#“why sam fans assume that kevin is on the list because i think that sam killed kevin”

[ohsamtumbles]

Why is this polls account frequently throwing Sam fans under the bus in their tags? :( We're not one big hive mind, dang.

Dean, Cas

[cblgblog]

My point was about Steve and Sharon and the treatment she received from Marvel. It's not about Sharon and Peggy. I don't want Sharon to be shown happy by Steve to validate him, it has nothing to do with Peggy. I'm sorry, Sharon was cut off because of the fans' hatred too. If she had become popular, she would still be there, just as Peggy got a series, or Loki who has a series. There's no way Marvel would cut Sharon if she had received love from fans. The writers do what Kevin Feige wants Part 1

if he had said, keep Sharon because she's popular, she would have stayed, even if they didn't like her. Yes, the fans had a voice over her departure, not just the writers and Marvel. BTW I'm not Staron stan, I'm just not going to close my eyes about how she was treated, and she can still be treated. She doesn't deserve this. Part 2

If she had become popular, she would still be there, just as Peggy got a series, or Loki who has a series.

It has something to do with Peggy if you’re making the argument that Sharon haters (commonly treated as interchangeable with Steggy fans, though that isn’t true in all cases, at all) are the reason Sharon didn’t get more screentime. If you’re making the argument that Sharon being less popular than Peggy is the reason Sharon lost out on a storyline. And, again. I don’t think she was treated badly by Steve narratively. By the writers, yes. She was wasted, they didn’t know what to do with her, she deserved better. She should’ve had more to do, if they were going to bring her in, more character development that wasn’t centered around a possible romance that didn’t get followed through with. As for the scenes she did get with Steve? No, I’m sorry, I don’t believe Steve treated her badly. He didn’t love her and leave her. He didn’t love her that way period, it was never allowed to progress that far. He didn’t throw her aside. They both went on the run from the law. He showed gratitude, he literally thanked her, so no, he didn’t treat her badly. The writers not doing more with her and letting her just fade out? Yes. But as it pertains to how they wrote her interactions with Steve? No.

And no, sorry, I don’t agree with blaming fans for what Marvel chooses to do. If Marvel was beholden to all their fan groups, then Steve would be in a relationship with Sharon, Bucky, Peggy, Nat, Tony, Sam, and plenty I’m sure I’m missing out on. Why is Peggy so special that people who prefer her to Sharon are the ones that get listened to, if you’re assuming that fans raging on the Internet is a thing Marvel seriously pays attention to? Did they just spin a wheel and whatever it landed on, that was the rabid fan group they were going to listen to? Quite a lucky coincidence for Sharon haters, isn’t it?

Peggy did become popular, more than TPTB expected after First Avenger. But to act like that’s a bad thing, like that’s people’s fault for liking her, and that’s why Sharon got removed? If she was THAT popular, her show wouldn’t have been cancelled after 2 short seasons, something that happened right before CW hit. Her show was cancelled, she was killed off, they had Sharon in CW, and Sharon has more cred with the comics crowd. They had every excuse in the world to not pursue anything more with Peggy and focus on Sharon. They didn’t. That’s on the writers, not on the people who enjoy Peggy’s character/didn’t like Sharon because of the romance angle and how it was done.

Peggy’s not Loki. She’s not Iron Man. She’s not going to be thrown into every project possible because everyone adores her on that level. If she was as popular as you’re claiming--enough to blame that popularity on why Sharon was screwed over narratively--then her show would still be on. It would be continuing on after AoS. Maybe we’d have a Howling Commandos spinoff by now. Have any of those things happened?

Yes, she is popular, she has a devoted fanbase, that is larger than Marvel anticipated. She is NOT as popular as Loki, or Iron Man, or any other character that is such a money maker for Marvel that they get used as much as possible, sometimes to the detriment of other characters. And I love her infinitely more than Tony or Loki, but you cannot, in any credible way, compare her popularity to that of Loki. Sorry, you can’t, and I say this as her biggest defender. The argument people make when blaming Peggy’s popularity for Sharon’s sparse appearances in the MCU? No. Neither Peggy Carter or Hayley Atwell have the power to sway the MCU in such a dramatic way. Hayley Atwell was a relative unknown before First Avenger, with 2 short seasons of a relatively low rated TV show under her belt by the time of CW. Vancamp, in comparison? She had 8 seasons of continuous primetime TV by then, across 2 successful TV shows. She was perfectly positioned after CW to step in more, had the writers chosen to do that. If Marvel were as beholden to Peggy fans as you claim, they wouldn’t have killed her off 20 minutes into the film. 

The writers do what Kevin Feige wants. If he had said, keep Sharon because she's popular, she would have stayed, even if they didn't like her.

Could not agree more with this. The writers do what FEIGE wants. When Emily clapped back at him during a panel, asking where her character went, she clapped back at HIM. Not the fans, She didn’t say “Why don’t more of you guys like me, why doesn’t anyone like me?” to the audience. Ultimately, it’s on Feige and Marvel, what happens and what doesn’t. Is it Stucky fans fault that Steve and Bucky haven’t had more time onscreen together, because they’re just not popular enough, people don’t want that enough? Is it Tony stans fault that he died? Were Nat and Gamora both killed because neither of them were popular enough? Because from everything on the Internet, fan reactions, none of those things are remotely true, yet all of those decisions were made. Nat and Gamora getting dead for manpain? That was bad writing. THAT was actual misogyny. Sharon wasn’t given enough material to work with as a character. Because they chose to bring her in and then wasted her, THAT is bad writing. If they’d wrote her in with a clear vision of what to do with her, she very well could have become more popular. They didn’t give her the material needed to stand out? That is bad writing. It’s not because this 60-year-old character doesn’t have a fanbase, or because Emily Vancamp, veteran of several TV shows, nominated for a long list of awards for her acting, not because she doesn’t have a fanbase.

Peggy is not that popular. Sharon/Emily is not that unpopular. Blame the writers, blame Feige. Enough with this narrative that one talented, successful woman with fans got screwed over just because another talented, successful woman also has fans. They both have fanbases. They’ve both proven that, given the right material, they can kill it. Stop pitting them and their fanbases against each other instead of blaming the people with actual decision-making power.

So yeah, I don’t agree with you, probably never going to, you’re probably never going to agree with me. Which is fine. We’re two strangers online, you saw a post I made and disagreed with it, which is fine. I don’t need to convince you, you don’t need to convince me. I’m sure that if you came off of anon and I saw your blog, there would be posts I’d disagree with too, and no amount of back and forth would change that, and that too is fine.

[bunnymcbunnister]

SPN Season 15 Spoiler Sheet, update 12/2

Not much this week with the holiday, but some potential cast info for ep 12. Under the cut.

DISCLAIMER: This is gathered info from various sources. This is not confirmed information. Stuff in this WILL be wrong. Don’t take this too seriously. This is for fun. 

General Info (oldest to newest)

There is hope to wrap up some Wayward Daughters storylines in the back half of the season

They are adding a whole extra day to filming to do the final scene. They will film the final scene last.  (Implies logistics- lots of returning people?)

Brad Bucker used the word “romance” when asked about Sam and Dean’s arcs. Did not specify who. 

In an interview, Kripe indicated that the series ending would have “peace” for Sam and Dean

Not much new at the TCA’s, but it was said it is “unlikely” Jeffery Dean Morgan will be back since his last appearance was such a good end note. There were some jokes about a Castiel spin off. Hell, I’d watch. 

There will be a special tribute ep, not clear if its one of the 20 or additional

Misha will be in 15 out of 20 episodes this season

Also according to Dabb, Jack is still in the empty and “he’s not coming back in the near future”

Cas’ deal with the Empty may come up later in the season. 

Dabb intimated that Chuck was inherently responsible for killing Mary when asked how the boys would respond to Jack. 

Dabb compared Chuck and John Winchester, claiming that Dean would have to break free of “conditioning.” Also, for Jack “there have been cosmic forces fighting for his attention since he was in the womb — and that will continue. As much as this season is about Sam and Dean finding agency, it’s also about Castiel finding agency, and it’s about Jack finding agency. As always, death is never the end. It’s just part of the journey and that’s certainly true with Jack.” 

Per Variety: At the outset of the season, the “Supernatural” foursome of Dean, Sam, Castiel and Jack are split up, but Dabb notes they won’t be for long because “ultimately this is a found family, and they have deep emotional bonds” that make up the most important part of the show.

Sam’s wound from the equalizer gives his powers/an advantage of some kind (per TVGuide)

Jack will be a critical part of the ending of the show

The cage/Adam is looking like it will be coming up for midseason

Shaving People, Punting Things: https://youtu.be/azTwku2uosA

In the cage, Micheal and Adam have formed a working relationship (MarySue)

Dean and Amara’s connection will be explored

There will be a bunker themed episode (MarySue)

According to Misha (Cinablend) Dean and Cas will have discord up to ep 8- which is the mid-season finale. 

