#OLTNE spoilers

[theresthesnitch]

Chapter 8: Like Father, Like Son

James walked up to Remus and Sirius’s door, hearing what he assumed was a lively wireless station playing in the background, though he didn’t know what program would include child’s laughter. Perhaps it was an advertisement.

He grabbed the handle and was surprised when it didn’t turn. He cast a quick Alohomora at it, then tried again, but it still didn’t open. He looked at the door, then looked up and down the hall, but he was definitely in the right spot.

He raised his hand in a fist, and quickly rapped on the door. James heard Remus’s laughter as he walked down the entryway to the door. The door opened, and Remus’s smiling face fell as he looked at James. “Oh, Prongs. We weren’t expecting you, were we?”

Continue reading here on AO3, or start from the beginning.

[theresthesnitch]

Hi Snitch, how have you been? ❤️

I've loved every chapter of OLT(NE) so far, and it's fun to see everyone's reaction to James being a total idiot.

So, just for the sake of it - and because it's a fun way to explore stories and characters - I'll play devil's advocate.

It's true. James' actions are cruel, his words are hurtful. He is in the wrong, without a doubt. All of these things are true... But they also make sense.

As you said, he doesn't think clearly (or at all) around Lily, he's waited and fought for her, and he feels betrayed, but I think there's more to it.

Let's take it one step at a time.

James joined the Order right after graduating from Hogwarts, at 18. He went from living a relatively sheltered life to being a soldier in a matter of months. He knew how cruel the world could be, all his loved ones had suffered because of it. And James has been, in many ways, a safe harbour for these people, someone to look up to, because he had the means, the skills and the willingness to lead and fight. And that is a huge honour, but also a big responsibility and sometimes a burden for someone so young.

And then the war turned very ugly, very quickly... But it was still worth it, because James had Lily and his friends, a reason to fight harder, a reason to survive and to live.

At his age, you're supposed to figure out who you are, to make mistakes. And let me tell you, your late teens and early twenties can be awful! I've met very few people who've enjoyed who they were. You constantly doubt yourself, your identity and it's chaotic and stressful and you lose your mind a bit. You start feeling a bit more settled in your late twenties.

So we have James, who's going through all of this during a war. This is a kid who's overly confident, probably very idealistic and optimistic. He learns very quickly that protecting his friends withing the walls Hogwarts and protecting them in the war are two entirely different things. He's not used to lose: he grows frustrated and impatient, and he starts doubting his entire outlook on life. I feel like the war was a bigger shock for James than for anybody else.

When he and Lily broke up, he had reached his limit. They had both seen terrible things, lived such horrors that there was no room for happiness. They had no control over their lives, and decided to end things because they wouldn't have forgiven themselves if they had been responsible for the other's death. Making this decision must have been impossibly difficult. Was breaking up the coward's way out? If they weren't strong enough to bear the thought of losing each other, how could they be strong enough for a war? Their enemies didn't have this weakness.

James stopped living after that. He fought to survive, not to live. Barely two years into the war, and he had already been destroyed by it.

He was a broken man... A broken boy, nineteen years old, forced to learn but also accept the complexities of the world, but without the right tools. So after a while, he found a (wrong and unhealthy) way to deal with all of this. He became numb. Reckless. Joined the hunt for the Horcruxes. Left Remus and Peter behind, too. And then the real horror began.

I think the hunt for the Horcruxes was nothing he'd even seen, nothing any of them (including Dumbledore) had seen. I think a part of him was forever changed during this time. Even after the war is over, he's profoundly affected by this. If we want to give it a name, it could be PTSD.

I think Peter's betrayal was the final nail in the coffin, and arguably the most painful part of the war, maybe even more painful than his break-up.

You see, we often think of James in the context of his relationship with Lily, but his bond with the Marauders is a fundamental part of who he is. He met them at eleven years old, before he knew about love and sex and heartbreaks. Those three people became his brothers. They were his first love, in a way. How could he wrap his head around Peter's betrayal? Had he been rotten from the beginning? And if not, why didn't they notice he had changed? Maybe they did, and they did ignored the signs, which would be even worse. I don't know if James got the answers to these questions. I don't know which is worse: to know or not know the reasons behind Peter's actions. I can only imagine what it feels like to lose someone you love like this. He would never expect his friend to be actually working for the enemy, helping him kill his other friends and gain power. It's the kind of thing you can't even imagine.

