#I once made a joke about Cloudberry opening her mouth and olde english tumbling out

[bonefall]

Reading your post about the DOTC leaders made me wonder - in BB, when does the DOTC naming style shift into the modern naming style? If they're already using modern-style names by the time Windstar's (possible) grandson is leader, that seems pretty quick - unless Cloudberry and Ryewhisker had DOTC-style names originally, and just got called modern-style names later on.

They did originally have DOTC style names! There's going to be more shuffles soon as I move to expand the Forest Cats into a third major cultural group, but I'm planning for all three of these groups to contribute to the naming system.

The older story, which I'm going to be shuffling now, is that two-part names came from Mountain Cats, but the name changes come from Park Cats.

Mountain Cats have a given prefix, and a familial suffix.

Whichever familial suffix the kittens receive is "political." Usually the names are split evenly, so as an example, Jackdaw Cry and Hawk Swoop named one twin Lightning Cry, and the other twin Acorn Swoop, but Clear Sky insisted that ALL of his kittens receive Sky as their familial suffix. Except Thunder Storm, of course, who he disowned.

This stops being used after the collapse of the River Kingdom and the massive conflict that came from the succession crisis. After that, Byyrkabraw, directly translated as "scab-forming" and roughly translated as "nepotism," becomes a taboo to be avoided. Sharing last names with your parents and family took on a bad, biased connotation for several generations.

Thus, the system dies in Clan Culture. However, it persists and evolves in Tribe Culture! Brook's name in BB is Brook Where-It-Swirls, and she shares the last name with her two brothers. They've kept last names, but the last names have gotten longer.

What DOES remain in Clan Culture is that Mountain-descendant cats 'prefer' 2-part names, and like to say the entire thing. It's Mountain culture that creates Clanmew's preference for contractions rather than syllable-shortening.

As an example, for a long name like... Dandelionbreeze, send her back in time to talk to a Park or Forest cat and they'll shorten her name to "Dan" or "Lion" or "Bree." It's the Mountain cat who would call her "Danzy," which becomes part of being 'polite' in Clanmew name shortenings.

Park Cats are born "nameless," and earn names as they grow.

It's PARK culture that was so centralized and ceremonial, with kings and a clearer hierarchy. As kits, they're just called by a characteristic trait. The Biggest One, Little Ears, Ginger. Their first real name is given when they're assigned as an apprentice, and they become [Mentor's Nickname] [Dominant Paw].

So as an example, because the prince is always mentored by their father and the king at the time was Arc-of-Park, Riverstar's very first name was Arc's Paw.

Once they're fully trained, they can earn titles. On average, a cat will earn two or three of these in their lifetime, discounting outliers like Titles Georg. These are three words or less, and usually reference strengths and achievements. Willow Flayed Bare, Slate Keeper, The Wind Runner.

These titles are made official by the King, which is where Warrior Name changes originally stem from.

In a situation where Park Cats have left their kingdom, they will turn towards the cat they recognize as an authority to make these name changes. In WindCo, either the "parriarch" of a homestead would bestow these names, or The Wind Runner herself. Thunder Storm began doing it on request, as the Park Cats who joined his cause wanted their names to come from him.

It's not seen as "appropriate" for a cat to name themself... but there are rebellious cats, who may forge their own titles, if they're willing to eat the social implications.

River's Ripple was quite independent. He came up with his own name, and then asked his papa to make the name official. King Arc of Park argued with him a lot about this, especially because the name he chose sounded a lot like an apprentice's title, and only caved in when he realizes there would be a MASSIVE scandal if it looked like his prince would willingly bypass the will of his father entirely.

(The Wind Runner's name was "crowdsourced." She didn't give it to herself; that's what WindCo calls her.)

Forest Cat names...

So there's the two-parts from the Mountain cats, and the name changes from the Park cats... and now I'm trying to work in a third element here, which I'm still trying to figure out.

I'm thinking of putting ranks into their names, since I'm starting with a given that Slash/Shai/Silverpelt is their leader. Maybe have it so that the name the Park/Mountain cats call him is "Slashes" in reference to his leg markings, but his real name is Silver-Star, with all of his cats just referring to him as his rank, Silver (formally) or his given name, Star (informally)

(Over time his name is going to become Silverpelt. They believe that he became heaven itself. Ssoen becomes Clanmew's opening particle for omnipotent knowledge, Star becoming the leader suffix.)

Then make it so that his followers follow the Rank-Given name system. So there's Claw-Milkweed, her daughter Kit-Bramble, a good hunter might be Whisker-Violet. So, over a very short number of generations, both the Forest Cat and Park Cat naming systems start to meld, since it's not all that different.

ALSO NOTEWORTHY: The Wind Coalition was more mixed with Forest Cats than the River Kingdom was. So the Park/Forest name schemes beginning to mix together would be beginning up on the Moor, while there would be more Mountain/Forest mixing happening in Thunder's Clan.

This is a WIP section btw, these guys are still extremely new.

Anyway, skip forward a few generations

Cloudberry's and Ryewhisker's names aren't the ones they had in life. The were active 25-ish years after DOTC, after the collapse of the River Kingdom when things had begun to "settle down."

With the Law of the Deputy, Commandment 3, WindCo and River Kingdom are now Clans. They operate with a Leader and a Deputy.

In-canon, Cloudberry is the daughter of the RiverClan leader, Emberstar. I'm not sure if that's going to remain; because I still haven't chosen who Riverstar's successor is. The Law of Loyalty is Commandment 4 and I'm committed to Duststar of WindClan being alive and in a position of power during the succession crisis.

It could be that Cloudberry's father is Riverstar's successor, OR I swap Ryewhisker to be Duststar's son/grandson instead and include a small detail that Duststar feels a need to prove he's NOT being biased in favor of his dead descendant by forcing this commandment through.

Maybe both, that could be fun. Romeow and Mewliet type thing. Two Clans, alike in their digkitty.

Anyway, point being, Cloudberry is from Park Cat culture as a member of RiverClan, which was heavily influenced by some pretty open travel between the groups under Riverstar's rule. The modern naming system was coming together, as cats of these three cultures mixed, but it wasn't quite there yet. So Cloudberry probably had a full title, while Ryewhisker had a title and a rank.

It might even be a translation quirk. Cloudberry is also called "knout," and it's a red-orange fruit that comes to be heavily valued in the Clans. Knout Berry Keeper, which is only remembered as Knout-Berry, written as Cloudberry.

(It would be cute if the direct translation was Cloudberry Cloud.)

For Ryewhisker, the most I know with him is that he's somehow related to the guy who invents Tunnelbuns, or at LEAST some kind of inventive contributor (such as a person who invents bread). He gets his name from that-- Rye is one of the most easily accessible grains.

I haven't nailed their names down yet, since by the modern era, they're known as Cloudberry and Ryewhisker. But they did actually have different names, which have changed over the years.

They also didn't speak Modern Clanmew, their native tongue was actually the border between the Mountain/Park/Forest pidgin and the creole language that would soon be born! A linguist might describe it as Ancient Clanmew.