#I feel like if your choosing a character for their pristine morals this isn't the show for you

[bless-the-telephone]

I understand "I love to hate Lestat" fans but I could never be one. I love her and all her atrocities against humanity.

[obae-me]

Yes! Finally someone said it!

At first when I saw the interaction I went- hey he's being such a jerk- Ohhhhh wait! This is literally him wanting us to stay soo fricking bad, but Mr.Pridey McPridepants just can't admit it. OFC HE WOULD TRY TO IMPRESS US (even if this emotionally constipated man can't differ b/w chivalry and being an asshole). He's trying to so bloody hard to sweet talk his way into us staying. Even if he's being forceful and manipulative; it's because he's so shit scared of giving us the choice and then us choosing to go cuz he KNOWS wherever we going must mean a lot to us especially when we are going such great lengths to return.

Not to say, that this behavior is ok or good but at the end of the day isn't obey me about flawed and morally grey characters? Even the ANGELS aren't perfect and morally sound, and if I dare say, sometimes they make decisions even crueler than the demons. We are literally talking about the AVATAR OF PRIDE HERE! XD

Literally as soon as you look past the image that he literally puts up cuz he wants ppl to see him that way, you will realize that he really is just a soggy, pathetic man who can't put aside his pride to ask us to stay like a normal person XD Also to point out a lot of ppl LIKE Levi and Mammon BECAUSE OF their pathos lol.

I have always seen that there is SUCH a double standard when it comes to him. Ppl say that he's being too fake and only cares about his image and not his brothers, but when he does show his softer side, they say he's not being genuine or he's pushy or something of the sort. What most ppl fail to see is that he loves his brothers and mc, probably even more than his own life but he's just so bad at showing it because he is held back by his own trauma and sin. While that does not make him innocent... that does make him like his brothers. He acts this way because thats literally the only way he knows how to keep things in his control and keep his family safe and ppl fall for it ... LIKE IT'S NOT THE REAL HIM! TvT

I have this theory (might be a hot take idk?) that most of the ppl playing obey me are pretty young, so they don't like Lucifer because they are anti-authority (I also am, its not a bad thing) but this man is anything but Authority and Power. I might be a lucifer apologist lol but all I am saying is for ppl to look at him with the same open-minded lens they see the other brothers with and you might find him a lot more bearable and dare I say... likeable?

Phew, sorry for rambling in your inbox but I have some strong feelings for that stupid old man XD Also, this feels a lot similar to how expectations are so high and rigid for the eldest sibling whereas these same expectations become a lot less severe for the other siblings...

Firstly, thank you for calling him a soggy pathetic man, that gave me a good chuckle.

And YES! All of this, 100% yes. He doesn't want to admit that there are other things out there more important than him. Not just because of his Pride, but because he finally let someone else behind the walls he put up around his heart (we saw this around Nightbringer lessons 11 and 12, when he was ready to be THE enemy to protect his family, only to end up admitting to himself that he cared about MC just as much) and now, after all that, MC is determined to leave. I'm sure somewhere in his mind, he feels like he's failed.

He's puffing up his feathers as big as he can and screaming "look at me, look at me, look at me"! The big peacock man is flailing.

He's afraid. He's hurt. And so now these weird (and problematic) safety mechanisms are being put in place to protect himself.

Things in his mind are SO 'not fine' that now he's parading around trying to convince everyone (including himself) that everything is perfectly fine! Everything is perfect, everything is great, the outfits he chose are pristine, the food he settled on is text-book. It feels like he's following some sort of guide, like even the things he's saying have been pulled from a novel somewhere. It's not quite the way he normally speaks. If everything can play out the way he sees it in his head, there won't be room for error. Right?

And this isn't new behavior either. It was the ENTIRE plot of season 1 in Shall We Date. Lucifer locked Belphie away because he was worried of what might happen to his sibling. But in a way, 'protecting' his brother was mostly protecting himself.

He's worked so hard to create what he has, that he can't stand the idea of losing it all.

There's also a whole spiel I could go into about how everyone in the family fills a certain "group" role that keeps everything balanced and running smoothly (as smooth as it can get for them). For example, Mammon is the energy of the group, the drive. Beel is the motivator, the encourager. Asmo is the dreamer, etc. Lucifer has to be the guider, the manager, the authoritarian.

While, yes on multiple occasions, he's dismissed his brother's wild antics outright, there have been so many other instances where his brothers say "I want ___" and he gives them the advice or the structure they need to accomplish it successfully. OR even ending up providing it himself should his brother's wishes be genuine (Mammon's car for example).

When he's more on his own, he can drop that uptightness completely. As we see again in Shall We Date, when they're taken to the video game world, and when he doesn't have the worries and responsibilities placed onto his shoulders, he's capable of skipping classes to take a nap on the roof. And fully enjoys it, with a smile on his face and everything.

At the very root of him, while he needs to fulfill the controlling dynamic, he does not want to. At least not completely.

I've always known this, but Nightbringer actually gave me a big confirmation boost! In Wanders Whereabouts, Barbatos gives Lucifer a video call in which he tells Lucifer about all the recent trouble the brothers have gotten themselves into. Barbatos then proceeds to let Lucifer know that as their guardian, the eldest needs to essentially work harder to keep them in line. Then Barbatos sends the damages bill to him.

If he isn't constantly keeping his siblings in line, he takes most of the blame!

And thirdly, I think you are correct, yes. I think especially with the addition of Nightbringer and the anime, a good portion of the fandom is a younger demographic, which doesn't surprise me (listen I played Mystic Messenger when I was a preteen/teen, I was there when the dark texts were written). And a lot of what appeals to that demographic is the coming-of-age, rebelling against conformity sort of story.

And, I want to repeat, my initial post that you are referring to wasn't meant to come off as a "oh everyone is so stupid thinking Lucifer is this way, you should all love him" but more of trying to explain the fullness of his character since it can be harder to spot.

Like, people in the fandom almost always completely understand Mammon. He's not just, "tough and grumbly man who steals things". He's someone who struggles with admitting his own feelings, someone who lets his ambitions blind him from the troubles they can cause, and someone who at the end of the day, loves his family more than anything. And most everyone in the fandom fully understands this.

And yet, with Lucifer, a lot of people tend to take him exactly at face value.

There's a lot of things I could explain about him needing to play a "Parental Guardian Figure" while also just being their brother at the same time, and in a lot of media where the older sibling is forced to become a guardian, they get a lot of flack for not doing it correctly.

Anyways, I could ramble on and on and on about Lucifer as a character, but I think this a good chunk of condensed thoughts. And thank you for sending this over, I always love a good Inbox ramble! Especially about my favorite grumpy, sleep-deprived man <3