#(no shade to vi but she's an unreliable narrator)
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Welcome to day 7294 of me asking myself "Do I like Catriona Cordella or have I simply consumed too much isekai villainess content?" (I think I do like her a little fuck)
#yes ik shes a bitch but i cant help but think of things from her pov#because she does genuinely seem like a good person#if she was truly insensitive she could just sit around like king tauri and get away because shes 3rd in line to the throne#but instead she became a flier and risked her life#(plus we forget most of what we know of her is from violet's pov)#(no shade to vi but she's an unreliable narrator)#fourth wing#iron flame#the empyrean#catriona cordella
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I've been reading your Erikar posts and I think that they work really well with the idea that moirallegiance really doesn't work the way it's "supposed" to. It's framed in-universe as a very one-sided "stable person pacifies dangerous person" deal, but both Erifef and Gamkar, which are basically platonic ideals of that concept, failed independently because of how unstable that dynamic is -- one person is worn out doing all the emotional labor and the other is not interested in being pacified. Whereas the meowrails, despite also being framed as a "classical" moirallegiance, are much more clearly two-sided, as both parties consistently help, listen to, and advise each other, and the relationship is consequently much stabler and more enduring. I love the way you frame Erikar because it works really well with this by showing both parties taking and giving "pacification" and support in turn, instead of one shouldering all the work.
Yeah! I think this is a good way to talk about something Hussie likes to do that I'm a huge fan of, which is: unreliable narration. This unreliable narration has garnered Hussie the reputation of being a "troll" or even flat-out "wrong" about HS, and I find both of these to be very unfair because the use of unreliable narrator is both deliberate AND thematically fitting.
As part of Homestuck's post-modern stylings (and I mean post-modern in the literature sense, not vis. art, though it has shades of that too), it plays heavily on the ideas of narrator-as-character, author-as-character, metafiction, and we-all-know-it's-a-story-itis. Hussie himself, even in his external commentaries (Formspring, Tumblr, Books, etc.), is fully aware that his additions add to the metatextual texture of the work and change how it's interpreted - that, although his additions technically lie external to the "story" Homestuck is telling, they are also paradoxically part and parcel of that very story.
As a result, they deliberately play a character WRT Homestuck, both in- and out-of-universe, and this character is, by their own admission, buffoonish and oafish. It's really apparent in their book commentary, where they'll sometimes even drop the act, or "realize" they've dropped the act and hurry to put it back on (a standout moment is when he provides a very genuine, honest analysis of Vriska, before going "oh, wait, I forgot, she's literally my wife and has never done anything wrong ever in her life ever"). They also mention how their narrative voice sometimes works antagonistically to the characters, such as when it assures Vriska that she has no choice but to kill Aradia, subtly pushing Vriska towards that option.
Functionally, neither the narrator nor the author (and by that, I mean the caricaturized character of "the author" that Hussie plays) of Homestuck are entities that you can take fully at face value; they need to be challenged and interrogated as much as any other character, have their motives dissected, have their blind spots pointed out.
And why would this need to be the case? Because that's literally one of the main thrusts of Homestuck: malicious entities (in HS's case, LE, Doc Scratch, and Caliborn, who at various times struggle with Hussie for control of the story, before killing him and wresting it away entirely) will attempt to write the narrative. They'll push their version of events, their politics, their biases, their philosophies. They'll try to change the story to suit them and perpetuate their own power and ability to enforce that power. And you can't let them win.
Hussie-as-a-character/narrator himself is not particularly malicious, and, as the narrative prompt serving as Caliborn's guide, is even ultimately sympathetic, expressing that kids need to grow up and mature, achieve self-actualization, emotional catharsis, etc.
However, as a result of his oafishness, he has a tendency to play to the characters' worst instincts, to pick favorites among the cast. The most blatant example of this is his "love" of Vriska, which - contrary to popular opinion - isn't "real". Hussie is not actually in love with Vriska; the whole thing started because - due to misogyny - people accused Hussie of only giving Vriska so much plot relevance because he was literally in love with her. Why else would a female character with an unpleasant personality be allowed to be important, amirite? And Hussie clearly thought that this whole thing was so ridiculous that he 100% leaned into it as a joke. I'm not here to litigate whether or not it was appropriate to do so, just to point out that Hussie's "love" of Vriska was always an artifice - an aspect of Hussie-as-character that he played up to highlight the fact that Hussie-as-character is an unreliable buffoon, and, by extension, that Vriska is not blameless and perfect.