There was also a huge deal of guilt involved, because nothing could have erased the years they had spent together, their adventures, their secrets. I think James took it worse than Sirius and Remus, and not just because he was alone and they had each other, but because I think James knew Peter had looked up to him ever since he met him. He knew the influence that he had had on him. I think James blamed himself because of this. He knew the kind of person Peter was: he probably wasn't an autonomous individual in the same way James' other two friends were. Also, Sirius had experienced the betrayal of his own brother, and Remus feared deep down that this little group, this family was too good to be true, so he was prepared for their friendship to end one day. James had none of that. He had never known this feeling. He was completely unprepared and powerless.

The knowledge that James could have done something about it, that he could have fixed him, too is something that will forever haunt him. James grieves the person he thought Peter was. It's the kind of grief that will eat you inside, that will cement itself in your brain.

Truth is, I don't think James is the same person he was before. His actions and words are influenced by all these things. I'm not saying that the war made him rude and disrespectful but it makes sense that he's more blunt now: you don't have the time nor the energy to be your best self when you're trying to survive. These experiences turn you into the worst version of yourself. And, according to the story, the war has just ended and James is probably still in that mindset, and he needs a lot of time to readjust to his old life. A life he probably doesn't recognise anymore.

I'm not an expert, but many veterans have had trouble going back to their old lives. Their brain is still in fight-or-flight mode, and they sometimes experience feelings of depersonalisation and derealisation. I'm not saying that this is James' case, but it's important to contextualise his actions.

This is probably the longest ask I've ever sent you (and that's saying something) so I apologise for the length and the typos I'm sure to find if I read it again, which I won't lol

Also, this is more of a reflection about your version of James rather than an analysis. I'm sure you have a very specific idea of who he is, and if I'm completely on the wrong track I don't mind at all, quite the opposite: I'll be very happy to get to know your James better ❤️

I think that telling each other stories is what we're all ultimately here for, it's our highest purpose. It's all about about sharing, at the end of the day, so thank you for giving us this wonderful story. It makes my brain go brrr and my heart go ouch but also aw. I love it when a story pushes me to think critically, it's incredibly satisfying and it reminds me of why I love reading so much.

💜

I don't think there's a better way to show appreciation for one of my fics than a lengthy love letter to it in my ask box. This is....everything. I love this.

Also, as far as James goes? You hit the nail on the head there. A few additional details that I think play an important part below the cut here.

***

Absolutely, 100% yes with the war hitting James harder than he expected. I think you also have to consider the Lily aspect of it all. James started the war fighting for and because of Lily, but then she was gone, and I think that had a two-fold effect on him.

First, we see him being more reckless in the past snippets in chapter 1. James volunteers for the "special taskforce" without thinking twice about it because "it should be someone like him with nothing to lose." It's also the first time that he sees his friends split, and the war causes that. This ultimately has consequences that shake James to the core. Like you mentioned, he lost Peter somewhere along the way, to the point that Peter betrayed them. Was Peter always bad, or was it some failing in James that made him go bad? (Because James would have always thought he could save his friends, and he failed.) However, he also watched fellow members of the taskforce die. From chapter 1:

When Peter and Remus left, the latter sending a longing look back over his shoulder, James and Sirius were left with Fabian and Gideon Prewett, Kingsley Shacklebolt, Dorcas Meadows, and Caradoc Dearborn. They sat in a circle, with Dumbledore at the head looking fondly around at them, as they waited to hear what this dangerous task would be. 

It's not a mistake that the other members of the task force were almost unanimously characters that died in the first war in canon. James, Sirius, and Kingsley are the only surviving members of this task force. James worked closely with them, for years, trying to bring about the end of Voldemort, and he watched them die while he did it. I think James holds a lot of guilt for that too. From chapter 2:

He would tell her, if she wanted to know, what he had been doing for the last five years. He would tell her of the hunt for Horcruxes and the danger and the way he missed her every day. 

He thinks about telling her, and in his head, it is inexplicably tied with her. All of these horrors he went through, and she was part of it.

The second effect this time had on him ties in well here. James always held out hope that Lily would come back to him again, and that the war could be over, and they'd make it work this time. James spent 5 years imagining what reuniting with Lily would be like without the pressure of keeping each other alive, and....none of that had a kid in it. He fought for her, and nearly died for her, and he always imagined that in the time after, they'd have this life together that was shattered when he came back and thought she found someone else.

