#South Park Meta

[crab-people-overlord]

Understanding Stan Marsh: A Character Analysis and Response to Fandom Mischaracterization (Writing Depression/Addiction Responsibly):

I’m sure a similar analysis exists - but I haven’t found it so I wanted to make it. I’ve seen similar analyses about Wendy with her intelligence/tendency to serve as a villain in things like Style fics and Kenny with his own addiction as well as lower-class designations, which absolutely should exist. But I haven’t seen any about Stan in the same sense despite issues I’ve seen in fandom about his characterization and either blatantly disregarding and misunderstanding what depression is/or/trying to further their specific shipping agenda such as Kyman. And I think it’s finally time we fucking talk about it. This is due to me noticing a prolific increase in the ‘Stan Marsh is an asshole’ tag on AO3.

The Problem of Character Flanderization

Character flanderization (the tendency to focus only on a character's weaknesses) has always existed in fanworks, but the current treatment of Stan Marsh reveals a particularly troubling trend in how mental health and addiction are portrayed. This isn't about calling out specific creators - many (even most) write Stan beautifully, even in ships like Kyman. Rather, this analysis addresses a broader pattern of mischaracterization that does a disservice not only to his character but to real people struggling with similar issues.

Please note this analysis is not directed at any particular creator at all! I see SO many good characterizations of Stan, even in Kyman fics (I’d argue a lot of them do!). But I also see very unfair portrayals of him in some fics which at the end of the day show a complete disregard to addiction/depression and ignore his good traits in favor of furthering their own agenda. I’M NOT OKAY with this, and I think it’s time we talk about this as a fandom. 

 This trend often manifests in two primary ways:

Depression Mischaracterization:

Some of fandom's handling of Stan's depression reveals a profound misunderstanding of clinical depression that goes beyond simple character misinterpretation. The "You're Getting Old/Ass Burgers" arc isn't just about Stan being "negative" or "selfish" - it's one of television's most authentic portrayals of how depression manifests in young people. Stan doesn't CHOOSE to see everything as shit; his brain chemistry literally alters his perception of reality. This isn't character weakness - it's a medical condition that he fights against while still trying to maintain his relationships and sense of self.

What many fanworks miss is that depression often coexists with deep empathy and care for others. In fact, Stan's depression might partly stem from how deeply he feels things - his awareness of environmental destruction, animal cruelty, and societal hypocrisies. He continues to fight for causes he believes in and protect those he loves even while struggling to find meaning in his own life. That's not selfishness - it's remarkable resilience. The show demonstrates this complexity brilliantly: even at his very  lowest points, Stan still:

Tries to maintain his friendship with Kyle despite literally seeing him as shit

Continues to stand up for what he believes in when he realistically thinks it can make an impact

Attempts to understand and help others, even when he can barely help himself

Fights desperately to stay present in a world that has lost its color and meaning

When fanworks reduce Stan's depression to mere selfishness or use it as a convenient plot device to make him the villain, they not only mischaracterize Stan but potentially harm readers struggling with similar issues. They send the message that depression makes someone unworthy of friendship or love - exactly the opposite of what people with depression need to hear.

Alcoholism Mischaracterization:

Stan's relationship with alcohol deserves particular attention because it's portrayed with a nuance rarely seen in either animation or fanworks. The show presents a complex web of factors that contribute to Stan's relationship with alcohol:

First, there's the genetic component - Stan comes from a family with clear predisposition to addiction, particularly through Randy. But crucially, Stan never sought out alcohol on his own. He was introduced to it by adults who should have protected him, making his initial exposure a betrayal of trust rather than a character flaw.

What makes Stan's arc so powerful is how it captures the insidious nature of functional alcoholism. He discovers that alcohol makes an unbearable world bearable - it literally changes how he sees things from "shit" back to normal. STAN HAS NEVER EVER BEEN ABOUT getting drunk for fun; it's always been about self-medication to seem 'normal' to others in response to genuine mental health struggles. The show demonstrates how someone can be both struggling with addiction and highly competent - a reality many fanworks seem unable to grasp.

Even in the "bad timeline" of the Post-Covid episodes, Stan maintains his fundamental characteristics and ability to function. He becomes what's known as a "functional alcoholic" - not because this is healthy, but because it reflects a tragic reality that those who seem most adjusted often hide the deepest struggles. He learns exactly how much alcohol makes him functional versus dysfunctional, developing the kind of careful management that allows many real-life individuals with addiction to hide in plain sight.

When fanworks reduce this complex portrayal to "pathetic or asshole drunk Stan," they miss the point entirely. They ignore:

The environmental factors that led to his alcohol use

The relationship between his depression and self-medication

The reality that addiction often coexists with high functionality

And especially, and something I think a lot of you need to fucking understand - the way addiction can stem from trying to feel normal rather than trying to get high. Stan never ever tries to feel ‘high’ or even drunk. He ALWAYS is just trying to feel fucking NORMAL. 

This oversimplification doesn't just do a disservice to Stan's character - it perpetuates harmful stereotypes about addiction that make it harder for real people to seek help.

Stan's Core Character Traits

Stan consistently demonstrates practical morality alongside emotional depth. His quiet leadership often goes unnoticed - he's frequently the instigator of group plans alongside Cartman, but without the manipulation or need for credit. His relationship with Wendy shows realistic pre-teen awkwardness while maintaining genuine care and respect. These aren't the traits of a "simp" or an "asshole" - they're the complex characteristics of a well-written character dealing with real challenges.

Just rewatch the show for evidence of this - Stan at the same level of Cartman instigates things. And at the same level of Kyle, he tends to do it for the greater good of society. He’s just not as attributed to his actions because he’s naturally more quiet about it than both Kyle and Cartman are. 

TLDR- /Mental Health and Responsiblity in Writing:

The show's handling of Stan's mental health offers a masterclass in nuanced characterization that many fanworks ignore. His depression and struggles with alcohol aren't plot devices - they're part of a larger narrative about growing up in a world that often doesn't make sense. Writing Stan as a "pathetic drunk" or "selfish depressive" isn't just bad characterization - it's potentially harmful to readers who share these struggles

His depression on the actual show is shown as a legitimate struggle, not a character flaw

His relationship with alcohol is portrayed as functional and carefully managed - something maybe some of you would be surprised to learn that some of the most functional folks in your life actually are pretty good at hiding. Stan in his depression arc is ultimately meant to be shown as someone who is a ‘functional’ alcoholic rather than a ‘dysfunctional’ one. That’s not to say it’s healthier to be functional. But it’s ultimately the whole point of that goddamn arc - that even those who seem the most well-adjusted may be hiding a more sinister addiction. So I don’t really see the fucking point of writing Stan as someone who is so alcoholic to the point that it fucks up his entire life. 

The Shipping Problem

The rise of ships like Kyman often comes with an unnecessary cost: the villainization of Stan. This ignores the show's complex web of relationships - Stan's deep friendship with Kyle doesn't need to be erased or twisted to explore other relationships. The best Kyman fics prove this by maintaining Stan's character integrity while exploring new dynamics. Additionally, Stan's relationships with other characters, particularly his often-overlooked friendship with Kenny, deserve more attention and respect in fanworks.