Since this is the Eridan blog, I'd be remiss not to talk about him. Hussie's commentary towards Eridan is especially fascinating to me, because Eridan is one of he characters Hussie-as-character is biased against, in a similar way as he's biased in Vriska's favor. Thus, his attitude towards Eridan is very dismissive, both in the book commentary AND in the comic itself. "Gamzee: Indulge emotional theatrics" and "Jade: Answer this douche bag" come to mind. He also spends the vast majority of the Act 5 Act 2 book mocking Eridan for being sad and alone, with nobody to care about him and nobody who listens to his problems.
Now, the reason I call this fascinating is twofold: the first is that his commentary in the Act 5 Act 1 book has a WILDLY different tone: while he's still biased in Eridan's disfavor, he outright calls Eridan a "good character" alongside Nepeta, and offers genuine insight into his characterization and the powers of Hope - comparing him at one point to Dave if Dave took a much darker path.
So when his attitude changes from "he's a shithead, but fairly complex, I guess" to "he's a loser idiot that nobody likes LMAOOOO", you're supposed to notice that! You're supposed to question that, to wonder why he has a change of heart, why he's suddenly so dismissive of a character he was genuinely writing whole paragraphs about before.
And the answer is multifaceted:
He's playing up his buffoonish character, to let you know that he's about to be wrong as hell. Every time Hussie starts really amping up the Hussie-as-character persona, you're about to be in for an opinion that SHOULD NOT be taken at face value.
He's reflecting a common fandom opinion, because one of his favorite things to do as an unreliable narrator is to speak on behalf of another character or entity, highlighting the biases and blind spots in play - in this case, the audience's. Again, he's about to be wrong as hell, so he's doing this specifically to indicate that the audience members who believe this are also wrong as hell.
Act 5 Act 2 is when we get the one conversation in all of Homestuck where somebody (Karkat) cares about Eridan and takes his problems seriously. During this part of the story, Hussie goes COMPLETELY silent. This is incredibly out of character, as he usually can't shut up, and the commentary is usually dense, packed with words, without pause. Compare:
In those blocks of silence are contained the conversation Eridan has with Karkat where Karkat literally tells him "I know it's hard being you" and that Nepeta's rejection of him wasn't a negative reflection of him. In other words, Karkat cares about Eridan and takes him seriously, COMPLETELY contradicting Hussie-as-character's assertions that nobody does, so utterly that Hussie-as-character has to completely shut up during that entire sequence because he has no way of reconciling his stance with the evidence presented.
Now, Hussie-as-an-actual-person is completely aware of what they're doing, or else they couldn't do stuff like this so consistently and so precisely. So I want to be very, very clear that this is not Hussie "not understanding his own story" or whatever BS the fandom likes to say in order to cast Hussie as the villain. This is masterful usage of unreliable narrator, like, I'm genuinely impressed.
By acting a clown and insisting that nobody likes or cares about Eridan, the audience is MEANT to glean from the text:
That Karkat is clearly an exception, and he quite likes and cares about Eridan,
That those who are dismissive towards Eridan and treat him purely as an object of ridicule are Wrong as Hell,
That maybe it's not a good thing for us - both audience, author, and characters - to be so quick to judge and dismiss others just because they're annoying and nasty - that doing so can have dire consequences, as we see with how Eridan's story plays out.
And I'm not kidding when I say that we have to be constantly fucking vigilant, that there's very, very little that can be purely taken at face value. Not long after this is one of Karkat's memos, where he attempts to warn his past friends about all the murders, only to dismiss past!Gamzee by saying that current!Gamzee going crazy murderclown "barely even concerns [him]." Hussie then notes in the commentary - and not for the first time - that Karkat has a Problem(TM) with not seeing past/future versions of people as contiguous with their current selves, which he does as a defense mechanism so as not to confront his own feelings of shame and self-loathing. Hussie then proceeds not to comment on the following:
CCG: YOU ARE DEAD TO ME CCG: PAST YOU, PRESENT YOU, FUTURE YOU CCG: AND ABOVE ALL, UGLY SCARFNECKED DOUCHEBAG HIPSTER YOU CCG: WAIT I FORGOT, ALL OF THE YOUS ARE THAT YOU
Hmmm... interesting. I wonder why Hussie points out one of Karkat's running character traits, just to "forget" to notice when an exception happens directly after? I'll let this one be an exercise for the class.
