@general-illyrin @tar-thelien @who-needs-words I think you all mentioned being interested in the reverse gondolin au - is anyone interested in helping with wrangling the timelines, especially the second age stuff? Here's the current outline:
(Edit: anyone feel free to help out if you're interested!)
YT 14365 - Birth of Lomion
YT 14373/FA 1 - Death of Argon
FA
2 - Aredhel adopts Lomion
300 - Birth of Idril
316 - Turgon & Idril kidnapped by Eol
400 - Turgon & Idril rescued. Death of Eol
465 - Finrod more-peacefully passes throne to orodreth while on Quest. Everyone except beren still dies
472 - Nirnaeth. Turgon named High King of the Noldor.
476 - Turgon abdicates official title. Aredhel named High King of the Noldor.
496 - Tuor comes to Gondolin
502 - Wedding of Idril and Tuor
503 - Births of Earendil and Elwing. Idril begins to have foresight dreams about the Fall.
506 - Second Kinslaying. C^3 dead, celebrimbor stays in gondolin. Aredhel denounces the oath/kinslaying and disowns C^3
Elwing survives & is found by Oropher & Thranduil // Galadriel & Celeborn. oropher, thranduil, oropher's wife, and thranduil's then-gf // galadriel & celeborn take Elwing to Gondolin as refugees. The Silmaril is left hidden in the woods of melian's domain.
507 - Elwing comes to Gondolin.
509 - Idril captured by Morgoth. Idril reveals the location of Gondolin in exchange for an Oath to not harm her family (Turgon, Tuor, and Earendil). Idril rescued.
510 - Gondolin prepares for war with Morgoth.
513-522 - Siege of Gondolin. Deaths of Duilin and Rog. Gothmog slain by Aredhel the Huntress. First use of the Three Rings by Lomion and Celebrimbor in defense of Gondolin. House of the Hammer of Wrath destroyed.
523 - Maedhros believes a Silmaril is with Elwing at Gondolin.
525 - Earendil weds Elwing. Lomion weds ???. Adoption of Gil-Galad
532 - Births of Elrond and Elros.
538 - Third Kinslaying at Gondolin. Death of Amras. Elrond and Elros kidnapped by Maglor. Deaths of Elwing and Turgon. Second use of the Three Rings by Lomion and Celebrimbor. Deaths of Maedhros and Aredhel. Lomion named King of Gondolin and High King of the Noldor. Deaths of Salgant, Penlod, and Tuor. Earendil named Lord of the House of the Wing.
540-549 - War declared between Gondolin and the Feanorians of Himring over the Third Kinslaying and kidnapping of Princes Elrond and Elros.
549 - Elrond and Elros recovered. Feanorians and Gondolin severely weakened. Celebrimbor // Gil-Galad declared heir to the High Kingship.
552-554 - Second Siege & Fall of Gondolin. Third use of the Three Rings by Lomion and Celebrimbor. Deaths of Ecthelion, Glorfindel, Egalmoth, and Turgon. Idril and Celebrimbor lead survivors through the Secret Way.
555 - Gondolithlim refugees arrive at Sirion.
556 - Idril departs for Valinor.
558 - Earendil searches for Valinor.
560 - Havens of Sirion destroyed by Morgoth. Gondolithlim/Doriathrim survivors scattered. Elrond and Elros rescued (as adults) by Maglor.
572 - Morgoth controls Beleriand. Earendil and reembodied Elwing come to Valinor and rally the Host.
575-617 - War of Wrath
618 - Maglor claims the Silmaril from Eonwe's camp and casts himself into the Sea. Death of Maglor.
620 - End of the First Age.
SA
1 - Founding of the Grey Havens and Lindon under High King Lomion
2 - Elros becomes the first King of Numenor
c. 500 - Sauron returns to Middle-Earth in the East.
650 - Eregion is founded
1000 - Galadriel is given Vilya; Lomion wields Nenya
1170 - Annatar comes to Lindon and Lomion turns him away. Lomion warns Celebrimbor of Eregion of his suspicions.
1200 - Annatar comes to Eregion. Celebrimbor takes him in to monitor.
1250 - Celebrimbor creates the Seven; Lomion creates the Nine.
1410 - Annatar is kicked out of Eregion.
1600 - The One Ring is forged. Sauron remains in hiding.
1610 - Sauron begins to gather and prepare armies in the East.
1673 - War of the Elves and Sauron begins.
1675 - Sauron invades Eriador.