Complex relationships can be written without villainizing other characters like Stan

Good Kyman fics prove you can write the ship while maintaining Stan's character integrity. 

Both Kyle and Stan canonically view each other as super best friends and equals- and this is because they literally ARE equals, even in a moral sense. Neither of them is better than the other. They have a deep connection to each other. Any fic written about either of them HAS to accurately represent this without making Stan to be a primarily weak selfish villain. This is so incredibly unfair to Stan’s character, and a massive representation of him. Same if it’s vice versa for a fic for Stan misrepresenting Kyle (though I’ll be honest - I far more often see Stan as misrepresented in recent works as a selfish asshole over Kyle). 

When writing Stan, consider:

His actions, even negative ones, should stem from established character traits

His struggles with mental health and substance use should be treated with nuance and care. Writing him as an asshole or complete loser (he can be a lil bit of a lovingly designated loser lol) is a slap in the face to those who do function quite well in the real world but with this particular struggle of depression and addiction. Don’t ignore Stan's many strengths, such as adjusting well to things in the moment both physically and intellectually. (He absolutely can be dumb about some things to the extent that it's humorous, but he is not actually dumb - he consistently shows some of the most complex critical thinking in the entire show, even compared to Kyle. And it makes no sense to disregard this aspect of his character.) 

His relationships with other characters should reflect their canonical complexity.

If writing him as antagonistic, ensure it serves character development rather than plot convenience.

Stan deserves better than reductive characterization. His struggles with mental health and addiction make him more relatable, not less worthy of respect. Writers who reduce him to his lowest moments not only do a disservice to a complex character but potentially harm readers who see their own battles reflected in his story. We can and should do better - both for Stan and for each other. He is literally meant to be written as the person most relatable to general society, after all.

[kennytheworkingclasshero]

I’ve talked about Stan Marsh the Animal Lover before and how much I enjoy that side of his character. I love that even after You’re Getting Old and Ass Burgers, where he is in a depressive, careless state, he still finds it in himself to love and take care of animals. These screenshots from The Fractured but Whole really heal something in me:

Look at how happy he is with the kitty, his little hand around the animal and his big, toothy grin. He looks genuinely happy here.

Also this screenshot of him protesting animal testing:

He looks so sad and hurt at the prospect of these animals getting hurt. His frown, his eyes, his hand reaching out. Reminder that Stan is canonically an animal rights activist and eco terrorist, he’s not just talk when it comes to this.

It’s lovely to see this side of him alive and well, especially because I do believe that deep down Stan still cares and values things despite saying he doesn’t, that’s why he’s still close to Wendy and Kyle. These are two characters who are so passionate and angry and have such a moralistic side to them it’s crazy, they care so much about so many things and Stan being close to both of them shows that he does still care and appreciates people who care. He wants these people around him, to ground him and remind him of what’s important even when things seem dire.

[ashes-goin-down]

Can we talk about Cartman's tendency to pet Kyle? And the way Kyle lets him do it?

It's such an under-discussed part of their dynamic. Cartman does this all the time. He does it to tease Kyle. He does it to comfort him. He does it to express gratitude. He even does it to pictures of Kyle when Kyle's not there.

And you could say that's just Cartman, he's just touchy, that's just how he expresses himself . . . except that it's really not. All this petting and stroking isn't something you see him do with Stan and Kenny. (Friends he has said multiple times he loves.) It's not something he does with his actual pet, Mr Kitty. It's not something he does with his mom. It's not even something he does with Heidi or Yentl. There's a lot of hand-holding and kissing in those relationships, but Cartman appears to consider this expected romantic partner behavior, and to be imitating that accordingly. What you don't see with them is the clingy, almost unconscious need to touch he demonstrates with Kyle. Kyle has to be stroked, patted, petted, hugged, poked, pulled on . . . it seems to be a comfort thing for Cartman, and that is just so fascinating to me.

It's also endlessly fascinating to me that Kyle - who has no problem putting Cartman in his place about anything else - allows this nearly every time. Maybe there's some token complaining, but he never actually tries to stop it. It's not "ew, Cartman is hugging me" it's always "why is Cartman hugging me?" and that's a subtle difference I think gets overlooked. People like to claim Kyle's response to Cartman having a crush on him would be disgust, and that Kyman could only ever be one-sided for this reason. But Kyle's response to Cartman being affectionate with him is actually pretty much always confusion, not disgust. I get the impression Kyle doesn't know how he feels about it.

I'm not sure what I'm trying to say here, but it's just so interesting to me, the relationship they both have to touch. Cartman uses Kyle to fulfil his need for touch and connection - and Kyle doesn't often reciprocate this touch, but he pretty consistently makes the concession of allowing it. They're feeling each other out, trying to work out "who are you to me and what do I feel for you?" It's one of the elements of Kyman that makes the ship so endearing, I think. There's this sweetness to it that absolutely should not exist between these characters, but does anyway.

Definitely! You’re right, Cartman does seem to seek out physical contact with Kyle considerably more than with anyone else he isn’t directly romantically involved with and my favourite instances of this is when he does so under the guise of antagonizing him. Two examples of this are the whole ‘Jennifer Lopez’-thing in “Fat Butt and Pancake Head” and Cartman promoting Kyle to the Germans in “Funnybot”. In both cases he uses an instance of disrespecting Kyle as a front to compliment him, with the ‘Jennifer Lopez’-persona constantly being gushing over him, telling him how much she likes him, calling him ‘handsome’ and of course ‘kissing’ him by Cartman pressing his hand against Kyle’s mouth. This is especially interesting considering the fact that later in the episode it is very heavily implied (and then pretty much outright confirmed in “200”) that Cartman really doesn’t have full control over the character. In “Funnybot” Cartman calls Kyle either ‘gentle/soft’ or ‘juicy’ (lol), ‘pretty’, and ‘very beautiful’ in extremely mangled German (which I guess is just regular German in-universe since the native speakers talk just like that) and while the context of the scene is obviously very dark for the viewer, who can infer what’s going on, Kyle doesn’t actually seem to realise what is happening. He doesn’t appear to understand what is being said at all and as such Cartman doesn’t even really have the excuse that he’s teasing him.