At a convention, Jake Abel was asked to share two lies about Adam’s return and a truth. The said 1. Adam is not upset about hell 2. Adam kills someone 3. Adam bring someone back. I am assuming its the bring someone back (Micheal?)

In one of his cookbook interviews, Misha used the word “we” several times when talking about the final scene of Supernatural. He said that would be the last scene they shoot. It seemed to imply that he was in the scene, but that could be open to interpretation. 

The finale will air on Monday May 18th. The show will move to Mondays when it comes back on March 16th. It’s gotta come back either than that and go on a mini break or something, because that is not enough Mondays. 

Dabb mentioned that once Sam realizes what is going on with his connection to Chuck, he will reach out to people “some we expect and some not”

JaxCon spoilers: 

Misha said the ending was “happier than he expected” but also had some sadness. 

Misha mentioned that Claire will be mentioned on the show, but as of yet not appear. 

Jared mentioned April 5th as the date of filming the finale. 

Jensen said Dean will DANCE in an upcoming ep

Jensen reaffirmed his earlier spoiler about Dean/Cas reconciling, explaining why he has so much trouble with “that relationship” and that will “shed some light and then bruise some egos”

Episode 15x07

Title: Last Call

OFFICIAL SYNOPSIS: CLOSING TIME – Dean (Jensen Ackles) goes off on his own to take on a case. Meanwhile, Castiel (Misha Collins) has an idea of how he can help Sam (Jared Padalecki) track down God. Amyn Kaderali directed the episode written by Jeremy Adams (#1507). Original Airdate 12/5/2019.

Written by: Jeremy Adams

Director: Amyn Kaderali

Filming Dates:  9/26- 10/7

Airdate: Dec 5th

Photos: http://www.ksitetv.com/supernatural/supernatural-last-call-images-description-released/199736/nggallery/image/sn1507b_0301b/

Promo: https://youtu.be/ztvk50kN29A

Sneak Peak:

Castiel ? Yes Jack ? 

Guest stars: Shoshannah Stern

Other Spoilers/info :

Misha posted from set in new shoes- very shiny with well tailored pants. (The next day he posted in full Cas costume, so are the shoes a one off? Another outfit with new shoes?). 

Misha and Jensen made a video from set. I feel like if Jared was around he would have been in it since it was about money raised?  Maybe a Dean Cas scene?

There will be a battle scene in this that Jensen mentioned he was looking forward to and we would enjoy. 

After NJ Con, it appeared that Jensen returned to work, Jared and Misha stayed an extra day and then Misha went home. Misha only did about 2 days of filming. 

Jensen and Christian filmed at a bar called Swazey’s. This was the fight scene Jensen was referring to. 

At some point, Sam might be shirtless or we can see part of his chest- Jared had his anti-possession tattoo at the weekend convention.

Per TVGuide, Leo and Dean will have a wild night out in an effort for Dean to recapture his mojo. Dean will become the lead of a band called Dean and the Impalas, which is made up of Supernatural crew. 

Osric Chau popped over to set, but he is filming on Legends of Tomorrow in the same studio. Sebastin Roche also indicated he would come by, he is filming on Batgirl. Unfortunately, neither Kevin or Balthazar will appear in this one. 

Eileen is in the promo photos

 Episode 15x08

Title: Our Father Who Aren’t in Heaven

OFFICIAL SYNOPSIS: GOD BLESSES HIM WHO HELPS HIS BROTHER – Sam (Jared Padalecki), Dean (Jensen Ackles) and Castiel’s (Misha Collins) continued search for a way to defeat Chuck (guest star Rob Benedict) leads them to unexpected places and toward unlikely allies. Richard Speight, Jr. directed the episode written by Eugenie Ross-Leming & Brad Buckner (#1508). Original Airdate 12/12/2019.

Written by: Buckleming

Director: Speight

Filming Dates:  10/8- 10/18 (no filming 10/14 for Canadian Thanksgiving)

Airdate: 12/12

Photos: 

Promo:

Sneak Peak:

Castiel ? yes Jack ? 

Guest stars: Jake Abel, Shoshannah Stern

Other Spoilers/info:

Jake Abel posted a script with the caption “hell hath no fury like a brother scorned”

Shoshannah Stern was spotted on set- Eileen!

This will be the midseason finale

At BurCon, Misha mentioned Dean is still acting like “a dick” in the ep they were filming- which is this one. 

 Episode 15x09

Title: The Trap

OFFICIAL SYNOPSIS: 

Written by: Berens

Director: Singer

Filming Dates:  10/21-10/30

Airdate: 1/16?? 

Photos: 

Promo:

Sneak Peak:

Castiel ? I think not Jack ? maybe

Guest stars: Rob Benedict, Kim Rhodes, Jim Beaver

Other Spoilers/info:

Midseason premier episode

Misha was at home for the first week of filming, and I think the second. I don’t think he is in this. 

Alex and Rob were hanging out- Chuck and JACK?

Kim Rhodes posted in front of the SPN set and with her trailer- Jody looks very likely. She also had dyed hair and she has been rockin the grey for the past few Jody eps. Maybe a flashback/AU?

Jim Beaver posted from set- Bobby!

Jensen shared that in this episode, Dean will pray to Cas to “confess” why he has been treating Cas the way he has. Misha confirmed this in another interview and said tears would be shed- not sure who is doing the crying (besides me). 

Episode 15x10

Title: The Heroes’ Journey

OFFICIAL SYNOPSIS: 

Written by: Dabb

Director: Showalter

Filming Dates:  10/31- 11/12 (No filming for Veterans/Armistice Day)

Airdate: 1/23 ??

Photos: 

Promo:

Sneak Peak:

Castiel ? maybe briefly?  Jack ? 

Guest stars: 

Other Spoilers/info :

Misha texted some local fans from set in costume about an WA election, but after the convention was promoting his cookbook all over the place. I think he filmed, if he did, for 2 days, max. 

The story will be about Sam and Dean as heroes from the good and bad side (from MarySue)

At DCCon, Jensen shared that  this a bit of a wacky episode- Sam and Dean lose their abilities to fight, Dean gets cavities and Sam gets a cold. Jensen later seemed to refer to this ep when talking to TVGuide- mentioning the Impala will get a flat. 

Episode 15x11

Title: The Gamblers

OFFICIAL SYNOPSIS: 

Written by: Davey Perez and Meredith Glynn

Director: Beeson

Filming Dates:  11/13-11/22 

Airdate: 1/30??

Photos: 

Promo:

Sneak Peak:

Castiel ? seems likely Jack ? 

Guest stars: 

Other Spoilers/info:

Misha and Jensen made a video for a fan that I think was filmed during the first day of shooting? Not for sure. So maybe Cas?? J2M made a video about Thanksgiving, so Micha must have been around at some point. 

Megan Fitzgerald (writer/showrunner’s assistant) and Emma Peterson (production office) were very excited about something in the dailies for this ep. 

They filmed at a church and a park in Surry according to YRShoots. 

 Episode 15x12

Title: Galaxy Brain

OFFICIAL SYNOPSIS: 

Written by: Bobo Berens AND Meredith Glynn

Director: Speight

Filming Dates:12/2-!2/11 (?) The production office tweeted they have a week off for Thanksgiving

Airdate:  2/6?? But that is when Katy Keene premiers?? Maybe 3/16?

Photos: 

Promo:

Sneak Peak:

Castiel ? Jack ? 

Guest stars: Yadira Guevara-Prip ?

Other Spoilers/info:

Alex canceled a comic con appearance in Argentina for “professional obligations” so it seems likely he would film this week

IMDB lists Yadira Guevara-Prip as a guest star, so Kaia? They are not always reliable on casting

 Episode 15x13

Title: Destiny’s Child

OFFICIAL SYNOPSIS: 

Written by: 

Director: 

Filming Dates: 

Airdate: 2/13 (??) I have no idea anymore

Photos: 

Promo:

Sneak Peak:

Castiel ? Jack ? 

Guest stars: 

Other Spoilers/info:

[dotthings]

Let’s talk about Dean lashing out at Cas and his line “you’re dead to me,” in context of the current situation and what we know and have seen from Dean as a character. This kind of lashing out when Dean is in a great deal of pain, most often because he is terrified of losing, or has lost, someone he loves, is consistent for the character.

No it’s not OOC. No, SPN does not hate Dean. No, it’s not “abusive” and I wish to hell all the TFW lanes would wake up and realize the way some carelessly slap that “abusive” label onto Dean, or onto Cas, or onto Sam, trivializes abuse and hurts fans who are abuse survivors and who relate to the TFW characters for very good reasons. Unhealthy coping mechanisms or way too harsh, or misguided, they do hurt each other. Nothing in me idealizes the TFW relationships or characters and there are all kinds of problems in that familial team which I have blogged about here for actual years. They do have some repeat/cyclical behavior. 