1677 - Fall of Ost-in-Edhil. Celebrimbor and Lomion remain at the House of the Mirdain. Death of Celebrimbor in battle // Fourth use of the Three in battle. Sauron does not learn of the Seven. Founding of Imladris.
1678 - Sauron defeated by the Numenoreans and the Elves of Lindon.
1679 - Sauron flees to Mordor. First White Council held.
3147 - Civil war in Numenor.
3225 - Ar-Pharazon seizes the Sceptre.
3228 - Elrond claims the Sceptre. Ar-Pharazon disowned. Tar-Miriel named Ruling Queen.
3232 - Sauron taken to Numenor as a prisoner.
3274 - Elrond kicks Sauron out of Numenor and outlaws the morgoth cult.
3310 - Morgoth cult publicly reappears.
3319 - Downfall of Numenor. Tar-Miriel leads a greater force of the Faithful away.
(green // blue means two main options, red means i need to think about it more)
The main details I'm figuring out right now are
does Celebrimbor still die at Eregion - I don't think he's getting captured/tortured, but he could still die in the battle. On the other hand, he could probably survive by using Narya & Lomion using Nenya, but that would definitely have repercussions further down the line
how does Idril's deal work - I'm currently thinking of Idril exchanging the location of Gondolin for her family's guaranteed safety, because it seems in character for Reverse Idril? But on the other hand, even if I limit it to immediate family at the time of the oath (tuor, turgon, earendil) then idk where turgon dies? Maybe Maglor can kill him but that seems kind of random
where and how does Turgon die
how does Prince Elrond's character even work
how does Numenor still fall when factoring in Prince Elrond - I'm thinking that the morgoth death cult gained enough traction during the time sauron was there that even after Elrond kicks him out, the cult still sticks around and reemerges later? The Fall still happens, but they never go to attack valinor and there's a good deal more Faithful (maybe 40-60%?)
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Jason Todd Reading List
Pre-Crisis Robin
(this includes his origin, how he becomes Robin, and what happens to this version of Jason in the Pre-Crisis Timeline)
Batman #357-399 (1983-1986)
Detective Comics #524-567 (1983-1986)
Batman #400-403 (1986-1987)
Crisis on Infinite Earths #5, #9, #11-12 (1985-1986)
Post Crisis Robin
(includes his origin, how he becomes Robin and his death - i tried to have this chronologically according to when these events take place so that means the publishing order is a bit weird)
Nightwing #103-106
- Collected as Nightwing: Year One
Batman #402-403, #408-425, #430-431
Batman Annual #10-12
Tales of the Teen Titans #86-91
Legends
Detective Comics #575-578
Batman: Full Circle
Superman Annual #11 (1985)
Blue Devil #19 (1986)
New Teen Titans #18-31 (1986-1987)
Action Comics #556, #594
Batman: The Cult
Batman: A Death in the Family
Post Death Mentions
(includes any mentions, memories or appearances of Jason's "ghost" after his death. honestly, you don't need to read these to follow along for Jason's storyline but they show how those who cared about him dealt with his death.)
Batman #432-435, #496 (1987-1993)
Detective Comics #606, #609 (1989)
Underworld Unleashed #2 (1995)
Batman/Demon (1996)
Nightwing #10 (1997)
Batman: Legends of the Dark Knight #100 (1997)
Nightwing: Secret Files and Origins (1999)
Jokers Last Laugh (2001)
Joker: Last Laugh Secret Files and Origins (2001)
Deadman: Dead Again (2001)
Batman: Gotham Knights 16, #34, #43-45 (2001-2003)
JLA Avengers #2 (2003)
Batman: Gotham Country line (2005)
Detective Comics #790 (2004)
Batman #620-630 (2004)
Red Hood
Red Hood: The Lost Days
- This is before Jason returns to Gotham as the Red Hood. It shows a bit of what he did after coming back to life
Hush/Batman #608-619 (2002-2003)
Batman: Under the Red Hood
Teen Titans V2 #29
Nightwing V2 #118-124
- collected in - Nightwing: Brothers in Blood
Outsiders V3 #44-46
Outsiders V3 Annual 1
Green Arrow V3 #69-72