That moment, as unreasonable as we all know it to be, made James fracture. James is nothing if not a man who loves Lily, but he never thought about losing her like that. He still wants her (as much as she wants him) but to him, it feels like a betrayal to him and to all the people who fought a war and died in that war while standing next to him.

Perhaps it's made him a bit cruel, but he doesn't mean to be. He loves so much that he doesn't know how to handle the heartbreak he's feeling. He hurts so much, but he doesn't know how to let her go. He's caught in this terrible spiral where he can't win either way--except we know what he's giving up. James doesn't, however.

I know I've mentioned this in asks before, but I actually had far more flashbacks planned out for the years between, enough to the point that I legitimately considered making a second fic to cover that time period. I think we would have seen a lot more development for James if I'd stuck to the plan that included them, but it didn't ultimately add to the story I'd set out to tell. However, if I had, that would have included:

Watching Wolfstar fall in love which only made him long for Lily more. (I have a few of these drafted if anyone wants to see it)

James got seriously injured about 3.5-4 years into the time apart. Like, Sirius pacing the halls of St. Mungos and discharing accidental magic like crazy because he thinks his brother is dying (which should inform Sirius's behavior a bit too)

Regulus showing up when he hears that James is hurt, and showing Sirius his locket-horcrux.

Regulus recognizing the curse that's killing James, and saving him.

Regulus helping them find more horcruxes, and ultimately developing a relationship with James and Sirius too (Brotherly; no Jegulus in my Jily fic!)

Dramatically watching the Prewets, Meadows, and Dearborn die.

Regulus still being killed, despite everything.

Finding out that Peter caused James's injuries and got Regulus killed

Nearly losing the war before Voldemort was finally defeated.

And two weeks later, Lily is back in town. And she has a kid that James doesn't know. And it breaks him.

He's broken. He's torn to pieces. And yet, our James is made of love and hope, and everything that is good. He just has to find that again. Perhaps in a green-eyed, messy-haired boy?

[theresthesnitch]

Hey there Snitch!!! Big OLT fan over here 👆👆 ok so here is my question, after the big father and son meeting, James is not intrigued by the fact that Lily never told him that she was pregnant in the first place? He's not mad at her at all? Just upset about being kind of an idiot? I would love to read more about his (and yours consequently) thoughts and feelings about it. And I'm guessing we going to see them talking about Harry, I was just wondering if this hasn't crossed his mind. Can't wait to the final chapter!! This is by far the fic that has instigued me the most in a very long time. Thank you for sharing it with us

Oh thank you darling! I'm so glad you love it so much. I've had this fic brewing for so long that I'm loving sharing it with you all. It's a bit bittersweet to post the final chapter and be done with it. What if I don't post Monday and just keep it open for a bit longer? 🤔 (just kidding, i wouldn't do that to you all!)

So let's talk angry James.

I had several comments and messages about how angry James would be at Lily/Mary/Remus/etc when he found out, and to me, that feels like a mischaracterization of James--at least OLT James. Maybe Ignite James, but he has way more fire and fight than OLT James. He's feeling a lot of emotions, and maybe he's a bit upset, but I don't even think that is an overwhelming feeling for him.

First, consider the moment that he figures it out. He's not talking to Lily, he's looking at his son. James, who was an only child of older parents, has always wanted kids--plural, as in a big family. He was never going to be angry about having a kid. I don't think, in that moment, he is thinking about why he didn't already know about Harry, he's just thinking I have a kid.

When Lily shows up, I think he's still in awe of Harry, who has just hugged him, and I think he picks up on the fact that Lily is upset EVEN THOUGH he doesn't know why. He does love her (despite the way he's been acting) and I think that he doesn't want to fight with her right then, especially if she's upset.

Tiny spoiler for the next chapter, but there's a small time jump before the next chapter (days, not weeks or months), and I think James had a lot of time to think (and talk to Remus and Sirius) in that time, and I think he's done a lot of thinking about how they got there. I don't think he'd blame Lily enough that he'd ever reach the point of anger.

The thing is, they both have fault here (I know the debate in the comments has been raging over Team James and Team Lily, and maybe you agree or disagree with who is MORE to blame, but they have both taken steps that prevented a resolution here). James has to take some of the blame here, and being mad at Lily would mean he'd have to at least deny that he had a part in this. (also, to be fair, James is definitely mad at himself too).