They also have character development and I’ve watched as they grow more self-aware and lesson some of their more unhealthy coping mechanisms and grow more honest with each other. It’s one reason I love S14 so much, it’s so character driven and the characters are vocalizing so much more honestly than they used to. I’ve waited so long for SPN to do a season with this tone. Each of them still makes mistakes but they seem increasingly quicker to realize it, to fully confess to each other what they were thinking, and vocalize their motives. In Dabb era in particular I’ve noted how some things I was used to extrapolating in earlier seasons, things that were tacit in the story, in the build of the characters, are now more often in addition to the story showing it, also being vocalized by the characters themselves.

Character development is good and it is sad when they slip back into unhealthy coping mechanisms again, but they are by nature imperfect characters and in fact those flaws are part of why we love them. So much as they progress, it’s not going to be all self-acceptance sunshine and roses and nothing but mutual understanding and kindness. So long as I am also seeing character development, I’m not going to hit the ceiling every time they mis-step.

Stuff you need to put my post in further context: 

I’m speaking here as someone who writes a lot on Cas pov as well as Dean pov. I’m not someone who bashes the others in Team Free Will and only talks about Dean. I consider myself a dual fan of both characters (I love Sam too but that’s for another discussion, I relate the most to Dean and Cas and that’s just how I’m wired). I’ve been defending Cas for a decade. A literal decade and I don’t bash Cas, I love him, and I wish more Cas fans could at least extent some basic courtesy back and understand that if Cas hate hurts them, Dean hate will hurt people who love Dean.

I’m feeling terrible for Cas right now and I’ve already made a number of posts on his motivations and pov. He withheld information and he shouldn’t have done that, but we know it isn’t all on him, Sam and Dean have already vocalized they know it isn’t all on him, and we also understand why and we know he doesn’t deserve the harsh words Dean said.

Does this mean Dean is a horrible abusive person who doesn’t deserve Cas, doesn’t deserve love (from Cas or fans), because he lashed out?  No.

Does this mean Dean is OOC, has never done anything like this, would never, and the writers are “destroying” the character?  No.

Dean is getting a lot of hate right now. A lot. And he doesn’t deserve it.

What a trap is it to try to counter, in meta, the extreme hot takes of the farthest character pole extremes. Because if I catalog the previous examples of Dean lashing out at a loved one because he’s scared, grieving, hurt, worried, about another loved one, all that will go into standom’s hot takes machine and get spit out as “gotcha! See? He’s abusive! Look how mean he is!” 

They will ignore how soft he is. How he is 90% of the time the biggest softest softie that ever softed. All the instances of how forgiving he is, how loving he is to those he loves, how protective, how gentle. That all flies out the window because Dean lashed out.

Some claim he’d never. Oh yes he has, oh yes he does, and oh yes he just did and there is nothing OOC here.

So I won’t make an extensive list of when he’s lashed out, and an extensive list of his soft squishy loving center would just not fit into one post anyway. But in case you don’t believe me that this lash out here is consistent, remember he screamed “then let it end” at Bobby, Dean broke lamps over Kevin’s death flinging the entire contents of a bunker library to the floor, MoC Dean lashed out at Sam over Charlie’s death, he yelled at Sam for calling Cas, who Dean was gravely worried about in S11, an “it,” he yelled at Sam out of his grief for Cas in S13. Which by the way, Dean again got a ton of hate for, from Cas extremists, who ironically claim Dean isn’t caring enough for Cas, but if he shows the intensity of the pain he is in due to his grief for Cas, that’s wrong too. 

In 14.18 Dean lashes out for a complex set of reasons. Yes, a lot of it is his fear/grief on Mary’s behalf. Losing her is devastating to him and he’s going through it for the second time. A lot of it also is the fact that Cas kept information from him, didn’t go to him. Even though later in the episode Dean follows Sam’s confession about his own need to believe in Jack with his own, even though Dean vocalizes his shared culpability with Cas. The culpability isn’t the only factor here. Dean trusts Cas so much and he loves Cas so much and I think Dean’s also hurt Cas kept something from him and hurt that Cas thought he should fix the thing all on his own and it’s a little too similar to Cas in S6 an we know how that turned out. That doesn’t mean Cas is like he was in S6, I’m talking deep in Dean pov here, what Dean’s fears are and that it reminds him of it and that hurts extra.

I’m not saying it’s not mostly about Mary. But those things about Cas, the closeness of his bond with Cas, and a sense of personal trust being stepped on, that Cas didn’t, personally, go to him, didn’t lean on him, ask for him, confide...that’s also driving why he lashed out. Had Mary not been in peril, Dean probably wouldn’t have impulsively lashed out so hard, but he still would have been hurt Cas kept this from him and said something acerbic. 

None of the dual Dean and Cas fans defending Dean are telling anybody they have no right to be upset or no right to be hurt. Nor are we hand-waving to make Dean perfect. That’s the whole point. I don’t need a perfect Dean to still be a Dean fan.

The lashing out isn’t a healthy coping mechanism and it’s sad what went between Dean and Cas in this episode, but it’s not the destruction of their relationship by any stretch. We already got, right in the episode, self-awareness from Dean’s end, we got Cas’s full emotional confession why he did it. Dean lashed out but Cas didn’t run, he didn’t assume he was no longer wanted at all, I think Cas understands Dean and he, like Dean, is forgiving, and nobody has told Cas to be gone from their sight never to return. It’s just going to take time.

Dean is really isolated right now, reflected in the framing of the TFW scene at the pyre and the TFW in the kitchen, where Dean is shown physically separate in scene blocking. He’s an island. He’s still freezing Cas out, but he needs some time. Let’s see what ep 19 and 20 bring.

Also where am I making excuses for Dean or treating Dean as perfect in this post or blaming Cas? Nowhere, that’s where. 

I’m not interested in countering the Dean bashing by shoving blame onto the writer, because I thought this episode was a complicated honest emotional wallop, and I’m not going to deny Dean the right to be imperfect and complex by saying “he’s OOC” every single time he isn’t the sweetest softest best most supportive softie, every time he has a vulnerability, every time he says something he shouldn’t. It’s fair to say that writers control the character so if you don’t like what a character did, blame the writers, they’re the puppet-masters. But in this case it’s not doing Dean any favors by taking that defense, by denying how complex he is and waving around the “OOC!” flag to try to make it all better. Better IMO to talk about Dean’s pov and motivations and what makes him tick and give him some love that way. 

[nerdylittleshit]

Thoughts about Spn 13x18

SPOILERS! SPOILERS! SPOILERS!

This week on “how much plot can we cram into 40 minutes of television?” – the answer might surprise you. And look, there was a lot that I liked about this episode, but there was enough going on for at least two episodes. I especially felt that the Lucifer storyline was completely unnecessary and weirdly unconnected to the rest of the episode. And in general mytharc-episodes are always more plot-driven than motw-episodes, but ever since BuckLemming write the majority of the mytharc-episodes it is hard to keep track of everything. But as usual, let’s take a closer look.

A woman’s place is in the resistance

Ok, here we go:

CHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARLIE!!!!!!!!!

I mean really, ever since the moment they introduced multiple universe we were all waiting for this particular character to come back (and Eileen, just saying). And in season fan fiction, where they bring back ALL the characters, nothing is impossible. Which is kind of the problem. I mean I am thrilled to see Charlie again, even though I feel conflicted that the writers who killed her in the first place brought her back. But starting with 12x23 we have now a pretty long list of characters they brought back: Bobby, Cas, Ketch, Rowena, Kevin, Gabriel and now Charlie. And even though Supernatural is known for bringing dead characters back they usually do it in form of flashbacks or as ghosts. And just as character deaths should have a purpose other than being a motivator for the brothers to get revenge/go to a dark place, the “resurrection” of a dead character should be more than just fan service. Death in fiction should be meaningful, and by bringing a dead character back you risk to take this meaning away. I feel that especially true for Gabriel’s return, because his death was meaningful, he did sacrifice himself for humanity, it was a perfect ending for his arc, and 9x18 left it entirely open if he was still alive or not. By now though it seems however like we get a repetition of season 5 where Gabriel refuses to help, only to (hopefully) return in the last moment.

In general I think instead of killing off characters especially as a plot device and then bringing them back later as fan service they should let their characters live, to give them time to grow and to develop, giving them a life and purpose of their own, the way they did with Jody, because in the end it makes a better story.

But going back to Charlie. I had hope for a minute it might be our Charlie who thanks to Oz magic transported herself in another universe. However the fact that this is a different Charlie makes me think she will stay in her universe, trying to rebuild it, but at the same time it gives Dean some closure that he could save another version of his friend. In general the idea of meeting AU-characters is interesting, as we know that they never met the Winchesters, and we only know those characters through the Winchesters. They are different but also in some ways the same, because they had lives of their own. Bobby is still a hunter, because he was one long before he met his boys. Charlie still fights the good fight, because she had already been doing this in our world (as a hacker, but still once exposed to the world of the Supernatural she becomes a hunter in every universe). The biggest difference is then Kevin, who of course is still a prophet, but without the Winchesters to take care of him, falls into the arms of angels, and helps them, having no real choice left.

