#The prophets

[derangedrhythms]

Robert Jones, Jr., from 'The Prophets'

[usstrekart]

"What We Leave Behind" (S07E25, Stardate 52902.0) is a sublime way to tie up the story of DS9. The war ends, the Prophets win, Odo returns to his people, Dukat dies, Worf fully joins his people, and life moves on for many others. The door is left open to tell more stories, but if they don't come that is okay.

For my final DS9 episode poster I journeyed back to the beginning. "What You Leave Behind" leaves the station with the hope of Sisko returning from the Celestial Temple, and so does my poster.

[fictional-gods-tournament]

Round 1

Characters' info under the cut

The Weaver (wiki)

Domains: Order, Preservation, Science, Technology, and Language

Propaganda:

The one that made the Wyrm become corrupted to further it's own goal of maintaining creation

The Prophets (wiki)

Domains: The Bajorans, Prophecies

The Pale King (wiki)

Domain: Mind

[multiverserift]

I really like Kira Nerys. Let's discuss her and organized religion A hothead, experienced freedom fighter, child soldier, passionate, kind, really good at self-control. In [DS9 S01E19: Duet], she learns that life can be complex and difficult and ultimately learns to forgive Marritza. She learns that hate has to end at some point to make peace. But there is one aspect of Kira that I always find unnerving: Her absolute blind spot when it comes to faith. And DS9's handling of organized religion. 01. Bajoran Culture and Cultures in Star Trek Because Kira is the Bajoran character we see most, and the only fleshed out character where "being Bajoran" is a major character trait, we mostly experience the culture through her. Yes there's Leeta, but there is just a single instance where it plays into the story that she's Bajoran. [DS9 S05E20: Ferengi Love Songs]. Leeta wants a Bajoran wedding, while Rom tries to hold onto what's left of his Ferengi identity. Rom ultimately lets go of all the Ferengi stuff. Good for him. Of course there is also Kai Winn, but her stories mostly circle about her being Kai Winn, not her being a Bajoran. There is a single instance here too, where her Bajoran identity plays into the story, and her past during the Occupation. ([DS9: S05E10 Rapture]) She explains that she teached the faith of the prophets and was imprisoned for it. The other Bajoran characters are less fleshed out characters. Shakaar, Lupaza, and Furel. Even Li Nalasm remember him? Ro Laren is there of course, but her job was to create conflict in the perfect world of the Enterprise-D. Not being Bajoran, primarily. Star Trek does this more than once. Experiencing a whole culture through a single character. For a long time, Spock was the only fleshed out Vulcan we got to see, besides one episode with Sarek. Plus Sarek in the movies. It took decades until Tuvok showed us more than Spock's perspective. And ENT with T'Pol and the Vulcans arc finally fleshed out the species more. Jadzia is the only Trill that matters. Kind of a one trick pony species. The people with the symbiotes. And when Ezri finally shows up, we learn a bit more about them when they're not centered about their symbiotes. Cardassia is a good counter-example: We have Dukat, Damar and Garak to show us Cardassian culture from various perspectives. Plus the Tribunal episode, TNG's torture of Picard ("There are four lights!") We learn a lot about Cardassia. The DS9 treatment of the Ferengi will always be top notch.

