old Diplomacy, Intimidate, and Bluff, as well as any spell which augments those powers.

That being said, having Charm X and Suggestion would still be helpful against creatures that aren't the devils' target.

[monstersdownthepath]

Recently you did a post on Lorthact (which I'm SUPER happy about, by the way), but I was thinking of making some adjustments to his equipment. Given his limitation of only 25 spell levels to steal at a time, and the fact he might use some of those for wizard school powers, I was thinking of giving him a ring of major spell storing to give him 10 extra levels of spells to fall back on. What's your opinion of this?

Yeesh, the guy has a Major-er-est Ring of Spell Storing built into his own body and you want to give him another? One that gives him access to Divine and Psychic magic he doesn't have to hypnotize anyone for???

If I reached over and tugged on your face, would a mask come off and reveal Lorthact himself?

Joking aside, it'd be a good way to add +1 CR to him. It also gives him an emergency button in the shape of something like a Heal, Mislead, Nine Lives, Gate, or similar to have him suddenly spring back from what should have been his death to let him be a recurring threat to the party. I balk at the idea of giving him even more unrestricted access to other spell lists, but do what you have to if it turns out the party can fight past his nonsense and 1-round him.

[monstersdownthepath]

The Anemos is an outsider described as godlike that watches over the world's winds. Do you know if there's elemental equivalents for earth and water (and possibly fire)?

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The number of creatures that watch over waterways is truly mind-boggling. If there's a magical creature that lives vaguely near the water, you can bet its description will involve words similar to "attacks those who disrespect its waters" and "acts as a protector of waterways against pollution/corruption/overfishing/whathaveyou." I say this because picking just as a godlike being that watches over the winds was proving to be too difficult... especially because there's no creature that's an exact analogue to the Anemos, what with the Four Winds in place.

The closest thing to a godlike entity of earth and stone would undoubtedly be the Xiomorn, though they're often more preoccupied with their vaults than they are the world above them.

[monstersdownthepath]

Hi there! You’ve never steered me wrong in advice on monster tactics, I’m hoping you can do the same again now.

I’m making a two-continent realm for my next big D&D game for my players to explore. One country is based loosely on Cheliax of the Inner Sea - when a massive Undead threat rose in the north, and began an invasion against it, Iabus (Cheliax 2.0) made a pact with Hell for troops to defend it as long as it was officially recognised. My question is, what kind of return would Hell expect outside of souls? What did it get from Cheliax, and how would I organise it in a way that works?

Souls. Souls, souls, and more souls. Hell wants souls more than anything else in the universe. More souls, more reach, more control of the cosmos. Cheliax in Golarion is defined by it's tyranny and it's bottomless demand for territory and reach, and when military might doesn't get them what they want, they turn to law, strangling what they can with bureaucracy and tyrannical rule until whole nations have no choice but to bend to their will. All so Hell can take it's pick of enslaved souls sacrificed to it.

However, each Archdevil wants something different, and depending on which one the country's leader has pledged itself to, there may be different demands at play.

Asmodeus is the one Cheliax is bound to in canon, and the pride of the Prince of Darkness shines in every respect. He doesn't just want Cheliax to grow, he wants it to rule in every sense of the word. He wants it to be a towering example of what the world would look like under his fist: efficient, controlled, and perfect.... At the expense of all forms of freedom and the complete subjugation of all but a specific, narrow ruling class. It's not enough that Cheliax feeds Hell, it must also feed Asmo's ego. It must literally be Hell on earth. Baalzebul, ever eager to please his creator, would demand roughly the same. Dispater, ever eager to make Dis 2, would probably work similarly as well.

If you want to know what a city in Belial's thrall may look like, it'd probably be similar to Nex. Flesh forges, construct districts, monster factories of every shape and description...