Ketch was right in assuming that Charlie broke Dean’s heart, though in a different way. It is also interesting that refers to her death as being butchered (at least BuckLemming are self-aware) just as she is about to get butchered again. It is a really messed up situation between Dean and Charlie, because he is projecting his feelings for the Charlie he knew on this basically stranger. He is afraid to lose her again, but AU-Charlie is right in telling him that this is not his call.

Also speaking of her name, I was surprised she still went by “Charlie Bradbury” in the other universe, as this was only one of her many aliases. Sam & Dean stuck with it, because she happened to use that name when they first met, and I think at some point Charlie adopted that name because she saw Sam & Dean as her family. But why AU-Charlie? Why no other alias? Why not Celeste? And why did ask Sam “Charlie Bradbury”? How many Charlies do you know, Sam?

You had me at “impossible & stupid”

I admit I was the biggest fan of bringing back Ketch, but I did enjoy his story in the last two episodes (and I like seeing David Haydn Jones). The only way to bring him back and to make sense is to give him a redemption arc, which is exactly what they are doing, and I expect him to sacrifice himself for either Charlie or Mary. Now that the BMoL no longer exists (I think) he has no more purpose and no more duty to hide behind. He has to face his choices and the consequences and he feels regret. Because as he told Asmodeus he still has a soul. And unlike Dean he likes to be prepared when he goes in an unknown area, which honestly is the better plan. Because every plan is better than no plan. Having Ketch on the other side is a tactical advantage (unless Mary kills him again, which I wouldn’t blame her for).

We also learned a bit more about the other universe. Because as the angels talked about crimes against the archangel Michael I wondered how the humans outside of the resistance live. I imagine a lot of them were forced to become vessels and the rest are slaves. Fun times.

Speaking of fun times…

Hookers Porn stars & Monte Carlo

I’m not sure how to feel about Lucifer. I always found the characters to be interesting, but I could never get behind Sabriel, because to me Gabriel’s behaviour towards was always abusive. The way they ended his story though was perfect. They gave him a redemption arc in the way Supernatural knows it best, by sacrificing himself for the greater good. This is the reason I wasn’t as thrilled as others when they brought him back, because learning that he faked his death all along takes away the meaning. Yes he helped, but unlike Sam, Dean and Cas he was not willing to risk anything for it and returned to his old life of being not involved. That doesn’t mean he deserved what happened to him, but it takes away his character development. As seen by the end of the episode where he again chooses not to help, knowing that the next apocalypse is waiting to happen. This time however his abuse plays a bigger part in refusing to help. If he does change his mind in the last minute however it will be just a repetition of season 5, as a mentioned, so I hope they do anything but that. Still, right know only Gabriel and Ketch know about the archangel blade, and with both Lucifer and Michael as a threat it would a shame not to use it again.

People have already discussed about Sam’s “I need you” towards Gabriel, a big parallel to 8x17. Both times the angels are under someone else’s control: Cas was under Naomi’s control, Gabriel is still haunted by Asmodeus. Both times the “I need you” breaks them free. Both angels however leave in the end, though Gabriel only to protect himself, whereas Cas wanted to protect the angel tablet.

I think Sam’s “I need you” comes from a different place, and that is simply because Sam has no problem to distinguish between “we” and “I”. Dean hides his own emotions behind a “we”; admitting to Cas that he personally needed him was a huge step. Sam however is not afraid to express his own emotions.

In the end they took a risk with using Gabriel’s grace to heal him instead of holding it back to open the rift again. From a moral point it did belong to him anyway and they shouldn’t have used it without his permission. I do get Dean’s anger however. As I don’t think that Gabe will give some of his grace willingly I wonder if they make him to an antagonist towards the Winchesters now.

Also, goodbye Asmodeus. You won’t be missed.

The storyline I honestly couldn’t care less about

The only good thing about the Lucifer storyline was seeing Anael aka Danneel giving him shit and calling him a failure. I don’t think we learned anything new about Lucifer here. He is not his father and he never will be. He neither was the powers (to create) nor does he care about ruling heaven and humanity (what was it with the exorcism scene???). He only wants to be worshiped, not loved, the way people did when he used Vince as a vessel.

He is still powerful enough to threat other angels (and to kill them I suppose) but once they learn he made empty promises they will turn on him. I would love to see Anael as a new ruler over heaven, however I don’t think Danneel has the time to take a bigger role.

Next week however we will see what Rowena is up to and Billie returns. The same Billie who warned Dean not to cross over to other universes, which he didn’t tell Sam. Should be interesting.

[babygirl06301]

I wanna talk about That Scene™

in 13x03, and I’m gonna do it line by line, so are you with me? (using this video posted by @lostboycas for reference) It’s gonna be long.

TL;DR: Just read the emboldened bits

By the way, this post is gonna endorse the hell out of Destiel, so if you don’t ship it, please don’t tarnish this post with hatred. Live and let love, dudes.

I’m going through the whole shebang and sheboozle, so we’re starting with:

D: [giving a reason as to why he said he’d kill Jack] I told him the truth. See, you think you can use this freak, but I know how this ends, and it ends bad.

S: I didn’t.

D: What?

S: I didn’t end bad... when I was the “freak,” when I was drinking demon blood.

D: Come on, man, that’s totally different.

S: Was it? Because you could’ve put a bullet in me. Dad told you to put a bullet in me, but you didn’t. You saved me. So, help me save him. 

So, this piece of the conversation kind of hurt me a little bit because I feel like Dean regressed back to the Dean he used to be, which is sad. Not that Dean’s old self was bad, it’s just that he’s grown so much since then. He’s a lot more accepting of monsters and demons and “freaks” if he can be convinced they’re not evil.

Now, of course, I understand why he’s harboring such hostile opinions toward Jack (and if I didn’t understand, I got it loud and clear with this episode), but it’s sort of disheartening that he’d use the work “freak” in front of Sam after everything they’ve been through. 

However, I do appreciate that Sam stuck up for Jack here without hesitation. Especially since I’m sure he understands more than anybody else what Dean’s going through, whether you liken that to how Sam felt when he lost Jess and/or Sam just simply observing the connection that Cas and Dean have built over the years. I’m liking that Sam is connecting the most with Jack right now, despite S12 setting it up for Cas having that connection (which will come later, of course). I’m so glad that Sam has his own path/storyline again. I feel like it’s long overdue.

I’m gonna put the rest under the cut so I don’t spam you guys with a wall of post.

Next:

D: You deserved to be saved. He doesn’t.

S: Yes, he does, Dean. Of course he does.

So, I know we’re all talking about this scene/line mirroring this one:

(Shameless self-promo: this photo is from my side-blog, check it out here)

and a lot of people have been talking about this parallel. @chocolatedeathwarrior made a post about it that you can see here. I kind of want to talk about something in the same vain which is that Dean blames himself for Castiel’s death--not Jack.

I think the first place we see that this season is during this scene where the angel Dean is fighting tells him that Castiel is “all the way dead” because of him.

Knowing Dean, this was kind of what I expected to see as a reaction to Cas’s death. It’s still sad, though. I do think that he’s projecting his self-hatred onto Jack because he can’t handle his true thoughts, which are that he got Castiel killed. And as much as I wish he wouldn’t take it out on my little pumpkin, I can’t blame him. Losing somebody with whom you had that kind of connection with... Well, I’m just surprised he’s still standing. Long story short, that line of dialogue in 4x01 is most likely mirrored here because Dean didn’t think he deserved to be saved back then. And, in my head, he feels guilty that Cas saved him in the first place because then Cas wouldn’t be dead today. (i.e. “If I hadn’t broken the first seal in Hell, Cas could’ve left Earth the second he sprung me, and none of the rest would’ve happened) Just... Dean’s got demons, ya know?

Another thing I kind of want to focus on here is Sam’s response to Dean saying that Jack doesn’t deserve to be saved. To me, his response tells me he sees Jack as an innocent, and I’m assuming that’s the case because he saw himself as an innocent victim as well. But I find the differences between them even more compelling than their similarities. Sam was chosen, but Jack was born into his power. Sam was given power specifically to do evil, Jack’s powers are just assumed to be evil because of their volume and their origins. Sam embraced his powers (eventually), and Jack seems to be afraid of his powers. So, by and large, Jack seems to be even more of an innocent than Sam was. Which is why Dean needs to back the fuck up off my baby.

Moving on:

D: Look, I know you think that you can use him as some sort of an interdimensional can opener, and that’s fine. But don’t act like you care about him, because you only care about what he can do for you. So, if you want to pretend, that’s fine. But me? I can hardly look at the kid. ‘Cause when I do, all I see is everybody we’ve lost.

First of all, can we just take a look at Sam’s face here when Dean says that Sam just wants to use Jack for his own personal gain?

Like, why would you say that about his little moose? Mamma Moose is gonna fuck you up.

But, honestly, that face is both amazing (because you can tell Sam really does care about Jack) and sad (because Sam’s wondering if his big brother really thinks that he’s that selfish). I mean, of course Sam would like for Jack to bring Mary back, but I also believe he really does want to fulfill Kelly and Cas’s wishes for him. Not to mention, he can connect with Jack on a level he hasn’t been able to with anybody else.