Countdown to Final Crisis:
Countdown to Final Crisis #51 (2007)
Teen Titans #47 (2007)
Countdown to Final Crisis #50-33 (2007)
All New Atom #13-15 (2007)
Countdown to Final Crisis #31-1 (2007-2008)
Battle for the Cowl:
Robin #177, #182-183 (2008-2009)
Azrael: Deaths Dark Knight #3 (2009)
Batman: Battle for the Cowl (2009)
Batman and Robin #3-6, #23-25 (2009-2011)
New 52 Red Hood
Batman #0
Secret Origins #5
Red Hood and The Outlaws V1 #1-14 (2011-2015)
DC Universe Presents #17 (2015)
Batman: Death of the Family:
Batman #13-15
Red Hood and The Outlaws #15
Teen Titans #15
Batman #16
Red Hood and The Outlaws #16
Teen Titans #16
Batman #17
Red Hood and The Outlaws #17 (2013)
Batman and Robin #10-12, #17 (2012-2013)
Batman Inc (2012-2013)
Red Hood and The Outlaws #18 (2013)
Justice League #19 (2013)
Batman and Robin #20 (2013)
Supergirl #35 (2014)
Batman/Superman Annual 1 (2014)
Action Comics #34 (2014)
Action Comics Annual 3 (2014)
Batman and Robin #33-37 (2014-2015)
Red Hood and The Outlaws #19 (2013)
Red Hood and The Outlaws Annual 1 (2013)
Red Hood and The Outlaws #20-40 (2013-2015)
Batman Eternal #10-12,#15 ,#18-20 ,#25 ,#26 ,#28 (2014-2015)
Grayson #12 (2015)
Deathstroke V3 #15-16 (2014)
Batman/Superman #25-27 (2014)
Red Hood/Arsenal #1-6 (2015)
Batman and Robin Eternal (2015-2016)
Robin War:
Robin War #1 (2015)
Grayson #15 (2015)
Detective Comics #47 (2015)
Red Hood/Arsenal #7 (2015)
We are Robin #7 (2015)
Robin: Son of Batman #7 (2015)
Robin War #6 (2016)
Red Hood/Arsenal #8-13 (2015-2016)
Rebirth Red Hood
(current continuity)
Red Hood and The Outlaws V2 #1-6
Batman #16
Nightwing #15 (2017)
Trinity Annual 1
Trinity #12-15 (2017)
- This and Trinity Annual 1 is also known as Dark Destiny Arc
Red Hood and The Outlaws #7-18
Red Hood and The Outlaws Annual 1
Batman #33 (2017)
Detective Comics #967-968 (2017)
New Talent Showcase (2017)
Batman and The Signal #1, #3 (2018)
Batman: Prelude to the Wedding: Red Hood vs Anarky
Red Hood and The Outlaws #26-31
Red Hood and The Outlaws Annual 2
Teen Titans #22 (2018)
Teen Titans Annual 1 (2019)
Red Hood: Outlaw #31-36
- Continuing on from the Red Hood and The Outlaws comics but Jason is on his own now.
Red Hood: Outlaw Annual 3
Event Leviathan #2-3 (2019)
Harley Quinn: Villain of the Year (2019)
Red Hood: Outlaw #37-47
Batman: Alfred R.I.P #1 (2020)
Robin 80th Anniversary (2020)
Joker War:
Nightwing #72 (2020)
Red Hood: Outlaw #49 (2020)
Batman #100 (2020)
Detective Comics #1030-1033 (2020)
Teen Titans #45 (2020)
Red Hood: Outlaw #50-52 (2020)
Batman: Urban Legends #1-6
Truth & Justice #10-12
Batman Secret Files: Clownhunter #1
Robin #5 (2021)
Nightwing Annual 1
Detective Comics #1041-1043, #1052, #1057
Task Force Z #1-12 (2021-2022)
The Joker: The Man Who Stopped Laughing #2-10 (2022-2023)
- This is still ongoing, I will update when new issues that Jason appears in is published - in 6 and 7 Jason is only there for a few panels
Batman: Legends of Gotham (2023)
Lazarus Planet: Next Evolution (2023)
Batman 136 (2023)
Knight Terrors: Robin (2023)
Gotham War: ongoing
Batman/Catwoman: The Gotham War: Prelude [2023]
Batman/Catwoman: The Gotham War: Battle lines[2023]
Catwoman 57 [2023]
Batman/Catwoman: The Gotham War: Red Hood #1 [2023]
Batman 138 [2023]
Batman/Catwoman: The Gotham War:Red Hood #2 [2023]
Batman/Catwoman: The Gotham War: Scorched Earth - releasing 31/10/23
Nightwing 107 [2023]
Future State
(I'll be honest, I don't understand Future State vs current continuity so I can't explain much for this but it's a possible future timeline I think. Jason is undercover as a cop in this btw)
Dark Detective
Future State: Gotham #1-18
Alternate Universes
(can chose what among these you want to read. none of this affects the current continuity)
Batwoman #6 (2017)
- In this comic, Batwoman travels to an alternate universe where we see a Jason Todd who was never taken in by Bruce Wayne and ends up becoming a priest
DC Universe Legacies #5,6
Batman The Brave and the bold #13 (2012)