Moloch would demand military might. Cheliax has an incredible military as it is, but Moloch would demand focus on it. A complete wartime economy 24/7. Citizens that never know and never will know a time of peace. Constant expansion through conquest. Mandatory drafts. Mandatory training in weapons, armor, magic, all forms of crafting. Regular, hideous sacrifices on giant pyres. A leader who is equal parts general, warrior, and king.

Geryon would have what Golarion has had and will likely continue to have for the foreseeable future: a mageocracy. Ordered and bound to Hell's will, all mages must submit themselves to the kingdom's laws, all must do as the leader commands. All must give themselves to the city, one way or another. The average citizen may live a life as normal as any dictatorship allows, but at any time, they may be taken away by the city's cabal, because something within them is the perfect ingredient for their next spell. Conquest is secondary to discovery; a nation under Geryon may seem downright neighborly to the surrounds... provided they have no lore or magical secrets the Serpent wants. That's when demands are made. That's when submission is demanded.

The less said about a city in Barbatos' pocket, the better.

And of course, Mammon's military would pale in comparison to his banking system. I loathe to bring up a show I've never watched to completion and ever will so don't recommend I do, but anyone familiar with the Iron Bank from Game of Thrones had a head start on figuring out exactly how a city in the Argent Prince's grip would function.

[monstersdownthepath]

What’s your opinion on sundering weapons or armour, and why don’t smarter monsters like vampires, liches, or dragons do it more often?

Well, let's look at the math:

Say a bog standard vampire wants to sunder Fighter McStabberson's +1 steel greatsword. A bog standard vampire is CR 9, so McStabberson is likely level 6~8; we'll say he's level 7 with 18 Str and 12 Dex (to maximize his value in his fancy new full plate).

This puts his CMD at 22. With a vampire's CMB bonus being +7, this means he has to roll a 15 or higher to successfully sunder McStabberson's sword at all! And since the vampire doesn't have Improved Sunder or Dirty Fighting, each sunder attempt means McStabberson can make an Attack of Opportunity against our poor vampire.

But hey, if the stars align and the vampire miraculously succeeds both his attack rolls, he slams the fighter's sword for 1d4+4 damage! ... which means the sunder attempt does absolutely nothing.

A steel sword, you see, has 10 Hardness, which the vampire cannot bypass and cannot hope to overcome with his slam attack. Oh, wait, I said it was a +1 sword, didn't I? That means it's hardness is actually 12, as every +1 enchantment to an item increases its hardness by 2. Each +1 also adds +10 HP to the item (bringing the sword from 10 to 20), but since the vampire can't pierce the items Hardness, the HP value doesn't matter.

Why would the vampire waste its time trying that at all when it could simply Dominate Mr. McStabberson instead? His slam attacks would also be much more effective if turned against McStabberson due to the Energy Drain attached to them. Similarly, a lich or a dragon would do much better evaporating the fighter underneath the armor than trying to go through it first, especially if that armor is enchanted. The only character that can really make the sunder maneuver work is someone specifically built to maximize its effectiveness through feat lines and weapon choice, but those are few and far between for one very specific and incredibly important reason:

who in their right god damn mind is going to destroy their potential loot?

And on the other side of that coin, having a monster specialize in sundering your player's gear is an effective tactic and is easily on the list of Top 10 Ways To Make Everyone Hate Playing With You. NO ONE likes losing their loot!

[monstersdownthepath]

I'm planning a 20th-level one-shot with a lich as the enemy. I've made the lich a divination wizard and complete knowledge of the wizard spell list. What kind of tactics would you use in this situation to make it as challenging as possible for six 20th level characters?

SIX level 20 characters? Well, you may want to start with making your BBEG Mythic first, but keep the party un-Mythic. That's the least you can do to begin making this fair for your poor lich!

Secondly, since they're a Divination wizard, I presume they're just the basic Diviner, which is good for explaining how and why your BBEG knows a lot about the party and how to counter them... and then, obviously, have them tailor their spell list to counter exactly what the party can do. Have them prepare Time Stop as a reaction to the party bursting down the door so they can cast it, buff themselves to protect against the party's tactics, and then continue from there.