Which brings up an interesting tangent that I’m going to go on now:

Why is it that Sam, of all people, is doing what Castiel would’ve wanted? Not that it’s out of character for Sam, but don’t you think that it’d be more in character for Dean to do so because of the bond he and Cas shared? No. Because Dean not only blames Jack and blames himself, but he blames Cas. He’s furious that Cas put himself in a situation that got him killed. He’s pissed at Cas for being dead. And I don’t think Dean knows what to do with that.

Back on track:

S: Mom chose to take that shot at Lucifer. That is not on Jack.

D: And what about Cas?

S: What about Cas?

D: He manipulated him. He made him promises. Said “Paradise on Earth,” and Cas bought it. And you know what that got him? It got him dead! Now, you might be able to forget about that, but I can’t!

This is it. This is the moment everybody is talking about. Including me.

Okay, for one thing, he totally disregards Mary. “Fuck her, we’re talking about Cas. Keep up, Moose Man.” Like? Both of them were killed by Lucifer (he thinks), both of them chose to protect everything they were leaving behind, so? Maybe Dean reacted differently to Cas’s death because, oh, I don’t know, their bond isn’t familial? I mean, I’m just throwing that out there, but I dunno, maybe it could be a very fucking likely possibility?

Sidebar: I was discussing this with @tobythewise, and has Dean ever called Jack by name? Because I don’t think he has, and I imagine that’s in an effort to not humanize Jack in his mind. I assume he’d rather see Jack as a thing instead of as a person.

So, now, we’re gonna talk about a thing. A thing that the anti-Destiel fans may not enjoy. I’m gonna make a statement. And it’s gonna be pretty matter-of-fact. My conviction is pretty strong here. Are you prepared?

Literally, Dean has never reacted to a loved one’s death like this.

Look at the pain, the near panic in his eyes (and, no, that is not a Hercules reference).

Honestly, make a list. Make a list of the behaviors Dean exhibited immediately following each of these people’s deaths.

John (shuts it down, doesn’t talk about it until he’s dealt with most of it on his own, privately bashes in the Impala)

Sam (immediately takes action to bring him back to life after a very short, and still private, grieving period, essentially bypassing the opportunity to feel the loss of his brother)

Bobby (ignores the pain, denies the existence of Bobby’s spirit for a long period of time)

Ellen, Jo, and Ash (ignores the pain again, accepts their deaths as his fault as well as part of the job)

Kevin (same thing, blocks out the pain, privately trashes the bunker)

Charlie (same thing, puts up a wall, only briefly berates Sam for involving her in their dangerous lives)

Mom (assumes she’s dead, won’t talk about it, accepts the loss)

Crowley (accepts the loss again)

Castiel (prays to Chuck to bring him back, openly implies to a random angel that he wants to use Jack’s powers to get Cas back, publicly screams out his pain of losing Cas to Sam, knowing full well that Jack could potentially hear)

This isn’t to say that he isn’t trying to block out Cas’s death like he does with everybody else’s, but it isn’t fuckin’ workin’, is it, mate? 

And, I know. Dean has blocked out the pain of Castiel’s deaths or disappearances before, but that was because: their relationship wasn’t as developed as it is now, they just came out of a falling out, or he didn’t fucking block it out, and instead, he had dreams and nightmares about losing Cas.

So, basically, the point I’m trying to make here is that Dean is having a blown out reaction to losing Castiel, and I think it’s because he never got to say the things he needed to say to him. Things like “Thank you for everything you’ve done to save me” or “You don’t have to prove yourself to me” or “We need you here more than you realize” or “I love you.” You know, just... whatever.

Of course, it isn’t to say that Dean cares about Cas more than anybody else, because we know that’s not true. Sammy is #1, always. But it is to say that A, Castiel’s bond with Dean is significantly different than a friendship, family, or frenemy bond. B, because of that, he doesn’t know how to cope with the loss and C, the matter of the unrequited feelings and unsaid words is taking its toll.

Phew, that was a lot. I’ve only got one more thing to discuss here: Jack.

J: [whispers] Castiel. 

One thing I found kind of interesting/strange was Jack’s facial expression throughout this whole scene.

It’s very neutral, almost, right? I mean, it’s puzzled, sure, but given the context of the conversation between Sam and Dean, shouldn’t he be sad or mad or something? Seeing as how this dumpling is just like his dad, I get it . I mean, he’s new to the world, he doesn’t quite understand the “ebb and flow of human emotion” (Castiel, 2013), but he didn’t even react when Sam was defending him, which I found interesting. 

I made a post about this, but I’ll say it again here that Jack seems to value Dean’s opinion more than he does Sam’s. Just like Cas did. Not that Sam’s opinion is worthless, but still, Jack seems to want Dean’s approval more than he wants Sam’s. Maybe that’s because negative words reach people quicker than positive words? Maybe because Sam readily gave his approval, Jack feels he needs to focus on getting Dean’s? Maybe Jack’s connection to Cas bonded him to Dean in the same way Cas was bonded to Dean? (like how Amara used their connection to reach Dean in S11 *idea courtesy of @tobythewise.*)

The latter answer is my favorite because it reminds me that Cas learned how to be human from Dean, and what’s Jack been doing since hittin’ this green earth?

Exactly. Anyway, I find it really cute that Jack is looking up to Dean, but I also find it really sad that Dean is shutting him down like he is, and I also find it sad that Dean is in so much pain that it’s literally shooting out of him and hitting everything in sight.

So, then we see Cas. 

Here’s the thing: Jack needs Cas, yes. Jack could’ve subconsciously woken Castiel up because he wanted him back. But it’s pretty coincidental that Jack did so right after hearing Dean’s literal screams of pain for Cas. I hope Jack’s not thinking that bringing/having Cas back will make Dean accept him. I know that will probably be what happens, but I want Jack to bring Cas back just because he knows it’ll make Dean happy. Ya know? Hell, maybe both of those things are his motivation. Although, I don’t think he woke Cas up consciously. But! He did say earlier that using his powers were like breathing, so waking Cas up for Dean must of felt pretty natural to him, huh?

Anyway, that’s all I’ve got. I love, love, love this season so far. I love the Dabb era. I love that Castiel is getting the screen time and love that he deserves. I love that Jack is one of the best characters to ever join the show (which is impressive after 13 seasons). I love that Sam is a little Mamma Moose. I love that Dean is finally grieving Cas. I love it all. After a particularity grueling hellatus, I’m looking forward to more. Let me know your thoughts! 

[andrewuttaro]

New Look Sabres: Preseason GM 4 - TOR - The Olofsson Show

I don’t really know where to begin with this one. I guess until Rasmus Ristolainen is traded every postgame needs to start with updated angst meter. With Risto being on the roster last night my angst rating went from 7/10 on Friday all the way down to a 4/10 on this fine Bills Gameday. I guess it’s still preferred he moves before whatever toxic drama he experienced behind the scenes ruins the locker room dynamic after they lose a couple games in a row. I know the trade trash sites have heated up their production on him the last couple days, but I don’t let that excite me unless Tim Murray is GM, or its clear Terry Pegula is breathing down Jason’s neck about bonus money. So how about we talk about the other skaters? I think I put in my mandatory 4 sentences of Ristolainen. He landed a dirty hit on one of the Leafs top 4 defenseman? Oh well, you can’t beat the classics. Welcome to Toronto, Tyson Barrie. I’m not making an excuse for that hit. It was stupid, ugly and a little too on brand for Risto. I think the more interesting question is does this mean Risto is really going kamikaze to end his time as a Sabre? He wants to go down with some kind of ritual suicide landing the most trash hits possible. Again, painfully on brand for Risto but I think everyone who is going to like him after he leaves will no matter what and the people who aren’t going to lose any sleep about it aren’t losing any sleep about it. I didn’t lose any sleep about it, that was the hard cider.

Yeah, I saw Ad Astra during this game last night. That’s how I do preseason promise: just ignore the game. Don’t see this movie unless you like Art films. Other than the space monkeys the only thing that wasn’t artsy AF was Brad Pitt just wailing for his daddy the whole frigging movie over narration. Well anyway, I came how to Beer pong and a series of drinking games with my siblings. That was fun but uh… sorry about some of the tweets that I let out during this time. I don’t think it was the booze though that made me enjoy this game so much watching it back. The big names came out to play for the home crowd against a Leafs team of Michal Neuvirth, John Tavares, Mitch Marner and the funny name alliance of no-name prospects. Tavares scored a little ways into the first. It was just a net-front redirect but it was in that range of goals Carter Hutton could have stopped. Hutton joined Rasmus Asplund on Chad DeDominicis’s list of the only two Sabres who were outright bad in this game. I’d have to agree on at least three goals against in this game. Henri Jokiharju and Dylan Cozens got back to back starts playing in this game and nothing really jumped off the page for me in this go around for them. That said, all I did was watch the highlight packs with a slight headache, so I probably missed something. Grill me for what I miss in the comments.