So to tie it all back to your ask: why is the exposition on troll romance done the way it is? What are the narrator's motives? Hussie even outright states in the commentary that Kanaya/Tavros/Vriska, which is used as an example of an auspicetism, isn't even a real auspicetism, as Kanaya feels no need to commit to it, and at most is putting out mixed signals - it's just used as an example because it's the closest thing we've seen.
Well, the answer I've arrived at, personally, is that the troll romance explanation is as flawed as it is because the narrator is taking on Karkat's point of view. A movie poster on Karkat's wall, the troll version of Serendipity, is used and namedropped as the ultimate expression of meeting your soul mate in every quadrant - as well as the assertion that "every" troll believes that there ARE destined soul mates for every quadrant, which Karkat definitely believes, but isn't a sentiment necessarily shared by everybody else. Moreover, the explanation ends with a tirade about how Karkat tried to explain quadrants to John, who didn't get it because "he's an idiot".
I'm not saying that Karkat is literally narrating here, just to be clear - I'm saying that the narrator (Hussie-as-character) is relaying factual information as processed through the lens of Karkat's biases, and, as a result, we can't take the explanation at 100% face value (though we can't discount it as entirely untrue, either). It's not so much that "real" moirail pairs work because they're doing moirallegiance "wrong," but that Karkat's view of moirallegiance is simplistic, idealized, and flawed, and we see this play out when he's bitter about his breakup with Gamzee because Gamzee stops "needing" him to keep him calm, even after Karkat has failed to be kept calm by Gamzee in return.
The more I look into Homestuck, the more that I'm genuinely impressed by the way it handles its writing. I hope this was interesting to everyone, too. I feel a little like I'm peeling back a curtain, or opening up a clock to reveal all the little cogs and wheels.
No, you can't trust Hussie as the narrator, but that's on purpose, and it's on purpose because why do we trust narrators? Why do we assume people telling a story are unbiased, benevolent, and have no ulterior motives? Why do we let idiots, assholes, predators, and monsters get away with their version of the truth, when a little scrutiny will have the whole ruse fall apart? Why do we let people tell us not to care about other people, why do we let them tell us that it's okay to be cruel to acceptible targets, why do we let them go unexamined?
And how about the stories we tell ourselves?
#homestuck#eridan ampora#karkat vantas#gamzee makara#vriska serket#writing#unreliable narrator#postmodernism#post-modernism#homestuck is good actually and hussie is an incredible writer
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a bonus note about dusk del sciaris: this is in fact a more or less accurate depiction of her makeup. she wears A LOT of makeup. she wears thick foundation with NO blush, slate grey eyeshadow, and an imperial shitton of black eyeliner and mascara… and the most aggressive red lipstick her precious little hot topic ass could find. she’s 14. she looks like a washed-out alien like this. the only reason it works is because she’s good at applying the stuff so she doesn’t make mistakes like blurring the edge of her lip that would push it into “preteen’s first makeup test” territory.
she does this because she thinks the intense makeup makes her look sleek and sophisticated and threatening. this is very funny to me because as far as sayara tyriea is concerned, it works. so we hear in sayara’s POV how dusk looks so cool and put-together and she can totally pass for an actual adult like that, she looks so badass and intimidating, she’s so unreadable… which is mostly proof that sayara is an unreliable narrator.
someday, somehow, i will find an excuse to describe dusk del sciaris during a violet ravenhart POV, because violet thinks she looks like a goddamn circus clown. this is rich coming from vi, who is the god empress of hot topic goth aesthetic, but at least vi knows how to pick shades of heavy eyeshadow that look decent with her skin tone. and vi is too lazy to bother with foundation, too, so she has color in her face and doesn’t look like an alien or an unfinished painting.