If you want to make them juicier, have them have allies (either already present or summoned during a Time Stop) and give them the Foresight school instead so they can benefit from the +2 aura a Foresight wizard can project, especially if they're ranged and thus can stay within the 30ft bubble. It's not much at level 20, but it's more useful during a 1-shot adventure where the Divination wizard's final power (reducing a target's resistance to scrying) isn't worthwhile.

Let's see... General tactics and buffs: Mind Blank, Elemental Resistance, Stoneskin, Greater Invisibility, and every Symbol you can think of along the hallway. There's tactics that are cheesy but effective, like Mass Hold Person, Mage's Disjunction, Overwhelming Presence, Mass Suffocation, and Dominate Person, but if you want to make it exciting instead of harrowing and potentially frustrating, eschew the Save-or-Sucks and go for the classics like Prismatic Wall/Sphere/Spray, Meteor Swarm, Death Clutch, Waves of Exhaustion, and other spells that are debilitating and damaging but still counterable.

I'll admit that actually building such high-level encounters against players I know nothing about is just me throwing spaghetti at the wall, but my most pointed advice is that your BBEG needs something to be able to overcome the sheer numbers advantage the party has, especially if they're not going to be holding back with Save-or-Sucks of their own, like minions in the CR 16~20 range who are also being buffed in some way... Might I suggest the simple addition of Dual Initiative?

[monstersdownthepath]

It's possible I'm missing something within your page, but I can't find your discussions and thoughts on celestials (especially angels and archons, my favourites) or true dragons (of all types). Maybe they're relatively self-explanatory, but I do find your discussions on monsters extremely helpful, as they help me act out those creatures more effectively in combat. Is it possible you might explore these at some point?

That's because I have a personal vendetta against true dragons! You'll note that my blog contains 99.99% NO dragons. I find the true dragons rather dull due to cultural oversaturation, to be entirely honest, but their origins in PF canon are interesting enough for me to talk at length about!

There were two vast seas in the Maelstrom at the dawn of creation, one fresh, one salt. The freshwater sea, Apsu, and the saltwater sea, Tiamat. At the beginning of time, it's said, Apsu first created his son Dahak (who would later become the Chaotic Evil god of dragons) who rampaged across creation, frolicking in all that could be unmade. The saltwater sea birthed six Beautiful Metals, which were said to be gods until Dahak took them and smashed them across the Material Plane like so many wine bottles, the fragments becoming the first of the Metallic Dragons... which he then hunted for sport.

When the freshwater sea took on draconic form to stop the rampage of his son, he gave Dahak the cosmic equivalent of a spanking, causing him to come running to his mother, sobbing into his wretched little claws about it. Tiamat healed Dahak and restored several of his 'toys' to life so he could play with them again, but the corrupted rebirth created the first of the Chromatic Dragons, who rejoiced in Dahak's presence instead of fearing it. Now having a new army at his side, Dahak and Apsu clashed once more... and once more Apsu came out on top, and once more Tiamat came to their son's aid, casting Apsu from the Maelstrom once and for all for the attempt on their son's life.

To this day, Apsu and Dahak battle against one another for ultimate supremacy over all dragons, but Tiamat still exists, living out in the universe as a titanic sea of salt water in which lays the power to create gods. It's said that all dragons fear her, Chromatic and Metallic and Esoteric and Imperial and etc etc etc alike, and that saying her name is forbidden amongst their kind. Even the Evil ones don't; Dahak doesn't even like mentioning her for reasons unknown.

Perhaps he fears that one day his good graces with her will run out.

[monstersdownthepath]

@wyvernrider101

I won’t be able to give a single satisfactory answer, I’m afraid, as most of this is piecemeal selections from various sources!

The Complete Book of the Damned holds a lot of information, and not just in the section devoted to Hell! The various entries for infernal nobles, the Queens of the Night, and the Archdevils contains tasty tidbits and morsels

In addition, Hell Unleashed has scatterings of facts, as does Inner Sea Faiths when speaking of Dahak and Apsu in regards to how Dahak affected Hell.