The star of this show was really Sam Reinhart. That was obvious even in the highlights. A couple minutes after Tavares’s tally Sam Reinhart scored essentially the same goal from a rebound. That’s right, Sam Reinhart is our John Tavares! And he’s better than JT you know! Lol, whatever I guess we have to troll each other as fanbases whenever we play. How about we just both be good at the same time, so I don’t need to bring up the Sabres have won more playoff series since the lockout even though we haven’t made the playoffs in eight years! OH BURN! Suck on that one, T-Town! What did all you punks do while we were throwing the queen’s tea in the harbor? I’m sure you normies were sipping it hardily you cowards! Okay, enough of that. In the second period Victor Olofsson scored an Ovechkin goal uncovered in the office on a powerplay. The Leafs would tie it up again before the middle frame ended but I really want to dwell on this Olofsson goal for a minute. It was powerplay goal assisted by Jack Eichel and Rasmus Dahlin. In addition to those guys Jeff Skinner and Sam Reinhart were on the ice. Assuming Victor Olofsson does become a scorer like we hope can I submit a formal request to Ralph Krueger and the two new assistant coaches with him?  That should be a powerplay unit all season. That group consists of all the bonified scoring talents we have, and Rasmus Dahlin can play defense for the lot of them to whatever degree you need that on a powerplay. I mean, we need that because we’re the Sabres so yeah. In fact Trevor Moore would score a short-handed goal for the Leafs in the third period but not until after… the guy scored… the only guy whose worth mentioning in summer 2016: Jimmy Vesey, JV Vasectomy… uh… I’m sorry guys I think the mean nicknames bit is going to get cut before the end of Training Camp. Kinda sorry not sorry on that one.

That shorthanded Leafs goal by the way was strike two against Hutton last night. I don’t know what you expect when the Sabres are tied with the Leafs going into the last five minutes of regulation, but I normally think W. Last season beat that out of me a little bit, but I have a new hope now. Victor Olofsson scored again but this time from a Reinhart assist from behind the net. Olofsson just kinda passed it into the net. By this point I think the Leafs had Michael Hutchinson in just to remind all the Leafs fans present that this is a preseason game and even though it’s cheaper to drive all the way from Kitchener to Buffalo than to Toronto just because of ticket prices up there doesn’t mean the blue and white actually give a shit about the middle class. Olofsson is the standard bearer this year for the hopes of eternal optimists like me. If he can score just 20-30 goals this season he will be a helpful contribution. It’s guys like that coming in and adding just a little bit that makes us that much closer to a 90-point team. If Victor Olofsson wants to turn this team into the Olofsson show I’m more than pleased to cheer it on. The Leafs were bagged and this one would end 5-3 for the home team. CJ Smith would put in an empty netter in the last minute but those last seconds ticking away beating the Leafs is drained of its joy when it’s the preseason. Oh and sorry, CJ, an empty netter isn’t going to save you from cuts. I hope to see you called up, gee, I hope you survive waivers, but dude, figure it out. There are teenage Swedes whose names sound like Star Wars characters jumping you on the depth chart now. That segways nicely into cuts.

Before the unfortunately mostly rather expected cuts I want to debut a new bit. For games I’m writing up the next day, particularly ones that life stopped me from watching, I’ll be picking a reply to one of my Sabres tweets about the game for analysis. That’s right, your reply guy moment is going to find its way into New Look Sabres this season! Please contain your excitement. Our first ever Reply Guy Analysis comes from one of my most loyal followers: Jonathan who is leaning into the millennial theme with a couple snowflakes around his name @LakeEffectXJ, says: “Was fun and entertaining. A nice reminder exactly how good Olofsson’s shot is, a surprise for many how good Miller’s shot is, and we got reintroduced to how good Reinhart is and that he should be running his own line.” Thanks Jonathan, onto the cuts. Arttu Ruotsalainen saves Rob Ray and RJ from almost certainly butchering his name and gets sent back to the good old Liiga with two I’s. Everyone else cut is going to the Rochester Americans including CJ Smith and Andrew Hammond who both need to clear waivers. Hopefully both those guys do. The fun part of doing these blogs the day after is having information like this. Assuming you haven’t read the list of cuts and are too lazy to go read it now that you’ve made it this far here I’ll just list them out for you: Eric Cornell, Sean Malone, Andrew Oglevie, Kyle Olson, Kevin Porter, CJ Smith, Jacob Bryson, Casey Fitzgerald, Brandon Hickey, Zach Redmond, Devante Stephens, Andrew Hammond, Michael Houser, and Jonas Johansson. Amerks Training Camp starts Monday.

As always like, share and comment on yours truly’s special Sabres blog. Hopefully this was your break from the Bills game reading. In which case I have to warn you to not try to hold a loaded hot dog in one hand and your phone in the other. You think it’s easy but it’s not. Why ruin that nice jersey? I’ll be really honest and say I have never looked forward to a Bills game in my entire life as much as this one. I was a drought baby and a certain stinker in Jacksonville wasn’t going to get me pumped a couple years back. Anyway, I hope you come on back to read again as we have two more preseason games and the closing of Training Camp before we can actually get excited about beating teams. I think I speak for everyone when I hope we actually win enough for it to meaningful this season.

Thanks for Reading.

P.S. Moore shoving Olofsson into the Leafs bench was kinda fun I guess. Sportsnet said it led to the ensuing Leafs goal which I suppose it did but I thought taking guys out of the play was bad.

[startegypt49-blog]

Ask Sam Mailbag: 04.05.2019

Is Zion really that much of a "cant' miss" No. 1 overall pick?

Is it a concern that he couldn't lead his team into the Final 4?

LongGiang Le

Sam: It would be a good study to compare the NCAA tournament success versus NBA career success. It's hardly an indicator, no offense to Ryan Arcidiacono, who was an NCAA tournament most outstanding players for a title team. Certainly, there were great winners like Kareem Abdul-Jabbar (nee Lew Alcindor), Wilt Chamberlain, Bill Walton, Earvin (Magic) Johnson, Isiah Thomas and Hakeem (nee Akeem) Olajuwon. And guys who dominated the tournament like Jack Givens, Tony Delk and Mateen Cleeves. Kevin Durant, James Harden and Paul Pierce were out in the second round, Ben Simmons and Paul George never even made the tournament and even though Michael Jordan's shot won a title, his junior year his North Carolina team didn't get to the Final Four. So we won't hold that against Zion.

You mean a can't miss player like Greg Oden, Markelle Fultz or Joe Barry Carroll? There's no such thing as can't miss. Though the large majority of overall NBA No. 1 picks have had good careers, if not always superstar. Which is the "can't miss" question on Williamson. Someone and likely several in the draft will be All-Stars, though team building is about getting that one star. The 76ers have made some really good deals and other drafts, but without Embiid they're still about a .500 team. Since I've been following the draft starting in the early 1960s, I'd say Zion's in the top 10 of most hyped players. I'd probably put him after Kareem, Magic, Olajuwon, Walton and LeBron. And in a group with Oden, Shaq, Patrick Ewing and maybe Elvin Hayes or Tim Duncan. Cazzie Russell is just on the edge. Most, obviously, went onto big careers, and Zion should also. Though Walton's and Oden's were sidelined by injury, and Williamson does put a lot of torque on his body. Ewing never led his team to a title even as a Hall of Famer. It still requires luck after lucking into the No. 1 pick.

More than ever if we get the no 1, I'd trade it. I really don't want Zion. A lot of these kids look awesome against the other kids, they won't against an NBA talent. Maybe he will be as good as this generation gets. But I remember everybody was hot and heavy for Eddy Curry, and I'm wondering, "he can't even beat high School kids for the State Championship, let's get real". I know we need a point, and a shooting /scoring defensive All NBA, Klay Thompson, or a realistic version of him.

Tom Golden

Sam: I believe some personnel people have doubts about how Zion will hold up and where he fits at his size. But it would take the boldest and most secure executive in history (Pat Riley? Popovich? Red Auerbach?) to pass on Williamson, especially since the presumed No. 2 pick is a late blooming point guard who we're not sure could bench press a rack of basketballs. Zion has been the media story of college basketball and, at the very least, would be the best merchandise and ticket seller to come along in years. There probably isn't a team business and marketing department that would let him pass if only for the media coverage the team would get for the next six months. ESPN already is interviewing reporters to embed with Zion. I'm guessing, but would not be surprised. That alone should equal the value of his contract. You'd be able to make a great trade if you had Williamson, though no one will. I know I'm getting the No. 1 pick right this year in my mock draft. Probably two and three also, but from there I'm done. And probably many teams as well.

Lemon Jr. drives

Now that we are down the season stretch. Which of these young players that are getting time that you would like to see stick on with the Bulls to try to and or make this roster going into next season? Lemon, Jr. Jakkar Sampson, Shaq Harrison, Arch, and TLC.