I do think they have a lot of discussions to have, and that this is definitely one that would come up. It is not in chapter 9. However, if it were to exist somewhere, it would probably look a little something like....

***

James pulls Lily closer to him, her head resting on his chest as the sweat cools on their bodies. He twirls a finger in her hair, the question lingering in his mind until it just comes out. “Did you ever think about telling me?” 

Lily turns, resting her chin on his chest so she can look at him properly. “Hm? When?”

“While you were hiding. Did you ever think about telling me? Sending an owl or something?”

“Of course I did.” Lily pushes herself up a little more, so they are face to face, and he can see the storm of emotions brewing there. “I wanted to tell you every day. If it had been any other situation, I would have told you immediately.” 

“You did?” He hates the uncertainty in his voice.

“Yes, James.” She bends to kiss him. “I wanted to, but we had just broken up because we couldn’t keep each other safe. A baby? He was safer if no one, including you, knew he existed. What if the owl was intercepted? They would have used him against you, and I couldn’t let that happen.” 

“No, I know that. I get why you made that choice.” James tucks a strand of hair behind her ear. “I guess… I just need to know that you wanted to.” 

Lily cups his face with her hand. “Every day. Every single day, I wanted to tell you. I was so afraid, and my body was changing, and I wanted to share every single moment with you. It was the best and worst time of my life.” 

“I wish I could have been there. Sometimes I wonder what it would have been like to see you pregnant.” He sees her face drop at this, and he immediately regrets it. “I’m sorry. That’s not what I meant. I don’t blame you for it.” 

“No, I know. I wish you could have been there too.” 

Lily laid her head down on his chest, and James bites back the words he wants to say. We could do it again. I can be there this time.

It’s too soon. They’ve only just started to come back to each other, to trust each other. But soon, James thinks, he’ll have to grab that ring his mother is keeping for him, the one that belonged to his grandmother and was always meant to be for Lily. Soon, they’ll talk about more. 

For now, he’s content with her and Harry, and it’s enough.

[theresthesnitch]

I know that’s probably too much to ask, but do you have some teeny tiny happy jily(or james+harry) snippet to get us through this looong weekend that stands between us and the next OLT(NE) chapter?

Ohhhhhh, yes. Absolutely. How about Jily + Harry?

A tidbit from the promised happy ending.

***

James leaned in closely, whispering like he was telling a secret. “Tell you what, why don’t you go to the kitchen and grab a bowl for me, and I’ll be in there in a few minutes to help you.”

“Alright!” Harry popped off the bed and ran for the door.

James rolled back to Lily, pressing hard against her arse again. “Where were we?”

Lily laughed. “Not anywhere close enough to finish before he comes back. Or, more likely, destroys the kitchen by making the batter himself.”

James sighed. “So you’re saying I have to get out of bed now.”

Lily rolled to face him, and pulled him down into a kiss. “I’m saying it’s in your best interest not to wait and see how many things he pulls out before he finds a bowl.”

“You’re right, as always.”

[theresthesnitch]

I might have accidentally sent my last ask on anon (it's the OLTNE crack theory where James thinks he's hallucinating Harry, Scrooge-style), apologies for that 😂

@jfleamont you did, but you have me cackling so hard.

Brb, rewriting the ending before tomorrow. 🤣

[theresthesnitch]

Me, when I started posting OLT(NE): I'm prepared for people to hate my characters.

Me, now: I'm really glad this story is done so I don't let these comments make me stop writing it.

I know today's chapter was rough. It's the low point of the story. I need you to trust me that it gets better.

[theresthesnitch]

wait wait wait!!!! WHAT IF (now hear me out) James finally pulls his head out of his ass and decides "yes, lily is it for me. i am going to love her no matter what and i will be with her and her son and i can live with that. i can build a life with her and her kid." so he GOES TO HER HOUSE and KNOCKS ON THE DOOR ready to tell her HE LOVES HER and omfgggggg harry answers.

(send me your theories on the James&Harry reveal and the Jily resolution!)

[theresthesnitch]

Betrayal.... I can somehow only hear Sirius yelling this when he finds out Remus has met Harry 😂😂 ("Remus, the absolute betrayal!")

Also that snippet of Jily + Harry made heart explode with happiness. OLT(NE) is making my October go fast and slow at the same time 🙃

Alright, so you're *correct* but you're also not. 🤣

When I titled chapter 7 Betrayal, I was actually thinking about Sirius at the end of the chapter. He asked Remus why he would betray James, but then a little black haired, green eyed kid came in, and look who is the betrayer now.

