#ASOIAF shipping

[horizon-verizon]

Okay everyone, Mysaria is NOT trying to manipulate Rhaenyra!!!

[cynicalclassicist]

Yeh, I can see that with ASOIAF ships.

Or Doctor Who.

a ship where i see what people see but it is simply not very interesting to me personally it’s like

[motorway-south]

its so funny that s1 criston is like "can we run away together" and rhaenyra rejects him and s2 alicent is like "can we run away together" and rhaenyra rejects her and s2 larys is like "can we run away together" and aegon is like yk why the hell not??

[fshfish]

redraw of an older piece!

dialogue was going to be:

"you betrayed me, my Queen.

Do you know what happens to traitors?"

[horizon-verizon]

Well, Criston wanted her to give up everything so he can maintain a belief in his own honor. 

Daemon wants her as she was is and even stronger and more powerful after becoming queen. 

Also, Criston was Kingsguard, not high enough of birth/“blood” to be married to a princess even without, and thus unmarriable. To marry him was to elope and lose everything (again, he expects her to do this?! that’s not love).

Daemon is marriable because Targs/Valyrian dragonlords married sibs and uncle/nieces or nieces/nephews, is a prince, was definitely going to support her and her kids’ claims on the basis of their existing and long emotional connection and the feudal value placed of blood relations that marriage is supposed to be used for, and was single [by episode 5].

BTW, Westerosi lords can marry their first cousins.The Faith allows it and doesn’t rule it incest (Sources: 1 & 2) : 

However in Westeros incest is only applied if father lays with daughter, mother lays with son, or brother to sister, and the children of such unions are considered abominations.

Joanna and Tywin Lannister are an example of first cousins marrying.

Other first cousin marriages:

Viserys I and Aemma Arryn

Rickard and Lyanna Stark

[proposed] Robert Arryn and Sansa Stark

There are even two avunvulate marriages within the Stark house: Jonnel and Sansa Stark [uncle and niece], Serena and Edric Stark [uncle and niece].

But I also don’t like overall how HotD’s Daemon & Rhaenyra’s characterizations are written. They are too obsessed or fixated on Viserys and rhaenyra doesn’t express and act as if she has agency. The Daemyra content was good enough to merit content, but it could have been much better if the characters were written better and with less prejudice.

Rhaenyra denied Ser Crispin when he asked her to run away with him. But when Daemon showed up to the rehearsal dinner she was ready to drop everything and go to Dragonstone and marry him

what am i supposed to do with this information

[ladystoneboobs]

so, one aspect of catelyn which i think is underrated (certainly the biggest adaptation loss which nobody talks about) is her, let's say superstitiousness, or better yet, let's call it genre-savviness, being one of the few adult characters open to magic and the supernatural in this fantasy world. we first meet her in the godswood, home of gods which are not truly hers, yet she is still very aware of their power. when she and ned talk of the deserter he killed, he hopes he won't have to go with the nw to deal with mance rayder, but she has even more fear of that idea bc there are worse things beyond the wall than just wildlings. ned scoffs and says she's been listening to old nan too much, but she's right. we already know from the prologue that she's right! and here she is, understanding the genre of their world better than her husband, who was actually born and spent his earliest years in this northern land of deep magic, listening to old nan's stories. same with the direwolves, where she was uncomfortable with them at first, but later believed in them as guardians from the old gods even after robb had lost his own faith. and once again, we know she's right even if she doesn't know the evidence to back up her instincts, bc summer and shaggydog did not fail bran and rickon and robb was almost certainly a warg like his brothers. (perhaps making it more fitting that she's the one brought back as a fantasy vengeance monster, not ned and robb, the most unbelieving dead starks.) and in her 2nd agot chapter, everyone focuses on her ambition in wanting ned to agree to the hand job (pun intended) and sansa's betrothal, and while she does recognize the value of their daughter being a future queen more than ned does, that's only her stated argument bc she thinks it's rational enough for ned to listen to. (if ambitious matchmaking were as important to her as to her father she never would have made those frey betrothals fandom loves to blame her for.) in her own head there's a deeper urge driving her. she keeps thinking of the dead direwolf with antlers in its throat, an omen which filled her with dread from the first she heard of it, before robert's arrival, and thinking of it again is what makes her desperate to convince ned not to refuse robert. she had to make him see. and really, she's not wrong, as jon snow would say. the dead direwolf was an omen of ned and robert getting each other killed. it's just one of those misread portents, with no way of knowing the danger to ned was in his loyalty to robert, not conflict with him. BUT the next time she's dealing with baratheons, she knows exactly what she's talking about. it's catelyn, not brienne, who sees the shadow slaying renly, and explains that it was stannis who did that through some dark magic. with no way of knowing how it was achieved and no prior expectation that such a thing were ever possible, she realizes with no hestitation that stannis was guilty and that his red witch was capable of pulling this off somehow. really, the only instinct of the supernatural she's wholly wrong about is her insistence that varys gathered his knowledge through some dark enchantment. however, though that might offend varys, given his own personal experience with a sorcerer, i'd say it's a reasonable assumption without knowing the dude had children moving through walls everywhere like oversized rodents. and imo it just shows she had a healthy respect and awe for varys's power which most other characters lack.