This scene fits the reaction you described that Kyle tends to have when Cartman engages him in physical contact very well: Kyle reacts to Cartman excessively touching him with confusion but simply lets it happen. He has every reason to be wary of Cartman’s intentions and yet he makes no effort to stop him from what he’s doing. In “ManBearPig” Kyle wakes up to find Cartman leaning over him and while he doesn’t actually touch him, he does get extremely close to him, giving us the famous image of their faces mere inches apart. Kyle’s reaction to this is incredibly understated: He appears at most slightly irritated and attempts neither to push Cartman off nor to move away from him. Once again, he mostly just seems confused by Cartman’s behaviour but, as far as we can see, makes no further attempts to investigate the reasons behind it. This understated reaction is an indication of an (imo) often overlooked aspect of their relationship, which is that while Kyle is well aware of what Cartman is theoretically capable of, he doesn’t actually seem worried that he’d ever seriously harm him. Personally, if I found myself trapped in a cave with a person who constantly professes his hatred for me and whom I know has no qualms about killing people, and then woke up to find said person looming over me in my sleep I’d be much more worried than Kyle appears to be. In fact, considering everything that has happened over the course of their relationship and how many despicable things Cartman has done, Kyle seems Weirdly Comfortable And Safe With His Evil, Ill-Intentioned Friend. Because that’s what they are: They’re friends. To call it a complicated friendship might be an understatement but when it comes down to it the simple fact of the matter is that these two do like each other. While in earlier seasons a point could be made that they only spend time together out of necessity (with the main four being somewhat isolated from the other kids, as Craig points out in “Pandemic 2”, and Cartman originally being an incidental part of the group as ‘the friend no one likes’), they’ve both long since expanded their social circles to a point where they are no longer ‘forced’ to spend time together for lack of better options. Kyle would be more than justified in cutting Cartman off completely and yet he doesn’t and I can honestly see no real reason for this other than the fact that he simply cares about him as a person.

So I agree that Kyle probably wouldn’t react with disgust to the hypothetical reveal that Cartman harbours romantic feelings towards him. I’m not claiming that he would necessarily be elated but I’m pretty sure ‘disgust’ would not be his first reaction and I think many people who think that it would be might at least partially hold that opinion due to projection: Because while we, as viewers, are frequently meant to find Cartman repulsive both physically and emotionally (his embodiment of the 'fat bastard' trope is a key part of his character, after all), Kyle doesn’t actually appear to overtly feel that way about him – which is to say he does kinda but not exclusively and it’s all just a bit more complicated than that. Kyle being thoroughly confused does seem like the most likely reaction to me. Regarding the physical aspect: Of course Kyle frequently makes derogatory remarks about Cartman’s appearance, specifically regarding his weight (to the point where it’s been a main focus of their dynamic for almost thirty years) but we see several times that his critique actually seems to stem from a place of worry and that he feels bad when he thinks that these comments have actually managed to hurt his feelings (e.g. “Raising the Bar”). Of course, what exactly Kyle’s feelings towards Cartman are is, with good reason, a source of much discussion and I’d claim that Kyle himself isn’t very sure of this. His sentiment towards Cartman definitely seems very erratic, with Kyle going from actively attempting to get him killed in “Fatbeard” to being concerned for his emotional well-being just a season later (“201”, “Poor and Stupid”). This concern Kyle has for a person he supposedly can’t stand has been a pretty consistent part of his character in later seasons and it’s especially striking when compared to the way he disregards his best friend’s feelings when he’s in genuine need of emotional support (“Raisins”, “You’re Getting Old”). This discrepancy is not only an indicator of the complicated relationship Kyle has with Cartman but imho also hints at at least one reason for it. In a (painfully long-winded😅) comment on AO3 I just touched on the similarities between Kyle and Cartman how interesting I find the very different ways in which they deal with their shared character traits. I believe this is something that draws them towards each other, though I’m certain that neither is actually consciously aware of this. You put it so beautifully in your last sentence: "There's this sweetness to it that absolutely should not exist between these characters, but does anyway." There really is an unexpectedly soft underbelly to their relationship that is a lot of fun to explore. While I wont deny the toxic aspects of this ship (in fact, they’re a major part of what I find interesting about it), there is also the surprising potential for a real emotional connection between these characters.

[chaoticreivingu]

I always found it funny that being indirectly compared to Pip is what caused Butters to tip over the edge here.

[drownedinlavender]

Hate when people talk about Cartman as a character that can never be redeemed or forgiven because his behavior is beyond amending. Dude, this is a cardboard cut out committing war crimes. There is nothing to atone for cause he isn't real.

It doesn't make sense to me to push real life morals into a show where the poor kid dies in grotesque, new ways every seasons simply because "he is poor."

That's like loving dark romance and getting upset at the male lead for kidnapping! Of course he's gonna kidnap the female lead! This is dark romance we're talking about for Christ Sakes! Watch something wholesome if you want wholesome content

[fayoftheforest]

human kite & antisemitism

In the notes of my recent meta on Vampire Kyle AUs, a user reflected on how similar antisemitic stereotypes might overlap with his TFBW character as well. Since I also have some thoughts on this and enjoyed putting together the last lil post I thought I’d do another on this subject too :) 

South Park Fandom Wiki states that Human Kite is heavily inspired by Superman, “being a faraway alien with the ability to fly and to shoot lasers out of his eyes, even wearing a costume with the color red, yellow, and blue and a symbol in his chest to match.”  I think this is pretty cool! Superman was created by Jewish immigrants and is very Jewish-coded in his origin story, being “a refugee with the Hebrew-inspired name ‘Kal-El’ who escaped a dying world and fought Nazis during World War II” (JewishUnpacked). I don’t know if Tratt were aware of these roots, but either way, I think it’s pretty neat :)

South Park Fandom Wiki also claims that Kyle playing an alien character “may be a reference to how Adolf Hitler did not consider Jews ‘human.’" This is. Uh. Less neat.

Similarly upsetting is the name itself, Human Kite, which is a play on words with the horrific ethnic slur “kike.” American Jewish Committee posits that the term “is derived from the Yiddish word for circle, ‘kikel,’ a reference to how Jewish immigrants at Ellis Island signed their entry forms: a circle as opposed to an X, which Jews associated with the cross of Christianity. Immigration officers described those who signed forms with a circle as ‘kikel,’ eventually being shortened to ‘kike.’”

Did Matt and Trey really create his entire character just so that Cartman could call him Human Kike that one time? I can’t say for certain, just in the same way I don’t have a direct quote from them confirming the reasoning behind their selections of names for Kyle and Ike. But I can tell you that if you put ‘em together and you get… yeah. Yep. “Kike” again. Thank you, Tratt, very cool 👍Get a new joke maybe :/

Now, let’s talk specifically about his laser powers. Up until researching for this meta, I had presumed that Kyle’s ability to shoot lasers from his eyes was a direct reference to the Jewish Space Laser conspiracy popularised to the public by terrifyingly influential political figure Marjorie Taylor Greene. In 2018, Greene wrote a Facebook rant speculating that the California wildfires were caused by a giant laser floating in space, owned by the Jews. Very normal thing to believe :|

However, during my research, I realised that these timelines did not match up. As mentioned, Greene’s rant was shared in 2018, but didn’t go viral until 2021. Meanwhile, South Park’s The Fractured But Whole was released way back in 2017! What I had initially assumed was another antisemitic reference is in fact just a dreadful and ridiculous coincidence. Nonetheless, It’s still a commonality that’s worth pointing out, I think.

Just as an aside, I’d like to take this opportunity to give a shoutout to cousin Kyle’s version of Human Kite. Everything about him is an egregious Jewish caricature, from his irritating, snivelling voice to his long list of health issues. It’s not my fault that the limited Jewish gene pool has fucked me over, Tratt! Leave me alone! A meta about antisemitism within Cousin’s Kyle characterisation would be a mile long, so I’ll spare you that for now.