so those two!!! both aelia and dusk have significant hairstyle changes between books 1 and 2, which is vaguely a spoiler but i don’t really care right now. the book 3 “era” of character design is what i always picture when i imagine the ‘archetypal’ forms of these OCs… book 1 designs are larval. they haven’t found themselves yet :’)
i think the only character whose design doesn’t change significantly between 1 and 2 is violet. violet just looks angrier and more sleep deprived. this is because every character in this story is a different lens through which i examine self-identity and what it means to find yourself, and violet has known who she is from the start. violet doesn’t have to find herself. violet found herself years ago and claimed her place as heiress and sister and daughter, and now she has to hold on while the world and her own trauma try to tear that strength away from her.
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Hey love your metas! I want to ask about Sansa dealing with her sexual assaults and trauma. The way she mismemorised the traumatic events, do you think she gonna misremember any other similar traumatic events in future? Do you think her family will help her remember these events n dealing with it?
Hello Anon,
Thank you ♡
I recently wrote about Sansa dealing with trauma, particularly sexual assault trauma.
Here is the post for anyone interested.
And here is another one.
Almost every meta, essay, analysis, etc, about the so-called “un-kiss”, has been written from a sexual perspective. For the majority of this fandom, either shippers or not, Sansa remembering a kiss instead of the sexual assault she suffered and later having nightmares with her assaulter being in bed with her, CLEARLY means that she is having sexual fantasies with her assaulter, that she is expressing her dark, repressed, hidden, deepest desires about her assaulter, that all this is part of her sexual awakening.
But every time GRRM has been asked about the subject, either from a sexual perspective or not, he consistently tagged Sansa misremembering things and events as “unreliable narrator.” Lets see.
In chronological order:
JUNE 26, 2001
SF, TARGARYENS, VALYRIA, SANSA, MARTELLS, AND MORE
[GRRM is asked about Sansa misremembering the name of Joffrey’s sword.]
The Lion’s Paw / Lion’s Tooth business, on the other hand, is intentional. A small touch of the unreliable narrator. I was trying to establish that the memories of my viewpoint characters are not infallible. Sansa is simply remembering it wrong. A very minor thing (you are the only one to catch it to date), but it was meant to set the stage for a much more important lapse in memory. You will see, in A STORM OF SWORDS and later volumes, that Sansa remembers the Hound kissing her the night he came to her bedroom… but if you look at the scene, he never does. That will eventually mean something, but just now it’s a subtle touch, something most of the readers may not even pick up on.
[Source]
It is very curious that the person who misremembered Joffrey’s sword name wasn’t Sansa, it was Arya:
The big man shrugged. "I was Joffrey's sworn shield. The butcher's boy attacked a prince of the blood."
"That's a lie!" Arya squirmed in Harwin's grip. "It was me. I hit Joffrey and threw Lion's Paw in the river. Mycah just ran away, like I told him."
—A Storm of Swords - Arya VI
But despite the unreliable narrator’s identity confusion, what I understand from George’s answer is that misremembering a minor detail like Joff’s sword name “it was meant to set the stage for a much more important lapse in memory,” like the “un-kiss” for example, that George mentioned next.
At the same time, the “un-kiss” will eventually mean something, but just now it’s a subtle touch, something most of the readers may not even pick up on.
Take note that George’s answer is from 2001, after ASOS was published, so by that time he already knew about the existence of the shippers that want Sansa with the Hound being together in a romantic/sexual relationship. You can check this fact by reading the questions and answers from 1999 compiled in this post. But he still mentioned that the meaning of the “un-kiss” was “a subtle touch, something most of the readers may not even pick up on.”
So much for the so-called “evident”, “canon”, “endgame“ ship and ASOS being “their ship’s book” ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
* * *
OCTOBER 05, 2002
SANSA’S MEMORY
[Note: This mail has been edited for brevity.]
… this is an inconsistency with ASoS more than an outright error. In ASoS, Sansa thinks that the Hound kissed her before leaving her room and King’s Landing. In ACoK, no kiss is mentioned in the scene, though Sansa did think that he was about to do so.
Well, not every inconsistency is a mistake, actually. Some are quite intentional. File this one under “unreliable narrator” and feel free to ponder its meaning...