oh, oh, and let's not forget that she also believed in the curse of harrenhal, from her own childhood and the stories old nan told her kids. "and every house that held Harrenhal since had come to misfortune. Strong it might be, but it was a dark place, and cursed. 'I would not have Robb fight a battle in the shadow of that keep,' Catelyn admitted." sure, that wasn't enough to save robb, but he did not die from the curse of harrenhal. that doom was meant for his enemies from tywin lannister to roose bolton.

[mneiai]

Since Snow is Jon's actual name and "Stormborn" is just Daenerys' nickname, whenever people use "Stormborn" as the ship name, I think they're shipping Jon Snow/Edric Storm.

[horizon-verizon]

One thing I have noticed is how Jon’s stans want him to have this really powerful bond with Daenerys’ dragons but I have NEVER seen them talk that way about Daenerys and Ghost. You’ll see Stark fans theorize or make fanfiction/fanart of the Starks having her dragons or being part of the Three Heads or taking Daenerys’s prophecies but you’ll never see anyone claim Daenerys will warg Ghost or another direwolf. I couldn’t care less about the direwolves but I found that quite interesting.

Jonerys is all about co-opting Daenerys’ Targaryen identity for Jon. Or make it seems like they are both leaders, when in reality what Daenerys is doing in Essos, in Meereen, just stomps on EVERYTHING Jon does (did since he’s dead, murdered by his own men, lmao). It’s just just about giving Jon access to Daenerys’ dragons and groundbreaking accomplishments & storyline. Ship trash as hell, by shipping them (or pretending to because they are quick to throw Daenerys under the bus, they just want to use her as a self insert), Jon’s stans can elevate him through Daenerys.

From what I have also seen of the most of the Jon stanning Jonerys shippers so far, I must agree. Part of it is that in real life, men also can't be much of anything professionally nor domestically without leaching off of their female partners and family members, so of course we have people do the same with fictional characters. Apparently in the U.S. men are more likely to get promotions and shit when they have children or get married or even just move in with a woman whereas it's the reverse for women. Still, bc it's tacitly expected the woman would be the one performing much domestic labor and birthing children that "depend" on the man's income. You'd think BOTH would get the promo for the household to get even more $, but nah...bc women are the main consumers but also the expected ones to consistently consume products for their households, children, etc.

Aside from Nymeria and Ghost--the dogs themselves, but in the case of Nym, the relationship w/Arya, I am in anticipation of seeing again in the books--the direwolves of ASoIaF don't really intrigue me all that much. And it could be bc we haven't gone anywhere away from Bran using Summer to warg AND I don't see how they'd be involved with the coming war to this day.

[horizon-verizon]

Blame @la-pheacienne for my recent bout of Daemyra TV posts.

DAEMYRA + KISSES

1.04 “king of the narrow sea” | 1.07 “driftmark”

[dob-the-destroyer]

good to see that the mcu is finally tapping into one of the most reliable markets ever: lesbians!