Li’l Gotham #2, #10, #12, #17, #20, #21, #24 (2012-2013)
- This comic is adorable
Tiny Titans #23, #29, #33, #39, #45, #47 (2010-2012)
- This comic is also adorable
Convergence: Batman and Robin (2015)
Arkhamverse: (these tie in with the Batman: Arkham Knight video game)
Arkham Knight: Genesis
Batman: Arkham Knight - the game picks up right after the end of this comic
DC Comics’ Bombshells #46, #60, #62 (2015-2016)
Bombshells United #18-24 (2018)
The Dark Knight Returns: The Last Crusade #1 (2016)
Injustice: (these tie in with the Injustice video games)
Injustice - Gods Among Us: Year Five #38 (2016)
Injustice 2 #2-3, #5-7, #13, #18-20, #46-49 (2017-2018)
Injustice Vs. The Masters Of The Universe (2018)
Beware the Batman #11 (2014)
Batman: White Knight #7 (2018)
Mother Panic: Gotham A.D #2-6 (2018)
Batman Beyond #25 (2018)
Batman/Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles III #5-6 (2019)
Titans Giant #1-4 (2020)
DCEASED: Unkillables (2020)
DCEASED: Dead Planet #2-5 (2020)
Batman the Adventure Continues (2020)
Batman: Three Jokers #1-3 (2020)
Suicide Squad: Get Joker! #1-3 (2021)
Titans United (2021)
- This was to promote the Titans HBO show (even though it does not tie with the show)
DC's Round Robin - Robins (2021)
DC vs Vampires
Dark Knights of Steel: (Ongoing, I will update as they are posted. Medieval AU, the Robins are all younger and met each other before they met Bruce)
Dark Knights of Steel: Tales from the Three Kingdoms
Dark Knights of Steel #1
Batman vs Robin (2022)
- Some more honesty, I haven't got a clue as to what this fits in with so I can't help much with this but I do know that it will be 5 issues, finishing in 2023
Batman - Beyond The White Knight #1, #4-8 (2022) (ongoing)
Batman White Knight Presents: Red Hood #1-2 (2022)
Batman: Wayne Family Adventures (Ongoing series on Webtoon.)
Red Hood: Outlaws (Ongoing series on Webtoon)
Batman: The Brave and the Bold #1, #4 (2023)
- at the end we get to see an alternate universe where young Jason and Dick are brothers and first meet Bruce
Other Media
TV Shows
Batman: The Brave and The Bold, Season 2 Episode 19
- In this universe, Dick Grayson is the only Robin but in S2 E19, "Emperor Joker" features a scene in Bat-Mite's extra-dimensional museum where Bat-Mite has a statue depicting Jason's death. Bat-Mite then breaks the fourth wall and tells Batman that readers voted for Jason to die.
Young Justice
- S2 E8, S2 E9, S2 E20, S4 E19 an image of Jason as Robin is seen with other memorials for heros.
- Jason is also thought to be the Red Hooded Ninja who appears in S3 E6, S4 E5, S4 E8
Titans
- Seasons 1 and 2 with a short cameo in season 3 of the HBO show
Movies
Batman: Under the Red Hood
- Animated movie that changes the storyline of Jason's death, resurrection and return to Gotham
Batman: Death in the Family (2020)
- This is an interactive film involving the events of Batman: Death in the Family comics.
Lego DC Batman: Family Matters (2019)
Video Games
Batman: Arkham Knight
- Arkham Knight: Genesis and Batman: Arkham Knight comics are set before the events of this game.
Injustice: (these tie in with the Injustice comics listed above under Alternate Universes)
Injustice: Gods Among us (mentioned)
Injustice 2
Gotham Knights
- The Batfamily (Dick, Barbara, Jason and Tim) protecting Gotham, as well as dealing with the death of Batman. This was very recently released and I haven't played it so I can't tell you much.
I just want to add the following:
I cannot guarantee that this is 100% accurate or up to date. I will do my best to update when we get new Jason content.
I have not had any help with this and got the information from multiple other sources. Because I've had no help, no one has proof checked this so there might be some errors.
If you notice any errors or know of anything I've missed please let me know and I will fix the error as soon as I can!
Last Updated: 25 October 2023
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