[Source]
Here George’s answer is more succinct: the “un-kiss” is not a mistake, it was intentional, file this one under “unreliable narrator.”
* * *
NOVEMBER 27, 2007
GEORGE R.R. MARTIN ANSWERS YOUR QUESTIONS
Here’s a really particular question (which I realize means it probably won’t get asked in a general interview): In A Storm of Swords, there is a chapter early on where Sansa is thinking back to the scene at the end of A Clash of Kings when The Hound came into her room during the battle. She thinks in the chapter about how he kissed her, but in the scene in A Clash of Kings, this actually didn’t happen. Was that a typo or something? —Valdora
GRRM: It’s not a typo. It is something! [Laughs] ”Unreliable narrator” is the key phrase there. The second scene is from Sansa’s thoughts. And what does that reveal about her psychologically? I try to be subtle about these things.
[Source]
Here George gave us little clues:
[The un-kiss] is from Sansa’s thoughts [an internal thought for herself, she is not telling anyone that the Hound kissed her]
What does that reveal about her psychologically?
I try to be subtle about these things
Also take note how GRRM repeatedly highlights the word “subtle” regarding the “un-kiss”:
but just now it’s a subtle touch (After ASOS but before AFFC)
I try to be subtle about these things (Shortly after AFFC)
This is a stark contrast with the majority of this fandom, either shippers or not, that interpret and believe that Sansa remembering a kiss instead of the sexual assault she suffered and later having nightmares with her assaulter being in bed with her, CLEARLY has to do with her sexual awakening, that the “un-kiss” means that she is having sexual fantasies with her assaulter, that she is expressing her dark, repressed, hidden, deepest desires about her assaulter.
And I wonder, since Sansa has similar dreams with Ilyn Payne and often feels naked around him:
As the headsman looked at her, his pale colorless eyes seemed to strip the clothes away from her, and then the skin, leaving her soul naked before him. Still silent, he turned and walked away.
—A Game of Thrones - Sansa I
She dreamt of footsteps on the tower stair, an ominous scraping of leather on stone as a man climbed slowly toward her bedchamber, step by step. All she could do was huddle behind her door and listen, trembling, as he came closer and closer. It was Ser Ilyn Payne, she knew, coming for her with Ice in his hand, coming to take her head. There was no place to run, no place to hide, no way to bar the door. Finally the footsteps stopped and she knew he was just outside, standing there silent with his dead eyes and his long pocked face. That was when she realized she was naked. She crouched down, trying to cover herself with her hands, as her door began to swing open, creaking, the point of the greatsword poking through …
She woke murmuring, “Please, please, I’ll be good, I’ll be good, please don’t,” but there was no one to hear.
—A Game of Thrones - Sansa VI
Once she dreamed it was still her marrying Joff, not Margaery, and on their wedding night he turned into the headsman Ilyn Payne.
—A Storm of Swords - Sansa II
Does this mean that Sansa is having sexual fantasies with her father’s executioner as well? Does this mean that Sansa has dark, repressed, hidden, deepest desires about Ilyn Payne too?
I think that the “un-kiss” has to do with Sansa’s internal thoughts, how her mind works, how her mind deals with unpleasant/disturbing events. So in order to decipher its meaning we must ask ourselves about Sansa’s psychology, she is a deeply traumatized child by many events: Her direwolf’s death, her father’s death, the disillusionment of her Prince and the Queen as high moral figures, the disillusionment of the knights as fair heroes, the psychological, physical and sexual abuse she has suffered so far. The “un-kiss” is a subtlety from the author, this can’t be as easy as “Sansa has the hots for the Hound”.
Sansa: All she wanted was for things to be nice and pretty, the way they were in the songs. —A Game of Thrones - Sansa I
Sansa: Almost raped by the Hound during the night of the Blackwater Battle, he invaded her bedroom, pushed her to bed, put a dagger at her throat, requested a song from her under threat of death.
There is a song called “Off to Gulltown” that says:
Off to Gulltown to see the fair maid, heigh-ho, heigh-ho. I’ll steal a sweet kiss with the point of my blade, heigh-ho, heigh-ho. I’ll make her my love and we’ll rest in the shade, heigh-ho, heigh-ho.
Sansa: The Hound kissed me during the night of the Blackwater Battle.
