#[ crack || the droid stole a freighter? ( kylo ren / ben solo ) ]

[helwrit]

kylo tags

[the-bibliophile-jedi]

Trying to understand the hatred towards Kylo Ren aka Ben Solo

As December is nearing I'm yet again trying to understand what aspect of Kylo Ren's character makes his seem so evil and irredeemable to the antis

Sorry for the long rant

The first scene with Kylo Ren from Jakku

Antis: Oh God he killed an old unarmed man so brutally! And he ordered the massacre of an entire village! He should just die, he doesn't deserve any redemption.

Me: (trying to be rational) yeah that was indeed horrible. This cannot be justified at all but it doesn't mean that he shouldn't be redeemed. Like didn't anakin murder an entire village of tusken raiders? And what about those younglings? And those poor rebels in rogue one. And we don't have any idea about so many other people he killed between episode 3 and 4. He still got his redemption. Also, I'm pretty sure he sensed Finn's conflict and that he hadn't killed any of the villagers but still let him go.

Poe's interrogation scene

Antis: He treated Poe so horribly. He tortured him sooooooooo much. He is just pathetic.

Me: yeah of course he treated Poe so badly. No denying that. But what if the resistance captured an important first order member? What if they get hold of hux? Would they be nice to him or use any means possible to get information out of him? The latter of course because they are at WAR. Also didn't darth vader himself torture his own daughter (although he didn't know it then) to get information about the stolen death star plans? Also in rogue one Saw Gerrera kind of tortured Bodhi Rook using that horrible creature to make sure he was telling the truth and it even lead to a temporary loss of his sanity. So I guess it happens on both sides.

when Hux says they were trying to identify who helped Poe and Kylo Ren immediately says the one from the village

Antis: OMG he knows it was Finn. He identified him, God he is so evil.

Me: like I said before, he saw Finn's inner conflict yet let him go, bc I guess he was going through the same conflict?

When Kylo finds out Finn and BB-8 escaped with the help of a girl

Antis: Did you see that? Look at what an angry and destructive person he is. And look how he treats the first order employees.

Me: Well I guess that's better than force choking his co-workers like darth vader used to. Also (about that 'the droid stole a freighter' comment) did he just make a joke?

The scene with Snoke and Hux

Antis: These people are so inhuman they are destroying an entire planetary system. Pathetic.

Me: Maybe it's just me but did you see that smug look on Hux's face when he looked at Ren? It felt as if Ren was not fully supportive of the destruction of the Hosnian system. We can't see his face obviously and I think it was necessary that he had his mask on in that scene or it could have given away a lot.

The scene with Darth Vader's destroyed mask

Antis: What is wrong with him? Doesn't he know Darth Vader redeemed himself? He is actually worse than Vader.

Me: are we just going to ignore the fact that he felt 'the pull to the light' which shows he can still be redeemed? And I guess he is feeling that way right now because:

• He ordered the murder of an entire village

• An entire planetary system is about to be destroyed

• Perhaps Finn's abandoning the FO intensified his inner conflict?

So about the first two points, these two horrible acts must have made him feel guilty and that guilt was the pull to the light. Also remember that time Palpatine told Anakin to show no mercy because only then he will be able to fully use the dark side? Ren is doing the same here, killing innocents to feel the dark side fully. I'm not saying his actions can be justified, but I'm saying that this doesn't make him irredeemable.

Kylo Ren and Rey's confrontation on Takodana

Antis: Look how he is torturing her! She is in so much pain. And he just kidnapped her what the hell! He should just die.

Me: (the reylo inside me awakens) What an evil person right? He didn't even let her fall on the ground and carried her to the ship in the nicest way possible. He could have carried her using the force, asked the stormtroopers to take her like he did eith poe, or at least he could have thrown her on his shoulder bc that way he would have one hand free to defend himself in case someone attacks him which had a very high chance since they were in a battle zone and resistamce fighters were pouring in. Also about torture, let me point it out again, they are at WAR and he is extracting info just the way the resistance would have done. Doesn't make his crimes any less but it doesn't mean he is downright evil.

The most important scene- Rey's interrogation

Antis: HE MIND RAPED HER!!! SHE WAS IN SO MUCH PAIN!! HE INVADED HER PERSONAL MEMORIES!!!! JUST KILL HIM ALREADY!!!!!!!!!!!!