02. Kira and Religion So back to Bajor, Kira and religion. Hehe, Bajor Kira. Sorry. As a non-religious man, I have my problems sharing her point of view. Trusting in faith, even when it contradicts rationality. There are two main storylines that illuminate this problem: 1. [DS9: S04E17 Accession] 2. Kira's relationship with Kai Winn. In Accession, Akorem Laan takes over the job as Emissary and installs himself as a conservative, even reactionary, religious leader. Bajorans are told to follow their d'jarras. A caste system. And Kira as our PoV Bajoran, simply....does it. Her D'jarra is Ih'valla, the artists caste. She actually had to struggle with this before. In [DS9: S02E02 The Circle] she tried living in the monastery with Bareil. She tells him she sucks at being an artist. Kira really tried. So when Akorem takes over the religious leadership (maintaining a good working relationship with Kai Winn, what a red flag), Kira shows us how Bajor reacts. They simply.....comply? Odo even tries out the sceptical, rational PoV. Kira just brushes it aside. DS9 does this a few times, actually. Respecting their characters' choices rooted in faith. Odo fighting Weyoun calling him a god on every occasion. Worf and Kira agreeing on Sisko's choice of trusting the Prophets in [DS9: S05E10: Rapture]. Weyoun 6's sacrifice. Even Quark's little prayers to his piggybank. What I really dislike about the plot of Accession is the Deus Ex Machina. The characters are not confronted with their choices. Akorem Laan and Vedek Porta don't go to jail for murdering some guy. Kira doesn't have to deal with supporting a regime that got opressive in a heartbeat. What I would have really liked to see were the Bajorans that disagree. The ones Akorem threatens with deportation. Sorry, our 45 minutes are up, the Prophets endorse The Sisko, Akorem is gone. Kira even still likes his poetry! Yay! Pity. I would have loved to see the consequences. And see if Kira finds a way to deal with blind obedience. Which brings me to my second point. 03. Kira Nerys and Kai Winn

While Gul Dukat is mainly Sisko's antagonist, Kai Winn is Kira's. She basically killed Kira's boyfriend, cashed in on his accomplishments and literally stole his fame, after she cheated her way to becoming Space Pope. Which would have been him. Bareil. Interesting side story: Bareil does the same thing Kira does. He blindly trusts the religious system. Bareil doesn't question Kai Winn's authority. Well, then she kills him by overworking him, and he lets her. Gladly. He decides to get killed. Because he trusts the Prophets. There's another side question here. Are the Prophets to be trusted? Are they doing good things for Bajor? or are they selfish? I basically think they're selfish af, and I can explain. But that's a story for another time.

So Kai Winn did a terrorism in [S01E20: In the Hands of the Prophets], gets people killed, supports an insurrection (but to be honest, her support never got public), cheats herself to be Pope, nearly starts a civil war because of Shakaar. Kira is in a powerful position. She is one of the most trusted advisors to the Emissary of the Prophets, is an administrator of DS9, was a member of the famed Shakaar Resistance Cell. She obviously has power. Military power, political power. She knows how to play politics. There is a dialogue about this in [DS9 S01E13: "Battle Lines] And she obviously knows Kai Winn is horrible. Dangerous. When does she talk back? Once. She does it once. In [DS9 S02E24: The Collaborateur], she is snarky and gets scolded by Winn. She never openly defies her again. Kira is complicit with a religious organisation that constantly punishes her for it. That would force her into a career she hates. That killed her boyfriend and robbed his dead body. Kai Winn even gloats over it a few episodes later. And in Accession, we see the climax of this: Even when the religious regime gets captured by bad people, she complies. 04: Fazit I would have loved to see Kira deal with the contradictions. See people who don't comply with Kai Winn's church. Who challenge that system. Because like in our world, organisations can and will be captured by bad players, in bad faith. The ability of political structures to withstand capture and abuse is essential. This always starts with the people being able to recognize it and fight back. I don't like it. I'm more like Odo. Rational, naturalistic. I don't understand how one can think with religious faith. Especially because Kira has such a temper and a sense for injustice. She challenges Winn from within the system, yes. With Shakaar. For a while. Then Shakaar loses steam as a character and we don't delve further into the matter. Simply DS9 having enough depth to allow such discussions about their characters is one if the reasons I love it so much. Stay safe out there, people. Stay vigilant in the face of powerful people. Thank you for reading.

[writergeekrhw]

Thanks for answering all these questions! Were the Prophets inspired in any way by the Tralfamadorians in Kurt Vonnegut's books? That's just what naturally came to mind for me for "aliens who live outside of linear time and teach a human they hand-selected to see things that way too" even if the Prophets, I assume, don't look like plungers in their natural state

Not to my knowledge. Unfortunately, the only person who'd know for sure is Michael Piller, and he's with the Prophets now. May his memory be a blessing.

The Prophets are shaped more like toilet brushes.