Anyway, what does this all mean when we’re creating fan content around TFBW? Must we just chuck the Human Kite persona into a blender and never speak of it again? Not necessarily. Speaking as a Jewish fandom member, I quite enjoy reading and writing Human Kite. It’s a fun character to play around with! Despite his unfortunate roots, I don’t believe including him is innately antisemitic. It just depends on how you go about doing it! If he’s not secretly running the world, controlling the banks and Hollywood, or consuming the blood of innocent Christians, you’re on the right track. 

You could even go for a little meta-commentary and acknowledge the antisemitic coding within the text! Here’s an example of how I did that in my upcoming TFBW reality swap fic (don’t question why there’s two of everyone, it makes sense within the text lmao)

“Wait, you’re telling me in an alternate reality we’re all aliens?” Kyle gawks at this funhouse-mirror version of himself, who’s busy gawking right back. “No, Kyle, just—just you,” Kenny says. “Oh.” Kyle narrows his eyes. “You know, it’s difficult not to interpret this with antisemitic undertones.” “What, like the Jewish Space Laser conspiracy?” Cartman asks. Mysterion frowns. “Jewish people have space lasers in your universe?” “No,” Cartman sighs and shakes his head forlornly, before muttering, “it’s a made-up rumour to perpetuate mistrust and hatred towards the Jewish community.” “Alright, don’t sound so disappointed,” Kyle huffs. “Guys!” Stan says. “Can we not start this argument again?” “I never said it was a cool rumour, Kyle!” Cartman snaps defensively. “Obviously it’s super harmful and whatever. All I meant was that it would have been cool if it were real. Because, like, space lasers are awesome! Right?” He looks to Kite, apparently presuming that they’re an authority on the matter. “Um.” Kite blinks, then says hesitantly, “I can shoot lasers… from my eyes. And once I did sort of fly up into space and magnify the lasers to destroy Chaos’s tin foil factory. So, uh. Does that help?” Cartman’s face lights up and is split in half by an enthusiastic grin. “It helps a lot, actually.” Kyle groans and pinches his nose. “You have no idea how much education you’ve just undone, dude.” He opens his eyes to glower at Kite. Kenny glances at Chaos. “Tin foil factory?” Chaos waves a hand dismissively. “Outsourcing proved more efficient.”

There we go! A lighthearted little nod, which acknowledges potential antisemitic readings of Human Kite, without justifying or excusing it. It’s not at all necessary when creating fan content around Human Kite, but just know that that’s an option to you, if you so choose. Just make sure antisemites are the butt of your joke, and not Jewish people, lmao.

I’ll finish up by returning to my general sentiment that I held in my Vamp!Kyle post. If you conduct your creations with a basic level of awareness and self-reflection, you’ll probably be alright. Just stay in the know, and you’re all good to go 😎

[voncel]

Production for South Park seems so unserious but like in a funny way. Not just the “six days to air” thing, but how the show’s supervising producer can just ask Trey Parker for a voice role and they give her a character who gets a predominant background role for the rest of the show. I’ll always have Jennifer Howell to thank for Bebe Stevens.

Same thing goes with Jennifer and Bruce’s child, Jesse Howell; one of the first of many voice actors for Ike.

Then we have creating Butters inspired by Eric Stough or the naming of Cartman after their fat obnoxious college friend. Idc how parasocial this sounds but working on early South Park just seemed like so much fun, these two friends just making whatever they think is funny by breaking every Hay Code they can think of.

[rx-aysgl]

On Kyle's Side: My Personal Take on Cartman And Kyle's Dynamic From Kyle's Point Of View

This is a four part essay in which i explore Cartman and Kyle's relationship, focusing primarily on Kyle's perspective. As said, i have broken it down into four different parts titled:

Sense of Identity

Martyr Complex and Competitiveness

Cartman

Their Relationship

There will be an extra chapter where i will make some additional commentary.

Hope you guys enjoy.

1. Sense of Identity and Selfishness

In the show Kyle is always concerned about “doing the right thing”, at least that's what he likes to tell himself. Though in reality, he is extremely selfish when push comes to shove and the reason for that stems from his constant questioning of his own identity and his stance in things. This makes him come off as rather inconsistent in a lot of ways. As a result, Kyle feels very lost. So what does he do? He decides to base his opinions and feelings and thoughts off of his environment because his own existance overwhelms him so much (eg. the "Tooth Fairy Tats 2000" episode). This puts him into this vicious cycle where he keeps getting lost even more due to not being able to pinpoint his own frame of thought and latching onto the external world that consists of many different people who have found their own way in life who also keep changing constantly and thus leaving all kinds of contradicting impressions on him. Throughout the series we see him try to change his apparence, religion, even his personality for the sake of fitting in (this also correlates to his martyr complex which i will get to). He creates this moral code for himself that he conditions himself to stick to in order to find his own identity and feel a sense of belonging but the sheer inconsistency of said moral code causes him to come off as indecisive, sometimes as a people pleaser and sometimes a hypocrite.

His defiance of a stable frame of mind pushes him to act on instinct and his momentary emotions while his refusal of self-acceptance causes him to distance his true self from others he considers close to him (Stan), hence the selfishness. It makes sense because how could someone get close to another when he can't even make peace with his own identity?

The reason i am mentioning this is to point out that since Cartman is so extreme in his beliefs and deliberately commits so many evil and selfish deeds, Kyle is obsessively drawn to him because it is so easy to call out and oppose him. Their polarity makes Kyle feel a sense of self he doesnt allow himself to truly make peace with and sugarcoat how fucked up he can be just like all the people in South Park that have wronged him but not enough to channel these feelings into. Cartman keeps Kyle grounded. Just like basically every other kid in the show, Kyle has done terrible things but he is so concerned about being right that he has to have Cartman by his side to make him escape from his own inner conflicts by reflecting it directly onto Cartman, the one person he is actually much more similar to more than he likes to think but he can only subconsciously acknowledge it.

2. Martyr Complex and Competitiveness

Another very essential aspect we need to pay attention to is Kyle's martyr complex. Kyle feels the need to not only to do the right thing but also to “sacrifice himself” for it. He is so self righteous to the point that not only does he not acknowledge his own flaws he also thinks he has to be and is some kind of heroic figure to others (eg. "Ginger Cow"), though this is more subtle compared to the other aspects of his personality.

The martyr complex causes Cartman to be seen as an even easier target than he already is and Cartman is more than willing to exploit Kyle for it hence feeding his very own complexes. They mutually feed off of each other to the point they are obsessed with each other and need each other. I would also like to point out that Kyle often shares some of his most vulnerable moments when Cartman is by his side in a suprising way (eg. choosing to stay by Cartman's side in the "You're Getting Old" and "Ass Burgers" episodes as an escape from Stan's depression at the time, crying with Cartman in "Kenny Dies" etc.) and vice versa. Though this is hard to notice on Cartman's side because Kyle conveys his vulnerability via confusion, sadness and desparation whereas Cartman does so via anger, jealousy and revenge.