[theresthesnitch]

Just thought I should pass here and say that I am hooked in OLT (NE) and it is keeping me entertained through a serious and painful flu. Thank you! I just Monday comes soon enough for the next chapter ... or, maybe, a little snippet??? Please!

Oh no! I'm so sorry you have the flu! When you say serious and painful, I hope you mean that you're recovering at home and not in a hospital? Apparently that's happening a lot this year with non-Covid illnesses. Regardless, I wish you a speedy recovery.

As far as a snippet... Of COURSE you can have one! It's the second one of the day, but no one *minds* that right? You're all going to end up discovering how easily bullied I am if I'm not careful, but with only 3 chapters left, there's not much I can snippet without either spoilers or context, but this is from Monday's chapter. 😘

***

“Evans, wait.” She turned back to him, an expectant look on her face, and James lost his train of thought.

“Potter?”

James sighed. “Remus mentioned that he met your son.”

She crossed her arms over her chest, and raised a sardonic eyebrow. “He did.”

James ran a hand through his hair. “He didn’t tell us who the dad is, but he said he could tell as soon as he saw him.”

“I’m sure he could.” She didn’t offer anything further.

James felt his heart beating out of his chest, and he wondered if she could hear it too. “Why is his dad not in the picture?”

[theresthesnitch]

Am I late for the James-Harry meeting theory? ok ok my guess is James will go to Wolfstar flat and Sirius will open the door but won't let him in 'cause harry is there, James can hear him playing and is like wtf whats going on, so S tells him what happened with lily's parents and James goes with her because he wants to support her. L parents are ok and J and L go to J flat and L is like "i still love you I want you in my life but you have to be ok with my kid" and J is like "i love u too and i will be ok with your son tell me about him" and she just tells him and he cries and the morning after they go to pick him up and Harry cries because is really emotional over finally meeting his dad.

(not too late at all!)

(send me your theories on the James&Harry reveal and the Jily resolution!)

[theresthesnitch]

Crazy OLT(NE) theory, Remus and Sirius have to entertain Harry while Lily is at the hospital. Harry wants to draw and he draws his family, with Lily and James in love ('because mummy loves my daddy') and he secretly owls it to James when R&S are distracted. James is hella confused but that's the way he figures out that Lily's son is his son and Lily still loves him 🥰 the end

😂😂😂

(send me your theories on the James&Harry reveal and the Jily resolution!)

[theresthesnitch]

James Potter, king of forgetting the contraceptive charm

James has no idea what you're talking about. What contraception charm?

[theresthesnitch]

I think we're done with OLT theories? Yes? Maybe?

I'm so excited for tomorrow's chapter.

[theresthesnitch]

Okay, new crack theory: Lily has an accident and is brought to St Mungo’s with Harry. She is unconscious and they need someone to watch Harry and one of the healers is a former classmate and realizes Harry is James’ son and they call him. Or: Harry gets upset Lily still hasn’t brought James home like she promised him and runs away to find him.

(send me your theories on the James&Harry reveal and the Jily resolution!)

[theresthesnitch]

One of my favorite things that I’m seeing in the comments of OLT(NE) is that people are still picking sides between James and Lily, and it’s not unanimous one way or the other. I have comments saying James is unforgivable, and some saying Lily is unforgivable, and the thing is…. They’re both making poor choices, and the way you are all reacting shows that it’s not clearly black and white (and it shouldn’t be).

[theresthesnitch]

James already is a great dad 😭😭😭 but I want to grab him by the collar and shake shake shake him because he’s being so crappy to Lily. I mean, she was sobbing in Remus’s arms and he did nothing.

Okay, this has had me thinking since it came in. I don't think I agree that–in this very limited circumstance–James is being shitty to her. Here's why:

First, I don't think Lily would accept comfort from him in this situation. I think it's about half her parents (who at that moment are in the hospital and not doing well) and half James taking Harry. If he had tried, I think she would have shut down her emotions with an "I'm fine" and left.

Second, James is being dragged away by Harry, who doesn't know his mom is upset, not really. Lily blew off Harry's concerns. ("Why are you sad?" "I just love you so much.") If James stops to comfort her, Harry is going to notice and I think he prioritizes Harry in that moment over Lily.

Sort of a time and place thing....and give James a chance to support her. 😘