[tidetower]

The Prince of the Hightower and the Heir to High Tide

Artist: erchitos

[horizon-verizon]

Links to Where the Quotes OP Lists comes from

ONE

TWO

THREE

Where do these come from, and I mean, who wrote these exact words?:

Rhaegar, the emo Prince, who was said to have been never truly happy, named the place he stayed at with Lyanna the “Tower of Joy.”

Dany seeing a blue flower growing out of a wall of ice, which filled the air with sweetness in the HotU during the love section of her visions. It's a clear hint of Jon Snow being the love child of Rhaegar and Lyanna who will likely also be Dany’s third and final husband.

The author refers to Rhaegar as a “love struck prince.”

And of course, we have this official new artwork by Justin Sweet, one that GRRM personaly commissioned, which frankly gives me some misguided hope that TWOW is nearly upon us. lol

This was so insightful!

I love the interplay of light and dark given what we know of these characters: Rhaegar with his sense of grief/doom is fully in the shade of the enormous heart tree while Lyanna is in the half-light half-dark, perhaps representing her own more optimistic and less convoluted worldview. She's exploring, finding balance; he's watching and seeing something he admires that somehow exists in all the twists and inescapable turns of the forest engulfing them. The third 'person' in the art is the heart tree itself, old/wise/frowning, but also cradling both Lyanna and Rhaegar. They're both connected to it, representing in a sense that their fates are sealed and known. This is a stolen moment they're having (it's a false spring) but despite the simplicity it's still connected to the much larger world around them.

Do you think that Lyanna and Rhaegar were seriously in love?

Yes. It’s literally so plain to see, you have to dig your nails deep in denial to think otherwise. You can read between the lines that GRRM wrote them as lovers.

GRRM has described himself as a romantic and ultimately R+L will be framed romantically (yes yes it has problematic implications when you think about it, but so do many other relationships that the series frames romantically, not least because these books were written with thirty-year-old sexual mores).

He dies with her name on his lips, she with his roses in her hand.

The subversion of “dragon kidnaps girl and valiant lover knight fights a war to save his beloved from her tower” when in truth the “knight” turns out to be a bit of a manwhoring douch who slept with every woman he came across, and the girl loved the dragon he slayed.

The gender subversion of the beautiful Princess with the beautiful voice and the valiant knight who stands up for the weak.

The tale of Bael the Bard, in which a Stark maid associated with winter roses disappears with a singer and comes back with their son. A male relative takes part in his killing and presents it to her as some kind of victory, but it actually breaks her heart, and she dies “by tower”.

Lyanna being heavily asscoicated to Winter Roses which were given to her by non other than Rhaegar Targaryen when he named her his Queen of Love and Beauty. Roses in general are a symbol of love while the blue rose adds a hint of mystique and in attanining the impossible.

Rhaegar, the emo Prince, who was said to have been never truly happy, named the place he stayed at with Lyanna the “Tower of Joy.”

Dany seeing a blue flower growing out of a wall of ice, which filled the air with sweetness in the HotU during the love section of her visions. It's a clear hint of Jon Snow being the love child of Rhaegar and Lyanna who will likely also be Dany’s third and final husband.

Ned confronts Robert about not truly loving Lyanna, because he only ever saw her beauty and not the Iron underneath- it’s implied that the big moment between Rhaegar and Lyanna was meeting her as a Knight who valiantly defended the honor of the weak, not some lovely little maiden spotted at a feast as she would have been to Robert.

The author refers to Rhaegar as a “love struck prince.”

And of course, we have this official new artwork by Justin Sweet, one that GRRM personaly commissioned, which frankly gives me some misguided hope that TWOW is nearly upon us. lol

I love the interplay of light and dark given what we know of these characters: Rhaegar with his sense of grief/doom is fully in the shade of the enormous heart tree while Lyanna is in the half-light half-dark, perhaps representing her own more optimistic and less convoluted worldview. She's exploring, finding balance; he's watching and seeing something he admires that somehow exists in all the twists and inescapable turns of the forest engulfing them.