3. Cartman

Cartman chastising Kyle like this most likely stems from how he believes Kyle was the catalyst to how fucked up he turned out to be due to his constant agression and bullying towards him in the earlier seasons, where he was mostly just a spoiled brat and nowhere near as bad as he is now. His pent up fury leads Cartman to also feel an extreme amount of envy towards Kyle with the reason of Cartman being a little more capable than Kyle at recognizing how him and Kyle share many similarities (being very emotionally driven, selfishness, neuroticism, stubbornnes, a habit of denying their own mistakes) who is in full denial of it on a conscious level. Cartman does try to get closer to Kyle and also the rest of his friends and seek their validation in the earlier seasons but as time goes by he realizes more and more that Kyle does not get the same treatment as him regardless.

Therefore, Cartman blames Kyle for his suffering and takes it all out on him in various disgusting ways because he thinks that Kyle deserves all the terrbile things happening to him.

It is very important to take into consideration how abhorrent Cartman's upbringing was and how influential it is to the way he feels towards Kyle. All of his childhood; he was raised with all kinds of abuse, neglect, extensive bullying and was depraved of almost all positive emotions. The result of this is Cartman ending up percieving positive emotions in a very traumatized, distorted and disturbing way. With this gradual build-up and "Scott Tennorman Must Die" being his breaking point by spreading fear to all of South Park and feeling an overwhelming amout of attention on him that he craved so much, Cartman ultimately comes to the conclusion that he can only and only validate himself by inflicting negativity on others. Independent from being conventionally "positive" or "negative" emotions, post-Scott Tennorman Cartman correlates all of his emotions to seeking attention and asserting himself as much as he can in means of a defense mechanism and in means of validating his own existance. His real feelings are filtered through a broken perspective, of which are conveyed intensely to the people he feels strongly about like Kyle or Liane.

How this all comes back to Kyle lies in the fact that Cartman also "benefits" from the way Kyle caters to his own problems via their seemingly very polarized relationship, not only does Cartman keep Kyle grounded as mentioned but Kyle does keep Cartman grounded as well.

At this point, their individual vicious cycles have become one, a constant play of cat and mouse; with both of them unable to differentiate which one is which, ever chasing.

4. Their Relationship

Describing their feelings towards each other as solely hate wouldn’t do justice to the times they tried so hard to keep the other in their lives (eg. the "Smug Alert" and "Skank Hunt" episodes) not only for the sake of just existing in each others lives or keeping in touch etc. but also to keep each other in their individual loops they are in, of which they cannot maintain with anyone else.

As a consequence Kyle and Cartman’s mutual obsession with each other leads them to go such lengths as saving each other multiple times. However, since there is a perpetual competitiveness between them due to Cartman's evny towards Kyle and Kyle's insatiable need to prove himself to be better than Cartman, they simply cannot stand each other’s happiness, especially if it involves someone really close to them, like a partner. Cartman ruining Kyle's potential romantic relationship with Nicole in "Cartman Finds Love" and Kyle trying to ruin Cartman's relationship with Heidi in "Doubling Down" and Kyle being unable to appreciate Cartman finally changing his ways for good and having a loving relationship and family in the Post Covid specials are all examples of both of them selfishly trying to involve the other in their own issues they should be able to deal with on their own, only have they not been such self absorbed people.

Their rivalry brings out the best and the worst in each other and they both know deep down that they are just like each other and they both hate it and feel an odd sense of comfort in it. That is exactly the reason why they simply cannot stand when the one of them goes on to have a happier life than the other. Not only do they feel as if they have lost some kind of battle but they also feel abandoned when it happens.

Extra Thoughts:

I find their relationship to be extremely complex and honest to god it has my multi media overthinker ass climbing up the walls and shitting furnitures. They are my favorite characters in the show and analyzing both of them was such treat to me. Due to some things i have mentioned in this essay especially on the last chapter, you can interpret some of them in the same vein as some kind of shipping subtext, even though this essay is essentially written in means of sheerly exploring this dynamic as it is. I honestly like keeping things really ambigious without necessarily categorizing relationships as romantic or platonic but if written properly i can enjoy both renditions of this relationship.

In order to clarify some things, i can enjoy romantic kyman ONLY AND ONLY in the condition of Cartman bettering himself over the years. I know it would be really difficult and may seem impossible to most of you but i find it an interesting and challenging story to think about and create content for. I believe that Eric is forever gonna stay as an asshole and i do not expect him to become an angel in the future. However I also think of him to be a really traumatized 8 year old, who is a really fucked up product of his really fucked up environment, a child who is smart enough to learn to be a better person, especially to those he values as his friends if given the proper opportunity. I do not think that their relationship will ever be a conventionally and classically an ideal one, especially from an outsider's perspective but Kyle and Cartman (and the entirety of South Park's cast) are both very far from being ideal human beings in the first place. At the end of the day, relationships can be very complex and unhealthy in real life, they always come in different colors and shapes. It is okay to explore a relationship in fiction without thinking it is the ideal relationship or the relationship you want to have in your own lives. It is okay to explore a relationship because it is interesting and well-written. This is what media literacy is all about.

As a disclaimer before some dumbass ship discourse happens, there are ofc some lines not to cross like the romanticization of inc*st, p*dophilia, r*pe and things like ww2 aus and shit btw. That being said, if you cannot separate fiction and reality to the extent i talked about in the previous chapter, this is your stupidity. Stop making it everybody's fucking problem.

anyways im gonna be extra deadass rn if someone gave me a 100k word long collage au that is written properly i would eat that shit up like theres no tomorrow. it doesnt even have to be romantic i just want more of them they are so interesting 😭😭😭 they also funny as fuck so the 2012 yaoi becomes even funnier. what a great dynamic godzamn 😭😭😭😭

Thanks for reading!!!

[roostertuftart]

I saw someone say the other day that style would never work because Kyle needs someone that challenges him and

1. Idk where you got the idea Stan doesn’t challenge Kyle because oh boy does he

2. Also like. Idk? Challenge him how? Fight with him? It’s fine if you like kyman or whatever but Kyle is a really insecure character who CRAVES having people stand by him and support him. If anything, having Stan support him more (and vice versa Kyle supporting Stan) is what their relationship needs to work, not someone who’s gonna fight with Kyle and give him a hard time constantly/leave him to fend for himself more

[kymantruther]

cupid ye was more kyman than it was style

seeing as south park episodes aren’t gonna come until march, this gives me the time to talk about cupid ye…which i’ve wanted to after the episode came out but i figured i wouldn’t have enough time to. so i really planned this analysis to be after all the episodes were made for s26…but again seeing as they’re on break, i took my chances.