Thomas Brackeen

Sam: I'd like to see many of them as they are hard playing, good, tough kids. Perhaps one or two will be there. As I noted the other day after the Wizards game, there basically are about 10 Bulls roster spots taken already without any of those guys: Dunn, LaVine, Porter, Markkanen and Carter, basically next season's starting five (if no Zion), and none are playing now. Then there's a potentially decent bench with Valentine, Hutchison, two draft picks and one or two free agents with about $20 million available. And that doesn't include Cristiano Felicio, still under contract, and Robin Lopez, a free agent who could return. Of course, there could be trades. I've been a fan of Walt Lemon's since watching him all season in the G-league, though I suspect the team for now is most comfortable with Arcidiacono and Harrison. But it's possible there will be just one roster spot available since the Bulls like to carry 14 to keep a spot open in case of a trade opportunity. And some of those guys might find better opportunities for more playing time considering the way they've improved as NBA players. I'd say most deserve to be on NBA rosters next season. Most have done a good job with the Bulls in a tough situation and are the kind of players you'd like for your bench.

Goran Dragic drives

I'm a huge fan of team building and unlike most of our fans, actually have patience and see potential in our roster. My biggest fear in free agency this year is acquiring players that may push our young players already on the roster, further down the rotation. There's something to be said for on-job training. Hutch and Valentine specifically. The drop off from the starters to the bench is too dramatic. So I've compromised a list of pieces that I think will fit and compete.

Bulls possible new roster: All UFA

Pursue Dinwiddie or Dragic as starter

If Dragic is starter, still attempt to sign Dinwiddie as backup

Keep Arci as 3rd pg

Niko or Taj (backup PF)

Re-sign Robin

Pursue Hood/Justin Holiday/Glen Robinson III

Trade Dunn! For picks/cash if necessary

Maybe waive Blakeney, Felicio, if no one bites in trade talks

Still have Hutch & Valentine

Valentine has to show and prove

Keep Selden? Maybe G-League prospects Lemon & Sampson?

Brandon Evans

Sam: If I can figure that out, you seem mostly to be looking for the Bulls 2015 roster. Dragic, by the way, has a player option for about $20 million which I assume with his injuries he'll pick up. I would. Been there, done that. I know there's been talk about bringing back many from that ol' gang, like Derrick, Taj, Jo. Dinwiddie recently signed a three-year extension, as I recall. The Bulls still need some veteran guidance in addition to Otto Porter Jr. But when you bring back players you had in more golden times, the tendency is for the community to expect them to be who they were and not who they are. It could change, but I suspect the Bulls will look for younger veteran types like Porter.

Lemon Jr. attempts layup

Toronto was an enjoyable first Bulls game because of the refreshing team effort and Lemon. You have to like his burst, the way he distributes the ball and his drives to the basket. We don't know if he can shoot beyond eight feet and certainly the league will adjust but for one night he was fun to watch.

John Petersen

Sam: Then he didn't look good, and then Wednesday in Washington he did again. It's difficult to put too much into what goes on these days between teams not playing for anything. But it is something when you can make a winning shot and/or free throws like Lemon did in Washington. It shows more than just about Lemon that there are players—as there are people in all professions—who need a chance, that opportunity often transcends ability. We generally accept that if you have the job or perform, it's because of you and that others would not be able to. It's not necessarily the case, but those who have the positions like to write the narratives. Walt Lemon could have been a rotation regular this season on a dozen or more NBA rosters. He just wasn't because he wasn't before. It's often the flaw of scouting and personnel in many fields. Some people need a chance even though they don't have the appropriate credentials.

The latest collegiate cheating scandal has shined a light on what we all knew, that wealthy and connected people can get their kids into places that assure a foot in the door that others don't have. It's been the great inequity of American society, and many others, undoubtedly. After all, how many of those European queens ever sounded smart? And the kings sounded like absolute idiots. Like so many of these presidents and world leaders with Ivy League credentials. After listening to them, you know they didn't take their SATs.

Guys like Walt Lemon and before him at Windy City, Alfonzo McKinnie, were NBA players. They just didn't have the right resumes, the right college or awards or camps. It's why you so often see scouts travel in packs. If they all make the same mistake, then it's not wrong. That's why so many of these mock drafts you see are consensus. The best way to keep your job is to make sure the other guys see things the way you do. The outlier is the risk taker, and we find so few. Why take a chance on a guy like Walt Lemon if no one else does? Sure, sometimes those guys slip through, and sometimes like with Lemon and McKinnie, they improve with time and experience. Most of us can recognize obvious talent. Guys like Lemon and Sampson aren't All-Star, franchise changers. They actually are like many of us, who could do many of our bosses' jobs better than they do. If only the opportunity. It's the greatest of gifts. Then it's on you. And, really, what more can you ask.

Wendell Carter Jr. looks to move to the basket

You wrote that the Bulls didn't have anything resembling what it would have taken to move up in last year's draft. I found this opinion to be surprising as I thought they could have bested Dallas' offer, though admittedly I wanted them to take Jackson Jr. at the time, not Doncic. I was worried about Doncic's seemingly so-so athleticism, which as you wrote hasn't held him back so far.

Anyway, I thought the Bulls could have offered the #7 pick (Dallas offered #5) and next year's first round pick (same as what Dallas gave up, both are young/bad teams so you'd assume one's 2019 first wouldn't be much more highly valued than the other's). But what I thought could've put the Bulls offer over the top was including the #22 pick used for Hutchison. I suppose Atlanta specifically wanted Young and feared losing him to Dallas if they moved all the way back to #7, but at least that Bulls offer would have been very close to what Dallas offered, right?

Anyway, I hope Carter turns out to be a good one. He is who I wanted them to take if they couldn't move up and hasn't disappointed me so far. Not sure I saw any star potential this year before he got hurt but I didn't expect to.

Cameron Watkins

Sam: I actually think it's possible the Bulls would have been with you and taken Jackson, who also looks like he'll be really good. After all, let's not judge all the drafts after six months. Remember, three months ago Young was a bust. But it's moot because I knew they were trying to move up and couldn't. They hope Hutchison becomes a contributing player, but No. 22 never is quite enough to get you much. They could not beat Atlanta's offer without giving up Markkanen. LaVine coming off knee surgery recovery and as a free agent didn't have as much value even if he could have been traded. We haven't talked about Carter much because he's been gone so long. BO, as it were, Before Otto. And before Lopez' Leap.

But when next season begins—assuming the Bulls don't get the No. 1 pick and Zion says he's a center—Carter will be back starting at center. There are concerns and questions, though there should not be that many as he'll have just turned 20. He really had an impressive (half) season considering he was deferring offensively at the time trying to fit in and going through two coaches in his first season with half the starters out. He had some huge scoring games, several double/doubles, and played with unusual poise. He probably cannot work on his height in the offseason, which has been the main concern as he was overwhelmed at times by the bigger centers. He's said he considers himself more of a power forward. But he is unusually physical for someone his age and has the potential to do so many more things offensively inside and outside. His injury was perhaps the freakiest of the freaky. He probably could trip over someone like that 100 times and reach down to regain his balance and never do that again. It's a setback after playing just a half season and most under a different coach. He'll be the Bulls starting center next season. We're all anxious to see how good he can be. At his age, there's plenty of room for excellence.

Zach LaVine passes the ball

What do you think of Zach Lavine's development as a playmaker in the latter half of this season? In this era of position less basketball it seems like we need a primary playmaker and ballhandler rather than necessarily a point guard, so Zach filling that role well could potentially open up our options in the draft.

Cameron Lam

Sam: I guess it's not so position less if the Bulls need all that. This talk about position-less basketball is mostly a term for playing zones on defense (switching) and players having multiple skills, you know, like they had in the 1960s. The game hasn't changed that much other than the demand for a while to specialize—some dribblers, some shooters and some rebounders—to where now it seems like an innovation to have players who can do multiple things. Players once were supposed to do that because, you know, that was basketball. Sure, most people can do one thing better than other things, but players were once taught to do more things. There were various reasons for specialization, some insidious so you wouldn't have to pay certain players more money since they were, say, just rebounders and not scoring. Clearly, Robin Lopez isn't going to be your facilitator on the fast break. Players do have certain special skills. Zach is a very talented guy, which means he can dribble, he can pass and he can shoot. Imagine that. That's why he has the chance to be a great player. But he does some things better than others. I'd rather see him, at least for now, specialize more as a scorer since he's got an uncanny ability to shoot and get to the basket. So far he's tended to defer when he's had to run the team. But perhaps the biggest issue with a player like Zach now is how long he's been associated with losing. It's the biggest problem with these rebuilding situations. It sounds great to get those lottery picks and build when you've had a run of finishing in the middle. But there's also a line when you expose a player to losing too long. Zach began in a Minnesota rebuilding, got hurt, and came to Chicago in the ground zero of its rebuild. He does seem like a player who cares about winning since he seemed really depressed as the losses mounted into December and January and seemed to recover after the Porter trade and some success. It's a positive that he has multiple talents, but the Bulls still have some needs to address.