I’m not sure where YOUR lore actually comes from! Nine errant souls forged into planar layers?? Is that from Princes of Darkness? If it is, that’s one of the few books I haven’t read.

[thecreaturecodex]

Archon, Watcher

“Golden Seraph” © Anthony James Rich, accessed at his ArtStation here

[Commissioned by @wyvernrider101. The request was to make an angel in the vein of the Supernatural TV show, where angels have to possess a mortal host in order to have a corporeal form. The problem with that is that in D&D 3.x/PFRPG, angels automatically radiate a magic circle effect, which explicitly blocks possession effects. So I made it an archon instead. The name “watcher” appears commonly in apocryphal texts, so I wanted this particular entity to have the look of a biblical angel.]

Archon, Watcher CR 9 LG Outsider This translucent, luminous humanoid being has three pairs of wings—one on its back, one in place of legs and a third covering its face like a helmet. It carries a sword made of pure light.

Watcher archons, also known as grigori or irin, are beings of law and good that report on mortal doings to the hosts of Heaven. Unlike many archons that are more focused on planar battles and wide-scale struggles between good and evil, watchers focus on the deeds of individuals, knowing that these small interactions add up in ways that affect the whole cosmos. Their bodies are pure light, and can hardly interact with the material world directly. Watcher archons use words to steer the deeds of mortals, and can inhabit the body of a willing host to protect them and enforce the law of Heaven more directly.

When in their native form, a watcher battles using a sword of brilliant light. This blade is especially effective against the undead, but few creatures can resist its radiance for long. Watcher archons, however, prefer to act in supporting roles, either warding and healing a chosen mortal or riding inside of them to stir their hearts to glorious deeds. They can take over their host temporarily, but rarely do so unless requested to by the mortal in question.

Watcher Archon  CR 9 XP 6,400 LG Medium outsider (archon, extraplanar, good, incorporeal, lawful) Init +8; Senses darkvision 60 ft., low-light vision, Perception +17 Aura menace (20 ft., DC 21)Defense AC 23, touch 23, flat-footed 19 (+4 Dex, +1 dodge, +4 deflection, +4 sacred) hp 105 (10d10+50) Fort +8, Ref +11, Will +11; +4 vs. poison DR 10/evil; Immune electricity, incorporeal, petrifaction; SR 20 Defensive Abilities sacred armor Offense Speed fly 40 ft. (perfect) Melee blazing blade +14/+9 touch (4d8) Special Attacks cohabit Spell-like Abilities CL 9th, concentration +13 (+17 casting defensively) At will—detect chaos, detect evil, greater teleport (self plus 50 lbs. objects only), invisibility (self only), mage hand 3/day���cure serious wounds (DC 17), daylight, heroism, placebo effect 1/day—holy smite (DC 18), shield other, telekinesis (DC 19) unshakable zeal Statistics Str -, Dex 19, Con 20, Int 15, Wis 18, Cha 19 Base Atk +10; CMB +14; CMD 29 Feats Combat Casting, Combat Expertise, Dodge, Hidden Presence (B), Improved Initiative, Persuasive Skills Diplomacy +21, Fly +25, Intimidate +21, Knowledge (planes, religion) +15, Perception +17, Sense Motive +17, Stealth +17 Languages Celestial, Common, Infernal; truespeech Ecology Environment any land or underground (Heaven) Organization solitary, pair or council (3-8) Treasure none Special Abilities Blazing Blade (Su) A watcher archon can call to its hand a brilliant sword of light as a swift action. This sword strikes as an incorporeal touch attack, and deals damage as per a searing light spell (CL 9th). Cohabit (Su) As a standard action, a watcher archon can enter the space of a willing corporeal creature and infuse itself into the creature’s body. This functions as the spell riding possession, except that the creature inhabited also gains the benefits of the watcher’s sacred armor ability. A watcher archon cohabiting a corporeal creature may take over its body as a standard action, as per the possession spell. An unwilling host may resist this with a successful DC 19 Will save—if it succeeds, the watcher archon is expelled from its host’s body and may no cohabit with it again for 24 hours. A watcher archon can take control in this fashion for 10 minutes per day—these do not need to be consecutive, but must be split up in 1 minute increments. The save DC for this ability is Charisma based. Sacred Armor (Su) A watcher archon gains a sacred bonus to its Armor Class equal to its Wisdom modifier.