so this is the perfect time for me to talk about cupid ye and how the episode always read more kyman than style to me. this may sound absurd considering the episode phrases stan and kyle’s relationship in a romantic way, but i find that’s all it extends to. let’s review the episode for a bit so i can elaborate. sure, the phrasing implies some sort of romance between stan and kyle, and there’s even a scene where stan is stammering and love struck when kyle talks to him. But we don’t ever see stan act upon this. notice how throughout the entire episode stan NEVER confronts kyle about how he misses hanging out with him? i see people call kyle a bad friend for “ditching” him, but it’s a notion i never got. stan never said anything to kyle about it, kyle’s not a bad friend for wanting to have fun with someone else, it’s not ditching in the slightest (unless you’re going to try and actually imply kyle belongs to stan and should only be around him 24/7). how was kyle supposed to know stan felt this way? he was having fun with tolkien, kyle’s suddenly villain for having fucking fun??? i can only blame stan in this situation because all he did was avoid the problem and act like it didn’t affect him (when it did).

even at the end of the episode, he only confronts tolkien not kyle. this just signifies to me there’s a clear communication problem in stan and kyle’s friendship. for an unknown reason, stan doesn’t want to address things with kyle. with this fact in mind, that scene where stan is nervous to talk to kyle at lunch suddenly doesn’t look so cute anymore, in fact, it demonstrates a legitimately problem of stan’s.

it’s no wonder stan and kyle’s friendship is breaking off, stan can’t even discuss his feelings with kyle. he does nothing but mope around and feel sorry for himself when he could literally fix the problem if he talked to his super best friend.

but opposed that to cartman in this episode. what does cartman do in the episode when he realizes he did something wrong? he acts. he realizes he’s gone way too far with the rumor about kyle running hollywood and he actually does something about it. sure, stan can stand in front of kyle to protect him (which tolkien did too so even that’s not a style moment lol) but cartman’s the one who forced cupid ye (arguably himself) to take his meds to save kyle.

cartman got kyle in this mess but he got kyle out of it.

and let’s talk about the initial synopsis for the episode too.

the synopsis says cartman is jealous. watching the ep, it appears stan is jealous, and he is. so why would it say cartman is jealous? because cartman is projecting. cartman ordinarily doesn’t care if stan and kyle have a fallout, actually he typically relishes in them. but that’s only because he gets kyle to himself (ex: assburgers, cbaa). but this time, tolkien and kyle hang out. so cartman takes stan’s jealousy and acts like he’s doing it for stan and his friendship with kyle, but in reality he’s doing it because he’s jealousy. just as the synopsis says.

and i don’t think it’s a coincidence cupid me, cartman’s gay conscious, is in this episode about cartman being jealous of tolkien and kyle’s friendship. in their valentine’s day episode at that ;).

so to summarize, it’s incredibly surface level to say this episode was style. this episode was kyman to the core and just furthers the theory that cartman is in love with kyle.

[fanbun]

Does anyone else think Cartman has some kind of power to make his hallucinations real?

Mitch Conner in The Fractured But Whole seemed to actually possess Kyle’s hand, and in the recent episode Cupid Ye was shown shooting kids with his nazi love arrows while Cartman was trying to stop him. Mr. Mackey said he saw a bee flying around the school, so that could either mean it was a literal bee or Mackey just saw Cupid Ye that way because it was an easy explanation for the hysteria.

Omg. Wouldn’t it be cool if this facet of Cartman is tied to Imaginationland in some way? Since Cartman’s Christmas critters became real in Imaginationland?

…Come to think of it, what about Kyle and Mr. Hankey? Maybe characters from Imaginationland often leak into the town of South Park and become “real.”

[kennytheworkingclasshero]

The effects of Kenny’s unstable home life and how that makes him feel comes out full force in the Vaccination special. Kenny comes from a family that has neglectful and violent parents and an older brother who is inebriated most of the time. Kenny has to be the caregiver for Karen, with no clear love coming from his parents. He’s usually the one who has to be the adult. However, when it comes to his friends he gets to be a kid, gets to mess around with them and go on adventures and he gets to feel loved. In their own little fucked up way, they’re a family and for Kenny, the only family he feels is there for him (apart from Karen, of course, but he has to be more of a parent than a brother to her). These are the 3 kids who he has known since he was in pre school and who mourned him when he died. When the prospect of them breaking up comes into play and the found family he has leaving, he loses it and feels utterly heartbroken. Not only because he’s losing the people he loves but also because all he’ll have left is his neglect family with no one to turn to for normalcy or comfort. We can also see this during The Scoots, where he is sad when he is being pushed out of their Trick or Treating tradition and both times he is emotionally mature enough to take himself to counselling.

[ashes-goin-down]

I think Cartman hates jewish people and -Kyle- too much to be vulnerable like you've depicted. No matter what level of physical attraction he might feel.

Hi there, thanks for your comment. Unfortunately I wrote a whole-ass novel in response so here's the TL;DR so you don't actually have to read all that: I agree that the comic is OOC but I don't think it's because of Cartman's hatred of Kyle or Jewish people.

Sorry for misusing your message to go on a somewhat loosely related rant but I've been meaning to write this for a while and it came as a convenient excuse lmao _

I agree with you regarding the vulnerability. I don't think Cartman would voice his feelings like that unless (he could claim that) it's a farce (e.g., Jenny Simons, "Cartman Finds Love") or the other person shows interest in him first so he feels safe from rejection (Heidi, initially - not opening that whole can of worms rn lol). For example, he treated his attraction to Patty Nelson as a big secret, apparently not even considering ever confessing to her, and that's most likely because he was expecting the reaction she did end up giving him since, beneath his self-deceit, he's excruciatingly aware of the fact that he's actually not exactly highly regarded by his peers.

It's a lot of work upholding the façade he's build for himself of being this cool, esteemed person and it cracks easily even without direct outside influence (for example when Clyde Frog or Cupid Me insult him) so he really, really doesn't deal with rejection very well. Him being this vulnerable to Kyle specifically and then getting rejected would be absolutely catastrophic for him, so I agree that he wouldn't put himself in that position. However, it's my opinion that the most OOC thing about the comic is the fact that he simply acknowledges that Kyle hates him. I don't actually think he'd just accept that but would instead convince himself that it isn't true ("Kyle has internalized homophobia" or better yet "Kyle doesn't think he's worthy of someone as cool and awesome as me") and then do some crazy shit to try and win him over.

So yeah, you're right: He Would Not Fucking Say That. I don't think his hatred of Kyle and/or Jewish people is the reason he wouldn't, though, as I believe Cartman's feelings towards Kyle and Judaism are a lot more complicated than that. It's not without reason that his relationships with both are such a big part of the show and that people smarter than me have written whole essays on the topic lmao

I feel the need to clarify that I am in no way trying to excuse any of Cartman's antisemitism! I'd just like to voice a few thoughts on its origin and evolution.