The third 'person' in the art is the heart tree itself, old/wise/frowning, but also cradling both Lyanna and Rhaegar. They're both connected to it, representing in a sense that their fates are sealed and known. This is a stolen moment they're having (it's a false spring) but despite the simplicity it's still connected to the much larger world around them.

Another point I like is the lack of sigil etc. on their clothing—we know who they are but the interaction is not one of Targaryen to Stark on it's face. [there's also this other art by the same artist which parallels Lyanna and Jon's poses + Rhaegar and Jon's clothes

LAST AND MOST IMPORTANT THOUGH: the blue roses at the bottom that are firmly in the light.

Conclusion: Rhaegar and Lyanna were intended to be your classical tragic love story; think Romeo and Juliet or Tristan and Isolde and whatnot, not Rhaegar kidnapping some random girl to have a Visenya. Although Rhaegar’s desire to have a third child probably pushed him into pursuing his passion in running off with ‘his Lady Lyanna’ too use some of Ser Barristan words here.

[wodania]

green king and black queen, brother and sister

[targsource]

Lord Commander and the Dragon Queen

by nataa.draws on instagram

[horizon-verizon]

there is a strong line b/t domestic abuse that did not happen or was described in-text vs an author's weirdness abt rape (Daenerys-Drogo) he clearly wrote as r*pe but denies when it's depicted as r*pe.

daemyra could have been reported as abusive--the greens would have spread that around like wildfyre; the sources and maesters writing F&B would also take that opp...nothing of the sort is mentioned. At the same time, aegon's 12 year old, not even denied by his supporter & PR handler, Septon Eustace. HotD had a free choice unlike with Dany-Drogo--to not have DV where there was none. they decided different.

daemyra is unhealthy in its setup and bc who these people were/came to be, but not necessarily abusive in canon. dissimilar things.

"You may have valid reasons to not like this fictional relationship. But it doesn’t make that relationship meaningless or unimportant or not real within the story." [yep, thats' what I've been trying to get across]

Actually Daemon and Rhaenyra is a love story. It’s not a romance HEA love story, it’s a fucked up love story set in a world were love is nearly impossible to maintain.

When we talk about love being written into another genre people tend to dismiss that it is love entirely because it’s hard to accept that literature can be layered. That it can have more than one point.

The Dance is not a love story. It’s a war story. A war story that centers around a patriarchal society’s misogyny.

So what does a love story, especially between a woman grasping for power among men who don’t want her to have it and a man who is essentially the first man ever in this society to be in a subservient position to his wife, look like in a war story?

It’s going to look tense and violent at times. It’s going to cause these characters to have their own internal conflicts within themselves as they try to navigate their relationship and what it means in their world. It’s going to mirror the other themes of the war itself and it’s going to show us how war and separation and loss and grief all impact a romantic relationship.

It’s not going to look like what romance novels have taught us love should look like.

But neither does reality right?

I completely get not wanting to ship a toxic incest ship! Like I get it!

But that doesn’t mean you can remove that there is love in that relationship. It’s important to the characters and who they are that they are in love with one another.

Because that motivates their actions. That drives their desires. That is the root of so many other emotions that these two will be going through.

I see a lot people try to dismiss the relationship within the character’s individual arcs. But you can’t do that because it’s built in.

The story - especially what we have coming up - can’t work if you remove that relationship.

So I need people to essentially accept that you may not like something. You may have valid reasons to not like this fictional relationship. But it doesn’t make that relationship meaningless or unimportant or not real within the story.

[horizon-verizon]

The randomness of Alicole suddenly having nonstop sex makes sense when you remember these writers want to put a stop to Rhaenicent.

They were all for queerbaiting but there was no way in hell they were actually going to make any of their leads queer even if George's books suggest Rhaenyra's bisexuality.

So the very first scene of Alicent is her getting eaten out by Cole, just to remind the audience she's straight and is sexually attracted to man not her stepdaughter.

This has less to do with "is this realistic for the characters?" and more "will this put an end to fan specualtion about the character's sexuality?".

Never considered this. Could be both simultaneously: to make Alicent is straight thing obvious by the frequency of alicole's sex AND the existence of the ship itself becoming HotD canon bc of Alicent given something more to do. But you make great points, anon.