Fandom/Shippers: Sansa fancies the Hound uhhhhhhhhh
Sansa: Has unpleasant memories of the “un-kiss” feeling soiled by it.
Sansa: Has a nightmare about Tyrion and the Hound in bed with her the night after Marillion attempted to rape her.
Fandom/Shippers: Sansa fancies the Hound and have fun dreams with him uhhhhhhhhhh
It's really all that easy?
George hates to be predictable:
I spoke earlier about how predictable stories bore me. And we’ve all, you know, seen the stories where the hero, you know, he seems to get in trouble—he’s all alone, he’s surrounded by twenty foes, but he’s the hero! You know he’s going to get out of it; you’re not really engaged. I want you to be engaged. I want you to feel what the viewpoint character is feeling. If the viewpoint character is in trouble, I want you to be afraid, I want you not to know whether he’s going to get out of it. And I think the only way to do that is establish very early in the books that you’re playing for real, that anyone can die, and if the character’s in a life or death situation that he might not survive it. That these are not superheroes, these are not Indiana Jones. These are fallible human beings who are vulnerable to death and betrayal and all that. To my mind, that makes the stories much more suspenseful and gripping and emotionally involving.
(...)
I also liked the idea of the story not being predictable. Too much of fantasy is too predictable, you know? They say we write the stories that we want to read. And I was a reader long before I was a writer, and as a reader I love stories that take me to places that I don’t expect, and I hate stories where you read the first five pages and you know exactly what’s going to happen for the rest of the book. Those stories bore me very quickly, and I don’t want to bore my readers or indeed bore myself in writing, so I try to, you know, create a fairly complicated thing that’s full of twists and surprises and unexpected turns, but all of them rooted hopefully in human nature and arising out of the characters and the desires and wishes and dreams of those characters.
—A Dance With Dragons: George R. R. Martin
And he is always distracting us:
There are some mysteries in these books. There are some things that I’m gonna reveal later on that I’m planting clues for. There are some later plot twists that I’m foreshadowing. There are things that are gonna happen in Book 5 and Book 6 and Book 7 where I’ve planted a seed for it in Book 1. But I don’t necessarily want to give away my hand. So, what do I do when I plant the seed? Well, I plant the seed, but I try to do a little literary sleight of hand, and while I’m planting the seed, my other hand is up there waving and is distracting you with some flashy bit of wordplay or something that’s going on in the foreground, while the seed is being planted in the background. So hopefully the seed is there, the foreshadowing is there, but maybe you won’t notice it, because it’s surrounded by so many other things.
—The George R. R. Martin Podcast, Episode 7 (9:17)
Transcription provided by this post.
Think about it!
* * *
DECEMBER 2016 ASKING GEORGE R.R. MARTIN ABOUT SAN/SAN
My question is regarding Sansa Stark. Her sexuality has evolved through every book and yet the memory that seems to stick the more with her in this regard is the night of the Blackwater. So I was wondering if you can expand on your view on what this is, since as before that night her interactions with Sandor Clegane weren’t really physical.
The night of the Blackwater, yes. Ahhh… Well, I’m not going to give you a straight answer on that hahaha… Uhmmm, but I would say that ahhh… you know a television show and a book each has its own strengths and weaknesses; there a re tools that are available to me as a novelist, that are not available to people doing a television show. And of course there are tools available to them, that are not available to a novelist, I mean they can lay in a soundtrack, they can do special effects, they can do amazing things that I can’t do, I just have words on paper. What can I do, well I can use things like the internal narrative, I can take you inside of territories… thoughts, which you can’t do in a TV show… Ahhh… You just have the words they speak, you see them from outside because the camera is external, while prose is internal, and I have the device known as “unreliable narrator”… Ahhh… Which again, they don’t have. So, think about those two aspects when you consider that night of the Blackwater.
[Source]
Here George was asked directly, by a shipper, about the “un-kiss” and Sansa’s sexuality, and he stuck with his classic “unreliable narrator” answer.
George also repeated these things:
I can use things like the internal narrative
I can take you inside of territories… thoughts
Prose is internal
I have the device known as “unreliable narrator
His comparison between a TV Show and a Book is very telling:
You just have the words they speak, you see them from outside because the camera is external, while prose is internal.