Cartman is clearly weirdly obsessed with both Kyle and his religion and obviously they are linked. While I suppose initially it might have been a bit of a chicken-egg situation ("He hates Kyle because he hates Jews" vs. "He hates Jews because he hates Kyle"), I believe originally his antisemitism may have simply been a byproduct of his fascination with the third reich, which itself I think was mostly a result of his enjoyment of envisioning himself as a dictator (i.e. the ultimate authority figure) and as such was actually pretty surface-level - as is evident from the fact that for a long time he didn't seem to fully grasp what exactly Judaism even IS (as shown when he apologizes to Kyle for calling him a Jew or when he uses the term as an insult towards Stan and Kenny). Still, I very much dislike it when people try to downplay his bigotry as naivety. That really doesn't hold any water after very early on in the show, if it ever even did in the first place, since he definitely acts from a place of malice and over time his fixation on the religion seems to have developed into something bigger. He's learnt more about it and it became much more synonymous with Kyle for him (the order of which is also debatable but I of course lean a certain way). At this point in the show I believe it's safe to say that he wouldn't be nearly as obsessed with Judaism if Kyle wasn't Jewish. While Cartman is obviously a bigoted asshole in many ways, he's not nearly as preoccupied with other minority groups as he is with Jews and he has even shown himself to be surprisingly tolerant of homosexuals and disabled people (who, of course, were also heavily persecuted under Nazism).

I really do think that "Jewpacabra" did leave a lasting impact on his character. It's pretty obvious that he was being genuine at the end of of the episode and actually did intent on self-identifying as Jewish from then on (and iirc M&T confirmed as much in the commentary to that episode and explained that they just sort of… forgot about that lol) and then in "Shots" he does claim to be Jewish and while that may have been in an attempt to get a vaccination exemption, the aforementioned commentary makes me believe it may not exclusively be that.

Notably, he specifically calls himself an "Orthodox Jew", which Kyle obviously doesn't seem to be and that ties in nicely with him becoming a rabbi in PC and making the religion his entire personality - because it's not enough to become Jewish: He needs to beat Kyle at being Jewish.

Of course, Cartman never actually stops being antisemitic before the time skip but then "Cupid Ye" implies that that isn't even a fully conscious decision that he can completely control but instead at least partially caused by whatever he has going on mentally. He even actively attempts to counteract it when he decides that it has gone too far. That's my take on the episode, at least. Obviously the whole thing with Cupid Me is kind of messy. No matter what exactly is actually happening there, I do think the his actions here prove that his feelings regarding the matter are more complex than they may initially appear to be.

Though I know it's still a point of contention for many, to me personally it seems pretty clear that him being a rabbi and a family man in PC was authentic and that he wasn't simply messing with Kyle the entire time. However, I find it extremely interesting that Cartman converted BEFORE meeting Yentl so I actually don't see any way in which Kyle didn't have any part in that and as such I don't think he would have ever become a rabbi if Kyle didn't happen to be Jewish. So my personal headcanon is that while Cartman's conversion was indeed directly influenced by Kyle, he actually did end up finding fulfillment in the faith and it ironically helped him let go of his obsession with him (which I think fits the show's style of humor).

To summarize: As a shipper I may be biased but I think that Cartman is a disturbed little boy who grows up to be a disturbed little man who fails to fully understand his feelings towards Kyle and - as an extension of that - the Jewish faith and thus lashes out into extremes regarding it.

[chaoticreivingu]

Compare & Contrast: Pip Pirrup & Butters Stotch

There’s a story that’s been spread around the South Park fandom for a very long time, in which it’s argued that due to Pip’s unpopularity among the audience and creators alike, Butters replaced Pip and his role in the show. But did he really take over his role or is this just one fanon game of telephone?

Pip’s role, ever since the beginning of the show, was to be severely abused and hated by everyone, adults and strangers alike. He’s well-spoken and emotionally mature for his age, but at the same time too awkward to even be seen in public with, and whenever he speaks his “punchable” personality is enough to cause a scene. His submissiveness and passive ways aren’t seen as endearing, and seemingly every aspect of him, from his mismatched clothes to his voice was designed to induce a cringeworthy reaction from the cast. His only usefulness is that everybody can take his anger out on him however they want with no consequences at all. No adult cares about him and he’s an orphan, so he can’t snitch to anyone.

Butters on the other hand, isn’t universally hated. Sure he’s seen as lame by the rest, but Kyle likes him enough to invite him to Casa Bonita and even in Awesome-O Cartman was the only one dead set on pranking him.

That’s not to say he’s not bullied at all during this era, he did start out as a Melvin at first and does get picked on a lot in seasons 3-7, but he’s not as low on the social ladder as Pip is, since he practically has his own level at the bottom of the barrel.

An example of this is in Two Guys Naked in a Hot Tub, where Stan, Dougie and Butters all visibly interact with the media and police in some way, but Pip is delegated to doing behind the scenes work, once again highlighting how much of a stigma everyone has around him, that even around others like himself, it’s best to not have him talk or else the plan might backfire from the possible awkwardness that might ensue.

Even if he was called a “Melvin” by Stan, it’s clear that his bullying is never as severe as Pip’s. While Pip’s abuse relies on social isolation, physical beatings, humiliation and life risking situations, Butters’ bullying is more about manipulating, drifting, pranking and taking advantage of his gullibility to make him go along with a plan, even if he’s initially cautious about it.

To put it into perspective, the first time Butters bled was 5 seasons after his debut. The first time Pip bled was in his first appearance.

These scenes almost serve as parallels to each other to highlight how different these two are in terms of their roles, personality and how the rest view them.

In the former, the main 4 convince Pip to go down the slide, he cracks his head open and bleeds profusely. They proceed to laugh at him and even tell him to do it again to get hurt more for their entertainment while Pip runs to the nurse’s office.

In the latter, Butters convinces the main 4 to play with him, Kenny accidentally throws a ninja star into his eye and he bleeds profusely. They instantly stop their playtime to check on Butters’ wellbeing while Butters pleads to go to the hospital.

It’s clear from this how unaccustomed Butters is to such an injury and how much the main 4 value Butters as a person and friend, even if they don’t want to admit it. On the flipside it’s evident that Pip is seen as nothing more than entertainment for the boys and how much he’s used to being treated this way since he barely reacts to the injury.

Other scenes that serve to differentiate the two is in Hooked on Monkey Phonics and Cartman’s Silly Hate Crime. Both Butters and Pip are featured in the episodes, and in the latter act like a matching set but react differently, like at the thought of the boys losing the match against the girls(Butters’ focuses on losing to women while Pip’s is a more general statement).

In both episodes Pip is given the usual physical abuse treatment even when he imitates the others to fit in or tries standing up for himself, while Butters isn’t mocked at all and is more antagonistic, strapping Mark to a bench and calling Clyde the second fattest kid. Unlike Pip, Butters rotates from being bullied to doing the bullying since that’s how South Park Elementary School’s society functions.

For the last scene to compare and contrast, in Professor Chaos Butters and Pip are both featured and devalued by the boys.

Butters’ scene is set in the privacy of Cartman’s room, nobody else is there except for the Stan,Kyle, Cartman and Butters. The Scamps fire Butters for being too lame, but still apologize for things going this way as Butters sadly leaves, with the punchline being his outlandish reaction afterwards.