[monstersdownthepath]

Hey. So you said in a previous question that some beings might have the strength to become Those Who Remain in the next cycle of creation, as they’re not meant to be in this reality. You listed some potentials, such as Baba Yaga and some of the existing Great Old Ones, who have the necessary strength. My question is - surely if they could become Those Who Remain, won’t many others too, like every single god, who are all stronger than those you named?

Some have the capacity for it, but not all. Not nearly all. Gods are strong, yes, but they're bound by forces and cosmic laws that we're not made privy to, forces which creatures like Demon Lords, Archdevils, Empyreal Lords, and other CR 25+ creatures aren't shackled by, making them prime candidates to become Great Old Ones in a new cycle.

More broadly, it's hard to be a god of the sun if you don't know there will be a sun in the next iteration. Same with things like civilization, art, or undeath, or narrower concepts like forges, prostitution, alcohol. Gorum, the god of war, has stated (perhaps correctly, perhaps not) that if war among mortals ever stopped, he would rust away... and there not being any more mortals to fight wars in the end times means that he, and gods like him that rely on mortal presence, would fade. If you take Tabris the Chronicler at his word, a great many gods will simply kill one another in a final dramatic war as the stars go out and creation winds down, so THEY can't make it into the next cycle.

We don't know the exact mechanics of how the end times happen and what happens to gods whose existence is inextricably linked to specific concepts that may only be found in this universe; whether they fade into quintessence, go dormant until the next cycle and are reborn in a new shape with a new personality (there is some canon evidence that this one may be true: the Truth of Zon-Kuthon), or if they simply cease to exist altogether. Maybe it has to do with the broadness of their divine portfolio?

I mean, look at the ones that did survive and what they represent: Abhoth and Shub-Nishurath are gods of life, while Nhimbaloth is god of death and oblivion. Azathoth is a star but also a force of nuclear chaos and undirected power, and James Jacobs himself says that creation is balanced on top of it, making it a cosmic support beam. Nyarlathotep is a malevolence that lays in the Dimension of Dreams, itself a remnant that carries debris from past cycles into new ones. Yog-Sothoth is time, and as the Watcher has seen every iteration thus far. All of these Outer Gods are general concepts--life, death, time, and chaos, with Nyarla as the only real outlier--concepts which are the most likely to be found in a new universe and flourish. Who's to say that they're the only Outer Gods that made it into the new cycle? Maybe they're the only ones that survived/woke up, while the rest either faded to nothing from a lack of quintessence, or remain dormant until a cycle that can feed into them comes along, like cosmic tardigrades waiting for conditions to become favorable before they wake back up... And you may notice, awakening the slumbering old gods is the apocalyptic goal of Cthulhu!

If you want my crackpot theory, it ties into a concept I've held onto for a long while, which coincidentally relates to this post here. In my little headspace cosmology, the end goal of every universe is to achieve a perfect state of being, where all forms of life achieve perfect cooperation with one another. This is called a transcendence event, and it marks the point where the universe hatches and all life inside becomes a single creature: A transcended being, eldritch and strange, beautiful and divine. Once numberless smaller creatures, now together forever as the individual cells of something infinitely greater than any one.

Perhaps the reason every afterlife plane seems to want as much quintessence as possible--quintessence they gather as souls break down and merge into the plane--is so they, too, may eventually hatch?