Also, it seems that he is done with questions about Sansa’s sexuality, as you can see from the chronology of questions and answers in this post.
So, the “un-kiss” and any other misremembering from Sansa has to do with her psychological state, not with her sexuality in particular.
Sansa did something similar with the Trident incident, where her direwolf Lady, part of her soul, was killed by her own father using his sword Ice.
She remembered the facts exactly as they happened when she told her father about it. But later she started to blame Arya and Cersei, but exculpates Joffrey, her future husband:
Sansa and Septa Mordane were given places of high honor, to the left of the raised dais where the king himself sat beside his queen. When Prince Joffrey seated himself to her right, she felt her throat tighten. He had not spoken a word to her since the awful thing had happened, and she had not dared to speak to him. At first she thought she hated him for what they'd done to Lady, but after Sansa had wept her eyes dry, she told herself that it had not been Joffrey's doing, not truly. The queen had done it; she was the one to hate, her and Arya. Nothing bad would have happened except for Arya.
—A Game of Thrones - Sansa II
She accommodates and compartmentalize a lot as a way to cope and survive every unpleasant, disturbing and traumatic event that already happened to her in her short 13 years.
So to answer your specific questions:
Do you think she gonna misremember any other similar traumatic events in future?
I think so. This is sad because it means that Sansa will experience even more traumatic events that she will have to deal with...
We need to wait to know the “un-kiss” true meaning. She romanticizes the Hound’s rape attempt against her and made it into a kiss, just like a song called “Off to Gulltown” that describes a non-con/sexual abuse situation against a maid, like her.
Inside her mind Sansa decided to remember the good things that men like Tyrion and the Hound did for her. In her first AFFC chapter (Sansa I), she thinks:
When Joff had her beaten, the Imp defended her.
When the mob sought to rape her, the Hound carried her to safety.
When the Lannisters wed her to Tyrion against her will, Ser Garlan the Gallant gave her comfort.
Only in her nightmares the true slipped out:
And she dreamed of her wedding night too, of Tyrion's eyes devouring her as she undressed. Only then he was bigger than Tyrion had any right to be, and when he climbed into the bed his face was scarred only on one side. "I'll have a song from you," he rasped, and Sansa woke and found the old blind dog beside her once again. "I wish that you were Lady," she said.
—A Storm of Swords - Sansa VI
But after Marillion’s attack, Littlefinger forced kiss and Lysas’s death she is starting to join the dots. For an instance, when she hears Littlerfinger using the same sexual innuendo than Marillion, “Let me warm you”, she realizes that Petyr Baelish is bad news:
Let me warm you, Sansa. Take off those gloves, give me your hands."
"I won't." He sounded almost like Marillion, the night he'd gotten so drunk at the wedding. Only this time Lothor Brune would not appear to save her; Ser Lothor was Petyr's man. "You shouldn't kiss me. I might have been your own daughter . . ."
—A Storm of Swords - Sansa VII
The whole passage from her first AFFC chapter (Sansa I) is very revealing:
The things her aunt had said just before she fell still troubled Sansa greatly. "Ravings," Petyr called them. "My wife was mad, you saw that for yourself." And so she had. All I did was build a snow castle, and she meant to push me out the Moon Door. Petyr saved me. He loved my mother well, and . . .
And her? How could she doubt it? He had saved her.
He saved Alayne, his daughter, a voice within her whispered. But she was Sansa too . . . and sometimes it seemed to her that the Lord Protector was two people as well. He was Petyr, her protector, warm and funny and gentle . . . but he was also Littlefinger, the lord she'd known at King's Landing, smiling slyly and stroking his beard as he whispered in Queen Cersei's ear. And Littlefinger was no friend of hers. When Joff had her beaten, the Imp defended her, not Littlefinger. When the mob sought to rape her, the Hound carried her to safety, not Littlefinger. When the Lannisters wed her to Tyrion against her will, Ser Garlan the Gallant gave her comfort, not Littlefinger. Littlefinger never lifted so much as his little finger for her.