Do you think today's NBA players are the laziest defenders you have ever seen ? You only need to look at the steals and blocks per game leaders over the last 45 years to see that the last 3 seasons leaders rank near last in both statistics. You could only imagine MJ's numbers playing against today's NBA defenses.

Adam Palmer

Sam: I hadn't noticed that comparison and I'm not sure if that's an actual defensive measure, though they are lower in both categories. I think a lot has to do, especially with blocks, that there are so many more threes shot and when players go to the basket they'll often pass up a layup attempt to try to assist on a three. Everyone over 40 winces. But the defenses, I will agree, are not always as aggressive individually because the teams play so much switching and zone-like systems, which lead to lazy defensive principles.

Of course, the irony is that in the years you are referring to in the 70s, especially, the NBA was known as a league in which the players didn't play defense. The NBA players can defend better than you think because they are so much more athletic now. But the systems of play, perimeter shooting and load management make it look worse than it is. I plan to try to work "load management" into as many columns as I can since among all the stupid things said in sports, it might be the absolute stupidest. We used to use the term, but it referred more to working with Michael Sweetney.

NCAA: From what I've read, there are absolutely zero one-and-done prospects in the Final Four. I love that. It would be nice if GMs figured out that most college freshmen are not ready to help you win in the NBA. But I'm afraid it's going the other way. We'll soon have 18 year old's coming straight out of high school, which will hurt both the NBA and NCAA. My call would be to go the other way – require 2 years of college or 21 yrs. old. That sets up college as the (slightly) faster route to the NBA, and hopefully would encourage kids to go to school. Or here's another idea: base the rookie contract scale on number of yrs. in school, so that staying in school helps you earn more during your first contract. There's also the idea of paying college players. I'm not opposed, but I wonder if schools can pay them enough to keep them away from the NBA for an extra year or two.

Art Alenik

Sam: I've never fully understood why the players' association has been so adamant about helping teenagers leave or avoid school and come into the NBA. I know this lame argument about everyone has a right to earn a living and tennis players can play at 16 and whatever. It's not in the Constitution. I also know you can't be a lawyer at 16. I have some lawyer jokes to use there, but they are lame as well.

The collegiate example this season is an aberration since Duke could have been there and Kentucky has been with a roster filled with NBA-to-bes. Though the point is salient that you can beat those teams more now with experience and savvy. It's why the NBA has taken a step back in quality because so many unprepared teenagers and 20-year-olds have to be on NBA rosters. It's like the old, ridiculous bonus baby baseball rule when a high paid young player had to start on a major league roster. It usually ruined his career, though he didn't have to play. Good luck benching your lottery pick. I don't much care about the NCAA and college since so many of the major universities are a sewer of corruption with either the parents buying their way in or the administrators forcing the kid through easy courses to assure eligibility for sports or even as I've heard from some NBA players keeping kids from taking more sophisticated courses because it takes away from sports training.

The NBA, like any business, should have a right to protect itself from hiring unprepared employees. Sure, some players are ready, but between so many young players breaking down physically because their bodies aren't ready and teams having to go back to so many basics with unprepared players, the game suffers. I'm for extending the waiting period, which obviously is about to go the other way because it seems even the NBA has given in. I know the argument about kids in unfortunate and hardship financial situations and the need to make money, and I'm pleased to see what the NBA is doing regarding the G-league and increasing salaries. If only those kids like in baseball could play there for a few years and learn to play. And perhaps make Hoffman Estates a destination for other than the Poplar Creek Buffalo Wild Wings.

As we all seem to be focusing on the upcoming draft and this is assuming the lottery falls in standing order with the bulls picking number four.

My thought is that Jarrett Culver from Texas Tech would be a good fit with the rebuilding core, if... LaVine is pushed back over to point. Everyone is looking for a scoring point guard who can distribute as well, surely he fits the bill and Culver would be a very good 3 and d slashing guard alongside him.

Could work?

Alex Kansas

Sam: Ooops, I just dropped Zach above from point guard responsibilities. Trying not to contradict myself, Jim Boylen has employed some sequences with different players handling the ball into the scoring area. Many teams do so. You don't have to have an exclusive point guard. Steph Curry is Golden State's point guard, but Green and Durant do plenty of playmaking. OK, Green. I believe Culver still is playing, so we can both scout him. I remember last year the 3-D guy to get was Mikal Bridges. It seems like it's been an adjustment for him. Though I'm not sure Booker will let him have the ball. It seems the first three picks in the draft will be in order Zion, Morant and Barrett, the latter because it seems he'll just figure a way to score. From there it seems, at least for now, that someone will like someone at 5 who someone else will see at 12. But that's the way Donovan Mitchell gets to 13. You have to pick right and be fortunate. The Bulls clearly need three-point shooting perhaps as much or more than any team in the NBA. So he could work.

I am sure we will add a quality player as long as we stay in the top 5.

Lots of draft experts seem to be down on RJ Barrett. I have not seen him play a lot at Duke, but he seems to have decent physical tools, comes from a strong basketball background, is competitive and has been winning at all levels. To me this feels like a case of everyone expecting him to be the best player in his class, which he was not and now everybody is extra negative about him. What is your take?

Sven Ruppert

Sam: Barrett is the tough call for me, and as I said above I expect he'll be taken third. I haven't been that impressed watching him because he's not super explosive, but we all said that about that Doncic guy. He seemed to figure out a way to score. And he seems to know how to make plays. The league likes explosive players for their star potential. But then you can get someone like James Harden, who just knows how to score. Barrett looks like he'll figure a way.

LeBron James and Lonzo Ball

The television program I was watching this morning while exercising asked the question, "Is Zion the best Duke player ever?" ......huh? he doesn't have a midrange jumper. He brain-fades on defense and it hurts his team. BTW, nothing personal aimed at Williamson, who seems to be an okay kid. Also on the LeBron Channel, saw an interesting graphic. Did you realize that Jordan never missed a post-season as a Bull? Comparison to LBJ might not be fair (different types of players in different eras), but he asks for these when he declares himself the best of all time, which he has. Come to think of it, I don't remember Magic or Bird or the Doc ever missing a post-season. West? Wilt? Oscar? Kareem missed one season, but he played until he was in his early 40's plus the year he missed he was league MVP - I'd say that's a competitive guy. Not buying the idea that LBJ walked into a lousy Cavs team as an 18 year old. For one thing, no one made him skip Ohio State. For another, the Bulls team Jordan joined had big time problems which Jordan will acknowledge if you ask him. Jordan didn't take days off. He busted his butt dragging some serious bozos into the post-season. I'd add here that he didn't have roster input, otherwise Walter Davis and Johnny Dawkins would have been Bulls. Jordan took the lemons and made lemonade. That's what great players do. Players today often mind their personal corporations, frequently reverting to their AAU roots as they seek to play with their buddies. Jordan wasn't allowed to play with his buddies and built Jumpman/Air Jordan anyway.

None of this makes LBJ any less a player. LBJ is the best player of his generation. Hall of Fame penthouse with Kareem/Jordan/Wilt/EJ/Bird/Oscar/Russell? he takes pre-season pretty indifferently, takes personal days off in-season and then there's this. Plus he walked into a turn-key situation NBA-wise. I think that Kobe has missed the playoffs, too. These guys get their own tier with Hakeem, Ewing, Iverson, Karl Malone and Barkley, which isn't bad company. Of this lot, LBJ might be top dog though Kobe has more rings, Malone's stats are in important areas somewhat better, and Hakeem produced head-and-shoulders the very best basketball of any of 'em when he had all of his game working.

Pete Zievers

Sam: It is what LeBron brings on himself with some of those pronouncements. I guess part is getting swept up in that, but one thing with Jordan was he never declared himself better than greats. I remember when Julius Erving came to Chicago Stadium for the last time in what the media was calling a passing of the torch. Jordan was gracious in suggesting no one would do the things Dr. J did. It's somewhat inaccurate, of course, to compare the eras since Jordan the season he was hurt made the playoffs with a 30-win team (and then scored 63 in the playoffs and was swept). I'm sure the Lakers would have made the playoffs if LeBron didn't miss a month hurt and then sabotage the rest of the season with the Anthony Davis gambit, which he likely wouldn't have if he didn't get hurt and desperate. This is one debate that is never ending. But will anyone ever believe in 20 years either was better than Zion?

Kobe Bryant and Tim Duncan

So let me start by saying that Kobe is a great player. Having said that, I truly don't understand how anybody can look at his career numbers and put him in the same conversation as MJ and Lebron, just like I wouldn't put Iverson in the same conversation as Kobe. But even beyond that: the guy was an incredibly difficult teammate. How the heck is it that he's become sort of an elder statesman now quoted all over the place? If people want quotes from a 5-time champ on being a leader or whatever, you could ask Tim Duncan.

Media narratives are nuts.

Alejandro Yegros

Sam: Perhaps it's more a lesson in modern media, though media narratives are wacky. Just wait out the bad days until they move onto something else, and then you can be whoever you say you are.

Source: https://www.nba.com/bulls/news/ask-sam-mailbag-04052019