Me: woah woah wait. How long had she been unconscious? He actually waited for her to wake up while sitting in that uncomfortable posture? WHYYYY??? That is sooooo not evil. And why does it bother him that she still wants to kill him? I mean who doesn't? Lol. I am willing to bet that at least half the FO would like to see him dead. And he removed his mask because she said he was 'a creature in a mask'? I mean even Poe said that it was difficult to understand him with the apparatus but he didn't remove his mask then. And is there a good reason they made the villain so damn attractive? (Now that scene when Ren asks her about BB8 and she gives that smart answer) Is he-Is he amused? And why isn't this EVIL guy annoyed by her answer? (You know I can take whatever I want) uhhhhh...why do i sense some sexual tension here? Also why does he have to lean sooooo close to her while probing her mind? He didn't do that with Poe right? And do I see a slight smile on his face? And of course he can relate with Rey's feelings of loneliness here. He is connecting with her here. Also MIND RAPE? She does that to him too right? And she reveals his deepest fear? And he doesn't even lash out on her and just leaves right? And I don't want to go over it again but c'mon they are at war and he wants information. (Plus he says in the novel that he'd have preferred not to go ahead with the mind probe bc it gave him no joy and that he would go as easy on her as possible)

Meeting no 2 with snoke and hux

Antis: He is so bad, if he gets hold of rey he is gonna torture her so much. And these monsters are about to destroy the resistance!!

Me: I'm not entirely convinced that Ren is happy about the destruction of the resistance base (which would eventually result in the death of his mum) and that's why he tries to interrupt snoke and says that he can get the map from her. (Also snoke says that he sensed that Ren has compassion for Rey in the novel and what did Anakin say about compassion in attack of the clones? Compassion, which I would define as unconditional love, is central to a jedi's life)

Kills Han

Antis: This is it. There's no going back now. HE CANNOT AND SHOULD NOT BE REDEEMED!!!!!! HOW COULD HE KILL HIS FATHER??? HAN SOLO? REY SHOULD KILL HIM!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Me: Are you annoyed by the fact that he killed his father or because he killed Han Solo? Obviously patricide is a terrible act and yeah what he did was absolutely wrong but I guess what is bothering you more is the fact that he murdered fan favourite Han Solo. Because Anakin killed his only father figure and best friend Obi-Wan too right? And on one hand Ren and Han had a very strained relationship as father and son but on the other hand Anakin and Obi-Wan were sooooo close to each other. And he almost killed his pregnant wife and unborn child right? And he actually was the cause of his wife's ultimate death. And he was redeemed. So why not Kylo Ren? Also you are just going to ignore the look of shock and guilt on Ren's face right? Also, according to the novel, the act weakened him instead of making him stronger. He was horrified by what he had done.

Antis: You reylos are JUST pathetic. Trying to justify that monster's actions. Rey should never forgive him. And how can she when he killed the only father figure she ever had?

Me: woah woah who justified his actions? We are just saying that he can still be redeemed there is nothing wrong with that. And he killed Rey's father figure? Seriously? Are we the same fandom who has made fun of the fact that Luke felt so sad by the death of Obi-wan Kenobi even after knowing him for a few days? Isn't this the same situation? Also more than the fact that it was Han that he killed, I guess what hurt shocked Rey the most was that he killed his own father. She couldn't understand how could someone do that to their own family because she had always longed for one.

The Final Fight: Finn and Rey vs Kylo Ren

Antis: He threw Rey on that tree. He hurt her again.

Me: She was going to shoot him. What did you want him to do? Does it bother you because he thre a 'girl' at the tree? Because it seems like it does. Also, I guess it was better than force choking her? He is perfectly capable of that. And did you even see the way he pounded on his injury because remember 'pain leads to the dark side'? He is trying to draw power from his pain because he doesn't have enough darkness in him.

Antis: Oh God look how he hurt Finn. What do you have to say about thay huh? He almost killed him.

Me: Yeah ikr Finn was being so nice to him. He didn't deliver a single killer blow at him. He would have never killed him if he had the chance because he doesn't consider him his enemy am i right? Bullshit.

Rey and Kylo fight

Antis: He could have hurt her so bad!!! He would have definitely killed her. You kill him Rey! He deserves it!

Me: Well first of all, he would have easily killed her when they were standing on the edge of the cliff. I don't even know how many times reylos have stated this but no one wants to listen right. Secondly, guess what? Rey is a wonderful person but she is not fully on the light side after all. He wanted to kill him, would have definitely killed him had the ground not cracked and separated them, and well almost did kill him because she left a wounded man alone to die on a planet that was about to explode bc she had no way to know that someone was coming to save him. But of course that is justified for her because she is on the good side and they are at war right? What gets me everytime is the fact that we forget that the resistance has killed many innocents too in the name of greater good. I've always felt that not all stormtroopers are evil (even before watching tfa) and tfa and finn intensified my belief. Most of them are just following orders because if they don't they will be killed right? And not everyone can be as brave as Finn was. How many of them were on the 2 death stars and star killer base when they were destroyed? Not everything is as black and white as it seems.

But of course, if someone is adamant about something we cannot change their pov no matter how many logical explanations we give. You don't ship reylo? Cool, you don't have to. But it's not an abusive ship. Tbh Ren suffered more at the hands of Rey than she did (lol) and they are are EQUALS. No one is saying that he is her superior, rather she is the stonger and braver one and he is the one with more experience. And yes of course, a woman can both be both romantic and badass (because I am too lol and so was leia, and padme though she isn't given much credit).

[legacyfell]

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