Except to get me out. He did that for me. I thought it was Ser Dontos, my poor old drunken Florian, but it was Petyr all the while. Littlefinger was only a mask he had to wear. Only sometimes Sansa found it hard to tell where the man ended and the mask began. Littlefinger and Lord Petyr looked so very much alike. She would have fled them both, perhaps, but there was nowhere for her to go. Winterfell was burned and desolate, Bran and Rickon dead and cold. Robb had been betrayed and murdered at the Twins, along with their lady mother. Tyrion had been put to death for killing Joffrey, and if she ever returned to King's Landing the queen would have her head as well. The aunt she'd hoped would keep her safe had tried to murder her instead. Her uncle Edmure was a captive of the Freys, while her great-uncle the Blackfish was under siege at Riverrun. I have no place but here, Sansa thought miserably, and no true friend but Petyr.
—A Feast for Crows - Sansa I
As you can see Sansa is starting to realize that the persons that help her, can also hurt her and have ulterior motives to help her, that the help is not unconditional and always has a price.
So I think she will reach a point where she would be able to do the same with all her abusers, she will realize that men like Tyrion, the Hound, Dontos, etc, have helped her but at the same time have hurt her, Tyrion accepted to marry her and almost commit marital rape, the Hound attempted to rape her and repeatedly abuse her psychologically and physically, even Dontos, always requesting kisses.
Do you think her family will help her remember these events and dealing with it?
Most probably. Meeting Jeyne Poole again, for example. Knowing what Littlefinger really did to her, and all his crimes against House Stark.
I really hope for that moment of realization, when she can stop lying to herself, when she can clearly see all those men as her abusers and that she owns them nothing.
George, please! She had enough already... Give her some peace and quite! Give her true friends and her family back!
Thanks for your message.
#anon ask#sansa stark#anti sandor clegane#anti tyrion lannister#anti petyr baelish#anti littlefinger#anti sansa's abusers
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Sweater, I Don’t Even Know Her: Time for a Good Old Fashioned Costume Analysis
So imagine you’re me and you have to go to the South Carolina State Museum and you’re wandering around the Confederate History Exhibition (0/10 do not recommend) when a fricking 12th grade episode drops. And you have no hi speed data because you spent it all streaming UnUps.
So I ran around desperately seeking some semblance of service. There was only service next to the confederate flag that used to fly on the capitol dome. So I tried to watch it without anyone noticing, holding the phone up to my ear. But MAMA NEEDS HER VIOLIV KISSES so I watched it again with no audio.
And guys honestly I cried right then and there.
But that’s beside the point and I’m home now so let’s look at these kiddos.
I chose this picture because I never thought we would be blessed with Viola Simone Messing saying “adorable” in the way that she does again. ALso look at those smiles that could light up this whole town. Haven’t seen them in a while, etc.
Oh man doesn’t this feel like forever ago? anyways let’s play compare and contrast. The lighting is so much warmer now, and everything feels so freaking COZY.
They’re on that couch (the same couch where the cast announcements were made, btw. Sentimental moment for me.) and they’re in those SWEATERS. Notice that the color schemes for our kids are basically the same:
Vi is sticking with the same warm color scheme, which is something only Viola wears, not Sam. Sam sticks with cool plaids, and Vi wears both that (see Random Questions) and things more feminine (see More Family Time) as well as warmer tones (see Boys are Back)
I’ve always had a theory about Liv’s clothes, stemming back to when I costumed Twelfth Night in the Infamous Production. Olivia started in all black, and over the course of the scene, dressed in lighter shades until her wedding dress in act V. We see the same thing in Liv. In her room she wears lighter shades, but once she leaves the house she wears dark greys (see the 12thbomb bunch of vlogs) eventually progressing to white (see above). She does wear black in Baking Brownies but that was such a sophisticated top it didn’t need color symbolism. In Response, she wears stripes, something I noted in Unreliable Narrator’s analysis as something that means transition. ANd boy howdy was she making a transition.
Here we see Liv in a sweater with a complex pattern of white, grey, and black. We’ve only really seen her in solids.
She’s finally accepted her dark past and is making something beautiful from it.
Liv has realized that her anxiety and her grief is not something to be ignored, it’s a part of her, it’s a chapter in her life, and it’s something to go from.
And it’s beautiful.
#12gw#twelfth grade or whatever#im so happy#this is such a good day#except for the state museum thing
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