Pip’s scene is set publicly, in Denver no less. While it already starts awkwardly by Pip clapping instead of cheering like the rest, it’s when he asks for tea at a baseball game that all eyes lock on to him in anger or shock. After Pip doubles down asking for crumpets Cartman angrily tells him to go away with some people still looking at him, while he leaves in confusion at what he did wrong. Coincidentally, immediately after Pip leaves, Butters shows up to hijack the game.

In all these examples, Butters and Pip both act and react in separate ways and even in bullying scenes the punchlines aren’t the same. By late season 8 Butters starts to grow more and more to the point that by season 14 the nerdiness is just a quirk that’s slowly fading, while Pip gets his last appearance by being Barbra Streisand’s punching bag and dying in the process.

So if Pip is superficially similar but inwardly different than Butters, why did Trey and Matt stop using him? Simple, they just got bored of him like they did with Dr. Mephesto and Mrs. Crabtree.

In the creator commentary for Two Guys Naked in a Hot tub they say they enjoy writing Butters more but that’s understandable, one is an original character they created while the other is a direct parody that’s more creatively limited, not due to being “empty” but his lack of parents and inability to make fun of others limit a lot of potential that could be done in later South Park episodes that focus more on the parents or aren’t afraid of making characters mean spirited for the sake of the plot.

As a bonus, here's some minor details that are worth mentioning:

While they’re both blond, geeky and voiced by Matt Stone, Pip and Butters’ jackets are dark red and turquoise respectively, which are direct opposites on the color wheel.

Their hairstyles also indicate their different personality traits as Pip’s long and straight hair emphasizes his lameness and softness compared to the rest while Butters’ short and spiky hair indicates he has more of a backbone compared to his fellow Melvin.

Finally, while(in earlier seasons) Butters’ accent is stereotypically southern and his speech is drawn out, Pip’s accent is stereotypically British and his speech is concise.

[drownedinlavender]

An idea I like to play with in my mind is teen Eric Cartman angst.

As someone who grew up in less than ideal circumstances, once I grew older, I began to feel ashamed of what I did and what happened to me when I was younger. Most people who have experienced SA as a child know what I'm referring to.

It's not a new concept, the fact that, as kids, we don't understand what's going on around us; We don't understand the weight of the things that we have done or the things done to us. As we grow older, the reality of it all sinks in and it's unbearable.

Picture Cartman, growing older and understanding the gravity of what he has done and what has been done to him but unable to do anything about it because he lacks the tools to do so.

Cartman has already been proven to feel insecure, inadequate, and less than, but he pushes it all down by re-writing the narrative to better suit him. Imagine those insecurities gnawing at him more and more as the weight of his past actions catches up to him. Imagine him lashing out more and more, more moody and with much more attitude as he reaches adolescence. There is a naivity and ignorance that childhood offers, but it quickly erodes once we learn more about the world around us as we age.

This is just one scenario of course, he could also very well maintain a sense of delusion which would shield him from dwelling further into what he isn't ready to face. He could deepen his denial and further his delusions, burrying his past deep in his chest until he basically re-writes his own narrative.

I love both scenarios but I am more into angst, so I like the idea of him being unable to fully supress the reality of it all and becoming too aware of himself as he ages, hehe

[fayoftheforest]

vampire kyle & historic antisemitism

DISCLAIMER: this post is not intended to incite drama or discourse, I simply want to share my thoughts on a complex topic. Just because I’m Jewish does not mean I speak for the entire community. We’re not a monolith, there is great diversity of opinion among us, discussion and debate is a beloved part of our culture, etc etc :) ok on with the post!

But wait, Fay, I hear you interject. Vampires aren’t even real! How can they be sayin’ stuff about Jews? Well, my dear friends, I have some rather grave news for you: much of pop culture is Sayin’ Stuff About The Jews. And very little of it is positive :/

I’ll quote Jewish author Deke Moulton to establish the basic links between vampires and antisemitism:

The problem is tied to the conspiracy called the blood libel. If you’re not familiar with it, the blood libel started in Medieval Europe in the 12th century and claimed that Jewish people needed the blood of Christian children to make our Passover matzoh. For context, Jewish people are prohibited from consuming blood at all – we will salt kosher meat to draw out blood. Despite being very old and very wrong, the blood libel idea still persists today (albeit usually with slightly less obvious framing).

There is also a common trope of vampires operating through a secret, worldwide council that often governs ‘vampire affairs’ but also may dabble in controlling other aspects of the world’s governments. While some people can see a similarity to the Catholic Church, often times this calls upon the antisemitic trope of the ‘cabal’—that Jews secretly run the entire world (which is another strange antisemitic trope, as Judaism doesn’t have any central religious figure like the Pope). The word ‘cabal’ itself is a bastardization of the word kabbalah, a form of Jewish mysticism. If you combine this with a trope of vampires hoarding large amounts of money (especially gold?), you’re using yet another antisemitic trope that says Jewish people control the world’s banks.

Even things like being adverse to the sunlight can have antisemitic implications – the early Church claimed that, because in Judaism days start at sundown and thus our time of worship happens at night, that gathering at night to worship was proof of us being evil and satanic.

So, all vampires are bad and wrong, and vampire Kyle AUs are a hatecrime, and everyone who’s ever done one should go straight to jail, right?

Well. No.

Because really, it should be noted that this extract is from an interview on Moulton’s novel “Don’t Want To Be Your Monster,” a book which not only features blood-sucking vampires, but a blood-sucking Jewish vampire. Interesting, interesting... it's almost as if this topic is nuanced or something 🤔

Many iconic vampires are based on antisemitic stereotypes. Perhaps most famous is Dracula, with curly hair and a hooked nose, is an Eastern European immigrant who has the intentions of “infecting” British society. Another example is Nosferatu, who also has an exaggerated hooked nose, is thin, pale and hunched, and is topped by a skull cap. There are modern exceptions to this trend, though! Twilight comes to mind. Edward Cullen is far more inspired by Stephanie Meyer’s Mormonism than Judaism as a whole. Explained so aptly by The Quietus, “As vampiric portrayals become more positive, they tend to also become less connected to Jewish representation.” Come on, you guys >:( Jewishness can be hot and sexy too, I swear!!

From what I’ve seen of Vamp!Kyle AUs, portrayals tend to lean more towards the mysterious and alluring Cullen-type than the bad-to-the-bone Dracula. Ultimately, I think this is what redeems our fandom’s vampire Kyle. Because crucially, whilst vampires can be antisemitic, they are not innately antisemitic. When you show Kyle brooding behind his high-collars and flashing toothy grins at his love interest, it’s not typically symbolic of the ultimate evil that we are expected to fear and ridicule. It's intended to be cute, or cool, or hot, or whatever.

My advice is thus: if you want to make something deeper or complex with the AU, just have a think about what you’re using his vampiric traits to represent. Are you drawing from unfortunate stereotypes or feeding into antisemitic fears? Are you validating or justifying the “othering” or ostracisation of Jewish people from wider society? You could consider finding a Jewish beta/sensitivity reader, if that’s accessible to you. But generally speaking, so long as you’re not presenting Kyle as an all-powerful predator to pure, innocent Christian society, I reckon you’re probably alright :)