[lgbtqreads]

Fave Five: Queer Historical Fiction with Black MCs

The Ballad of Jacquotte Delahaye by Briony Cameron (17th c.) Mademoiselle Revolution by Zoe Sivak (18th c.) The Prophets by Robert Jones, Jr. (19th c.) Dead Dead Girls by Nekesa Afia (early 20th c.) My Government Means to Kill Me by Rasheed Newson (late 20th c.) Bonus: These are all Adult Realistic fiction, but for historical YA fantasy, check out This Ravenous Fate by Hayley Dennings, out in…

[thebeskarburrito]

Winn talks like she’s hot shit and the voice of the prophets or whatever when Quark meets the prophets before her. Imagine if God spoke to Pablo Escobar before the Pope.

[thebajoranwitch]

what do you think

In Deep Space Nine, the first of September 2024 is the date of the beginning of the Bell Riots, when homeless people who have been forced into small districts with little to no support or security rose up and ended the separation. This is called by Benjamin Sisko and is, in canon, a massive, though grim, step towards the United Earth that we see in Trek, and later to the federation.

I’m writing a prayer for a ritual that I am doing tomorrow and I will be sharing at least a version of this prayer in case there is anyone else who would like the inspiration for their own practice, but I will ask, since I usually write it in bajoran, would you like to read it in English or Bajoran?

[kingoftheu]

So O’Brien was definitely hell on Cadets at the Academy right? Like he made it his life goal to remind them that being an Officer did not make you a god. Never unfair but by the stars every Cadet dreaded Engineering 101, which he teaches specifically so he gets a chance to put the fear of the Prophets into Security, Command, and Science. Every Ensign has his lessons branded into their minds by the time they graduate.

On the flip side, the minute an NCO, be they a Warrant Officer, Petty Officer, or a newly enlisted soul walks through the doors he is the sweetest most supportive man who ever lived. Coffee, a sympathetic ear, and advice. The entire enlisted ranks love “Mister Miles” and they fact that he terrifies the officer corps makes them love him even more.

In conclusion the LaForge kids and the Lower Decks ensigns live in perpetual fear of Miles O’Brien but the Prodigy kids are gonna love him.

[flowerbloom-arts]

I love them alot.

(Original Tumblr post and comic under the cut)

[derangedrhythms]

Neither of them chased the other and yet each was surrounded by the other.

Robert Jones, Jr., from 'The Prophets'

[cdr2002]

It just hit me

The wormhole wasn’t discovered in the Mirror Universe because the Prophets were protecting the mirror Bajorans from contact with the Dominion, because the mirror universe Alpha Quadrant was in a far more volatile position with the Alliance being far more fairweather friends than the Federation and the Emissary (presumably still Ben Sisko) not ready for his task, and then later dead (unless they whisked away Mirror Sisko and we don’t know); not to mention the eventual quadrant-wide war that erupted when the Rebellion formed.

So in a way it was a good thing?

I don’t know that I’m right but I want to confidently believe that I am

[radiophd]

the prophets -- revenge of eastwood

[writergeekrhw]

Hello, Robert! I love the Bajorian faith. I would like to know if you guys thought more about Judaism (Prophets) or Catholicism (Kai) when creating the Bajor religion.

Ira is Jewish. Hans, too, nominally. Michael was Jewish.

I'm a lapsed Catholic. In college I was a lector and eucharistic minister. Rene is also Catholic.

Ron is... umm... I have no clue actually. Gentile-ish?

So... both?

There's some Buddhism and Zoroastrianism in there too, but I have no idea who's to blame for that.*

*That's a lie. The Zoroastrianism was me. The Buddhism was Michael.

[virginwithasthma]

I'm loving the references to Nigeria in The Prophets. It's shaping up to being a good book.

Isaiah not realizing his name is Kayode because he heard coyote is simultaneously funny and sad

[divine-swag-summit]

Lower Bracket Round 1-A: Match 16

Zorc Necrophades(Yu-Gi-Oh!) vs The Prophets(Star Trek: Deep Space 9)